Yes, we were pretty awful, especially in the first half, but we lost 0-1 to a dodgy penalty in a match where the officials completely bottled it. They didn't even give us a corner when the ball went a yard over the line.

Out of possession, we were typically solid. I never really felt like Leeds were going to score and Pickford didn't make any difficult saves, just a couple of fairly routine ones. To read some of the comments, you'd think the ball was bouncing off our woodwork every 5 minutes.

In possession, we were absolutely dreadful. I don't know if it was Moyes's set-up or the players feeling tense, but we just didn't attack. Our first home game needs a completely different attitude. I don't really know how Moyes complains about needing attacking options when he didn't even use the ones he's got. McNeil should have come on, even if it was only at left-back, once the goal went in.

Complaining that the manager, coaches, all the players, the owners and the tea lady are all irretrievably terrible might make you feel better for a bit, but it's not true, realistic or helpful.

What needs to change is our attitude in possession of the ball.

Your last paragraph is down to bad management as the manager's job is to motivate the team.

Moyes did not want a West Ham result, so he set up what seasoned Professional s he had.With the negative caution of a relegation Manager youth was not given a chance.This is a problem when the Club's transfer policy is to reduce the average age of the squad and put a emphasis to use the available resources to do this, This is the correct policy.Moyes will only play youth under pressure.
.

I'm as frustrated as everyone and have two Leeds fans at work who haven't stopped gloating today. They're worse than RS fans. A one-team city who laugh at our fans, our songs, our team but have spent most of their recent history outside the top division. Today has honestly been worse than losing a derby because begrudgingly, I have to admit that the RS are lightyears ahead of us but a good Everton side would have beaten them last night.

Brighton at home is a tricky game in a new stadium which is as new to us as it is to them. Lose two matches and we'll be into the usual dread and it's not even September.

What needs to change? We need to start recruiting players that we need rather than what we want. How on earth can we still have Seamus Coleman as our main option at right back? How on earth is Michael Keane starting a season at centre back? Why have we signed two goalkeepers who will get minimal game time? Why have we recruited Barry who seems on (extremely) early signs to be Moise Kean II? Do we ever learn? Why do we seem to pin transfer hopes on a single player and waste weeks in protracted negotiations that we're never going to gain from? We did that with Giroud years ago and still haven't learned. Why do we continually look to play the ball backwards? Why have players got no awareness that if they lose the ball in a certain position then we're in trouble? Why don't we sign players with pace and aggression? Why do we give stupid fouls away in dangerous areas? Why does our keeper start a session of keep-ball in our area only to then launch it 5 passes later? Why do we make substitutions after the opposition have made 3 or 4 changes? Why do I get swept up in pre-season optimism and feel flat as anything at the end of August?

It's the hope that kills you with Everton.

His team selection and strategy played right into Leeds hands and basically said we won't attack you so come get us especially the first twenty minutes.

Leaving Grealish on the bench and playing Beto on his own up front was a big error and gave Leed the confidence and impetus to get most of their players forward at every opportunity

Okay in the end they almost snatched a draw only for some bad luck but it wouldn't have exonerated Moyes.

They need a big comeback game against Brighton but how many times have we said that and it never happens.

Go and get the Bournemouth manager.

Things are never as good they seem when you're winning and they're never as bad as they seem when you're losing.

Keane, Coleman and Gana in the last chance saloon. Patterson as brittle as ever and can be written off as having nothing to offer. Branthwaite needs nursing. A couple of months before he's back to his best and hopefully he can remain fit. Beto is a lost cause. Chermiti is in our growing ranks of the "not ready" (read won't ever be ready). Likewise, Tim Woebegone. Barry, maybe ready some day, Moyes notwithstanding. Aznou ? What's going on there. One for the future? McNeil has become a bit part player.

But at least our "marquee" signing is, according to Moyes, probably able to play every second game. He's not a keeper though. But we're OK on that front.

Things had better change for the Brighton game and we must sign, at the very least good, speedy RB and RW.

Only one game so far, I know. But far worse performance than expected and not acceptable.

FFS EFC get your finger out and sign players, who have experience and are ready to go NOW !

Play with commitment, passion, ferocity. Get the crowd on its feet and and roaring.

Everything else is peripheral. Our core value is playing harder than the other guy. Do that.

Moods are low this week after that wretched performance on Monday but lets not forget that the transfer window is a shady spectacle full of shadow and mirrors where 90% of what we read in the papers and online is guesswork.

I've no doubt we will have at least one additional RW in the next 11 days, whether that is Dibling or someone else we can't be so sure. Personally I'm more convinced that a high class 6 is going to be the difference maker for us right now. Angelo Stiller anyone?

I also have no doubts we will get a RW before the window shuts Sam and it’s got to be Takefusa Kubo imo. I appreciate the problems it caused in the past but right now the situation could become so dire we need to bit the bullet and accept that we may need to pay over the odds for a couple of full backs and a right winger.

Mike@20

Agreed Mike. We played that game like it was another pre season friendly, no intensity or passion. Penalty decision was a disgrace but in reality we deserved absolutely nothing from that game. First game of the season and I’m already chucking stuff around the lounge.

I have a horrible feeling that we won't get much and are in big trouble.

What's the saying...? If you feel weakened, you need to fight harder!

It requires all 11 players to have a high technical level, the team shape to be set up correctly, movement off the ball, pre-arranged patterns of play, the team ethos to be 'forward thinking' - usually with a higher line than we play.

Moyes has never had a team that dominates possession at its core. He is essentially a non-possession coach.

No matter what players come in, we will never be that type of team. New recruits will be brought in with the aim of improving the KITAP1 ideology and maximising breaks, free kicks etc.

Tbf to Moyes, it may be the way we need to operate for a few seasons until we can increase the quality and depth of the squad. Perhaps then we could change our footballing philosophy.

Nigel@25 the rumour is that Kubo is valued at £60m. I don't see us paying (or being able to afford) that; I agree we need a RW but it may be someone who we've hardly heard of. I like Bakwa at Strasbourg who seems good value at around £26m.

Ajay@26, I think we are all frustrated, especially after Monday. When the window is shut that will be the time for serious dissection of our summer's transfer work but there remains serious gaps currently. Yes, Stiller is probably destined for bigger clubs but you never know! A player of that ilk would really transform us potentially.

Donnarumma (PSG)
Tyrell Malacia (Man Utd)
Kiwior (Arsenal)
Chilwell (Chelsea)
Zinchenko (Arsenal)
Garnacho (Man Utd)
Bissouma (Tottenham)
Kalvin-Phillips (Man City)
Raheem Sterling (Chelsea)
Nkunku (Chelsea)
Jackson (Chelsea)

Do you see any of them being interested in joining Everton, and who do you think are worth pursuing? Some TWers are advocating a punt on Bissouma, but I don't think Evertonians –and particularly, David Moyes – will put up with his reported disciplinary issues. Malacia may be an interesting option – although primarily a left-back, he has played right-back for Man Utd. Could Jackson be a surprise last-minute option on loan?

Bissouma is the right type but has had discipline issues at Spurs which would not go down well with Moyes. Maybe he could re-invigorate him but seems unlikely.

I like Zinchenko as a versatile option who could probably do a good job at 6 too where he plays for Ukraine. Could be a good loan though he's had one or two injury issues. I also think Kiwior is an underrated defender who could play in a few different positions. Am not sure either are starting XI picks necessarily but as we saw on Monday we also need more depth and genuinely versatile players really help on that front.

I think we should offer Lucas Vasquez a contract. He's a free agent with years of experience at Real Madrid playing right back/wingback and still has plenty to offer. Yeah he's 34 but look at the job Ashley Young did for us and he was older.

Vasquez is still in excellent condition and could be just what we need.

I am sold on Vazquez! He has just turned 34, and if he has looked after himself well, should give us at least 2 years of top-class right-back play. He would be a huge improvement on anybody we have had recently in that position. Massively experienced in La Liga and the Champions League, he would be a good role model for the likes of Dixon and Patterson. But I wonder if he would be interested in joining Everton. The Saudi League seems like a more probable destination for him.

Myself, I would be happy if we signed Matty Cash (or Vazquez) for right-back, John McGinn in central midfield and a reliable striker (Højlund is on that I have been advocating). I would be willing to wait on the pacy right-winger for the next window, as I believe McNeil, Grealish, or Alcaraz can do a job there for the time being.

Beto hasn't a clue concerning hold-up play as his control is very poor. If Barry isn't trusted, then why did we spend so much on him when we need a striker ready to play? He needs a full game to show what he can do with Grealish and Ndiaye in support.

Moyes needs to motivate the players as there wasn't enough aggression or determination to win battles against Leeds. This squad is nowhere near as poor as folk are saying but Moyes needs to pick the right players and fire them up – less of the moaning to protect himself!

And Grealish must start.

Lucas Vazquez is in good shape - there's a load of training videos online of him keeping himself in condition so he'd just need to be gotten up to match fitness by the looks of things.

Like you say maybe he'll go to Saudi but he's surely someone we should be offering a contract, even if just for a year.

Three, four or five quick passes, definitely open a lot of teams up, especially when you often concede possession and draw your opponents on?

I thought if we would have had a little bit more in our forward areas the other night, we would have ran away from Leeds, during that second half, but we just never had enough craft, and we never had enough pace, and that’s why it’s imperative we sign a few more players.

N’Diaye and Grealish, both possess loads of quality, but they are going to need their fullbacks running past them sometimes, plus we definitely need more pace out wide, and a centre forward, who as well as being able to run in behind, can also get hold of the ball, because I believe second phase play, is very important for a non possession team?

Midfield is the engine room of a side; if your midfield is not good enough, you are goosed. I was pleased when we signed Dewsbury-Hall but we have to see how he pans out.

It's very early days yet, it's too soon to panic.

I've read Hoijlund is more likely to go to Napoli on loan as cover.

Just decide on Who we wany and go and get them. A few million over the odds is no big deal if they are the right players.

Kellen Fisher - Right back
Jamie Vardy - proven goal scorer for 30 minutes a game
Fatawu - right wing. (Dibling/ Fofana)

We don't need a recruitment committee just a man with a checkbook!!!!

I get the feeling we have been hanging on for Fofana hoping that a CL club don't come in for him and so he will grace Everton with his presence. If so that is very high risk.

If it was as simple as you say we wouldn't be having this problem recruiting who we want/need. Many other clubs are in a similar position - my guess is this will run till transfer deadline day because that's when agents/selling clubs get the best deals.

Presently, after spending millions of pounds on players, there has been no sign of the type of players we really needed being brought in.

Is there nowhere in England and Europe that, since the 2024-25 season players of the standard we want have been available or do we just have to keep looking at who other teams are looking at before negotiating and loose out?

This is not just 2 players we are looking for, it is the position in the league we may end up in without them.

Look at the players other non top six clubs are signing and ask yourself why didn't we go for them?

We've signed Barry, Aznou, KDH and Grealish. Also Travers, King and Alcaraz (although he was already here).

I don't really see any difference in us when compared to clubs such as Wolves, Fulham, Palace, Villa, Bournemouth, Newcastle, West Ham, Man Utd... technically we've signed 7 players this summer. All of those mentioned have signed less than 7 so honestly don't think your point holds a great deal of weight.

We also lost 3 loan players and 3 players on the books so a rebuild was always going to be difficult. Remember we're dealing with a historical mess, not one of the current manager or owners making.

Is he injured? Not match fit? Or just out of favor after a poor showing pre-season?

It depends how much money we can spend. With this PSR rubbish, it's likely to be not enough.

Alcaraz was already here and we let go 4 experienced Premier League players and, as far as I am concerned, only signed KDH of Premier League quality.

The squad was already one of the smallest in the Premier League last season, so we have weakened it even further.

You're making this into a debate about who is right or wrong - I'm merely responding to what you asked me to do which was to look at other clubs signings and compare them to ours.

All I'm saying is that they're comparable in numbers. I don't know how good Aznou is for example, yet you do? Barry as well? You seem to know exactly how good, or seemingly how bad all the players are we've signed. Grealish is no good either? Come off it, Jay - we both know that's not true.

You've made zero effort to debate anything - all you're doing is telling me what the truth of the matter is, when actually you have no more idea about what's the truth here than any other supporter of any club. And you're basing your claims on future predictions anyway.

We've all played one game yet you're in absolutely no doubt that what you're saying is completely correct. That's not really debating, nor is it realistic. In case you missed it, West Ham lost 3-0 to Sunderland as well.

Your last paragraph is actually agreeing with me as well. Although you've trimmed it down to 4 players we let go, but I believe it was more like 6.

Debating with you is extremely frustrating so I think I'll give it a miss from now on unless you have something sensible to say.

Other teams have signed Tete, Walker, Walker-Peters,, Hutchison, Elanga, Ferguson, Tierney, Partey, Ramsey, Bailey, Doak, Jadon Anthony, Sarr, Gittens, Petrovic, Madueke, Ugochukwu, Gudmunson, Bijol, Longstaff, Stach, Callum Wilson, Cunha, Ndoye, Macatee, Diarra, Xhaka, Bellingham, Kudus, Arias, Tchatchoua, Semedo etc.

A lot of those would have been good additions to our squad but the elite recruitment committee were too busy arguing with each other to get much needed additions to the squad.

The point I was trying to make was that most teams have strengthened but we have significantly weakened what was already a small squad.

I also disagree that you get the best deals at the last minute as most clubs will not allow a quality player to go because they don't have time to get a replacement. Last minute deals are usually out of desperation.

I'm not trying to be a know it all Just expressing a polar opposite opinion to yours.

Celik has played RB 161, RM 54 and CD 23. He's 28, a Turkish Int with 54 caps.

Rensch has played RB 132, CB 64, LB 13. He's 22 and a Netherlands U21 International with 22 caps.

This takes one of their players off the wage bill and solves an urgent problem for us, for the cost of his wages. It also means we can try before buying and saves us money, that we can use for this summers business.