Season 2011-12
The Mail Bag
Financial Fair Play
26 Comments: Can anyone tell me when the new Financial Fair Play rules kick in?
I was reading an interesting article in the Daily Mail yesterday by Martin Samuels regarding this, in which he discusses a number of clubs including Everton.
One point he makes is that it already may be too late for us to get a benefactor...
Peter Barnes, Posted 23/11/2011 at 14:58:16
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A benefactor might well be allowed to eradicate our debts and return our assets to our ownership without falling foul of any of the rules, so it wouldn't be 'too late'. We would then have at least a modest transfer budget to make gradual improvements. This is something I would instinctively find more palatable than the brash "give us your players we're richer than you" model adopted by Man City.
Also, I'm sure I could find a way round the rules. Like charging my brother £20M for an executive box for a start, as it would simply count as standard operating matchday income in the books. The rules will probably stop clubs running up debts, I doubt it can stop benefactors providing clubs with money.
Also, I'm sure I could find a way round the rules. Like charging my brother £20M for an executive box for a start, as it would simply count as standard operating matchday income in the books. The rules will probably stop clubs running up debts, I doubt it can stop benefactors providing clubs with money.
The answer?s not as clear as you might hope, Peter.
In a hugely simplified summary, the rules will be enforced from the 2013 - 14 season, but will be based on financial information from next season onwards. There will also be a diminishing amount of leeway in balancing the books until at least 2017 - 18.
Unfortunately, that leeway will be measured in tens of millions, rather than the sort of money that Man City?s owners have been throwing around so, basically, Martin Samuels, is right to point out that anybody expecting us to be able to follow in City?s footsteps is seriously deluded.
There?s a reasonable summary here...
http://www.ffw.com/feature/financial-fair-play-rules.aspx
... but there are better ones out there (I couldn?t track down the one I was looking for)
In a hugely simplified summary, the rules will be enforced from the 2013 - 14 season, but will be based on financial information from next season onwards. There will also be a diminishing amount of leeway in balancing the books until at least 2017 - 18.
Unfortunately, that leeway will be measured in tens of millions, rather than the sort of money that Man City?s owners have been throwing around so, basically, Martin Samuels, is right to point out that anybody expecting us to be able to follow in City?s footsteps is seriously deluded.
There?s a reasonable summary here...
http://www.ffw.com/feature/financial-fair-play-rules.aspx
... but there are better ones out there (I couldn?t track down the one I was looking for)
Mark, perhaps like renaming your stadium the Etihad for £400m despite the fact that company is very strongly linked to the owner of that club. The rich will get a lot richer and the rest of us will suffer.
FFP will play straight in to the hands of the clubs with big revenue. For example, with United's massive turnover and profit they will still be able to buy big and pay big. Clubs like ours and pre-Mansour City won't be able to get a wealthy benefactor who can pump hundreds of millions of pounds in to it to compete.
Ipso facto ? we will continue to languish in the doldrums whilst those at the top get even further away. Personally, I don't see anything wrong with someone wanting to pump his own money in to a football club as long as he isn't putting the club at risk à la Leeds and Portsmouth etc.
Also, I could be wrong but my understanding of FFP according to someone on TalkSport the other day was that you just can't spend more than the interest on your debts. Can somebody clear this up?
Ipso facto ? we will continue to languish in the doldrums whilst those at the top get even further away. Personally, I don't see anything wrong with someone wanting to pump his own money in to a football club as long as he isn't putting the club at risk à la Leeds and Portsmouth etc.
Also, I could be wrong but my understanding of FFP according to someone on TalkSport the other day was that you just can't spend more than the interest on your debts. Can somebody clear this up?
Platini introduced the FFP rule not to help the poor clubs like ours but to help the rich clubs move further away from the rest. But a simpler way would have been a wage cap of 65 grand a week.
That way, the big teams would not be able to pay players 250 grand a week and have them sitting on the bench collecting their pay check, and Arteta and Pienaar would still be playing for Everton.
That way, the big teams would not be able to pay players 250 grand a week and have them sitting on the bench collecting their pay check, and Arteta and Pienaar would still be playing for Everton.
I think you can still use new investment for capitol projects such as a new stadium.
Anyone who doesn't think what Man City is doing is wrong worries me:
? £190 Million DEBT in ONE year
? £110 million wages a YEAR
? Paying £2½ MILLION wages a year just for a chief executive
It's a DISGRACE!
? £190 Million DEBT in ONE year
? £110 million wages a YEAR
? Paying £2½ MILLION wages a year just for a chief executive
It's a DISGRACE!
Is this the first known use of the word 'interesting', Martin Samuels and the Daily Mail in the same sentence?
Putting that disgusting rag to one side, the FFP rules, whilst good in theory, have slightly more holes in them then your proverbial Swiss cheese.
If you look at City as a prime example, the owner(s) already own the club sponsors and the company that will be splashing out for the naming rights. These deals are supposed to reflect the commercial values involved but they are very easy to manipulate in these circumstances.
And, if needs be, a friend of a friend of the owner, second cousin twice removed for example, decided he wants a very expensive box at the Ethiad Stadium, well, ker-ching! The rich get richer etc.....
Putting that disgusting rag to one side, the FFP rules, whilst good in theory, have slightly more holes in them then your proverbial Swiss cheese.
If you look at City as a prime example, the owner(s) already own the club sponsors and the company that will be splashing out for the naming rights. These deals are supposed to reflect the commercial values involved but they are very easy to manipulate in these circumstances.
And, if needs be, a friend of a friend of the owner, second cousin twice removed for example, decided he wants a very expensive box at the Ethiad Stadium, well, ker-ching! The rich get richer etc.....
What about us. We are looking for loan deals for Donovan and Lukaku. How is that good? We should be looking for a permanent deal for Beckham and a striker, Beckham could be a good replacement for Arteta and Kenwright has said there will be msome money for a striker in January.
I think we should sign Becks and get Donovan in on loan. The Lukaku loan deal seems like a reach, not going to happen as long as AVB is under pressure to achive, he will not let him go out on loan, as he needs him in case they suffer in front of goal.
I think we should sign Becks and get Donovan in on loan. The Lukaku loan deal seems like a reach, not going to happen as long as AVB is under pressure to achive, he will not let him go out on loan, as he needs him in case they suffer in front of goal.
Beckham? BECKHAM!!!!
A replacement for Arteta..??
What was it George Best said about him...
A replacement for Arteta..??
What was it George Best said about him...
Hate to say I am ever going to agree with Arsene Wenger but, as slimy as he irrefutably is, he made an excellent point several months ago.
"Give every team in the Premier League a budget of (insert financial figure agreeable to all but I think he said £15m) a year and that is their budget for transfers and player salaries. Then we will see who has the better team."
Makes perfect sense to me. The sole problem is that it would restrict business opportunities in a capitalist environment and that would be unfair chaining all 20 teams to that restriction. That said, isn't that what the restrictions being put in place are aiming to do ~ even the field? Except they are far less workable or fair.
"Give every team in the Premier League a budget of (insert financial figure agreeable to all but I think he said £15m) a year and that is their budget for transfers and player salaries. Then we will see who has the better team."
Makes perfect sense to me. The sole problem is that it would restrict business opportunities in a capitalist environment and that would be unfair chaining all 20 teams to that restriction. That said, isn't that what the restrictions being put in place are aiming to do ~ even the field? Except they are far less workable or fair.
The fair play rule will take a long time to take effect.
Bobby #6
"the big teams would not be able to pay players 250 grand a week and have them sitting on the bench collecting their pay check, and Arteta and Pienaar would still be playing for Everton"
Actually Arteta took a pay cut to go to Arsenal and good luck to him. He was a good servant to the club and wanted to play in the Champions League, something we won't be doing anytime soon.
"the big teams would not be able to pay players 250 grand a week and have them sitting on the bench collecting their pay check, and Arteta and Pienaar would still be playing for Everton"
Actually Arteta took a pay cut to go to Arsenal and good luck to him. He was a good servant to the club and wanted to play in the Champions League, something we won't be doing anytime soon.
Ciarán, we can agree on something.
Jimmy... behave!
Jimmy... behave!
George Best about David Beckham in 2000
"Beckham - you can say he's got a good right foot but he's not got a left. "
"Beckham didn't deserve to be elected best player in the world. When he can do something else apart from cross perhaps he will."
"He (Beckham) cannot kick with his left foot, he cannot head a ball, he cannot tackle and he doesn't score many goals. Apart from that he's all right."
True words: Beckham is past it now ? his free kicks last week reminded me of Arteta at his lowest.
"Beckham - you can say he's got a good right foot but he's not got a left. "
"Beckham didn't deserve to be elected best player in the world. When he can do something else apart from cross perhaps he will."
"He (Beckham) cannot kick with his left foot, he cannot head a ball, he cannot tackle and he doesn't score many goals. Apart from that he's all right."
True words: Beckham is past it now ? his free kicks last week reminded me of Arteta at his lowest.
Nick Entwistle 17
First time you have agreed?
Could not bring myself to say the same, but ditto.
First time you have agreed?
Could not bring myself to say the same, but ditto.
Arteta didn't take a pay cut to go to Arsenal. It's a myth.
...and you know that how Richard?.....
I think people need to wise-up. This FFP is a strike AGAINST Man City. It's brought in to protect the status quo and stop teams like City, Malaga and Anzhi-whatever. The Champions League powers that be don't want one of their teams supplanted by a rising upstart.
City are buying the title this season. How is that different from what Man Utd and Liverpool did? Arsenal didn't have a problem outspending most clubs when they bought the title either. Real and Barca have done nothing but buy titles by cherry-picking the best players in the world for years. Same in Italy.
This has nothing to do with creating a level playing field and everything to do with handicapping further the have-nots. I hope City win every single fucking trophy for the next ten years and really stick it to the clubs that have spent the last 20 years skewing football to suit themselves.
Not that I'm for spending like this. There are two big problems with football at the moment. Money and Character.
The money is obscene and sickening. £250 grand for kicking a ball on a field? Disgusting.
And the character of the idiot, moaning fans constantly calling for people to be sacked or dropped. And the idiot players unable to avoid the money grabbing bimbo/slag in a nightclub and literally proving day after day that they have more money than sense.
This sport is finished. It's become a system of contol.
City are buying the title this season. How is that different from what Man Utd and Liverpool did? Arsenal didn't have a problem outspending most clubs when they bought the title either. Real and Barca have done nothing but buy titles by cherry-picking the best players in the world for years. Same in Italy.
This has nothing to do with creating a level playing field and everything to do with handicapping further the have-nots. I hope City win every single fucking trophy for the next ten years and really stick it to the clubs that have spent the last 20 years skewing football to suit themselves.
Not that I'm for spending like this. There are two big problems with football at the moment. Money and Character.
The money is obscene and sickening. £250 grand for kicking a ball on a field? Disgusting.
And the character of the idiot, moaning fans constantly calling for people to be sacked or dropped. And the idiot players unable to avoid the money grabbing bimbo/slag in a nightclub and literally proving day after day that they have more money than sense.
This sport is finished. It's become a system of contol.
John, you must feel a whole lot better with that off your chest.
There is no way Everton will sign Beckham for several reasons:
? I think last January, Beckam said he would not come to Everton having played for Manchester United.
? Everton could not afford his wages.
? Beckham has said this week that he would not play for another Premier League club.
? I think Beckham will keep playing abroad.
? I think last January, Beckam said he would not come to Everton having played for Manchester United.
? Everton could not afford his wages.
? Beckham has said this week that he would not play for another Premier League club.
? I think Beckham will keep playing abroad.
County Rd. or the Champs Elysees??? I can see why he can't make his mind up!
Most of what was written about Beckham at his peak was spite because of his lifestyle. He was a great player capable of scoring 15 a season and creating another 30-40. He's won everything going bar international and you can hardly blame him for that. He's played for three of the biggest clubs in the world and is revered by each side's fans. The fact that he sells loads of shirts shouldn't even be a footnote in an outstanding career.
Most of what was written about Beckham at his peak was spite because of his lifestyle. He was a great player capable of scoring 15 a season and creating another 30-40. He's won everything going bar international and you can hardly blame him for that. He's played for three of the biggest clubs in the world and is revered by each side's fans. The fact that he sells loads of shirts shouldn't even be a footnote in an outstanding career.
His missus is a bit of a pig though!
I watch Galaxy all the time. Beckham still retains that educated right foot of his and, in fairness, he got himself in sick shape this season. But a 90 minute, full EPL season? Those days are gone.
He stands out over here for the obvious reason beyond his name value, technical skill in MLS is sorely lacking which causes Beckham's crossing and corner-kicking to really stand out. In all of MLS only Donovan can match up.
Plus, Arena, intentionally deploys players around Beckham to enable him to jog or lope into space instead of having to work hard for that space as he would if he comes back there.
Can't see an EPL manager doing that for Beckham game in and out, especially as Beckham's body cannot withstand even the 38 game EPL schedule, never mind all the other tournament games.
Myself, I believe all the "move to France" talk simply the routine "Negotiating in the press at the end of a contract" that goes on all the time between player and Club.
Put another way, if the EPL was Beckham's only option, he'd have to retire. This way he can get another 2-3 years as a big fish in the biggest small pond, the USA or a big fish in a tiny pond, France. Can't see him choosing the latter. On the other hand, didn't see him coming to MLS 5 years ago. So who knows?
One thing certain though. David Beckham as a regular in EPL is a non-starter. Those days are gone.
He stands out over here for the obvious reason beyond his name value, technical skill in MLS is sorely lacking which causes Beckham's crossing and corner-kicking to really stand out. In all of MLS only Donovan can match up.
Plus, Arena, intentionally deploys players around Beckham to enable him to jog or lope into space instead of having to work hard for that space as he would if he comes back there.
Can't see an EPL manager doing that for Beckham game in and out, especially as Beckham's body cannot withstand even the 38 game EPL schedule, never mind all the other tournament games.
Myself, I believe all the "move to France" talk simply the routine "Negotiating in the press at the end of a contract" that goes on all the time between player and Club.
Put another way, if the EPL was Beckham's only option, he'd have to retire. This way he can get another 2-3 years as a big fish in the biggest small pond, the USA or a big fish in a tiny pond, France. Can't see him choosing the latter. On the other hand, didn't see him coming to MLS 5 years ago. So who knows?
One thing certain though. David Beckham as a regular in EPL is a non-starter. Those days are gone.
FFP is just another thing. The Clubs with clout will do what they want and dare anyone to do anything about it. Let's get ownership with the financial wherewithall and get into that mix.
As far as Wenger's comments on giving everyone the same amount of money? Nothing much will change. The well-run Clubs will do well and the rest will be the rest.
As far as Wenger's comments on giving everyone the same amount of money? Nothing much will change. The well-run Clubs will do well and the rest will be the rest.
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1 Posted 23/11/2011 at 17:19:47
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