Not really. They seem to get a kick out of telling lies about ToffeeWeb. Nothing we say is going to change that. For the record, we only ban people who are abusive. That inlcudes those who are for and against Kirkby.

In case anyone's missed it: http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/philmcnulty/

There are some worthwhile contributions in the comments section as well, including from Mr McNulty himself, responding to what people have said.

Obviously the guy must come under pressure from his paymasters to churn out endless articles about the Ronaldo saga, and exactly how much the Redshite will be ripped off for Barry. However, the knowledge he has about the stadium debate and his keenness to enter into discussion on the subject only confirms what I've suspected for some time - Phil's a blue!

Ric, BK (BK has done it on numerous occasions)and KW have also lied all the way through this Kirkby fiasco. Would you like to give your views on their part in all of this? You know, stadium for £10m, world class, top notch transport links, Goodison can’t be re-developed, all of a sudden they now tell us it is their plan B. Looking for investment 24/7, and all that shite. Thing is, you probalby think the sun shines out of their arses.

Ric, how can it be KEIOC’s mouth piece when it is a free forum? Yes possibly some of the articles are loaded but that is because it is run by a person not an automatom with no personal feeling on the matter.

There have been and are still many posts against KEOIC, as Michael says people are banned for being offensive nothing else.

I do feel that the forum is deffinitely anti Kirkby but it is the posters not the webmaster that make it so.

I would suggest that the poster, who is too scared to give his name think before he speaks. The name alone would seem to indicate he is a ManUre supporter so why would he be on here and how would he know what we discuss?

Tony, none of those comments I relayed to Toffeeweb have anything to do with me, so unless you are asking a rhetorical question I really don’t understand why you pointedly ask me about KEOIC.



Brian, don’t get hot headed mate. My opinions on this topic aren’t relevant. You seem to have lost it, over my copying and pasting of another person’s comments.

I’ve posted my opinion on the stadium before. In a nutshell: I’d move to Kirkby if we were promised one hell of a classy stadium, with brilliant transport links etc. However we aren’t. We have an inept CEO in charge of our club and he has lead us on this jolly down a dead-end. IMO, if Kirkby fails, KW needs to be sacked and the club has to start afresh, this time working closely with LCC. Happy now Brian? Good.

Ric, it was a rhetorical question.

Rik, I know they were someone else’s comments. I just thought you were being a bit mischiveous by posting it.

The problem with Toffeeweb is that the writers adapt a "we are right" philosophy.

Don?t get me wrong, we?re all good blues, but the general and consistant negativity sometimes discredits genuine and valid arguements made from within.

There is a lack of balance from within the writers.

Just my opinion of course.

John, the authors of this website are fans like the rest of us and don’t need to be balanced. They each have their owns views and the right to air them.

As Michael says (and I can personally vouch for this) no posts are ever removed or edited on the basis of their stance. Only posts which are poorly written (e.g. almost illegible) or abusive are ever removed.

Garry,

I think its a good thing to critque any organisation as it keeps those at be on their toes and accountable, however, I do believe that any supporters group with the power to influence mass opion - as ToffeeWeb like it or not has become (and to its credit) has a responibility to present balanced arguements.

Giving Tony Marsh a vechile to spread his doomsday theories is not in the best interests of Everton and its supporters and is not presenting a balance.

John to be fair the "giving Tony Marsh a vehicle" is a tad melodramatic. If that were the case then the dubious Gerard Madden who has claimed to be at matches when his posting times lend themselves to make this impossible and his purely pro-Kirkby threads raise the question if Tony’s view could influence the masses then what exactly does Gerard’s do? It’s the web and in essence it gives countless people the opportunity to post countless conspiracy theories, viewpoints, "expert views" and general chance to let loose without the age old going toe to toe in the pub scenario when two stubborn viewpoints meet. This site far more than any other site relating to Everton Football club gives an opportunity to hear real fans voice real opinions as varied and differing as they could possibly be and it should be acknowledged as the best. Personally I can be humoured, infuriated and reminded of the great passion and history of the club I love within minutes on the same site, long may it stay that way.

To John Charles,
Lyndon, Michael and Colm give their own time and effort into creating a place where fans can give communicate and offer opinions and boy do they draw a range of opinions!! To say they have a ?responsibility to present balanced arguements? is rubbish! It?s their time and effort and they have no responsibilties to you or anyone else. They are not employed by EFC and do not have to ?work in the best interests of Everton? ? who defines these best interests; you, Blue Bill or Tony Marsh?? I know they have the best interests of EFC at heart ? but the best interest are not always those of the owners and their mouthpieces.
Anyway, this is not Pravda, it's a privately run site run by fans if its not toeing the party line enough for you then log on to the official site and read the shit presented there.

John Charles
have you ever thought about how much time,effort and organisation goes into a site like this.

They dont need to to kept on their toes nor accountable.They have their own standards and most posters on here appreciate it and applaud it.

Fortunately we are in a freedom of speech arena where apart from the odd over emotional outbursts of venom there is healthy and productive debate.

If you feel it is one sided then it’s on you or your ilk to provide that balance by posting something objective and relevant.You might just be surprised how much more respect you get than coming on criticising the site and its editors.

Oh not the "blame Toffeeweb" shite again. It really is getting tedious. Yes, of course, it?s Michael and Lyndon?s fault that the club has been treading on eggshells - however deftly - for years and probably will continue to do so. It?s Michael and Lyndon?s fault that the ground move debate is no clearer now than when PJ first aired it in late 1996. It?s Michael and Lyndon?s fault that Everton are stuck behind the "Sky Four". It?s Michael and Lyndon?s fault that it?s gonna rain again tomorra. Zzzz.

Get a grip. It?s a website. About Everton. With a comments facility.

The whole "blame Toffeeweb" crap (sorry, should that be Toffeepleb? "oh, nurse, me sides") crap is THE dullest drone bar none - on a bleedin loop it seems - circling Evertonian circles right now.

Lame.

Why do I write?
I believe the articles in Toffeeweb are purely reflective of the views of a majority of the fanbase. They are not filtered because of ones view, otherwise the Madden, Wilo, Pierce perspectives wouldn’t appear. Love then or hate them they have opened up discussion as much as any other writer on this website with some considered opinions.

The point is its a public forum and if there were that many pro Kirkby, pro board supporters out there then I am sure the site would reflect the opposite view as a majority. Which it doesn’t.

What it tries to do is be realistic in attempting to understand exactly whats going on with our club. This can be very difficult given the nature that the spin we get (when we get it!) often falls well short of credibility.Thats what drives people to write in. It does me.

We are passionate about our club, but we have no right to assume that our view should be the only view and vice versa.

The anger and frustration that comes through in articles and postings are in the main a reflection of the feeling that something is wrong with in our club. Its heading (literally) in a direction few agree with, few want and many think is wrong.

When you post an article on Toffeeweb you get constructive comments back from a majority of fans who have taken the time to give their view. You also get the abuse as well as ctitical comment even IF your view was anti Kirkby or not.

I post here with my views regularly. People know I have issues with the way the club is run and the debacle that is Kirkby. They know I am passionate but obkective (when I can be) but it gives me a chance to have a view, an opinion in the hope that it may raise an issue that has been devisive and left to fester by the club through a lack of response.

Toffeweb and its posters pro or anti, abusive or reasoned have all one thing in common. We want the best for EFC. That we are left to argue against each other has been the most despicable lack of responsibility by the club.

Thats why there is debate, passionate debate. People want answers, people want the truth no matter how good or bad it is we can handle it. But please, I would love to see the truth from the club, not my conjecture or anybody eles;s We can handle the truth, we can’t handle spin, broken promises or lies.

Thats why I write. Why do you?

I just find all this saddening to say the least. Six years ago, the football world regarded us as relegation fodder, a slain giant doomed to oblivion.

We get a young and honourable manager who pulls us out of the mire and the football world now consider us one of three clubs who can realistically break the Sky Four monopoly.

And then what happens? Destination Kirkby comes along and we are in a state of civil war. We don?t know whether the manager will stay as yet and if so, for how long....

We do not know whether the manager has funds to improve the squad to mount the skyfour challenge....

There is only one thing we should be focussed on and that is pushing for the Champions League...

We seem to be mortgaging ourselves up to the hilt for destination Kirkby, alienating every political body that is around....

Bill Kenwright has hit the self destruct button and the consequences are now starting to show...

Mid-table mediocrity here we come...

I think all this criticism of Toffeeweb from some quarters is just a bad case of: ? If you don?t like the message, shoot the messenger?.

I think Michael & Lyndon do a really good job & ToffeeWeb is by far the freeset most open forum for ordinary fans to have a proper debate about issues.

If those who represent certain vested interests don?t like the often very pertinent questions raised / debated then I?m sure they are as welcome as anyone to come on here & explain their side of it.

I personally feel alot of the critic?s don?t like the light the disemination of info? on forums like this, shines into the corners of our boards dark & murky dealings.

I have a moan, some people have a go at me but its all pretty friendly even when it gets heated. It all seems like good honest, transparent debate to me.

Well done ToffeeWeb!

Weak. Very very weak.

I would have certainly offered a response.

The problem with Toffeeweb is that the main mouth piece Michael Kenrick is a hypocritical wanker. He can happily abuse and write what he wants but then if you write something he doesn’t like he will either A)show in up in front of over posters (well try at least) or B) not post your comments at all. He will then say that he is using his editorial privelage to block your comments. Too many Numpties have too much to say on this website
For a site that prides itself on being a free and open forum its a farce a bit like the way Everton is run at the moment.

Michael, MK may well have an ability to ridicule some posts with an exacting wit, but as this site is an open forum it does not therefor make the initial post redundant. You can either agree or disagree or not pay any attention to his retorts.
We know ToffeeWeb is against Kirkby and the board but their input is just input.
Opinion from an authority makes it no more relevent or worthwhile... oh and they do publish both for and against articles.
Therefore, ToffeeWeb is not biased. If posts against Kirkby are more abundant that means more ?against? articles are being submitted and that maybe the majority don?t want to go.

I know that they post for and against things about Kirkby and rightly so! The problem I have is and I quote him from his response to this article "For the record, we only ban people who are abusive. That inlcudes those who are for and against Kirkby"

A week or so ago he abused a poster with his Editorial Right and I just find that hypocritical. So in theory he himself should not be able to post!

Thanks for the mostly sensible responses, guys and gals; the majority of you clearly understand and appreciate what we are providing here... and then there?s Michael Tracey.

What I dislike, Michael Tracey, is people being abusive, which is exactly what you are doing. Calling me a "hypocritical wanker" and claiming there are "Too many Numpties [who] have too much to say on this website" shows us exactly the kind of person you are. That is someone who has no respect for a free forum and therefore has no right posting on one.

Michael Tracy,
Surley that poor poster could have stuck up for themselves? If somebody?s comments are abusive and off point then of course they will be removed as they do not add anything to the topic being debated. Pressumabbly your comments will not be removed because, although technically abusive to not only the editorial team but also the "Numpties" that you don?t agree with who voice their oppinions on this site.

As this site requires peoples? comments and oppinion to keep it fresh and ensure people visit, wouldn?t it be a bit stupid if everyone agreed with the articles, letters and responses or for MK and team to forcily make it so? Would reading an aritcle and then seeing a long list of yeses be more to your liking? Funnily enough I think someone?s already pinched that idea though... here you go.

That link’s meant to go to www.evertonfc.com... but obviously they stopped people from including HTML so people don’t link off to darker internet bits.

Chad: but obviously they stopped people from including HTML so people don?t link off to darker internet bits.

No, you just have to form it correctly :) ? [a href"=www.evertonfc.com"] should have been [a href="http://www.evertonfc.com"] ... but with angle brackets of course.

Ah, sorry Lyndon must try harder!
Got out of the habit of re-reading and spell checking before posting too.

Michael Tracey,

Not sure what he gets up to in his more private moments, but he?s not hypocritical.

I admit I?ve pushed my luck a couple of times. I?ve had posts removed and even had a private warning when I?ve tried to sneak in the "odd" insult aimed at the Yes voters.

I?m absolutely certain that TW applies these same rules to everyone.

Post removed for abuse of the forum, and failure to provide a valid e.mail address.

The funny thing about the critics of ToffeeWeb, is that no matter how much they complain they always know whats going on. Now maybe it's me but there is only one Everton site I find that is crap and biased, and for that reason I don't use it and have no interest in what is happening on it. It's human nature if you don't like it, you don't use it.

A short time ago Iposted a genuine request for someone to defend Keith Wyness as I know little about him. Lyndon responded by inviting supporters of the board to reply. A response wasn?t exactly forthcoming. It?s not the fault of the editors that the club seem to be frightened of the site.

I don’t think you can read that much into it, to be honest, Andy. In my experience, requiring someone to respond never seems to ellict any meaningful response. The Club are actually much more concerned about what’s said on The People’s Forum, where they tend to be even more outspoken than our readers.

We are under no illusions about the limited impact we may have as a site ? that’s one reason why we don’t get heavily involved in active campaigning, although we provide exposure to Everton-related initiatives. The objective has always been to present a continually updated source of current information, and to encourage intelligent discussion about the issues of the day among concerned Evertonians.

Some people need to think we have an agenda; we don’t, but of course we do have opinions and we ? just like all the other fans who contibute to the site ? aren’t afraid to voice them. It’s just a pity that when someone objects to a particular discussion, they attack the posters and want us to throttle the discussion. We will very rarely acommodate such requests, and usually send them away with a flea in the ear because that attitude is totally anathema to the ideals of a free and open discussion. Sadly, human nature dictates that we can’t have such discussions without limiting the freedom of those who would see them curtailed, either through attacks and abuse against us, or against other contributors.

All I?m saying is that if you are going to get all high and mighty about abusive posts then practice what you preach! I think thats the point you are missing. I have no problem with a free post and if I think that someone is a Numpty I will say so! Sorry I called you a wanker probably a bit out of order but you are still very hypocritical and if you don?t want me posting then there isn?t much i can do about it! I do appreciate the time and effort that you put in to the website and it is a fantastic forum and a thankless job. Thank you and keep it up! But don?t get all 1984 on us. Either abuse is acceptable or not and if its not then all should be banned not just selctive ones which you don?t like. Without visitors and posters on this site your website would be well not valid.

Michael,

The point you are missing is that abusing us or other posters (for example by calling them childish names) degrades the value of the discussion and singles you out as... well, as a Numptie yourself. I have no problem with you posting about the issues, as long as you are not abusive.

As to what is or is not abusive, the way this site is set up, I usually make that call. You can contribute if you want by reporting abuse, but the final decision is made by me. It is of course selective, 1984 if you like, but I would be the last to claim it will be imposed consistently across the board. You implictly accept that as one of the Conditions of Use you agree to by posting on this site. Not exactly hypocritical.

So play it safe, don’t contribute by calling people names, and stick to the issues, not attacking other posters. We have plenty of posters who can and do handle this without a problem, but there are always some who are out for causing trouble. Without moderation, the lunatics usually end up taking over the asylum!

As an "exiled " Evertonian I don?t know all the specific facts re Mr McNulty. From what I have read about him I believe that he used to be with the Echo but is now with one of the Nationals and I gather that he has a history of being pro Red in his bias.

His comments strike me as being an attempt to stir things up. I have found ToffeeWeb has been very fair regarding our proposed ground move. I may not agree with the "ToffeeWeb Team" on every issue but praise where it?s due-I do not believe that ToffeeWeb has acted as a mouthpiece for one view or the other; rather Toffee Web has given everyone an opportunity to express their opionion and could teach Mr McNulty a lesson in what impartiality really means.

Michael Brien: trust me, Phil McNulty is an Evertonian.

Fair enough! Point taken. Thank you for your feedback.

Greg ? as I don?t live in the Merseyside area any more, I will take your word for it. I do think that his citicism of TW as being "pro - stay at Goodison" is wrong though!! The guys at TW have been pretty fair on the subject and given good "space" to most of the different views.

To digress slightly a good Evertonian in the national press is Brian Viner ? not sure if he still writes for the "Independent".

I can see the point Micheal Tracey is making and i think it has merit.
Hurling abuse at someone should not be allowed wether it be by a poster or editor.
The rules are there for everyone.

To be honest, I don’t ever listen to a word Mr McNulty writes about Everton. I still haven’t, and never will, forgive him for being the ring leader in hounding out Joe Royle in 1997.

Greg, I don?t doubt McNulty is ?an Evertonian?.

The problem is, due to circumstances (beyond our control?), the meaning of ?an Evertonian? now means something different to everyone.

There was a time, not so long ago (?pre-Rooney, and pre the totally on-the-level, not in the least bit corrupt Kirkby vote) when I?d hear of someone who was a ?good Evertonian? and immediately and without thinking, make a mental decision "a good lad...one of us" etc.

Recent events now make me ask "yeah but...what SORT of Evertonian??.

Sad?

Absolutely!

This is my first and probably last visit/insight to your bewildering and somewhat exclusive world that is the ?ToffeeWeb? site!!

From an outsider?s Everton football fan point of view..

I was wondering if any of you guys really enjoy the game of football..!? I mean actively kicking a football? May I suggest you all take a break from ?Everton?, get off the keyboard and smash one down the laces and I?m sure you?ll all feel a whole lot better about football and of course your beloved Everton..

I blame Toffeeweb for many things !! Like diverting too much of my time from work, keeping me up with the opinions of people met in a drunken haze years ago and for constantly reminding me of the joys and frustrations of loving our club. Emotions can make rational observations very difficult at times and an abusive comment (that the poster would think twice about in the real world) is so easy to send without thinking of the consequences.
I remember the days before Toffeeweb.org and since that time Toffeeweb has been the most consistantly informative site. While Michael Tracey may argue for his freedom of speech, would he take over from the Toffeeweb editors if they just thought "why am I bothering to do this for free and getting called a wanker ?".

Respect

Whether you are for or against DK, whether you support or disapprove of BK/KW/IR/DM or whether you have an opinion on anything to do with EFC your gonna get it on Toffeeweb.

I think that when you post on ToffeeWeb there should be a warning. Not to stop the things people can put in their responses but too warn you that people aren?t going to agree with you and will tell you in no uncertain terms you are wrong. (Whether you are or not is irrelevant)

People will post just to wind you up (Gerard Madden anyone) People will post to have a go at you. People will post to agree with you and people will dismiss your opinion out of hand. People will get personal.

All these people have one thing in common. They all support Everton Football Club. We, the contributors to such sites as this have a responsibility to air our views on any subject to do with Everton FC and as such deserve the right to publish those views on ToffeeWeb.

All I am suggesting here is that if you post on this site and air your views then any response either agreeing or disagreeing with you should be inline with the original post. I mean that if you disagree tell the person why you disagree don?t just call them a tosser or tell them they haven?t got a clue. Lets have some proper debates here. If it tell you IMO that 4-5-1 is the only way to play with Cahill in the side as I believe he lacks the vision and passing ability to play in a 4-4-2 as a major central midfielder then I don?t expect to get a response saying ?you know fuck all you do? and that?s it. If you believe I am wrong tell me why you think I am wrong and I?ll respond telling you why I think I am right and why I believe you are wrong. It?s respecting the view of your fellow Evertonians. Something which I feel has been sadly missing during the last few months on the posts here at ToffeeWeb.

So over to you guys on how we as a collection of Evertonians decide on how we want to interact. I?m sure the time is right to start showing each other some respect?..

Tim Howard has admitted during a recent EvertonTV interview that many of the players, he included, browse daily through football website sites to read about gossip and potential transfers. If this were true there is no doubt that they would have come across or heard about ToffeeWeb.

With the chance to interact with real fans and maybe report the TRUTH on the site, I have no doubt that these players would regularly post messages on this site using fake names.

So, forgetting the serious (and bloody depressing) issues, does anyone suspect anyone to be a possible Everton figure? I suspect Michael may already know the answer?! ;-)