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Financing the breakthrough
There's been a lot of talk this season about a team outside of the top four breaking into it. Given how well we've performed this season to date, any of the talk that has mentioned Everton has seemed more justified than ever.With the mid-season transfer window in situ, now would seem the ideal time for David Moyes to really make the most of an excellent season by bolstering his squad in the right areas and then really pushing on to the end of the seaason.
Unfortunately all Moyes has been able to do, with over half the transfer window over, is to sign Fernades on a loan deal and hold out for as much cash as he can for McFadden. Now this is not at all a criticism of the man. Over the last couple of transfer windows I think he has gotten far more right than wrong. Instead, I think it is a sign of how our poor finances have really hamstrung him at the worst possible time.
At the moment it is hard to see where the money will come from for Moyes to spend in the way he needs to to really bring the squad up. The Board is seemingly broke and our line of credits with the banks are overextended as it is. With the exception of selling players, it's hard to see where cash will come from between now and the end of this transfer window. To date, the only fringe or bit part player that there has been any reported interest in is McFadden, which means that the possible £5m we get for him may be the only cash raised this month for players coming in. If you add to this the fact that most of the extra loans raised last August were apparently spent on Yakubu, there is nothing in reserve to add to the money raised in selling McFadden.
What to do then with this five million then? In my own mind you make the most of it and sign Pienaar on a permenant deal. This would then take the pressure off in terms of any other successful loan signings until the summer and would mean that one quality player was signed during the window.
After that I really don't know. It's hard to see how our finances will pick up between now and the first of August, when the next window opens, or between now and the middle of August when the next season starts. I suppose it will just have to be the usual wheeling and dealing by Moyes, with us fans crossing our fingers that it is just the fringe players we see leave the club.
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Although I would not like to see McFadden leave, I agree with you Kieran that Pienaar would be an excellent buy. Fernandes is certainly expensive but is I thin worth the oney if EFc can buy him for £8m.
As for the money issue, surely EFC have budgeted from the increased income expected this year to cover the money laid out for Yakubu...
As for the money issue, surely EFC have budgeted from the increased income expected this year to cover the money laid out for Yakubu...
Just out of interest. how do you know all this. do you work for the bank?
You say "the board is seemingly broke". How do you quantify this.
I?m not trying to cause an argument but I just don?t get the same impression as you.
And Moyes has also bought a young goose.
You say "the board is seemingly broke". How do you quantify this.
I?m not trying to cause an argument but I just don?t get the same impression as you.
And Moyes has also bought a young goose.
First of all: we signed Gosling on a permanent base. I don’t see him getting a regular starting spot right now but that doesn’t mean we did not sign him. We are not totally broke, apparently we have enough money to spend 1mil on a young talent from League One.
Secondly: We had the money to sign Manny AND Yakubu last summer. We don’t know why the Manny deal fell through exactly (well I don’t know at least), but I don’t expect us we threw the money we had reserverd for Manny out of the window.
And thirdly: we’ll get what, 50mil or so, coming summer on TV-rights? Now I know the club has probably already reserved most of that money, but I still think it will not leave us broke.
I don’t think we’re the rich kids in the Premier League, but to suggest we’ll have zip to spend is quite absurd.
Secondly: We had the money to sign Manny AND Yakubu last summer. We don’t know why the Manny deal fell through exactly (well I don’t know at least), but I don’t expect us we threw the money we had reserverd for Manny out of the window.
And thirdly: we’ll get what, 50mil or so, coming summer on TV-rights? Now I know the club has probably already reserved most of that money, but I still think it will not leave us broke.
I don’t think we’re the rich kids in the Premier League, but to suggest we’ll have zip to spend is quite absurd.
Just had a seriiously wierd thought about back up for Carsley. Neville right back, Gosling and Hibbert his back up. Then for Carsley besides Neville how about Hibbert? He is one of the best man markers in the league, where was Petrov last week, in Hibberts pocket, Ronaldo never goes to the left when we play the manure, Giggs is lost against Hibbert. So when we play the Shite and Chelski, Hibbert in midfield and gone on the threats of Stevee Me and Lampard.
As I said a weird thought.
As I said a weird thought.
Just a quick correction mate, the window starts on July 1st not August 1st, You?re forgetting that we have Robert Earl on the Board now and he, unlike Hicks and GIllett, doesn?t mind spending his own money to improve the club, also as mentioned above we will have improved income in the summer, I think its aroiund £50m TV rights as Erik Said, then theres money for finishing position, usually around £20m for 6th, probably twice that for 4th, then if we qualify for CL theres huge boost to income, finally prize money if we manage to win UEFA or CC.
You could well be right Rob. As I don?t know exact figures myself I?m in no position to call anyone a liar. This is what I based my arguement on: I thought that Robert Earl had just underwritten those loans last summer from the banks though. As for the league finish it was recently increased form 500k per place so wouldn?t be worth that much more than 8-9m for a top four or top six finish. The T.V money is a fair point but has been a standing income for the last couple of seasons. And, with the amount we owe the banks, and with having to put millions aside for the stadium and projected running costs for the next financial year I honestly don?t think we will have that much more than we did last summer.
I think that we fans need to admit that we really do not have a very good idea of the club’s finances (the annual report is a useful source, but I don’t believe that it provides specific information on player transfers and fees, or does it? Somebody, please correct me if I am wrong).
Anyway, the fact is that EFC have been consistently spending 10~ 15 million on new players per year (net of player sales) over the past 2 years (Johnson, Lescott, Yakubu, Baines, Jagielka, etc). There is no reason, why we would not be able to spend a similar amount this year, too. Unless the players’ salaries have gone through the roof, which I doubt. In fact, I would hazard a guess that BK is keeping his powder dry for a really big signing in the summer (a la Yakubu). Again, I admit, this is pure speculation.
I trust that DM and BK know what they are doing - I don’t see DM complaining about a lack of funds. So, I am satisfied with that.
I really believe that we have a good squad now. Just a few reinforcements over the next couple of windows and I believe we will be challenging the "Top 4" for honours - I really do !
COYB !!!
Anyway, the fact is that EFC have been consistently spending 10~ 15 million on new players per year (net of player sales) over the past 2 years (Johnson, Lescott, Yakubu, Baines, Jagielka, etc). There is no reason, why we would not be able to spend a similar amount this year, too. Unless the players’ salaries have gone through the roof, which I doubt. In fact, I would hazard a guess that BK is keeping his powder dry for a really big signing in the summer (a la Yakubu). Again, I admit, this is pure speculation.
I trust that DM and BK know what they are doing - I don’t see DM complaining about a lack of funds. So, I am satisfied with that.
I really believe that we have a good squad now. Just a few reinforcements over the next couple of windows and I believe we will be challenging the "Top 4" for honours - I really do !
COYB !!!
Just a couple of points.
this article is pure speculation. You have no idea what Davey wants to do in the transfer window. You are saying that’s hall he CAN do, well he’s not known for splashing cash in Janaury (its too expensive) so he’s not going to spend it if he doesn’t have to.
Prize money for the premiership went up by a huge amount this year. (last year Man Uud got £30m, tihs year Derby will get that!) So we should stand to get at least £45m as a result of league finish alone.
this article is pure speculation. You have no idea what Davey wants to do in the transfer window. You are saying that’s hall he CAN do, well he’s not known for splashing cash in Janaury (its too expensive) so he’s not going to spend it if he doesn’t have to.
Prize money for the premiership went up by a huge amount this year. (last year Man Uud got £30m, tihs year Derby will get that!) So we should stand to get at least £45m as a result of league finish alone.
£2.66mn per year for the next three years to arrive at everton for the latest Chang sponsorship deal.
By my simple maths reckoning thats a pienaar every year for the next three without touching the overdraft!
Good Work Everton!
Our relationship with Chang appears to be very strong. The setting up of a co branded academy in Thailand is an excellent idea and will help promote Everton to the Thai youth. What odds would we get on the new Kirby Stadium becoming the "Chang Stadium" ??
By my simple maths reckoning thats a pienaar every year for the next three without touching the overdraft!
Good Work Everton!
Our relationship with Chang appears to be very strong. The setting up of a co branded academy in Thailand is an excellent idea and will help promote Everton to the Thai youth. What odds would we get on the new Kirby Stadium becoming the "Chang Stadium" ??
When will you ever learn? Just about every team that ever got into the top half of any league is always ?just one or two players off being a great side?! If Moyes went out tomorrow and followed every suggestion we make, he?d have a right ?dog?s breakfast? of a team. Just let him ? and the Board ? get on with it. They haven?t made a bad job of it so far!
chris is right, i have heard people wittering on about budgets and we have to sell mc fadden, rubbish, the bottom club in the prem this year earns 27 million, you only get aprox 26 million for winning the champ league. so let?s assume we only finish mid table, its got to be at least 35 million, proberbly 40 plus. that?s why all the clubs are being bought out by business men, it?s a gold mine, the futures bright the futures blue.
There is something odd about the Manny F deal. If he is such a good player where is the queue of clubs seeking his services? He is worth only what a prospective purchaser is prepared to pay.
Valencia do not reckon he is worth his purchase price yet want to recoup as much of it as possible.
I fancy that David Moyes has learned from past mistakes on the European transfer market.
Valencia do not reckon he is worth his purchase price yet want to recoup as much of it as possible.
I fancy that David Moyes has learned from past mistakes on the European transfer market.
To be fair Kieran. Moyes has already been on record and said he will probably only be arranging loan deals. Plus the fact there is generally not the quality available in the January transfer window unless your spending big bucks!
I do have to give the board credit for their business acumen with recent comings and goings. Whereas in the past we would give players away who would go on to establish themselves in the Premiership (McCann, Dunne), we now seem much more capable of holding our nerve and getting the best possible price. It would have been easy to accept Birmingham’s initial bid for our fifth choice striker, but we appear to be in line to recieve up to three times that amount. It’s good business. Moyes can do a lot with £5.5m
On the other hand, we don’t spend excessively on over-rated players like we used to. If we can get Fernandes for a considerably discounted fee, then great, if not we move on.
Personally, I feel like putting £5.5m in the bank now to add to any potential prize money for league and cup finishes makes perfect sense. We generally only play one up top, so Mcfadden would be most likely to get a game in a wide position. As much as I like the guy, £4m profit on a player who has never quite made it for us makes perfect sense.
On the other hand, we don’t spend excessively on over-rated players like we used to. If we can get Fernandes for a considerably discounted fee, then great, if not we move on.
Personally, I feel like putting £5.5m in the bank now to add to any potential prize money for league and cup finishes makes perfect sense. We generally only play one up top, so Mcfadden would be most likely to get a game in a wide position. As much as I like the guy, £4m profit on a player who has never quite made it for us makes perfect sense.
Like many of you guys on here it is impossible to get accurate details on the finances of our club and rightly so, such detailed information should not be publicly available.
However, I would have thought given Moyes comments about the difficulty in finishing in the top 10 this season that the club would have budgeted for finishing around 8th-10th, given that each premiership place is worth around £500k, pushing on for 4th would give us anywhere between £2-£3m extra. I have seen on many forums that we have an option to buy Pienaar for £2.5m ish (can anyone confirm?) so I think a top 4 finish could buy us Pienaar.
Also given our history in the cups I don’t believe that the board would have budgeted heavilly for extra gates, as a very prudent estimate lets assume we will have played an extra 6 home games this year, allowing for cut price tickets at £20 with attendances of 35,000 thats another £700k per game, potentially £4.2m (obviously they are further costs associated with these games so not straight profit). Added to that the sale of McFadden at around £5m, I would think that will give us enough to have a try for Asharvin.
With regard to Manny the only question is do we still have the money we were going to spend on him in the summer? if so then you would assume that he could be bought in the summer as well, that of course ignores the standard £10-£15m transfer kitty that the club have probably budgeted for in the summer.
So I think the biggest question now is do the board really believe we can push on for 4th spot, if so then now is the time to invest, if we succeed then the players will pay for themselves, if we don’t! MORE DEBT.
However, I would have thought given Moyes comments about the difficulty in finishing in the top 10 this season that the club would have budgeted for finishing around 8th-10th, given that each premiership place is worth around £500k, pushing on for 4th would give us anywhere between £2-£3m extra. I have seen on many forums that we have an option to buy Pienaar for £2.5m ish (can anyone confirm?) so I think a top 4 finish could buy us Pienaar.
Also given our history in the cups I don’t believe that the board would have budgeted heavilly for extra gates, as a very prudent estimate lets assume we will have played an extra 6 home games this year, allowing for cut price tickets at £20 with attendances of 35,000 thats another £700k per game, potentially £4.2m (obviously they are further costs associated with these games so not straight profit). Added to that the sale of McFadden at around £5m, I would think that will give us enough to have a try for Asharvin.
With regard to Manny the only question is do we still have the money we were going to spend on him in the summer? if so then you would assume that he could be bought in the summer as well, that of course ignores the standard £10-£15m transfer kitty that the club have probably budgeted for in the summer.
So I think the biggest question now is do the board really believe we can push on for 4th spot, if so then now is the time to invest, if we succeed then the players will pay for themselves, if we don’t! MORE DEBT.
Is tying us into a 3-year deal worth £8M with Chang a good deal for Everton? I base this on future expectations, not current ones. We are a good team with a lot of potential this year. Say we finish fourth and win the Uefa or League Cup this season; that makes us a REALLY good team and one that will get a lot of TV coverage. That could mean we could be potentially be throwing away millions in sponsor money due to us signing the deal now.
Obviously our season could fall apart, we could lose our next cup games (both Uefa and League cup) and finish bottom half so the £8M deal could look good.
I personally feel like we may have sold ourselves short and we could finish 4th and win a cup with a bit of luck.
Sorry Mark, that wasn’t a weird thought - that was an insane thought!!!!!!
Hibbert in Midfield????????
Hibbert in Midfield????????
I was just thinking wasnt we gona by manny in the summer??? so where has that money gone?? plus the sale of mcfadden 5.75 mill plus all the extra t.v coverage of the uefa cup and carling cup i would say we should have enough to sign arsharvin,
In the summer buy manny and pienar, surely thats all we need??? 4 strikers for 1 position, plenty of cover for midfield if we buy the above, and we need 1 more center back. now thats not big buisness in the summer for a club of our size
In the summer buy manny and pienar, surely thats all we need??? 4 strikers for 1 position, plenty of cover for midfield if we buy the above, and we need 1 more center back. now thats not big buisness in the summer for a club of our size
Mark Wilson- the funniest post for a while.... can just imagine tony hibbert in midfield against chelsea in our biggest game for years.... thats one weird though!t
Hibbert did used to play in midfield, he was converted into a fullback
When DM completed Manny’s loan deal he said that he may not be able to buy him in the summer. Read into this what you will but I say either Davey is bluffing or we do not have the money
oh a happy belated new year to mr riquelme .............could be this transfer window .well the barcodes got kev the gerbil
Steve, Don’t believe a word that DM says. He tried to bluff us that Manny wasn’t even coming on loan in the first place, didn’t he?
Hibbert in Midfield???!!! The boy couldn’t pass water, imagine what he’d be like in the engine room? LOL! I’d like to see it happen just for the comedy value!
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1 Posted 16/01/2008 at 22:22:05
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I believe Osman would be a more suitable substitute than Fernandes as he can cover 3 of the positions in Midfield as opposed to just one. The only man without a genuine rival for his position in the team is Carsley, the only 2 options are Neville and Jagielka and they are a right back and centre back. I think at the price Fernandes is a bit of a expensive not to be first choice. Spend wisely on a top quality defensive midfielder, bring in a few decent squad players and maybe we will reduce the gap between us and the big 3 even more.