The Mail Bag
Victory in Greece
Comments (39)
A victory against anyone is welcome these days and all credit for this one given all the circumstances. We beat this lot easy with a strong team at Goodison and then again today with a patchwork team. We have to be grateful for the fact that Greek football has been on a downslide since they won the European Nations Cup some years ago. They did however beat Benfica and I hope we can get Benfica again down the line with a stronger squad. Looks like Moyes will be asking for volunteers for Sunday’s game against Spurs.
Tom Bowers, Posted 02/12/2009 at 17:29:00
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Im bringing my boots on Sunday.
Just watching Valencia vs Lille and Ever Benega is playing and Manny Fernandes on the bench for Valencia. Benega is playing well, wish he had come to us instead of messing us around!
Thought Coleman played very well for someone with only a handfull of appearances. A great moral booster before the tough game v Spurs
Great gutsy win for the boys on a terrible pitch but with 3 more injuries were really up against it on Sunday.For what its worth i rate the lads as follows.
Howard- Wasn’t tested too much but dealt with everything 7
Coleman-Vast improvement on Benfica and bar nearly giving away a penalty he played well 8
Hibbert-Got stuck in as our most senior defender for the majority of the match.Booked and could have seen red 8
Distin-Only lasted 15 mins 6
Baines-Still not up to last seasons standards.having no compettion for his place dont help 7
Gosling-lasted 10 mins before getting injured 6
Pienaar-What a relief to have him back.Despite the pitch he still looked a class apart 8
Fellaini-Not his biggest fan but thought he played well.got stuck in and could have scored late on 8
Cahill-Battled well in his best position and linked up well with Jo early on 8
Bily-Took his goal brilliantly but didnt set the world on fire.More to come i hope 7
Jo-Not a bad showing at all from the big man before injury struck 7.5
Subs
Baxter-Got 80 mins and showed some good touches 7
Duffy-Looked nervous early on and settled in well for a 17 year old 7
Yakubu-Still nowhere near fit and showed nothing in his 15 mins 6
Its a step in the right direction and a much needed win and clean sheet but the next 2 games will be a true test.Time to start praying
Howard- Wasn’t tested too much but dealt with everything 7
Coleman-Vast improvement on Benfica and bar nearly giving away a penalty he played well 8
Hibbert-Got stuck in as our most senior defender for the majority of the match.Booked and could have seen red 8
Distin-Only lasted 15 mins 6
Baines-Still not up to last seasons standards.having no compettion for his place dont help 7
Gosling-lasted 10 mins before getting injured 6
Pienaar-What a relief to have him back.Despite the pitch he still looked a class apart 8
Fellaini-Not his biggest fan but thought he played well.got stuck in and could have scored late on 8
Cahill-Battled well in his best position and linked up well with Jo early on 8
Bily-Took his goal brilliantly but didnt set the world on fire.More to come i hope 7
Jo-Not a bad showing at all from the big man before injury struck 7.5
Subs
Baxter-Got 80 mins and showed some good touches 7
Duffy-Looked nervous early on and settled in well for a 17 year old 7
Yakubu-Still nowhere near fit and showed nothing in his 15 mins 6
Its a step in the right direction and a much needed win and clean sheet but the next 2 games will be a true test.Time to start praying
Just got back to hotel in Athens
I was impressed with the work rate of Felliani , Jo and also Baxter when he came on
Pienaar though was outstanding
I was impressed with the work rate of Felliani , Jo and also Baxter when he came on
Pienaar though was outstanding
Were you watching, were you watching, were you watching Tony Maaaarsh? Weeere you watching Tony Marsh?
I’d like to thank Maged TV for giving me the chance to watch the match , I’d like to say Maged is shit for the terrible picture and streaming, and despite the obvious problems with team selection thank you for giving us an away win in europe which takes us through to the knockout stages, it was difficult to watch but i thought Pienaar class, Feli good game , Hibbert not bad and led by example . Anyway it’s a WIN
I’m not getting carried away, but a win is good for morale given our recent run. Plus, we seem to be showing more fighting spirit since the first half debacle against Hull.
Tell you what though, I was screaming at the Yak to chase down. I know it never has been one of hsi strengths, but christ, the guy is looking for fitness, bloody move son!
Tell you what though, I was screaming at the Yak to chase down. I know it never has been one of hsi strengths, but christ, the guy is looking for fitness, bloody move son!
Great job well done by a mixture of the lads tonight - Coleman, Baxter and Duffy had to step up, and did.
I hope in 2 or 3 games time I won’t have to point this out. Pienaar, Fella and Bily together - second time since September 16th. It makes a hell of a difference.
Heitinga and Neill will help out on Sunday and it might just be that our squad is coming together at last.
We won’t be outclassed in Europe after Christmas.
I hope in 2 or 3 games time I won’t have to point this out. Pienaar, Fella and Bily together - second time since September 16th. It makes a hell of a difference.
Heitinga and Neill will help out on Sunday and it might just be that our squad is coming together at last.
We won’t be outclassed in Europe after Christmas.
Brilliant win in awful conditions. Ball stopped on a number of occasions because the pitch was totally waterlogged. Pienaar marries class with total commitment. Which carries huge authority. Should be captain. Bily’s goal was great but he never seems to play for the 90 minutes. I think he could be real class, but I worry about his attitude. Thought all those who came on were heroes. The only person I’d be really concerned about is Yakubu. He looks totally out of shape and SLOW. And not that arsed either. Idle speculation: Would we get any money for him? Would we be crazy to sell him when we only have an injury-prone Saha and Jo?
We were very lucky tonight. Moyes got it all wrong yet again.
I thought the young lads did OK, particularly Coleman after his roasting in Lisbon, but they were put under a lot of unnecessary pressure in the second half by Moyes’s continuing rubbish tactics. Against any Premier League team he would have been falling back on his excuses well before the finish.
By playing Jo the clown up front on his own, totally out of his depth, with a gap of 60 yards between him and the rest of the team (all trying to be defenders), there was no out-ball, he ensured they would have no respite.
11 men back for set pieces so the only way out is up. I sometimes think he enjoys seeing them constantly under pressure, something in his psyche from his playing days. Unfortunately, Spurs will break the Premier League scoring record if he makes them play like that at the weekend.
You’re all being conned by the scoreline. Pienaar and Cahill spent all their time running about in defence when they should have been linking up in attack. Against a very poor side, we should have been attacking but I don’t think our manager has come across that concept yet.
Distin clearly shouldn’t have started. Bilyaletdinov only played for about ten minutes. Yakubu is a complete waste of space at the moment. Fellaini was anonymous and Hibbert his usual clumsy self.
I’d like to see someone teach Baines how to pass to one of his own team. Come to think of it perhaps they could do they same for the rest of them. Whatever they do in training it isn’t tactics, it isn’t ball skills and it isn’t fitness.
I was rather hoping Moyes might have had the decency to go by now or at least offer to reimburse his obscene wages but our idiot chairman still loves him so that’s OK.
You need a break to start the season again, but I’m worried that even after tonight we wont push on. What was clearly grab a goal and then defend for dear life isn’t doing anything to regain the players confidence. Whilst I agree a win is better than a loss I didn’t really see anything out there which would give the players confidence to go out over the next few weeks and play good open concise football. We are playing with fear, and automatically dfrened deep and hope for a break.
The second point which I think Moyes has alluded to tonight post match is that some of the injuries are being caused by physical stress to the players, particularly those who have played all matches and those having to play with injuries. I feel we will soon have a HUGE injury list and I already feel that this season will be one of staying above water only.
The second point which I think Moyes has alluded to tonight post match is that some of the injuries are being caused by physical stress to the players, particularly those who have played all matches and those having to play with injuries. I feel we will soon have a HUGE injury list and I already feel that this season will be one of staying above water only.
Player rating wise I’d go more along the lines of:
Howard: Wasn’t tested too much but dealt with everything (except the shot that beat him and was cleared by Coleman/"Baxter" according to Joe Royle... though he did keep caling Jo Saha!) l considering the makeshift defence 6
Coleman: Vast improvement! Played really well and should some instinct going forward - but did nearly giving away a penalty he played well 8
Hibbert: Got stuck in as our most senior defender for the majority of the match, made good block and looked comfortable mopping up. Unfortunate to get booked 7
Distin: Only lasted 15 mins but looked solid as ever 6
Baines: Pretty poor game. Still not up to last seasons standards, having no real competition for his place doesn’t help. 5
Gosling: Lasted 10 mins before getting injured, but scrapped in box to try to make early chance 6
Pienaar: What a relief to have him back.Despite the pitch he still looked a class apart. Outstanding first half but has propensity to try Hollywood balls at times 8
Fellaini:Thought he played well. Got stuck in and could have scored late on 7
Cahill: Battled well in his best position and linked up well with Jo early but very little second half from the captain 6
Bily: Took his goal brilliantly, but didn’t set the world on fire. More to come i hope 7
Jo: Carried on from Sunday with a better display. Did well to poke ball through to Bily for the goal, but frustrates with lack of sharpness making runs — still does not look like a striker - even at a quater of the rprice City paid. Injury came in to allow what seemed the obvious player to come off 5.5
Subs:
Baxter: Got 80 mins and showed some nice touches 7
Duffy: Looked extremely nervous early on, but settled in well for a 17 year old 6.5
Yakubu: Still nowhere near fit and really disappointing in his 20 mins 5
Howard: Wasn’t tested too much but dealt with everything (except the shot that beat him and was cleared by Coleman/"Baxter" according to Joe Royle... though he did keep caling Jo Saha!) l considering the makeshift defence 6
Coleman: Vast improvement! Played really well and should some instinct going forward - but did nearly giving away a penalty he played well 8
Hibbert: Got stuck in as our most senior defender for the majority of the match, made good block and looked comfortable mopping up. Unfortunate to get booked 7
Distin: Only lasted 15 mins but looked solid as ever 6
Baines: Pretty poor game. Still not up to last seasons standards, having no real competition for his place doesn’t help. 5
Gosling: Lasted 10 mins before getting injured, but scrapped in box to try to make early chance 6
Pienaar: What a relief to have him back.Despite the pitch he still looked a class apart. Outstanding first half but has propensity to try Hollywood balls at times 8
Fellaini:Thought he played well. Got stuck in and could have scored late on 7
Cahill: Battled well in his best position and linked up well with Jo early but very little second half from the captain 6
Bily: Took his goal brilliantly, but didn’t set the world on fire. More to come i hope 7
Jo: Carried on from Sunday with a better display. Did well to poke ball through to Bily for the goal, but frustrates with lack of sharpness making runs — still does not look like a striker - even at a quater of the rprice City paid. Injury came in to allow what seemed the obvious player to come off 5.5
Subs:
Baxter: Got 80 mins and showed some nice touches 7
Duffy: Looked extremely nervous early on, but settled in well for a 17 year old 6.5
Yakubu: Still nowhere near fit and really disappointing in his 20 mins 5
Eric Hardman what planet are you on???
Words fail me. given what was available and the injuries during the game, this was a tremendous performance. and yes Spurs will be a different proposition, but give Moyes and the Guys credit for a classic European away performance. Jo was good tonight, there I’ve said it and I’ll sya it again, Jo was good tonight. Oh and by the way Jo was good on Sunday against the RS not brilliant but he WAS good.
For goodness sake what does it take for some of you guys to give some credit, this squad has unbelivable injuries to contend with, and yes Hull was a disaster but c’mon give some credit where it’s due.
Words fail me. given what was available and the injuries during the game, this was a tremendous performance. and yes Spurs will be a different proposition, but give Moyes and the Guys credit for a classic European away performance. Jo was good tonight, there I’ve said it and I’ll sya it again, Jo was good tonight. Oh and by the way Jo was good on Sunday against the RS not brilliant but he WAS good.
For goodness sake what does it take for some of you guys to give some credit, this squad has unbelivable injuries to contend with, and yes Hull was a disaster but c’mon give some credit where it’s due.
Eric, i wouldn’t be too critical on tonights performance as a lot of players were playing out of position and the conditions were atrociuos. It also didn’t help losing two players to injury in the first 15 minutes.
It was good to see some young guys get a run as well. I think you managed to complain about everything except the scoreline.
Chad, i think youll find Cahill did plenty in the second half, particularly in clearing many balls from our own box. I agree with the majority of people that he had a pretty good game.
It was good to see some young guys get a run as well. I think you managed to complain about everything except the scoreline.
Chad, i think youll find Cahill did plenty in the second half, particularly in clearing many balls from our own box. I agree with the majority of people that he had a pretty good game.
All I can say is thank goodness Pienaar is back. Notice how much better we have played since he is back. We may have lost to Liverpool but we played well and tonight we played amazingly well considering the issues we are having.
Max..agree 100% about Pienaar.
To be fair to both Coleman and Baines AEK looked most dangerous down the flanks..I thought they were excellent. Obviously Yakubu is way off fitness, if we are going to play one up top , if Saha is unfit and without Victor available the manager almost has to play Jo. Tonight and Sunday while not setting the world on fire Jo worked hard and was much improved. Its real hard to be critical of that team performance, particularly because of our recent record. They fought hard for the shirt today.
To be fair to both Coleman and Baines AEK looked most dangerous down the flanks..I thought they were excellent. Obviously Yakubu is way off fitness, if we are going to play one up top , if Saha is unfit and without Victor available the manager almost has to play Jo. Tonight and Sunday while not setting the world on fire Jo worked hard and was much improved. Its real hard to be critical of that team performance, particularly because of our recent record. They fought hard for the shirt today.
Howard
I did not see the game tonight but thought Jo was quite good in the Derby and had a goal ruled out which was 50/50 for offside. It would have been given if we were playing Blackburn but most officials are members of the Stevie G fanclub so will disallow if at all possible.
In fact, I thought Jo was good enough to distance myself from the Rob Hollis who put some very nasty comments about his ability to control a ball on this very site a week or two ago.
I did not see the game tonight but thought Jo was quite good in the Derby and had a goal ruled out which was 50/50 for offside. It would have been given if we were playing Blackburn but most officials are members of the Stevie G fanclub so will disallow if at all possible.
In fact, I thought Jo was good enough to distance myself from the Rob Hollis who put some very nasty comments about his ability to control a ball on this very site a week or two ago.
I cant believe people on toffeeweb. Fellaini plays well most weeks and gets slaughted, but today he was like Rodwell and hardly did anything and people seem to think he did well. I know everyone has different opinions but i must be watching different games to everyone else.
I am curious as to what has become of Wallace. The last few pre-seasons he seemed like the best of the young players to me but he’s about the only one who hasn’t had a look in of late.
From what i have noticed Moyes seems to bring 2 of the best academy players into the squadfor a season to sit on the bench and watch, almost as if they are on an apprenteship.
They are only played in when absolutely neccessary in an injury crisis or if the team is 4-0 up and Moyes wants to rest key players. This season it is Baxter and Wallace, last season it was Rodwell and Gosling and the year before it was Vaughn and Anichebe. Think it was the defender Mark Hughes who came through with Rooney.
They are only played in when absolutely neccessary in an injury crisis or if the team is 4-0 up and Moyes wants to rest key players. This season it is Baxter and Wallace, last season it was Rodwell and Gosling and the year before it was Vaughn and Anichebe. Think it was the defender Mark Hughes who came through with Rooney.
Ian, Moyes does seem more than reluctant to play the youngsters. Last nights performance shows he should be more inclined to try one or two in their natural positions rathet than shuffle the ’versatile’ first teamers to fill the gaps. He then complains injuries are caused by using the same players all the time. "Listen to yourself lad".
Pienaar finally in the middle to bring some craft and link up play ( how long ahs Arteta been out?) Fellaini sitting in, breaking it up. Round pegs in round holes? But what will we see v Spurs?
Pienaar finally in the middle to bring some craft and link up play ( how long ahs Arteta been out?) Fellaini sitting in, breaking it up. Round pegs in round holes? But what will we see v Spurs?
Eric Hardman, possibly the most ridiculous post I have seen. A glue pot of a pitch and several really inexperienced kids. The team worked really hard in Greece, got what they deserved and never looked in real danger.
what the hell are you smoking?
what the hell are you smoking?
John Street, you beat me to it, comical on here sometimes.
We won away in Europe with shall I say a typical Red shite 80s away performance with a side the most depleted ever.
We where in control most of the game and they never looked like scoring ever, what more do people want?
We won away in Europe with shall I say a typical Red shite 80s away performance with a side the most depleted ever.
We where in control most of the game and they never looked like scoring ever, what more do people want?
Been saying it for a while, the football and form will pick up when Pienaar is back and Jo ’the clown’ aint half as shite as people make out, I think he’s talented (if a little too soft). This isnt really contributing, its more of a weak I-told-you-so. Sorry. Great result last night.
I’ll be honest - when I saw Hibbo starting at centre-half, I was convinced that we were about to witness something truly awful.
l don’t mean that in a ’coz he’s shite’ way, but simply that if I was an opposing manager and/or attacker and saw ANY opposition centre-half that height, I’d think "If we play this right - Christmas!".
It just looks....wrong.
Anyway, I was wrong and I take my hat off to Duncan’s mini-me, and to all of them for a genuinely battling performance.
I admit to being a glass half-empty type and could rattle off hundreds of moans I have re Moyes-BK etc, but this is not the time.
I think when they show the type of commitment they did last night, they should be given a slap on the back.
I should also add that I think a lot of teams suffering the same run as we’ve just had, WOULD have lost there last night (even though AEK weren’t great).
The win for me is encouraging as it tells me they’re still a real ’team’ and they’re prepared to battle for each other.
Maybe the most important asset any team can have.
l don’t mean that in a ’coz he’s shite’ way, but simply that if I was an opposing manager and/or attacker and saw ANY opposition centre-half that height, I’d think "If we play this right - Christmas!".
It just looks....wrong.
Anyway, I was wrong and I take my hat off to Duncan’s mini-me, and to all of them for a genuinely battling performance.
I admit to being a glass half-empty type and could rattle off hundreds of moans I have re Moyes-BK etc, but this is not the time.
I think when they show the type of commitment they did last night, they should be given a slap on the back.
I should also add that I think a lot of teams suffering the same run as we’ve just had, WOULD have lost there last night (even though AEK weren’t great).
The win for me is encouraging as it tells me they’re still a real ’team’ and they’re prepared to battle for each other.
Maybe the most important asset any team can have.
I'm usually livid after we have won a game 1-0 by nicking a goal and then playing defensive and soaking up all kinds of pressure and getting extremely lucky (like against Pompey and West Ham) cos the score line fools everyone as it could have gone either way (just like at Fulham).
But last night I thought those tactics were spot on because the team was in a state before the game started never mind when we lost 3 more players during it, and we were never really under pressure anyway — and also, the state of the pitch!
I'm proud of the performance last night but in other circumstances this negative style of Moyes is unnaceptable and needs to be changed fast.
Iit was understandable and acceptable at the start of his reign when he was just trying to achieve stability at the club and get rid of all the dead wood. but now we have class players and stability is not our goal anymore therefore the outdated negative Moyes tactics have to go
But last night I thought those tactics were spot on because the team was in a state before the game started never mind when we lost 3 more players during it, and we were never really under pressure anyway — and also, the state of the pitch!
I'm proud of the performance last night but in other circumstances this negative style of Moyes is unnaceptable and needs to be changed fast.
Iit was understandable and acceptable at the start of his reign when he was just trying to achieve stability at the club and get rid of all the dead wood. but now we have class players and stability is not our goal anymore therefore the outdated negative Moyes tactics have to go
" ’Jo ’the clown’ ain't half as shite as people make out, I think he’s talented (if a little too soft). This isn't really contributing, it's more of a weak 'I told you so'."
---------------
Sorry, he is.
---------------
Sorry, he is.
Tom, Victory at any time is good for morale, and its a bonus, when you can only field a team like we did last night.
I will not criticize any performance last night, the conditions were atrocious, and the result
was earned, by hard work, and a minute help from lady luck. for a change.
I will not criticize any performance last night, the conditions were atrocious, and the result
was earned, by hard work, and a minute help from lady luck. for a change.
Outstanding performance and super atmosphere.
Stayed in the team hotel and the lads were absoluteley delighted with the result.
A superb performance.
Stayed in the team hotel and the lads were absoluteley delighted with the result.
A superb performance.
As rare as it is to find an outside look at Everton I found this Richard Jolly article fairly interesting.
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/columns/story?id=706579&sec=england&root=england&cc=5901
Amongst all of our bitching I think we kind of lose sight that there are plenty of reasons we are under performing. I won't list them but add to it Gosling and Distin today and we have an unbearable amount of injuries at this point. Things surely must get better, if Cahill thinks we're too good for this... so should we, right?
Ciarán re Jo - Oh no he isn’t.
(well it is the panto season after all)
(well it is the panto season after all)
Eric Hardman, your assesment of the game has got to be, without exception, the most ridiculous of all time.
There is nothing wrong with criticism when it is justified but I am affraid you lose all credibility when you criticise after such a performance. We had three teenagers playing one of which was making his debut, had our much criticised right back playing at centre back, and to top it all lost two players to injuries before 15 minutes had been played.
Lets try and put things in perspective and offer reasonable criticism rather than just biased anti-Moyes rubbish.
To win a match away from home in Europe under those circumstances is absolutely superb and personally I thought we played well.
There is nothing wrong with criticism when it is justified but I am affraid you lose all credibility when you criticise after such a performance. We had three teenagers playing one of which was making his debut, had our much criticised right back playing at centre back, and to top it all lost two players to injuries before 15 minutes had been played.
Lets try and put things in perspective and offer reasonable criticism rather than just biased anti-Moyes rubbish.
To win a match away from home in Europe under those circumstances is absolutely superb and personally I thought we played well.
Howard, He’s BEHIND YOU [lying on the floor]
"Ciarán re Jo - Oh no he isn’t.
(well it is the panto season after all)"
Howard, for once I agree with Ciarán....jo is shite!!!!
(well it is the panto season after all)"
Howard, for once I agree with Ciarán....jo is shite!!!!
Eric ......i guess some people are never happy eh???
Moronic view on the game and performance. It wasnt pretty by any means and noone will say it was but to criticize after that is ludicrous
Moronic view on the game and performance. It wasnt pretty by any means and noone will say it was but to criticize after that is ludicrous
It’s great to see so much diverse opinion but, let's face it guys, it was always going to be a nail-biter even before we knew the state of the pitch and the team formation and subsequent injuries. This is the way Everton play these days — not going for the jugular or just not having the squad capable of doing so.
This for the most part has been Moyes’s MO — getting one goal and shutting up shop .Sadly we are not that good at it these days but it is nice to get away with it sometimes, especially under the circumstances last night. Let’s move on to Sunday with some positives.
Ahhh...the old - ’for once.....I agree with [someone I don’t agree with very often]’
An underated line.
An underated line.
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1 Posted 02/12/2009 at 20:31:11
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Tonight, the main thing was the result and we can only hope there are enough bodies to carry it on against Spurs.
Tempo, sprit and keeping it simple are surely the key. Cut out the sloppiness, work hard and earn another win.
And then go to Chelsea and get mullered. Probably....