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| Thursday, 01 January 1970  32 Comments  [Jump to last]
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Reader Comments (32)

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Tanvir Akram
1 Posted 16/07/2017 at 17:37:05
Walsh weaving his magic. Picking up talented youngsters with a bright future.
Gavin Johnson
2 Posted 16/07/2017 at 17:59:14
Already a regular in the NUFC U23s. Looks like he could be a good one for the future.
Neil Thomas
3 Posted 16/07/2017 at 18:42:04
These are the kind of signings that interest me. I would hate to be seen as a "buy success now" club like Chelsea and Man City.

Our club is all about building from the foundations up with hungry players – not fat cats just here picking up their paycheques.

Jason Broome
4 Posted 16/07/2017 at 18:59:13
The problem with the success of the 80s was that we had an excellent 1st team with no infrastructure to back it up.

An aging stadium, average training facilities and no real investment in the youth.

Now we have everything in place for an amazing future. Lewis Gibson is another step in the right direction.

Long may it continue.

Anthony Dwyer
5 Posted 17/07/2017 at 00:32:02
It's good to bring in talented young players, but Neil @3 I honestly can't agree with you. If Usmanov joined Moshiri and gave Koeman an open chequebook, I for one would be buzzing!

Soz about that.

Andrew Keatley
6 Posted 17/07/2017 at 00:41:43
Neil (#3) – Seems like we are already becoming like Man City and Chelsea; they have led the way in targeting talented youngsters from other academies and signing them up whenever opportunity arises.

Hopefully Gibson signs and eventually becomes a regular first-teamer.

Harry Wallace
7 Posted 17/07/2017 at 01:38:29
Sign him up!
Paul Kossoff
8 Posted 17/07/2017 at 02:57:04
Tanvir, Walsh weaving his magic? Mr Walsh better line up a replacement for Lukaku pronto, and stop wasting time buying up reserves, or we are going to be a, "keep-the-ball, possession-based" Martinez type team with no goals.

Koeman is turning us into another pass pass brigade, pack the team with midfielders, don't lose possession and don't get beat. We can't do that unless we have a team at peak fitness.

Walsh has done fuck all so far, keeper £30 million, centre half £25 million, midfielder £25 million, Rooney £150k a week. Where's the hidden gems in that lot?

I hope I'm wrong but where are the goals coming from?

Darryl Ritchie
9 Posted 17/07/2017 at 03:19:25
I've been reading online that Newcastle fans are not liking this one bit. A kind of a mini Rooney event.
James Watts
10 Posted 17/07/2017 at 03:23:28
Paul (#7)

"Walsh has done fuck all so far, keeper £30 million, centre half £25 million, midfielder £25 million, Rooney £150,000 a week. Where's the hidden gems in that lot?"

Errm... Sandro? The lads he's brought in for U23s? The Nigerian lad on loan at Anderlecht? Last season, Gana & Lookman? All seemingly at decent prices and most of them I'd bet you had never heard of them before being linked. We've also been linked with a multitude of players we've never heard of before, whether they are true or not we'll see.

"I hope I'm wrong but where are the goals coming from?"

Agreed we're still a striker or two short but Sandro, Klaassen & Rooney will score quite a few between them.

"A "keep-the-ball, possession-based" Martinez type team with no goals."

Errm. Up until the last few months of Martinez, we scored for fun. It's just we also let in loads for fun too. And if you think Koeman has a possession-type obsession, you clearly haven't been watching last season or saw what his team were like at Southampton.

You really should think through what you post before posting as it makes you look a tad silly with pretty dumb posts like that.

David Ellis
11 Posted 17/07/2017 at 04:35:04
Paul (#7) – I've got to side with James Watts on this one. Walsh has completely transformed the way we go about transfers. Totally professional. All well planned and well executed.

We are now in the messy end of the business with finding a new No 9 – this won't be easy as clubs don't want to sell their good players and suddenly we are seen as a genuine rival and threat to those who finished above us, but I am confident we will get it done.

Although I think it will be a couple of years before we have another truly great centre forward (after all, we've only had a couple since 1992 – Yakubu and Lukaku).

Alan J Thompson
12 Posted 17/07/2017 at 05:41:30
I'm still trying to work out what the visit to Italy was all about.
Shaun Wilson
13 Posted 17/07/2017 at 06:51:56
I hear they have nice weather, Alan, lol!
Colin Grierson
14 Posted 17/07/2017 at 12:34:31
I agree, Shaun, and the pasta is pretty good too. The sun-kissed tomatoes and the olives (don't forget the olives!)
Peter Roberts
15 Posted 17/07/2017 at 12:38:10
Andrew Keatley (#6)

That may be true but who was the last Chelsea academy graduate to make it into their first team and hold down a regular spot? Similar for Man City, Iheanacho notwithstanding.

They might Hoover up talent but they then farm them out to all corners of the earth and rarely do they find a gem to break into the first team where they buy in the finished article or close to thereof.

We haven't been able to do that and give youth a chance far more willingly. You only to have to look at the likes of Barkley, Davies, Lookman, Calvert-Lewin, Pennington, Galloway, Holgate, Stones in the last 5 years as players who've come either through the academy or signed for the U23 squad and held down a regular first-team squad or bench place at some point or other. No wonder young players want to play for us.

James Morgan
16 Posted 17/07/2017 at 12:52:07
James (#9), well said.
Dermot Byrne
17 Posted 17/07/2017 at 12:56:30
Paul K: the strategy is, thank god, not just about the first team in the coming season. This shows that a longer-term strategy is there too which buys players who will either be great for us on the pitch or good assets to sell later.

As for your worry about goals, it is only 17 July. Chill and give it a bit more time. I reckon you will be pleased. Well... at least less disappointed!

Andrew Keatley
18 Posted 17/07/2017 at 12:59:22
Peter (#14) – That's a very good distinction.

I totally agree that we have a decent track record of promoting academy players into the first team, and that must be a major contributing factor for any young player making the decision to join Everton.

We've also done incredibly well to scout young players who have broken into senior football elsewhere; Stones and Holgate from Barnsley, Calvert-Lewin at Sheffield United, Lookman at Charlton, Galloway at MK Dons. That's been a real success story, and is very different from the stockpiling-then-loan-elsewhere approach of Chelsea.

Andrew Ellams
19 Posted 17/07/2017 at 13:00:34
Steve Walsh is the Director of Football, not searcher of bargains. It's his job to oversee all transfers and get them done. Anybody who thinks that we are going to catch the top 6 by just unearthing a team of Gueyes and Sandros is in for a world of disappointment.
Mike Berry
20 Posted 17/07/2017 at 13:11:52
Great to see we're picking up potential stars of tomorrow at small fees. It's the right thing to do and we could be the envy of many teams, with it seen as good practice in retrospect.
Daniel Lawrence
21 Posted 17/07/2017 at 13:12:59
Be good to hear Bentiez's view on him joining a bigger club...
John Pierce
22 Posted 17/07/2017 at 13:46:32
Andrew Keatley – stockpiling talent is exactly what we are doing. The romantic Everton has in many ways gone.

The addition of the several U23 players is purely the best way to run an academy. The numbers in should mean we generate one or two first teamers, which is great.

But the main reason is profit. At this age, Everton buy low and sell high players who don't make it to lower Premier League / high Championship clubs. The regular profit from these players helps hugely in the pot created for transfers.

And you might ask why would they come? You answered that yourself. They know, even if they don't make the first team, the grounding at Everton near as damn guarantees them a career in footy.

Chelsea might be who you dislike but that model is the one we follow. It will eventually lead to multiple loans.

Dermot Byrne
23 Posted 17/07/2017 at 14:30:46
Bang on, John P!
Martin Mason
24 Posted 17/07/2017 at 14:33:12
Another surge in the stream of positivity coming from the club. A real shame for youngsters that the step from U23 to first team squad is getting to be a chasm now but all we can do is make sure we have good youngsters at U23 level, pray that just a few make the transition, and that those who don't move on to good teams having been improved by us.
Dave Abrahams
25 Posted 17/07/2017 at 14:51:12
Martin (#24), I wouldn't mind betting that five or six of last years U23s will get quite a few games in the first team this season. Davies and Holgate have already had a taste. They should be followed by Kenny, Walsh, Calvert-Lewin with Lookman a certainty; Dowell, if he doesn't go on loan, will be another.

That's not bad, Martin, and hopefully will be carried on in the next few years.

Andrew Keatley
26 Posted 17/07/2017 at 14:54:20
John Pierce (#24) – I think there is a large distance to travel from where we are – picking up the odd young player from other academies/lower division sides – to having about 38 players out on loan like Chelsea had last season.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/sep/01/chelsea-38-players-loan-who-where

Not every club is going to follow that model. The numbers don't work. We'll be roughly where we are, unless we hit a rich vein of on-field success, in which case, we might be able to speculate a bit more.


John Pierce
27 Posted 17/07/2017 at 15:13:41
Andrew – Chelsea will be the model we follow not necessarily emulate.

As you say, 38 players is frankly ludicrous and scamming the system. We are moving in that direction and will continue to do so, because we can and the rules allow it.

For what is worth, I'm against the whole loan system. Prem to Prem loans should be banned outright. If you are a Premier league side then you should have no need to loan from the same division.

Limiting others loans, to a set number would stop the influx of 'bought' talent and discourage this type of approach. Especially the 'loan-to-buy approach'. It would allow players to flourish IN a lower league team, rather than on loan from an academy were they don't get 1st team action.

But back to the point, Everton are buying talent, which ever way you look at it. You say "the odd player" – this window alone, we've bought in half a team's worth.

Teddy Bertin
28 Posted 17/07/2017 at 15:23:24
Paul Kossoff (#8) – you really are a prat sometimes. Walsh and team behind the scenes have worked harder and more efficiently than any team at any other club in Europe for the last 3 months.

The most exciting transfer window in Everton's history, every other club looking to Everton and wondering how they are getting such amazing deals over the line, and you say that our Director of Football has done fuck all.

Those type of comments are what make people behind the scenes give up on trying to communicate with football fans. Can you name a Director of Football from any club in the world who has achieved more in the last 3 months?

Did we not just beat off 47 other clubs, including Arsenal to sign Henry Onyekuru?

Did we not just ward off the likes of the Italian Champions and Champions League finalists to sign Sandro Ramirez?

Have we not just sold a striker for 3 times what we bought him for, in what was probably, or very close to a world record fee?

That's without mentioning the other 7 players that have been signed and without mentioning the fact that Steve Walsh has flown all around Europe discussing deals for other plays too.

From all that, I think most people would agree with you that Steve Walsh and his team have done "fuck-all" since coming in. Moron

Mike Gaynes
29 Posted 17/07/2017 at 15:28:58
John #27, why do you oppose the loan system? No opinion myself, just curious.

The idea of loaning players from one team to another is totally alien here in the US... none of the sports or leagues here do it.

Martin Mason
30 Posted 17/07/2017 at 16:03:23
Dave @25, I really hope so. For me it'll perhaps be a nicer measurement of success than just becoming another club that tries to do it with big buys. I'm happy that we still look for value.
John Pierce
31 Posted 17/07/2017 at 16:14:59
Mike,

Ah, where to begin! The system, like many things was created to help sides that needed cover for a short period time before money came into the game. For a month or perhaps three.

Now it's used to farm players you own without you actually playing them in your team. This is mostly at the top level. Many academy players can get better wages for this than playing first-team football lower down the pyramid. The hilarity is if sold before 23/24 the parent club gets a development fee when all they have done is lent them to another club. Simplistic yes, but you get my drift.

The loan system is there to help out, if a Premier League side cannot find a space for an academy product then maybe they have too many on their squad.

Take Lukaku for instance we got him on loan, why? He wasn't playing games and Chelsea realized he would easily damage his opponents playing for Everton and contractually he couldn't play against them. That's too much of conflict of interest for me. No player should be loaned to a team in its own division.

If the loan system was limited then clubs would be forced to play talent and Premier league teams couldn't stock pile them. A player at age 21 say would rack up 100+ appearances in a lower league team, rather than an academy player who might have a handful of games and is nowhere near as seasoned. It hurts the quality of the lower leagues.

There is so much more to this subject, than meets the eye, and is worth a delve. Such as the parent club paying most of the wages of a loan player. Can that be right? If you can't afford him then you won't be able to buy him.

We are now in the age of the super loan, were promising players are deemed too good to go down the leagues and teams will only loan to other European top divisions or premier league clubs. Or they stay in the academy were the standard of football is not great.

Welcome any thoughts, just my opinion that clubs big and small need better regulation when it comes to the loan system.

Mike Gaynes
32 Posted 17/07/2017 at 17:59:34
Thanks for the summary, John. Again, I have no particular opinion myself on this, although from my distant observation it seems to be a system that works well for the player and the clubs.

I just remember that talented mess we loaned to Blackpool some years back. Nine high-pressure promotion and playoff games, ending in a Wembley final, made a big difference in Coleman's maturity on the pitch. (And obviously Blackpool were ecstatic with his contribution.) Plus I've seen comments from other posters in years past that Ozzie's loans to Carlisle and Derby were the making of his career.

So if, as you say, academy players get better wages and more opportunity to pile up senior game experience, what's the downside for them? If it gives the Prem team a better-developed player and the lower-division side a needed helping hand, what's their incentive to stop doing it?

I do definitely see your point about the ethics of Prem to Prem loans. It would be totally weird to see the NBA Lakers lending a power forward to the Clippers for half a season and paying his wages – on condition that he not play against them. That aspect is bizarre. But having cheered so many of Rom's goals, would I be a hypocrite to criticize the system that brought him to us?

It's an interesting topic. Thanks again.

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