I’d have preferred 3 in the centre and having Walcott alongside Niasse up front, sacrificing width from wingers to make sure we have the energy drive and numbers to make it competitive in the middle. I fear the likes of Ramsey and Ozil will simply have too much time to float around in front of our defense and will eventually pick us off. I fully expected Schneiderlin to be recalled but dropping Davies will show us up. Davies should be in for Bolasie.

I fear that Bolasie and Niasse will barely get a touch while Walcott will simply because he’s a superior player.

I'd have preferred 3 in the centre and having Walcott alongside Niasse up front, sacrificing width from wingers to make sure we have the energy drive and numbers to make it competitive in the middle. I fear the likes of Ramsey and Ozil will simply have too much time to float around in front of our defense and will eventually pick us off. I fully expected Schneiderlin to be recalled but dropping Davies will show us up. Davies should be in for Bolasie and I'd have preferred Rooney in the centre instead of Schneiderlin.

I fear that Bolasie and Niasse will barely get a touch while Walcott will simply because he's a superior player.

Sam is clearly looking to defend and hit them with pace on the break. Why not play Tosun – is he another flop or is Sam taking it slowly with him?

What was the strop from Holgate that Michael refers to? Not looking forward to this!

Play Coleman you bloody fool??

I think we are set up for an a absolute shelling today, Williams and Schneiderlin on the pitch against a team that usually cuts through us with consummate ease!?

Bolasie has been invisible since returning a month ago.

Can’t see anything other than a big loss today with that.

How are you meant to ever build momentum when the team keeps having 5 or 6 changes????

This is a great opportunity to get some momentum going after the hard fought win on Wednesday. 27 matches against the top six though without a win means I won't be holding my breath.

On a positive note, the team is stronger than at any time this season and Arsenal are inconsistent. It is a good time for us to believe we can win it.

Coleman, who burst his lungs playing the full 94 minutes on his return from a 10 month lay off. He himself said in his after-match interview he may not start today. Legitimate switch with Kenny, rather than risk stress injury to Seaumus.

Jags, 35-years-old and who also played the full game Wednesday. Allardyce has already previously said Jags needs to be carefully managed and not play consecutive games within the space of a few days. Williams and/or Mangala legitimate replacements for him.

Schneiderlin for Davies. Erhmm... no struggling to justify this one, other than the probable 3 central defenders and two wing backs pushed further forward means Sam wants a bit of insurance in front of the centre backs. Only, Morgan doesn't do the protecting role very well, does he?

Bolasie for Siggy/Rooney loses a bit of guile in midfield, but offers balanced width in attack on both flanks. Wayne is another who, like Jags, needs managing and not over playing in consecutive games a few days apart.

It is not a submissive defensive selection and the bench has plenty of strength and depth.

How it all plays out is another matter.

What is to be lost by actually trying to win a game.

Go Allardyce. Just go and be miserable somewhere else.

Coleman needs a rest after just coming back from a bad injury
Mangala adds a bit of speed to the defence
Rooney and Sigurdsson too slow for the midfield
And catch them on the break with our quick three up front.
Plenty of options to come off the bench if we're struggling.

In Sam we trust
COYB

Keep it tight and hit them on the break except with Schneiderlin in we will struggle to do that. Would have preferred Davies energy and drive but time will tell and if we come away with something we should be happy enough.

Just saying like.

I fear it's going to be a very long 90 minutes.

Why did Allardyce change a winning team?

How do you set up your team to exploit that weakness? Seven(!) defense-minded players and with a centre-forward who can't control the ball...

Allardyce Out!!

Who will be blame for today.

“The Gunners have been good, but Everton have been terrible. How was there so much space for Ramsey in the middle of the pitch?”

I said before the game there'd be too much space in the middle of the park for Arsenal with us only having 2 midfield players (post 7).

Wish I got paid £6mil a year!!

And I want pleasure out of it.

Fire this fat fucker now!

At least under Koeman we had ‘promise. The youngsters where the future. Now we have only one kid left playing (and he’s only in because he had no other choice). He’s not going to only kill us this season, we will take years to get over this man.

I do not say this lightly .I would rather us be relegated and seeing that we at least tried to WIN games, rather than this miserable football on show today. I am not even angry any more, I have just simply had enough of the mismanagement.

Sad, sad, times to be a blue.

Yes, you adapt for different games but there's got to be some kind of consistency. Some style of play. We've got to be about something.

So we continue to lurch from one thing to the next.

We are relegation fodder.

It was obvious after 10 mins it wasn't working and here we are watching our club being made a holy show off, shocking!

Anyone seen Schneiderlin break into a run?

Just sack the buffoon tonight. Or now would be better.

Sam.. "Arsenal are defensively weak". What a complete tool.

Chastising.

Arsenal have not had to work hard or do anything out of the ordinary for any of their goals. We can be grateful it's only four.

The half was summed up on the stroke of half time when only 2-3 Arsenal players getting in the way of each other inside our penalty prevented them from getting a nap hand, with no one in a Blue shirt getting close to them.

Hopefully, Arsenal will declare now, otherwise I dread to fear what the final scoreline will be.

Pitiful.

The problems here are the same as the problems since Sam joined us. In fact you can even say it's the same problem as the fact we appointed him. These problems go right through the club.

What are we? We can't be a Roberto, a Koeman and an Allardyce type club. Can't be a high tempo attacking team one week and an all out defensive unit the next.

There just needs to be some plan about what we're trying to do. We're seeing that same problem reflected right through the club. The managerial appointments make no sense, the transfer business makes no sense, the team selections make no sense, the gameplan makes no sense.

But how could it make any sense? It can't be coordinated to any overall strategy - there very clearly isn't one!

A lineup that had lost the game before a ball was kicked. It won't be Allardyce's fault either, oh no. The players have let him down. A place for 5 defenders but our £27m striker can't get a game.

We have three games of consequence remaining: Palace, Brighton and Newcastle. All must wins if we are to avoid relegation.

All to stay up and have little to no chance of playing for anything positive next year.

David Barks will have hung himself with his braces and smashed his head in on the ceiling.
Darren will have never been so embarrassed in 50 years of watching Everton.
Assorted posters screaming at the cowards.
And the odd voice of reason who knows the majority of the players are not worth a carrot.

Schneiderlin and Williams off please.

Every blue at that game should be refunded from the players wages, fuckin shower of cowards.

Mangala providing balance with his 2 left feet and positional sense of an 8 year old. Wasnt exactly brave enough for their 3rd either. Thank God it's only a loan.

Right I am off behind the couch for the 2nd half.

I dread the second half and feel sympathy for any player who is put on the field for the last 45. What on earth are they supposed to do? How on earth can you leave the only two creative players we have both on the bench ?

PLEASE LEAVE OUR CLUB !!!!!

Humiliating.

Allardyce out!!

if like a lot of supporters believe Allardyce will be gone in the summer you will not be saving much in compensation firing him now

Robbie Savage on BT said Everton not involved in a relegation battle. Another fraud. Once a knob always a stupid knob.

I would love to see young, hungry quality players in the likes of Lookman and Dowell terrorising defences next season, without Fat Sam telling them what to do.

Is the future with Sam? Really?

Would other "big" clubs accept this sort of shit?

Why in the fuck doesn't our board grow a pair and sack this shithead? He's taking us NO WHERE (and pretty fucking fast at that!).

Bring Unsworth back. Match Oxford's price. ;0) Or bring Silva in.

We've paid six million and we won't make another managerial change this season. It's all for naught. There won't be a real game of football until August.

We haven't been a big club for a long time

Arsenal's strength is mainly their passing and movement in midfield. Our genius manager thought it would be a good idea to fit these three into a team that's a man light in midfield.

Personally, I'd extend his contract and double his wages. He is truly the Albert Einstein of football!

I know many don't like this manager but it's 4 managers in the last 3 years and for me there are too many bang-average players who just don't care enough. It's also a team assembled of players who have experience of struggling at club level (Pickford, Williams, Gueye, Bolasie, Sigurdsson) or young lads with the odd bit of quality (Walcott). Most these players are probably reasonably happy with our position. How many are genuine winners.

Shocking first half, poor selection, poor attitude, poor tactics just dire really.

Davies comes on at half time and shows pedestrians like Schneiderlin how to carry the ball forward. How he never started is criminal.

Tosun has been here about 5 games and he's already chucking his arms around looking fed up.

Those sort of exonerated from blame tonight. Pickford, Davies, Walcott (what must he be thinking!!!) and Niasse. Kenny was full of effort but quite poor to be honest.

Too many players letting this club down though. Poor selection fair enough but no fight.

Get rid of this twat

After five games Big Sam said to the board, "Look what I've achieved so far. Give me a 3-year contract."

The Board said something like, "Hold Your Horses" or even, "No way, Sam. You've done what we wanted and that's your lot, we'll pay you off in the summer."

I believe the team for the Leicester game, like today's team, was selected in the belief that they would blow it; they didn't. So he ignored that team when selecting for today and picked Schneiderlin and co and dropped, Sigurdsson, Davies, Coleman etc. Today he got what he'd half-expected when he picked an unbalanced and bizarre team against Leicester.

Allardyce (or "the ego has landed") wanted a long-term contract with a bigger team than he had had previously. It is not appearing and he is not all that interested.

Before you throw out my cynical idea, compare and think about the teams selected for the last three games. Is there any coherence? Is there any tactical nous? Does he appear to know which players give us the best chance of keeping the game tight or of winning?

We have got an angry manager and he is not helping Everton at the moment.

I'm struggling to keep my emotions in check. .

A disgraceful team selection after a win, disgraceful subs apart from Keane, taking off our two best players in Walcott and Niasse.

Picking and keeping on Schneiderlin on when he made no impression on the game either in defence or attack and hasn't all season beggars belief.

If Allardyce had any decency he'd take a few quid now and go back into retirement were he belongs. I'm waiting to hear from you on who's to blame because it can't be him.

It doesn't matter who gets the job because he's got to be better than fat Sam, and take his mate Walsh with him.

Allardyce said he can't play Rooney and Sigurdsson in the same team, but played both against Leicester and won. Then leaves both on the bench today. Our game against Leicester was 10 days after our last game yet he made 5 changes today.

He stated Lookman wasn't going out on loan yet days later he goes on loan. He then said he was prepared to let him go to Derby as he wouldn't get game time at Leipzig. Today the boy comes on and scores the winner. I said the other day, if he gets game time at Leipzig he won't come back here.

He signs Tosun for £27 million and seems he doesn't fancy him now. He said Bolasie still wasn't up to speed so rightly leaves him out of the Leicester game but brings him back today.

He signs Mangala – I was talking to a Man City season ticket holder this morning and he said "I can't believe you have signed him, he has a mistake in him every game."

All of that said, I am bound to admit as an Allardyce supporter that his selection was defeatist and we might have done a couple of goals better if we'd had a go and chosen different players – but maybe not.

We're not playing in Arsenal's league and they're the bottom of the top 6. That's the truth and no amount of shouty pretence will change it.

Shameful cowardly selection against an Arsenal side that lost to Swansea, SA might have well said we can't beat these lads FFS it's Arsenal.

I've played the game at amateur level, but I could've told him: 5 at the back you need full back/wing back otherwise you've got no width, and Martina is barely a right-back let alone not a left sided wing back.

Gana & Schneiderlin cannot play in the same side (in fact Schneiderlin just can't play) we concede goals for fun when these 2 are in front of the defence.

Bolasie will need to be eased in; unlike Seamus he's woefully short of match fitness.

Why can't people on millions a year not see this. WTF was he making 5 negative defensive changes for? we got exactly what we deserved. A 7-man defence letting in 5; just fuck off out of my club, and take 'Director of Football' with you.

Everyone knows Arsenal play intricate passes through the middle and if they get through to the last line of defence they will do damage, so surely we should have packed the midfield instead of playing the half-fit Bolasie in place of Sigurdsson or Tom was insane.

I would love to know the terms of Sams contract- I would guess there will be a seven figure bonus for escaping relegation and with it only being for 18 months there is no incentive for him to build a team or play attractive football. It is a short-term appointment and all he needs to do is stay in the league – that is my guess in any event.

A disgraceful team selection and utterly embarrassing first half. He was appointed to stay up and sort out the defence – the defence is as bad as ever it was and no sign of any real improvement elsewhere. Tom showed again today that the kids will put in the effort – the big buys aren't bothered as long as they get paid.

Sick of being conned and being the backdrop to a rich boys toy.

No, they don't, but they have a better manager!

Believe me, most of this is due to the manager. We actually have a decent squad, but they are not utilised in the right way.

Pick a weakened team against Arsenal, because we're going to lose anyway; rest your better players for the Watford game – that's his thinking, and the type of ambitious manager we have in charge of EFC.

On paper, it was 3 at the back with Kenny and Martina as wing backs but it may as well have been 5 at the back for it's effectiveness and the time we spent camped in out own half.

If Luke Garbutt was to be given a start, it would have surely been in that formation. He might have offered something going forward. Martina for me, would probably be the first name in an Everton all-time worst 11. He has no business being on the field.

The only good point was that we at least put a shift in the 2nd half and Davies looks something like his best again.

Is there no one at the club who knows that constant changes to the team is destroying us and that our record of starting with three at the back is horrendous.

Everyone connected to the club right now just seem to be completely thick. We are in some kind of bizarroworld, same mistakes keep being made with the same outcome.

Even an old Everton hero of mine said on TV last night that Arsenal aren't the team they were and that we can go there and win. Arsenal aren't that good but we have yet another lunatic manager who gave a good impression that he had been bunged to ensure we conceded loads of goals for Sky TV. What's going on is unbelievable!

Sam – you are yet another thick fool, just fuck off now!

How Walsh is still there is reckless to the extreme. Him and Koeman have destroyed the club in just a few short months. Unbelievable, isn't it?

Too good to go down? I don't think so. It's a real possibility.

Sam – you don't change a winning team.

Sure, we have many woeful players, but he keeps picking them.

I saw the tail end of the Leipzig game and they seemed to be playing with 2 strikers, one of whom was Lookman. His goal was stunning and will hopefully be on YouTube this evening at some stage. He should have been playing for us today instead.

That aside, you can go through our team and plainly see who isn't up to the standard we long for. We have not one but multiple problem areas: central midfield, left back, central defence and strikers.

Our recruitment campaign in the summer past must rank as the worst ever by an ambitious top flight side, but it was immediately preceded by horrible acquisitions too: Schneiderlin, Williams and v sad to say it – seemingly Bolasie also. And I know many of you think Gueye is special, but really, he's not good enough either.

So... we have to consolidate, hold what we have in terms of Premier League status in the remaining games, and then enact a holistic, root-and-branch overhaul of the club, right down to the tea ladies and ballboys.

No team will ever beat Arsenal by standing back and watching them do what they like. With the introduction of our 19-year-old hustler and an attacking attitude, we improved significantly. I realise that Arsenal may have eased off but if we had started with a positive attitude it may have been better.

We started with a brand new defensive system, namely a back nine! Only soft Sam could have come up with such an idiotic plan. Loyal fans do not give up. Allardyce should never be any more than a minor negative blip in the Everton story. I hope his reign ends soon.

First half was a disgrace. Poor team selection and poor tactics accompanied by mistakes from the usual suspects, Keane Schneiderlin and the error prone man nobody wanted.

When will people at the club realise that playing Schneiderlin weakens the side?

On Wednesday night, we has 3 captains playing:- Coleman, Jags and Rooney. Today, not one leader on the pitch.

Why, oh why, Allardyce, would you change the system and the team so very drastically!?!? And then put all the blame on the players!! Disgraceful.

Allardyce will keep us up. For that, at least, we should be grateful.

I understand that there are those who think Unsworth and Silva would have had us playing entertaining and winning football fairly quickly, if only that had been allowed. I think such people are fantasists.

David Unsworth would, at least, have played the younger prospects and – no doubt – have ditched those who have gone. Beyond Walcott, what difference has Big Sam made?

Tosun is on the bench – mysteriously. I assume Allardyce will be with us to the end of the season, but I seriously don't think it would make that much difference if he left tomorrow.

In Sam we trust... hmmmm.

How foolish do you feel eh? Predicting 6-0???Not even close!

COYB

[Collapses from sarcasm overload]

Oh well, enjoy your retirement, Sam. The trouble is, I don't have any confidence in this board to arrest this very real crisis and appoint the right people. It's all about self-preservation. Who could argue that this club will never be relegated when asking the Council for £280m, or more?

I despise the unaccountability that pervades through the corridors of this club. Still the old farts run their boys club how they wish, failing at every hurdle.

Moshiri needs to go and have a good long word with himself to.

For the millions spent he must be privately seething at how embarrassing Everton Football Club currently are and portraying themselves nationally as a joke club, everybody's whipping boy.

Sitting there in his interview going on about “Fab Fours” and making a show of himself .

Listen, Farhad – there's nothing at all 'Fab' about Everton Football Club 2017-18, we are a complete disgrace and you are part of it.

Moshiri sacked Koeman who probably would have roughly got the same amount of points as Allardyce in this spell anyway, brings Fat Sam in, gets bent over a barrel with his demands of an 18-month contract worth £6 million to stabilise the defence, well after his first 4 games, our defence has become an absolute sick joke – AGAIN!!!!

We might as well kept Koeman, he would have just about got us safe, and saved ourselves the money wasted on sacking him and employing the Brown Envelope bunger.

Wasting more and more money on unknowns like Tosun who I'll bet my life won't be here next season, ”Oh he didn't settle into the culture, the weather” blah blah blah...

We are a club that's in crisis and has been in crisis for some time; the question is: How do we get out of it?

Sam isn't quite the troubleshooter that soft-lad Farhad had him down as, is he?!

“Sam, you say the players are inconsistent, yet you made an abundance of changes from the team that had just beaten Leicester. You dropped Coleman, Rooney, Sigurdsson, Davies, and Jagielka. You completely changed the formation for a back 4 to a back 5, with 2 holding midfielders. And you went back to partnering Gana with Schneiderlin despite Schneiderlin struggling all season.

So Sam, how can you blame the players for inconsistency when it is your inconsistency in team selection, formation and tactics that is so clearly on display?”

Sam (#178), you're so right, how can he blame the players for that? He picked that formation.

Twatted 34-7

David Barks,you changed your mind? 😂😂

My god – how much evidence do you want to see what type of person he is???

The difference that I have with many fans – and I entirely understand the anger – is that I do not see us doing much better on anyone else's vision either.

It's clear the players are to blame... and the fans... and that dodgy slope at The Emirates.

Bad day all round, but after backing the Welsh to win by more than 14, my glass is still half-full.

Couldn't resist an each way on Blast of Koeman, bagged a nice winner in Off You Go. Even my footy acca went in.

Trust Everton to try to spoil my day. They tried hard but they couldn't.

Stuff em.

Tip the Scots to win the tournament but back a result that means they won't.

Did you back the jocks to win the tournament?

And some still wonder where the crux of the problem is!

I'm sick of it under Allardyce but struggle to see anyone else do better at this point. The players aren't fit enough and the quality isn't there.

Fat Sam to get us to Premier League safety and then get another manager lined up well in advance to get pre-season and next season underway.

4-4-2 is the most solid formation for teams like Everton who don't know how to defend properly.

Anybody associated with this shambolic, shite of a club should be ashamed.

I hope it's an indication he's been told he's gone at the end of the season if he keeps coming out blaming the players. What kind of manager does this? Why would they want to play for him when he throws them under the bus every time things go tits up?

It's sad what's happening to Everton. Buy a striker who is not ready for the cut, at the same time as going out of the FA Cup to our big rivals. Until every last voice is together in admitting the board have delivered some terrible transfers and until everybody realises Moshiri brought a Director of Football in to find gems for profit, it will keep on happening.

Let's have a proper honest look at this. Koeman wanted Depay, Witsel & Giroud. What did he get? They are players that can make a difference when you're playing awful. That alone is a must for a decent team.

This board want too many numbers in youth so it keeps wages down. Half this squad have got no chance of a game but get paid. Once the Director of Football came in, the plan was obvious and a stinker.

If this is expansionist football then the mentality at GP and FF is questionable, as in my time this is ranking all considered as the worst season ever, in the last 46 years.
Its rank and stinks the roof off every week now. We were lucky on Wednesday and so it makes the demise even more alarming.

Theres no game management, no leaders on the pitch today; lets hope Seamus is fully fit and available for the run in, as we need him like never before..

Seeing Schneids jogging round and barely getting a sprint in the whole game tells it all. Midfield was over run and Sam picked the wrong team today and must take stock and admit his mistake.

Staggered today by the result...no, as it was expected and it should have been 9 -1.. Its become the normal expectation now and an away win against one of the top 6 is light years away..

Well and truly we need a miracle this season, as all teams below us will fancy playing Everton and Palace are capable of doing us next week, and no doubt they will exploit Evertons left hand side.

Another gutless and cowardly showing and how them players get paid every week bar a couple is beyond me.

The club has some form of mental barrier and in my life time I'm starting to doubt if Ill ever see a decent team again, let alone win a trophy..

Solace now in the ale... Hopeless and disgraceful Everton..

And who has made millions out of the club he really loves and never actually put any money of his own into it, would it?

Selling current players will be hard and only at a loss. Getting new fans to watch that utter crap only if they're paid... for Christ's sake 5 changes to a winning team.

Schneiderlin, who he tried to get rid off in the transfer window, comes straight in – why? Once again, against a big team, he was ineffective, probably why he couldn't get a game at Man Utd.

Coleman I could understand but he probably should have only played him for say 70 mins in the last game.

Bolasie is short of match fitness but is like Niasse (big respect for this guy) – they both run around like headless chicks; sometimes they get lucky but less than more.

I'm sure if Tosun was given a decent run before he – like many others who have been banished to the bench and were unable for some reason to get a run in the U23s – loses form and desire, he would score as many as Niasse. Let's not forget, he has missed a lot of sitters as well.

Formation and tactics... well, neither of them exist at Everton under Sam. Every half-decent team who play Everton know they are going to try and be ultra defensive, so they can just attack at will knowing they are not going to get caught on the break or have to defend for long periods.

Well done, Sam and the Board – you will have given no hope to up-coming players who will want to get out of Everton as quick as possible, but also for making Everton the biggest joke in world football – at least you put us on the world stage.

Let's hope The Spoiler gets the boot this weekend too...

A special mention for Mangala – the way he jumped over the ball for one goal and turned his back for another shows he'll fit in very well right now.

Moshiri needs to get better advice on football matters. A clean-out top to bottom is required if he has Champions League aspirations.

Silva, Dyche? Not good enough, the choices of people brain washed by years of Kenwright mediocrity.

In my ideal world, only Walcott, Rooney, Davies and Pickford would have ever worn an Everton shirt.

I said it back in September. Schneiderlin should not start a game. He is the out ball for players too low on confidence to try a pass. Get possession and first thought is square or back.

How Williams was not subbed at half-time is beyond me. Allardyce should have ditched back three when it was 1-0. Plain to see it wasn't working.

I think we should just close our eyes and get this season finished. There's another platitude.

Bournemouth go to Chelsea midweek with a "couldn't give a fuck who we are playing" attitude and do em 3-0. The football, or lack of, we are serving up will ultimately crucify us – that's for certain.

Get Eddie Howe in the summer if we are still in the Premier League. At least he's a manager who likes his teams to play football. And doesn't shit his pants every time he sends a team onto the pitch.

What a fucking joke of a club we follow. It's wearing very very thin.

I'm asking this, as I'm wracking my brains trying to come up with any logic or reason behind tonight's selection and tactics. I am genuinely mystified by it.

Schneiderlein is a joke. He offers nothing. Nearly every goal I think why didn't you track him. No tackles, no creativity, no goals. I'd rather play two up top, than carry this fraud.

It's the same reason Unsworth lost games. We are simply too weak minded as a squad to gain any kind of rhythm.

I can't go blaming managers anymore though without being totally honest and asking myself – who is real quality in that squad and therefore, what am I expecting.

If that 16/17 players were called Watford for example, who would you buy for Everton?

This takes some saying but I'm embarrassed to be an Evertonian!! Pathetic!!!

Why as a player would you feel inclined to give it a go when the air of the manager is one of surrender and smugness?

The side, as we knew a hour before the game, were already beaten. Only Walcott and Niasse had any fight in them.

To throw a back three together who barely know each other is negligent. To then put six additional players on their toes and clog the last third is suicide.

And now as os his want, the obvious finger pointing at the players. Everton were atrocious today, ashamedly so.

The board remain the chief issue here, and should be castigated for the poorest managerial appointment in the clubs history.

The fella’s track record, style of play and personality are completely incompatible with the club. He should be removed, something I thought would destabilise the club, but truly it’s happening anyway.

Everton will be safe, I have no doubt about that and we don’t need Sam to get us there point by point, wretched performance by performance.

There's an old saying "If you can't fight, wear a big hat" – is that the 'begat' you are talking about???

Fucking sick off Everton being total horse shite every season. Big Sam, Sammy Lee, Shakespeare, Dunc, Kenwright, Walsh and Woods need to go ASAP after the season while a huge clear out of the deadwood in the squad need to go too starting with Schneiderlin.

Moshiri needs to get in his own people at board level and a top young manager who's also a coach need to come in with a quality backroom staff. Fuck the Director of Football model. It has never worked in the Premier League and just causes too many problems.

You should never change a winning team and first Bobby Brown Shoes started it at the end of his first season with the Dutch fool and Fat Sam continuing the horrible trend.

Kenny may be young but the boy can't defend for his life while Martina is a willing trier, there was a reason he was third choice right back at St Marys. Mangala had a shite debut but he was in a three with two underperforming and slow defenders.

We desperately need a quality left-back and a top deep-lying midfielder who can dictate play.

The worse is yet to come though because even if we escape the drop this club is in such a mess it will be very hard to sort it out and do any better in the immediate future.

I wanted Allardyce appointed for the simple reason he was " The red Adair " of football and could stem the tide and turn the slide down around, started doubting him after the Bournemouth and West Brom away matches using the wrong tactics, today's tactics (?) were much worse and unlike Red Adair he seems to be using petrol instead of water.

Like a lot on here I want the season over and Everton safe for now and a break from it all until August when we will all start worrying again.

Fat boy Sam has made a career of getting big fat contracts and doing as little as possible to earn it. In fact he will do whats required to get an early boot out of the door and boom.. weighed in. He's not alone in employing this tactic. All the greedy dirt-bag managers out there are at it.

The scurvy dog has done this at many places on the English map and, right now, he has just taken the living pish out of Everton and their gullible goons in control.

He held our club over a barrel at the outset some months ago over length of contract. He walked away but was playing the long game. As he tends to do. He settled for £9 million for an 18 month gig eventually. Knowing in his unscrupulous mind, that he wouldn't have to see out that time. Nothing like. A total fraud and bad ass with all his sycophants awaiting in the wings for a weigh out.

It would be nice if true blue Rooney couldn't employ some of his bad boy mates from the old days to come and have an advisory conversation with that fellow before he steals our dough and rides out of town.

he will be getting the bullet before May if he picks more teams like he did today, I see your point though as I thought the Dutchman was doing the same.

Honestly anybody with a functioning pair of eyes could have picked a better line-up today.

How has it come to having to study a side that were bottom of the league two weeks ago in order to work out how to play a football match after the money we spent?

His self serving, attitude is destroying whatever standing Everton have left in the top flight.

As to cement this fact, he yet again takes NO RESPONSIBILITY for this farce and publicly hangs the players out to dry (again). What a shocking appointment. Never let this man near Everton again.

I know the current problems go beyond one player - I'm never keen to see Ashley Williams on the team-sheet, Cuco Martina even as a stop-gap is far from ideal - but Schneiderlin is like a double agent or something.

As for Allardyce, it's his job to inspire confidence in the team collectively and in the players individually. Calling them all inconsistent and saying that the first-half performance was pathetic does not help. I also think setting us up as a back 5 plus 2 holding midfielders sends out a message to the team that we are only good enough to defend against Arsenal and then maybe snatch a goal on the break. No wonder confidence is low.

I think we were too hasty getting rid of Martinez – at least he tried to get us playing football. It is the worse time since the Mike Walker era at the moment.

I've said it before, and I will say it again today, and most probably again before this season is out, but these players are on absolute fortunes, but never would they have a whip round for the fans, who travel everywhere and have to suffer such unadulterated shite.

I'm glad I've stopped traveling to watch Everton play away, which is such a crazy contradictory remark, considering I'd travel absolutely anywhere to watch the team I love.

Tom Davies, struggles at times, but gives me hope, because he's very young, but he's also very brave, and let's have it right, the reason most people enjoyed the Leicester game, was because of the return and superhuman efforts of a man who really cares. A man who we can identify with, which is such a rarity in the modern game.

Darren, Paul, John G, if there is a nailed on tip, it's got to be that Steve Walsh, won't be at Everton next season, but if season ticket sales go well, then I wouldn't bet against Allardyce leaving though Darren.

That's not an excuse for today it will be the excuse for where we finish the season after 3 managers had a crack at Steve Walsh's squad.

Trevor Peers appears to see the bigger picture.

Certainly it seems like he has little appetite for the job which is not surprising with his contract only running for 18 months. Tosun sounds a long way from being ready which begs the question who was behind his signing- we needed a quick fix up front not spending £27 m on a player to sit on the bench.

Bolasie is clearly nowhere near ready for a game against a top team and playing two wingers and only 2 CMs against Arsenal was madness. How he can blame the players and not admit that he picked the wrong team is beyond me.

Someone else posted about the multitude of changes most games and I couldn't agree more- we have no chance of building a cohesive team when we change the personnel so much. There will clearly be many more again next week against Palace – I expect him to still be in charge but can't for the life of me see why he should be.

Pathetic was the right word but he forgot to include himself in that.

As Moshiri said "every Centre half is 60 million now". What? So you get us one for 12 million.

How often was Koeman and Golf mentioned? Koeman and holidays on international breaks?
Its all relevant to a mans intentions.
This was no job for a workaholic manager. He had every excuse in Steve Walsh to not fully commit.
Allardyce to me looks in a similar position and little hints about Transfers Contracts etc give me more reason to believe the DoF is detrimental to a club that traditionally doesn't acknowledge them?

Moshiri's millions have been wasted. Only Pickford and Walcott have been worthwhile buys.

Allardyce has just slaughtered Tosun to the media and that looks another £27 wasted.

Tactics have been shocking. We just need to survive and get rid of the dead wood in the summer and rebuild:

Martina, Keane, Williams, Jagielka, Kenny, Besic, Schneiderlin, Niasse, McCarthy, Robles, Stekelenburg, Sandro, Vlasic, Klaassen. Get rid of the lot and start again.

We're not up to it for all sorts of reasons, and one of those reasons is that most of the players don't care enough, not in their marrow; nor are most of them good enough, of course.

I don't like or dislike the man; I just feel a manager can't operate on a bigger level than the board above him.

I agree with a previous poster. We should never have sacked Martinez. He gave us the best season ever in the Premier League when we finished 4th.

Allardyce isn't the worst since Walker. The worst was Moyes. A negative, dour, cowardly tactician and his shit-scared football at away games became the heart and fabric of the club and still persists.

Burnley haven't won in 9 games and I expect us to overtake them.

It was a tactical horror show. The 5 a cross the back invited the Arsenal midfield on to us and Schneiderlin left Ramsay to do whatever he wanted.

Oumar tried his best and Davies shone in the second half but Williams just barges and pushes people all of the time, Kenny is out of his depth Keane shot of confidence and Mangala seemed to want to go on mazy runs upfield without the puff to get back!

One of the worst 45 mins I have ever witnessed. I have defended Sam at times, but this was the nadir.

The only crumbs of comfort will be if our "rested" boys return to gather points in our next games, which I suspect is what Sam has had his eyes on all along.

Maybe then can we begin to look like moving forward as a club and get a team that looks proud to wear the once famous Blue shirt.

The famous players from the Leicester game sitting on the bench (Coleman, Rooney) a centre-forward signed for £27 Mil. Boys Pen Billy too... wasting about £200 Mil for nothing it's a shame.

Sack Walsh too. And Keane should be sort out. He is a disaster. Too slow in his mind and stiff. Rubbish.

They weren't just pathetic today. They were pathetic at home to Spurs and Arsenal, and they were pathetic at Chelsea, Man Utd and Spurs. They've been pathetic often enough against the bottom 14 sides as well – we were mostly pathetic in victories against Bournemouth and Watford for god's sake.

But, if we were as bad as these pathetic performances suggest, we'd be bottom of the table – not seven points above the bottom three. Spineless, gutless, coasters who don't try a leg when they're expected to lose.

It wouldn't surprise me if we still have this manager in charge next season though because, as you say, something is very wrong at the top.

However those who are craving for the good old days of Martinez are, in my opinion, delusional.

Short memories gentlemen.

I'd take Baines, Jagielka, Lescott, Coleman, Carsley, Arteta, Osman, Fellaini, Pienaar over most of these now. At least they played for each other.

It seems strange that the Southampton game proves that Unsworth was out of his depth (and League One standard) but the Spurs and Arsenal games don't do the same with Allardyce.

Are you one of the massive backroom staff he brought with him?

You rate Moyes the worst manager ever and Martinez the best because he finished 4th, total crap. You have a short memory, Moyes took over an ageing team heading for relegation under Smith, no money to spend, and transformed the club, and surprise surprise, he also guided our club to 4th in the Premier League, spending pittance.

Big Sam was embarrassing in his interview, he's the one who changed a winning team, and was there any difference in our 5-1 defeat today, and Koeman losing 5-2 against the same opposition, his last game before he was sacked?

If only to see if Moshiri actually can get anything right!!!

Tell you what, poor selection or not, players have to show they care. A stat like that says they don't.

Anyone of a nervous or violent disposition who hasn't seen the game, please put your pet in another room or tune in after 15 mins as West Brom & Saints are on second.

In three seasons the only defender, I can remember him spending more than £2 million on was Funes Mori. People forget that during some of those drubbings we were defensively at the bare bones, I remember even Besic played in Defense and Gibson played in an Fa Cup semi final against Man.Utd add to that we at times had Ovideo playing rightback (same with Stones) against Liverpool.

In my previous post, I was not saying that Martinez was the right man but the fans must take responsibility (especially on this site) for hounding him out when the aim should have been taken at the piss-poor way Kenwright and Co were running the club.

What we have had since has been dreadful and the reality is that not many managers are around who can get you playing good football and passing the ball the way Martinez did.

The players are letting us down but they get played one week, out the next. There are no settled partnerships. We change playing style every other week.

So Sam's making some poor choices but he doesn't exactly have a squad with an obvious strength. It's a mish-mash of players brought in with no discernible style of play in mind. We don't even recruit for positions where we have no players available.

So we've undertaken some very poor recruitment. But it doesn't look like anyone is actually coordinating what we want and need with what we buy and no-one has any ownership or accountability. If Walsh had ownership and accountability then he would have been sacked after the Summer.

So everyone is under-performing. And the recurring theme is that, as well as being the wrong people doing the wrong things, they're also not being given the best chance of succeeding.

It goes right up to the board.

- Set a vision
- Set a strategy
- Put in place a plan
- Align every part of the club to that plan.

People look at Leicester's title as if it was just a freak occurrence. And to some extent it was. But there were some things in place that made it at least possible. They got everything aligned, right down to players in their best positions doing the things they were best at.

Huth didn't get exposed for pace or lack of ability on the ball. They knew what they were signing. The recruiters knew what they were expected to recruit. Mahrez didn't get slated for not tracking back, that's not what they signed him for. That's what they signed Kante for. They made it clear when hiring Ranieri that background staff were being retained... Ranieri was just part of the structure.

I still find it amazing that our club transforms every time we bring in a new manager. We've got an absolute identity crisis. We don't have any idea what we are and what we want to be. So it makes sense that we have no plan to get there.

I've never run a football club but, if this was my business, I'd be bringing in an external party to have a warts and all review of what we're doing and set some basic plans in place. Then maybe we can give some clarity to our employees on what is expected of them and give them a chance to succeed.

He must not be selected next week. And that's being fair to him.

It took a young kid to come on to show the required passion. He's struggling at the moment and has been for a while. He never hides, he is always an option for the man in possession and he gives 100% every time he is on the pitch. Can't ask for more, puts some of his team mates to shame.

I would select players who it hurts to lose first then work the rest around them.

I hope the team are up for a fight. Because that's exactly what they will have.

The manager is a top-drawer coward, as are some of our grossly overpaid overrated so-called professional footballers. How low can our club sink? So disappointing.

Time for a big clear-out here once we get to 40 points.

Anyway, Swansea are on live on BBC1 on Tuesday against Notts County – just in case we need to watch them again to see how to play a football match.

Personally, I don't profess to be an expert – but even I can see that unless there is a dramatic change if performance (in the Reserves / U23s) – Schneiderlin should never be selected for the first team again.

The manager is the manager and he has to determine who he wants to play and where he wants to play them.

The financial aspects can be left to an executive – but, in the old mould, the manager can say what he believes (in the present market) a player is worth and how long a contract he should be offered.

The manager then need not be involved in what type and colour of car the player wants, how many bunches of flowers his wife wants in the house every week, where they want to live, how many dogs they have, or where their children go to school.

But, and this is essential, the manager / coach, surely must be the one to decide what players he wants and where he wants to play them.

As matters presently stand, it seems to be a farce.

I'm sure a Director of Football model can work given that managers just don't last as long nowadays. I'm also sure the traditional model of hiring a long term manager and setting up the club around him can work. Any model can work if you understand why you're doing it and put things in place to support it.

What we've got right now needs a miracle to work.

I've championed BBS multiple times here, and I've received a hell of a lot of criticism for it.

But at that point in time when he went, it was (sadly) time for him to go. He had lost the dressing room, as Anthony rightly points out.

I want a manager who wants to play open football like Martinez, but one who doesn't completely ignore the defensive side of the game - like Martinez did.

Of course that leaves me with Pep as the only option, and he ain't leaving Man City any time soon.

In my opinion we need to hire a manager who wants to play attacking football, and just get behind the guy for 4-5 years and see what the hell happens.

If we don't we're stuck in this ever-spinning whirlpool of death realizing 12th to 7th place finishes. Stagnant. Lifeless.

Can you actually be stagnant in a whirlpool?

We knew that trouble was coming as soon as we heard the team. his was triage. I'm certain Sigurdsson, Jagielka, Rooney and Coleman will start against Palace. Possibly Calvert-Lewin too.

This game was sacrificed. Fuck the fans effectively.

Just got home from watching that shite. I've got nothing constructive to say, sorry.

Nuff said.

I would give Allardyce some respect if he done the decent thing and resigned (preferably tomorrow). I know it will not happen because there are millions at stake and we all know Sam is short of a few bob!

If Moshiri made 2 approaches for Silva and still rates the guy, well he is available now. I am not saying he is the answer but he would be a very brave man to want to manage us at the moment as we are a laughing stock. He would be on a hiding to nothing, as any new manager would if the results do not come instantly.

A season full of promise, completely in ruins but hey, 12 games of this shite to go!

Yes we need to remove Walsh and hire a well respected operator but we also need to appoint a coach not a manager.

Simply put its not the model which is the problem hiring completely illsuited characters for it is.

Walsh has no experience in crafting a vision/identity. Allardyce is one for complete control, no good in this model. A european coach not an anglophile like Martinez or Koeman, is what we require.

Tuchel or Fonseca are coaches not managers and would be much more comfortable in this set up.

Add to that this fucking buffoon who is a Championship manager at best. EFC has become the shithole of the football clubs.

To add I see Silva as more a coach than a manager and given his limited and a yet unsuccessful time in the Premier League, I think could also be a contender.

It's 2:00 am and we, the suffering faithful on Coach One, are on the M62. They managed to replace the punctured tyre and we finally left Holloway Road at 10:17 pm. Another wonderful away trip to savour!

See you at Watford!

We didn't finish 4th. We ended up 5th!

As for our next coach/manager, I'd go all in for Leonardo Jardim of Monaco. If not, I'd take a chance with Silva.

Then I settled down with a coffee for the 3rd part = day ruined.

We've been 16 years, 5 managers and we're still saying – well at least he changed it for the better(ish) at the break.

I don't doubt that we will stagger over the line into Premier League safety. But 'somebody' needs to decide just wtf the plan is and if there is one, is it working...No not at the moment... and do something about sorting it out.

Tosun; So Niasse's the main man until he gets up to speed. 'Somebody' picked him, 'somebody' signed off on the €27M. It looks like 'somebody' foisted him onto Sam saying this is the best we can get with what we can afford, you're the coach, coach him.

If I have to watch shite and vilify the manager until he gets sacked or leaves, at least let him pick his own players to be the architect of his destruction.

Kenwright, Allardyce, Walsh... Moshiri's 3 Stooges... 'Somebody' hired Stradivarius and Picasso and promptly put Stradivarius to painting and Picasso making violins.

Directors of Football, my arse.

'Somebody', 'somebody', this 'kin somebody keeps popping up... which 'somebody' is doing it wrong, Moshiri? somebody is... but it couldn't be you, could it?

I will defend to the end your right to make statements in any way you want, using any language you want, as long as it is not sexist or racist. However, I find the tone of your comment, and the language you use, to be abhorrent. And I reserve my right to be suitably disgusted and offended. Donald Trump offended me. So did you. Hopefully an excess of alcohol played some part in your diatribe.

I said on the Live Forum today - I feel truly terrible for the traveling fans. I mean your time, money, heart, everything...

You're saints. I sincerely mean that. It's a joke to have to watch that shit from a fucking kitchen / family room in America on NBC. Traveling on a bus to one of the most expensive cities in the world to watch THAT in person, spending your hard-earned dollar is just terrible.

If I ever, from now until TW and I part, take any umbrage with anything you say, please remind me you travelled to the Arsenal game in February 2018 and I will promptly apologize and ask your forgiveness.

Back in the day (about 55 years ago) when I lived as a teenager in Moreton, I used to go to Goodison Park and Prenton Park. Both were good places to be. But I don't believe what you are stating, mate!

You know there's not chance of Big Sam not being in the role at Noon on Monday!

Martinez... Koeman... Allardyce – has any top flight side ever had three such no-hopers as consecutive managerial appointments in living memory?

This is as bad as the Walter Smith days but Walter never had a penny to spend. Since then we've had Moyes – a good appointment but we were never going to win anything with him in charge with his knives to a gunfight outlook. We panicked going to the big clubs and there's still a stale smell from that. He stayed for 4 years too long but brought us stability.

Martinez was the right kind of appointment – he has a vision on how football should be played and sticks to it. We need to keep the ball well to progress in cup competitions and see out matches. The problem was we weren't fit enough and he should have got a defensive coach in to help him. The players had too much influence over the manager too.

Koeman was a huge mistake. Moshiri wanted the iron fist but there's only so long that works. We had no plan, no playing style and the recruitment policy was scattergun. The first time we've ever had a few bob and it's been wasted largely. Koeman saw us as a stepping stone but he got found out.

The debacle at Southampton was too much for Moshiri to risk our Premier League status. They only wanted to give Allardyce a 6 month contract but gave him the 18 months after that. There are certain things I like about him – his press conferences are a step up on Martinez and Koeman and they get in the ear of the 4th official – something we have lacked – it was no coincidence getting those penalties earlier in his tenure. But the style of footy is woeful and he'll be gone as soon as we're safe.

Where do we go from here as the next appointment is crucial. I'd go for Eddie Howe. He plays football the right way and knows the league. He's also a blue. With money to spend I think he could get a good squad together maybe starting with Charlie Daniels!

For his part the manager is also a disgrace. We should have our own system of play, not look at how last week's opposition played our upcoming opponents. Same old Everton, sh*t scared of the so called top 4 for the last 20 years.

Recruiting managers from Preston, Wigan, Southampton, Palace or coveting managers from Bournemouth or Watford is simply a guarantee of years more of the same. Liverpool did that for years before going after Klopp – Bundesliga winner, Champions League finalist – that is the level. They are not a wealthier club than us – don't make me laugh about spending the Coutinho money cos it went of Van Dijk and Keita – but they are more ambitious than us.

And let's not use the 'who would come to us?" argument. We have a super rich owner happy to spend big and money talks in football. So Moshiri, clean put the mediocrity in this club, get rid of the legacies of failure like Elstone and Kenwright. Go and get us a top manager to be ready for the summer. Someone whose has won trophies in England, Germany, Spain or Italy and managed teams season upon season in the Champions League.

Rob (#295), got to admit mate, Eddie puts a better shift in on the coach than Morgan and Keane do on the pitch. I wanted out the stadium on the third goal but my lad said let's give it to half-time. We didn't get close.

Not a jot of chemistry in that defence. Total strangers to each other. The first requisite at team's like Arsenal away is to be competitive. We'll remember the day. We really will.

Cast your minds back just a few months to when Big Ego was appointed. There were fans on this site talking about what attractive football Bolton played and Okocha this and Djorkaef that, blah, blah, blah. Not to mention the poll.

Ah yes, the poll. The poll were 50% of respondents wanted Sam Allardyce as our next manager.

I certainly wouldn't have thought that openly stating that they had weaknesses at the back for us to exploit, was a sensible thing to say before the game.

Then, in his post-match comments, to slate the players whilst not holding his hand up for the back three fiasco is ridiculous.

If the players are going to get criticised when they play back the tapes, then I hope some of them have the balls to mention the folly of the tactics.

I believe the problem may be in recruitment and man management. Either we aren't recruiting the "right stuff" (selecting new recruits based on their footballing ability alone rather than considering how they would fit into the team, whether they put shifts in, mental and professional attributes, how they get on with others etc).

Or maybe there are some players at the club who really can't be bothered and whether it's little cliques or whatever, it's having a negative effect on the team overall. If that's the case, those players should be moved on pronto.

Both of these areas are Director of Football responsibilities, aren't they – not the manager's?

Furthermore, he states he watched the Swansea game as a pre-match pointer to destroy Arsenal. I think he got the videos mixed up, and watched Waco, Texas Mass Suicide.

Why change a side that produced what we haven't seen for a long time, 'joined-up football' okay Seamus was ill apparently, one change needed.

It's a bit like a Formula 1 team, they win a race, and then the following race, (against stronger opposition) try changing the engine (for one out of a lawnmower) where is the logic?

If he has got any sense of decency he should resign, he isn't going to manage again, so it won't damage his 'football credibility' and let us salvage what is left of the season, with survival being uppermost on the agenda.

Eddie Howe is, and has worked wonders at Bournemouth, limited resources yet perform better than we do. He knows the Premier League and has had little money at his disposal, yet produces.

Sean Dyche has just been offered an extended contract at Burnley apparently

I've often advocated bigger, stronger players, especially in midfield. That team was hollow. Two centre mids who either strut around or are unable to stand and tackle, a still unfit Bolasie, a defender chucked in a couple of days after he's signed, the guile of Sigurdsson and Rooney on the bench and the £27M striker on the bench 'getting up to speed'.

I can understand him having a go at the players, but he'd be a bigger man if he explained the rationale behind that selection and how he got it horribly wrong.

He threw the game. On a "can't win, don't waste the effort" basis.

Expect multiple changes for the Palace game. He'll see that as one worth turning up to.

Like every football club, business, or organisation, the culture of winning or losing is set by those at the top. Who else can pick the phone up to the manager and his coaching team and tell them this is unacceptable? Who is it at Everton?

We need some ruthlessness. Someone who is willing to say in public what they expect from every player, manager and coach. Have we heard from the Chairman or CEO that this season's performances have let everyone down at the club, including the fans?

Or is everyone too busy setting the tables at St George's Hall for the EitC Dinner on the 13th February? I know I've had about 5 or 6 e-mails offering me tickets over the past few weeks. Meanwhile, we are stinking the place out every time we play. Never mind, the football will take care of itself.

I think the earlier poll is a truer reflection of how Evertonians view Allardyce. I remember telling a red mate about that earlier poll at the time it was concluded, when he asked me about the rumours of Allardyce's possible appointment. He said that was quite an indictment against Allardyce, and was surprised that as many as 20% were for the appointment.

In other words, non-Evertonians are probably as aghast as we are over his appointment. In short, there's no-way he represents the supposed ambitions and 'ethos' of the club.

I do wonder what the people at the top of our club think of the 'football' we have been served up in the last three or four years.

Do they think it's okay as long as we stay in the Premier League?

Do they think games against the top six are merely fixtures that have to be completed and losing them even heavily and regularly is acceptable?

Do they consider the team at all?

The Sams have to go... simple.

I would never signed Big Sam. He is an old fashioned manager never playing attacking football only speaking of clean sheets nothing else. And his starting XI is rubbish

I was as pleased as anyone to get the result and to see the return of Coleman, but it shows how far we have fallen.

The capitulation at Arsenal was insulting to the fans who had spent money and time to attend and embarrassing to all of us who have to face fellow football fans all over the world and explain just how we could be so bad.

I have lost count of the depressing evenings and weekends ruined by my love of this club, and that is without regular attendance to games. If we go on to beat Palace and Watford, I suppose Sam will feel vindicated, but personally, I think that to try to keep the winning team in place and try to build up some understanding would have been better.

Even if Rooney or Sigurdsson had needed hooking after an hour it would have at least allowed us to build on the Leicester result.

I also thought that Sam was wrong not to mention Niasse, as a player, like Davies, who gives his all.

Over the years I have experienced all the emotions from delight to despair, but the overriding feeling I have at the moment, is one of bitter disappointment.

I can understand the frustration that we are all feeling at this time, but all the effin' and jeffin' that's being expressed is not going to solve anything.

To the supporters who travel the length and breadth of the country, you have both my admiration and sympathy. My days of following the 'Blues' away from home are long gone, and I know that there won't be many of you who come under the category of "That's me I'm finished" – you more than anyone, you deserve better.

I can think of Pickford, Coleman, Walcott, Sigurdsson, Gueye, Davies and Bolasie who I would think would add immediate quality. The likes of Calvert-Lewin, Keane, Dowell, Lookman and Baningime offer potential. The rest are of average ability or aging and some have dubious attitudes – the leisurely Schneiderlin and obvious example.

If we all thought the players were shite, there would not be as much anger. The issue is that the tactics and mentality is wrong, all wrong, with mismanagement on a ridiculous level: no left-back; no replacement striker; piss-poor negative tactics; youth players overlooked, despite positive impacts when (under)used; and divisive comments which seeks to absolve Alardyce from his choices, so as not to deter his next employers this Summer.

The Arsenal game was a free hit as no-one expected anything from. It has been observed once or twice by the more sage observers that Schneiderlin and Gueye do not operate well together and that Arsenal are not invincible at all: RS twatted them on the counter attack. Bournemouth and Burnley don't have squads as good as ours but they can play without fear and above all commitment and determination: anyone remember what that was like? Feeling proud of the team even if you lose.

Personally, I don't blame Moyes and feel he kept us safe in turbulent times following periods of hideous incompetence: that's already been done to death. As for Kenwright, he should go... along with Allardyce... asap.

Finally, we are not a joke; we are an average side under-performing with a journeyman manager who has little to no popular support, who knows he is out in the Summer, and who is openly blaming players he picks.

A joke is when you set up a premise and then put a ridiculous or surprising conclusion: there is fuck all surprising about getting twatted by Arsenal and the other elite teams. We are simply a poorly run club that struggled financially for years then made a bollocks of a once-in-a-generation opportunity.

Sadly this is so absolutely typical of Everton. Outside of Everton, nobody can be arsed laughing at us because Everton does not have much relevance anymore.

I feel the level of self-serving cynicism from Sam Allardyce should result in fucking him right off now.

We shall continue to be Evertonians even when Moshiri's ignorance has landed us in the Championship, as it surely will.

Seriously though, it's people like Eddie on Coach 2, and Andy on Coach 1 who keep these coach journeys enjoyable, serving drinks and providing the entertainment via DVDs. Well done to both lads.

There needs to be a root and branch cleansing of the club and its practices, from Moshiri all the way down to the tea ladies.

Moshiri's wealth and business nounce is a considerable step up from Bill Kenwright. In the 2 years he has been the main player it is very hard to feel reassured he has (as highlighted by Ernie) 'a vision, a strategy, a plan, or is aligning every part of the club to that plan'.

Yes, he has changed manager 3 times in 2 years (if you include Unsworth). Can it be said he has yet made the right appointment?

Yes, we have paid unprecedented fees for players on his watch. Can you honestly say the money has been well spent?

Yes, he appointed Walsh as Director of Football to ensure 'continuity of style and player type at the club, whoever the manager is'. Can a definite style or player type be recognized as 'what Everton is about or represents?'

Walsh for me is clearly not up to the job. Nor does he have the credentials for the role, even if it is deemed an appropriate or necessary one for Everton or not. There are far, far better candidates available.

Lest we forget, according to reports it was Walsh who lobbied strongly for Sam Allardyce's appointment following Koeman's departure.

As Ernie rightly points out, everyone - EVERYONE - is under-performing. To quote Ernie:

"...the recurring theme is that, as well as being the wrong people doing the wrong things, they're also not being given the best chance of succeeding."

Moshiri is the man calling the shots. Unless and until he really implements a vision, a strategy and an aligned plan to every aspect of the club; unless and until he really shakes the tree, root and branch, continue to expect more of the same.

I fear he may be similar to Schneiderlin; because someone paid a lot of money for them we believe they will do it for us. We are the worst team with the worst coach in the Premier League. We gained some very lucky points under Allardyce and we are in a false position because of this.

We are too bad to stay up – not too good to go down.

But what concerns me would be if this 'plan' was something from above, from Moshiri? That indeed would be truly worrying, that a non-footie man, is directing team affairs.

If the players see this then they have lost games before they start, a la Moyes, and it may explain the abject level of effort shown by these mercenaries.

I'm only hypothesising – what do people think of that, if it were to be true?

Putting aside your claim it was a deliberately 'weakened' side Allardyce played against Arsenal (other than Kenny, all the starting XI were full internationals), the following link does not support your hypothesis about Moshiri picking the side, but it does reveal his limited thinking, ambition and expectancy in games against the big boys.

Everton’s Farhad Moshiri: Ronald Koeman has my total support

He is obviously oblivious as to how constant changes destroy any chance of the team knitting together and making us a solid unit. He really is thick and yesterday was like he was paid to make sure we got hammered.

Allardyce is a total embarrassment now and his talk of getting the players to pull together was destroyed by him criticising them after the game when it was clearly his fault.

It's what happens with mediocre teams – they win some, lose a lot, concede a lot of goals, don't score many, never win trophies, sell their best players in their prime, buy mediocre replacements, and occasionally have brushes with relegation.

And it's difficult to see that changing.

Schneiderlin – Coward,fraud,
Baines – Finished
Keane – Too weak and just not good enough
Williams – Donkey... Brian Labone must be turning
Jagielka – Finished, been sulking like a child
Bolasie – Never been good enough
Rooney – Past his sell-by date
Tosun – I think we've been sold another pup
Martina – Any time, any place, anywhere... just not at Everton
Gueye – Good for Bommy Night
Sigurdsson – We paid £25Million too much
Niasse – God loves a trier
Klaassen – Too weak, mentally and physically
Funes Mori – Accident waiting to happen
Mangala – Yobo Mk 2

Kenwright – Conman
Woods – Kenwright Crony
Elstone – Kenwright's puppet
Denise Barrett-Baxendale – Kenwright finger-puppet
Dr Keith Harris – Another Kenwright Crony and backer
Moshiri – Incompetent and out of his depth big time

We need a revolution at our club.

So many continue to view Everton in isolation and arrive at the mistaken conclusion you do.

The data screams out loud and clear EXACTLY what and where Everton is, and has done all season.

* We will lose home and away to the top 6 and often get seriously twatted in doing so (eg Arsenal h 2-5, a 1-5, Spurs h 0-3, a 0-4, United h 0-2, a 0-4). That record reads:

P 9 W 0 D 3 L 6 F 5 A 27 (GD -25) Pts 3 out of a possible 27.

In those 9 games alone we have conceded 27 of our 45 goals. That's 60% of the overall total.

* Against the rest of the league, from Burnley in 7th to WBA in 20th, our record is:

P 17 W 8 D 4 L 5 F 24 A 18 (GD +6) Pts 28 out of a possible 51.

Burnley is the only home loss in 9. The recent draw with WBA is the only other time this season we have dropped home points to teams in the 'bottom' 14 places.

From that you can conclude we will beat most of those teams at Goodison, but still struggle to win away against anybody, as has been the case for more than a year now.

In our remaining 11 fixtures we only play 3 more games against the top 7: h Liverpool and City, away to Burnley. Anticipate 0 points return on those games.
The other 8 games are against the 'worst of the rest'.

Given how many fixtures the other teams in that group are against each other, we are under no threat of relegation. All will be carving each other up and I for one will not be surprised to see teams surviving the drop this season with 35-37 points.

Conclusion: we will not be shown up as 'the worst team with the worst coach in the Premier League' as you claim. There really are considerably worst teams than us, Andy.

Small comfort, I grant you. But the fear of relegation THIS season is inflated by too many on here.

However, unless all the things Ernie writes about @ 278 are addressed, all bets could be off for next season with regards to the 'R' word.

Boalsie I don't see any evidence at all that he would or has added quality to our team. In fact, I would say Sigurdsson, who hasn't been great, has still been more productive overall.

The question was who would you buy for Everton? After Bolasie's spell, you would buy him again? If you would buy them two,surely you would only expect more of what we have already seen.

When you have players quite clearly not trying, or not giving a shite what happens, you have to question the point in caring at all.

I played for Laxey FC in the Isle of Man and remember a lad playing his first game. He wasn't very good but he tried, especially when a shot was coming right at him. He didn't duck or put his arms up or try to get out of the way, he put us face in the way and took the full force of the ball in the face. Knocked dizzy, blood pouring from his nose, wouldn't go off and played on.

Our new signing Mangala, 6ft-5in brick shithouse, same situation, ball coming right at him, not only ducks, but turns his back on the shot, ball deflects, goal. Does he give a toss? No! That's the difference, these pros don't give a fuck!

The malaise at the top (clueless Farhad and Boys Pen Bill) runs right through to the players and staff. Why give a toss if even minimum standards aren't required, if we expect (dixit Moshiri) to lose certain games, if we have a temporary manager, if we spent 5 months without a recognised striker and now we don't have a natural left back?

What must the likes of Rooney think when he looks around and sees a shambles, a complete lack of spirit and organisation after so many years of achievements and success?

Some would like to blame Mangala (after two days) or Keane (the lad's never had a settled partner and has missed many games) for our misfortunes when the guilt lies at the feet of Moshiri, Kenwright and Walsh for their gigantic cock-up with Koeman and then the summer transfer window.

Big Sam and his three musketeers also have a portion of blame due to their shitty tactics, cowardice away from home, team selections and grotty appearance (Sam must be the worst dressed manager in the Premier League) in general but they are only here for a few more weeks but the cretins at board level seem like they are here to stay and that's the scary bit.

Absolutely spot on. We are currently the worst team in the Premier League by some distance.

Those early wins Sam got after being handed a squad which was buzzing, are all that is keeping the chasing pack at arms length. The only thing Allardyce brought is good old fashioned poxy luck. We had our woodwork ratted more time than a brothel keeper's door in those games and we have enjoyed logic defying luck since. (Was it just the three times Leicester hit our woodwork on Wednesday?)

I cringed as Sam set out to spoil both games against a West Brom team who are in danger of being cut adrift. Only desperate finishing on their part allowed us to escape at the Hawthorns and they played us off the fucking park when the came to Walton, with the woodwork again coming to our aid.

They say the table doesn't lie and I have always believed that... but it's lying through its fucking teeth right now. If there is a worse team in the league than us at the moment, I haven't seen them.

I'd maybe accept it if this was our penultimate game of the season with possible relegation riding on a greatly more winnable last... but, then again, no, not really..

Anyway, this is nothing short of a needless, soul-destroying (for fans and players!!) capitulation, to the point of meekly offering up our already confidence sapped team as sacrificial lambs to yet another slaughter!!!

Oi... Big Sam... NO!!!!!!!

The deflected shot would have been blocked, and the cross too, and the wheelie bin would have been of some use after the game, to put fat Sam, little Sam and the fake Shakespeare in (and Mangala) to take them to Otterspool tip!😁

I just got done watching the Palace - Newcastle game and what a joy it was to see both teams going for it, playing long incisive passes that may or may not come off, 100% effort, speed of play brisk bordering on lightning at times.

I truly enjoyed it. By contrast, watching Everton is like having bamboo shoots stuck under your fingernails.

Otterspool! Ah, so many childhood memories...

Thanks, Bill, you have overseen a disaster at Everton FC

It is us who should be singing the 1995 song that the rRS taunt us with, to the directors box next home game. It should be sung loud from start to finish such is the seriousness of our predicament.

We've had luck all season, including Unsworth's two finest hours against Watford and West Ham.

Now, if you'd said poorest team to watch in the league, I'd have agreed with you.

I said we are currently the worst team in the league. Of that I have no doubt. We were murdered by the bottom team twice recently and we have progressively gone downhill the longer Allardyce is in charge.

You are right on one count though... we're definitely the ugliest too.

What the hell are you talking about!? How my opinion about Mangala being a dreadful defender makes me like Trump!!! I don't rate him as a defender and the same goes for Keane and Williams, ffs. I just don't think any of them are good enough for Everton.

Walsh and fat Sam Out!

I hate to say it but, if we are not any better than today, then we deserve to get relegated and regroup but, as Villa, Blackburn and Forest have realised, there's no guarantee that you always bounce back.

Leicester was a breath of fresh air but, fuck me, the stink's back.

Then not only let them waste millions on players that no other club wants... top that off by letting better players go out on loan! They have made the club a laughing stock while alienating the fans.

Pressure on the players and manager for the Crystal Palace game? Nah... most just don't give a fuck.

Three managers plus Unsworth have failed. The next must restore confidence or it's bye bye Premier League.

Arsenal are probably the one team that always outplay us, home or away, and are more than capable of giving most teams a good thrashing on their day. 5-1 is a stinker but again I'm not surprised.

However the football played under Koeman, Unsy and Sam has been tripe. I believe the midfield is the key area to any successful team. Unfortunately we have one of the worst midfields in the Premier League. There appears to be no game plan or understanding between our players.

I don't often blame individuals but Schneiderlin has to go. Why does he and Williams keep getting game time?? Their passing, positional sense, lack of marking and inability to track unmarked players is shocking.

I would rather Sam simply play hoof ball. Defenders defend (by actually marking) and we stop giving the ball away so cheeaply in our own half. It wasn't the 5-man defensive tactic at fault, it was the players and lack of cover in front.

Why was Keane brought back? Holgate has played well there. Keane should write this season off and wake up in preseason. How can we have so many gaps at the back? Poor players who can not read or understand the game. The midfield were useless, led by a passive Schneiderlin. It lacked vision and passing ability.

Pickford
Kenny, Holgate/Martina, Jagielka, Mangala, Garbutt. All stay back and defend.
Davies, Gana (to cover/tackle), Rooney (pass and create).
Walcott (movement and pace).
Tosun (hold/link play).

Subs. If we were losing.. Need fresh legs and pace in midfield, fwd. Sigurdsson for Rooney. Bolasie for Davies. Calvert-Lewin for Tosun.

A pining for the heady days of Unsworth's stint as caretaker manager wishes to discount the losses and 3 thumpings on his watch on some invented reasoning to help massage Rhino's numbers.

In the same breath, the same poster attempts to discount the wins on Sam's watch as largely down to luck.

Focussing on the 'luck' factor alone, the solitary 2 wins Unsworth recorded in his 8 games in charge were:

H Watford 3-2
H WHU 4-0

The 4 wins under Allardyce are:

H Huddersfield w 2-0
A Newcastle w 1-0
H Swansea w 3-1
H Leicester 2-1

Now me, I'm happy every time and any way Everton wins a game. But from the 6 nominations listed, I consider there is one standout candidate for the most fortunate win of the season.

It will make for interesting reading hearing from people on how they rank those games by the very subjective label 'luck' and which of those victories they consider were most heavily laced with 'the Gods smiling on us'.

Is there a prize for this?

If there isn't I won't be entering any more of your contests, Jay. Just so we're clear.

I can sum up yesterday – we were fucking shit.

You can close the thread now.

Big Sam is a traditional manager who, like many of his generation, is being left behind by a transformation in playing style during the last few years. That's not to say he is a bad manager, and is certainly a good man to have in a relegation fight, but yesterday illustrated his weaknesses for all to see. He was fit for purpose at a time of real anxiety because he will make sure we won't go down but he should be moved on at the end of the season.

He decided, against a team who are strong in the centre, to play with width. So, rather than pushing Arsenal players wide and forcing crosses from a Giroud-less Arsenal... he decided to play with wingers and wing backs and force Arsenal inside. We were utterly lacking in the centre, in part because of having 3 centre-backs as well as 4 wide players, so our DMs were pushing Arsenal's deep midfielders. Ozil and Mkhitaryan had so much space between defence and midfield as a consequence and it was so so easy for them.

It was tactical suicide and one of the most baffling managerial decisions of the season. We played into Arsenal's strengths. Not to mention the idiocy of playing a formation we have not been using with a new centre-back. And this is an Arsenal in a mini-crisis of their own, not a top of the table side. They've scored 51 goals in 26 games... but 10 in 2 against us. It's disgraceful.

I've gone on about Eddie Howe on here for ages – he is a manager who will make mistakes but he is a manager with a progressive vision who has consistently got the best out of a limited team, and more importantly got the best out of limited players. He has his team playing attacking and fluid football and it continues during bad periods. He is a progressive manager and looks for solutions to problems. He would not have let Lookman go on loan.

If we are to move forward as a football club we need to trust in a progressive manager and give them time to work through bad periods. We can't keep chopping and changing. Our squad is a baffling mix at the moment – it's not fit to purpose. It's massively overloaded in certain areas and woeful in others. There is no consistency of vision, possibly made worse by a disjuncture between the technical director and the management.

We, after years of waiting, have the financial capacity to compete with a lot of teams in this league. But we are shooting ourselves in the foot time and time again. We need a clear out this summer – players must go, a new manager must come in, and ridiculous illusions about getting top 4 in the interim must go. We need to look to the future - invest in youth, and move out the deadwood. And we must not buy any more players in the late 20s or early 30s. It's not what we need.

I like Theo and think he will do well for us, but buying cast offs in their late 20s from the team directly above us is not going to improve us. We need to take the chance on the next Aubameyang or Dembele and bring in a manager who can progress players and the club – not someone who will tread water or having us treading water.

Agree, I wanted Eddie Howe when Koeman got sacked as I believe he will get a big club. He is a good coach and his teams have a go and try to win games. He has done well over 3 or 4 years and he is young and hungry. Why some want Silva when he has been at two clubs in about 7 months.

After Saturday I would respond to Michael Lynch.
You ask if my glass is half empty?
Well Michael, I'm not quite sure, I can't find it,it isn't where I left it, I think I sent it out on loan!!

Instead of wanting jam on it, i'll settle for bread and dripping!!

To Chris Gould I would respond that you were right at the time, but after Saturday, I think I would not attract the same comment(s).

Its tough being an Evertonian, but I wouldn't change. But my god its probably the worst period I've known in 54 yrs of being a blue, and that's saying something!

Sam will keep us up, but then get rid.
________________________________________

Ray Smith 50

Is Tosun injured/carrying a knock.
Why is a £27m striker on the bench.

He was bought to solve the striker shortage and warms the bench.

Will he start Saturday?

Tonight would have been a good game to show what he can do, but no, Allardyce replaces Niasse with Dom, priceless.

Lookman going nowhere 2 days ago. Can we believe anything Allardyce says???

_____________________________________________
Michael Lynch 52

Ray @53, I take it your glass is always half empty then? We just won a game, played some great attacking football, saw Coleman look like he's never been away, and watched Theo produce the kind of performance none of our other players have been able to come up with all season.
What do want, jam on it?

_____________________________________________
Chris Gould 53

Ray, this is not the time to whine. Enjoy what was a much improved performance.
You can't criticise the team selection when we played with such energy and commitment – and won!!

I'm not sure Eddie Howe is yet the calibre of manager we need/want but he is a cut above Silva.

However I think the root of our problems lie further up the tree.

Kenwright has always been smoke and mirrors so you can imagine what that does for the culture in our club.

Moshiri seems content to rely on advice from Kenwright, Steve Walsh and Jim White with questionable results.

My proposal which I've advocated elsewhere is to get behind SA and the players for the rest of this season and then appoint David Dein As CEO and get Wenger as DOF and let them choose the new manager. If money is no object we should be looking for the calibre of Simeone, Tuchel or Ancellotti with the challenge of competing with Guardiola and Mourhino in the best league in the world.

It's been a dreadfully depressing season. Wednesday was one of 2 moments to saviour. I certainly stand by my comment.

But, yes, Saturday was dismal and baffling.

Still, I agree with Jay Harris, the problems are boardroom level, and I will continue to support Allardyce whilst he's here. I really don't want a 4th manager in one season. That would make the club look as fickle as some of its fans.

It's a bit of a joke how we've suddenly got people hailing Eddie Howe now he's had a good run. How many were calling for him when Koeman was sacked? He should stay where he is. Where he is appreciated. 3 or 4 poor performances with us and he'd get mullered on here.

While most are grateful for the breaks, I don't think there would be too many who would try to contest it... I guess there would be even fewer who think Rhino has anything to do with it.

It always amazes me how people would spend so much time selecting stats about games most of us saw anyway.

Allardyce's new tactic: three at the back – a crossbar and two posts

We've been damn lucky to win most of the games and awful to watch for bloody ages, the woodwork has been our best defender and we've had a few penalties that we would have been up in arms over had they been given against us.

Surely there's a light somewhere in this long, dark tunnel?