The Mail Bag
Fellaini or Rodwell?
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It appears that Moyes is going to persist this season with 4-5-1.
Cahill looks to be the man to play in behind whichever striker is fit, that leaves Arteta and Pienaar in the creative roles with Osman, Bily, Anichebe or A N Other wide right. This leaves us with the defensive midfield role which if we expect Heitinga to slot in at centre-half then it looks like its between Fellaini and Rodwell for the holding role. It's difficult to split them but it looks like Moyes is favouring Fellaini who he selected despite the fact that he doesn't seem to be 100%.
Anthony Hughes, Posted 16/08/2010 at 10:02:34
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It'll be Fellaini, Heitinga or even Neville at a push. Rodwell, at the moment, isn't considered experienced or aggressive enough for the holding position. He's more suited to attacking positions at present.
Bilyaletdinov or Anichebe on the right, Arteta and Fellaini in the middle of the park, Pienaar on the left and Cahill just off the striker.
Bilyaletdinov or Anichebe on the right, Arteta and Fellaini in the middle of the park, Pienaar on the left and Cahill just off the striker.
Both of them need to be starting alongside each other in my opinion. Fellaini, as he proved during his purple patch last season, is better in the holding role whilst Rodwell looks much more effective when he's given a greater licence to go forward.
I think Rodwell is at the stage now where he needs, and deserves, to be starting games, not coming on for the last 10 minutes as a replacement for one of Moyesies old stalwarts..
I think Rodwell is at the stage now where he needs, and deserves, to be starting games, not coming on for the last 10 minutes as a replacement for one of Moyesies old stalwarts..
I think he'll rotate, Anthony.
Sssssshhhhh, don't tell anyone but we will have injuries this season.
I'd prefer Rodwell on the right instead of Osman, At least he's mobile. It's obviously not a role suited for Rodwell, as he'd be better through the middle, but if you're going to pick Osman to play there why not Jack?
I think because we were away against Blackburn Bily was left out, but if Victor isn't fit I'd expect DM to play Bily at home against Wolves next week.
It all highlights the fact that we still need a player whose best position is playing out on the right with pace. Bily and Pienaar are both similar, no great pace, but good technically. All the top teams have a quick wide player in their squad eg. Walcott, Nani, SWP, Lennon etc. Maybe Gueye could turn out to be ours but it's too early to tell at the moment.
I think because we were away against Blackburn Bily was left out, but if Victor isn't fit I'd expect DM to play Bily at home against Wolves next week.
It all highlights the fact that we still need a player whose best position is playing out on the right with pace. Bily and Pienaar are both similar, no great pace, but good technically. All the top teams have a quick wide player in their squad eg. Walcott, Nani, SWP, Lennon etc. Maybe Gueye could turn out to be ours but it's too early to tell at the moment.
Both without a doubt, with Arteta, Pienaar, Cahill and Bily fighting for the 3 places between them and the striker.
4-2-3-1 seems to be the way to go and I can't imagine many teams can match a deep lying pair like those two.
4-2-3-1 seems to be the way to go and I can't imagine many teams can match a deep lying pair like those two.
I agree with that Andrew. I don't think it's case of Moyes persisting with 4-5-1 at all, more likely to be 4-2-3-1.
Except that he might play Arteta deeper along with Fellaini, and have Rodwell in a more advanced role.
Except that he might play Arteta deeper along with Fellaini, and have Rodwell in a more advanced role.
Fellaini would be my first choice in that defensive midfielder role because Rodwell would be better used as an attacking midfielder. I've been banging on about it for ages but Rodwell should be played in the middle with Arteta given the license to go forward or competing with Cahill for his position. It's bloody simple for me, just play your best team, Moyes, with whoever is on form and playing better getting the nod. Osman can only play in the middle and should be way down the pecking order with what we have got.
I agree to play them both... maybe with a diamond midfield:
Fellaini
Arteta Rodwell Pienaar
Cahill
Fellaini
Arteta Rodwell Pienaar
Cahill
I would also play them both in a 4-2-3-1, but will Moyes do this? I'd like to think he would but I think he's a safety-first manager and the above formation may prove too adventurous for him.
The recurring theme here is that we are overloaded with players who are best suited to central midfield positions and can't really boast of having any wide players. Square pegs which affects the balance of the team.
With the players we have at the moment, play them both. Wouldn't mind the Russian lad from Sporting who we are the verge of signing... so say goal.com!
Anthony, I guess the real purpose of 4-2-3-1 is that it takes away the need for an old-fashioned winger type, but gives more creative type players a bit more time in the opposition half to do their damage. If Arteta had the freedom of Fellaini and Rodwell covering his back, he could concentrate a lot more on what he does best which is putting his foot on the ball, controlling the tempo and choosing where, when and who he makes those killer passes too.
Agree with that assessment Andrew but when we need another option possibly with pace and width we don't have the players to employ this tactic and our plan B becomes the long-ball bypassing the midfield. If we are to progress, we need to have more flexiblity in the squad.
Fellaini showed last year that he should be one of the first names on the teamsheet, regardless who else is available, and I firmly believe he will show us over the next year or two that he is the best player at our club.
The problem is, how is Moyes going to fit everyone in? I'd be surprised if he dropped Distin for Heitinga, although Heitinga is one of the best paid and more outspoken players in the squad, so where does he play? Rodwell needs games in order to carry on his progression, but would you really drop either Arteta or Fellaini? Or does Arteta revert to his original position for us out on the right wing?
I agree that we have a lot better in the squad than Hibbert and Osman, but both are decent performers, who are Everton through and through, so Moyes shows loyalty to them, but I also think that they would not kick off too much if they were on the bench.
Coleman will not play or even make the bench much, except maybe Carling Cup etc... It would have been a good idea for him to do the first 3/6 months with Blackpool, to get him to grips with the Premier League.
We should without doubt cash in on Yobo and the Yak, Yobo is prone to error when low on confidence, and it looks like he will struggle to even make the bench, so do we really want him coming on when he is needed? Surely we could get £5m.
The problem is, how is Moyes going to fit everyone in? I'd be surprised if he dropped Distin for Heitinga, although Heitinga is one of the best paid and more outspoken players in the squad, so where does he play? Rodwell needs games in order to carry on his progression, but would you really drop either Arteta or Fellaini? Or does Arteta revert to his original position for us out on the right wing?
I agree that we have a lot better in the squad than Hibbert and Osman, but both are decent performers, who are Everton through and through, so Moyes shows loyalty to them, but I also think that they would not kick off too much if they were on the bench.
Coleman will not play or even make the bench much, except maybe Carling Cup etc... It would have been a good idea for him to do the first 3/6 months with Blackpool, to get him to grips with the Premier League.
We should without doubt cash in on Yobo and the Yak, Yobo is prone to error when low on confidence, and it looks like he will struggle to even make the bench, so do we really want him coming on when he is needed? Surely we could get £5m.
Yak hasn't appeared much, very little pre-season, and not even on the bench on Saturday, so there must be something going on behind the scenes. Let's face it, he is a good goalscorer, but will not get any better, so realistically it is time to cash in and get a more all-round striker in to add pace and strength.
Off on a bit of a tangent there, do any of you agree?
I don't know why Moyes doesn't play 4-2-3-1 and play Rodwell and Fellaini deep and then play Pienaar, Cahill and Arteta further forward.
Pienaar doesn't play as an out-and-out winger and comes inside allowing Baines to get down the left wing and Arteta could do the same.
At the World Cup, Germany played 4-2-3-1 with Khedira sitting and Schweinstieger at the side of him dictating the play, that's the roles Fellaini and Rodwell could play for us, Fellaini sitting and screening and Rodwell could be the playing DM, linking up with those 3 infront.
I know people will say Arteta is wasted out wide but does he have to play like a winger just cos he's there? Muller didn't for Germany, he got involved centrally and did well and got goals and was very effective and he isn't a natural wide man, he actually plays upfront or behind the striker for Bayern but I'm sure Arteta would do a job for us there, especially if we had Coleman playing RB.
The 4-2-3-1 formation is suited to having attacking FBs if you have a narrow midfield like ours would be, so the likes of Baines and Coleman would get forward and then the likes of Fellaini and Rodwell would sit in and cover whenever they ventured forward.
For me, I wouldn't mind seeing Arteta a bit further up the pitch and making things happen, when he's deeper and alongside the likes of Fellaini or Heitinga he seems a bit restricted to me and just gets on the ball and moves it on. I'd like to see Rodwell and Fellaini picking the ball up deep from the back and playing it on to the likes of Arteta and Pienaar and let them create things up top.
Pienaar doesn't play as an out-and-out winger and comes inside allowing Baines to get down the left wing and Arteta could do the same.
At the World Cup, Germany played 4-2-3-1 with Khedira sitting and Schweinstieger at the side of him dictating the play, that's the roles Fellaini and Rodwell could play for us, Fellaini sitting and screening and Rodwell could be the playing DM, linking up with those 3 infront.
I know people will say Arteta is wasted out wide but does he have to play like a winger just cos he's there? Muller didn't for Germany, he got involved centrally and did well and got goals and was very effective and he isn't a natural wide man, he actually plays upfront or behind the striker for Bayern but I'm sure Arteta would do a job for us there, especially if we had Coleman playing RB.
The 4-2-3-1 formation is suited to having attacking FBs if you have a narrow midfield like ours would be, so the likes of Baines and Coleman would get forward and then the likes of Fellaini and Rodwell would sit in and cover whenever they ventured forward.
For me, I wouldn't mind seeing Arteta a bit further up the pitch and making things happen, when he's deeper and alongside the likes of Fellaini or Heitinga he seems a bit restricted to me and just gets on the ball and moves it on. I'd like to see Rodwell and Fellaini picking the ball up deep from the back and playing it on to the likes of Arteta and Pienaar and let them create things up top.
Both as I prefer Heitinga at CB.
The question should be moot. It's 2010, not 1985. Top clubs should be expecting to play upwards of 45 games a season, excluding any involvement in Europe. That means rotation is the order of the day.
The question remains as to who is the 'better' player, but there can be no substitute for having both of them playing regularly, ready to go, match fit and fighting each other for a place in the side.
And of course, a REALLY good manager will choose the player to suit the opposition on the day. Rodwell and Fellaini have the same role in the side but go about it differently and the decision on who to play should depend on who is most suited to cause the given opposition the most problems.
The question remains as to who is the 'better' player, but there can be no substitute for having both of them playing regularly, ready to go, match fit and fighting each other for a place in the side.
And of course, a REALLY good manager will choose the player to suit the opposition on the day. Rodwell and Fellaini have the same role in the side but go about it differently and the decision on who to play should depend on who is most suited to cause the given opposition the most problems.
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1 Posted 16/08/2010 at 13:55:42
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Jack will play in the cup games perhaps?