Hopefully re-reading that, Steve, you may be struck by the strange juxtaposition of these statements: "This club has done so well" and "You have nearly destroyed this club". By any measure, this club is no closer to destruction than any other Premier League club.

And advocating the departure of BK now ? before the decision on Kirkby ? is simply futile. With the possible bonanza coming in the shape of these foreign moguls hungry to invest, there is no way he is going to sell his shares for £20M.

And don't deceive yourself ? he's only losing some of the fans, there are plenty who still fully support him ? just read the responses on here.

Could you do any better Steve?

I think accusing someone who clearly HAS (regardless of your view) made a success of himself in the business world (theatre impresario I think is the term, and he?s Chairman of a Premier League club...) as "not having any business acumen" is a little fanciful, if not insulting.

What do you do, by the way? What captain of industry are you?

Jeremy, that’s not a great argument you’re using to be honest. Have you ever slated a player in your life? By your rationale you are not allowed to do so as they would be better at football than you are. This doesn’t forbid somebody else from criticisibng.

I’ve no wish to get into any debate over BK, I know a lot of opinions are entrenched on the matter, but just because the people interested looked at Everton, does that mean he should sell? If he sells up, then it has to be to the right people. Who that may be is a different matter altogether...

Lies after lies after lies from the people who run the club.. Being an Everton fan at this moment feels like having someone drilling between your eyes! One big headache, it all seems a bad nightmare!

And who actually thinks Moyes is going to get his 5 or 6 / 3 or 4 expensve players he wants?

Anyone, supporter of the club or not, would be running it better at the moment.

Steve
I totally agree and for those who praise him here is a brief synopsis of Everton?s financial performance under him and a list of LIES that the man has come out with.

1.

YEAR INCOME PROFIT/LOSS
2006-07 £51.412M £-9.426M
2005-06 £58.123M £-10.794M
2004-05 £59.953M £23.509M
2003-04 £44.302M £-15.376M
2002-03 £46.781M £-12.980M

"The £30 million is ringfenced" (Kings Dock)

"The cheque will be in the bank in the morning" (Fortress)

"I would not sell Rooney for £50 million" (I suppose that?s not strictly a lie.)

"We will definitely make 2 signings before the season starts" (We didn't)

I am seeking investment 24/7(Read the KMBC application)

"I dont know what?s going on at the club I? only a fan"

The stadium will be world class

It will be virtually free

It will have the best served transport links in the country

On top of all that our debts have risen from less than £10 to over £66 million during his stewardship and HE HAS NOT PUT ONE BEAN OF HIS OWN MONEY INTO THE CLUB!

Billy,

There is quite clearly a difference. Firstly, we?ve all played football. Secondly, we all watch football for several hours of every week of every month of every year, for decades. We might criticise a player for not being very good, but we don't suggest he has no football skills at all (well, ok, I can think of 1 or 2 down the years...)

I?m simply interested to know if Steve has ever played at boardroom level, managed an annual budget of £50 million+, be rich, and has had his eyeballs on what happens in a boardroom for several hours per week. That's not a requirement for being able to criticise - of course everyone has their opinion. I?m a critic of Kenwright myself.

But accuse him of having no business acumen? As he probably sit?s back in his penthouse with a nice Chateauneuf du Pape; I think thats very silly. It's a great argument.

By that standard, Mr Harris, the Roman one is an immense failure at Chelsea, isn?t he?
Their list of LOSSES reads:-
2006/7 -£74.8M
2005/6 -£80.2M
2004/5 -£140.4M
2003/4 -£87.8M

But then Abramovich is a shockingly bad businessman, isn?t he? That?s how he must have aquired his £15Billion fortune!

As far as the ALLEGED lies are concerned ALL businessmen need to dissemble from time to time in order to protect commercial confidences and in that direction, I don?t expect Mr Kenwright is any worse than the next man. And where in that Director?s Contract that the Editor of this esteemed site is so fond of ?flashing?is it written that the Chairman is duty bound to share the secrets of all the club?s dealings with the hoi polloi?

I am sure Blue Bill would tell you that heading up Everton FC is an imeasurably demanding and stressful almost full-time job for which he seeks-and takes NO REWARD.

Tell me how many other ?club-loving ?chairman work on that basis let alone can boast of the success he has brought to Everton over the period of his tenue?

......And in case you were wondering, It was me who penned the above to save Doddy a job!
How did I do,folks?
If it?s OK we can make him redundant!

He is a liar and there is no doubt about that. The thing about great liars though is that they even convince themselves that what they say is true. My opinion is that with Moyes "best young manager" ALMOST signed, "Deal fo the century" stadium ALMOST agreed upon, "New Rooney" aka Jose Baxter ALMOST ready for first team action at 16, Jose Moutinho ALMOST signed etc etc Bill is trying to make as seem like a great buy for a prospective Abramovich. The new signings are probably contingent upon the assumed investment of a new backer who will be lured by all the things we have ALMOST accomplished. Only problem is that when the look at the books in detail and have to contend with Bill’s ego then no deal will go through so we will enter the new season probably still with Moyes but with no new signings. I fully expect su to enter the season with what we have at this point because other than Moutinho (we offered less that his well known buyout !) and Ramsey (we made a bid AFTER bigger and better clubs had) we don’t appear to have made bids for anyone which is strange given that it’s an Hourly process. The truth is Bill and Wyness thought this Crockby crap would get us a new investor and it didn’t happen so now we’re screwed.

Jay

I appreciate the effort that you have gone into in preparing and researching your financial statistics, but surely you must see that they are useless without context?

For a start, the profit/loss figures are after transfers (which are apportioned over several seasons). Judging financial performance should be done before transfers to make any sense. And how do they compare with other clubs? I?ve seen you compare to one Spurs season (which was an exceptional year for them), but how do we compare to our other rivals, Villa, Newcastle, Portsmouth?

The use of the word "lies" is harsh. Reading through the quotes, those regarding the future are all clearly what Kenwright HOPED would happen. He hoped to make 2 signings. He hoped he wouldn?t have to sell Rooney. He hoped the Fortress people would follow through. Kenwright talks with confidence, and states such things as facts. It?s not ideal, but you?d think most intelligent people would pick up on that and understand his point accordingly.

The thing is, the implication is that a better businessman wouldn?t tell such lies. The truth is, most businessmen wouldn?t say ANYTHING to the fans.

What about your "lies" Jay? You say our debts were £66m last year. They weren?t. Our gross liabilities were £66m, which is a different thing. For example, £10m of the £66m is an accounting "bookmark" to say we have received season ticket payments for a season we haven?t played yet, and if the entire season was cancelled we?d have to pay back. That?s not a debt.

So did you lie to us there, Jay? Of course you didn?t. You made a statement in good faith, even if the precise meaning wasn?t quite there.

The danger in your "everything is going wrong" spiel is that the impression is that ANYBODY except Kenwright would be better, which is just horribly, horribly untrue. Unless we can find a patron like Abramowich, ANY investor will take money OUT of the club in the long term. That?s why they are investors.

For example, to complain that Kenwright has increased debt is wrong while calling for new management of the club is pretty inconsistent. The absolute first thing that any investor would do is raise as much debt as possible, and indeed any businessman would be pretty suspicious of a company looking for investment that hadn?t first looked to the banks.

How strange that Wyness leaving has provoked all this hatred of Bill Kenwright!! If the Chairman sacked him, Hooray! He was the most disliked Everton official in my 40 years of support ? so good bloody riddance! If he just walked ? same message.

Yes, I do think there is a cash-flow problem at Goodison ? but what?s new? I shall continue to take Moyes as the barometer. If he says everything?s OK, I?ll believe it. If he walks, THEN we will know it?s curtains.

Simon,
You omitted to explain ’the King’s Dock money is ring-fenced’
Or did he mean to say ’I hope that the King’s Dock money will happen to appear and also hope there happens to be an assurance of a fence around it’?
Bollocks!

Jeremy,
Maybe I should have said "more business acumen", and yes Billy is a great lovey and is probably a very nice man, but is he really that successful in a enviroment where Simon Cowell can earn £40/50m in a couple of years? Sure he is a theatre impresario and indeed stages some high profile shows ? but he hardly sets the entertainment world alight.

I take my hat off to him in some respects as he has gotten hold of Everton for relative peanuts; however, how come he hasn?t developed the brand and moved the club forward?Unfortunately he has no money to invest in the club. Not his fault but he should recognise this and move on.


Michael, the success is in my opinion despite him and yes he has gone a long way in destroying the soul of this club, I doubt if there is another club anywhere (Stranraer apart) where the fanbase is so divided. His performance as chairman is abysmal.

And finally my personal experience is neither here nor there but suffice to say although I am not Roman I can still understand Latin.
NSNO.

Phil

I can’t quite remember the details around the King’s Dock. Didn’t it fall down because of cost increases? i.e. we could raise £30m (from debt probably) but once it started to go up (as far as £60m?) we couldn’t afford it, and Paul Gregg refused to act as guarantor for the unspecified amount.

And doesn’t ringfenced just mean the cash isn’t going to be used elsewhere? If it were to be raised through debt, secured partially against stadium itself, how is that an outright lie?

My memory isn’t clear on the details. Perhaps you can clear that up for me?

Neil M, two irrefutable facts - Bill employed KW and Bill agreed that KW be allowed to run his own business on the company?s time.

Simon, the lies that Jay and many others state from BK are statements from him. By definition, he has told lies, a mercurial businessman would indeed choose to remain silent or release cleverly worded statements via the press officer after they are checked very carefully by a legal department. In all cases it would appear that the mercurial Bill chooses to do neither and "hams it up". Given his acting and theatrical background, this should have been expected in the early days and after a number of faux pas (and that would be an extremely kind way to describe them) he should know better.

There is a world of difference between carefully chosen semantics and the sort of lies BK has told. As an example, how would "we are continuing to work closely with the Fortress Fund team" as opposed to the farce of two tranches which in an initial interview was £29m then the next day £15m with an option on a second £15m and the club didn?t even see two bob never mind half of it.

No problem, Simon
He lied

I once spent some hours in the company of Pete Winkleman ,the man who bought and transfered Wimbledon FC to Milton Keynes. When he learned that I was an Evertonian, he lost no time in telling me that, of all the people he had met in football, Bill Kenwright was his hero and model chairman.

Winkleman, you may know, was in a previous life a record producer, so in every sense a fellow luvvie of BB. So I guess his admiration was understandable. But PW went on to say that the best advice Kenwright had ever given him was to "do what?s right for the business and not what seems right for the fans ? they will always come round".
Explains one or two things, doesn?t it?

Thanks Phil, that’s a really helpful response.

Simon, at the time, Paul Gregg offered to finance the King?s Dock through a deal which would have wrestled the club?s ownership from BK to himself and a group he worked with to find the finance. BK then launched into what can only be described as a despicable coup de grace of using the Trinity Group of papers to whitewash Paul Gregg as a non-football loving member of the board that never bothered going to the game. The Fortress Sports Fund appeared as if by magic which BK told fans would regenerate the club and more importantly to the fans give DM funds to bring fresh faces in. Paul Gregg became disinterested and BK had disarmed and destroyed his previous friend and business partner to the point that he left the club.

The Fortress Sports Fund vanished into thin air as did the promised funds available for the King?s Dock. Liverpool City Council, having extended the date the club had to prove they had funds to continue more times than they had to, LCC eventually called BK?s bluff and the rest is history.

Sorry Simon, I thought you were being coy; my apologies
Thanks, Gavin for the summary
I will never forgive Bill Kenwright for losing us a world-class, effectively free stadium on the 2nd most famous waterfront in the world

A year ago, I challenged Wyness about King?s Dock. He said, "That was well before my time but the Chairman has always said the Council attached a lot of strings to it and in the end it just didn?t add up.??

Believe who you will!

Is Bill a Everton fan? Yes
Is Bill incompetent? Yes
Is Bill a liar? Yes of course he is
is Bill the man to take us forward? NO
Is Bill treating Moyes with the respect he deserves? NO

If you were Moyes, would you sign a contract given what is happening? No neither would I
Do you believe we will be better off in Kirkby? I don?t
Should Bill step down for the good of the club? Yes, no matter how much Bill claims to love the club he is destroying it.
Where have all our assets gone?
What has he done with the cash he received for them?
And as Phil states he cost us the best alternative to Goodison Park.
And like Phil and I imagine, a lot more fans cannot and will not forget or forgive the man.

Maybe the chinese proerb is a simple way to describe why people no longer have faith in anything BK does or says... and it?s more than twice!

"Fool me once
Shame on you
Fool me twice
Shame on me."

Before my retirement, I spent a lot of time working with and around the sports press of the North West. The only man I can ever compare with Bill Kenwright is the late Peter Swales.

Peter loved Manchester City with all his heart and thought that his adulation of Bert Trautman and Roy Paul was all he needed to get the fans on his side. In every way he was clueless when it came to understanding the world of football. He was never fortunate enough to appoint a David Moyes and went from one ?car wreck? to another. In the end they got relegated and he sold out for a pittance.

I?m sure he died of a broken heart and went to his grave wondering why the fans didn?t love him...

We can discuss and debate the ins and outs and wheres or whats and rights or wrongs but one sentence from the manager today brings the whole thing in to true EFC perspective: "we haven't got bundles of cash..."

Hold on tight!

Re David Hall above.Peter Swales was a distant relative of mine and often invited me to Maine Road in the days when John Hart and Tony Book were his ’joint managers’.In his 20 years at the helm,he appointed about a dozen managers-one of them Peter Reid whom he sacked for ’having no charisma with the supporters’.Swales’weakness was that he was far too sensitive to the whims of his club’s fans and hated to think they might not love and respect him.
I wonder if such thoughts ever enter Chairman Bill’s mind?

Wharever may be said on this site,I think Bill Kenwright is generally held in high regard by most Evertonians.
Remember,only a few ultra criyics dwell and disect his every utterance and he has presided over a period of relative success .
Whilst that can all be attributed to Moyes,the ’ordinary supporter’doesn’t go behind the headlines and I suspect -for all his failings-he would win any vote of confidence whether or not DK gets a positive response.
In general,the fans only ever rebel over team failure and things aren’t going to bad under Moyes’ tenure so far!

BK more or less destroyed this club? Our best season for about 20 years, and we’re destroyed.

The possibility of EFC relocating to Kirkby seems to affect what has happened in the past, not just what might happen in the future.

Bill ...

You have my full support...

People aint happy unless they are slagging somebody, and unfortunately, as Moyes is doing so well, you are the only fall guy left...

In Bill we Believe.....

Sorry Connie
I’ll empty it and return it ASAP

I cannot see Bill leaving, he has stated on many occassions that he has been approached regarding selling the club but the main stumbling block is that we are in the same city as Liverpool. I believe as soon as Kirkby is sorted and okayed Bill will sell to an investor and let's face it there is one or two out there. Look at Newcastle those guys are richer than Abramovic and looked at Everton, decided against and went for Newcastle. We have to get away from under the shadow of LFC, we cannot continue in the same vein as we have, as the chasing block of clubs from last season have already past us by. With your hand on your heart can anyone see us finishing in the top ten with the squad we have.

I hate hearing that the young lads are good enough, no they are not. Rodwell should be the odd appearance, Gosling appearances in Carling Cup and the others including Baxter aren't good enough. We need investment, therefore the move to Kirkby is a must. Then Bill will go, then we will have the money to keep Davey and then we will have a squad challenging for honours. I am sick of scouring the internet just to find the word Everton, let's get it sorted before the season starts.

But, but...
Peter
The Yes voters who think their fellow-supporters' only objection to the move is the geography continue to shout ?KIRKBY IS IN LIVERPOOL?(sic)
Now you?re saying the opposite. Just gets worse

[b]A year ago, I challenged Wyness about King?s Dock. He said, "That was well before my time but the Chairman has always said the Council attached a lot of strings to it and in the end it just didn?t add up.??

Believe who you will!
[/b]

Interesting to see that he’s prepared to go ahead with Kirkby, and the various caveats that council has put on that scheme...

Believe who you will, indeed.