The Mail Bag
Let's Get A Grip
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After much deliberation I have decided to post on here for the first time in a while, reading some of the comments from fans is pretty astonishing really.
After missing only one match this season, I too am disappointed with the result on Saturday: we hammered Blackpool and lacked that real cutting edge in front of goal (plus I am never ever watching MotD after the shocking way they showed the highlights).
Let's for 1 minute look on the brightside: we haven?t lost a game in 6, we?re playing some lovely football and are only a win away from 5th place... happy days. Yes, I agree we?re not going to win the league any time soon but the suggestions to get rid of Moyes are looney ? the man has single handedly turned round the fortunes of this football club and made us what we are today. The pessimists amongst us will say he?s taken us as far as we can go; others will cry out for investment (why we?ve all seen where that gets you, a la Liverpool).
We are a well run club with a fantastic manager, a good squad, and the foundations for a very bright future. I love the Blues more than anything in my life as my missus often says but I get upset when fellow Blues are so down in the dumps. Let's get a grip, club together, and get 6 points form Bolton and Arsenal. COYB!!!!!!
Mikey John, Posted 09/11/2010 at 12:46:44
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Agree with pretty much everything you say there, Mikey.
Am I the only one who left the game on Sat not too disappointed?
On paper, yes, Blackpool are a side that we should be beating every day of the week. On Saturday I saw a well fought game by both teams and thought Blackpool fully deserved their point. This is a team that has taken points off an impressive West Brom and an admittedly lacklustre Liverpool. They were also very unlucky not to take three points off Manchester City.
Anyone who watched Newcastle's Allardyce-esque study in boredom on Sunday must agree that you should applaud Blackpool and West Brom for actually playing football. Yet, reading the papers, you'd think Andy Carroll was Pele.
Although we should have picked up a win, I don't see it as the damning indictment as most people I have spoken to do.
Maybe I'm wrong.
Am I the only one who left the game on Sat not too disappointed?
On paper, yes, Blackpool are a side that we should be beating every day of the week. On Saturday I saw a well fought game by both teams and thought Blackpool fully deserved their point. This is a team that has taken points off an impressive West Brom and an admittedly lacklustre Liverpool. They were also very unlucky not to take three points off Manchester City.
Anyone who watched Newcastle's Allardyce-esque study in boredom on Sunday must agree that you should applaud Blackpool and West Brom for actually playing football. Yet, reading the papers, you'd think Andy Carroll was Pele.
Although we should have picked up a win, I don't see it as the damning indictment as most people I have spoken to do.
Maybe I'm wrong.
Mikey,
your sentiment is spot on we do all need to pull together and get behind the team and make Goodison rock.
However there is quite a lot of disenchantment with Billy's bullshit and our inability to finance what everyone can see is required for us to compete and that is a quality goalscorer, a quality rm who can also chip in with goals and a quality left sided CB who can also cover Bainesy if he gets injured.
That concern or anxiety holds back certain supporters from becoming too excited and although your argument that we are only one win from the top 5 is technically correct (it would have to be a 5-0 win with the others losing) if we use the same argument we are only one loss from the bottom 5 so we could go either way.
I do believe we are playing better football this season but with 4-5-1 you have to have goal scoring MF players and we just havent.
How many goals can you see Pienaar, Arteta or Heitiga score in a season.
Billy can score but is such a disaster for the other 89 minutes we cant afford to play him and Ossie seems to have lost his shooting boots this year as well as now being injured for a few months.
The Everton management must realise that all the teams are cancelling each other out now with the exception of those that can score goals and until we rectify that we will continue to languish IMO.
your sentiment is spot on we do all need to pull together and get behind the team and make Goodison rock.
However there is quite a lot of disenchantment with Billy's bullshit and our inability to finance what everyone can see is required for us to compete and that is a quality goalscorer, a quality rm who can also chip in with goals and a quality left sided CB who can also cover Bainesy if he gets injured.
That concern or anxiety holds back certain supporters from becoming too excited and although your argument that we are only one win from the top 5 is technically correct (it would have to be a 5-0 win with the others losing) if we use the same argument we are only one loss from the bottom 5 so we could go either way.
I do believe we are playing better football this season but with 4-5-1 you have to have goal scoring MF players and we just havent.
How many goals can you see Pienaar, Arteta or Heitiga score in a season.
Billy can score but is such a disaster for the other 89 minutes we cant afford to play him and Ossie seems to have lost his shooting boots this year as well as now being injured for a few months.
The Everton management must realise that all the teams are cancelling each other out now with the exception of those that can score goals and until we rectify that we will continue to languish IMO.
Firstly Lee, I understand your concern but surely if we get behind the team and show those players how much they mean to us then they won't want to leave, happy players will go hand in hand with success on the pitch (I hope).
Ian ? Blackpool played nice football; I am not quick to fault Moyes but I think taking Yak and Jonny off let them back into the game; however, you're right ? a point is better than a loss.
Jay ? Glad you agree and it's true that it could swing both ways; however, I guess what I was trying to get across with my point was a win Wednesday and even a point Sunday and the outlook will surely not look so bleak in the eyes of many! I believe we're good enough to beat Arsenal and I will be SCREAMING AT THE TOP OF MY LUNGS tomorrow and Sunday to get behind the boys and spur them onto victory and about that shower of WEDSHITE HAHAHA COYB!!
Ian ? Blackpool played nice football; I am not quick to fault Moyes but I think taking Yak and Jonny off let them back into the game; however, you're right ? a point is better than a loss.
Jay ? Glad you agree and it's true that it could swing both ways; however, I guess what I was trying to get across with my point was a win Wednesday and even a point Sunday and the outlook will surely not look so bleak in the eyes of many! I believe we're good enough to beat Arsenal and I will be SCREAMING AT THE TOP OF MY LUNGS tomorrow and Sunday to get behind the boys and spur them onto victory and about that shower of WEDSHITE HAHAHA COYB!!
Our squad is not aging. If anything we must a third of our squad under 25?
We have some of the the best youth prosepects in country in terms of Rodwell, Barkley, Duffy, Coleman (sure there's more) etc. With experience it is a great mix.
Our best players are either in their prime or approaching. By the time they retire, our youngsters will be in their prime (approaching).
We're in a great position.
We have some of the the best youth prosepects in country in terms of Rodwell, Barkley, Duffy, Coleman (sure there's more) etc. With experience it is a great mix.
Our best players are either in their prime or approaching. By the time they retire, our youngsters will be in their prime (approaching).
We're in a great position.
Well done, Mikey; good article.
As long as we continue to play proper joined-up football (that seems to be the common expression these days) and not not revert to hoofball i.e. Metalist in the Uefa Cup, then I am a happy camper too.
As long as we continue to play proper joined-up football (that seems to be the common expression these days) and not not revert to hoofball i.e. Metalist in the Uefa Cup, then I am a happy camper too.
Gonna be doing a bit of additonal camping on black ops tonight too... :-)
BTW ? where is that Tony geezer? You know, the one that always goes crazy ? anyone seen or heared of him lately? I don't think I have seen one of his articles for over a year?
3 points away from fifth position? We're also 2 points away from being fifth from bottom. As for being 'unbeaten in six', we've also only managed to scrape three wins out of eleven thus far.
There's no real indication of how the season is going to pan out yet but, as I'm a 'pessimist', I certainly wouldn't proclaim these to be 'happy days'.
As for your assertion that we're a well run club? Fuck me, where do I start?
There's no real indication of how the season is going to pan out yet but, as I'm a 'pessimist', I certainly wouldn't proclaim these to be 'happy days'.
As for your assertion that we're a well run club? Fuck me, where do I start?
Glad to see some positivity back in the ranks! Look at that shower of shite from across the park!!! Proud to be a Blue and to have our souls in tact!
A rapidly aging squad? ? is our team aging faster than anyone else? Should we blame the medical staff for not using Oil of Ulay during a massage? Is there some sort of anti-ageing process out there we don't know about?
Arsene Wenger seems to be trying something for himself, which granted, does wonders for the ego but not much else. Maybe we haven't put the hour back at Goodison but surely that won't age us that much... I think the squad has a good mix and no-one looks to have cause for a free TV licence just yet.
Great comments, Mikey, I'll be looking for you on a white charger with bugle blowing Z-Cars as you rally the troops!!
Arsene Wenger seems to be trying something for himself, which granted, does wonders for the ego but not much else. Maybe we haven't put the hour back at Goodison but surely that won't age us that much... I think the squad has a good mix and no-one looks to have cause for a free TV licence just yet.
Great comments, Mikey, I'll be looking for you on a white charger with bugle blowing Z-Cars as you rally the troops!!
Our goal-scoring midfielder is just now returning, step up Jack Rodwell and set the Premier League alight!
"..surely if we get behind the team and show those players how much they mean to us then they won't want to leave.."
I'm sorry but that is possibly the most naive statement I have heard for a long time. You really believe players remain at a club out of loyalty to the fans? What about trivial things like vastly improved wages, challenging for major honours, Champions League football etc???
I'm sorry but that is possibly the most naive statement I have heard for a long time. You really believe players remain at a club out of loyalty to the fans? What about trivial things like vastly improved wages, challenging for major honours, Champions League football etc???
John, Not all players are the same, Maybe i worded it wrong maybe if we ALL try and make Everton special again then surely it would help with success on the pitch, everyone can play thier role in making us great again. I am just trying to be positive.
Pitiful, Mikey. I can't decide which comment is the more ludicrous : "... suggestions to get rid of Moyes are looney ..." or "We are a well run club ..."!
I like Moyes but I don't believe he's a winner. His time at Everton will most likely be the high point of his mangerial career & there'll be no trophies to show for it - sadly, because he deserves at least one. So, although now may or may not be the best moment to act, at some point he must be replaced if we harbour any ambition to ever again win anything.
Just because we don't carry debts equivalent to the Greek national debt, that doesn't mean the club is well run. Unfortunately we seem to have a Board happy to tick over in mediocrity, seemingly awaiting the arrival of their return on "investment".
I like Moyes but I don't believe he's a winner. His time at Everton will most likely be the high point of his mangerial career & there'll be no trophies to show for it - sadly, because he deserves at least one. So, although now may or may not be the best moment to act, at some point he must be replaced if we harbour any ambition to ever again win anything.
Just because we don't carry debts equivalent to the Greek national debt, that doesn't mean the club is well run. Unfortunately we seem to have a Board happy to tick over in mediocrity, seemingly awaiting the arrival of their return on "investment".
"A rapidly aging squad? ? is our team aging faster than anyone else? Should we blame the medical staff for not using Oil of Ulay during a massage? Is there some sort of anti-ageing process out there we don't know about?"
Exactly what I thought. Is this the ultimate in pessimism or what?! Our squad is aging at exactly the same rate as everyone else's, and its not particularly old.
Exactly what I thought. Is this the ultimate in pessimism or what?! Our squad is aging at exactly the same rate as everyone else's, and its not particularly old.
Like me, it seems most would settle for eighth again ? my lack of ambition seems to be catching on!
Great comments on the "rapidly aging squad" line. Sums up the bizarre kind of negativity football fans are prone to - completely devoid of any rational thought.
Optimists are often accused of seeing all-things-Everton through blue-tinted spectacles. Maybe so. But there's no doubt the pessimists have opted for those shocking reactor lights - you know, the ones that go a kind of shitty brown as soon as the sun comes out.
Optimists are often accused of seeing all-things-Everton through blue-tinted spectacles. Maybe so. But there's no doubt the pessimists have opted for those shocking reactor lights - you know, the ones that go a kind of shitty brown as soon as the sun comes out.
Other teams will also have aging players, the big difference is, the top teams will be able to spend huge amounts to replace those aging players, whereas we won't.
Lack of investment continues to hold us back. And just because the Shite invested poorly does not condemn all investment as dysfunctional. Faulty logic there.
However, of course I do agree with the importance of getting behind the team.
However, of course I do agree with the importance of getting behind the team.
John Daley, (6) what about unbeaten in the next six. WHERE do you think we will then be !!
Yours (Jon the twighlight Zone)
Do de doo doo do de doo doo.....
Yours (Jon the twighlight Zone)
Do de doo doo do de doo doo.....
Mike Allison (15) Because your worth it.
Brian, you may have hit on something. All the players Moyes has signed are really young and don't have a chance of first team football.
At some point all our team will be over the hill and Moyes will defo be doing a "Sir Alex." This is what Moyes is looking at. I have slagged Moyes off in numerous posts in the past. What I see now, is all the players that Moyes is getting together, is for the future. We saw this in the 90s at Old Trafford.
Patience is a virtue and I think Moyes is doing this now. Look at all the players that Moyes has signed, they are all young. This is what we all have to look forward to. If I'm right then the future looks good. If wrong then it's an idea that's failed to work.
But for me, whatever happens, I'll still love my club.
At some point all our team will be over the hill and Moyes will defo be doing a "Sir Alex." This is what Moyes is looking at. I have slagged Moyes off in numerous posts in the past. What I see now, is all the players that Moyes is getting together, is for the future. We saw this in the 90s at Old Trafford.
Patience is a virtue and I think Moyes is doing this now. Look at all the players that Moyes has signed, they are all young. This is what we all have to look forward to. If I'm right then the future looks good. If wrong then it's an idea that's failed to work.
But for me, whatever happens, I'll still love my club.
So..er..basically 'turn that frown into a smile, I love Everton, hate Match Of The Day, love Moyes, COYB!'
I'm reminded of Steve Martin's bad-tempered speech to John Candy, in the motel, in the film Trains, Planes and Automobiles.
I'm reminded of Steve Martin's bad-tempered speech to John Candy, in the motel, in the film Trains, Planes and Automobiles.
Congratulations Mikey, you stated on Toffeeweb what's obvious to everyone else in football, that we have a fantastic manager working miracles with what he's got, and you didn't get one accusation of being an "acolyte" or an "apologist" for Moyes.
Must be something of a record.
Must be something of a record.
Doddy, you're flip-floping again, get back on the Lithium.
Every game is obviously big but in particular the next 2... if we can get 6 points from the next two home games then we will find ourselves in the top 5 or 6 and a real chance to attack the top 4.
Anything less than 4 and I fear we will set the tone for a mid-table Christmas.
Anything less than 4 and I fear we will set the tone for a mid-table Christmas.
It's an interesting league this year, that's for sure. If we win tonight we go above Spuds, the new media darlings.
My personal view of the season so far is that we have played okay-ish, had a little slice of luck in some games and some horrendous luck in others. Overall it has been a shitty start in my eyes but we could go above the Champions League side tonight and if luck goes our way we could be 6th.
As I said, strange.
My personal view of the season so far is that we have played okay-ish, had a little slice of luck in some games and some horrendous luck in others. Overall it has been a shitty start in my eyes but we could go above the Champions League side tonight and if luck goes our way we could be 6th.
As I said, strange.
Moyes has turned us into what we are today? What exactly is that? An average team who repeatedly stuggle to win against poor teams we should be beating time and time again. If we are going to achieve something we need to be winning against the weaker teams...Blackburn, Wolves, Newcastle, Blackpool and Brentford!
We'll probably lose once or twice in the next 30 games and still end up eighth and out of the FA Cup. Sorry for the apathy and pessissism but ? as has been highlighted everywhere ? we just can't score...
Moyes has turned us into a team that has been in Europe, got to the FA Cup Final, Semi Final of the League Cup, Top 6 finishes!! ? how can your argue with that?
OK, some results are frustrating but we just need to move on. 3 points tonight and I will be smiling. My relationship with Everton is love-hate!!! But I do love them most of the time. I feel some of the comments are a little harsh like pitiful for example... it's only my opinion and I want to look on the bright side instead of all the doom and gloom!
"we should be beating time and time again"
This old chestnut again. Why should we be beating these teams time and time again? The same was said about us not that long ago, yet we kept on beating teams and got into 4th place.
The league this year has already shown that anyone can beat anyone. The lower teams are beating the top teams, so again I ask, why do some posters believe that we have a right to beat these teams?
Apparantly our team/squad is full of shit/average players yet we should be walking over other teams. Strange reasoning that!
This old chestnut again. Why should we be beating these teams time and time again? The same was said about us not that long ago, yet we kept on beating teams and got into 4th place.
The league this year has already shown that anyone can beat anyone. The lower teams are beating the top teams, so again I ask, why do some posters believe that we have a right to beat these teams?
Apparantly our team/squad is full of shit/average players yet we should be walking over other teams. Strange reasoning that!
Tony
Nail on the head.
Why should we feel entitled to beat certain teams? The Premier League has shown already this season that the margins are very small. Blackpool thrashed by Chelsea, Liverpool dominated by Blackpool, Liverpool crush Chelsea.
We are playing mostly good football and have a good chance of being a couple of points off the top 4 after tonight.
Stop the moaning.
Nail on the head.
Why should we feel entitled to beat certain teams? The Premier League has shown already this season that the margins are very small. Blackpool thrashed by Chelsea, Liverpool dominated by Blackpool, Liverpool crush Chelsea.
We are playing mostly good football and have a good chance of being a couple of points off the top 4 after tonight.
Stop the moaning.
Tony and Sam, I'm with you.
Remember all those Evertonians who hated the Geordies because thay felt that they had the right to win against the so called weaker teams.
As we are weaker than Chelsea, Man U, Arsenal, City and Spurs, should we even bother trying to win.
Remember all those Evertonians who hated the Geordies because thay felt that they had the right to win against the so called weaker teams.
As we are weaker than Chelsea, Man U, Arsenal, City and Spurs, should we even bother trying to win.
I'm not saying Moyes has not done well in the past but my point is I remember a couple of years ago we used to be beating these teams convincingly and comfortably, but we just can't or don't do it anymore! Who's fault is this?
We are not as good as we were a couple of seasons ago in my opinion, I'm sure the stats will back me up. We used to go away from home and win quite a few games, but this season and last season our record has got worse. We have dropped far too many points against poorer quality teams time and time again. We play some pretty football and we can beat anyone on our day, but we have no consistency and too often no cutting edge upfront and there is little quality service to our striker(s).
I'm not saying we have a right to beat these teams, but we have better players than these teams so why are we not getting the results against them? Blackpool almost threw away a lead against 9 man West Brom last week, yet we can only get a draw against them. Maybe some of you are happy with drawing these games, but I expect a bit more as look at how much some of our players are on in comparison to teams like Blackpool, they should be doing more to earn their money!
We are not as good as we were a couple of seasons ago in my opinion, I'm sure the stats will back me up. We used to go away from home and win quite a few games, but this season and last season our record has got worse. We have dropped far too many points against poorer quality teams time and time again. We play some pretty football and we can beat anyone on our day, but we have no consistency and too often no cutting edge upfront and there is little quality service to our striker(s).
I'm not saying we have a right to beat these teams, but we have better players than these teams so why are we not getting the results against them? Blackpool almost threw away a lead against 9 man West Brom last week, yet we can only get a draw against them. Maybe some of you are happy with drawing these games, but I expect a bit more as look at how much some of our players are on in comparison to teams like Blackpool, they should be doing more to earn their money!
The division is cleary very tight, all bar perhaps Chelsea, so it's more than fair to say we still have a good crack at the top 4.
Whether we'll make it, who knows but we have a great manager, a really strong first 11 and a handful of quality players on the bench ? sadly injuries have hit us again but this happens to all clubs so it's nothing new, nor is it anything to worry about.
There are only a handful of clubs with huge money to spend and this is also nothing new ? big money has always only flowed through a handful of clubs.
Anyone shouting for Moyes's head is clearly off theirs and should be very careful what they wish for. The grass isn't always greener and even with investment (and a new manager) you're not guaranteed success.
David Moyes is a hero to my mind, a man of great virtue who has done wonders for Everton under tough circumstances (financial) and should be applauded at all times.
You ask any other club's manager and players what they think about Everton and every single one of them will tell you they hate facing us and that we have a great manager and tough team.
Getting behind them is all you can do.
Part of the issue here, as I see it, is that we (naturally) scrutinise every aspect of our own club, comparing them with other clubs yet we don't scrutinise them in the same way we do Everton so our view is often distorted as a result.
Top 6 and I'll be happy this season.
Whether we'll make it, who knows but we have a great manager, a really strong first 11 and a handful of quality players on the bench ? sadly injuries have hit us again but this happens to all clubs so it's nothing new, nor is it anything to worry about.
There are only a handful of clubs with huge money to spend and this is also nothing new ? big money has always only flowed through a handful of clubs.
Anyone shouting for Moyes's head is clearly off theirs and should be very careful what they wish for. The grass isn't always greener and even with investment (and a new manager) you're not guaranteed success.
David Moyes is a hero to my mind, a man of great virtue who has done wonders for Everton under tough circumstances (financial) and should be applauded at all times.
You ask any other club's manager and players what they think about Everton and every single one of them will tell you they hate facing us and that we have a great manager and tough team.
Getting behind them is all you can do.
Part of the issue here, as I see it, is that we (naturally) scrutinise every aspect of our own club, comparing them with other clubs yet we don't scrutinise them in the same way we do Everton so our view is often distorted as a result.
Top 6 and I'll be happy this season.
James @ 35 ? I agree!!!
James, Top 6 and I will be relatively satisfied but I will not truely be happy until we win the fecken thing.
It's still a mathematical possibility, Tony ? that 24-year rule may still apply!
Another poor result! A late equaliser at home to Bolton, but as you say James, Moyes should be applauded at all times and we have no right to beat these teams. I would also be happy with finishing 6th but we're going to have to improve if are to do so.
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1 Posted 09/11/2010 at 13:58:08
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Whilst we've been playing well, we don't have the squad depth (specifically up top) to kill teams off, the squad is aging rapidly with no hope of money being available to replace these players, we're going to lose the likes of Pienaar for next to nothing and without progress we'll lose our top stars who want to perform at a higher level before their careers extinguish ? the likes of Arteta come to mind.
In short, we're in the eye of the hurricane right now ? everything looks calm and cheery, but the reality is that a very rocky storm is up ahead. We're a club in stagnation and the foundations are anything but indicative of a bright future.
That's how the current situation is for me ? call me a pessimist if you like!