The Everton Commercial Promotion Scandal

It is an absolute disgrace and makes a laughing stock of our club around the world. From an overall company management perspective, we are a very small club. Please, Everton – start showing some ambition!

Agree with every word Steve.....its quite depressing walking around the sports shops and seeing Man City, Man Utd, Chelsea let alone the RS represented in our city and not Everton. When in John Lennon airport the other week thereÂ’s a huge statue of Gerrard waiting to greet you when you go to the waiting lounge FFS.

We constantly try to make out that Evertonians come from Liverpool and the RS fans are all home counties/Norwegians/Irish etc but even if that still holds any water it wonÂ’t do for long. What kid when walking around Liverpool and all he sees is RS advertisement and nothing from Everton is going to choose Everton to support?? If the EFC commercial side donÂ’t do anything proactive soon then a whole generation of potential new fans will be lost to the dark side, let alone trying to make any money from commercial activities. The club is rotten from top to bottom at the moment and if the club donÂ’t recognise this and start to rectify these issues then the only way we are going is to slide further into obscurity and with a dwindling crowd because we couldnÂ’t be bothered to attract the next generation.

Its a pathetic state of affairs really that the club we all love is being run by egotistical arrogant amateurs that donÂ’t appear to have the clubs best interest at heart and the chief culprit IÂ’m afraid is Bill Kenwright. Far from being a "wonderful Evertonian" he is keeping hold of Everton by hook or by crook, deceiving us into believing he wants to sell the club when in reality he is just looking to find people who will "donate" money to the club while he remains in charge.....not an attractive prospect by anyone looking to invest, hence nobody does. The least he could do is to make sure the club from top to bottom maximises their potential from the playing staff to the manager to the business side of the club, yet all appear to be in a state of inertia. Everton Football Club is currently a rudderless ship with absolutely no one at the helm and we are drifting into a shit storm of epic proportions in the future and nobody at the club appears to care one iota.

I was driving down Breck Road the other day and had never noticed before, every bloody lampost had a RS Banner on it.

The whole City reflects a one Club City and it is not Everton.

Kitbag deal was madness personified. Yes we receive a said amount whatever the sales but the fact is it has stopped the club expanding its commercial base.

Whoever was responsible for that fiasco should have gone a long time ago.

Then why arenÂ’t the two shops full with people buying all the EFC range? Simple, the demand isnÂ’t there. I buy loads for my son but wouldnÂ’t been seen dead in an EFC top. Stop moaning. We have two shops in the centre and a website you can buy from no matter where you are on the planet! Yet every season we still have a sale and kits on offer for a 㾶!

Next time you go the game have a look around, most fans donÂ’t wear colours at all. We had shops at Central station and in the Wirral before we had to close them due to lack of sales! Stop coming on with these stupid rants, the demand just isnÂ’t there before this deal, which I agree is too long we lost nearly half a million pounds on merchandise now we make minimum three million.

It was a good deal but should have been 3/5 years max. If you want a top just go and buy one? Instead of posting on here, you couldÂ’ve got yourself a top by now. Or are you to busy holding up a "Kenwright Out" flag at half-time at Villa Park? What an idiot he was; team down two-nil and the chairman allegedly unwell and some fathead does that. Time and place to protest and we all have that right ... but then? Seriously!

Alan, this article is correct and whoever runs EvertonÂ’s commercial "department" is a disgrace.

The Premier League in the last 15 years, and especially the last 3-4, is becoming hugely popular worldwide and we are not taking advantage. Whereas in the early 2000s I had to go to one of a handful of bars here in NYC that carried games on Setanta Sports or whatever channel it was then and showed Premier League games to cater to mostly British and Irish expats, now there are supporter bars everywhere in New York.

I have walked into sporting goods shops in New York many times and seen Tottenham Hotspur, Ajax, Celtic, Roma shirts for sale, these are not exactly glamour clubs playing for the Champions League title every year. Another example: My parents retired to a small town in South Carolina, and in their town they have a little specialty store with British goods and trinkets. They have fucking NEWCASTLE UNITED mugs!! They even have PORTSMOUTH baseball caps on the shelves!?!! Pompey, playing in League fucking 2!!!! I actually asked the owner why he stocked these, and he said he basically bought whatever Premier League items were available through his wholesaler. Well, why are fucking Newcastle mugs available to sit on shelves of the "British Curiosity Shoppe" in the middle of South Fucking Carolina, but not Everton ones?!???? Someone has colossally failed.

Think youÂ’re seriously missing the point Alan. If Everton tops were available in the major sports stores then the casual shopper would be more inclined to buy one.

I see you have managed to totally ignore the points about not seeing anything Everton in the city and RS plastered everywhere....its no wonder that we have this sense of we are ceasing to exist in the public eye when people like you think we are being unreasonable for complaining. If you want to sit on your behind and accept everything that is going on then fine, thatÂ’s your perogative, however I choose to air my views in the hope someone may listen and not just accept the easy route that a few years ago people didnÂ’t buy stuff at central station and over the water then theres no demand. We may as well all give up with that attitude. By the way, it was confirmed earlier in the week that there was nothing wrong with Kenwright so the protester with the banner had every right.

By the way, a lot of fans, myself included, does wear colours so IÂ’m not sure what youÂ’re basing that fact on

There is a lot of Everton fans in Ireland. If we want to buy anything, itÂ’s through the website.

My mate ordered a large t-shirt. Medium was sent to him. He had to send it back. All this hassle. And try and get into the club shop on match days. ItÂ’s a nightmare.

I think the club gear should b in all major sports shops.

It is piss poor. While on holiday in Oz I couldnÂ’t find Everton merchandise anywhere and arguably their best player of recent times played for us. We should have a massive fan base there. IÂ’d also just like to comment on how poor the quality of UmbroÂ’s brand is which in my opinion was another disaster.

A rubbish brand which disappeared and then resurfaced with the same poor quality product and material. When the Umbro deal was announced I was gutted and knew straight away yet again EFC had let us down with this second rate brand. Has it been disclosed yet how much the Umbro deal is worth over the five years??? Absolute shite.

We have missed the boat massively. We should have aggressively labelled ourselves as AustraliaÂ’s favourite Premier League team with advertising and posters of Cahill. The fella is a national icon over there. Same for Howard in the US.

We have a loyal fan base, who will always buy kits etc for their kids birthdays and Christmas. But we have not expended this market at all. The people who buy our merchandise will always buy it.

We are a complacent club in this respect.

Yeah the Howard, Obama was a missed trick then Justin Bieber playing in an Everton shirt. Could have sold a few million shirts on the last one alone. Look at Paddy Power or Ryanairs marketing. Someone needs to get a kick up the back side in our Marketing dept.

Dave Ganley you are 100% right, Alan Williams you fell for Bill and BobbyÂ’s excuses.

Way out of their depth. Spend the extra TV money on redeveloping Goodison, not excessive player wages, but better still employ some top notch Marketing people. There seem to be a lot of good ideas and opportunities around the Club and yet they are never followed through and capitalised on.

Alan has only made the same mistake that those who lead the club make - they are so convinced that the majority if not all Evertonians live, work and shop in the City of Liverpool that they forget about the rest of the world. That may have been the case many years ago it is no longer true. I live outside the area now but was born in Liverpool and apart from visiting Goodison Park I spend very little time in the City itself, not by choice but by demands on time etc.

There is a world full of football supporters throughout the UK and way beyond who would if given the opportunity buy Everton stuff, there have been far too many posts on this site to think otherwise. The stock situation has been well documented throughout the years and that hasnÂ’t changed yet, then there is the lateness of the arrival of new kits, when most people buy stuff for their kids to wear on holiday well before the start of the new season.

The reason that the City Centre and Speke etc are full of stuff marketing the other lot is because they claim or are responsible for many tourists coming to the city in the first place, that shouldnÂ’t be a reason not to run a similar campaign because many people come to the City who donÂ’t have an allegiance with the other lot and who knows we may generate new fans or customers if we did.

I understand what Alan meant and he is correct in some ways because Â’localÂ’ Evertonians are notorious for not buying every trinket, replica shirt etc that is produced and in many cases the affordability of such items is prohibitive to a large section of the fan-base, raising the money for season tickets or match tickets is often difficult enough without thinking about other items. But if the club are to compete then they do have to at least test the market outside of the confines of the City of Liverpool.

I partly agree with Mr ElstoneÂ’s rant in post #5, our own outlets were losing money which was being drained out of the Club. But they could have struck a deal with a company that had the distribution network to ship merchandise nationally and internationally instead of taking the shortsighted view of grabbing the money.

Eric #14 now now play fair. You have to respect AlanÂ’s position, if IÂ’d been treated to corporate hospitality as much as others have, IÂ’d probably leap to their defence.

I mean at least BillÂ’s a blue, right? ThatÂ’s about as far as I can go.

Pat (#13), I live in Essex and my son wants for nothing when it comes to EFC merchandise, the only problem I have is my wife telling me to stop buying him stuff and itÂ’s very easy for me to get hold of things.

If you read my post, I actually say the deal was good at the time but was too long, so I agree: itÂ’s an outdated approach but what annoys me is people spend the time to moan and tell everybody they canÂ’t get hold of merchandise yet the time it takes to post on TW you could have easily purchased an item from EFC online.

I go the game with about 8 adults and only one wears colours. I looked around me on Saturday at Villa and at least 60/70% of fans donÂ’t wear colours; itÂ’s not what we do. DonÂ’t get me wrong: I have no problem with people wearing tops; I just cant. All I have is loads OF EFC shorts that I take on holiday and live in at home.

As regards the idiot with the flag "Kenwright Out", yes, I will continue to call him an idiot for the simple reason: What’s the point of getting him out if we have nobody to replace him? Plus as usual you all forget the simple fact he doesn’t own EFC – he only has 27%. So if any person wanted to purchase EFC they don’t even need to speak with him, hostile takeover could easily be done or muted if the said person or consortium had the actual intent to purchase EFC.

To date nobody, I repeat nobody has ever officially come out and stated so: believe me it is very easy to call Kenwright’s bluff if you have the cash to buy EFC. As I said before, nothing wrong with protesting to or against the Chairman but asking him to get out with no alternative is a complete waste of time and does nothing but damage to the fans base. The BU made a big mistake personalising the battle with Kenwright and it failed. Unless we have a Plan B, then you need to work with the current custodians to force change and that needs to be done by constructive dialogue – not by drawing lines between sides.

If you wish to take issues or even demonstrate, feel free... but it will only win if you take the upper ground, this isn’t an industrial dispute; it’s our club so if both sides have a respect for each others position (you don’t have to like them) then that’s a basis to start, not by abusing each other – and I include Kenwright in that criticism.

I donÂ’t think this is solely about buying merchandise Alan. I think it is about how the ClubÂ’s name is promoted, either to visitors to Liverpool or further afield such as Australia and USA. We have missed some open goals with Cahill, Howard, Pienaar and the City of Culture to name but a few.

On the subject of merchandise, you have to put it in front of people to make impulse buys. Not everyone is like you and logging on to the Everton website continually.

Where I work we had a new computer system with as much data and info contained within it as you could ever want. All the KPI Boards were taken down as the information could all be found on that system. However, it required people to take the time to access it and gradually the Company realised people knew less than ever! Thus was because they had to actively search for information, rather than have it staring them
in the face on office walls. The Boards are now back up again!

Relating that to this scenario is that, if you know you want a black tee-shirt in medium, you will search it out. But, if you hadnÂ’t planned on buying anything specifically Everton, you wonÂ’t go looking for it on a website. People tend to buy on impulse, touch, sight and feel. Shopping online is a different experience altogether.

Richard Kenyon is the director responsible for Marketing & Communications.

Alan Williams - agree with most of what you say and in particular about a buyer of EFC.

However, when it comes to online and websites, I think you miss loads of points. Quite simply why do loads of other clubs have just websites???? It’s because they sell more by having their items in other shops – people like looking at items in flesh before buying and also promoting brand and impulse buys.

Also, like someone else said, surely Cahill, Howard and Pienaar, who I think was the face of the South Africa World Cup, could have been used as marketing tools to better effect.

Dear ToffeeWeb,

I recently submitted an article about EvertonÂ’s Promotions. I wonder would you tell me why it wasnÂ’t suitable for publication?

I have written to the Club about this same subject and ...... nothing, not even the decency of a reply.

I wonder why this subject is deemed so taboo, not even yourselves will print it.

IÂ’m mystified!!!!

The problem is Bill Kenwright wouldnÂ’t know a good manager if he fell over one.

He is too used to it being the Bill show that he forgets all about delegation and surrounding yourself with good people.

All he has surrounded himself with is his cronies who are getting a great return on their share investment while doing nothing for the club and Bobby Elstone, a good accountant but Chief exec of a top Premier League club – never.

Maybe IÂ’m just missing the whole point (as IÂ’m someone who has no interest in purchasing club merchandise anyway), but I donÂ’t get why people feel so strongly about this that the subject is brought up on here at least twice every season.

"What kid when walking around Liverpool and all he sees is RS advertisement and nothing from Everton is going to choose Everton to support?? If the EFC commercial side donÂ’t do anything proactive soon then a whole generation of potential new fans will be lost to the dark side."

Alright, who here ended up supporting Everton solely, mainly, or partly, due to some promotional campaign, commercial venture or tatty bit of merchandise spotted in a store window? For most, IÂ’d guess it boils down to their arl fella, family history, maybe a particular player, memorable match, or a myriad of other reasons more significant than spotting a coffee mug with the club crest whilst out on a shopping trip, or being awed by a big poster of James Beattie advertising support bras for boys with jugs.

"There is a world full of football supporters throughout the UK and way beyond who would if given the opportunity buy Everton stuff."

Does the online store not do international shipping then? Surely a website that can be viewed anywhere in the world, is more cost-effective and opens up a bigger market than having a host of Â’official stockistsÂ’ throughout the UK and beyond.

If the situation was reversed, all weÂ’d hear is "Why are Everton wasting their time trying to sell a small handful of shirts in high street shops when the majority of consumers and major retailers recognised the shift to online shopping years ago. They could have all official Everton merchandise available to anyone, anywhere, at a click of a button, rather than relying on passing trade and impulse buys. Living in the dark ages they are."

"Justin Bieber playing in an Everton shirt. Could have sold a few million shirts on the last one alone.....Someone needs to get a kick up the back side in our Marketing dept".

Fuck me. He also wipes his arse with Andrex, but that doesnÂ’t mean any fans he has left will automatically rush out to buy it for that reason and forbid any other brand from coming near their bum cheeks.

Karl; I donÂ’t disagree with you that much we can and should do better. In my job, I work with the main retailers and recently I had a conference with the CEO of Debenhams, Mr Michael Sharp, and 19% of their income last year came from people ordering online whilst in the shop his reply was people are just mad... makes no sense whatsoever and they never ever anticipated this would be the case and they check sales daily so the markets are changing very fast; retail isnÂ’t EFCÂ’s principle business so we will always be behind.

Brand EFC just doesnÂ’t have any identity internationally, that hurts me but all the big teams have a generic link to their names thatÂ’s identifies them; ours doesnÂ’t and itÂ’s "Everton who? Where are they from?" It will be that way until the brand on the pitch puts us into peopleÂ’s living rooms. I would love EFC to get away from the PeopleÂ’s Club logo as it means nothing. "The Originals" would be great... or "The CityÂ’s Originals" makes a statement that is fact and canÂ’t be changed. Everton FC, the City of Liverpool original Team!! something that gives us an identity is needed internationally.

John #21, the problem with shopping online for those of us overseas is that the cost of postage is often more than the cost of the items, then add on import duty, weigh up the risk of it getting lost / broken. And itÂ’s always good to check the size of shirts / other clothing. And it takes out the Â’impulse buyÂ’ factor.

When I was last in Liverpool I spotted Everton merchandise on the street stall in Victoria Street and outside TJs and bought stuff just Â’cos it was there.

So after the one time IÂ’ve bought online to deliver overseas... never again. IÂ’ll wait for the 1 time in 10 years that IÂ’m in the city.

Last time home in Liverpool, visiting from Japan, my boys were excited at the prospect of seeing Everton tops around town... saw none. The airport had more Man Utd stuff than Everton.

On a brighter note, my older son was awarded a pound in Mathew Street by an inebriated Evertonian for wearing his shirt.

Here in Japan, the big shops have Tottenham and Newcastle shirts occasionally. Got excited recently when I saw an Umbro poster in a sports shop with Mirallas and the team; alas, no Everton shirts to be found. Get some market traders from Great Homer Street – they’ll sort it out.

I have never bought merchandise from Everton. However, I own various mouse mats, mugs, coasters, slippers and other odds and ends, all given as gifts by family, kids etc. The mark-up on these items is incredible.

The Â’we were losing moneyÂ’ argument only acts as a further indicator of how amateurish our whole commercial operation was/is, and you certainly wouldnÂ’t mention it, itÂ’s that embarrassing. You measure commercial performance against all the other clubs in the League, that is the only comparison required.

Have Kitbag decided to donate ١m a season to us out of the goodness of their hearts? Some of the arguments put forward here are beyond ridiculous.

By the time the Kitbag deal is due to finish, we will be one of the worst performing clubs in the division when comparing commercial revenues. We were one of Â’The big fiveÂ’. We are an ever-present in the Premier League.

ItÂ’s a fucking shambles!!! And anyone trying to defend the way the club is ran commercially, is as deluded as our dear leader.

For us here in South Africa, it goes without saying that you canÂ’t get anything Everton-related. I suspect it would be the same in other countries as here, in that everyone wears their clubÂ’s colours etc whenever the chance arises. I play bass for a band and often play in my Everton shirt and it winds people up no end..... which is kinda the point.

Nevertheless, apart from the ridiculous Rand - Sterling exchange rate (which is getting on for 20 to the pound), add shipping and 100% customs duty and all the other Â’feesÂ’ and you can go away for the weekend for less than the cost of a shirt which will be obsolete in a few months.

Also as mentioned above, we had the Captain of Bafana Bafana (the rather embarrassing SA national football team) playing for Everton at the time of the biggest event on the planet..... if we canÂ’t capitalise on that then I donÂ’t know what to say.

Dave, you are one of a tiny percentage who actually put their case across on the internet. I would urge Blues to try and think about the other 99.9999% who have had the same experience as your good self, but they donÂ’t even know the likes of ToffeeWeb exist.

IÂ’ve never looked at the Kitbag site, but I imagine you can purchase almost anything Everton - as I explained above, itÂ’s not just shirt sales we are talking about.

ItÂ’s an open goal with a captive customer base, and weÂ’ve hoofed it over the bar and out of the ground!

IÂ’ve lived in London for 13 years and the only Everton merchandise IÂ’ve seen is in the local Asian supermarket that stocks bottles of Chang.

Merchandise aside, the problem is Everton do not use their players and former players and links (Obama, Landon Donovan) and sponsors to link current events and people to the club. Face it, for those of us not in Liverpool or even the UK, we do not have historical, geographic, or family ties, etc to a particular club. We need a reason to root for Everton versus Chelsea or Real Madrid,, PSG, Barca, Ajax, Bayern, etc.

Most of the casual fans here do not know Howard is at Everton, Cameron is at Stoke, Guzan is at Aston Villa, and most couldnÂ’t tell you what league the clubs are in or where exactly they are.
Why? Because Everton does nothing over here to push this link. No Howard commercials in an Everton shirt etc. Yet we see Chevy commercials with Freaking Wayne Rooney wearing a red Man Utd shirt with the Chevy logo and the club name displayed throughout the commercial.

This links the kids to a player who then links them to the club. Then, the kid can walk into DickÂ’s Sporting Goods or Soccer Village and walk out in a few minutes with a Man Utd shirt, ball, trinkets, etc. Viola, a new Man Utd fan is hatched. Sadly this is not so for Everton.

John Daley, yeah, I think you are missing the point. DonÂ’t know if you live in Liverpool but I do and I can tell you that the younger generation are influenced by peer pressure, advertising and a lot just donÂ’t have the same sense of following parents footsteps in which team they follow these days.

There is a lot of competition now for kidsÂ’ attention and in the past the split between whether they were a red or a blue was pretty mixed. Now, walking around the streets, you struggle to see any kids who wear any EFC kits and a great deal who wear the RS kit... this in a time they are no better than us over the last few years. So take the piss and be condescending all you like but most local kids are heading over to the dark side.

The fact that our commercial side is, as Kevin Tully correctly observed, "a fucking shambles" does impact country wide/international wide. One of the main reasons our retail is useless is because of the fact that the club does absolutely nothing to promote us. In this day and age when marketing is everything and kids seem to have no lasting affiliation nationally or internationally for a football club, to not be at least making the effort to put the Everton name out there is shocking in the extreme. As has been pointed out, you can get Portsmouth, Tottenham, Newcastle gear abroad and nothing from Everton....hardly bigger teams than us. It all compounds the fact that when visitors come to Liverpool, the Everton name just isnÂ’t known so nobody looks for it and consequently all they see is the RS brand which they buy, making their commercial venture even more profitable as they have no competition. A lot of people on here seem to think the commercial venture is only about existing fans but its so much broader than that. Its about trying to attract a new generation of fans internationally, not just in the L4 area.....it appears that some blues are as insular as the commercial team!!

As for Kenwright issue, we have had people willing to buy the club and Kenwright doesnÂ’t want to sell. He wants investment and to keep the power. There are not many rich people who are willing to just give their money away and have no say how it is spent. As for not targeting Kenwright because heÂ’s not the sole owner, he puts himself in the spotlight, he allegedly deals with all the offers that comes in, he sits in his lofty position as chairman and likes to suggest that this is his club so itÂ’s not surprising that fans will direct their anger his way at the state the club is currently in.

Yeah a hostile takeover could happen but when there are so many other English clubs willing to be taken over, why would a consortium be willing to have a messy fight when they can look elsewhere? The fans are stating that they are not happy with the direction the club is going. Without wishing to state the obvious, Â’Kenwright OutÂ’ signs mean find a buyer who can move the club forward because itsÂ’ blatantly obvious that he canÂ’t.

The apathy shown, and a willingness to defend our pathetic feeble attempts at commercialism, is depressing to say the least. In the last 25 years, we have gone from being a top top club with the power to compete with Man United, RS et al to a club that struggles to compete with Stoke, West Ham etc and to have fans that effectively say "we donÂ’t buy shirts" "lay off Kenwright" "Bobby will come good" just fucking typifies why we are where we are.

Dave 32,

Okay then, name one party that wanted to buy EFC but BK blocked them? ..... Yes, nobody.

Take your blinkers off and smell the reality, we all love EFC regardless of if you like BK or not. If I or anybody wanted to buy EFC and I had the cleared funds to do so, then I or anybody else donÂ’t need his blessing the shareholding at EFC is ripe for a hostile takeover. But again, I repeat myself: nobody has made that challenge to the board.

This fight to go to the next level isnÂ’t about Kenwright, itÂ’s about EFC as a brand, on the pitch and off it, and as it stands we arenÂ’t that attractive. We are in a bunch of others wanting the same; therein lies our problem.

We offer very little globally to the international market. That hurts me but having extra shops or more franchises wonÂ’t change our predicament. It may well pay some wages for the odd week but nothing life-changing. ThatÂ’s why this post is a red herring; it totally misses the bigger picture.

Alan #33, the shareholding at Everton is not ripe for a hostile takeover, just look at the shareholding.

Kenwright around 25%,
Earl around 23%,
Woods around 19%,

ThatÂ’s the Board and it makes up 2/3rds of the shareholders and they have no intention of selling, so a majority shareholding cannot be obtained.

Alan @ 33

The reason Mr Kenwright has not had to block one party is because of the exorbitant selling price. At 𧴵 million there will be no interested party. Not now, not in the future.

Do we, as a club, do this on purpose? Is there some dark, secret plan to run the club into the ground? Is BK and his merry band of fools really happy to have us be seen as an amateurish, joke of a club?

I would hate to think this is the case but.........,

Dave, 

Despite many other faults/amateurish antics ripe for taking aim at, one area you canÂ’t knock the club for in recent years is their efforts to entice the next generation of local supporters to Everton. TheyÂ’ve been offering heavily reduced child season tickets for 䀏 for a few seasons now and itÂ’s been a big success. ThereÂ’s more kids going to the game than there has been for ages and, guess what, loads of them wear shirts as well.  God knows where they get them from though, what with it being nigh on impossible to track them down unless youÂ’re one of the future-embracing lucky few to have access to this new fangled, high tech, Â’hinternextÂ’ IÂ’ve been hearing hushed whispers of.

Then again, I guess actually getting kids through the gates doesn’t count as much as a giant poster of Lukaku on a billboard across from Lime Street, or a few bits of merchandise available for purchase at the Airport though, does it? 

As for you spotting more kids in red shirts than blue when out on the street? How is that a conclusive barometer of local support? Were you keeping score? Did you stalk every street in the city, starting from L1 and working your way out? Are we talking just Liverpool or Merseyside as a whole? How do you know where they were from? Was it a matchday or non-matchday? Which team were at home that week?

Even if young Liverpool supporters do now heavily outnumber their blue brethren, how can such a significant swing be attributed simply to shirts not being readily available outside of the club shops and a lack of ’marketing’?

You outright dismiss the most obvious factor when you falsely claim that Â’theyÂ’ve been no better than us in recent yearsÂ’. When was the last time we were competing in the Champions League again? Everton were left behind on the pitch in 1988 and weÂ’ve remained behind them, bar a couple of occasions, ever since.

They might not have won the league in eons, but theyÂ’ve at least challenged and won other trophies during that time. TheyÂ’ve also heavily outspent us, had more high profile players and always had the media puckering their lips to kiss their arse at every opportunity. As much as we may hate to say it, theyÂ’ve been more successful than us in every way and success (perceived or real) is a more potent force for attracting people than any marketing campaign could ever hope to be.

Outside their catchment area, how many kids did you used to see randomly sporting Chelsea or Man City shirts? Now they’re everywhere. Why? A big advertising blitz? Some celebrity wearing their kit in a photo shoot? Scarves readily available down the shops? Nah. They’re wealthy and they’ve won shit within recent memory. It’s as simple as that. 

It’s the same with the ’untapped’ Asian audiences who are supposedly just waiting for Everton to entice them in. Advertising campaigns and readily available merchandise aren’t going to make a dent in it. When it comes to their attitude to sports, the only selling point of any real significance is success. Preferably on the pitch and financial. It’s just the way their culture is. 

That sort of global support is ephemeral and will always remain elusive and out of reach until Everton, miraculously, start challenging for titles again or find a buyer able to throw mega bucks at it.

As for this: "So take the piss and be condescending all you like but most local kids are heading over to the dark side".

Thanks Dave. Don’t mind if I do. Really, what else do you expect when people come out with ridiculous statements of incredulity such as: 

"Tim Howard was the talk of the USA, feted by the President himself... Any thought of the Obamas being pictured in Everton shirts? Not a chance!!!".

No shit Â’not a chanceÂ’. How is that a screw up at the clubÂ’s end? I didnÂ’t realise Kenwright had such clout that he could coerce the most powerful man in the world into taking up the clubs cause against his will.

----------------

[INT] [The Oval office. President Obama sits nervously by the phone, sweating profusely and looking shifty as fuck. Suddenly, the tense silence is shattered as the tinny sound of Z-Cars splutters forth from the speakers of the presidential hotline]

"Barrack. Bill. What you wearing?"

[Long uncomfortable silence, only punctured by BillÂ’s heavy breathing... a bit crackly, because the calls long distance like...]

"Do you remember when you came to me, on the day of my daughter’s wedding, and asked for heavily discounted tickets for ’Joseph & His Technicolour Dream Coat’ for Michelle and her mates? I told you then, that one day... and that day may never come (I lied about that bit. Soz.)... I might call on you to do me a service. Well, that day has finally arrived. 

Get it on.

Yes, right now.

Yes, you have to. 

DO IT! NOW!! "

[Hands trembling, Obama tentatively reaches out to the briefcase lying on his (absolutely massive) desk and slowly begins to open it. We don’t see what’s in there, but the entire Oval office is suddenly engulfed in a bright blue light emanating from it’s heavenly hidden content. A bit like that bit in Pulp Fiction basically, but blue instead of gold]

"Now send us a selfie on SnapChat to show youÂ’re not shitting me".

[30 seconds later....]

"Quick lads, quick. Pass these on to the promotional department.  THE PROMOTIONAL DEPARTMENT. The promotional depa......Dave! Fucking Dave!! Dave, the programme seller. The one with the lazy eye. Looks a bit like Columbo decked out in Craghopper. 

HeÂ’s quality with photoshop and his brother once had an article published in Â’Butchery Buzz bi-monthly: The thinking mans meat-mincing magazineÂ’. Still got plenty of contacts that lad. Just make sure he mentions me, the Boys Pen, Alan Ball, and Barrack watching the blues on a big fuck off lazy boy aboard Air Force One. Shirt sales will skyrocket, IÂ’m telling ya".

[Bill snaps back to reality. The guy from Kitbag, sitting across from him, looks decidedly unimpressed]

"Look Bill, I donÂ’t give a toss if Dave Ganley thinks itÂ’s a goer. ItÂ’s never gonna happen mate. ItÂ’s pure pie-in-the-sky fantasy and weÂ’re not gonna give you a penny more than we originally agreed upon. Now sign the fucking contract extension."

Eric 34: How can you say that when 37% is held elsewhere, so all you need to do is buy up the minor shareholders and then divide and conquer applies, and see who falls first based on offering more than they are worth? Add to that a massive PR drive and all three major parties would very much get their bluff called.

It is actually very easy to do if you have the will and the cash to do it, so you’re completely wrong – we are very much open to a hostile takeover due to the shareholding being split. Earl is a businessman who has no connection to the club and lives overseas; he would be the first party I would try and purchase the shares off. If you land him and take over 50%, then Game On.

As I have said before, you donÂ’t even need to talk with Kenwright, should he be the one that is allegedly blocking all these mysterious sales we keep missing out on.

Alan, why on earth would anyone pay over the odds for Everton shares when there are numerous outstanding mortgages, as well as restrictive long-term commercial partnerships?

The only way Everton would ever be of interest to any major players, is if was priced accordingly and the current custodians actually were actually looking to sell.

ItÂ’s common knowledge Bill wants investment without diluting his shareholding. Stop talking rubbish.

Aston Villa: being taken over for 𧵎M.

But 𧴵M for plucky little Everton is way over-priced?

Well, they did win the European Cup once... that must be it.

Villa takeover deal includes Tony Adams being brought in to advise on football matters. Think we could be better off as we are.

Michael, from this very website: "Everton were setting hurdles that effectively put them out of the running with so many prospective purchasers and that either [a sale] is not their true intention, or their lawyers are not accustomed to working in this commercial space."

In the very short space of time Trevor Birch was here, he stated there were numerous interested investors, but Bill didnÂ’t even want to offer a place on the board.

We are back to the word Â’donations,Â’ as Joe Beardwood called it. Madness.

I read when Villa were originally put up for sale (canÂ’t remember the asking price but it was more than 𧵎m) that, based on what heÂ’d paid originally and what heÂ’d sunk into the club. Lerner would be losing in excess of 𧴜m.

With that in mind, I hope when he eventually sells, Blue Bill doesnÂ’t lose on his investment...

Understood, Kevin. The club is not for sale. That seems to be the most plausible explanation.

But we do have some on here (eg, #35) who maintain that the sale price of 𧴵M is too high...

I vaguely recall JohnsonÂ’s asking price started at an incredible (back then!) 𧵄M... and progressively declined through the long drawn-out months of 1999 until Bill and TBH finally ground him down to a snap at 㿀M.

Alan #38, that 33% of shares is very diverse, being made up mostly of holders of only 1-2 shares. Good luck in trying to get all them. Grantchester is probably the biggest minority shareholder at 8% and has no need to sell, nor probably any interest to given his family ties to the Club.

Robert Earl was brought in by BillÂ’s friend Phil Green to oust Paul Gregg, so is just a prop to support Bill and wouldnÂ’t make the decision to sell himself.

Woods’s family has a longstanding history with Everton so heÂ’s pretty much like Bill, living the dream.

So really there is no potential for any major purchases of shares that would come close to being considered a hostile takeover.

The only real chance would be on the death of Bill or Woods and letÂ’s then see how keen their heirs are in keeping a stake in Everton.

Eric 45: itÂ’s not that cut and dry, please remember what IÂ’m saying is purely hypothetical and IÂ’m making the point that if you wanted to buy EFC and you were serious about it and had the cash to back your intentions then you can instigate a hostile takeover and call the bluff of the major shareholders. Nobody has ever made clear that wish or even tried to buy up smaller blocks of shares which are what happens in these situations, look at Arsenal.

What IÂ’m saying is BK canÂ’t block the sale of EFC if the potential new buyer has the will to do it, they can publically go on record and offer a price per share and start increasing their stake in the business, which will automatically get them around the table. EFCÂ’s problem is down to the stadium and matchday revenue; itÂ’s far too low, which means the investment needed to improve this and you then add the share purchase price means itÂ’s a poor investment; itÂ’s very simple really when you take the emotions out of it.

The Villa sale is different and it looks like one person is heading up a consortium to raise money to buy the club. That scenario doesn’t apply to EFC. We need investment into the infrastructure – Villa doesn’t. Don’t forget, we haven’t even touched yet the investment needed on the pitch, that’s why we are such a poor investment. We are stuck in that chasing pack,

Retail isnÂ’t EFCÂ’s primary business. What is? They sell players, TV rights, image rights, merchandise, hospitality, corporate events, they sell season tickets, match day tickets, they were selling friggin bricks 12 months ago. We have won the square root of frig all in 20 years. 20 years.

I wouldnÂ’t say our primary business is winning trophies, and to be frank with the dross on offer for 80% of this season, I donÂ’t think football is high on the list either. The club is a show up, the chairman is a show up, the commercial department more so. Kitbag my arse.

Alan (#46), yes youÂ’re talking hyprothetically and what youÂ’re saying is easily disproved as the major shareholders own 67% of the Club. Even the Arsenal example you cite, when Kroenke owned 30% of them, becoming the largest single shareholder, he couldnÂ’t get a seat on the board. Usamov likewise.

We are such a poor investment, Alan, because our board has done nothing since taking control of the Club: no investment in the ground or the squad except on a sell-to-buy basis, coupled with the huge debt, again brought about by the board.

We are not for sale because, simply put, no one wants to buy us. We are now a small club, financially speaking, with a small fan base, in a provincial backwater, in a rundown dilapidated stadium. We will never, ever win the league again (under our present board) so we are on a slow, downward spiral, like it or not. We canÂ’t compete with the big boys so a top 6 position can be considered a little miracle as would us winning a domestic cup.

Wake up and smell the coffee. Top 10 is the best we can hope for with this manager or Mandrake the Magician. ItÂ’s not pessimism or pro-Martinez blindness, itÂ’s a simple fact; you canÂ’t win the league with a team that costs less than a third of what the top 6 teams are worth.

Well John Daley I bow to your superior knowledge and shame on me for thinking that we were under performing as a club especially in the marketing department. I did challenge you to be condescending and to take the piss and you duly did....much to my amusement by the way although the quotes you seemingly have attributed to me about Tim Howard and Obama etc werenÂ’t actually me....but no matter....the rest of your post made me smile......I guess the trick is to give a wry smile when the club drives you up the wall (although it appears that we should know our place and just accept we are where we are and like it because its never going to get any better).

I really cant be bothered to change your mind about anything as you seemingly have all the answers.....including that the RS have been head and shoulders ahead in recent years (havenÂ’t we finished ahead of them a couple of years?) probably got that wrong too. Yeah they have won trophies (although I believe that they havenÂ’t for at least 4 years....hence the fall out about Rogers not winning anything inside the first 3 years of management) but havenÂ’t been the dominant force on merseyside as they previously were (oops trying to do reasoning....shame on me again)

Well thanks for refocussing me and if any time I have a surge of opinionated thoughts as to how we could improve in any small way I shall give you a shout to put me right.....hmmm after reading Colin Glassars recent post I should speak to him also.....the message I shall take with me as my mantra is that we all all doomed to mediocrity and we should not expect any improvement or any trophy wins as that is way above our station. Avoiding relegation is to be applauded and come the last game of the season against Tottenham I shall be urging all my companions to stand with me and applaud and shout as to the wonderful job El Bob and his charges have done all season in avoiding relegation and also to make sure I have a large banner displayed as to the first class way Bill and his luvvies have ran our club over the last 15 years...they really couldnÂ’t have done any more for us....The peoples club???? Nah we really are the self absorbed club with unreasonable fans demanding unreasonable changes and demanding the club be ran in a professional manner....for crying out loud who do we think we are??? Liverpool???? Obviously we donÂ’t deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as the supreme club on merseyside!! We protagonists should hang our heads in shame (I am growing red with shame as I type) for disturbing the status quo and unnecessarily ruffling the feathers of the wise old heads like yourselves John and Colin who know better and who patiently put us right.

Roll on next season for more dull to mediocre football (in light of the indoctrination you have given me John and Colin we should sign Bobby up for life) and I hope Bill and co will stay with us forever and duly make sure we maintain the status quo and never ever seek to move us forward......I will certainly make sure everyone knows that premiership survival is an achievement for such an insignificant club as ourselves. Cheers guys

Colin, Â’a small fan baseÂ’??? A small number of loosely associated (particularly overseas) Â’supportersÂ’ compared to some of the nouveau riche in the PL. But a small true footballing fan base, come on.

Some people seem happy to accept the current situation, but I never will. The lack of vision to this day displayed by the Board is a total disgrace.

I canÂ’t do much about it, but IÂ’ll never accept it and I certainly wonÂ’t be urging fellow Evertonians to.

We are run like a corner shop in many ways, our Board is way too conservative. TheyÂ’d probably call it prudent, but history shows that to seriously change things you have to seriously shake them up.

Karl (52) - "Some people seem happy to accept the current situation, but I never will"

Me neither, maybe we should form some sort of union of blues to fight this apathy (suggested name – ’some sort of union of blues fighting apathy’),

IÂ’m sure it would be very popular and we wouldnÂ’t be wasting our time or be accused of being whoppers/texans/balloons indulging in Â’kopite behaviourÂ’ by too-cool-for-school Evertonians.

Oh, wait a minute...

I'm in Munich for the Champions League match tomorrow. I've been around town and of course itÂ’s Bayern shit EVERYWHERE. Fine.

However, their "People's Club", Munich 1860, still has a couple of small shops and Bayern is kind of enough to sell some of their stuff as well in the red shops. Two problems:

1) WeÂ’re in the prem, 1860 is in God knows what division at this point.

2) Bayern is twice the size of Liverpool FC and yet we roll over and let them take control.

How can one business/team be so bad at EVERYTHING that we do? DoesnÂ’t Bill market his plays? HowÂ’s he so bad at marketing us? Until he goes weÂ’re done. Count these as lost years

Christopher... correct mate.

The one thing Kenwright should be able to do is raise our media/showbiz profile. Aside from Waxfaced Rocky turning up, IÂ’ve seen nowt of the sort. However you look at it, thereÂ’ll be no change until the clown and his chums go.