Season 2011-12
The Mail Bag
Moyes to Blame for This One
105 Comments: The humiliating performance against QPR has nothing to do with Bill Kenwright, the Bank or a lack of investment.
This was down to poor coaching, poor management and miserably inadequate pre-season preparation that gave neither Saha nor Fellaini adequate playing time, which was surely obvious when they came on. Yet again there was total reliance on Beckford who is an adequate Championship striker at best.
Yet again there were no game-changing moves to be made because frankly Moyes has nothing more to offer. He totally misread QPR, fielded a team he thought was able to handle them with minimum effort and was unable to retrieve the situation from his miscalculation.
I think Moyes will be managing a Championship side next season. I just pray it won't be us.
Peter Fearon, Posted 20/08/2011 at 17:19:47
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Stoke are evolving and becoming the side Everton were five years ago. They'll soon push on further. Looking at their club makes me wistful, imagine if we'd maintained our momentum.
Totally Agree Moyes couldnt AGAIN prepare us for the opening match of the season...............this time againts fucking QPR.
Time for him to move on...........
Time for him to move on...........
Moyes subbing of Beckford confirms for me that David Moyes is a fucking coward of the highest order.
Does he want to win?
Does he want to attack?
We're so slow and predictable...
Does he want to win?
Does he want to attack?
We're so slow and predictable...
"Bungle" Bill and "Zippy" Moyes are a double act I would expect to see in a David Lynch film.
Moyes says on Sky sports "You need the right players in the right positions to get a result". So that is Heitinga in midfield, Beckford as lone striker, Rodwell as right midfield, Arteta as deep lying central midfielder and Fellaini playing off the striker all in the same game.
Make no mistake this man is as equally egotistical and out of his depth as Kenwright.
Moyes says on Sky sports "You need the right players in the right positions to get a result". So that is Heitinga in midfield, Beckford as lone striker, Rodwell as right midfield, Arteta as deep lying central midfielder and Fellaini playing off the striker all in the same game.
Make no mistake this man is as equally egotistical and out of his depth as Kenwright.
Could not have hand picked an opening match. Moyes gets away with murder with his team selections and tactics. Woy Hodgson got sacked for less.
I'd had enough of Moyes last season, the money issues are a perfect smokescreen for a manager who is running on empty.
We look as stale and listless on the pitch as the club is off it.
No width, no creativity, no pace going forward, no pressure on the ball when we don't have it and carrying too many passengers i.e. Neville, Osman and Heitinga (in midfield)
As poor as Beckford was, he got very little service. Bizarre decision to replace him with Fellaini who never looks comfortable playing his back to goal. Cahill virtually anonymous.
Long hard season ahead unless someone is sold in the next 10 days with (some of) the money used to bring in one or two to freshen things up. My choice would be Jagielka. My fear is it will be Baines.
No width, no creativity, no pace going forward, no pressure on the ball when we don't have it and carrying too many passengers i.e. Neville, Osman and Heitinga (in midfield)
As poor as Beckford was, he got very little service. Bizarre decision to replace him with Fellaini who never looks comfortable playing his back to goal. Cahill virtually anonymous.
Long hard season ahead unless someone is sold in the next 10 days with (some of) the money used to bring in one or two to freshen things up. My choice would be Jagielka. My fear is it will be Baines.
Noel if we sell anyone that money will not be re-invested in the squad.
The Pienaar, Vaughan and Yakubu loan fee money all went straight to Barclays. It's game over pal.
The Pienaar, Vaughan and Yakubu loan fee money all went straight to Barclays. It's game over pal.
Disgraceful. I am so ashamed of them.
How can Fellaini ever be considered/played as a striker?!?!? ARGGGH!!!
This is not a response to today's result which came as no surprise to me.
It has been said often on this site that Moyes's constant overachieving has taken the heat off Kenwright. It's not a view I share. Kewnwright is inept and out of his depth and this week he has taken the heat off Moyes.
I have felt and stated for some time that things are stale at Goodison Park. I believe Moyes underachieved last season. The abysmal starts and utterly shite preparation are down to him. The bizarre substitutions are down to him. The mind-boggling team selections are down to him. The tactical ineptitude is down to him. The years since he signed his inflated contract have been wasted years. If he had gone then I believe we would have done better. I believe he is a vastly overrated coach.
He can force Kenwright's hand. He can resign with some honour and integrity and force the end of this double act. He must go and he must take his partner with him.
"Be careful what you wish for"? Who would wish for what he and Kenwright have brought the club to? Mediocroty and financial ruin.
In Howard, Jagielka, Distin, Baines, Barkley, Arteta and Fellaini we have seven players capable of playing Premier League football and achieving a top six finish. In Rodwell we have a player who might achieve that standard. Osman and Coleman will do a job. As for Heitinga, Saha, Neville, Hibbert, Beckford and the rest they are simply not good enough.
Now I'm not the greatest fan of Moyes but this is what he has to work with. At the end of the day he needs money to strengthen and there the problem is we have none. Kenwright ? please, please go.
So many simple passes were misplaced. Did we have a pre-season? The players looked as though they were getting to know each other. Rodwell and Neville can't play with each other down the right. Players out of position, dreadful team selection, tactics and substitutions. This defeat was definitely mainly down to Moyes.
Why did Artetea take that last free kick when you know Baines would have scored???
Arteta hit the wall, what a suprise!!!
Des Kelly in the Daily Mail today questions if Kenwright is actually taking calls regarding selling the club.
Le Tissier questions the Moyes philosophy on Sky after watching today's game.
"you can fool some of the people etc"
Let's hope it's getting through to the fans who defend Moyes and Kenwright, it's taking long enough.
Le Tissier questions the Moyes philosophy on Sky after watching today's game.
"you can fool some of the people etc"
Let's hope it's getting through to the fans who defend Moyes and Kenwright, it's taking long enough.
Stale. Moyes's first substitution says it all.
I have been watching Everton since the late fifties, the tactics and performance from certain players today was a fucking disgrace, I am gutted and totally confused as to all the bullshit from certain players, who have stated we have a great squad, this was total shit.
Apart from Barkley actually ? cos I thought he did really well ? but the rest of them?! Awful.
Disappointed as i am i do think we were a little unlucky. They had one maybe two opportunities all game and scored. We had more than a few decent openings but didn't capitalise. Once again our lack of striking options kills us.
Saha and Beckford were both very average and Cahill was anonymous apart from missing two of our best chances.
Not sure where our goals are going to come from this season.
Saha and Beckford were both very average and Cahill was anonymous apart from missing two of our best chances.
Not sure where our goals are going to come from this season.
Just sat down to contemplate that performance,
Just not acceptable. No desire. Embarrassing. Moyes & the players thought this would be easy, why else start with that line up?
They should all donate their wages to charity this week.
Just not acceptable. No desire. Embarrassing. Moyes & the players thought this would be easy, why else start with that line up?
They should all donate their wages to charity this week.
Should have had the Blue Union pick the team today. That way Moyes and Kenwright could have blamed them for the defeat. Hang on, they might have picked a winning attacking side.
This performance was just unacceptable.
Vaguely coherent Blues flooding onto 6-0-6 tonight, Jason Roberts sensibly pointing out that cash/takeover does not equal success (see Blackburn).
So while we may loathe Kenwright and co, a takeover is not necessarily the answer. And perhaps we're just not that attractive a prospect, given the shocking state of GP, the debt etc.
As for today, believe it or not QPR were a hopelessly overprized 13/2 to win today, and to be honest I wasn't that surprised they did. Those expecting a canter forget that QPR's 4-0 defeat last week flattered Bolton and how they took the Championship apart last season.
Having said that, I'm not anti-Moyes but was horrified with that team selection. Tim Cahill has done wonderful things for our club but 4-4-1-1 was totally the wrong formation at home to anyone, whoever they may be. And pulling Becks off for Fellaini? Madness.
A simple question: if Arteta and Saha are fit, why aren't they in the team? And if not fit, why are they on the bench?
So while we may loathe Kenwright and co, a takeover is not necessarily the answer. And perhaps we're just not that attractive a prospect, given the shocking state of GP, the debt etc.
As for today, believe it or not QPR were a hopelessly overprized 13/2 to win today, and to be honest I wasn't that surprised they did. Those expecting a canter forget that QPR's 4-0 defeat last week flattered Bolton and how they took the Championship apart last season.
Having said that, I'm not anti-Moyes but was horrified with that team selection. Tim Cahill has done wonderful things for our club but 4-4-1-1 was totally the wrong formation at home to anyone, whoever they may be. And pulling Becks off for Fellaini? Madness.
A simple question: if Arteta and Saha are fit, why aren't they in the team? And if not fit, why are they on the bench?
What kind of manager plays 4-4-1-1 at home. Beckford plays better along side Saha. QPR were far superior in passing,stronger and quicker in the tackle.
Despite a good show by Barklay we had the same old lack of input from Osman and Rodders who just doesn't seem to be anything above an average midfielder.
Osman's lack of speed and tackling is a perfect indictment of Moye's inability to see what is plain to others and yet he doesn't get subbed. Disgraceful Moyes.
Apart from Cahill's glaring miss and Bainsey's free kick we had nothing to shout about.
They were thrashed last week by an average Prem.side in Bolton so what does that make Everton?
Just as well the game at Spurs was postponed-God knows what that result would have been.
Sheff.Utd.must be licking their lips.
Despite a good show by Barklay we had the same old lack of input from Osman and Rodders who just doesn't seem to be anything above an average midfielder.
Osman's lack of speed and tackling is a perfect indictment of Moye's inability to see what is plain to others and yet he doesn't get subbed. Disgraceful Moyes.
Apart from Cahill's glaring miss and Bainsey's free kick we had nothing to shout about.
They were thrashed last week by an average Prem.side in Bolton so what does that make Everton?
Just as well the game at Spurs was postponed-God knows what that result would have been.
Sheff.Utd.must be licking their lips.
The Blue Union should have requested that Moyes should also have been present at the meeting in London last week. That way they could have fired questions at him and grilled him about his team selection and tactics.
He done it when he came and nine years later, he has not learned. SQUARE PEGS DONT GO IN ROUND HOLES DAVID.
When i saw Jack Rodwell on the right wing, suddenly became a Victor fan.
Through very bad coaching an up and comming prospect is getting ruined, just like Rooney, when he put Rooney on the wing. Watch out Barlkley.
When i saw Jack Rodwell on the right wing, suddenly became a Victor fan.
Through very bad coaching an up and comming prospect is getting ruined, just like Rooney, when he put Rooney on the wing. Watch out Barlkley.
The season is over before it has even started. Negative I know, but am as negative as Moyes. To be fair to the man he has had to work with nothing, but at the end of day he comes out and says that we are not a selling club. Based on this weeks evidence we have to become a selling club. Sell a player, use some of the money to pay off debt and buy some other players. Do we need Rodwell? sell for £10 to £15 million get some players, increase the squad get competition in the squad, freshen the squad. Haqve some balls play 442, put some youngsters in Velios, Gueyen etc. Why do we get theses promising youngsters in and never play them? if Hibberts is surplus to requirments sell him, Billy as well. I think if we lose to Sheff Utd then the seasong is gone with only a fraction played. ALSO DONT THINK FOR ONE MINITUE KENWRIGHT SHOULD GET AWAY WITH THIS,SELLING THE CLUB MY ARSE. this will never happen.
QPR have been in the doldrums for years and they come to goodison and make the place look very amateur, time for everyon to move on.
I would like to see a manager who can whip the boys up a Holloway or somebody of that ilk someone who is not afraid to attack, to blood yougsters, somebody who will shout from the rooftops about the pathetic board he works for. Everton belong to the people, the board are custodians of the club, it shoudl be privilege to be associated with and also be privilege to see a great club flourish to the levels of years gone by. We have had no money for 10 - 15 years why has it taken so long for this be noted.
I love Everton as well as every other Evertonian but I am now really worried by this. The Transfer closes soon I bet there will be a few 'STARS' going with no reinvestment to the squad, were shagged - SEASON OVER - SORRY BUT IT'S THE TRUTH
QPR have been in the doldrums for years and they come to goodison and make the place look very amateur, time for everyon to move on.
I would like to see a manager who can whip the boys up a Holloway or somebody of that ilk someone who is not afraid to attack, to blood yougsters, somebody who will shout from the rooftops about the pathetic board he works for. Everton belong to the people, the board are custodians of the club, it shoudl be privilege to be associated with and also be privilege to see a great club flourish to the levels of years gone by. We have had no money for 10 - 15 years why has it taken so long for this be noted.
I love Everton as well as every other Evertonian but I am now really worried by this. The Transfer closes soon I bet there will be a few 'STARS' going with no reinvestment to the squad, were shagged - SEASON OVER - SORRY BUT IT'S THE TRUTH
I agree with the author of this article, you cant blame Kenwrong or the bank for todays shambles. As soon as i heard the line up on the radio i turned to my mate and we both just sighed and shook our heads. 4-5-1 against a team who were took apart by Bolton and leaving three of our best players on the bench. Rodwell on the right wing - laughable, Heitinga in midfield - woeful and totally useless, Beckford on his own, well i dont want to be too harsh on him but he made Anichebe look like Messi today. It was like going back in time 10 years to a Walter Smith team - ridiculously negative, uninspiring and round pegs in square holes. Kenwright didnt pick the team, Moyes did, although Kenwright could probably have done a better job. Same shit, different season.
Moyes has nothing to work with but he can't even use what he has properly so that no fucking excuse.
Moyes fucked up today................again.
Moyes fucked up today................again.
last season we started off playing neat stuff but just not getting results. Today was a complete horror show. Whilst i agree that moyes tactical decisions in this one was quite baffling, what shocked me the most was the players attitudes. They looked like they hadnt got a clue what they were doing. One the the things that gets stated as a positive about our team is that we have a stable, settled squad who have played together for years. I know that players were playing out of position and some players have had less of a pre season than others but at times it looked like they hadnt played together before
At least I can get to say it was like having a team of new signings
At least i can get
At least I can get to say it was like having a team of new signings
At least i can get
100% Moyes is to blame for today, he picked the team including players out of position. He chose tactics and made the substitions. We cant blame Kenwright, Anichibe, The Blue Union or anybody else for all these deciding factors. Once again we start the season slowly, what ever our pre season is it does not work, players are un fit still. All summer Anichibe has been 1st choice striker in pre season, 1st game he doesnt get on. While i dont like him why did Moyes persevere all summer. We dont score enough goals its clear, what are we doing about it nothing ? we'll mudle through and the fans will be happy as we are not relegation material. Who needs entertaining football.
I did think on another day we would have put six past them on a different day with the amount of chances we had. Thought Barkley was outstanding.
Since 5pm I've been listening to people say "It's only the first match" and "Don't get carried away, we always start slow". I'm sorry but I'm sick and tired of this foolish optimism. This club is in trouble and David Moyes is one of the biggest issues we have.
I admire the man and I'm very thankful for thw rok he has done at the club but I'm sick and tired of watching Everton play in this dead end 4-5-1 defensive attitude. His tactics today were shocking. Playing Rodwell on the right, Heitinga in CM, the guy won a World Cup at CB, when is Moyes going to realise his best position. Arteta on the bench. One man up front, Beckford, who I feel sorry for. He's still finding his feet in the EPL and yet he gets thrown one man up front
At one stage we switched from 4-5-1 to 4-6-0 and then back to 4-5-1???? We should have got a 2-0 or 2-1 win with 2 men up front.
One issue I've though about is the lack of edge all round the club. I think the situation the club is facing has brough about an old boys network in the club. Everyone is backing one another. The cameras caught Kenwright clapping at the end of the match today. He should have been on his way to give Moyes and the players grief, not clap them off the pitch. Same way Moyes should be ripping the players apart, but he won't, they're all best buddies. Guess that's why we won;t see certain players dropped after today. He doesn't select his team on merit, he has his favourites who he feels he can always rely on.
At the end of the day, Moyes and the players have to take the blame for the performance and I have to say I'm sick and tired of Moyes now. I'd like to see a change, God knows who, but anyone has got to be better than Moyes at the moment, and this early in the season os the best time to do it.
Sorry Moyes, your time is up.
I admire the man and I'm very thankful for thw rok he has done at the club but I'm sick and tired of watching Everton play in this dead end 4-5-1 defensive attitude. His tactics today were shocking. Playing Rodwell on the right, Heitinga in CM, the guy won a World Cup at CB, when is Moyes going to realise his best position. Arteta on the bench. One man up front, Beckford, who I feel sorry for. He's still finding his feet in the EPL and yet he gets thrown one man up front
At one stage we switched from 4-5-1 to 4-6-0 and then back to 4-5-1???? We should have got a 2-0 or 2-1 win with 2 men up front.
One issue I've though about is the lack of edge all round the club. I think the situation the club is facing has brough about an old boys network in the club. Everyone is backing one another. The cameras caught Kenwright clapping at the end of the match today. He should have been on his way to give Moyes and the players grief, not clap them off the pitch. Same way Moyes should be ripping the players apart, but he won't, they're all best buddies. Guess that's why we won;t see certain players dropped after today. He doesn't select his team on merit, he has his favourites who he feels he can always rely on.
At the end of the day, Moyes and the players have to take the blame for the performance and I have to say I'm sick and tired of Moyes now. I'd like to see a change, God knows who, but anyone has got to be better than Moyes at the moment, and this early in the season os the best time to do it.
Sorry Moyes, your time is up.
Jesus people on this site really are pessimists of the highest order. I could think of other words but I won't. Yes, Moyes cocked this one up badly. But, if we let him go, we'll be a Championship side within 5 years, every half decent player will leave and we'll be left with whoever is already retarded enough to accept an offer from Bill.
Moyes blaming not having players in the right positions and needs a striker and wide players in his BBC interview.
David @ 35
If we keep him, it might be earlier ? there's a stonking thought.
If we keep him, it might be earlier ? there's a stonking thought.
I don't think I've ever been as anti Moyes as I am now. Ive been supporting Everton for probably close on 20 years and can't recall feeling so negative about the state of affairs at the club. I would like to know the difference between what Moyes says to the players before a game against teams like QPR as opposed to what he says before a 'big' game against United and Chelsea et al, because the tactics never fuckin change from one game to the next!
Goodison used to be a fortress of sorts but now these no mark teams know they can come here and get a result simply because it's blindingly obvious how the team will line up.
I had a wax today and this result hurts even more than that!
I don't know why this was a surprise. The exact same team as last year, with the exact same problems. Felt like I was watching Blackburn from last August today. Same team, same problems, same ole shit....
David, on what do you base "We'll be a Championship side within five years"? Why? Is Moyes the best £3.5millon a year can buy?
He "cocked this one up badly" ? yes he did, as he appears, once more, to have totally fucked up pre-season. Kevin, his time was up long before today. He provides succour to Kenwright and is now part of the problem. Everton is a stale pals act from chairman down.
Too many fear life without Moyes; we need something fresh, a boost,something new, a spark, something positive.
I posted this earlier today on 'The Fallout' thread
....?People...please don?t kid yourselves that losing the manager will be a major blow....it really wont
Let's see if you're still saying the same at 5pm this afternoon after he's played 4-5-1 at home with Big Sic (er I mean VIC) on the wing.... against a team who've just been battered 4-0 (at home) in their first game....will be very interesting.
Would love nothing more than for us to put in a big performance and win...but I can't say that I'm confident...?
I really don?t take any pleasure in saying I TOLD YOU SO but...
Chairman & Manager OUT NOW !! .....
The only thing I got wrong was Big Vic but believe me that's not too far away...probably midweek v Shef Utd...In fact playing Rodwell there was an even worse decision.
It's not just about investment now....We need a new manager with forward thinking, attacking ideas....not the dour defensive, boring, clueless twat we have at the moment...and I've been saying it for a LONG, LONG TIME !!
For ALL his failings Kenwrong CANNOT be blamed for the team selection,the formation, the substitutions and the style of play (which is non-existent) that is purely down to the manager...If the players aren't good enough well by his own admission on national TV...he fuckin bought them all !!
Apparently every club...yes that's EVERY club.... wants to be Everton...well according to Kenwrong they do ????
What planet is this buffoon living on !!!!!
....?People...please don?t kid yourselves that losing the manager will be a major blow....it really wont
Let's see if you're still saying the same at 5pm this afternoon after he's played 4-5-1 at home with Big Sic (er I mean VIC) on the wing.... against a team who've just been battered 4-0 (at home) in their first game....will be very interesting.
Would love nothing more than for us to put in a big performance and win...but I can't say that I'm confident...?
I really don?t take any pleasure in saying I TOLD YOU SO but...
Chairman & Manager OUT NOW !! .....
The only thing I got wrong was Big Vic but believe me that's not too far away...probably midweek v Shef Utd...In fact playing Rodwell there was an even worse decision.
It's not just about investment now....We need a new manager with forward thinking, attacking ideas....not the dour defensive, boring, clueless twat we have at the moment...and I've been saying it for a LONG, LONG TIME !!
For ALL his failings Kenwrong CANNOT be blamed for the team selection,the formation, the substitutions and the style of play (which is non-existent) that is purely down to the manager...If the players aren't good enough well by his own admission on national TV...he fuckin bought them all !!
Apparently every club...yes that's EVERY club.... wants to be Everton...well according to Kenwrong they do ????
What planet is this buffoon living on !!!!!
Completely agree. I can just imagine him sulking all pre-season. Tactics are predictable and there is no pressure on him to perform. Absolute joke of a club.
I am not interested in any comment regarding money, The Board, Kenwright, finance, Terry Leahy, Blue Union and so on. Today's performance and result was down to Moyes. No idea from 3:00pm ? same as last season by the way ? all talk until the first game of the season and then absolute rubbish. Bad selection, bad tactics, bad substitutions ? same as last few seasons.
I guess it won't take long for Moyes to ruin Barkley's play just like he ruined Rodwell. Please leave, Moyes, asap. I guess the Moyes fans will answer as always not to say how great he is but "Who would you have?" Well, right now, My Aunty Mary... I would look for a new emerging manager who wants to prove something.
Yet again, I was bored watching Everton... of course I renewed my Season Ticket ? I am a Blue but that does not mean I accept this drivel. Apart from Barclay... no comment on any other player, they were all too poor for me.
er, anyone know what the fcuk plan B is?
The heat will increase further on Moyes next week if we are defeated at Blackburn rovers who are currently bottom right now.
I really have nothing left to say about David'no plan B' Moyes.
To me with the players we have at our disposal right now not including the walking wounded I would go with
Howard
Baines,Distin,Jagielka,Hibbert
Osman,Fellaini,Barkley,Arteta,
Beckford, Yakubu
Subs,
Mucha,
Neville,Mustaffi,Baxter,Cahill,Saha,Vellios.
The reason for no Heittinga,Rodwell or Bilyedinov is I would try and offload them quickly to raise about £20-£25 million of which the manager would hopefully get half.
Now I'll await the slaughtering from you guys!
To me with the players we have at our disposal right now not including the walking wounded I would go with
Howard
Baines,Distin,Jagielka,Hibbert
Osman,Fellaini,Barkley,Arteta,
Beckford, Yakubu
Subs,
Mucha,
Neville,Mustaffi,Baxter,Cahill,Saha,Vellios.
The reason for no Heittinga,Rodwell or Bilyedinov is I would try and offload them quickly to raise about £20-£25 million of which the manager would hopefully get half.
Now I'll await the slaughtering from you guys!
Yep...same as Plan A
moe dour ngative defensive shite and blame it on the lack of cash...not the manager;s total lack of tactical acumen
moe dour ngative defensive shite and blame it on the lack of cash...not the manager;s total lack of tactical acumen
...apologies for the keyboard malfunction
I've just had a thought...PERHAPS Moyes has finally had enough and is doing it to make Kenwrong look like a twat and force him out...
no... no... got it right the first time ...he's just tactically clueless
Rodwell on the wing....what the fuck is that all about ????
4-6-0...what type of formation is that...can't say he's not an inovator tho' eh...fuckin garbage...!!
no... no... got it right the first time ...he's just tactically clueless
Rodwell on the wing....what the fuck is that all about ????
4-6-0...what type of formation is that...can't say he's not an inovator tho' eh...fuckin garbage...!!
Same as last year.
Good home results against the big teams, but when it comes to beating teams from the bottom half, we have no pace, imagination, or any ideas at all
Playing 4-5-1 at home against a newly promoted team who lost 0-4 vs Bolton last week
What is that all about
Play 2 or even 3 up top against these teams and take the game to them
We seemed scared to take the initiative and at times it seemed like a friendly
Where was the passion
The back 4 and keeper had nothing to do
Cahill looks far too slow and I think all the injuries have caught up with him
Rodwell was terrible. Can such a promising player really have gone this bad or as in post (27) has it been coached out of him, in which case I too worry for Barkley
Osman was Osman and Heitinga is a centre half who played in that position in the world cup final for the Dutch national side. Go figure
I thought Beckford did well and made some great runs that nobody else in our team spotted
Barkley has the look of a good player, so that means we will either sell him in 12 months or have coached all the talent out of him and turned him into a useless lump like Rodwell
I assume Arteta , Fellaini and Saha weren't fit enough to start, but when brought on 2 of them were played out of position and the 3rd was left up front alone.
On this showing I wouldn't pay £5 for any of them, Barkley being the exception and maybe Baines
Not good enough
Our proud club is falling apart
get it sorted
Good home results against the big teams, but when it comes to beating teams from the bottom half, we have no pace, imagination, or any ideas at all
Playing 4-5-1 at home against a newly promoted team who lost 0-4 vs Bolton last week
What is that all about
Play 2 or even 3 up top against these teams and take the game to them
We seemed scared to take the initiative and at times it seemed like a friendly
Where was the passion
The back 4 and keeper had nothing to do
Cahill looks far too slow and I think all the injuries have caught up with him
Rodwell was terrible. Can such a promising player really have gone this bad or as in post (27) has it been coached out of him, in which case I too worry for Barkley
Osman was Osman and Heitinga is a centre half who played in that position in the world cup final for the Dutch national side. Go figure
I thought Beckford did well and made some great runs that nobody else in our team spotted
Barkley has the look of a good player, so that means we will either sell him in 12 months or have coached all the talent out of him and turned him into a useless lump like Rodwell
I assume Arteta , Fellaini and Saha weren't fit enough to start, but when brought on 2 of them were played out of position and the 3rd was left up front alone.
On this showing I wouldn't pay £5 for any of them, Barkley being the exception and maybe Baines
Not good enough
Our proud club is falling apart
get it sorted
Nelly,
Moyes struggles to say "yes" or "no", the fella is one of the plethora of planks that infest the game.
Moyes struggles to say "yes" or "no", the fella is one of the plethora of planks that infest the game.
Moyes master stroke again, wrong players wrong positions then uber negative a goal down takes off the only striker on the pitch at home and wonders why we didnt win, fuck me if there were still cushions at GP you wouldn't have seen the pitch at the end.
He even has the audacity to say he needs strikers and wide players, hmm lets look at that one Gollum, you took a striker off and replaced him with a DM why not swap him for the ineffective Heitinga, you put a centre half/central midfielder on one wing Rodwell and another on the other wing Barkley.
DM had a player who can play on the wing on the bench who had actually look decent as recently as Monday night in Arteta but left him on the bench until finally seeing Rodwell was a liability and took him off, he put the impressive Barkley (one glimmer in a piss poor display today) on the wing - fuck off Moyes dont destroy this one too as he's obviously a central midfielder from the way he constantly tries to come inside and play and probably the player with the most shots on goal today (a 17 year old!!!!) He had Saha on the bench who could have partnered Beckford and at least given him a chance to perform to his strengths playing off another striker - any youtube of him sat Leeds could tell you this is how he works but not old wisdom of Gollum again.
I'm fed up sick of the same old mistakes, a sulking Gollum and another highlight that we pay good money to watch - start a game looking to score not make decisions too late to chase a game you one trick misery, why not start Saha and Beckford then if need be score and park the bus and go to your boring dreary miserable 4-5-1, why not start with some creativity in Arteta rather than put Rodwell the winger equivalent of a chocolate teapot there and bring Arteta on again trying to get a point from a game. The worst thig about this isn't the masterstroke of hindsight its the deja vu of just how many times will be see this every season??
He even has the audacity to say he needs strikers and wide players, hmm lets look at that one Gollum, you took a striker off and replaced him with a DM why not swap him for the ineffective Heitinga, you put a centre half/central midfielder on one wing Rodwell and another on the other wing Barkley.
DM had a player who can play on the wing on the bench who had actually look decent as recently as Monday night in Arteta but left him on the bench until finally seeing Rodwell was a liability and took him off, he put the impressive Barkley (one glimmer in a piss poor display today) on the wing - fuck off Moyes dont destroy this one too as he's obviously a central midfielder from the way he constantly tries to come inside and play and probably the player with the most shots on goal today (a 17 year old!!!!) He had Saha on the bench who could have partnered Beckford and at least given him a chance to perform to his strengths playing off another striker - any youtube of him sat Leeds could tell you this is how he works but not old wisdom of Gollum again.
I'm fed up sick of the same old mistakes, a sulking Gollum and another highlight that we pay good money to watch - start a game looking to score not make decisions too late to chase a game you one trick misery, why not start Saha and Beckford then if need be score and park the bus and go to your boring dreary miserable 4-5-1, why not start with some creativity in Arteta rather than put Rodwell the winger equivalent of a chocolate teapot there and bring Arteta on again trying to get a point from a game. The worst thig about this isn't the masterstroke of hindsight its the deja vu of just how many times will be see this every season??
Trever...The one I feel most sorry for is Barclay cos he's now got the hopes of every Evertonian on his shoulders...not good for a 17 yr old kid
The rest are average at best....The once good ones are now best their best so what's left...
No Craft... No Pace... No FUCKIN CLUE !!
The rest are average at best....The once good ones are now best their best so what's left...
No Craft... No Pace... No FUCKIN CLUE !!
You can blame Moyes all you want but look at the tools at his disposal . Neville and Beckford give all kids hope of making it . Before Beckford was removed six balls in a row came his way and he failed to control any of them. Ok Moyes should have replaced him with saha but when Saha eventually came on was he any better ? Answer no. Thats what moyes has to play with and yes he is no tactical genuis but until he has some money at his disposal i refuse to blame him. Blame the Leader of our business . The one who cant even provide him with loan wages not to mind transfer money. The same leader who cant account for 24 million in our accounts . Its beyond a joke and when we eventually drop to the championship i wonder what the Pro-kenright brigade will say then.
Not a great start admittedly but to say the season is already over with 37 games to go is surely just a bit premature. Not a surprise though.
michael @ 53
As Moyes said when defending his benefactor he bought the players - it's been a mistake letting him off the hook - today was as plain as it gets.
As Moyes said when defending his benefactor he bought the players - it's been a mistake letting him off the hook - today was as plain as it gets.
A stale, lacklustre performance for all except Barkley and Baines. They should all be ashamed to pick up their paycheck this week - not least Moyes for some truly lousy team selection and tactics. Even that buffoon Kenwright can't be blamed for what happened on the pitch today - although for most other things - yes!
Listened to most of 606 on 5Live. From what I heard I don't think a fully coherent argument against the current 'status quo' was made. I think the main issue I had was that it was not just today which was the reason for the boos - it's a culmination of a drepression that took hold for many of us from the start of last season and has just continued on relentlessly with no sign of investment, leadership, a return of team spirit or a team coherence and vision which we did have during our extended UEFA Cup run (our high water mark in my view). If it had only been today, then booing would have been inappropriate - but it's not.
I have no expectations of Top 4 or 6 or whatever for the forseeable future. I feared relegation last year and we somehow got out of it and flattered to deceive (more a consequence of some even poorer teams around us). This year I honestly fear relegation is almost a certainty. I can't see where our points are going to come from!
The view that if no one is interested in buying Everton, so what purpose would there be in Bill going, is flawed. I believe Bill's terms and conditions and ongoing ineptitude are the barriers to investment (along with the other board members). Everything is wrong - from our corporate enterprises, marketing, commercial, PR etc. right through to our team spirit...and we must try to get the silent majority who turn up week in and week out to see that change is now needed or we will be playing Championship football next year (unless administration gets us first!).
That's what is wrong 5Live! S.O.S. E.F.C!
Listened to most of 606 on 5Live. From what I heard I don't think a fully coherent argument against the current 'status quo' was made. I think the main issue I had was that it was not just today which was the reason for the boos - it's a culmination of a drepression that took hold for many of us from the start of last season and has just continued on relentlessly with no sign of investment, leadership, a return of team spirit or a team coherence and vision which we did have during our extended UEFA Cup run (our high water mark in my view). If it had only been today, then booing would have been inappropriate - but it's not.
I have no expectations of Top 4 or 6 or whatever for the forseeable future. I feared relegation last year and we somehow got out of it and flattered to deceive (more a consequence of some even poorer teams around us). This year I honestly fear relegation is almost a certainty. I can't see where our points are going to come from!
The view that if no one is interested in buying Everton, so what purpose would there be in Bill going, is flawed. I believe Bill's terms and conditions and ongoing ineptitude are the barriers to investment (along with the other board members). Everything is wrong - from our corporate enterprises, marketing, commercial, PR etc. right through to our team spirit...and we must try to get the silent majority who turn up week in and week out to see that change is now needed or we will be playing Championship football next year (unless administration gets us first!).
That's what is wrong 5Live! S.O.S. E.F.C!
Michael...Moyes HAS HAD money and HE bought ALL of the players....he paid £10mil for Bily FFS...he's supplied his own TOOLS (that being the operative word and no pun intended)
Now what is it they say about a bad work man....he always blames his WHAT ???
Now what is it they say about a bad work man....he always blames his WHAT ???
Could not have hand picked an opening match. Moyes gets away with murder with his team selections and tactics. Woy hodgson got sacked for less. Had enough of moyes last season, the money issues are a perfect smokescreen for a manager that is running on empty.
Andy Crooks 40, I explain that later in the first comment. Every half decent player will leave (Moyes is the only reason Mikel's still here along with Cahill etc) and no good manager will take the job. We'll be forced to scour the lower leagues for someone who wants a shot in the prem and who will accept low wages and in that case, unless lightning strikes twice and we find someone who gets us playing with no money, we're royally screwed.
We have in David Moyes someone who actually wants to do the job despite his great rep and job opportunities. If it was say, O'Neill, he would have walked by now. Same for Redknapp and countless other managers who have enjoyed an ounce of success.
Moyes spoke this week of how you should stick with managers and how it doesn't help to be changing staff every year. He's right too. And note that his strange tactical decisions go completely unnoticed when we're beating city and chelsea at home.
We have in David Moyes someone who actually wants to do the job despite his great rep and job opportunities. If it was say, O'Neill, he would have walked by now. Same for Redknapp and countless other managers who have enjoyed an ounce of success.
Moyes spoke this week of how you should stick with managers and how it doesn't help to be changing staff every year. He's right too. And note that his strange tactical decisions go completely unnoticed when we're beating city and chelsea at home.
How do you propose we replace Arteta, Cahill, Fellaini etc when their fees have half gone on repaying back the bank, Andy?
Many points raised here are very valid.
It's deja vu with the start of last season and before.
How many times have we seen games like this with the very same team and Moyes tactics except for Barkley.
I saw Cahill breaking for the penalty area with ample time to pass to Rodwell only to be dispossessed and why? Did he think he was Messi? Then he inexplicably heads wide from an excellent Becks.cross. Do I detect that Timmie is fading?
Then Osman has a clear run to the penalty area and his slowness to accomplish anything gets him dispossessed also. These are just a few cases of Everton's indecisiveness which contributes to the overall lethargy within the team. Yes Becks.made several bad connects but he also made several good ones and he runs his guts out when he is up on his own.He needs to play off another striker like King Louis.
There were many comments made during the summer similar to this but Moyes continues to stick with his failed rigid schemes. I will bet QPR will be lucky to win another away game.
It's deja vu with the start of last season and before.
How many times have we seen games like this with the very same team and Moyes tactics except for Barkley.
I saw Cahill breaking for the penalty area with ample time to pass to Rodwell only to be dispossessed and why? Did he think he was Messi? Then he inexplicably heads wide from an excellent Becks.cross. Do I detect that Timmie is fading?
Then Osman has a clear run to the penalty area and his slowness to accomplish anything gets him dispossessed also. These are just a few cases of Everton's indecisiveness which contributes to the overall lethargy within the team. Yes Becks.made several bad connects but he also made several good ones and he runs his guts out when he is up on his own.He needs to play off another striker like King Louis.
There were many comments made during the summer similar to this but Moyes continues to stick with his failed rigid schemes. I will bet QPR will be lucky to win another away game.
Michael #53 Beckford isn't a lone striker never will be replacing Beckford for Saha just gave us another lone striker, why not try to use the pace and space he was creating by putting another striker (Saha) on the pitch, change the 4-5-1 to 4-4-2, 4-5-1 isn't working so Moyes keeps it and fannies about with players in and out, he's a one tricky pony and every knows how to beat it. You can't even argue that QPR parked the bus today, they just outfootballed us passing and at times passed the ball between themselves over a dozen times before we even got a tackle in.
David....he may want to to the job...but he quite clearly ISN'T doing it.
It not about lack of cash it's about his tactics...or rather lack of them.
He's bought all of the players and continually plays them out of position....first Vic now Rodwell on the right wing... Heitinga in Midfeld....Neville in the team...Fellini up front....4-5-1...it's just not working...Fuck knows what would have happened to Rooney's career had he chosen to stay cos he was playing him on the right wing...His next trick will be to ruin Barkley as he has Rodwell....what was once refeshing potential is now a bad reality... if we could get £5mil for him at present we'll have done well.
I'm not saying he has always been this bad....Moyes did a good job getting us from were we where to Uefa qualification but he's now a spent force, devoid of attacking ideas (you only had to watch the game today to see that...4-6-0 at home v Q P FUCKING R...what the fuck is that all about !!) and it is time for him to fall on his sword...perhaps it will be seen as a very noble gesture by his apologists and it might cause a full scale revolt against the buffoons that call themelves the Board of Directors...at least he can then save face by saying he left for the right reasons....to move Everton forward.... cos under this regime we will become the next Shef Wed make no mistake..
It not about lack of cash it's about his tactics...or rather lack of them.
He's bought all of the players and continually plays them out of position....first Vic now Rodwell on the right wing... Heitinga in Midfeld....Neville in the team...Fellini up front....4-5-1...it's just not working...Fuck knows what would have happened to Rooney's career had he chosen to stay cos he was playing him on the right wing...His next trick will be to ruin Barkley as he has Rodwell....what was once refeshing potential is now a bad reality... if we could get £5mil for him at present we'll have done well.
I'm not saying he has always been this bad....Moyes did a good job getting us from were we where to Uefa qualification but he's now a spent force, devoid of attacking ideas (you only had to watch the game today to see that...4-6-0 at home v Q P FUCKING R...what the fuck is that all about !!) and it is time for him to fall on his sword...perhaps it will be seen as a very noble gesture by his apologists and it might cause a full scale revolt against the buffoons that call themelves the Board of Directors...at least he can then save face by saying he left for the right reasons....to move Everton forward.... cos under this regime we will become the next Shef Wed make no mistake..
David....he may want to to the job...but he quite clearly ISN'T doing it.
It not about lack of cash it's about his tactics...or rather lack of them.
He's bought all of the players and continually plays them out of position....first Vic now Rodwell on the right wing... Heitinga in Midfeld....Neville in the team...Fellini up front....4-5-1...it's just not working...Fuck knows what would have happened to Rooney's career had he chosen to stay cos he was playing him on the right wing...His next trick will be to ruin Barkley as he has Rodwell....what was once refeshing potential is now a bad reality... if we could get £5mil for him at present we'll have done well.
I'm not saying he has always been this bad....Moyes did a good job getting us from were we where to Uefa qualification but he's now a spent force, devoid of attacking ideas (you only had to watch the game today to see that...4-6-0 at home v Q P FUCKING R...what the fuck is that all about !!) and it is time for him to fall on his sword...perhaps it will be seen as a very noble gesture by his apologists and it might cause a full scale revolt against the buffoons that call themelves the Board of Directors...at least he can then save face by saying he left for the right reasons....to move Everton forward.... cos under this regime we will become the next Shef Wed make no mistake..
It not about lack of cash it's about his tactics...or rather lack of them.
He's bought all of the players and continually plays them out of position....first Vic now Rodwell on the right wing... Heitinga in Midfeld....Neville in the team...Fellini up front....4-5-1...it's just not working...Fuck knows what would have happened to Rooney's career had he chosen to stay cos he was playing him on the right wing...His next trick will be to ruin Barkley as he has Rodwell....what was once refeshing potential is now a bad reality... if we could get £5mil for him at present we'll have done well.
I'm not saying he has always been this bad....Moyes did a good job getting us from were we where to Uefa qualification but he's now a spent force, devoid of attacking ideas (you only had to watch the game today to see that...4-6-0 at home v Q P FUCKING R...what the fuck is that all about !!) and it is time for him to fall on his sword...perhaps it will be seen as a very noble gesture by his apologists and it might cause a full scale revolt against the buffoons that call themelves the Board of Directors...at least he can then save face by saying he left for the right reasons....to move Everton forward.... cos under this regime we will become the next Shef Wed make no mistake..
you can fool some of the people , how apt for this team, the starting line up today was nothing short of criminal, first rule of football start with your strongest team, how difficult can it be. Unfortunately it seems beyond David Moyles, this result had nothing to do with lack of invesment, but more to do with playing players in the true positions, and gaining as a team from from they can give. I tried to think why Moyles picked this team by his selections, was he trying to tell the board this team is has nothing to give and we are running on empty, because his subtitutions and team selections in general, were absolutely baffling.
As a season ticket holder, totally disgusted, but what I fear is their are plenty of fellow blues who are willing to give Kenwright and Moyles the benefit of the doudt, after today can you actually see progress and a good season ahead for Everton ?
As a season ticket holder, totally disgusted, but what I fear is their are plenty of fellow blues who are willing to give Kenwright and Moyles the benefit of the doudt, after today can you actually see progress and a good season ahead for Everton ?
Peter...we'd propably be better of with Moyles (Chris that is...) rather than Moyes
QPR.
A team stuffed by Bolton this week.
They had a virus go through most of the squad, hence some of their team selections as most had been ill.
Goodison Park - our fortress.
We hit the bar with a free kick.. and a kid looked pretty good.
End of.
Shite team selection.. Shite management throughout the WHOLE club..
Worried ? You Bet..
A team stuffed by Bolton this week.
They had a virus go through most of the squad, hence some of their team selections as most had been ill.
Goodison Park - our fortress.
We hit the bar with a free kick.. and a kid looked pretty good.
End of.
Shite team selection.. Shite management throughout the WHOLE club..
Worried ? You Bet..
Peter - we can forgive Nelly for her many typos today, but getting our manager's name wrong three times doesn't give your post the authority it requires.
Did Heitinga play in midfield again? Why does Moyes continually start off with such negative tactics even when we are playing poor teams!
Just coming round from 5 hours of feeling utterly mortified since the final whistle. I participate in another (international) forum which obviously includes supporters from other clubs, and have been unsurprisingly getting slaughtered by kopites after that embarrassment.
Although today's performance and result was not entirely unexpected, it still comes as a major shock. A decent enough start, followed by panicky defending, followed by a completed inability to create any chances of note other than Cahill's missed sitter. I could even stomach it if, like this time last season, we were creating a load of chances without finishing them. But we didn't. We hardly tested the keeper and that was inexcusable. David Moyes much take a large portion of the blame for this. As someone who has backed him these last 9 years, my support of him is hanging by a slender thread at this stage. Any more of this and that will be it for me, and I suspect many others.
This I believe will go down as a watershed week for the club. The week when it was exposed to the wider football world that the club is on it's knees and is practically bankrupt. And the week when many supporters finally lost patience with the manager. The staleness stands out like a sore thumb; all the more so because of the one shining light that was Barkley's performance. Seasoned professionals shown up by a 17 year old. If I see one more of those Neville 'floaters' I swear I am going to self-destruct.
We can't go on like this.
Although today's performance and result was not entirely unexpected, it still comes as a major shock. A decent enough start, followed by panicky defending, followed by a completed inability to create any chances of note other than Cahill's missed sitter. I could even stomach it if, like this time last season, we were creating a load of chances without finishing them. But we didn't. We hardly tested the keeper and that was inexcusable. David Moyes much take a large portion of the blame for this. As someone who has backed him these last 9 years, my support of him is hanging by a slender thread at this stage. Any more of this and that will be it for me, and I suspect many others.
This I believe will go down as a watershed week for the club. The week when it was exposed to the wider football world that the club is on it's knees and is practically bankrupt. And the week when many supporters finally lost patience with the manager. The staleness stands out like a sore thumb; all the more so because of the one shining light that was Barkley's performance. Seasoned professionals shown up by a 17 year old. If I see one more of those Neville 'floaters' I swear I am going to self-destruct.
We can't go on like this.
I'm bored... I'm Chairman of the bored.
I agree the financial mess is not Moyes' fault....but the way the team plays IS !!
David Moyles....
More like Comedy Dave.
More like Comedy Dave.
John Nugent...spot on mate...haha !!
Is it possible to be shocked and yet not surprised at the same time?
I think the record is now 7 defeats in our last 9 opening season games. That is not acceptable. I'm not anti-Moyes by any means, but that is a terrible statistic.
Like most, I don't understand the team selection. If Fellaini, Arteta and Saha aren't fit, why are they on the bench? And if they were fit, surely they should have started the game?
I also find it worrying to hear him saying after the game that anyone disappointed or surprised by the result shouldn't be because we are short in important areas! Doesn't exactly inspire confidence does it?
After 25 years the ability of Everton FC to fuck up my day still continues to amaze!
I think the record is now 7 defeats in our last 9 opening season games. That is not acceptable. I'm not anti-Moyes by any means, but that is a terrible statistic.
Like most, I don't understand the team selection. If Fellaini, Arteta and Saha aren't fit, why are they on the bench? And if they were fit, surely they should have started the game?
I also find it worrying to hear him saying after the game that anyone disappointed or surprised by the result shouldn't be because we are short in important areas! Doesn't exactly inspire confidence does it?
After 25 years the ability of Everton FC to fuck up my day still continues to amaze!
Robert, take it from me it doesn't get any easier after 45 years........
42 years supporting Everton. I live in California now so the game ended at 9am over here, so it's a longer day they fuck up for me....!
For God's sake, Rodwell played on the right because at present we don't have one fit winger at the club. Not one. Heitinga played CM because arteta and felli weren't fit and rodders was on the wing.
Moyes had a major part to play in our downfall with his substitutions and formation but in my opinon he played the right players in the positions available, largely.
Moyes had a major part to play in our downfall with his substitutions and formation but in my opinon he played the right players in the positions available, largely.
Having taken some time to cool off before i made a comment to vent my frustration, my take on things was that tha starting line up was fine considering we didnt have a fit winger available and so unfortunately Rodwell and Barkley had to play on the wings which is clearly not their best positions. However i thought Rodwell should have done much better.
The team looked disjointed and unbalanced. However Moyes had the cavalry of the bech to change the game if needed. Perhaps they were fit enough to be on the bench but not match fit to start due to their respective injuries during pre-season.
I thought we were probably slightly the better side and perhaps should have had 2 penalties and were unlucky not to score from the Baines free kick. The result could have been very different with a little bit of luck. Unfortunately there were a couple of individual errors from Jaggs that cost the team.
As for the substitution Felliani for Beckford; If Cahill had have score the chance Fellaini set up for him people would have been calling Moyes a genious. It just wasn't to be.
In conclusion, i dont blame Moyes, i blame the lack of decent wingers and strikers, i blame Jaggs for his costly mistake and i blame not having that littel bit of luck when it came to the penalty decisions that every team needs. Remeber, it's a marathon not a sprint.
The team looked disjointed and unbalanced. However Moyes had the cavalry of the bech to change the game if needed. Perhaps they were fit enough to be on the bench but not match fit to start due to their respective injuries during pre-season.
I thought we were probably slightly the better side and perhaps should have had 2 penalties and were unlucky not to score from the Baines free kick. The result could have been very different with a little bit of luck. Unfortunately there were a couple of individual errors from Jaggs that cost the team.
As for the substitution Felliani for Beckford; If Cahill had have score the chance Fellaini set up for him people would have been calling Moyes a genious. It just wasn't to be.
In conclusion, i dont blame Moyes, i blame the lack of decent wingers and strikers, i blame Jaggs for his costly mistake and i blame not having that littel bit of luck when it came to the penalty decisions that every team needs. Remeber, it's a marathon not a sprint.
I just can't understand the pre-season tactics. We never played the same eleven in more than one game, actually in more than part of a game and when did the starting eleven today play together in the pre-season?
The starting eleven for first game should have been chosen several weeks ago and played together in the last two friendlies so they can gel before the first game. The only changes should be through injury.
Moyes does the same thing year in year out and we take months before we start playing as a team rather than a bunch of individuals.
The starting eleven for first game should have been chosen several weeks ago and played together in the last two friendlies so they can gel before the first game. The only changes should be through injury.
Moyes does the same thing year in year out and we take months before we start playing as a team rather than a bunch of individuals.
37 to go. Let's see what happens.
Ian Tunstead, your post demonstrates the wisdom of reflecting before posting. (something I don't do) I stand by my view that Moyes's time is over but your post made me think.
Robert Elliot................So true.........and it was my Birthday,.............Thanks Moysie........and most of them twats that pulled on the shirt today........unbelievable.....
Robert Elliot................So true.........and it was my Birthday,.............Thanks Moysie........and most of them twats that pulled on the shirt today........unbelievable.....
Ian Tunstead #79 "I don't blame Moyes i blame the lack of decent wingers and strikers" Well after 9 years in charge, who the fuck is to blame for not having decent wingers and strikers? Who splashes out millions on players for positions we don't need to strengthen? When our club is so cash strapped, who wastes more money taking the whole entourage on expensive jollies to Australia or the USA? Why cant we get much needed friendlies here or in France, Spain, Holland etc? And why have we got a manager who was a defender, an assistant manger who was a defender and a reserve team manager who was also a defender? It's no wonder we don't buy any strikers or wingers, they don't know what to do with them. 4-5-1 at home to a newly promoted club who got smashed at their own ground the week before. I really do give up
Although moyes's selection,tactics were poor today the responsibility for the result lays with the players apart from Baines and barkley the rest were bad.Jags showed today why Wenger offered 12million maybe we should have accepted and played Heitinga in his true position.Where's the passion for the shirt gone[oh I forgot there all mercenary bastards now and older too boot].Even an optimist like me is thinking it's going to be a long season.
Thought long and hard and to be honest I am pissed on my own with no one to lean on. Guys I have read all posts all week and I hate all things Kenwright but being a sad bastard, I have also looked at all threads that sit with the mighty blues (that's what they were when big Bob Latch led the line).
I am sorry but Moyes has to go because, please ? How can you justify today? I am just like you all, a true blue and fuck me I can go back to my grandfather's grandfather and never have we played with no strikers on the pitch against QPR. Fuck Kenwright but let's not be blind, fuck Moyes too. I don't know which way to turn...
MOYES has been stale for two years now, time to go
I do appreciate what Moyes has done for Everton but I haven't always agreed with his tactics. For me it seems very negative to play a lone striker, especially at home. Saha and Beckford up front together would have been a much more positive way to go out and get a win.
Cahill has been a great player for us but his 8-10 goals a season come at the price of a five man midfield and a lone striker. Lampard has a similar impact at Chelsea but he manages to do it as part of a four man midfield allowing them to field two strikers. Why can't we do the same and have Tim as a central midfielder who chips in with some goals rather than base the way we play around him having a free role?
Look at Blackpool last year. They could have played a very negative counter-attacking game with a packed out midfield but instead they had the courage to line up in an attacking formation, sometimes with three strikers. Ultimately they didn't have the quality in defence to survive, we have so why not try and attack? Also, where was Gueye? Is he injured? I would love to see him out wide left and (a fit) Coleman bombing down the right. These youngsters would give us the drive and pace we were lacking against QPR.
Barkley looks like a great player but we shouldn't put too much pressure on his young shoulders. Look what has happened to Rodwell recently. It can't be easy being the focus of so much expectation.
One other thing that has been puzzling me. Why did we spend all that money on Billy when Cahill plays in the attacking midfield role. It seems to me we are wasting his talent by keeping him on the bench or playing him out of position. I like the guy but if he is not going to be used why wasn't he sold in the summer? He is certainly not a winger. Perhaps Moyes is keeping him until Cahill retires, but by then will he have any confidence left?
Cahill has been a great player for us but his 8-10 goals a season come at the price of a five man midfield and a lone striker. Lampard has a similar impact at Chelsea but he manages to do it as part of a four man midfield allowing them to field two strikers. Why can't we do the same and have Tim as a central midfielder who chips in with some goals rather than base the way we play around him having a free role?
Look at Blackpool last year. They could have played a very negative counter-attacking game with a packed out midfield but instead they had the courage to line up in an attacking formation, sometimes with three strikers. Ultimately they didn't have the quality in defence to survive, we have so why not try and attack? Also, where was Gueye? Is he injured? I would love to see him out wide left and (a fit) Coleman bombing down the right. These youngsters would give us the drive and pace we were lacking against QPR.
Barkley looks like a great player but we shouldn't put too much pressure on his young shoulders. Look what has happened to Rodwell recently. It can't be easy being the focus of so much expectation.
One other thing that has been puzzling me. Why did we spend all that money on Billy when Cahill plays in the attacking midfield role. It seems to me we are wasting his talent by keeping him on the bench or playing him out of position. I like the guy but if he is not going to be used why wasn't he sold in the summer? He is certainly not a winger. Perhaps Moyes is keeping him until Cahill retires, but by then will he have any confidence left?
Moyes made it clear that this was his team and it is seriously lacking in the most attacking options on the pitch -strikers and wingers and players with pace. The last time we played ant decent attacking football was when Pienaar and Donovan were out wide. Since they have left it has been pretty poor fair.
If Moyes knew he had to sell to buy then he should have moved players on to cover these positions. Central Midfield is loaded and Fellaini is overated -never completes a full season to many bookings etc.. Plus Arteta has never been the same since signing his new contract (???) and injury. Moyes though is simplly to conservative and it now looks like his tactics are outdated. 4-5-1 with an ageing Cahill no longer works.
Moyes and Kenwright are like two peas in a pod holding on to things out of stubborness and some kind of control trip. I will not go into Kenwright here, but Moyes should have let the Yak go last season for 6 million and Saha for 8 million to Turkey. He should have moved these ageing injury prone players on and looked to youth and pace and a change of direction.The starting eleven yesterday was a joke. So were the substitutions. Barrkley showed us the way forward, the one shining light in an all too familiar, abject performance. If we are not careful he will end up being another Rooney and moving on if he has any sense, and that would be criminal to see that happen again.I expect Fergie has already stated the ball rolling after seeing the lad play yesterday. He is gonna be a star.
Moyes's vision has gone, he is a spent force bereft of ideas and an inability to move with the modern game. It is his team. He has had players he could have moved on for a profit. There are things he could have done to have positions covered and some pace in the side. He should have seen this after Donovan and Pienaar left. He didn't, and now we are left with a team that is stale and slow and ageing.
Moyes has to go and so does Kenwright, the time has come. Get the old guard out. Neville first. Build the team around Barkley, Rodwell, Coleman and Baines - even give Maggie a go. At least he scored in preseason. Oh and Pre season don't get me started on that one.........
If Moyes knew he had to sell to buy then he should have moved players on to cover these positions. Central Midfield is loaded and Fellaini is overated -never completes a full season to many bookings etc.. Plus Arteta has never been the same since signing his new contract (???) and injury. Moyes though is simplly to conservative and it now looks like his tactics are outdated. 4-5-1 with an ageing Cahill no longer works.
Moyes and Kenwright are like two peas in a pod holding on to things out of stubborness and some kind of control trip. I will not go into Kenwright here, but Moyes should have let the Yak go last season for 6 million and Saha for 8 million to Turkey. He should have moved these ageing injury prone players on and looked to youth and pace and a change of direction.The starting eleven yesterday was a joke. So were the substitutions. Barrkley showed us the way forward, the one shining light in an all too familiar, abject performance. If we are not careful he will end up being another Rooney and moving on if he has any sense, and that would be criminal to see that happen again.I expect Fergie has already stated the ball rolling after seeing the lad play yesterday. He is gonna be a star.
Moyes's vision has gone, he is a spent force bereft of ideas and an inability to move with the modern game. It is his team. He has had players he could have moved on for a profit. There are things he could have done to have positions covered and some pace in the side. He should have seen this after Donovan and Pienaar left. He didn't, and now we are left with a team that is stale and slow and ageing.
Moyes has to go and so does Kenwright, the time has come. Get the old guard out. Neville first. Build the team around Barkley, Rodwell, Coleman and Baines - even give Maggie a go. At least he scored in preseason. Oh and Pre season don't get me started on that one.........
If there was one moment in the game yesterday that really sums up Moyes leadership , it was when Arteta took that wanky free kick instead of Bainsey.
What is the first thing any other manager would tell our players....BAINES TAKES THE FREE KICKS....PERIOD!!!
Did you ever see anyone other than Beckham take a free kick when he played for united? Why not.....Because SAF said so! The same with Ronaldo when he took over. But not our Moyesy. Baines is probably the best free kick expert in the PL at the moment...Why cant Moyes see that.......hat and coat time DM!!!
What is the first thing any other manager would tell our players....BAINES TAKES THE FREE KICKS....PERIOD!!!
Did you ever see anyone other than Beckham take a free kick when he played for united? Why not.....Because SAF said so! The same with Ronaldo when he took over. But not our Moyesy. Baines is probably the best free kick expert in the PL at the moment...Why cant Moyes see that.......hat and coat time DM!!!
Tony # 91. Agree completely, Baines should be taking all free kicks and Pens. Arteta can't even clear the first man from a corner. He is finished as a player for us and I would like to see him move on. Moyes tactics,leadership, decision making and substitutions were some of the strangest I have ever seen from a football manager. It was almost as if he was saying to everyone, "I have had enough of this and I want out."
The substitution of Fellaini for Beckford was a disgrace, and it smacked of throwing the towel in. At that time it should have been Beckford for Saha, Heitinga for Anichebe/Velios and go 2 up front. Not a single manager at any level would go down to 0 strikers when 1 goal down. Moyes is protected by the media too. If Alex Ferguson was a goal down and he took lone striker Rooney off for Carrick, it would be questioned all over the show, but unlucky Moyes has no money and nothing to work with. He had 3 fucking strikers on the bench!! I put on my facebook status 'Moyes out' after that game yesterday, and the response I got? A Bolton fan saying that proves I know nothing, and a Man U fan saying what can he do wih no funds? The pair of them have probably never watched Everton in their lives, and rely on the medias portrayal of Moyes the magician, Moyes the god! Well he can fuckoff for me. The only hope we have is that we get the same reaction we had after the spurs game a couple of years ago, where he took off a striker for Hibbert at 1-1 when we were dominating. That is the only other time I remember a chorus of boo's to a decision during the game. I hope Moyes heard and felt the massive kick up the arse we gave him yesterday, and he sorts it for Blackburn on saturday.
I said during the Summer this could be the crossroads for Moyes. The pre-season results-okay we don't take them seriously but then this after a week off and a team thrashed the week beforeby average Bolton.
He obviously doesn't get the message any more.Maybe he should get a taxi?
His squad selection and formation has been our downfall for a few years now.
Every team knows how to play us.
We have absolutely no idea how to get past a ten man defence because Moyes is a totally negative manager.
Over the years we have won games by being a defensive team relying on the set piece to steal the points but With Timmie now stuttering that ploy is becoming extinct.
Do the honourable thing Davie for all the loyal fans-Quit now.
He obviously doesn't get the message any more.Maybe he should get a taxi?
His squad selection and formation has been our downfall for a few years now.
Every team knows how to play us.
We have absolutely no idea how to get past a ten man defence because Moyes is a totally negative manager.
Over the years we have won games by being a defensive team relying on the set piece to steal the points but With Timmie now stuttering that ploy is becoming extinct.
Do the honourable thing Davie for all the loyal fans-Quit now.
Talk about deja vu!
Speechless
Hope Defender Dodd comes on to cheer me up
Speechless
Hope Defender Dodd comes on to cheer me up
Dan # 93. Agree, Moyes is protected by the Media. Continually saying what a great job he has done with no money etc etc. Yesterday was just shit tactics, shit team selection and shit substitutions, only the fans have picked up on this and Le Tissier on Sky Sports, the rest of the media seem to think Moyes is some kind of genius. He is past his sell by date. He constantly uses the excuse for no money=negative tactics. Bollocks. He could have gone 4 -3 -3 yesterday. It was the perfect opportunity to really show something different for the forthcoming season against and understrength virus depleted newly promoted shipped 4 goals last week QPR, maybe playing something like:. Howard, Baines, Distin, Jags, Hibbert, ( Neville is shit) Barkley, Rodwell, Fellaini or Arteta. And gone with Anichebe, Saha and Beckford upfront. With the Yak, Cahill, Hand Osman on the bench. At least it would have looked like he meant business. But no, 4-5-1 with an ageing Cahill no longer cuts it for me and Warnock knew this was coming. He read Moyes's predictability like every other manager in the Prem does. They have got Moyes sussed and this season will really show it unless he gets a kick up the fucking arse and has a complete change of his football philosophy, which I doubt is going to happen.
You know what, I was all for Kirkby. I know there were problems that were brought up but they were only short term because, if we had got the new stadium, a rich arab or someone of that ilk would have bought the club, just like they did for Man City.
I did say that if we did not get the Kirkby stadium then we would start to struggle financialy and that we could be the next Leeds Utd. Well, my worst nightmare seems to be happening.
We need a total makeover that means get rid of the manager the board and sell a couple of players to tide things over.
If we had put our chances away we would of won. I wish we had the money for a top forward but if you look at the salaries & transfer fees we have been paying, its above our achievements. If we take out the teams that regularly get to euro cup semis etc. (that's were the big money is) and finish in the top four we out spend the rest. Most of the money goes on salaries. All the in fighting in the world will not change our financial situation. We need to put more positivity into the club, starting with Moyes no of this talk that we will be lucky to get in the top 10. I want to hear we are Everton and we will go out every game to try to win and see were it takes us. There s many a club with bigger attendances than us who have won nothing recently and would love to regularly finish in top 8. Until that billionaire comes along and wants to give us all his money, get behind the club, criticise by all means but don't disrespect it like the treacherous blue union. Onward Evertonians
If Everton's second game had been cancelled This would have been our best start in 10 years But seriously lets not get depressed over One game.Lets see how things develop give Moyes and the players a chance before we start booing because the pressure and expectancy from the fans will only make the Players worse. especially at home Lets get behind them next week and give them a chance to Redeem themselves Other wise they will hate playing at HOME and loose confidence. Eddie Northwich
It wasn't 100% Moyes's fault at all, it was 50% his fault and 50% Cahill's for that absolute sitter....then again the odds may have to be reduced some for the ref not giving us the stonewall penalty.
I defend Moyes when I see fit, but to have no recognisedstriker on when losing is unforgivable...then again Saha was absolutely Cack when he came on anyway
I defend Moyes when I see fit, but to have no recognisedstriker on when losing is unforgivable...then again Saha was absolutely Cack when he came on anyway
Moyes and his tactics, team selection and placement were the reasons we we started so badly last year .. and ended up only with a respectable position.
If we fail again this year, and I'm not convinced we can pull off a 2nd half save like the last 2 years, it will ONLY be down to Moyes - not the players and not BK.
He has shown either he lacks the ability to learn and evolve or he is just plainly too scared to do anything that might stretch the defensive pattern, which for quite some time, has not been good at all! We are not creating and we have almost all of last season allowed sloppy goals to be nicked off us by weak teams.
I am not afraid of losing Moyes and falling behind... I'm afraid of keeping Moyes and watching a waste of some excellent talent!
If we fail again this year, and I'm not convinced we can pull off a 2nd half save like the last 2 years, it will ONLY be down to Moyes - not the players and not BK.
He has shown either he lacks the ability to learn and evolve or he is just plainly too scared to do anything that might stretch the defensive pattern, which for quite some time, has not been good at all! We are not creating and we have almost all of last season allowed sloppy goals to be nicked off us by weak teams.
I am not afraid of losing Moyes and falling behind... I'm afraid of keeping Moyes and watching a waste of some excellent talent!
David, how can it not also be the players fault?. It is them who constantly misplace simple passes and miss sitters. Moyes is by no means blameless but it winds me up the way so many posters wash over the blame of the players.
And don't give me this "spuare pegs, round holes" nonsense, these are vastly overpaid "professional" footballers who can't put a 10 yard pass and move system together.
Pass and move into space, it's such a simple concept, but those overpaid feckers in the middle can't seem to grasp it.
Beckford's control is getting as bad as Victor's and now it seems it has spread to old balsa King Louis, who was absolutely gash on Saturday.
Moyes's tactics need reviewing but stop being a "Player Apologist", there I'm taking that word back.
And don't give me this "spuare pegs, round holes" nonsense, these are vastly overpaid "professional" footballers who can't put a 10 yard pass and move system together.
Pass and move into space, it's such a simple concept, but those overpaid feckers in the middle can't seem to grasp it.
Beckford's control is getting as bad as Victor's and now it seems it has spread to old balsa King Louis, who was absolutely gash on Saturday.
Moyes's tactics need reviewing but stop being a "Player Apologist", there I'm taking that word back.
The fault is with both players and manager. The majority of the squad are average bar a couple of exceptions but it is a squad assembled by Moyes over the past nine years.
When on the occassion he has had money he has never addressed the issue of buying wide players. The squad is overloaded with centre backs and centre midfielders. This is bringing about the problem of playing players out of position which is a factor to team balance.
We're not Ajax and this isn't Total Football, our players aren't good enough to play anywhere on the pitch and so the manager should play them in their most effective position..
It's clear to most of us that Rodwell can't play wide, he's never going to beat a man and get to the by-line and supply crosses, Heitinga should be at centre half if he's selected, Bily can't play wide and should never have been bought as such. Osman has and is played wide and as been slaughtered down the years. Fellaini is touted as one of the best holding midfielders in the league yet gets thrown up front. These are all things us fans can see yet seem to be totally lost on our manager.
Tony (102) I am not defending that Cahill misses a sitter or Jags cant pass.. but Moyes chooses them, places them and decides on tactics...
I cannot overemphasize what playing players out of position does to them.. there is a reason defenders are defenders.. wingers wingers and strikers strikers.. they are not interchangeable without losing quality...
I cannot overemphasize what playing players out of position does to them.. there is a reason defenders are defenders.. wingers wingers and strikers strikers.. they are not interchangeable without losing quality...
Rodwell might not be a wide player but neither is Barkley and he didn't seemed to have a problem showing us that he is a good footballer.
Its amazing to think a player as average as Rodwell is considered by many a future great. What was annoying was that most are players were shattered not for the work they put in but as they were unfit. How much time does Moyes need to get players into good shape? Its one thing lacking match sharpness its a fucking crime to be physically unfit on the opening day of the season.
Lack of pace is a obvious issue right threw the team but lack of commitment and being outplayed by Journeymen and players not good enough for a relegated West Ham side points to big problems. Moyes tactics as many have said are frustrating but it looks like are best way of winning games is keeping clean sheets as if we concede were in big trouble.
No doubt Blackburn will bombard us with long balls Saturday in the way Stoke do whether we can stand up to it is another matter. It comes to something when i would prefer Hibbert playing fullback and Neville moved to midfield with Heitinga just being a empty shirt when he plays midfield. If Moyes cannot get a reaction in the next couple of games i fear for us this season.
Its amazing to think a player as average as Rodwell is considered by many a future great. What was annoying was that most are players were shattered not for the work they put in but as they were unfit. How much time does Moyes need to get players into good shape? Its one thing lacking match sharpness its a fucking crime to be physically unfit on the opening day of the season.
Lack of pace is a obvious issue right threw the team but lack of commitment and being outplayed by Journeymen and players not good enough for a relegated West Ham side points to big problems. Moyes tactics as many have said are frustrating but it looks like are best way of winning games is keeping clean sheets as if we concede were in big trouble.
No doubt Blackburn will bombard us with long balls Saturday in the way Stoke do whether we can stand up to it is another matter. It comes to something when i would prefer Hibbert playing fullback and Neville moved to midfield with Heitinga just being a empty shirt when he plays midfield. If Moyes cannot get a reaction in the next couple of games i fear for us this season.
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1 Posted 20/08/2011 at 17:46:34
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How i pine for a Joe Royle type of manager to come in and wake this club and gee the players up. QPR weren't even at full strength today. Says it all.
With this in mind i wish i didn't get Sky Sports and HD on a 12 month contract. I'd be happier using the money to do something else like golf instead.
A long tough dark season lies ahead...