The Mail Bag
Johnny Heitinga
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Having watched our last few games rather closely, I must say that I am majorly impressed with the performances of our Dutch stopper.
He is so comfortable and composed on the ball (more so than any of our other defenders) and reads the game exceptionally well. There have been some references to his lack of height, but I am not sure this is an issue, due to his excellent reading of the play.
He is no-nonsense in his approach and despite his skill is not afraid to stick his head in where it hurts (there was one occasion against Arsenal where he took a boot to the head and just got on with things).
The way in which he shackled Arshavin was also most impressive. All told, I think we have found the long-term partner for Jags and there is no doubt in my mind that he will continue to improve as he settles down more.
It really does add an exciting dimension to our play to have such a good passer at CB, with more attacks now building from the back.
Johnny, Johnny, Johnny Johnny Heitinga... Long may it continue!!!
David Gallant, Posted 14/01/2010 at 07:25:14
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Does look like he is going to be a key player for us, they call him Lionheart in Holland and I can see why.
Not sure if he is to similer to Jags for them to form a good partnership, Maybe need a CB who is strong in the air to play alongside either one. Time will tell.
I am interested to see who the hell we are going to play with him on Saturday, if Neill has gone, with Jags injured, Distin only just back in training and Yobo at AFCON, we are very short again.
Not sure if he is to similer to Jags for them to form a good partnership, Maybe need a CB who is strong in the air to play alongside either one. Time will tell.
I am interested to see who the hell we are going to play with him on Saturday, if Neill has gone, with Jags injured, Distin only just back in training and Yobo at AFCON, we are very short again.
Hetinga has been superb, after a dodgy start in midfield, when I was very critical he’s really looked the business in defence.
David, Good shout, mate; he is improving all the time.
Just one other thing, have you any spares (tickets) for that tournament starting down your way in July? Only joking of course.
Keep on supporting the boys in BLUE.
Totally agree, he is an excellent player and CB seems his ideal position. I havent got a clue who will be playing next to him on Saturday however. It seems a really bad time to break up a good partnership but most people think taking the money is the best option so ........
I hope Johnny and Jags make a great partnership for next season, could do with a left footer though, maybe that's in the pipeline.
I hope Johnny and Jags make a great partnership for next season, could do with a left footer though, maybe that's in the pipeline.
Yeah, totally agree with you there, he has been very impressive alongside Neill at the back. Good partnership there. If we do get rid of Neill, as is being suggested, then I really think we have shot ourselves in the foot.
Agree with the above, assuming Jags comes back with the same quickness that was a key part of his game.
One thing tho’....isn’t a Dutch stopper the sort of thing that is advertised in the back pages of gentlemens magazines ?
One thing tho’....isn’t a Dutch stopper the sort of thing that is advertised in the back pages of gentlemens magazines ?
The OS says that Neill will be playing against City before going to off to join his new club.
An odd situation. Shades of Leccott and first game of the season. I hope his mind will be on the job - as Mr McGuffog’s seems to be.
An odd situation. Shades of Leccott and first game of the season. I hope his mind will be on the job - as Mr McGuffog’s seems to be.
Johnny and Jags would make a great partnership, he was a folk hero in Italy and Holland.
Agreed he looks the business n’all.
Howard
Neville Heitinga Jagielka Baines
Osman Arteta Fellaini Rodwell Pienaar
Saha/Yak
Yep. Suits me, Dougie!!
Howard
Neville Heitinga Jagielka Baines
Osman Arteta Fellaini Rodwell Pienaar
Saha/Yak
Yep. Suits me, Dougie!!
Isn’t it funny. just a couple of games into his time with us and already one or two (we’ll call them Ciaran for short) were utterly convinced we’d signed a useless player.
Some has similar observations on Fellaini, and Saha,and of course Billy is a current recipient of the "No" vote from many.
Over the years Scousers have been well respected for their knowledge of the game, and of knowing a good player, or bad player, when they see one. Not any more. There are obviously fans who expect, no, demand that any player joining us has to play like Zidane from day one and not let up.
Heitinga is/was captain of Holland. he was lauded at Ajax (just as Pienaar was) and already proved he had it. It was just a case of bringing him back in the zone, as with Pienaar. He is an excellent player and I personally wouldn’t let Yobo or Distin anywhere near the centre of our defence.
I’d be grooming Shane Duffy, using Pip or Hibbert, and easing Jags back in. But as some have noted in other threads, when our central defenders play the ball out of defence it changes the whole dynamic of the team. That bit is Jags’ only failing. He is from the Sol Campbell school of defending, as opposed to the Alan Hansen one.
Some has similar observations on Fellaini, and Saha,and of course Billy is a current recipient of the "No" vote from many.
Over the years Scousers have been well respected for their knowledge of the game, and of knowing a good player, or bad player, when they see one. Not any more. There are obviously fans who expect, no, demand that any player joining us has to play like Zidane from day one and not let up.
Heitinga is/was captain of Holland. he was lauded at Ajax (just as Pienaar was) and already proved he had it. It was just a case of bringing him back in the zone, as with Pienaar. He is an excellent player and I personally wouldn’t let Yobo or Distin anywhere near the centre of our defence.
I’d be grooming Shane Duffy, using Pip or Hibbert, and easing Jags back in. But as some have noted in other threads, when our central defenders play the ball out of defence it changes the whole dynamic of the team. That bit is Jags’ only failing. He is from the Sol Campbell school of defending, as opposed to the Alan Hansen one.
Alan Kirwin - spot on. The premature denigration of our own players on here is, at times, embarrassing and shows a lack of understanding. Heitinga looks a great buy and the right sort of ’character’ we need. I think his influence on the team will develop further. All we need now is for one of those infuriating free-kicks to cannon in, he must ping them in regularly in training given the amount of chances he’s had to let fly!
Good comment Alan,
The stick Felliani was getting was unreal by most on here, it was starting with Heitinger as well, now it seems Billy is the latest victim.
I agree he's off the pace but i also think he has shown parts were you could see a good Premier League player develop. I also think Jo was begining to show some good movement but he is another one who takes it.
I don't think it helps them or the team. Ok we all have lowpoints but to single out one is unfair.
The stick Felliani was getting was unreal by most on here, it was starting with Heitinger as well, now it seems Billy is the latest victim.
I agree he's off the pace but i also think he has shown parts were you could see a good Premier League player develop. I also think Jo was begining to show some good movement but he is another one who takes it.
I don't think it helps them or the team. Ok we all have lowpoints but to single out one is unfair.
Heitinga’s skill on the ball has been impressive as has his reading of the game but the thing that has most impressed me has been his attitude and never say die approach allied to his undoubted skill. I think he has been organising and, in effect, captaining the side from the moment he moved to centre half.
A demanding and commanding figure and a great buy!
A demanding and commanding figure and a great buy!
Heitinga is a good player there was never any doubting that. As I remember it Cairan was critical of him playing Right back which is a valid point. It first appeared Moyes had indeed bought him as one. But then it seems to take a few months before he will play any new signings in their natural position.
As for Bily I just don’t see the point in his signing. 9m is a big outlay for a player in a position where we have plenty of talent already. He is no winger that is for sure.
As for Bily I just don’t see the point in his signing. 9m is a big outlay for a player in a position where we have plenty of talent already. He is no winger that is for sure.
Does anybody know for certain if Heitinga is eligible for the Europa League now?
He played for Atletico in the qualifers for the Champions League so if we play his old club in the next round after Sporting surely he can't play against a team he has already played for in Europe this season?
I hope the club have looked into this as with Neill now leaving we could be down on two central defenders if we play Atletico Madrid.
He played for Atletico in the qualifers for the Champions League so if we play his old club in the next round after Sporting surely he can't play against a team he has already played for in Europe this season?
I hope the club have looked into this as with Neill now leaving we could be down on two central defenders if we play Atletico Madrid.
"As for Bily I just don’t see the point in his signing."
James, any number of people posting on this site said the same about Heitinga.
Comment - thankfully - is free, but that’s exactly what its worth - unless you know how to sell it.
James, any number of people posting on this site said the same about Heitinga.
Comment - thankfully - is free, but that’s exactly what its worth - unless you know how to sell it.
Alan Kirwin, stop rewriting history to support your handbag fights with other posters and denigrating scousers in the bargain.
Hetinga was piss poor in the first few games he played for us; he reminded me of a bad Tommy Gravesen; all huff, puff and panic but no guile. Since he’s settled down and been moved to the centre of defence he looks a different class of player.
People call things as they see them and I saw a player playing without form, without the ability to find a decent pass and with the tackling style of a three legged wounded water buffalo - in short; he looked shit.
I’m glad to say he’s playing better and looks the class act that clever people like you knew he was all along.
Hetinga was piss poor in the first few games he played for us; he reminded me of a bad Tommy Gravesen; all huff, puff and panic but no guile. Since he’s settled down and been moved to the centre of defence he looks a different class of player.
People call things as they see them and I saw a player playing without form, without the ability to find a decent pass and with the tackling style of a three legged wounded water buffalo - in short; he looked shit.
I’m glad to say he’s playing better and looks the class act that clever people like you knew he was all along.
Sean Patton - yes Heitinga is definetly available for us in Europe - the reason he never played befor xmas was he was not registered in time - the exact same reason as why lucas neill was not playing. The strange thing with the Lucas Neill deal is that he is still actually available for us against City on saturday. I say play him again with Heitinga - hopefully give us a clean sheet and we will fondly remember him for what has essentially turned out to be a loan period - funny world is football - Everon cant afford to turn down 850k profit so a good deal for the club and a good deal for neill -prob get 80k a week and an 18th month contract and good weather.
Spot on Alan. Kevin, I’ll agree with you that Heitinga sucked for a month or so after he got here. What Alan is saying is that everyone automatically wrote him off as worthless, that was wrong.
I think Jags and Heitinga could complimenet each other well. With Jags playing solid defence and Heitinga contributing to the offence (while still playing solid defence).
I think Jags and Heitinga could complimenet each other well. With Jags playing solid defence and Heitinga contributing to the offence (while still playing solid defence).
Not by me Pat - I’ve seen too many players being written off by supporters who subsequently turn into World beaters...
Examples: Ratcliffe — really shite as a fullback was tried out at centre half and the rest is history...
Sharpy — looked lost in his first few games; looked imperious for the rest of his career
Southall — from clown to colossus in four matches.
Players take time to find their feet — even great players. Watching Heitinga I thought ’what the fuck have we bought here?’... and I’m sure I wasn’t the only one.
What does wind me up is people who try to suggest the said players actually played well and knew how good they were going to be all along... it’s just that you ’ordinary’ scouse folk couldn’t see it..
Yeah right..
Examples: Ratcliffe — really shite as a fullback was tried out at centre half and the rest is history...
Sharpy — looked lost in his first few games; looked imperious for the rest of his career
Southall — from clown to colossus in four matches.
Players take time to find their feet — even great players. Watching Heitinga I thought ’what the fuck have we bought here?’... and I’m sure I wasn’t the only one.
What does wind me up is people who try to suggest the said players actually played well and knew how good they were going to be all along... it’s just that you ’ordinary’ scouse folk couldn’t see it..
Yeah right..
Alan, Are you still for sending Moyes to coventry?
Premature you say?< My opinion of heitinga was based on what I’d seen of him in Spain... a period in his career that was less than flattering — he was sluggish and prone to many mistakes... I’m glad my informed reservations have been wrong...
Don’t let that stop you jizzing all over your keyboard like you’ve found a unicorn. If I popped up everytime you got something wrong, I’d get whiplash.
Premature you say?< My opinion of heitinga was based on what I’d seen of him in Spain... a period in his career that was less than flattering — he was sluggish and prone to many mistakes... I’m glad my informed reservations have been wrong...
Don’t let that stop you jizzing all over your keyboard like you’ve found a unicorn. If I popped up everytime you got something wrong, I’d get whiplash.
John Crook - Heitinga is NOT available for Europe as Atletico are still in the competition.... as far as I know anyway.
I am pretty sure Heitinga IS available for the next round of the Europa League.
Keith, they did indeed. I was not one.
But as for Bily, I had never heard of him... but, for £9m, I expected pace as it is what we have been crying out for.
But as for Bily, I had never heard of him... but, for £9m, I expected pace as it is what we have been crying out for.
Obviously that is not what he offers so I’m still puzzled by his signing. Happy to be proved wrong though. Time will tell. For the record, I think he will be a costly mistake.
Kevin, I think we just said the same thing. I’m saying that everyone wrote off Heitinga unfairly. He had a couple games that were pretty bad and then he improved greatly. If we still disagree, please clarify.
Thanks for the conflicting messages lads!
It is all conjecture anyway as Sporting might tear us a new arse.
It is all conjecture anyway as Sporting might tear us a new arse.
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1 Posted 14/01/2010 at 14:34:39
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Ultimately we have to give him and Jags a go together, the height thing maybe a factor, but class is more important. Jags and Lescott were our best pairing last year, is JH that much smaller than Lescott?
I’m worried about the next few games though, Heitinga and Neill were looking good together and I don’t see another available partnership I fancy at the moment. God forbid Heitinga gets an injury.