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So Mr Donovan has secured a work permit, and it seems he will join us on January 2nd. My post was not to discuss whether or not this is a good move, as it seems that has been done to death, but more a case of where would you play him?

For me, it's a toss up between wide right and in the hole. Out of the 11 on Sunday, Cahill and Bily were IMO our worst two players, so this would be a direct replacement for one of the two. And does anybody know if he will be eligible to face Carlisle?
Stewart Littler, Wigan, Lancs     Posted 22/12/2009 at 23:59:57

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Ste Boyle
1   Posted 23/12/2009 at 14:41:26

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I can't see why he wouldn't be available for the FA Cup. A good addition, I think, certainly an improvement to the starting 11 and could replace either of the two mentioned above.

No doubt though, in true Moyes fashion, he’ll play him at left back and leave Baines out.

Seamus Murphy
2   Posted 23/12/2009 at 15:10:22

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My guess is that Moyes will remain true to form and leave him on the bench. It is a major bug bear of mine that Moyes never puts new signings straight into the team. New players always give team a lift — on the first day of the season this year there were about 5 debutant goalscorers, one against ourselves. Moyes on the other hand doesn’t do that, even when the team is crying out for a shake-up.

Loyalty is generally a good thing, helps build team spirit etc but there is also a time for shaking things up a bit. Management is all about pulling the right strings at the right time but unfortunately our manager only seems to know one way to do things (not only with team selection but also with sustitutions and formation, with only a few exceptions).
So, in summary, I fully expect Donovan to be on the bench for the first few games at the very least. I hope I’m wrong as I would love to see some new signings dropped straight into the team in January.

Peter Fearon
3   Posted 23/12/2009 at 15:22:08

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Rule 15j of the FA Cup rules says that all Everton needs to do is register an on-loan player before Noon on the Friday prior to the tie and to get specific permission of LA Galaxy to play in the competition. That shouldn’t be beyond Everton’s front office despite some howlers over the years.

Incidentally, Landon Donovan’s most successful position has been in a forward midfield slot behind the striker or strikers, or in our case, behind where the striker would be if we had any.

Brian Waring
4   Posted 23/12/2009 at 15:36:50

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You are right there Seamus. He will be on the bench, and will probalby get a game the week before he goes back to the MLS.
Kevin Sparke
5   Posted 23/12/2009 at 15:35:13

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Given what I’ve just seen of him on youtube; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ck8JTJfjYbI&feature=related

and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ziEbexuToM&feature=related hopefully alongside or just behind a fully fit Saha.

Tony Williams
6   Posted 23/12/2009 at 15:50:40

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Stewart, I would gladly take a shit performance from Bily for another goal like Sunday's.

Seamus, I seem to recall a certain Bilyaletdinov coming on to make his debut after just arriving from Russia then playing the next game didn’t he? If not he has played every game since excluding bans and injuries.

Also a certain Mr Fellaini came straight into the team did he not and a Mr Disitn, and a Mr Yakubu, a Mr Johnson. Need I go on?
Ste Boyle
7   Posted 23/12/2009 at 16:05:21

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I can't disagree with Seamus. Donovan is here for 2 and a bit months and I have no doubt he’ll warm the bench and play about 150 minutes.

No doubt about it, whatever happens this guy HAS to play when he turns up. No excuse about fitness, get him in and let's get our money's worth. Or on the other hand, he gets crocked against Carlisle, misses the rest of his loan and misses the World Cup as well..... O I'm full of the joys of Christmas, ho ho ho...

Jonny Roberts
8   Posted 23/12/2009 at 16:10:45

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I currently live in the States, and watch him play a lot for the USA & the Galaxy, and in my opinion he is best with people infront of him. The Galaxy often play him up front and he seems to get isolated, but he is an exceptional wide player who has a really good work ethic. I see him as a much improved Leon Osman and think anywhere across the midfield would be fine. He will probably play the Cahill role or on the wing, personally I'd play him on the right wing. I would defo NOT use him on his own up front!!!
Tony Williams
9   Posted 23/12/2009 at 16:26:42

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Ste, many a true word said in jest mate.
Glen Anderson
10   Posted 23/12/2009 at 18:24:22

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Moyes has already insinuated that he’s a direct replacement for Yak during the African Nations Cup so my guess is that he’ll play up front.
James Gildersleeve
11   Posted 23/12/2009 at 19:38:01

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Ste, to be honest with you, Baines needs a kick up the ass anyway so if he was dropped I’d be more than happy. I think he’s been well below par this season and if Hibbert gets caned for his crossing then Baines should be slaughtered as he couldn’t deliver a letter recently. In my opinion he has no-one pushing him for his place and is playing like it.

I hope the rumours that we’re looking at Belhadj from Pompey are true. Don’t get me wrong, I rate Baines but he has been responsible for conceding many goals this season where he’s been caught out ball-watching

Richard Murray
12   Posted 23/12/2009 at 19:56:07

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Hmm. James, while his general play may not be reaching the heights of last season, it’s worth noting his crossing in the Chelsea game was consistently of the highest order.
James Stewart
13   Posted 23/12/2009 at 20:26:58

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I would be very surprised if he does not play on the wing.
John Talbot
14   Posted 23/12/2009 at 20:38:43

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Straight cover for the Yak while he’s away at the Nations Cup......obvious
Pat Finegan
15   Posted 23/12/2009 at 22:51:14

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His natural position is back striker where Cahill plays. He can play right wing too. I don’t want to see him as the lone striker, I don’t think he would be as useful there. He has pace to get the ball up the field and we need to take advantage of that.
Pat Finegan
16   Posted 23/12/2009 at 22:53:39

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James, Baines has 4 assists, that’s the most on the team. I would criticize his defense but all our crosses come from the left side because he does an excellent job of going forward.
David Cornmell
17   Posted 24/12/2009 at 00:27:10

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I’ve seen a lot of this boy; he’s a sound player. Especially when he plays in the hole. He can run at defenders, pick a pass and works very very hard.

He’s not a big man though and the physical nature of the league may take a little getting used to. That, and he’s got fuck all chance of winning a header against anyone other than Osman and he’s unlikely to be challenging him in the air too often.
You’d hope.

Stewart Littler
18   Posted 24/12/2009 at 01:02:09

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Tony W - don’t get me wrong, it was a very good goal, and I’m not one of those who thinks Bily isn’t a good player. However, he’s already played a full season, and I think he could do with a rest if and when we have the personnel to allow. And once again, he looked knackered on Sunday, hence why I think he was one of our poorer players, the goal aside.
Stewart Littler
19   Posted 24/12/2009 at 01:04:07

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Peter F - as the transfer window only actually opens though at midnight 02/01/09, can we register him by noon on New Year’s Day? In other words, can you register a new player before the transfer window opens?
Seamus Murphy
20   Posted 24/12/2009 at 02:04:01

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Tony Williams,

I think you should have a look again at Bily's stats, he was one of the ones I was thinking of. Bily didn’t come straight into the team as most would have hoped. His debut was in fact 2 mins against Wigan in August and he didn’t start a prem game until October! That’s the point I was trying to make!

Of course there are exceptions to this, but in naming Fellaini, Yakubu and AJ you picked 3 players who were club record signings at the time so of course you would expect them to go straight into the team. But Donovan is not a club record signing so I would expect Moyes to introduce him the way he did with Bily, painstakingly slowly.
Tony Williams
21   Posted 24/12/2009 at 10:09:38

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Seamus, you said new signings, there was nothing about picking and choosing which new signings you "actually meant".

Bily had his debut with 2 mins at Wigan, played the European game and suffered an injury, that’s why he didn’t start until October. The moment he was fit enough he was straight back into the team.
Seamus Murphy
22   Posted 24/12/2009 at 10:51:19

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Tony,

I think I did allude to there being exceptions in my original comment. You just don’t seem to be getting my point though and you are wrong again about Bily. I really am getting bored of exlplaining this to you now but since you are being so pedantic here goes:

Bily made his debut for Everton as an 89th min sub against Wigan when he could have went straight into the team. Everton's next game was not in Europe as you say, it was against Fulham in the league and Bily was an unused sub.

Is it impossible for you to accept that? Or do I have to go and trawl the stats to get more examples for you?

Tony Williams
23   Posted 24/12/2009 at 11:54:28

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Seamus, trawl away fella. You said that Moyes doesn’t put new signings straight in. I rattled off 5 within a minute I am waiting for your names.

Sorry, I missed one game of Bily’s and he has been an ever present since (barring injuries and bans) so it’s not really adding weight to your argument is it?

Let's go through the last couple of seasons shall we:

  • Beattie, injured when bought, straight in when fit.
  • Simon Davies, straight in;
  • AJ, straight in;
  • Yakubu, straight in
  • Krøldrup, was straight in the team for the pre season, got injured then got rid of;
  • Distin, straight in;
  • Heitinga, straight in;
  • Neville, straight in;
  • Marcus Bent, straight in.
I am not going to include loans, as they were stop gaps, Fernandes, Jo and my favourite Gardner (doh) but Fernandes and Jo, pretty much straight in. The only ones he buys and doesn’t put straight in are the youngsters who he has bought for the future.

So you can trawl all you want through stats and give us "an" example" not "more examples" because you have failed to give one so far, Bily doesn’t count, see above.
James Gildersleeve
24   Posted 24/12/2009 at 12:39:47

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Richard, unfortunately, one good game doesn’t make the rest of his performances acceptable. Too many times his crosses fail to beat the first man (a problem with many in our squad) and we should expect more from a player with his ability.

Pat, he does get forward well but he is after all a defender, and has shown weaknesses in this area too many times this season. I wouldn’t trust assist stats too much anyway as they can be misleading as to how much importance came from the pass that was made before the goal.
Seamus Murphy
25   Posted 24/12/2009 at 17:08:10

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Tony,

Why on earth does Bily not count!!? He is a prime example of what I was saying! Given a worthless 2 min debut then left on the bench for the next game!

Yes, you did list off 5 straight away but as I said three of those were record signings and Distin was forced into the team through lack of options. And Bily was the other one and as I pointed out, he did not go straight into the team.

So you ask for "an" example, other than Bily because that doesn’t suit you. Well we don’t even need to look outside the list you provided for a couple of examples because again you just seem to be trying to list names without knowing.

Heitinga did not go straight into the team, he started on the bench for his first game and only made his debut when he had to replace the injured Neville.

Fernandes - well he is almost two examples as both times he joined us he watched his first game from the bench as an unused sub.

So there’s three recent enough examples for you without going back to Bent or Davies! I couldn’t be bothered checking the facts on them but if your references if Bily, Fernandes and Heitinga are anything to go by then they probably sat out a few games before playing as well.

As I said already, I would love nothing more than to see Donovan dropped straight into the team but I still fully expect to see him warm the bench for a while first. Time will tell I suppose.
Anyway better get the last of these presents wrapped, Happy Christmas one and all!

Tony Williams
26   Posted 25/12/2009 at 13:56:49

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Just popped on before the pub then Xmas lunch, so Seamus you equate dithering to one game now? Fantastic. Have a great Christmas peeps.

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