The Mail Bag
Lack of Ambition?
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I rarely go to away games but Blackpool was too near to ignore. Like most I came back down the M6 feeling we had lost two points rather than gaining one. Results like this do pose the question as to whether we shall EVER win a trophy or, indeed, EVER be in serious contention so to do.
Personally, I`m a pragmatist and happy to see us comfortably in mid-table or above but I do accept that many of us aspire to greater things. Do they expect too much or is it my lack of ambition that lets the Club off too lightly?
Richard Dodd, Posted 07/11/2010 at
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I have serious worries as to your mental state, you seem to switch at the drop of a hat (or point) between uber partylineista to, will we EVER win a trophy?
While the trophy question is foremost in a lot of minds, including a number of punters who have, if they are honest with them selves, over the last 50 yrs seen only EIGHT trophies and none for the last 15 yrs.
Welcome to Evertonians (not) Anonymous.
Hi, my name's Derek, I have been an addict for 52 yrs.
ps: Have you tried any sort of Lithium based meds?
44 years a supporter and I've no more idea now than I had 20 years ago.
At one time, I thought we tried to play reasonable football (now characterised by some as "fancy dan" stuff) and to make a reasonable attempt at winning trophies.
Now? It all seems a rather disheartening, pointless exercise in spleen venting, nostalgia, and self-delusion on a massive scale.
As soon as I start reading a post beginning something like "We are a massive club and we deserve ..." I begin to wonder why we still harp on about Dixie, Bally and Alex. If we're so maqssive, why haven't we got a pantheon of heroes much greater than these four oft repeated names?
The only answer I can come up with is that we have a much longer tradition of ultra cautious boards of directors than we do of trophy winners.
Richard ... surely if we are to be content with mediocrity (and, de facto, that seems to be the case) we are heading in the direction of a Preston or Leeds ... "We used to be good but now we're, umm, well, you know, not good". If that's the case, wind the bloody club up and let's piss off to Tranmere.
I want EFC to compete, with a board, which for once since it built the bloody ground, actually prepares for progress and kicks it into gear.
Under BK, most definitely not. Caution is the mandate... Premier League survival at all costs. What we see on the pitch is a mere symptom of a chronically ill club with Bill Kenwright 'at the helm'.
I'm not expecting a billionaire nor overnight success... nor would I want us to achieve it through such means. What is not too much to expect is honesty and a plan... a very basic business plan to slowly move us forward as a business and eventually provide for the manager. I don't see any evidence of this existing under the current board and if it does, we should be privvy to it.
I am amazed that the banners questioning BK haven't been unfurled by the 100s. We are both the most passionate/loyal and apathetic fans in the land. We are the club's current custodians... what should we ask of ourselves??????
We even engineered an early exit from the Carling Cup to ensure there was no fixture pileup. The opportunity is unlikely to occur again ? and if we fail, Moyes must go.
For once I completely agree it is these results that prove we will never win anything under the current set up. With Moyes and Kenwright, it is likely we'll never go down and the bad days of being perrenial relegation fodder are behind us. But this is as good as it gets. This result proves we'll always be around 8th. The odd season we might just nip into 7th and compete in Europe or we might get a good cup run, and other seasons we'll around 10th or 11th. Without more money and a more adventurous manager this is where we are.
I think though, Richard most are pragmatists like you because no one really seems that arsed that we just make up the numbers now.
When are going to win a trophey? Leaving out the big four (what was, now is three) only Blackburn, Boro and Portsmouth have won trophies... one cup a peice. So it's not an Everton thing, it's football failing itself in its current set up.
We question our team and Moyes after all our pre-season bravado, and now Man City and Spurs who we all started worrying about are losing to crap sides we somehow think we're miles behind them. Wrong.
We're threatening the top 4. Man Utd have the biggest turnover in the world, Chelsea and City have BILLIONAIRE owners and hundred million transfer budgets, Arsenal play the best football since... Brazil, and Moyes has us up there season after season, one of only two managers to break the top 4.
Some think Moyes hinders our potential to the point where they want him to go, I think he can break into the CL.
I don't care what position we are in right now, but 3 points off 4th after ten games, I'd have taken. We're obviously improving and anyone who looks down the table rather than up is more than likely anti-Moyes. And what really annoys me about them is that they think ridding the club of Moyes is a proactive move to push us on when it is anything but. Football is about opinions, and a lot of them are bollocks.
We're going backwards, there are better players in the Championship and Beckford wasn't one of them. Another season of mediocrity at best, how long have we got to tolerate this under-achievement? Personally I'm sick to fuckin' death of it, it's too frustrating to watch and (as the recession kicks in) about to become too expensive to justify.
ps: Arteta needs to take a long hard look at his performances and his commitment, he got his payrise so let's see the payback!
The fact is money talks and we don't have any (and if I'm wrong and it's not a fact, why have the two richest teams basically shared it in recent seasons?).
Season's will come and go, we'll over-achieve, we'll under-achieve, but we won't get near a title.
City have a chance now because (like Chelsea) they have an owner who'll throw cash at it until they do.
As for them and Arsenal, can't see either of them winning it either (but they'll probably do better than us).
Fucking depressing.
Why oh why does Moyes not get his team to take control of the game right from the off instead of coming out negative and ultra-cautious, giving up enormous amounts of space in midfield to teams with clever nippy players like Blackpool?
The beginning of each half was woeful. This 4-5-1 formation stinks unless you have a lot of speed and Everton don't. It is like watching paint dry. The Blues had 20 attempts at goal and only 6 on target, which tells you about our attacking potency.
Okay we are now undefeated in 6 but, let's face it, we are a middle-of-the-table side and nothing more with this squad and these tactics. One Derby match win does not make a season.
Bolton coming up on Wednesday and the best we may get is another scrappy 1-0 win if we are lucky.
Almost two and half thousand blues at Blackpool yesterday and, due to demand, several mates (family and friends) could not get themselves match tickets. If you care so little and you are happy with mid-table boredom, why the fuck do you go? Why not give your ticket to a supporter who wants more than you, a supporter who see's a match more than an exercise in ambition management?
At the end of the day, you can watch our 3 minutes on MotD, read the Sunday sports rags ? you can even pop a post or two to TW. All this should just about cover your ambition regarding Everton.
Blackpool are a team we need to be attacking and beating; instead, we wait until it's too late to go attacking and run out of time to get the all important goal. The players need to be doing more to earn their money, as they keep failing to win against poor teams who have players on a fraction of their wages.
Can anyone clarify if Saha has scored since signing his new contract? I guessed so. How much are we paying him? We can't afford to be paying players like him so much money, half the time he's injured and then he misses glorious chances like yesterday and he can't hold the ball up like the Yak, hence the late rally from Blackpool yesterday.
There are also players who seem undroppable in the eyes of Moyes, like Sylvain Distin, who was unsuprisngly clowning around yesterday when he gave the ball away in the build up to the Blackpool free kick for the first goal. Moyes also continually gives the likes of Beckford a run from the bench and never gives Gueye a chance who might actually gives us a bit of width and quality out wide. I recall Moyes saying this lad is our secret weapon? Why not play him then?
This is what DM told the BBC:
"In the last 10 to 15 minutes Blackpool put us under pressure. We showed a lot of character but we started badly. We made the wrong decision too many times."
Hardly apologist stuff, is it? I think Moyes was as disappointed as the rest of us with the result and aspect of the performance.
Blackpool have given a lot of sides a good game this season and I think it was a decent point for us yesterday based on how the match panned out. Their secret is that they play with no fear ? their fans are just happy to be in the PL and whatever happens they will back them. To read many of the comments on TW, it's clear many Blues don't feel the same.
I don't think Everton's recent failings, especially at GP, have been simply down to "negative" tactics by Moyes ? even the best players will fail to thrive if a bad half or two is greeted by grumbles from the fans.
It's all a case of expectations ? whatever the likes of Blackpool do this season, their fans will go with it, while for many Evertonians anything less than glory (despite the huge sums available to our rivals) is unacceptable.
Anyone who really thinks we have a chance of seriously competing at the top end without a new sugar daddy (a situation which presents its own very real risks) is kidding themselves.
I for one think Moyes has done a fine job overall with scant resources. Sure he's had his fair share of bad buys but then who hasn't?
Arsenal lost at home to Newcastle today. Do you hear their fans calling for the manager to be sacked? No. I say better the devil you know... and I'm happy to argue the toss with those who say different.
Joe, we will finish above Newcastle this year. And Eugene you are absolutely correct. Of course you are.
"And Eugene you are absolutely correct. Of course you are".
Now I'm sure you saw this as withering sarcasm, but unfortunately, it doesn't tell me or anyone else why specifically WHY you think I might be wrong.
I mean if we all respond as you have, every opinion posted would be followed by "Yeah RIGHT!" or "Duurr!!!" or "That's what YOU say!"
So here's a tip.
If you would like to counter anything I've said, why not simply do so and give your reasons.
Couple of things to keep in mind.
1) My post was in the main opinion and what I stated as fact was backed up.
2) People can't see you tutting or raising your eyebrows on TW.
So it isn't a lack of ambition, it's simply a lack of cash to be able to buy someone like that and pay him on a par with what he'd get from one of the 'big (or rich) clubs'
So don't fret about ambition; revel in mid table obscurity with the odd good win to raise the false dawns. That's all there is.
Moyesy said: "It wasn't a great game for Evertonians and not for the Everton manager that's for sure.
We abused a great opportunity to take more than one point."
We got into the final third and couldn't finish. We had two one-on-ones with the goalkeeper and hardly made him make a save.
I thought with the way we played that we were going to really get what we deserved because we made so many bad decisions on the field."
I was disappointed at times with what the players did today.
This was a chance for us and if we're really ambitious then I see this as us not taking our chance today."
There are easily 4 teams equipped to finish above us; until we can get in strikers to SCORE goals, then that challenge to fourth may not take place for some while yet. Some perspective is severely needed on here.
Now I know he can be a class act and he scored against United and the Shite but it's the games against the Stokes and the West Broms that are the bread and butter games that need someone to dictate, grab the win and kill off the game the way Chelsea, United, Arsenal and even Liverpool do when they play away from home. Arteta should be, with his ability, running the show from the 1st minute, but he never gets subbed off when he's had a bad one.
Also Tim Howard's mistakes out of position for the free kick and lining up the wall) have cost us 7 points this season, yet he'll be starting next week with the Best Little Spaniard we know in midfield with no fear of getting dropped. If Bily started and had a stinker, he'd be on the bench the following week.
Everyone is looking for Jack to come back and battle with Fellaini and Johnny for a place but why can't he come in for Mikky and maybe shake him up to start pulling his finger out against the lesser teams? No-one is too good to be axed when playing shite!!
And (although they're all ludicrously overpaid) Arteta's performances recently will have done nothing to weaken Pienaaar's argument that he should be on the same money.
Arteta reminds me so much of Martin Dobson.
Good feet, smart, canny, brilliant when in the mood, but too often leaves you feeling..um.. 'unsatisfied.
Look at the Sky teams forwards
ManUre - Rooney, Beerbatov
Chelski - Drogba
RedShite - Torres
Citteh - Tevez, Abebeyor
Arsenil - Errmmmm, Brentner!!!! but look at the midfield
Us - Yak & Saha, one unfit and the other a sick note.
Never gonna challenge for a top 4 place without a top class stricker. It's that simple. Top strikers can have a stinker for 88 minutes then bang in a brace to win a game. We have Saha who should have buried his chance yesterday but has probably been in the doctor's office for so long he has forgotten how to play football and then we have Pienaar who can't even hit a ball with any semblance of power....who wants a bumper deal.....
Well at least you're honest but probably not in the best position to pass judgement on our entire season.
If all Everton supporters in Liverpool were to follow your model of support then we'll never have any money and never win nor challenge for the league.
One problem for me, Heitinga. If Rodwell isn't ready to start, then put Areta there as the holding guy, that leaves an option to play Saha and Yakubu with Cahill dropping back slightly. Fellaini is a big miss and we've yet to see how Arteta and the big lad will play together.
The team is ticking over nicely and are well capable of moving up a couple of gears as the season progress.
Thank you for your comment and you are right.
The easy subjects of critisism are always there but why o why do some get away with it?
Senor 75 grand (copied from another poster) Saha (Great but either lazy or injured or CBA) Johnny (see other comments) (BTW-He is too small for CB) Billy (sadly-but he just does not do it week in week out)
Bin the lot save the wages, cash in (if we can) and sort a few issues we have
Pip Jags Distin Baines
Jack Fella
Coleman Timmy Pienaar
Yak
A team that will not be beat for effort, a blend of youth and experience.
Back up of TH JB and some other committeds like LO and we will be well positioned at the end of the season.
You cock, I was agreeing with you.
Read through previous posts I have made on here and you will see that I have consistently made comments that are in agreement with the point you made about the finances.
Of course what you said seems, to me, to be blatently obvious, but to many on here it seems irrelevant or even wrong. I'm not one of them.
I await an apology. And please don't feel the need to share any more unwanted tips. It's quite annoying.
Ian Smitham - Hibbert is crap, Osman is a decent player but physically weak and dont forget its a squad that we need. 2 of the players mentioned in your starting 11 are not yet match fit and a third is in a contract dispute and will probably sign for someone else in January.
Andy - he may not have played well against Blackpool but many of the games you mentioned before were when the whole team struggled - any problems with Arteta's recent performances against Stoke, Liverpool, Birmingham, Fulham or the games against Villa and Utd before that?
I couldn't disagree more with your posts and hope that he proves you wrong on Wednesday!
Please accept my unreserved apology.
I was thrown by the second "of course you are".
On a completely unrelated matter, do Sayers do humble pies?
At the risk of repeating myself, I know he is a class act but he's got to step up a gear and start leading and dictating play more than he has been; if he doesn't perform, there's no reason why he shouldn't be subbed or benched just because he's a "superstar".
Apart from the odd cross field pass, he is garbage. I would gladly sell him in January if we could use the money to buy a half decent striker.
Baines should be given corner/free kick duties until he can significantly improve; why can no-one else in our team take a free kick? They don't do anything else all week bar from play with footballs... even I could cross beyond the first man with a bit of pace and I was a drunken amateur FFS!
I think you've found something there in your question. Dodd always backs BK and DM come what may plus the fact he can get away game tickets just like that must mean he works for the club.
It would explain his insanity.
This, methinks may be our (slight) lack of ambition combined with complacency where we are prepared to hold onto a point rather than go for all three.
I just hope we bust the back of the net a few times on Wednesday against Bolton because if we don't we'll find ourselves in reverse gear again as this years PL is so tight.
Individual errors are costing us this season and as usual we seem to be one of the most unluckiest teams, in that when an opposing team manage to get a shot on target, it usual goes in. 2 shots on target and 2 goals was the stat that stuck in my mind at the 75-minute stage. Sickening, it is.
We have been plagued by blatant defensive errors from the first game and the Blackpool game was no exception. We simply do not have the steel in midfield and when it's left to Heitinga he far too often gets penalised. Everytime Blackpool got in our half they looked dangerous as Everton back-pedalled without putting in a challenge.
The misses by Pienaar and Saha were inexcusable. The good thing is that we are on an unbeaten run for what it is worth and with 2 home games coming up maybe we can hope to play better and get 6 points. We need to get some wins as our only real achievement this season is the Derby win and 2 minutes of glory against Manure.
If anyone's post is confused then its yours ? "Will Everton ever win anything?" and then in the next sentence "I`m a pragmatist and happy to see us comfortably in mid-table." With us finishing 5th in 2 consecutive seasons plus 8th last season, your comfortable mid-table finish would represent a decline ? would it not?
Dropping Arteta and Howard if nothing else would provide a reality check for both, and hopefully provide the kick up the arse they most defo need. Too many players seem happy to accept being average will get them on the following week's teamsheet, when realistically they should be playing in fear of their starting roles week on week.
Unfortunately DM has his favourites that will start every game, irrespective of how they perform, and this is why we sit in mid-table. I also don't see this changing anytime soon, so, whilst we have our so-called star players underperforming in the majority of our games this season, don't expect any change to the set-up of the first 11 as you and me may be waiting for a while to come.
Graciously accepted, Eugene. The 'of course' was in recognition of obviousness that is for some reason, not recognised by the masses.
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1 Posted 07/11/2010 at 10:11:49
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What frustates me, a supporter of 40 years, is Everton's lack of application. This squad is definitely as capable as any callenging for 4th place. Such a missed opportunity yesterday ? we could have been fifth and fighting... Alas, we are mid table and a win by Liverpool today will see them above us, and it would be just like them to bother to turn up today wouldn't it?