This article may have been recategorised and is therefore no longer available at this URL.

You can try to find the updated link in the article archive.

Share article:

Reader Comments (39)

Note: the following content is not moderated or vetted by the site owners at the time of submission. Comments are the responsibility of the poster. Disclaimer


Ross Edwards
1 Posted 12/01/2014 at 18:02:25
Naismith shouldn't even get a rating. He was himself: crap, useless, a liability.
Trevor Lynes
2 Posted 12/01/2014 at 18:05:12
I think you definitely underscored Jagielka, who was great, and also Osman and Pienaar who along with Barry were the teams inspiration. I thought McCarthy less of an influence than usual. How can you give Heitinga and Naismith the same rating as Osman and Pienaar ??

I would have been more relaxed if Oviedo had come on instead of Heitinga we would not have to change the shape of the side. Oviedo is a natural sub for both Baines and Pienaar. We surrendered the attacking side of our game completely when both Osman and Pienaar came off. Jagielka ended up playing left side instead of central where he is better suited.

Brian Denton
3 Posted 12/01/2014 at 18:30:27
Dewch 'mlaen surely?
Paul Ferry
4 Posted 12/01/2014 at 18:25:43
Paul how on earth can you give Stones and Jags the same rating?! Jags covered for Stones again and again and I counted - just watched the game again on NBC - five Stones clangers and not one from Jags. Now I'm not a big Jags fan but credit where credit is due, Jags was not far from top-drawer yesterday and the only better player on the pitch was Barry. And 6 for Pienaar - 6!. Nuts had his bet game for yonks yesterday and especially in the 1st half he was reminding me of his old purring best.

I would also agree with Ross Edwards - our 18-year-old youngin who did a great job announcing on the PA yesteday 9/10 and he even stumbled over Naismtih - that Naismith was a bag of shite in admittedly a last quarter run-out and giving him the same rating as Lu and Nuts - Jesus wept!

Paul I know ratings are in the eye of the beholder and I also know that I rattle on about this week-in-and-week-out but you have an unenviable ability to pull off howlers!

Ross Edwards
5 Posted 12/01/2014 at 18:42:57
I know Paul, I was stunned that he was even in the squad yesterday. He doesn't contribute anything useful or beneficial in any way, shape or form.

Apart from that goal v Chelsea of course.

Matt Traynor
6 Posted 12/01/2014 at 18:07:11
"You have to go all the way back to Sunday 22 December 2002 for the last time we played the first Merseyside derby of a season at Anfield rather than Goodison Park. I wonder why that is?"

This comes up time and time again.

It's done like this at our request - Derby at Goodison first, as the club is worried that having the Derby at home in the second half of the season would impact on ST sales.

Matt Traynor
7 Posted 12/01/2014 at 18:07:11
"You have to go all the way back to Sunday 22 December 2002 for the last time we played the first Merseyside derby of a season at Anfield rather than Goodison Park. I wonder why that is?"

This comes up time and time again.

It's done like this at our request - Derby at Goodison first, as the club is worried that having the Derby at home in the second half of the season would impact on ST sales.

Dennis Ng
8 Posted 12/01/2014 at 18:48:40
Matt, really? There's a correlation on that?
Phil Sammon
9 Posted 12/01/2014 at 18:59:10
Surely you can't 'request' when you play certain teams. Not saying you're wrong, Matt, but surely...you're wrong.
Ross Edwards
10 Posted 12/01/2014 at 19:05:57
Surely Phil it would be at the request of the Premier League.

An Anfield Derby second would create more interest for TV as there is more to play for than if it would be at the start of the season.

That's my (wrong) take on it.

Patrick Murphy
11 Posted 12/01/2014 at 19:07:32
Matt is correct in what he has said; for whatever reason, Everton did ask for the first game to always be played at Goodison – a decision which baffles me but they must have had their reasons... One of which may have been that they didn't want to host a derby game at Goodison that had too much riding on it and could lead to behaviour that would show Evertonians in a bad light. Which is also strange considering we have played Man City and Man Utd in the second half of the season without any particular problems and under the lights.

Dennis Ng
12 Posted 12/01/2014 at 19:12:47
Yes, my sentiments too. If I can choose, I rather play the other top teams away in the first half and home in the second. Heck, if we can play the first 19 games away, I'd go for that! I would think it is to our advantage to have the hard games at home at a latter day to digest them. Not sure if winter plays a part to why we have such a request. But I can see how consumer trends might be a bit different from what we expect.
Dennis Ng
13 Posted 12/01/2014 at 19:16:26
Paul T, my only difference to your ratings is Lukaku Osman and Pienaar 7, Barry 9. It was a masterclass by Barry. The other 3 did not have that much of a great day but they held up the midfield well. Considering how much Norwich was able to pressure us after Pienaar and Osman left, I think it's obvious their presence was missed.
Kevin Tully
14 Posted 12/01/2014 at 19:21:36
Here's a link to how fixtures are compiled:

http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/fans/faqs/how-are-fixtures-compiled.html

The clubs obviously have a say in the schedule.

Harold Matthews
15 Posted 12/01/2014 at 20:26:10
Trevor / Paul F. Thanks for putting Mr Traill right on the ratings. I also thought Barry was terrific and Howard was in good form.

If Baines stays, which looks likely, whats going to happen with Oviedo? This very talented and likeable lad has had a raw deal throughout his Everton career.

Dennis Ng
16 Posted 12/01/2014 at 20:46:48
Harold,

I might be reading too much between the lines but I remember RM said that McGeady can contribute to the experience or learning or something of that matter.

My belief and this is the same for many players is to cross train players into other positions, probably the first being Oviedo. That will also be true for other players of cos if my guess is right.

I'm equally surprised Ovideo not having a part in Norwich, but if RM fully rotates between him and Baines, say Oviedo playing the full Brom game, I actually don't see a problem short term.

Gareth Prytherch
17 Posted 12/01/2014 at 20:30:07
Just on the fixtures thing, I'll try and find the link but in the Guardian before the last Derby it was stated that it is done because there have been occasions when a whole calendar year has passed without a home derby.

There was a thread on here about it, I don't know if anyone can search the site for it.

Wayne Smyth
18 Posted 12/01/2014 at 21:48:07
Thought Pienaar had a great game. Worked really hard, kept and used the ball very intelligently.

I'd agree with Paul Ferry that Stones had a bit of an off day too. Seemed to get caught out by a few long balls....but he's young and will have learned some lessons hopefully.

As for Naismith, again useless performance with nothing positive. If it weren't for the fact that most of our reserve players who are close to the first team are off getting valuable experience in the lower leagues, I'd have one of them on the bench without hesitation ahead of Naismith.

I'm sure Naismith isn't as shit as he's showing. He probably plays better in and around the box where he doesn't need pace, to be able pass, or to get past anyone, but played on the wing or in midfield he's as bad a footballer as I think I've ever seen. How you've given him the same rating as Pienaar or Osman is beyond me.

Harold Matthews
19 Posted 12/01/2014 at 22:20:54
Dennis. You may be right with the changing positions thing. He's always going on about being creative with transfers, team selection etc, and I believe it was he who turned Swans winger Britton into a DM.
Dennis Ng
20 Posted 12/01/2014 at 22:40:53
Harold, let's hope so. That is what I would do for sure.

My first option though is not Oviedo but Baines into a DM. Quite a few reasons for that, tactical, cover, skill set and succession wise. But it's really personal preference. And surely RM sees things that I didn't consider yet, e.g. age, transfer or a million reasons.

I can see Oviedo and Coleman being trained as wingers or into Bale-ish players. The reason I say Oviedo first is his natural flexible positions and availability of direct cover, although I consider Coleman closer to the Bale mold than Oviedo. Based on what I see of course, which might be a selective sample of their performance.

We'll see. Injuries will be the headliner for the next 2 weeks but I'm sure we'll see a bit of this transformation coming soon.

Harold Matthews
21 Posted 13/01/2014 at 00:14:35
Dennis. I'm not sure we've got a 6'-2" flying machine like Bale on the books. He's one of these new fangled inverted wingers who operate on their un-natural wing so they can cut in and shoot with their stronger foot. Mirallis and Deulofeu occasionally try it but I don't think Martinez ever has Bale in mind. In fact, he might prefer them to stay on their natural flank because it offers more options.
Dennis Ng
22 Posted 13/01/2014 at 01:17:56
Harold, I see, you have a point there. I agree with your train of thought. Now that you mention, I remember his highlight reels from the right flank instead of left. I could see that pure pace wise, they are not there but they will be better in other things that Bale is not good at. I often wonder the differences in wing play but you've definitely given me a lesson on that! Aiden plays both flanks (I think) so perhaps he will take the front end of Barkley's load and transfer some of that knowledge to our wing backs. Pure guess.
David Ellis
23 Posted 13/01/2014 at 02:26:40
I thought Naismith played quite well on Saturday. As he came on I confidently told my 10year old he was one to look out for because he was rubbish....but honestly he wasn't. Rarely miscontrolled the ball, rarely gave it away, nice little dribble in the box...quite a tidy cameo in my opinion.

Having said that the whole team seemed to fall apart when Naismith came on, but I don't think we can blame him for that.

Matt Traynor
24 Posted 13/01/2014 at 03:03:17
Phil #842, the fixtures have been scheduled by computer for years. There's interviews out there on the web with the guy who maintains the algorithim.

There are certain parameters they try to work in. (Travel distances over Xmas and New Year being one, though sometimes you wouldn't think so).

Police forces also have input, as well, obviously, as TV companies. It's no coincidence that Sky's "Super Sunday" of the top 4 playing each other on the same weekend is a regular occurrence.

Clubs can also make requests. Everton's request was purely from a commercial point of view that they would prefer to host the Goodison Derby in before Xmas, as they fear having it after Xmas would adversely affect Season Ticket sales (but lead to more people buying half STs). That's why this season they make a big play of "Man Utd, Man City and Arsenal included in the ST deal".

Liverpool were happy to go along with this as it gives them a home derby on the run in to their eventual title win... er...

It's been this way for years now. It's up to you if you believe me or not. I've been wrong before, I'm sure I will be again in the future.

Harold Matthews
26 Posted 13/01/2014 at 02:46:07
Dennis. Despite my surname, I'm not an expert on wing play by any stretch of the imagination. Bale, Ronaldo, Robben and Ribery play the inverted way but it severely limits crosses into the box a la orthodox wingers like Valencia. These days the crosses come via fullbacks like Baimes, Oviedo and the City pair, who have about five assisrs each but underlying everything will be the managers strategy. Players going out and doing things willy nilly will not last long.

David. You got it right with Naismith. People calling him useless are insulting Martinez.

Dennis Ng
27 Posted 13/01/2014 at 03:57:34
Harold and David, definitely agree with Naismith performance. I find it odd that we lost more possession after he came in but not because of him. I think it's just one of those, useful player, not a tactical fit. Love his workrate.

Harold, yep, that's the same way in NFL or other sports too. Even with the license to roam, I'm sure there are defined tasks for each position. Even Barkley seems to be defined within a certain area and tasks based on the tactic.

As for the winger role, I've never given it much thought, so when you mentioned the regular vs inverted, it made sense. It does seem to me that McGeady will have a more diversified winger role while they might get Coleman and Oviedo to do winger duties. Wonder if we'll get someone to be the target man for the crosses but that might be a distraction form the way the current team plays. If I'm to judge from the Noriwch game, we might be able to benefit from those speedy strikers with a delicate touch.

David Ellis
28 Posted 13/01/2014 at 05:05:25
Dennis - to be honest I would prefer if we did not have to play Naismith - but he did OK on Saturday. I think he will drop out of Martinez' plans in the summer.
Dennis Ng
29 Posted 13/01/2014 at 05:10:10
David, that is almost for certain given the circumstance. I've come to forget his position. A winger, no crosses, just chasing the ball like a headless chicken sometimes. I feel sad for him because he works very hard and does OK in everything, just not where we're headed.

I was thinking, given his workrate, is it possible to convert him to a DM? I know size and height might be an issue but it does open options for both us and Naismith. More ball winner than control or playmaker.

Phil Sammon
30 Posted 13/01/2014 at 06:53:16
Dennis

One of your more insane suggestions there I think.

David Ellis
31 Posted 13/01/2014 at 06:56:09
Dennis - don't think so. He can't tackle for a start. Anyway we have no need to force round pegs into square holes. We can now attract decent players and a manager that plays them in their best positions.

Oh - how's the plan to spend less time on ToffeeWeb going? You must be asleep by now surely - it must be 3am for you!

Phil Traynor
32 Posted 13/01/2014 at 07:22:24
Why has the first derby match of the season been played at Goodison every year since 2003?

The ToffeeWeb article referred to above, http://www.toffeeweb.com/season/13-14/comment/talkingpoints/26106.html, advises, "So keenly anticipated is the Merseyside derby that for the last 10 years, alone in the Premier League, it has been governed by special rules. The first fixture will now always be at Goodison and the second, after Christmas, at Anfield. This prevents supporters having to wait more than a year for what they always used to consider their most important home fixture and avoids the situation that cropped up 50 years ago, whereby Goodison Park did not see a derby game during the whole of 1963". The quote is taken from an article in the Guardian, http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2013/nov/21/everton-liverpool-merseyside-derby.

Personally, I think this explanation is a smokescreen. I can't find a link, but I have previously seen a more plausible reasoning, along the lines that a lot of Everton fans buy season tickets to guarantee attending the derby. If the Goodison derby is in the first half of the season then a full season ticket needs to be purchased, if it's in the second half of the season, a half season ticket will suffice. In my opinion, the special rules were introduced and have been maintained by the powers-that-be at Goodison.

Apologies that I can't find a way to slag off our bastard offspring on this occasion.

COYB!!!!

Peter Roberts
34 Posted 13/01/2014 at 13:43:50
Never mind 1963, the same happened in 1995.

94-95 season results:

Liverpool (h) W 2-0 (21 November 1994)
Liverpool (a) D 0-0 (24 January 1995)

95-96 season results:

Liverpool (a) W 2-1 (18 November 1995)
Liverpool (h) D 1-1 (16 April 1996)

So it has happened in the Premier League era.

Sam Higgins
35 Posted 13/01/2014 at 16:12:20
I don't know why folks are quick to criticise Paul's field reports he always provides a subjective narrative on the days events with the added flavour of the banter before and after the match which I enjoy. It takes time to compile these reports and yet some people are so quick to jump all over them - so u saw the game differently - probably cause u were watching it on a PC screen rebuffering every 10 seconds and not actually in the flesh at Goodison. Added to that u have to give the man kudos for having a German misses - I was seeing a Swiss bird not so long ago - also called Katja and my goodness they sure are rampant those bavarian lasses. If he has made an error its probably due to lack of sleep.
Fran Kearney
36 Posted 13/01/2014 at 16:32:14
Great report, Paul,

It's a shame some posters on here feel the need to disect your very comprehensive view of the game and performance ratings, trying to score points like children is not clever, same old crowd dishing out the same old sarcasm. have a go yourselvesif you think its so easy,

I've just seen Sam Higgins post, you beat me to it Sam

John Hughes
37 Posted 13/01/2014 at 22:09:15
Just to concur with Sam and Fran.As an exile in the south-west I enjoy Paul's reports very much thank you and let us not forget that there is no right or wrong opinion when it comes to footy. Keep 'em coming Paul and thanks for taking the trouble.
Patrick Murphy
38 Posted 13/01/2014 at 22:29:22
Sam I admire your defence of Paul's report and like most things football related everything is subjective. However you and I could sit next to each other in the best seats at Goodison and still have a completely different view on what took place - A laptop or PC monitor does not in itself make the views of some posters any less valid.

Just in case your wondering I regularly attend the Grand Old Lady.

Stephen Brown
39 Posted 13/01/2014 at 22:25:45
I also really enjoy your reports Paul. the player ratings are always a good way to start a debate as inevitably different people will view the game slightly differently . On Naismith - he isn't really that good but you've got to admire a team player! I hope he can contribute in a small way as he seems like a good pro and decent fella !
Dennis Ng
40 Posted 13/01/2014 at 22:30:02
Phil, David, yea, I was asleep a bit after that last post. I am on Central time, so an extra hour later from east coast.

Figures that the idea was way out there with Naismith. He works hard tho, but best to offload him in the summer, good for both parties.

We can beat rs any day. It's really down to tactics, some luck and quite honestly, refs. Sunday refs are horrible! And from what I heard its not an EPL thing.

Terry Davies
42 Posted 14/01/2014 at 09:00:32
Da iawn, Brian

Add Your Comments

In order to post a comment, you need to be logged in as a registered user of the site.

» Log in now

Or Sign up as a ToffeeWeb Member — it's free, takes just a few minutes and will allow you to post your comments on articles and Talking Points submissions across the site.


About these ads


, placement: 'Below Article Thumbnails', target_type: 'mix' });