Pickford happy at Everton and looking for the club to kick on

Now get a couple of players in who can score some goals for us and we can look forward to a better season.

My son says he doesn't control shots well enough, spilling them often into dangerous positions. He also thinks Pickford is erratic, and the backline can never be settled properly with him in goal.

I told my son I'd wager Pickford saved us 9 points each of the last two seasons. His biggest downside for me was early in his career when he'd use that nuclear leg of his and bomb it down the pitch, out kicking everyone, straight into the opposing keeper's hands and we'd simply concede possession back to the opponent thanks to that continual braindead move. Or blow it into touch trying to find a teammate down the wings (sides of the pitch for you non-American language fans).

Jordan has improved significantly in that regard, and I now think his distribution as he's developed as a keeper is absolutely superb.

I truly believe without Pickford we would have been relegated the last two seasons. He stops so many would-be goals it's simply insane.

We have to keep him. He's the best keeper I've personally seen for Everton - and it pains me to say that as he easily beats Captain America Tim Howard.

9 points I'd bet he saved us. He's invaluable. And he's been fantastic at improving the weaker parts of his game over time.

So who's right? My son, or me?

Goalkeeping has changed over the years, they are a different breed now. The balls used in the various competitions are different, perhaps smaller, lighter than before, so move around more, making life more complicated for goalies.

As for Pickford, he frustrates me but he's England No 1 so he'll do for me.

I guess we're lucky that his family is settled because to think a lad from the northeast has loyalty to Everton makes no sense.

That's because what we'd want for him is what he's worth.

I've seen them all since the late 1950s and Pickford is the best, bar Southall.

A first-class goalkeeper is just as valuable as a first-class striker; maybe more so as the 'keeper can keep you in a game until the striker scores.

Without him, I have no doubt whatsoever we'd have been relegated – if not this last season but the one before, too.

Get the takeover done asap, get some finances available within P&S rules and get our decent targets in before the new season. Then we will have a fighting chance of a better league position and keeping our Premier League status.

However anyone who doesn't think Pickford is a top keeper and our best player is wrong. End of.

😃

And while I agree any player could be had for the right price, which for us is probably £70 million, and anyone’s head could get turned for that amount, I do genuinely believe he loves our club and is happy to be here, which matters a lot given the state of our club.

Pure speculation, but if say a Saudi club came in for him at an obscene number, I think he’d turn it down. Manure and it might be another story.

Flitting between "great save" and "WTF???" isn't for me and I think for many neutrals and I can't imagine it makes for a calm defence. A steady eddie comfortable on the basics such as commanding his area would be my preference but that's not Pickingtons.

In fairness I haven't seen an all round decent keeper in years maybe this is symptomatic of why fans of other clubs pile in on him despite him being England's number one. Although being an England player is no longer the accolade it once was.

There’s a long road ahead, this season, and I’m not gonna get complacent, but there’s a better sense of being, than this time last season.

Sean Dyche has instilled discipline and respect into this squad, and they won’t get beaten without a battle on the pitch.

I hope there’s more incoming players of course, for me strikers and a CB, perhaps Branthwaite, will get his chance, to start, and not too many injuries from the preseason fixtures.

UTFTs!

As to the debate of if he’s the best keeper we’ve had, for those old enough he couldn’t lay a glove on big Nev - pun intended.

As for more recent GKs, I’m quite fond of Nigel Martin, who did a great job between the sticks and doesn’t get the credit he should imo. I guess we all have our differing views and there’s no right or wrong. I’d put Martin above Howard and Pickford myself.

Pulled off lot's of World class saves during the season when defensively we were generally all at sea.

Great that he is staying. I felt for sure he was going to move and I wouldn't blame him one bit.

Just like him we all hope the club will kick on this year and see no more of the shenanigans near the foot of the table that we all suffered yet again.

I agree with Bill @12, saved us from relegation twice and comfortably our best goalkeeper since Big Nev.

"Let's be honest: he's only staying because no club will pay what we want for him".

There are three assumptions here in a single sentence about which, like the rest of us, you know nothing.

The first is that you assume he wants to leave; the second is that you assume Everton want to sell with a price in mind; and the third is that no other club would meet this price.

Poor stuff, Paul.

What do you actually base your statement on, by the way?

Some here will laugh, but I truly believe Picks to be the best short-range reflex shot-stopper in the world. Of the others I've seen, only Onana and Jose Sa are even close. And nobody on earth makes that Chelsea save except Jordan Pickford. Nobody.

Plus I really like the way he has worked to improve the previous weaknesses in his game -- distribution, demeanor, and dropping or tipping high crosses. He is significantly better and more mature in all three of those areas than he was a couple of years ago.

I'm ecstatic that he's staying.

If it was Liar Bill instead, OMG...he would ended up giving us another Rooney Fire Sale (the Pu Pu Platter for those on the American side of the Pond): not enough cash up front (a return of £27 Million in early 2000s was disgracefully low for a Generational Talent like Rooney) AND the subsequent "obligations" to purchase rejects from Manc, notwithstanding Howard & Neville have given us great services (Not in a million years would I swap Rooney in a deal for Howard, Neville & the Cash REMAINED AFTER THEIR PURCHASES).

Nonetheless, still very happy that Pickford is staying. Without him, we would have been looking at a league fixture list with Bristol, Preston, Coventry & Sunderland.

Overall I think he is a brilliant shot stopper and can create breakaways with his distribution.

Totally agree mate. Evertonians have much to complain about but the narrative bashing Pickford is IMHO madness.

Talk about quick, he's gone from Switzerland to Hoylake and back in an afternoon while Virginia has been promoted over the 35 year old understudy. Still, you know where you read it.

The weight may not have changed but it has been said that the extra "wobble" and speed through the air is caused by the ball being made more round but it most certainly doesn't become waterlogged like the old casey did. Or to paraphrase Bobby Collins, "He wouldn't know which side the ball is laced".

I admit to being a Jordan convert.

I have criticised him. That Anfield moment. Erratic. Doesn't command the box or come out of the six yard box very often. More comfortable close to the goal line. Punts the ball like a Rugby player. I wish he sometimes would get a stronger hand on those parry's, but let's not take away the fact he kept the ball out in the first instance. Where are the defenders following up?

We should always remember, the Keeper is the literally the last line of defence, so laws of average come into account.

Let's not forget, he has spent most of his career playing in struggling teams in Sunderland and Everton. Hardly surprising there will be mistakes.

However, I don't think there is a better shot stopper in the Premier league and he is maturing.

It is not an understatement that he kept us in the Premier League these past two seasons.

There are probably more examples, but that incredible sequence of saves against Chelsea where I think I stopped breathing for 30 seconds and almost had to reach for my inhaler.

The penalty save against Leicester.

The outstretched leg against Wolves.

And don't underestimate that late save against Bournemouth when their player almost replicated Doucoure's strike. If that went in, we were down.

I know anyone is saleable in the game and words are nice. But I generally get a feel for players based on their reaction.

Jordan is very much in connection with the supporters. You see that at the match.

I would suggest if he is sold, it will be the club, not him, as we have seen in the past.

As we head to Wigan next week and get ready for Fulham next month, I'll take this as a positive.

He has matured and hit the prime years. It's great to have at least one player in the team that's Top 6 worthy.

Some players should only be sold if you are going to take the buying club to the cleaners!

The least of our worries him being in the team, when you have such obvious gaps in the team elsewhere.

That's why I said if he was to be sold it would be the club's decision. Not his. He clearly isn't pushing for a move if you take his words at face value.

Alan Ball and more recently, Wayne Rooney spring to mind.

Both came out in hindsight and said they didn't want to leave. The club made those decisions. Even the murky circumstances in which Duncan Ferguson was sold to Newcastle was the club, not the player, by all accounts.

Us supporters often take our anger out on the player. When the reality is that is usually the club making the decision and happy to hang the player out to dry and let the masses vent their anger, deflecting from those who made the decision.

No delusion here. Just reality.

And Paul # 43, how do you know Pickford actually wants to go to Man Utd? He's said all summer he doesn't want to leave Everton. Man Utd paid £80M for that donkey Harry Maguire, so I'm pretty certain they would have paid the asking price for Pickford, who has probably got another 10 years of top-flight football left in him.

Maybe I know sod all!

Keepers are notoriously shouty characters.

Just as strikers are selfish and need an arm around them now and then.

Paul, lighten up. Jordan may well end up playing for Everton in Europe.

Common sense based on facts!

Alan @ 36 makes the correct point. Certainly there have been technical innovations over the years making the ball move around more meaning goalies are more likely to punch rather than grab the ball.

I imagine we can agree that the ball is still round but even then, it seems there may be different versions of what is considered 'round'.

I wouldn't say Gordon West was much further behind – he was a great goalie… only Gordon Banks kept him out of the England side.

I don't feel there is much point in comparing him with former ‘keepers, as the context is that this is the worst Everton side in maybe 50 years, and it is Pickford's consistency under continuing pressure that has kept us up for two seasons running.

I, myself, have been a critic at times but, in the state that our club is in with constant change, I now see his dedication as something that needs to be cherished, and I feel that Dyche is the right manager to keep him focussed.

I can't comment on Ted Sagar but I think you're doing a gross disservice to Gordon West.

Pickford has his limitations (mainly physical attributes) but there's not many better around at the moment – and certainly none we could afford. The fact that he is willing to stay is good news!

Ted Sagar was the bravest Everton goalkeeper I've seen as well as being very good, playing on those mud heaps of pitches and being bashed and shoulder-charged in the days when ‘keepers were not protected by referees. Ted was slight and very agile, as I remember, and I only saw him in the later years of his career.

Neville Southall is still the best goalie I've seen for Everton and I think you really under-estimate Gordon West – he played in the days when referees turned a blind eye to some of the rough treatment they came under.

But it's all about opinions and I think fans who point out Pickford's faults, and he has a few, are just stating some obvious points about his game. He is a great shot-stopper but I don't think he is a great goalkeeper.

From all the Everton goalkeepers that I have seen over many years, Pickford is genuinely the best distributor of the ball by a keeper that I can recall. He is much more than just a stopper in my view.

And George Best when asked of his opinion of Gordon Banks said that he had a problem kicking and then in the next Home International showed exactly what he meant although his goal was disallowed for foot up but his studs always pointed to the ground and Banks had let go of the ball. And I'd still reckon if he was playing now and at his prime Banks would still be the best in the world, and West was right behind him and who knows where if he hadn't turned down going to the World Cup in Mexico.

Sure, he has his weaknesses - his lack of size will deter some people, and personally I think he is very weak in one-on-one situations - but he has certainly proved his worth to Everton and England over the last four or five seasons. A big plus for the club if he stays another year or more.

Some fans need to stop the constant criticism of the players already at the club because we need to hang on to them all and get the best out of them. The club should stop thinking we need to sell to buy because no one is interested in coming here.

What young player would want to join Everton and run the risk of being continually slagged off by some our fans and put unnecessary pressure on themselves.

There may be a few older players in the Ashley Young mold who don't want to go to Saudi, who want to stay in the Premier League, who we can get and that's it. Sign them, keep above the relegation zone, press reset for 24/25 and maybe then we can move on.

But for now keep everyone and sign the few experienced players who will come to us on a free. That is the reality!

Those that do this in my opinion remain stuck in their expectations from the past. Expectations are afterall the birthplace of disappointment. I feel sorry for you that you can't talk about Pickford without being critical.

We are extremely lucky that he is happy playing for us, he has worked hard to iron out the more obvious struggles with his game. In the past 2.5/3 seasons he has been outstanding for us and deservedly kept his England no 1 status. Personally I can't believe Chelsea or Utd didn't come in for him.

As much as I really like him, I think had Utd come in with an offer of Henderson and anything north of £35M we would have had to seriously consider it. Not because we want him to go but because it would have been good business. That hasn't happened and I hope we can build a new look Everton side around him.

Since I’ve resigned myself to Bill Kenwright staying, then my expectations can only be filled with joy, because I’m fed up with being disappointed!!

My own view is that everything in that statement with regards to Everton football club, sums up the Bill Kenwright era Steve. “Don’t strive - survive”

Pickford is good, but what’s wrong with giving any footballer some constructive criticism? I have always judged a big part of any goalkeeper’s game, on the saves he doesn’t have to make.

Wether you are a forward, a midfielder, a defender or even a referee, then the most important position on the pitch, has always been your starting position. Sometimes I think this is Jordan Pickford’s biggest flaw, and if he could improve this, then he would also improve his overall game, because he would suddenly have to make fewer saves?

I wouldn't disagree with that list.

Maybe I'd put Pickford ahead of Howard, but that is a minor point really.

For me and my generation it will always be Southall. Although most of us us remember that save at White Hart Lane, I think the one he made at Hillsborough was on a par.

The half-time sit down protest in frustration at half-time on the first day of the standards not being good enough.

Two league titles. Two FA Cups. A European Trophy. A winner with attitude. No wonder he wasn't welcomed into the Bill club.

I was too young to remember, so I don't know how good he was, but I always had a soft spot for George Wood. Only because he was the first Everton player I met in person outside the players' entrance at the Main Stand. I still have the photo.

Nigel Martyn is the next best I've seen. What a shame we didn't sign him first time around. If the story is true, he was set on signing for Everton but we enticed him with a hamper offer, so he walked out and went to Leeds.

So the story goes.

Widening the keeper debate. Southall, Buffon, Neuer, Schmeicel Senior.

I'm probably being unkind to a generation of British keepers. Shilton, Clemence and Jennings. I'm not old enough to remember Gordan Banks.

Yes, he does make mistakes but so does every other player on the pitch. His position is what gets his mistakes so heavily criticized as it could lead to a goal, as other players mistakes normally have coverage.

Having a good keeper also provides confidence in the players ahead of him, and being first choice for England shows the confidence the manager and players also have in him.

Top teams usually have a good spine and that is Keeper Central Defender and Striker, we just need a proficient Striker that will improve the overall improvement of the team…

Far from it. My opinion is that the current team (poor though it is by today's standards) would beat the all conquering eighties team.

Perhaps, some of us oldies have a wider perspective?

Actually, it's impossible to make definitive comparisons. Could Pickford have coped with the permitted aggression on goalies of yesteryear? Or with the heavy laced balls? Or wearing no gloves?

Could West and Southall have coped as well with the modern lighter ball? How would they have coped with the required foot and distribution skills of the modern game?

It seems like a thick market this window but no top level blockbusters that several teams are waiting on. From that I would expect some late flurries of transfers

We are a fire sale, everyone is up for grabs, this is just another cover story to hide the shit we are in.

Quite right.
I’ve given up checking who’s coming in, I’ll believe it when they come through the door.
Deadline day late deals await, again!!!!

I'm very pleased - and even more relieved that there is no chance of any kind of deal involving Maguire.

Mike Gaynes, I don't think you are over the top in your effusive praise of Jordan. A top, top shot stopper.

The image of an entirely rudderless ship sinking at a rate of knots with all hands jumping into the lifeboats is slightly negated.

Ever so slightly.

Pickford deserves a lot of praise imo, because he didn’t have to sign that new contract last season, but he has been a model professional since he joined Everton, and could have easily acted the goat and agitated for a more considering how poor we have been these last two seasons.

1 pints is good

2 pints your mellow

3 pints your happy

4 pints your maulding,

5 pints your sad

6 pints your belligerent

7 pints your unconscious!

8 pints you wake up wondering were you are and why...

OMG, memories of St Benets social on a Sat night..

When folks here talk about keepers needing to command their area to be great, I always bring up Banks, one of the greatest ever... who wasn't particularly good on crosses.

Just back from holiday - alcohol free - but missed all there news due to lack od signal. Question Off Topic - What's the latest on your mate Kenwright - has he gone yet??

I'm glad he wants to stay, but everyone's in the right job till they find a better one...

Hes England's no1, he's established himself there for his country playing for us, The majority of Evertoians support him, He's maturing and actually getting better and think the next few years are going to be his best !

A footballer who isn't chasing an extra 50k a week ?
A footballer who seems to be showing genuine loyalty?
Who'd have thought it ?

Deserves the armband after Seamus !

But what it came to was a gathering "outside'' of the pub, drinking on the pavement. I intended to toast 'Absent Friends' but decided to toast under my breath, and I was thinking of your Uncle Tommy.

I'm not sure, to be honest. I'm back swimming every day so maybe I'm on the change from the chlorine. Certainly no mileage left in banging the "We're doomed by Moshiri and the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock" drum, it's not even a debate anymore.

That said, Westy was a legend. He joined Blackpool (always used to be a fertile area/club for us) in 1960 having gone for a trial as a defender, seriously.

At the trial he opted to try out as a 'keeper, and got taken on. He was competing against Tony Waiters for a game, and Waiters went on to win a few England caps in 1964, nonetheless Westy showed enough in his 30 Blackpool games for Everton to sign him in 1962.

From thereon, and in a time where there were loads more English goalies than now, he got better and better (and not least in my opinion because Andy Rankin was an excellent goalie too, playing second fiddle to Westy).

He was as good as Banks, and his distribution was as good as could be given his ability to accurately throw the ball at real pace to the likes of Husband and Morrissey.

Those who saw him cherish his memory, and not least because 'keepers in those days received nowhere close to the protection from refs enjoyed for decades now by those plying that skill.

Steep membership fees here so I reckon they've got the crocs covered although rodents might be a problem. Heard someone extolling the virtues of Klopp the other day and whilst not a naturalist I'm pretty sure that's vermin behaviour.

Andy is on his way down after palming this thunderbolt from Roger Hunt over the bar in front of the cop. We went on to win 1- 4.

Link

It was a great save but don't give those bastards an inch; it was 4-0 not 4-1, with Harvey, Pickering, Temple and Johnny Morrissey finishing them off with a second-half goal scored in the Kop, and there wasn't an awful lot of Kopites keeping us company after that fourth goal went in!

I was half way up the Anfield Rd terraces and had a perfect view from behind Roger Hunt.

There was much merriment in Moorfields after that game!! ;)

As for Moorfields there was always plenty of merriment in Moorfields every night of the week once a few large whites had been consumed, sadly that place has gone along with the many characters who frequented that lovely gaff !

However, given our dire financial straits and the desperate need to sign proven goalscorers, I'm inclined to sacrifice both Pickford and Onana. The latter has never impressed me at all since his arrival and Dyche needs to cash in on both, in order to strengthen the squad.

In the short term, the likes of Tom Heaton could be acquired for a nominal fee, to do a more than adequate job for us. The goalkeepers we already have providing back up.

It's a question of financial pragmatism and realistically prioritising weaknesses in the squad.