A book - "Successful Management for Dummies".

Maybe for his birthday people could stop slagging him off for a day?

Don't be daft, Alex!

I agree with Alex, the fella`s done the best he can and we could be in a worse situation.

Maybe like in that shitty Jim Carrey film 'Liar, Liar' Bill could be gifted/cursed with the ability to speak only the truth for 24 hours.

Maybe Jenny could get him some electric shock treament, and everytime he opens his fucking mouth, he gets zapped!!!

Alex and Roy, can I remind you respect is earned not free and in BK's case he has neither earned it or deserves it.

Jenny could always send for young Daffy Dodd to fawn over him for the day.

A pair of those spanky yellow footy boots, so Moyes can try him out wide right..... he's gotta be better than Osman in that position.

Actually I've got a better idea for Jenny, she should get him a restful break at a nice quiet health spa.... after all he must be knackered looking for that investment 24/7.

All the best Bill, you'll be glad to know "I've ringfenced the money for your present & it'll be in the post in the morning." ... Honest!

Well ToffeeWeb must really be scraping the barrel to allow a post as pathetic as this one to be 'aired'.

While I am not a fan of Bill Kenwright's press conferences and the way he handles the media and fans, what he has done is somewhat more acceptable than the ramblings of the American owners at Liverpool and certainly a cut above the utter disgrace that occured at Pompey last season.

So to come on here with nothing but the intention to insult a fellow blue, regardless of his position, is outrageous, childish and very wrong. I'd say you should be ashamed of yourselves but you wouldn't stop spraying your names on bus stop windows long enough to listen.

Sad really.

Agree entirely, Jaime.

To the tune of Happy Birthday (obviously)

Happy birthday to Bill
Jamie Rowland needs to chill
Happy birthday dear Kenwright
Even though you may talk shite
And your bank balance is nil

Heres a thought Jamie, if you don't like the thread, don't comment. Ditto Alex, considering you seem to agree with Jamie.

I wonder if he lies about his age...?

Folks, it's called humour, you know... banter. Hasn't anyone ever wound you up? Take it for what it is, utterly shamefull!

Get a sense of humour!

This is nearly as bad a post as the Fuck Birmingham one. Roll on the Man United game so we can get back to talking football and not character assasination.

Nul Points.Awful stuff this..

The worst thread I've ever seen on this site. Another idiotic stage offered to the usual suspects.

Dont Comment? So its completely fine for someone to submit a nonsense post that does nothing but insults a person and their personal life just because they happen to run a football club.

its a sad article that shouldn't have been allowed to post...i expect better from toffeeweb because usually the site is full of good articles and opinions that we can all debate on...this is just complete nonsense and I was so disappointed after reading it that I had to comment to ridicule it

Jamie, and everyone else who's moaning about this thread, its a joke. A harmless bit of fun, stop turning it in to your own Save Bill Kenwright's honour quest.

Why don't you suggest something for his birthday, the billionaire he's searching for, perhaps a new striker, new ground or whatever?

If it was about Ken Bates, would you comment then?

So put your handbags away, and fuckin cheer up.

By the way I hope he has a nice birthday, he's 65 years young.

Retirement age... hmmm.

Sadly predictable who would not see any funny side of this... I assume the trigger was publication somewhere of the fact that it is Bill's birthday ? something we've not 'celebrated' before ? he is surely must un-Virgo-like if you ask me! Nice to note that you can't come up with anything better to discuss yourselves and so get all precious on us with this righteous indignation. Sorry, but water off a duck's back.

Get a grip lads. Given Bills background I think he is well used to both positive & negative reviews. Actually I think he would actually be quite chuffed that his birthday merits a mention on an Everton site.

What Jamie said.

How very easy it is to slag someone off. Bully's love an easy target. Humour has nothing to do with it and its got nothing to do with this post either. Maybe we should all get together with Bill so we can play 'all pile on'

Ped, how easy is it after ten years not to still be full of bullshit and lies? Better still, how after ten years he still has folk gullible enough to swallow it?

"Maybe we should all get together with Bill so we can play 'all pile on'"

What kind of birthday present is that?

Jenny could purchase him a years membership to the local observatory, so he can "watch this space" for long as his hearts content.

Or dress him up as Marilyn Monroe and teach him "How to Marry a Billionaire"

A DeLorean fitted with a flux capacitor. Bill gets in the car and sets a date of October 6, 2000.

Bill puts the car in drive, arrives at his destination and continues to live in this time warp until March 31, 2003.

At 11:59pm he announces EFC has the necessary dosh. Bill gets into the DeLorean, sets the date for today and goes "Back To The Future."

Today, EFC play in a fantastic stadium. A stadium, admittedly not owned outright, but with a majority shareholding (49%); 76% of 76% income for all events at the stadium; money is coming into the club; EFC is a member of the "Sky top 4" year after year; CL qualification is not a pipe dream but a reality; what could have been...

http://www.toffeeweb.com/club/kings-dock/new-stadium.asp

Watch this space!!!

Absolutely on the nail Gary Sedgwick. As well as watching our team play in the best stadium in the country we should be revelling in Wayne Rooney hammering in goals for fun and leading us year in, year out into the Champions League. So happy fucking birthday Bill.

Oh yes, all of the comments in this thread are just good fun and splendid humour.

Ah well, some pretty funny. Some distasteful. But, as long as it's humour eh?

Even if it is humorous (highly debatable), the same old joke gets tiresome when trotted out for the umpteenth time. Sorry, I shouldn't have bothered commenting, should I?

Gary Sedgwick #28 John Otway#30, in fact we are so successful that two American 'entrepreneurs' make a successful bid for the company, promising to make us the greatest team in history, fast forward to 2010 and because they bought the club on loans using the club as collateral, we?re now 46 squillion pounds to 12 different banks and are paying 26 million a year in debt repayment-the golden future has arrived!!

David Hallwood, roll forward to today, right here, right now, welcome to Everton FC in debt to the banks with multiple mortgages against Goodison Park, a training ground they rent, a former training ground they can't sell and the only thing of value being current players contracts and a chairman spouting the same tired old shite for ten years ? fucking yippee.

So Gavin we're in debt, the RS is in (even bigger) debt, Man U is in debt, Fulham is in debt, WHU is in debt, I could go on and on, the only team spending money is Citteh (even Chelsea's calmed down even though they've got an ageing team) ? so your point is??

Just hope we can repeat our performance and result from last season on Saturday. I would think that would suffice as a Birthday gift.

Arhh, fuck it.

24/7

Deal of the century,

Watch this space,

Watch the clock,

£50 mill for rooney,

Safety certificate,

Free stadium,

The cunt sold Rooney,

Fucked up the Kings Dock,

Embarressed us to death over Destination Kirkby... Remember them twats with there tesco fuckin bags!

Appointed a manager that won't rock the boat ie, asking for funds,

But the biggest and worse thing he is responsible for, imo, he's actualy lowered young and possibly old Evertonians' expectations.

Whereby we all feel gratefull to exist as a top 6 side... stability, safety, are words he hides behind.

The media lap it up, and think he's some kind of super chairman, and we should be grateful were not fighting relegation.

If we don't achieve anything this year, and by that I mean a fuckin trophy, or at least Champions League, he has got to go, as this team will break up; Fellaini, Rodders, Johnny, and Co will go somewhere else.

Happy fuckin birthday, thanks for turning us into a small club.

There, I said it... dont feel any better tho.

David Hallwood. I would refer you to the Arsenal business model which is what we had the chance to pre-empt.

David, my point in responding to your post, as if BK is some form of financial fucking messiah, he isn't. I'd also point you to Man U and Chelski's ability to service their debt and Everton's still growing ? last season selling players to buy, this season not a sausage on the transfer front beyond freebies and cheapies, any money we have just trying to maintain players. How long before the banks question BK's amazing business model and call in some of the debt with a sale of our only resource ? player(s)? Come on David, what's your point???

My point, Gavin, is that I'm forced into a BK apologist position when I'm nothing of the sort, but feelings against BK are so bitter that people almost lose their reasoning. I refer to a report late last season by someone called the Swiss Rambler (??), who painted a very bleak financial picture of EFC, because expenditure is outstripping income, and unless the club can increase revenue streams the business will fail.

He proposed various ways to increase revenue; increase ticket prices year on year, á la Man Utd, but that came with a warning that, because our fan base isn?t as global as Man Utd's and also Merseyside is a relatively low-wage economy, this maybe counter-productive. Or we can build a new stadium or rebuild GP; however, because of our weak financial position that is further exacerbated by the global money crisis, this isn?t going to happen anytime soon.

On TW, we?ve done to death wage inflation, but to my mind this is the single biggest issue in the EPL that, if it isn?t halted, will do just about every club in. Arteta, £75k per week, will be followed by rises to all the major players and smaller rises to the lesser players and this is something that BK has got little control over ?well, he has... but at a risk of losing all the good players; now that would make Toffeewebbers like your good self sound like Tim Howard with a particularly virulent attack of Tourette's.

So does BK deserve all the abuse shovelled on him on the website? Is he a fuckwit/gobshite/loser/fuckin idiot etc etc. Most people would take a view that a self-made multi-millionaire and successful theatrical impresario is anything but; however, most people aren?t Evertonians. Has he made mistakes? Hell, yes. Does he bullshit? That depends on your point of view. The world of business and politics is full of people that put a spin on bad news and very few of them will tell it like it is; quite the opposite, in fact... and they usually ?big up? their product ? now our Bill is certainly guilty of that.

If we look at the King?s Dock ?fiasco?, my understanding of that is that they couldn?t raise the necessary finance in time, which is unfortunate, but it happens. In another existence, I was in the music industry and put together a £5 million project only for one of the backers to pull out. You are left with two choices: phone everyone up and say the deal?s off, or run round like headless chickens trying to find alternative funding, blagging all and sundry on the way.

To my mind, BK's mistakes (apart from merchandising, which is laughable) is after King?s Dock, he/they should have redeveloped GP with the knowledge that the finance wasn?t out there for a purpose-built stadium, and what appears to be a refusal to have a rights issue obviously because his/their investment would be diminished.

But, to finish off, if you go on any other fans? website, with the exception of the Billionaire twosome, the board and chairmen get crucified. Apologies for the length of the post.

David Hallwood...

Two words that spring to mind regarding your "understanding" of the Kings Dock fiasco:-

...RING FENCED...

And another thing...

"I was in the music industry and put together a £5 million project only for one of the backers to pull out."

Well you didn't put the fucker together then did you!!

Well said Jamie Rowland.

I clearly have no sense of humour either - if someone could explain where the "funny side" is in this article I'd really appreciate it. Lost.

Nice one Tony! but my point exactly. At times you spend x amount of months putting something together and then through no fault of your own someone gets cold feet or has second thoughts and leaves you high and dry. Now to get the money you obviously put the best spin you can on the project, and phrases like 'can't fail', 'copper-bottomed' and all the rest of the shite drops from your lips, even though you know you're winging it.

To some people, salesmanship is another word for bullshit ? and of course it is but that's the game and to say BK has acted any differently from any other CEO/figurehead is delusional/

David, you say..

"Does he bullshit? That depends on your point of view".

No it doesn't, it doesn't make ANY difference what your point of view...

Either he bullshits/lies/spoofs or he doesn't.

Either he's telling the truth or he isn't.

Sure, people can make excuses and apologies, but that doesn't ACTUALLY change what he is saying and whether or not it is truthful.

You continue...

"The world of business and politics is full of people that put a spin on bad news and very few of them will tell it like it is".

Agreed, but let's be clear: Putting a spin on something is being dishonest. In other words, you (me, all of us) have a choice ? tell the truth or play with the truth.

If you decide to play with it, you do so for NO other reason than to avoid telling the truth.

Also, telling something like it ISN'T is also being DELIBERATELY dishonest.

I also don't buy into your argument that the rich can't be thick/fuckwits etc.

You say...

"Is he a fuckwit/gobshite/loser/fuckin idiot etc etc. Most people would take a view that a self-made multi millionaire and successful theatrical impresario is anything but."

I think you're right, I think most people WOULD take that view, but... most people are idiots.

This 'money equals smart' is a modern notion, borne of Hello magazine, X-Factor et al.

I've had people say "Well, you say Jordan is a dead-behind-the-eyes, thick-as-shite scrubber, but she's banked over £20 million so she can't be that stupid."

Money = intelligence.

Fucking ludicrous!

I mean think of them all, 'Chantelle', Jade Goody, David Sullivan, The third duke of Inbred, etc etc ? all idiots.

In fact, the way the world is now, I would suggest these days, wealth is more likely to mark you out as someone with NO scruples/morals/brains, as it is as someone of intelligence.

David without sounding too obvious, BK has employed a myriad of people who you would suspect would be carrying out his short- and long-term business strategy and securing as much on- and off-field revenue as possible. If anything, the last ten years has shown what an utter failure BK is as a businessman when it comes to running an EPL team; our percentile income is clearly outstripped year on year by percentile outgoings.

The same man has been responsible for what can only be described as the most divisive project in the history of the club in DK; he was at the helm at the failed KD ? despite there being an offer of finance which is documented and has been discussed here ad nauseum.

He was also in control during the appointment of Keith Wyness, an absolute abhorrence of a man, again with documented history of fraud leading to his expulsion from Australia and a documented history at Aberdeen Football Club of opening a stadium development company, pallying up with a supermarket and developer, and telling the club and fans they had to move as the stadium was falling down, and the deal was the best thing that ever happened to the club ? this all sounds so familiar.

Well Aberdeen are still playing at the same ground, his resurrected company would have earned him another payout independent of his Everton salary, who also allowed him to run this business on the company's time (conflict of interest or lack of common or business sense?).

BK has seen some absolutely atrocious events on his clock... yet, when anyone dares call him out, they have to listen to the same old stories; true blue, look over the park, Portsmouth and now Man U and Chelsea comparisons. His soundbites are an insult to my intelligence yet still lapped up by the faithful, you know the ones ? 24/7; watch this space; wow, the money is ringfenced; we see 7/8 people interested in the club every year ? which suddenly changed into 4 - well Bill is it 4 or 7 or 8 or none? Tell you what, Bill ? don't bother.

So we will have to agree to disagree on Bill but, as far as I'm concerned, he is holding this club back and no-one else, ten years and counting...

i hope the twat had a shit birthday.

Don't know about that James, if he got even one in ten of the presents suggested on here I bet he had a whale of a time.

Last word on the subject, because this is beginning to make War & Peace look like a short story. Gavin I am not, repeat not a BK apologist, supporter, acolyte, or whatever they're called on TW, and if Sheik Yerackers wanted to take control of EFC provided all the supporters converted to Islam ? well where's that copy of the Koran that I bought in a car boot sale (I passed on the rucksack next to it though).

I've stated that he's made mistakes and IMHO when KD project went tits up, then GP should have been redeveloped maybe over a number of years. It was obvious that DK was the realisation that the finance wasn't out there. But my main point is that the hatred is so vehement against BK that posters like you, who are obviously intelligent people, lose all objectivity and everything BK does is wrong. I also stated that this is a common sentiment with fans; go onto Newcastle?s website and you would think that this Mike Ashley fellow is a combination of pol pot, Hitler and a child molester, ditto Randy Lerner etc etc. The irony is that BK is held up as a shining example, in fact we?ve just become top of the financial fair play league (only got a vague idea what it is but it is to do with value for money), now I?m off to the pub to celebrate cos it will probably be the only fucking thing that we win this season.

To sum up, BK?s EFC school report; B- needs to improve. Would I like a new board? Oh God aye, but on that note, I think the Everton board has been pretty shit for a lot longer than BK?s tenure.

Moving on to Eugene Ruane #48; where do we start? Just because a person?s rich doesn?t make them smart ? agreed, but it doesn?t necessarily make them stupid either. Nevertheless if a person has built up a business over a number of years, it would lead me to believe that they have business acumen coupled with methodical thought process, which some people may call intelligence, but then what is intelligence?

To answer that we would stray far outside of the ?football website? brief. For example, my wife has got all kinds of qualifications, with more letters after her name than a Welsh railway station; and zilch common sense ? some of the shite she comes out with is truly jaw-dropping. So is she intelligent or well educated? And no, I can?t see the point of the ?debate? either.

And finally, yes I agree with you that people should tell it like it is, no bullshit, no spin, just straight talking. I also believe in the end of all wars, poverty and that there should not be a child on the earth going to bed hungry tonight. Sadly I?m over 12 years of age and I realise that the world and humankind will always be mean, violent, treacherous and duplicitous, which is a polite way of saying... fucking grow up.

David, not once did I call you an apologist or anything of the sort, I simply remarked and listed a number of BK's higher profile failures and he has many many of them. The report you mention on the best value is utterly meaningless drivel as it earns the club what exactly, some kudos in whichever resting place your god may be? It most certainly isn't paying the debts or funding the club's expansion.

DK was sold on a premise of lies which eventually leaked and then flowed like a river during the DK hearings; true cost of the stadium, no off-field concerts, reduced capacity which even then have had no deliverable transport strategy despite many attempts... and most damning ? the complete lack of a Plan B.

As far as the shite Everton board goes, I fully agree, BK was on it a long time before he took over from PJ and he has kept the same old faces on it, who else would you blame other than BK for that?

Interestingly, I also work with a rabid skunks fan who sings the praises of Ashley, having kept the club together when he could quite easily have let it slip further into debt, and according to him, he has calmed a sinking ship, despite him being hated by a swathe of fans; he remains at the helm and appreciated by enough to stay there.

Enjoy your pint.

David, you said..

"Moving on to Eugene Ruane #48; where do we start just because a person?s rich doesn?t make them smart-agreed, but it doesn?t necessarily make them stupid either."

Erm right.

So... what's your point?

You were the one who initially linked wealth with intelligence, I simply put forward the obvious and entirely legitimate counter-argument you had chosen to ignore.

I mean seriously ? why give us one half of an argument when the other side is PLAINLY sitting there with it's hand up saying "SIR... SIR... SIR!!

If you (now) think both views are legitimate, why didn't you state that from the off, instead of just giving us the bit that suited whatever the point is you were attempting to make (something about you're not an apologist for Bill but have been forced into it because some people are nasty about him... or something)?

Actually, I think concentrating only on the parts of an argument that suit your own agenda is sometimes called 'spin'.

You continue:

"Nevertheless, if a person has built up a business over a number of years, it would lead me to believe that they have business acumen coupled with methodical thought process, which some people may call intelligence"

It MIGHT lead me to believe that... and it might not.

I believe for instance that those who make millions through producing and selling pornography, do so because of a complete lack of morals and because they AREN'T intelligent (nb: In the 60s, Joan Bakewell could have posed nude in playboy and become very rich ? she didn't become very rich BECAUSE she was intelligent.)

But ok, let's say you're right about that.

I would STILL say 'so fucking what?'

Because we're not in reality talking about a person dealing with 'A' business are we? ? We're actually talking about a person dealing with TWO businesses.

The initial business that made him/her successful AND a football club.

More often than not, two VERY different businesses and businesses with VERY different 'consumers'.

Again, I believe you're spinning to suit.

Just to spell this out ? following your 'logic', someone who who sets up a French Cheese import business over a number of years (with their 'business acumen coupled with their methodical thought process' ... blah waffle) is probably qualified to successfully run a football club.

Question: How long should I make the list of (intelligent!) successful businessmen who have fucked up trying to run a football club?

You finish...

"And finally, yes, I agree with you that people should tell it like it is, no bullshit, no spin, just straight talking. I also believe in the end of all wars, poverty and that there should not be a child on the earth going to bed hungry tonight. Sadly I?m over 12 years of age and I realise that the world and humankind will always be mean, violent, treacherous and duplicitous, which is a polite way of saying fucking grow up"

Yes, thank you Clarence Darrow ? I'm sure everyone is impressed by what an 'adult' and a world-weary realist you are.

Yes, of course the world is 'mean' but to accept this, the way you (apparently) do, is desperate.

Fortunately, not everyone thinks that way (which is why slavery was abolished, workhouses were closed and they stopped sending 8-year-olds up chimneys).

I'll be honest (look it up!), I think your posts are revealing.

Apart from the internet warrior-like 'fucking grow up', I think most of what you've written IS spin.

You prefer the word 'mistakes' to lies, you (unsurprisingly) seem unconcerned about spin and not 'telling it like it is'; you (unsuccessfully) attempt to push us toward what is OBVIOUSLY only one half of an argument. Your take on bullshit is that it is somehow subjective and most worryingly, your answer to the suggestion we have the choice to tell the truth or to lie, is some 'It was ever thus' bollocks.

Rather you than me... Mandy.

On ya, Bill, Keep batting away crooks like those who tried to take the RS and Blackburn for a ride. By maintaining a dignified silence, Bill saved us from the kind of embarrassment suffered by fans of those clubs. Let this be a lesson to those who would have danced a ridiculous jig to welcome the latest snake oil dealer.

The merest mention of a takeover by that kind of charletan would have sent some of you into ludicrous paroxysms of rapture. Bill may not have fulfilled our desires but at least he hasn't destroyed our dignity, and for that we should be grateful. Happy birthday, you old tart.

'Maintaining a dignified silence'.

Yes Dick, that's what Bill's been doing.

Actually while I'm here, I'd like to commend comedian Alan Carr for maintaining a deep, rich, not in the least bit annoying, fruity voice.

(Well, you fucking started it!)

Dick, Dignified and Silence are we still talking about Bill? Watch this space and 24/7 are a bit nearer the mark.

David Hallwood (#33)... but Bill's still got the DeLorean... :-)

Yes, this is exactly what we want!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11163004.

Maybe, just maybe this is what "Evil" Bill is protecting us against.

Thankfully I can?t get to check out TW much due to my work commitments and constant travelling but this site is becoming such a gutter one with the same people personally slagging of others and mainly our Chairman. Yes I may be called a BK apologist or whatever else you like to call me but constructive criticism is always welcome and we got it mostly on some threads but this site is monopolised by prats constantly posting the same bullshit.

I have met BK on several occasions and yes he does say a bit too much when it may be a bit wiser to hold his council but he is not out to make a buck or weaken EFC as a club. I have stated many times its very easy to run a multi million pound business with the aid of hindsight as people do on this site, I do it on a daily basis and its not easy and we do make mistakes a lot more than one would like but as long as you lean from them then you pick yourself up and move on.

Some of you just need to come in to the real world a bit more and look forward not back; History buys you nothing, we live on our current P&L and the money is going in to the players pockets!! That?s the problem, COYB

Alan, care to define which is "bull shit".

Alan,

Bill's been searching 24/7 for ten years, when if he had let Gregg and Granchester take over instead of inventing Fortress Sports Fund, we would've had our investor/rich owner.

Gregg, backed by the Moores family, was the thing he says he's been looking for, so the man has virtualy ruined us, just to keep us under his control.

We have to accept mediocrity because you and others tell us this shit that we're safe in Bill's hands.

Don't talk crap, answer me this, Alan: What's Phil Green got to do with us? What about the other spurs fan Earl?

He's sold Rooney; he's gonna sell Rodwell... and he's sold us all down the river!

Saviour, my arse!

"Get a sense of humour" and "Can't you take a joke?" are statements rarely uttered by people engaged in playful tomfoolery. These phrases are almost always, as here, delivered by those seeking a defence for pointless unpleasantness. Whatever you think of BK, it doesn't reflect well on us to see an entire thread devoted to the many ways we could ridicule him.

Alan Williams you say "this site is monopolised by prats constantly posting the same bull shit"

You're SO right about that!

I mean how many posts do we have to read along the lines of "Sure Bill's made mistakes BUT..."

(nb: another one who prefers 'mistakes' to lies).

You say BK is "not out to weaken EFC as a club"

You're probably right...but his intention is of no real consequence if he DOES weaken it.

People who run 'big business' are generally very well (imo ridiculously) paid and SHOULD take the slings and arrows if and when they fuck up - simple.

However they usually don't, it's usually someone just below them who gets it.

It actually seems to be a 'boss thing' - 'I fuck up someone else pays' (I'm sure you're not like that!)

In fact come to think of it (certainly in the UK) there seems to be a culture of actually rewarding boss failure.

Adam Crozier for instance - his time at the FA is generally seen to have been a failure.

Didn't stop him getting the top job at the post office though.

Which he fucked up.

But that didn't stop him getting the top job at ITV.

Sorry - I'm straying

Alan, posts on TW are sometimes going to annoy you and insult you and insult your intelligence and amaze you and make you laugh and frustrate the shit out of you.

But keep in mind, It's NO different for you than for anyone else. Remember, as annoyed as you might get by the posts of others, there's a good chance (I GUARANTEE!) that your posts are inducing a weary "Oh for fuck's sake" in someone else.

My advice, stop whining and remember the old adage about heat and kitchens.

Don?t need to, Gavin, those that know, know already; those that don?t... well basically don?t care anyway. It would be wrong for me to name names as I would be doing to them what they say about BK. Two wrongs don?t make a right.

Constructive critism is very welcome and that?s what we want because nobody knows the full facts and sometimes we all need to eat humble pie from time to time, that?s life. Just seems so many posters these days just want what can?t be delivery in the real world and that is basically what winds me up. COYB!!

We should clone him. After all, it'd be like having a new signing...

Bill would like to thank all the people who sent in Robert Daniels voodoo dolls and the additional set of pins for good measure, he hopes Robert enjoyed being a prick for the weekend..

Thanks Dave,

I actualy did enjoy it, I was quite amazed at the reaction the post received, it was put up to stimulate a debate about what he might like for his birthday.

I expected a few remarks as to his running of our football club, expected some witty and maybe lighthearted comments, from both sides of the divide, I hoped it would amuse people on what was a non-football weekend.

As the comments progressed, I got sick of everyone defending his honour, instead of taking it as a bit of fun; people were so serious, you cant speak about Bill like that... 'blasphemy', and my personal favourite, 'character assassination'... don't make me laugh!

He's as tough as they come, I've met him several times, this is water off a duck's back, thick skin and all that.

So, yes, I did enjoy the weekend ? it was great... but I hope this weekend's better, and we beat the Mancs.

Coybs.

I've noticed that too, Eugene, how it is always "Bill has made mistakes"...

Thanks Eugene, when it comes to whining I?m afraid you top that list so I wouldn?t want to take your mantle. As you?re a font of all knowledge maybe you should inform all TW readers just how much Bill actually takes out of the club as a salary???

You choose to mention the top earners in private/public office which is very similar to the red tops and very easy to use as a comparison that all Directors or CEOs earn this remuneration which basically isn?t true. Taking stick as you say comes with the job no matter what organisation people are in that?s fine but when the attackers are personal then it's not on, especially when its not justified. He isn?t perfect and we all know that but he doesn?t own the club either so in the long run we will get new owners then we will reflect on his tenure and see if he has actually done a good job.

Maybe you should check out the recent article from the University of Warwick, apparently all considered we top the table for value for money, but no doubt it must have been written by a fellow Kenwright apologist? COYB

Alan you say..

"Taking stick as you say comes with the job no matter what organisation people are in that?s fine but when the attackers are personal then it's not on, especially when its not justified".

Gibberish.

Personal?

Of course it's 'personal' (do you actually read what you write?)

If I think BK is useless, I don't say "Some CEO's are useless".

If BK has lied I don't say "Barry Manilow lied"

What I (absolutely legitimately) say is "BK is a fucking liar and I think he's fucking useless".

Not 'justified' you say?

Nonsense!

Absolutely justified

You in my opinion have existed far too long in a world of boss-speak and spin (eg: where lies become mistakes and nobody says what they're actually thinking).

'Taking stick' is fine you say.

Really?

When?

Define 'stick'.

Because I suspect it's only 'fine' as long as it's not YOU who is taking the stick, or those who've shaken your hand at some (Everton?) function ("I've met him, lovely feller - haw haw").

Then they're bastards, they're over-stepping the mark and they're making it (the classic) 'too personal'.

I really hope there aren't blue employees of yours reading TW.

It could be damaging to your career if they were to find out how much time you (who run a multi million pound company on a daily basis!) spend here and how much Howard's Way bollocks you spout.

Imagine the embarrassment at the next shareholders meeting if one of your posts is produced.

Cut to Charles Frere type holding up a print-out.

"The man (zoom - close up) doesn't know the difference between a mistake and a lie for God's sake!"

Cut to audience full of extras looking concerned.

"Rhubarbrhubarbrhubarb...."

As for the Warwick University study, no I didn't read it and couldn't give a fuck if it says Bill is the second coming.

I DID however see what we had available to buy players this summer.

(Wardrobe by The House Of Howard)

Robert Daniels - "As the comments progressed, I got sick of everyone defending his honour, instead of taking it as a bit of fun; people were so serious, you can't speak about Bill like that... 'blasphemy', and my personal favourite, 'character assassination'... don't make me laugh!"

You presumably had in mind comments such as - "Maybe Jenny could get him some electric shock treament, and everytime he opens his fucking mouth, he gets zapped!!!". One of Brian Waring's many light hearted & well intended pieces of banter.

You are being utterly disingenuous in what you say. Some people can indeed make points using humour and without resorting to bile & spite. But some can't and you know as I know that any thread with "Bill" or "Kenwright" in the title will attract the same rubbish as the preceding 563 threads on the exact same theme.

Not sure I follow the comparisons of Kenwright with Crozier or "bosses". The latter are all well- (arguably, over-)remunerated for what they do, even when they fuck up.

Kenwright is not paid by the club. He mortgaged his house to buy it. His decade as chairman has seen a marked improvement in the club's on-field performance. We have gone from relegation regulars to European challengers and have, by any comparison, our best squad for 25 years.

What seems to be beyond the limited wit of the truly spiteful are those simple facts. Despite our club's financial straightjacket, we are a better club now than for over two decades. That isn't all down to Moyes, and how could it be, as the same whingers who rant about Kenwright often do the same about Moyes.

People who always bring problems are vacuous & aren't worth the airtime. It's just noise, bit like a dozen 6-year-olds goading a kid with glasses, and like much of this thread.

So I wonder, all the whingers who swamp TW with the same story/complaint/criticism of Kenwright that they've already posted hundreds of times before, and which allegedly happened 8 years ago, why not post a positive contribution on the same topic? Because everything is of course relative. It now seems that seeing things as relative is also now on the forbidden list for the baying wolves. Any hint of mitigation or balance or even devil's advocate brings out the risible & amusing moniker of Apologist. Ha!

Since when did things cease to be relative? Since when did comparisons become a heinous concept? What fucking nonsensical drivel is this?

And on this theme of relativity, why not pause from slagging off Kenwright for a nano-second and let's see a list of clubs who a) Have undergone successful takeovers, and b) Have invested in club and infrastructure, and c) Outperform Everton where it matters (on the pitch), and d) Are not saddled with huge debt as a result.

We can discount Leeds, Newcastle, Villa, West Ham, Liverpool and even Man Utd. Now, who does that leave? Who is it that we are comparing ourselves to? And please don't offer silly responses like Stoke City, because they spent more than we did in ONE transfer window. Remember, in the real world everything is relative. You need to take account of overall wage bill, quality of squad, value of squad, league performance over a decade.

The reality is that mistakes may have been made in the past, even the recent past, but much good has been done as well. Everyone makes mistakes. Everyone. Just ask fans of Liverpool, ManU, Newcastle, Leeds, Villa, West Ham etc etc etc. But the reality (great concept) is also that the vast majority of people that know Kenwright (yes, KNOW HIM, work with him, for him) regard him as a good man. So, bizarre as it may seem to some on here, first-hand knowledge wins over third-hand, ill-informed and frequently pig-ignorant nonsense.

How many times do we have to listen to 8-year-old news? Everton have no money. Everton also do not have the debt of other clubs. Everton have not imploded and been relegated. Everton have not gone into administration and been snapped up by a porn king. Everton have not had 5 owners in one season and sold their entire team. Everton have not put ticket prices up by 200% in 3 years. Everton is not a circus. Everton (inexplicably to many on here) is admired by many in the game not just for on-field performance but for off-field management.

Now even those who don't despise Kenwright know we can do better. Everyone knows our marketing has been lacking and we've been way too slow in coming forward on many things. Many of us were upset by the Kings Dock not going ahead (I actually wrote to Kenwright to express my anger and irritation at his denial). But many of us also see all the other examples of new owners riding in on white horses and then hiding in another country while the club disintegrates.

To me, listening to this "playful banter" 85 times a year is much like listening to my two children. It doesn't matter how many times they are told something can't be afforded, or what the mitigation might be for not buying or doing something, they still want it and they still ask for it. It is a sign of intellectual and emotional development when they stop asking as they realise how boring it all sounds.

Grow up guys.

Ahhh Alan, once again it's ' Mistakes '
Not lies, maybe I'm missing something, and they both mean the same thing?

Nice rant, Alan. Here's some pointers for you:

1) To my knowledge, we have never ever featured a discussion of Bill Kenwright's birthday as a thread topic, so that's hardly the same theme as 563 preceding threads. If there had been any football worth speaking of this weekend, this topice would probably not have seen the light of day and that would probably still be the case.

2) You talk of disingenuous, yet you sweepingly deprecate every previous BK-related discussion with your disingenuous generalizations. The man is the Chairman of Everton Football Club and the fans have every right to raise issues of concern, especially failures, mistakes and lies of the past that are elsewhere conveniently swept under the carpet or simply denied.

3) Regarding Kenwright's purchase of shares in the club by remortgaging his house (is there any independent proof of that? Perhaps it's another one of Bill's little 'elaborations'?) Jay Harris has repeatedly raised a very worrying coincidence regarding the company debt, which jumped from £1m when BK took over, to a staggering £20M one year later ? strangely similar to the total cost of the club. But will ever hear the truth on that one? I doubt it. But if true, it puts Everton in exactly the same leveraged buyout boat as some the clubs you want to compare us with.

4) Talking of people "with the same story/complaint/criticism of Kenwright that they've already posted hundreds of times before, and which allegedly happened 8 years ago" ? isn't that exactly what you're doing in his defence? How many times have we heard the same old diatribe from you? Guess what? There are still people who ain't buying it. Still people who hear the lies and know them for what they are ? lies.

5) No matter how many times you bitch and moan on here about Evertonians discussing their Chairman, you ain't stopping that discussion. It is a valid area for concern and there are enough questions (far too many for a professionally run organization) to justify it in terms of both historic and current relevance. If that is something you personally do not like then I think you know what the right solution is.

One would hope that telling your kids to "grow up" is really working well as an educational tool in the Kirwin household.

Alan... Or is it Bill?

The electric shock gag was very funny, you must see that .

After a nano second,

A. We haven't been taken over,

B. We havent invested in the club,

C. The list of clubs who have out-performed us on the pitch is too long to mention.

D. We are saddled with huge debt with no assets, apart from players.

And your point is?

How about a nice Val Doonigan style aran jumper?

Michael, I imagine very few people want to stop "Evertonians discussing their Chairman". The concern, looking at what has been said above, is that this thread was not a discussion of our Chairman. It was plain and simply a free-for-all of petty, crude name-calling. Whatever you think of him, that just seems childish and downright nasty.

I'd take issue, therefore, with your claim that this thread is simply "a discussion of Bill Kenwright's birthday". As everybody is aware, it is simply an invitation to lay into him on a personal level, hence language like "cunt" and "twat" peppered throughout. I'd like to think we're above that, but evidently not.

Ciarán (#72) "How about a nice Val Doonigan style aran jumper?"

All things considered, I'd have to agree with that. It's the best solution to this difficult problem. After all, he'd look well in one of those. And you could always throw in a copy of "Paddy McGinty's Goat" for good measure.

Michael

1. Whatever the pretext for this article, the content was the same as the preceding 563.

2. I fully accept the right to raise issues and indeed have not only done so myself but have written to Kenwright over the Kings Dock debacle. It is not an issue of right and wrong, it s an issue of moving on and general maturity.

3. I agree with you. I too would like to know the details of this. However I think we also need to be careful. Are you seriously suggesting that Everton FC had only £1m of debt at the end of Johnson's reign? I suggest you re-check.

4. Defence? You mistake relativity for defence. Get back in the real world asap.

5. It's your website and, irrespective of this shite, it's excellent and I love it. Doesn't mean I am also not entitled to my opionion. This thread is bollocks and most of us know it.

And finally, my kids do not need to grow up. They are 7 (boy) and 5 (girl). Both are Evertonians & both wear Everton kits. They do not need to grow up and are never asked to. Fucking stupid comment.

Robert Daniels (or is it Benny from Crossroads) ? Tell me about C again. How long is that list exactly? You don't know what points are.

Ciaran - We've crossed but occasionally you cut through it. That was one such post.

And there it is!

"Grow up guys!"

Like the Manchester Evening News - a friend dropping in!

The world-weary, disinterested, above the puerile tittle-tattle voice of reason.

(congrats Robert - put the right bait out and you'll catch fish!).

But as usual Alan is whupped, NOT by anyone here I hasten to add but....by himself.

Still haven't figured out we're judged by words AND deeds eh Al?

Seriously Alan, do you realise how many times you have posted THAT before?

Not word-for-word but definitely..THAT.

It's like a kid wearing a blue scarf and telling everyone he's a United supporter (nb: not believable)

How many times you have written more or less the same thing, to criticize others for posting more or less the same thing?

Do you genuinely not see any inconsistency?

Maybe not, maybe you're so blinded by your own righteousness (and naturally of the wrongeousness (?) of those who disagree) that you don't.

After all, a few weeks back, you never saw any inconsistency in posting hundreds (thousands?) of words to say you couldn't be bothered getting involved and you have a life etc

And here's a (fairly obvious) question - why can't YOU let it go?

I'm honestly curious.

Why can't YOU resist?

As you can see, there are always plenty of people always ready to rush to Bill's aid when some slavering pig dog cage-rattler has a pop

Why aren't they enough?

You mention you have 2 kids - wouldn't the time you spent writing 'leave him alone' posts (that he'll never see) that have been better spent with them?

Ludo or...whatever kids do now?

Or watching telly?

Or doing anything else other than writing for the umteenth time, to tell us WE'RE (roll on the drums) repeating ourselves.

Don't get me wrong, personally I enjoy reading your stuff as I like to find the sleight-of-hand hidden amongst the 'apparently' open, honest 'why can't we just be adults' stuff.

In the above?

Well I loved how you attempted to sway things towards there being a choice only of those who PERSONALLY know him and the ill-informed, pig ignorant, etc blah.

"Oh no, I don't want to be thought of as pig-ignorant and the only other choice is...."

Good effort but.....we KNOW he lied (ie: WELL-informed).

I also like the lack of 'imo' before informing us we have the best squad in 25 years (so...that's a fact?)

Oh and I loved your (again nice use of world-weary tone) attempt to hint at a statute of limitations.

"8 years" you cried (oh the humanity!).

There is one question I CAN answer though.

You ask how long you must hear about 8 year old news.

Never again - it's your choice.

Now go dig that Ludo out.

Ho hum.

And still I wait for that list. You know, the one with content rather than froth. The one with a solution rather than a whinge. The one that shows us exactly which clubs we should be emanating.

Surely Robert Daniels can enlighten us. He reckons the list of teams who have outperformed us is too long to mention. Perhaps that's why he doesn't mention it :) Go on Robert, take one for the team, tell us the list.

I asked a similar question sometime back on a b o r i n g l y identical thread. On that occasion I asked what the Kenwright haters actually wanted. NOT what they don't want, but what they do want. I've had quicker responses from HMRC :)

Alan,

With respect, you said,

C.Outperform Everton where it matters (on the pitch).,

How about, Leicester, League Cup? Blackburn, ditto? Middlesboro, ditto,

All in the last ten years while we've won... fuck all.

Oh and I forgot about Chelsea, the Shite, Manure, Spurs, Pompey, Arsenal...

Is that enough points!

Ah, Eugene. If only you'd discovered content, and if only I could be arsed. Sadly neither, in this case, is true. But tragically even if it were, you'd then need to read the posts and consider both sides. Geddit?

Night.

Alan,

Yes you've probably had a quicker response off the tax man.

But it will still be quicker than Bill's search 24/7 and all that.

Ten years and counting.

Wow Eugene, when you calm down you should take a bit of time to read over your contribution to this page. With very little provocation, you've come across as a real nasty piece of work. Sure you're a lovely bloke, like, but you've done yourself no favours here.

Opinions are opinions and we're all entitled to them. Nobody is entitled to express them like that.

Do I 'geddit'?

Let's see, two more posts but...you can't be arsed.

Oh yes I DEFINITELY geddit.

A little boy in a blue scarf cheering for United.

Night.

Can't agree with that, Paul, Eugene's contributions are strongly satirical but not "nasty". What they make apparent is the ill-concealed malice that informs the pious and self-righteous indignant platitudes of "moral" discourse, which of course is something deeply mortifying to those of a bourgeois disposition.

Far from it, Tommy. What Eugene does is treat people like children when he doesn't agree with them. The whole "don't you get it yet?" tone leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

To be fair, Alan's last comment wasn't much better. No need for "geddit?" (although I suspect this was an attempt to mimic Eugene's own didactic "why doesn't everyone think like me?" style).

Maybe I'm old-fashioned, but I don't think message board discussions about FOOTBALL (just in case you'd forgotten what we're talking about here) should develop any differently than conversations in a pub. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't adopt an aggressive, mocking tone about somebody I didn't know - and I certainly wouldn't try to wind him up by talking about his kids. The same applies to any pro-BK posters who resort to similar tactics.

On the point of repetition (which, appropriately, appears again and again), well it's only to be expected, isn't it? Some people think BK is a liar - and they repeat it again and again. Some disagree - and they repeat their disagreement again and again. Both groups are entitled to do so. Neither should talk to the other as if they haven't got a brain of their own.

Tommy (#83), a brilliant succinct summary!

Have to agree with Tommy (82),Eugene please stop telling the truth as some on here prefer fairy tales and findthe truth offensive.

Well....I'll leave you lot......to um......GOODNIGHT!


(runs like fuck)

"What they make apparent is the ill-concealed malice that informs the pious and self-righteous indignant platitudes of "moral" discourse, which of course is something deeply mortifying to those of a bourgeois disposition. "

Can we not just get him the Val Doonican sweater as Ciarán suggested, and make do with that ?

Brendan,

You get the sweater,

Think Alans already got the goat.

Night all.

lol Tommy (83) classic.

On second thoughts Robert, maybe we should get him something deeply mortifying to those of a bourgeois disposition.

I know. What about the ill-concealed malice that informs the pious and self-righteous indignant platitudes of "moral" discourse?

Alan (#75)

1. Not so. The content of all our threads is unique and different. Stop telling porkies.

2. Playing the maturity card doesn't wash. Some Evertonians don't forget so easily ? and they certainly don't forget being lied to.

3. One of these upcoming winter nights, I suppose we could do the research via that Companies House website...

4. Sorry, not buying this "relativity" crap of yours. Sounds too much like an apologist mantra to justify your boring repetitions.

5. I don't appreciate you calling any of our threads "shite". Evertonians have opinions they want to air. The last thing they need is you speaking for a presumed majority. Just speak for yourself, please ? as everybody else on here does.

Has Toffeeweb turned into the Waltons ?

Saying goodnight to each other, dear me.

Excellent reply, Eugene.

Thankfully working down south, not many blues in this place, but proud to say three of us now. As I go on TW maybe once a month and always from work, which is normally a 13-hour day, I?m not entitled to contribute because you perceive me to have a good job? Considering the amount of time you spend on this site then I will use your own analogy I guess you must be unemployed?

Seriously, I hope that?s not true but your reply just sums up just how blinkered you are to the real world. I know nothing about you and the same in reverse, and I?m happy to say I?m nothing like what you perceive. I check EFC websites every day either in the morning or when I have a sandwich at my desk ? it?s the best therapy around and it?s my escapism from the BS of the job.

What I don?t like is when you attack BK personally; yes, criticism is acceptable and part of life but doing it with the aid of hindsight is always easy.

I will be getting up at 6:30 on Saturday with my 6-year-old son and doing a 530-mile round trip again because that?s what I do and, no matter what job anybody has, the feeling is the same. BK does the same and has taken a massive fiscal risk with his own estate; he is not evil or looking to kill us out of existence ? he is merely a dreamer who has taken on something he can't handle.

Yes, he will make a profit when he sells up but so will all the others. Until somebody else comes along, we are stuck with him. Challenge him by all means ? I have and had several hand written letters in return to difficult questions, I just wonder how many PL Chairman?s do that?

COYB 3 points on Saturday!!

So it's agreed then? We'll give Bill Alan and Eugene to play with...

Paul Foster.

Was I really nasty?

If so, why?

Was I just born..snotty?

Am I just a bit of a cunt?

Let's see shall we, lets have a look at the facts.

44 was my first post on this thread.

It was a response to David Hallwood's piece (40) and specifically to his point that the truth depended on how you look at it, or your 'point of view'.

If you read my response, you'll have seen David WASN'T called a wanker, a cunt or anything else.

It's was a straight forward piece about my interpretation and understanding of 'the truth'.

The first direct response to my post came in 48 from David himself, who put a counter-argument and finishes by telling me to 'fucking grow up'.

Post 56, Alan Williams (pro Bill) informed us "this site is monopolised by prats constantly posting the same bullshit".

(following the simplest of logic, I am one of these prats).

68 and Alan Kirwan is in full swing - we (those not prepared to call lies mistakes) are,"whingers posting nonsensical drivel" and our (my) views are "third-hand, ill-informed and frequently pig-ignorant nonsense".

NB: All this by the way ABSOLUTELY fine with me - happy to take it, happy to give it back.

Then you shove your oar in.

"You've come across like a nasty piece of work".

"You've done yourself no favours" (eh?)

"What Eugene does is treat people like children when he doesn't agree with them".

"It leaves a bad a taste in the mouth".

I stated recently that (despite what some might think) my first post on any thread is very rarely insulting or sarcastic, but if someone gets snotty, I'm not likely to respond with "Well I can't agree, but I respect your right to...".

I'm sure I'm not the only who has noticed there's a real smug, self-righteous tone to many posting on Bill's behalf.

They love to portray themselves as 'reasonable' and those with opposing views as rabid savages, but it's a thin veneer and as I have indicated, they usually let themselves down eventually and show their true colours.

So Paul - fuck off!

Tommy (#83) and almost anything that Michael has written here - please...don't patronise us (or me) by attempting to sound above your station. This is a pathetic post that has lead to a seemingly stupid set of responses.

the fact that we (as a collective) are even bullet pointing this post is obsurd.

To say that its 'okay' because we have never 'celebrated' BK's birthday before is also just as childish. This site, i always thought was intelligent, offering debate and opinions without jest (unlike some other Everton fan sites - and thats what this is...a fan site).

However I have to wonder if posts like this are the reason that the Everton media team give LOADS more time to other fan sites than they do this...

Everyone is entitled to their opinions...mine is that this is a very sad article made worse by the fact that the sites own editors are attempting to justify it.

You're absolutely right Jamie, everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

Here's mine..on yours.

Telling Tommy not to post "above your station" makes you sound like a Georgia plantation owner..in 1850.

If you were anti the initial post, why read every single post after it?

Sorry but that's just dumb.

I mean if you hated Coronation St, you wouldn't sit there watching it saying "this is awful...this is shocking...oh I hate this.." (would you?)

No - you'd switch over or go do something else.

What is it with people who read stuff on here then whine..

"Oh not THIS again!" Oh not him, can't stand him"

GO DO SOMETHING ELSE!!

People used to get furious with Tony Marsh and yet read every post - could never figure that out (their behaviour I mean, loved his stuff!)

Finally, you say "Everton media team give LOADS more time to other fan sites than they do this"

True.

Maybe TW should hold special Everton dinners (say 5 nights a week!) and we can all be bezzies with 'Bails' and 'Degsy Mount'.

Of course we'd have to toe the party line but fuck it - freedom of speech is overrated anyway...right?

Eugene (97). Spot on about Tony Marsh posts. They were always a good read and usually dripping with emotion.

Telling Tommy not to post "above your station" makes you sound like a Georgia plantation owner..in 1850.

I've just had to wipe coffee off my computer screen.

Michael

4. Sorry, not buying this "relativity" crap of yours. Sounds too much like an apologist mantra to justify your boring repetitions.

What? Which parallel universe do you inhabit where seeing things from a relative perspective is tantamount to being an apologist? Did you just make that up?

Sorry Michael. We can differ on anything, but your take on this point insults your own intelligence. You sound ridiculous. FYI, EVERYTHING is relative Michael.

As for boring repetitions, I'm numb with laughter with this from one of the flag carriers for the slag-Kenwright crew and never averse to jhaving the same thread, same posts & same words repeated ad infinitum.

Nonsense of a most impressive order.

Neal, I think the most embarrassing thing about the pro BK posts in this thread are the whitewashing they have attributed to anything anti BK. I pointed out jokingly at first his leading accolyte Daffy Dodd, and he has not posted but he and I have shared many a thead and not come to blows. Since then I responded to David Hallwood pointing out a number of BK's lies (yes they are lies not mistakes) and his failings as the head of Everton FC again restrained and pointing out to David that I didn't call him an apologist.

I also don't think Eugene has done anything apart from raise a grin for those who appreciate his dry humour and wit and retorted when he has been called out. As always with such a divisive figure as BK you appear to be castigated which ever side of the fence you sit. I met several chaps years ago at Glyndebourne (long story) who had the inside line on BK from their own professional dealings with him and they weren't positive at all (if I remember correctly it was along the lines of jumped up ticket tout) so the "I've met him/worked for/with him" arguments also have two sides.

Robert Daniels

Forgive me, where are Blackburn, Leicester and Middlesboro right now? Have you thought this crap through?

2 of them are in the 2nd division, on their knees. So in your warped little world a single Micky Mouse cup win 10 years ago and relegation, administration etc etc, triumphs over finishing 4, 5, 5, 6 & 7 in the premier league, regular European competition and an FA cup final does it?

So you're a supporter are you?

Sadly, in a thread full of crap there's always room for a final turd...or two...

Alan, play nice... if Robert wasn't a supporter then he wouldn't be on here now would he.

Yes. The 'You'll Never Walk Alone" track.

Can't help but get involved in this one. Alan, I see your point regarding Blackburn, Leicester and 'Boro and the fact that we have had good finishes in the league but those are in spite of Kenwright ? not because of him. Year after year, Moyes has had to sell players to fund transfers and juggle what he has to maintain this position. It seems that we are running faster and faster just to stand still. This can't be maintained indefinitely and once the inevitable happens and Rodwell is sold to fund next year's buying, where do we go?

Kenwright seems incapable of bringing in any investment into the club, there's no sign of anything happening on the stadium front, and the long-term future of the club doesn't bode well for success.

A birthday cake. The simplest things are always the best and most appreciated.

Alan,

I was merely pointing out that those three clubs have won a trophy in the last ten years when we haven't.

I notice you don't mention the other teams who definitely have out-performed us on the pitch: the Shite, Mancs, Chelski, Spurs, Arsenal ? all the teams we used to be on a par with untill your hero turned us into a second-rate club.Take one for the team and admit that you are wrong, and those teams I've just mentioned have out performed us, as you said, on the pitch.

Oh and if you would like to meet me after a home game, anytime soon, we can discuss your reference of loyalty to the blues, please let me know, cos I'd love to meet you,

Thanks,

Will this get larger than the Gosling thread?

I am interested in Jamie's comment (#97.) What was meant by, "attempting to sound above your station"? Did you mean level of education? Level of intelligence? Class?

Oh dear. It's been a while since I've been on this site and even longer since I've actually posted a response. This thread has just reminded me why.

When I saw the excerpt on the mailbag section of the home page I had a feeling that it was intended to invite criticism of our colourful chairman.

People are entitled to their opinions either way, but it's not as if BK had actually recently come out with one of his BS jems. What's provoked this? Ah yes, it's the bloke's birthday. Well the evil fucker deserves it then. FFS

Ok so both sides are often guilty of the same faults in the so called debate (for debate read vitriolic row) but for me the issue is the content of the original post and it's relevance or worth. No offence to Robert personally, I don't know the guy and I'm sure he's as passionate a fan as anybody, but come on Robert, you know what your agenda was and you knew what you were starting.

When BK comes out with some of the shit he talks then I expect these types of posts (while they still leave a bad taste in the mouth due to the very personal nature of many of the insults) but it's just the guy's birthday, that's all!!

I find it all a bit embarrassing to be honest. Can't wait for the football discussions to start again.

COYB

'Attempting to sound above your station?'

Yes, I can just see it after Saturday's match.

Reporter: " Wayne, what did you think of the Everton fans booing you during the game?"

Rooney: " What they make apparent is the ill-concealed malice that informs the pious and self-righteous indignant platitudes of "moral" discourse, which of course is something deeply mortifying to those of a bourgeois disposition."

"Where's me coat?"

Neil,

I started the thread because it was Bill's birthday and thought, rightly or wrongly, that it might be quite funny. I did think there would be a few remarks that might be near the knuckle, but would all just be lighthearted banter.

I have been on ToffeeWeb now for over a year, and I haven't read past articles or threads, I don't know people's views, just by their names, which it seems a lot do.

I am not stupid enough to question one's loyalties, as we wouldnt be here, would we? I find this site to be the most informative, without being under the influences or bias of anyone concerned with the club,

This is by no means an apology for starting this thread, but people are looking for ulterior motives, ie, with the sole intention of ridicule on BKs behalf, as the reason. I can assure you, it was not.

If anything, I underestimated the depth of feelings over Bill. My own views on his birthday are, I couldn't give a toss; my views on him the man are, I couldn't give a toss. But as the person who runs my beloved Blues, he makes me want to throw up.

Anyway Neil, no offence taken, it was a fair comment you made, 3 pts Saturday please,

COYBs

Robert #109
"Oh and if you would like to meet me after a home game, anytime soon, we can discuss your reference of loyalty to the blues, please let me know, cos I'd love to meet you,"

You really shouldn't be posting this late when you have school tomorrow.

Jesus Brendan got a good 19 hours there; I'll just get back to my station now Mista Jamie.
Guess it ain't malicious when the cannonade is fired from the moral high ground. Ill-nature coursing through exemplum veins. There's another day and a half Big B.

That's easy for you to say Tommy.

Hahahah Eugene just in the door got exactly the reaction I was looking for I'm just worried about the souls of all the toffeeweb angels, what with them stooping to employ the horrid machinations of the devils and all that

Brendan #112 - quality