The energy surrounding Everton Football Club was undoubtedly positive as the team headed into the first game of the season against Leeds United.

The new Hill Dickinson Stadium and the arrival of Jack Grealish had fans in a good mood, especially after the progress on the pitch under David Moyes in the latter half of the 2024-25 season.​

After 45 minutes at Elland Road on Monday night, that positive energy was gone and, despite small improvements in the second half, a penalty conceded by James Tarkowski put an end to any hopes of crawling away with a lucky 3 points. ​

Everton didn’t create a single shot in the first half, and only took 31 touches in the Leeds half, of which only two were in the home side's penalty area. Leeds were mostly restricted to half-chances, but the Toffees’ inability to retain possession gave Leeds plenty of opportunity to put pressure on the Everton back four.

Due to injuries to Jarrad Branthwaite and Vitalii Mykolenko, David Moyes employed a back four of Jake O’Brien, James Tarkowski, Michael Keane, and James Garner, who had been used as a makeshift right-back in the past but was playing as a left-back. Garner’s move into the back four meant that the more defensive Tim Iroegbunam stepped into midfield alongside Idrissa Gana Gueye.

Defensively, the changes didn’t cause too many issues; Everton only conceded two shots on target, apart from the penalty, but they wreaked havoc on the team’s build-up play.

Leeds pressed well as a unit, leaving the Everton defence little time to pick their pass into the midfield. Most of the time, they didn’t, forced to hoof it forward to Beto, whose hold-up play left much to be desired, but wasn’t surrounded by physical players who could help him out. Iliman Ndiaye and Kieran Dewsbury-Hall are both slight technical midfielders, while Carlos Alcaraz was simply losing his battles for the second ball.

When Everton tried to play out from the back, it was even worse. Losing Branthwaite is a blow, as he’s naturally good with the ball at his feet, but moving James Garner to left back meant that Everton were left without a player in midfield who could move the ball forward.

Tim Iroegbunam completed just 14 passes in his 71 minutes on the pitch. Compare that to James Garner, who occupied the same position against Roma and completed 49.

So what can David Moyes change ahead of Brighton? Assuming he’s picking from the same squad he had available this week.

If Mykolenko is fit, then the back four picks itself, and Garner moves back into midfield. If he isn’t, Moyes could employ a back five similar to what we saw in the Premier League Summer Series.

The back three would mean additional support for either Nathan Patterson or Seamus Coleman at right-back, and could also allow for Dwight McNeil to play left-wing back. It's a position he’s occupied before, and it would give Everton another option for carrying the ball forward and linking defence and attack.

On the other side of the pitch, Ndiaye and Dewsbury-Hall showed small flashes of creativity in an otherwise dull game, so they will naturally be in the side again, while Carlos Alcaraz should make way for Jack Grealish after an average performance, provided David Moyes deems the new man able to play from the start.

At striker, even if he doesn’t start, Thierno Barry deserves a longer cameo after a disappointing showing from Beto, especially against a Brighton defence that lacks pace.

Regardless of the personnel changes, supporters will hope to see a much-improved performance from the team on a historic day for the football club as a whole.


Reader Comments (55)

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Neil Lawson
1 Posted 19/08/2025 at 09:24:05
Difficult to argue with those conclusions. Choose a starting line up and set the team up to win from the start rather than cling on in the hope of a late goal.
All of us don't want to see our team lose but we can stomach a loss if the team plays positively and is totally committed but are beaten on the day by a better team. We can not and will not tolerate a negative mindset where we appear to concede that the opposition ( whoever they may be ) are better than us and should be feared.
Mike Allison
2 Posted 19/08/2025 at 09:35:09
I guess I'm not surprised by the massive over-reaction.

Yes, we were pretty awful, especially in the first half, but we lost 0-1 to a dodgy penalty in a match where the officials completely bottled it. They didn't even give us a corner when the ball went a yard over the line.

Out of possession, we were typically solid. I never really felt like Leeds were going to score and Pickford didn't make any difficult saves, just a couple of fairly routine ones. To read some of the comments, you'd think the ball was bouncing off our woodwork every 5 minutes.

In possession, we were absolutely dreadful. I don't know if it was Moyes's set-up or the players feeling tense, but we just didn't attack. Our first home game needs a completely different attitude. I don't really know how Moyes complains about needing attacking options when he didn't even use the ones he's got. McNeil should have come on, even if it was only at left-back, once the goal went in.

Complaining that the manager, coaches, all the players, the owners and the tea lady are all irretrievably terrible might make you feel better for a bit, but it's not true, realistic or helpful.

What needs to change is our attitude in possession of the ball.

Dave Lynch
3 Posted 19/08/2025 at 09:44:33
Bit of an oxymoron post that, Mike (with respect).

Your last paragraph is down to bad management as the manager's job is to motivate the team.

Josh Horne
4 Posted 19/08/2025 at 09:55:55
Mike@2 they were not hitting the woodwork every 5 minutes, I agree that they really weren't much of a threat.
They weren't very good in fact, but we still conceded the entire pitch to them for most of the match and snuffed out our own attacks by playing back to the keeper. That has to come from the manager, and he has got form for it.
Jerome Shields
5 Posted 19/08/2025 at 10:33:18
Angus that is about right.Iroegbunam was out of position. I would have reversed position with Dewsbury Hall.Possession in midfield was woeful. I put that down to lack of a coherent plan and coaching.Beto is never a Target Man and hoofing the ball does not utilise the available players. The forwards ball supply was non existent.

Moyes did not want a West Ham result, so he set up what seasoned Professional s he had.With the negative caution of a relegation Manager youth was not given a chance.This is a problem when the Club's transfer policy is to reduce the average age of the squad and put a emphasis to use the available resources to do this, This is the correct policy.Moyes will only play youth under pressure.
.

Craig Walker
6 Posted 19/08/2025 at 13:08:32
Sometimes it is difficult to judge the state of Everton. We sign a few players who, on paper, seem an improvement on what we have and contributors start mentioning "Europe" or "top 5". We lose one game and we are relegation certainties and the manager has to go. My dad used to say that you are only ever 3 bad results away from a crisis at Everton.

I'm as frustrated as everyone and have two Leeds fans at work who haven't stopped gloating today. They're worse than RS fans. A one-team city who laugh at our fans, our songs, our team but have spent most of their recent history outside the top division. Today has honestly been worse than losing a derby because begrudgingly, I have to admit that the RS are lightyears ahead of us but a good Everton side would have beaten them last night.

Brighton at home is a tricky game in a new stadium which is as new to us as it is to them. Lose two matches and we'll be into the usual dread and it's not even September.

What needs to change? We need to start recruiting players that we need rather than what we want. How on earth can we still have Seamus Coleman as our main option at right back? How on earth is Michael Keane starting a season at centre back? Why have we signed two goalkeepers who will get minimal game time? Why have we recruited Barry who seems on (extremely) early signs to be Moise Kean II? Do we ever learn? Why do we seem to pin transfer hopes on a single player and waste weeks in protracted negotiations that we're never going to gain from? We did that with Giroud years ago and still haven't learned. Why do we continually look to play the ball backwards? Why have players got no awareness that if they lose the ball in a certain position then we're in trouble? Why don't we sign players with pace and aggression? Why do we give stupid fouls away in dangerous areas? Why does our keeper start a session of keep-ball in our area only to then launch it 5 passes later? Why do we make substitutions after the opposition have made 3 or 4 changes? Why do I get swept up in pre-season optimism and feel flat as anything at the end of August?

It's the hope that kills you with Everton.

Tom Bowers
7 Posted 19/08/2025 at 13:31:20
Make no mistake Moyes cost us this game.

His team selection and strategy played right into Leeds hands and basically said we won't attack you so come get us especially the first twenty minutes.

Leaving Grealish on the bench and playing Beto on his own up front was a big error and gave Leed the confidence and impetus to get most of their players forward at every opportunity

Okay in the end they almost snatched a draw only for some bad luck but it wouldn't have exonerated Moyes.

They need a big comeback game against Brighton but how many times have we said that and it never happens.

Ajay Gopal
8 Posted 19/08/2025 at 13:31:34
It has gone all quiet on the rumours front. No credible information available anywhere on the net, which is concerning for me. Nottingham Forest seem to be gobbling up our targets - McAtee, Hutchinson, Douglas Luiz, maybe Rico Lewis? Maybe it will come down to the last few days/hours of the transfer window, where we scrape around for the leftovers. Nothing seems to have changed at Everton.
Colin Malone
9 Posted 19/08/2025 at 13:45:34
Moyes is Moyes. He won't change.

Go and get the Bournemouth manager.

Mike Allison
10 Posted 19/08/2025 at 13:52:37
Dave, what I'm saying is that it was bad, but our situation isn't as bad as many people are making out.

Things are never as good they seem when you're winning and they're never as bad as they seem when you're losing.

Steve Brown
11 Posted 19/08/2025 at 13:58:22
Mike @ 2, I respectfully think you are displaying massive complacency.
Jack Convery
12 Posted 19/08/2025 at 15:28:36
The Moyesiah has apparently been giving Beto, coaching sessions. Well if last night was anything to go by, that's gone really well. Davey pointed out Beto, a week or so ago and said he wanted more from him. Maybe the players didn't like, one of their own being publicly called out. They certainly didn't run through any brick walls, for the manager last night. As usual, something is amiss behind the walls of Finch Farm. TFG have a habit of moving Managers on, who complain. De Rossi for instance, a Roma Legend. Be careful Davey Boy.
Pat Kelly
13 Posted 19/08/2025 at 15:33:57
Don't underestimate the extent of the problems we're facing.

Keane, Coleman and Gana in the last chance saloon. Patterson as brittle as ever and can be written off as having nothing to offer. Branthwaite needs nursing. A couple of months before he's back to his best and hopefully he can remain fit. Beto is a lost cause. Chermiti is in our growing ranks of the "not ready" (read won't ever be ready). Likewise, Tim Woebegone. Barry, maybe ready some day, Moyes notwithstanding. Aznou ? What's going on there. One for the future? McNeil has become a bit part player.

But at least our "marquee" signing is, according to Moyes, probably able to play every second game. He's not a keeper though. But we're OK on that front.

Christy Ring
14 Posted 19/08/2025 at 21:20:15
Looking at last night's game, I know Beto was isolated, but he won very few headers, couldn't control the ball, if DCL had put in that lack lustre performance he would have been slated, and this crap, that he can't play with his back to goal, show me a striker who's not facing his own goal? We need a striker badly, would a free signing Vardy do a job?
Colin Glassar
15 Posted 19/08/2025 at 21:40:28
I see we are being linked with Moyes old boy, Edson Alvarez (WHU), who I’ve never heard of. If Moyes wants to get a hammer he should go for Jeremy Bowen.
Dale Rose
16 Posted 19/08/2025 at 23:06:45
It was a dire performance and lacked organisation. We havent had a decent striker since Lukaku. Why we got rid of Young I don't know. We seem to have bought some young players who lack premier league experience and are for the future project. Well the future is tomorrow. We are not in the position to be a project for years to come so lets just concentrate on now and the basics.
Bob Parrington
17 Posted 20/08/2025 at 01:37:02
Having watched all of the games in this round, I have to own up that, to me, our beloved Everton appeared to be the worst, most clueless team of all those on display. Surely, this lack lustre performance cannot be repeated. IMO Moyes tactical approach to the game was completely negative and that affected the team morale.

Things had better change for the Brighton game and we must sign, at the very least good, speedy RB and RW.

Only one game so far, I know. But far worse performance than expected and not acceptable.

Jack Convery
18 Posted 20/08/2025 at 02:31:30
Celta Vigo RB - Óscar Mingueza aged 26 and can also play CD, LB, CM, RM. Out of contract in 2026. Current Spanish International RB. Transfermarket has him valued at £20m. Seeing as he's out of contract and an oven ready player, to coin a phrase, this is someone we should be inducing with a 4 year contract and an optional 1 year extension. He's obviously better, than what we have and shouldn't break the bank.

FFS EFC get your finger out and sign players, who have experience and are ready to go NOW !

Alan McGuffog
19 Posted 20/08/2025 at 07:25:33
Jack forget it. A line from the poem Drakes Drum. " Capn art thou sleeping there below ". There's no sense of urgency in this club
Moyes runs the team like a Sunday league outfit. " you can play at the back can't you Tommy ?", " has your mate still got his boots "?,..." that lad with the Transit..he can play on the right ?".
Don't expect anything in this window. Maybe the " sleeping giant" prefers to snooze.

Mike Gaynes
20 Posted 20/08/2025 at 07:32:40
What needs to change? One word. Intensity.

Play with commitment, passion, ferocity. Get the crowd on its feet and and roaring.

Everything else is peripheral. Our core value is playing harder than the other guy. Do that.

Ajay Gopal
21 Posted 20/08/2025 at 07:41:03
So, today's rumour is that Crystal Palace are lining up Dibling to replace Eze. So that's that then. How did it get to the point where teams who were well below us - Crystal Palace, Nottingham Forest, Brentford, Bournemouth, Brighton, Aston Villa, Newcastle,Wolves - have players who they are able to sell at huge fees, and then replace them with high priced talent, while we stand by watching as our most valuable assets get slowly sold with low quality replacements? (Richarlison, Gordon, Onana). Kinnear & Co. have been seriously underwhelming so far. TFG made a huge mistake in letting Kevin Thelwell go. Under unprecedented financial constraints, he managed to keep us afloat with loan deals (Harrison, Mangala, Alcaraz) and the odd decent purchases (Ndiaye, Tarkowski, McNeil, O'Brien, Young). Even with the deals that didn't come off - Lindstrom, Broja, etc - we at least could see what he was trying to do. Who knows what he would have achieved with a 150 million budget?
Colin Glassar
22 Posted 20/08/2025 at 07:46:57
Ajay, soon Morecambe FC will be out-bidding us at this rate.
Sam Hoare
23 Posted 20/08/2025 at 07:58:05
Ajay, "that's that then"? From a rumour?! Feels a bit defeatist! I'd be very surprised if Steve Parish was willing to pay £45m for a 19 year old winger; very likely its a story planted by Dibling's agent to put more pressure on Everton.

Moods are low this week after that wretched performance on Monday but lets not forget that the transfer window is a shady spectacle full of shadow and mirrors where 90% of what we read in the papers and online is guesswork.

I've no doubt we will have at least one additional RW in the next 11 days, whether that is Dibling or someone else we can't be so sure. Personally I'm more convinced that a high class 6 is going to be the difference maker for us right now. Angelo Stiller anyone?

Andrew Ellams
24 Posted 20/08/2025 at 08:26:14
Sam, is it beyond the realms of impossibility that Dibling could replace Eze if he was to move on? (he looked like a man on his way when he left the pitch on Sunday).
Nigel Scowen
25 Posted 20/08/2025 at 08:36:02
Sam@23

I also have no doubts we will get a RW before the window shuts Sam and it’s got to be Takefusa Kubo imo. I appreciate the problems it caused in the past but right now the situation could become so dire we need to bit the bullet and accept that we may need to pay over the odds for a couple of full backs and a right winger.

Mike@20

Agreed Mike. We played that game like it was another pre season friendly, no intensity or passion. Penalty decision was a disgrace but in reality we deserved absolutely nothing from that game. First game of the season and I’m already chucking stuff around the lounge.

Ajay Gopal
26 Posted 20/08/2025 at 08:39:45
Sam (23), I understand my outburst was a result of frustration, but like Andrew (24), I could see Dibling being targeted by Palace with the Eze money (no pun intended!). I agree with you though that we need to prioritise a high quality 6. But Angelo Stiller? The rumour is that Real Madrid are interested, so 'that's that'! ;-)

Andrew Merrick
27 Posted 20/08/2025 at 09:33:53

Mike 20, thats exactly what we should have done at Leeds because thats all they did and all they had.
If we had matched that our few more talented players might have shone.
I commented enough on the live thread about squad deficiencies, but I worry we have messed up this window big time.
Andrew Ellams
28 Posted 20/08/2025 at 09:47:20
We've definitely screwed up in this window Andrew and the next 10 days will be about picking up scraps at best.

I have a horrible feeling that we won't get much and are in big trouble.

Kim Vivian
29 Posted 20/08/2025 at 10:15:27
It's only because it's the first game of the season that I'm not chucking stuff around the living room. There's only one way from that performance on Monday and that's up. Hopefully we don't go sideways at the weekend but with that (even decimated) squad we should have been considerably more aggressive.

What's the saying...? If you feel weakened, you need to fight harder!

Liam Mogan
30 Posted 20/08/2025 at 10:15:49
Possession of the football, and keeping hold of the ball under intensity is one of the most difficult things for teams to achieve.

It requires all 11 players to have a high technical level, the team shape to be set up correctly, movement off the ball, pre-arranged patterns of play, the team ethos to be 'forward thinking' - usually with a higher line than we play.

Moyes has never had a team that dominates possession at its core. He is essentially a non-possession coach.

No matter what players come in, we will never be that type of team. New recruits will be brought in with the aim of improving the KITAP1 ideology and maximising breaks, free kicks etc.

Tbf to Moyes, it may be the way we need to operate for a few seasons until we can increase the quality and depth of the squad. Perhaps then we could change our footballing philosophy.

Sam Hoare
31 Posted 20/08/2025 at 12:32:12
Andrew@24, its certainly not beyond the realms of possibility. But I'd be very surprised at the price of £45m.

Nigel@25 the rumour is that Kubo is valued at £60m. I don't see us paying (or being able to afford) that; I agree we need a RW but it may be someone who we've hardly heard of. I like Bakwa at Strasbourg who seems good value at around £26m.

Ajay@26, I think we are all frustrated, especially after Monday. When the window is shut that will be the time for serious dissection of our summer's transfer work but there remains serious gaps currently. Yes, Stiller is probably destined for bigger clubs but you never know! A player of that ilk would really transform us potentially.

Ajay Gopal
32 Posted 20/08/2025 at 13:01:01
Sam, the BBC has published a list of 'unwanted' players / players who need to be moved by their clubs. Some interesting names, but most of them would not come to Everton anyway - they call them the 'Limbo XI'

Donnarumma (PSG)
Tyrell Malacia (Man Utd)
Kiwior (Arsenal)
Chilwell (Chelsea)
Zinchenko (Arsenal)
Garnacho (Man Utd)
Bissouma (Tottenham)
Kalvin-Phillips (Man City)
Raheem Sterling (Chelsea)
Nkunku (Chelsea)
Jackson (Chelsea)

Do you see any of them being interested in joining Everton, and who do you think are worth pursuing? Some TWers are advocating a punt on Bissouma, but I don't think Evertonians –and particularly, David Moyes – will put up with his reported disciplinary issues. Malacia may be an interesting option – although primarily a left-back, he has played right-back for Man Utd. Could Jackson be a surprise last-minute option on loan?

Sam Hoare
33 Posted 20/08/2025 at 13:16:18
Ajay, it's an interesting list and we could certainly do worse than a few on there. Quite a few are close to other clubs already with Donnarumma supposedly choosing between Chelsea, United and City, Garnacho is close to Chelsea apparently. I quite like Jackson but Chelsea are asking for £60m, I reckon he'll go to Newcastle if they sell Isak.

Bissouma is the right type but has had discipline issues at Spurs which would not go down well with Moyes. Maybe he could re-invigorate him but seems unlikely.

I like Zinchenko as a versatile option who could probably do a good job at 6 too where he plays for Ukraine. Could be a good loan though he's had one or two injury issues. I also think Kiwior is an underrated defender who could play in a few different positions. Am not sure either are starting XI picks necessarily but as we saw on Monday we also need more depth and genuinely versatile players really help on that front.

James Marshall
34 Posted 20/08/2025 at 13:17:27
Even a thread about the upcoming game has descended into one about the Leeds game! Give it a rest.

I think we should offer Lucas Vasquez a contract. He's a free agent with years of experience at Real Madrid playing right back/wingback and still has plenty to offer. Yeah he's 34 but look at the job Ashley Young did for us and he was older.

Vasquez is still in excellent condition and could be just what we need.

Andrew Merrick
35 Posted 20/08/2025 at 13:28:54
Two fast wing backs please, Santa.

I'm getting that in early because I fear nowt good is coming this window! :I
Ajay Gopal
36 Posted 20/08/2025 at 13:41:55
James (34),

I am sold on Vazquez! He has just turned 34, and if he has looked after himself well, should give us at least 2 years of top-class right-back play. He would be a huge improvement on anybody we have had recently in that position. Massively experienced in La Liga and the Champions League, he would be a good role model for the likes of Dixon and Patterson. But I wonder if he would be interested in joining Everton. The Saudi League seems like a more probable destination for him.

Myself, I would be happy if we signed Matty Cash (or Vazquez) for right-back, John McGinn in central midfield and a reliable striker (Højlund is on that I have been advocating). I would be willing to wait on the pacy right-winger for the next window, as I believe McNeil, Grealish, or Alcaraz can do a job there for the time being.

Dave Williams
37 Posted 20/08/2025 at 13:47:04
Moyes was always very swift to criticise everyone but himself in his first spell here, seeking to protect his reputation as a priority. He can't be blamed for our injuries and his gamble playing Garner at left-back worked well defensively, albeit we missed him in midfield where Gana was swamped in a very poor showing from him.

Beto hasn't a clue concerning hold-up play as his control is very poor. If Barry isn't trusted, then why did we spend so much on him when we need a striker ready to play? He needs a full game to show what he can do with Grealish and Ndiaye in support.

Moyes needs to motivate the players as there wasn't enough aggression or determination to win battles against Leeds. This squad is nowhere near as poor as folk are saying but Moyes needs to pick the right players and fire them up – less of the moaning to protect himself!

Paul Tran
38 Posted 20/08/2025 at 14:04:08
We badly need some energy and purpose on Sunday. None of that was on show at Leeds. And Moyes needs to explain the tactics more clearly to the players, because most of them appeared to have no idea what they were doing on Monday.

And Grealish must start.

James Marshall
39 Posted 20/08/2025 at 14:06:42
Ajay@36

Lucas Vazquez is in good shape - there's a load of training videos online of him keeping himself in condition so he'd just need to be gotten up to match fitness by the looks of things.

Like you say maybe he'll go to Saudi but he's surely someone we should be offering a contract, even if just for a year.

Christy Ring
40 Posted 20/08/2025 at 14:38:34
Andrew we definitely need another defensive midfielder, we were overrun by Leeds, and need a striker because Beto can't start against Brighton, we still don't know about Barry, one for the future like our new left back, not much good to us in the present?
Tony Abrahams
41 Posted 20/08/2025 at 14:45:45
Possession under pressure is about two things imo, Liam. Movement being created by your teammates, and players having the ability to remain calm?

Three, four or five quick passes, definitely open a lot of teams up, especially when you often concede possession and draw your opponents on?

I thought if we would have had a little bit more in our forward areas the other night, we would have ran away from Leeds, during that second half, but we just never had enough craft, and we never had enough pace, and that’s why it’s imperative we sign a few more players.

N’Diaye and Grealish, both possess loads of quality, but they are going to need their fullbacks running past them sometimes, plus we definitely need more pace out wide, and a centre forward, who as well as being able to run in behind, can also get hold of the ball, because I believe second phase play, is very important for a non possession team?

Raymond Fox
42 Posted 20/08/2025 at 15:03:06
We really need good players for several positions as it stands. We lost out big getting nothing for Calvert-Lewin and Doucoure + others. Having said that, I suppose we couldn't sell them earlier because we were fighting to stay up. All the recent damage was done in Moshiri's ownership.

Midfield is the engine room of a side; if your midfield is not good enough, you are goosed. I was pleased when we signed Dewsbury-Hall but we have to see how he pans out.

It's very early days yet, it's too soon to panic.

James Marshall
43 Posted 20/08/2025 at 15:12:57
Lukaku is injured, out for 3 months.

I've read Hoijlund is more likely to go to Napoli on loan as cover.

Jay Harris
44 Posted 20/08/2025 at 15:15:01
Its' very simple for me.

Just decide on Who we wany and go and get them. A few million over the odds is no big deal if they are the right players.

Kellen Fisher - Right back
Jamie Vardy - proven goal scorer for 30 minutes a game
Fatawu - right wing. (Dibling/ Fofana)

We don't need a recruitment committee just a man with a checkbook!!!!

I get the feeling we have been hanging on for Fofana hoping that a CL club don't come in for him and so he will grace Everton with his presence. If so that is very high risk.

James Marshall
45 Posted 20/08/2025 at 15:27:20
Jay - having money is one thing, whether other clubs want to sell, agents want to deal, and players want to come to us is another matter entirely.

If it was as simple as you say we wouldn't be having this problem recruiting who we want/need. Many other clubs are in a similar position - my guess is this will run till transfer deadline day because that's when agents/selling clubs get the best deals.

Bill Gall
46 Posted 20/08/2025 at 15:29:50
Employment goes on performance, therefore there should be more attention on the department that deals in transfers either in or out, as it seems that players we are interested in over a number of weeks suddenly sign for another team. The major players we have needed were at right-back and winger to strengthen the right side.

Presently, after spending millions of pounds on players, there has been no sign of the type of players we really needed being brought in.

Is there nowhere in England and Europe that, since the 2024-25 season players of the standard we want have been available or do we just have to keep looking at who other teams are looking at before negotiating and loose out?

This is not just 2 players we are looking for, it is the position in the league we may end up in without them.

Jay Harris
47 Posted 20/08/2025 at 15:59:12
James it is simple.

Look at the players other non top six clubs are signing and ask yourself why didn't we go for them?

James Marshall
48 Posted 20/08/2025 at 18:19:19
Jay - I've just done as you asked and there are numerous non-top 6 sides that have made 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 signings. So exactly the same and less than we have.

We've signed Barry, Aznou, KDH and Grealish. Also Travers, King and Alcaraz (although he was already here).

I don't really see any difference in us when compared to clubs such as Wolves, Fulham, Palace, Villa, Bournemouth, Newcastle, West Ham, Man Utd... technically we've signed 7 players this summer. All of those mentioned have signed less than 7 so honestly don't think your point holds a great deal of weight.

We also lost 3 loan players and 3 players on the books so a rebuild was always going to be difficult. Remember we're dealing with a historical mess, not one of the current manager or owners making.

Kieran Kinsella
49 Posted 20/08/2025 at 18:25:44
The mystery to me was why McNeil didn't fill in as auxiliary fullback? He has done it before and would seem a better option at LB or LWB than James Garner.

Is he injured? Not match fit? Or just out of favor after a poor showing pre-season?

Raymond Fox
50 Posted 20/08/2025 at 18:57:52
If Moyes doesn't fancy one or two of our players, maybe he could do swop deals or sell to buy what is needed more.

It depends how much money we can spend. With this PSR rubbish, it's likely to be not enough.

Grant Rorrison
51 Posted 20/08/2025 at 19:07:41
Funny how there's so few players that would improve our squad yet it's simultaneously not good enough to get a result against a bloody average team like Leeds.
Jay Harris
52 Posted 20/08/2025 at 19:46:21
James, if you think we have signed 7 players of Premier League quality, then it is pointless debating with you.

Alcaraz was already here and we let go 4 experienced Premier League players and, as far as I am concerned, only signed KDH of Premier League quality.

The squad was already one of the smallest in the Premier League last season, so we have weakened it even further.

James Marshall
53 Posted 20/08/2025 at 20:01:33
Jay - at no point did you or I say anything about the quality of players signed. I make no claim to know how good the players other teams have signed - you seem to be a font of knowledge though when it comes to the abilities of players other teams have signed?

You're making this into a debate about who is right or wrong - I'm merely responding to what you asked me to do which was to look at other clubs signings and compare them to ours.

All I'm saying is that they're comparable in numbers. I don't know how good Aznou is for example, yet you do? Barry as well? You seem to know exactly how good, or seemingly how bad all the players are we've signed. Grealish is no good either? Come off it, Jay - we both know that's not true.

You've made zero effort to debate anything - all you're doing is telling me what the truth of the matter is, when actually you have no more idea about what's the truth here than any other supporter of any club. And you're basing your claims on future predictions anyway.

We've all played one game yet you're in absolutely no doubt that what you're saying is completely correct. That's not really debating, nor is it realistic. In case you missed it, West Ham lost 3-0 to Sunderland as well.

Your last paragraph is actually agreeing with me as well. Although you've trimmed it down to 4 players we let go, but I believe it was more like 6.

Debating with you is extremely frustrating so I think I'll give it a miss from now on unless you have something sensible to say.

Jay Harris
54 Posted 21/08/2025 at 06:14:26
James I trimmed it down to 4 who were contributing fairly regularly to the first team. We actually let 12 players go.

Other teams have signed Tete, Walker, Walker-Peters,, Hutchison, Elanga, Ferguson, Tierney, Partey, Ramsey, Bailey, Doak, Jadon Anthony, Sarr, Gittens, Petrovic, Madueke, Ugochukwu, Gudmunson, Bijol, Longstaff, Stach, Callum Wilson, Cunha, Ndoye, Macatee, Diarra, Xhaka, Bellingham, Kudus, Arias, Tchatchoua, Semedo etc.

A lot of those would have been good additions to our squad but the elite recruitment committee were too busy arguing with each other to get much needed additions to the squad.

The point I was trying to make was that most teams have strengthened but we have significantly weakened what was already a small squad.

I also disagree that you get the best deals at the last minute as most clubs will not allow a quality player to go because they don't have time to get a replacement. Last minute deals are usually out of desperation.

I'm not trying to be a know it all Just expressing a polar opposite opinion to yours.

Jack Convery
55 Posted 22/08/2025 at 00:53:18
Ask TFG to arrange a loan, for either Devyne Rensch or Zeki Celik to come to us, as a RB. They can play other defensive positions too, with a view to buy. Roma have 4 RBs on their books, having bought Wesley for £25m, who is now 1st choice.

Celik has played RB 161, RM 54 and CD 23. He's 28, a Turkish Int with 54 caps.

Rensch has played RB 132, CB 64, LB 13. He's 22 and a Netherlands U21 International with 22 caps.

This takes one of their players off the wage bill and solves an urgent problem for us, for the cost of his wages. It also means we can try before buying and saves us money, that we can use for this summers business.


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