The Mail Bag
Paranoid
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Somehow I knew it was going to happen and it's been confirmed the case. John Terry has had his red card overturned by the FA.
Now people may say fair enough it wasn't a red. However, the FA can't downgrade red cards to yellow cards so Chelsea would have to prove that it wasn't even a booking (which it blatantly was ? it was cynical). The FA even confirmed this in a statement on Sunday night.
Yet now the FA have gone against their stubborn disciplinary procedures and overturned it. Usually they would increase the ban if the appeal is rejected which should have been the case here.
As Evertonians (as have lots of other clubs) we're had our fingers burnt before over appealing red cards. In fact Moyes has openly admitted that there's no point appealing as we'll only get it increased.
Call me paranoid but the reasons they've got a result are as follows;-
1) They're moneybags Chelsea
2) They're a top 4 side
3) They just happen to be playing Man United on the TV next game
4) He's England captain
I am totally disgusted and appalled by this decision and it once again proves that, aside from the money some clubs have got, the Premier League is by no way a level playing field and the FA have once again shown total favouritism to the top four clubs.
Brian Lawlor, Posted 16/09/2008 at 14:23:32
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So every year Everton FC would have to go through the season with all odds against them, while others (we know who) get the support of the 12th man (referee) and the 13th man (FA).
Damn! We’re screwed!
No they don’t. They just have to prove it isn’t a red card. Which it wasn’t.
You can sometimes point the finger at the FA for big team bias, but there’s no point complaining when nothing has happened.
And how are they showing bias towards top 4 clubs? He is going to play AGAINST UNITED. And Vidic isn’t. I’m sure United are chuffed with that particular display of Big 4 bias.
Perhaps the worst example of this was the disciplining and humiliation of the ref following the Liverpool Chelsea game when he gave the penalty against Liverpool
This sent a message to all Prem refs about the nature of power in the game and its no co-incidence that the Clattenberg fiasco followed hot on its heels.
Will they do the same for everyone else this season? Doubt it!
We have been led to believe that appeals are only worth making in cases of obvious error by the officials, such as mistaken identity. The very fact that posters on this thread have different views on the issue means that this is simply a case of personal judgement. Is this an invitation for all clubs to start launching appeals against what they feel are undeserved cards? I believe the yellow that Arteta received (without warning) on Sunday for standing too near the thrower was ridiculous. No doubt if Everton appealed that we would be slapped with a big fine for wasting the FA’s time.
The worst thing about it is that, as someone previously mentioned, cards cannot be downgraded from red to yellow, so Terry has effectively got away totally scot-free.
Chelsea have to prove to the FA that it wasn?t a red nor a yellow card. That's the only way it can be overturned.
It was at least a yellow therefore it should not have been rescinded. That is the FA procedure that has always been in place.
You?ve chosen one of reasons to pick at, what about the other 3?
Maybe JT got confused with all the calls for treating refs with respect like they do in rugby and thought you were allowed to rugby tackle now to!!!!!!!
Great minds etc...
One thing of interest when listening to the Liverpool game on the radio, Graham Taylor made a point (from memory it was a simular situation with a tackle minus the cynicism of Terry) that if the tackle didn’t warrant a yellow card, it is not a yellow card offence just because he was close to being the last defender.
Either he was, red card, or he wasn’t, no card... but referees are sometimes scared not to make decisions. Just something of interest from that game which even had Alan Green enthusing over.
As for Terry, to me it was two yellows. One for bringing the player down and two for the purpose of halting the game to his benefit, which like I say is no different to putting your hand out to stop the ball and game.
Secondly - you lot all have too much time on your hands to care this much!
Point 2: how’s about making all so-called "professional fouls" an instant red card?
I think it’s appalling that a player (especially John Terry - England captain) should deliberately bring a player down in order to stop a certain goalscoring opportunity.
If they amended the rules accordingly then it wouldn’t matter what team the player played for. (Assuming the ref gets it right!)
As an aside I see The RS got away with it again on Saturday. Stone cold handball appeal not given. I can’t remember if it was in the penalty area or not but it was definitely handball. Lucky bastards.
Anyway, deliberate handball is a red isn’t it? Though of course refs take differing views on this according to where the foul has taken place and how important it was to the field of play.
There needs to be a better system of independant monitoring to stop complete bullshit decisions like the two we?ve seen today. It seems like they have complete power and nobody to answer to over it.
Personally I think Terry shouldn?t have been red carded ? but there are ways to complain and if I recall from the TV coverage we had the usual Chelsea surround the Ref response.
I watch quite a lot of the 6 Nations Rugby - and it is interesting the different attitudes to Referees in that sport - but also the different attitude of the Referees towards the players. Yes the players accept the decisions of the Officials and don?t abuse the Referee BUT - the Referee is always communicating with the players and show them equal respect. I watched a Heineken Cup match on BBC a couple of years ago and was really impressed with the Ref. Firstly when there was a problem with a couple of players he called both Captains together and asked them to sort it out - otherwise he would have to give both players a card/send them to the " sin bin". In the same match at a scrum the Ref made a mistake in calling both teams to reset the play ? he apologised to both sets of players !!! I think the Ref gained more respect from the teams for being honest enough to admit to making a mistake.If only Football Referees could be so open and honest!!
I am impressed by the way the Rugby Referees use the team Captains to instill discipline when necessary and they generally use cards as a last resort. Some of their Football counterparts seem to auditioning for the Royal Shakespeare Company the way they dramatically produce their cards. Perhaps it would do the game some good if Match Officials and Captains got together and studied some films of certain key incidents in Rugby games and saw how these incidents were dealt with.
I know some of you out there might scoff, there are plenty of differences between the sports and obviously Rugby is far more physical. However the basic principles in the "interacting" between players and match officials is surely the same. I would hope that I am not the only football fan who is highly embarrassed at the way Chelsea/Man Utd players crowd around the Referee when a key ruling goes against them.
Paranoid is me knowing for a fact that he won’t, and this will happen to allow him to play against us, getting away with a handball in the box and scoring the winner from an offside position in the 94th minute of a 92 minute game.
Now as for Wiley and his incomptetent assitant Glenn Turner............
All run by money and horrible twats like that arsehole Barwick - what a fat ?orrible dickhead that man is. Jesus, lookin? at him makes me sick.
Crozier fucked it up (and he was slimey as well) and now the rest of em are at it again.
I just can?t wait until the whole thing falls flat on its face - football I mean. Only problem is that these people in the FA (and hundereds of average players) are already millionaires, due to the current climate.
Salary cap, squad cap, statute for certain number of ENGLISH (nevermind Wales and fuckin Scotland) players in the ENGLISH Premier League and do away with the flat purchase of players.
The American system works great for all their sports and I don?t see why I shouldn?t here to be honest.
I personally think it was worth a red, but even if we accept that it should have only been a yellow, why does this give Chelsea the right to appeal? Referees make mistakes in every game, that’s just the way it goes.
An appeal should be reserved for times like Celtic last night when (unbelievably) the ref sent off the wrong player. Common sense should prevail and a successful appeal should see the ban transferred to the correct player. Not situations like this, where a single decision is analysed and debated after the match.
It’s unbelievable that the FA can turn over a red card like this with little to no fuss, but can’t find it within their rules to further punish Danny Guthrie, whos horrendous ’tackle’ at the weekend left Hull’s striker with a broken leg.
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1 Posted 17/09/2008 at 05:29:22
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West Ham ? monied team from London? A small fine thank you very much.
Dodgy red card? Let?s double the ban.
We are still not considered a big club by the powers that be as we would have got that penalty. Imagine Man Utd at 2-2 with that decision. Yeah, I can really see the ref giving a free kick on the edge of the box.