Although Moyes has improved our squad how much quality can he inject with limited funds? The Chang deal seems extremely cheap for the 5th placed team in the Prem: £2M a year over 3 yrs. A completely laughable deal showing no ambition or statement of intent of a club trying to go places. Jesus £2M a year sponsorship ? is that the best Wyness could do? £6million total over 3 yrs would only just buy us a championship player on the current market. Even the Darren Bents of this world get sold for £16 million.
One really does have to worry about the business plan for Everton and its progress over the next 5 years if Wyness blows his load in excitement the moment he gets a cheque for £6 million. That?s if there is a business plan of course. Wyness is the true weakest link in the triangle with Moyes and Kenwright.
Then of course we have the Tesco Goodison retail-park stadium to consider. How much will that drain transfer funds in the short term or even the long term? We're going to have to put some money into the pot and no doubt that will impact on Moyes's transfer fund.
One has to think that Moyes may well have a meeting with BK and look at the transfer kitty and then look at his current squad and think What?s the point? Where is this all going? With Villa, Newcastle, Man City, and West Ham preparing to spend big and the resurgence of Tottenham next season, next year could be even tougher to keep in the top six never mind break into the top four.
But let's face it we're currently the 5th best team in the Premier League and under Moyes we will probably always hover around the positions of 8-5 in the league. But to go the next mile we're going to need £100 million from somewhere and that?s only going to come via a buy-out.
With Celtic having an indifferent season and Strachan not loved by the majority, could David Moyes be soon going back to his roots and managing the green and white hoops? Or will he just walk away with a sense of pride and think "With Everton, I?ve gone as far as I can possibly go."?
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1 Posted 10/04/2008 at 14:21:39
2 Posted 10/04/2008 at 14:36:24
It goes without saying that Wyness is more concerned about getting his stadium project sorted out by piling every available farthing the club has into the Tescodome kitty. And, for the same reason, I honestly don't believe we?ll see any Kenwright statements surfacing this summer about "finding the cash somehow for David".
I know a lot of spin was put on to the David Moyes interview with ITV4 and the ?traditionalist? tag he was given by the commentator with regard to the stadium debate, but I think he sees Kirkby as a money pit that his short- to medium-term ambitions cannot cope with.
Moyes will be gone in the Summer, IMO. The fact he hasn?t brought a number two in, I believe, speaks volumes in that respect.... he knows deep down he himself wont be here.
3 Posted 10/04/2008 at 15:05:45
In his heart I?m sure he?d love to stay. Everton are relatively stable compared to say, the barcodes, but he?s not going to get a £50M war-chest from Bill.
4 Posted 10/04/2008 at 15:34:29
Man Utd - Not yet
Arsenal - No
Chelsea - No
Liverpool - No
Celtic - No money but big pull ?
Europe - Maybe ??
He will stay here IMO
5 Posted 10/04/2008 at 15:37:27
6 Posted 10/04/2008 at 15:37:09
Oh dear... what will Mr Marsh have to moan about then??
7 Posted 10/04/2008 at 15:16:02
I don?t think Davey has the necessary ?big player? or even ?quality player? mentality that the top managers have, and we?ve seen this by his meandering back towards players he fancied when he was at Preston...and also in his obsession with utility players.
Now i know we?ve had a relatively small gross transfer budget... but we either accept this needs to change or we accept our mid table Uefa Cup position in the league as our pinnacle.
He said he had a five year plan... and we?ve achieved stability on the pitch.... it?s time for Moyes to either push on or admit defeat in securing the budget a team needs to compete with the top four..
Frankly, this talk of a ?B? list is a bit concerning... But let's see what the summer brings. But to be honest, with the cost of this Kirkby white elephant truly unknown, I can?t see there being a bumper budget for the likes of Arshavin. My cynicism says we?ll be buying the Kevin Nolans of the Premier League for a long time to come.
8 Posted 10/04/2008 at 15:27:19
I do not know DM on a personal basis so I have no idea if he is the kind of guy who will say that he has already earned enough in ten years of management and will be prepared to take a pay cut to go back to Scotland (no SKY millions even for the ?old firm? these days) IF Celtic should make a managerial change.
Is David willing to leave an environment where he is loved by many of the fans and treasured by his board to go to Celtic.... a huge club on a global basis where the fans have now turned on a boss who has just brought them two Premier titles in a row and taken them to the last 16 of the Champions League?
The pressure in Glasgow would be terrific with King Walter Smith and his young assistant McCoist heading for this year?s title and in the last 8 of the Uefa Cup with one cup already won and another still ?up for grabs?.
Would Moyes's own interest not be better served by earning more money at Goodison, knowing that there is no real expectation of going higher than 5th and no pressure on his own position as manager?
Moyes has said as much. We are not even close to being a fourth placed team and, barring the collapse of one of the financial giants above us, there is no prospect of that in the short tern ....at least.
David has never been a winner as a player or as a manager and Celtic would not only demand trophies but the fans at Parkhead would never settle for the ugly, long-ball hoofball that has dominated much of our season here, so an assistant would have to be found in order to coach some style.
I can?t imagine Moyes would ever consider going ?across the park to the red side? so in the Premier League, that would only leave him Arsenal , Man U or Chelsea and I doubt if even David?s greatest admirers would harbour even the wildest dreams of Moyes going to any of these three.
Conclusion: ....he would be mad to leave Everton and I believe he will stay even if he is told to sell off a few of our better players in the Summer.
Money talks and a five-year contract for Moyes would make an already wealthy man even richer.
Nothing to do with Moyes but does anybody out there think the suggestion that we might move to Kirkby one day is just a load of hot air? It will never happen ...........will it? So the future home for EFC is ???
Ask Mystic Meg........... damned if I can work it out !
9 Posted 10/04/2008 at 15:51:22
As for summer transfer funds, nobody can predict what we will have to spend. All I do know is that in the last two summers we have broken the transfer record twice and I see no reason why Moyes won?t be given enough to make the midfield additions we desperately need.
As for the Pienaar deal. They are haggling over a number of financial issues. What's new? Let's wait until after 30th April before we start being critical. At the end of the day if he walks away then the club have missed out on a brilliant opportunity, but if we sign him and club save a few quid then they should be commended.
I think sometimes we look for problems before they have arisen. I could be wrong; Moyes and Pienaar could walk and we could have no money to spend in the summer, but until I see it in black and white I'm not going to panic... but I don?t think any of the above will happen. COYB
10 Posted 10/04/2008 at 16:57:39
And we might get our money?s worth out of him this time!
11 Posted 10/04/2008 at 17:51:51
12 Posted 10/04/2008 at 17:46:48
As for Pienaar that will get sorted, its not just the price of the deal its his personal terms, who knows if he is asking for 60 grand a year would you buy him?? I think not.
If Moyes does go i agree with David, Mr Bilic still owes us and he loves the club, I can remember him being in the Channel 5 studio talking about everton before a Uefa Cup game, I can remember him saying that Everton need to learn how to pass the ball!! Ummm a manager that wants to see a passing game... he gets my vote! coyb
13 Posted 10/04/2008 at 18:23:49
His progress at Everton with limited funds will have been noted by clubs who are just as ambitious and more wealthy.
I suspect he is frustrated by Kenwrights bullshit and failure to deliver meaningful inward investment, so anything is possible.
For those who scoff that he could up sticks and leave us for another premiership club including the RS, go back 4-5 years and consider how likely you thought the following were?
Would you have backed Rooney to piss off to the Mancs - Once a Blue, always a Blue?
A Everton Chairman apparently Blue through and through taking us out of the City?
No it all seems as incredible as the RS being three down at half time in European Cup Final against probably the best defensive team in European and coming back to win it.
Football is unpredictable but the influence of money is predictable on players, managers, CEO’s and chairman
14 Posted 10/04/2008 at 19:10:41
How many more interviews do you want to here with Davey going on aboout his long term ambitions for Everton and how he wants to achieve success here etc before you will believe he?s going nowhere.
He hasn?t even sat down to discuss the new contract yet, the same as they don?t do with many players until the summer and Daveys doesn?t run out for another season yet anyway.
Just chill and relax for a bit and enjoy finishing on the most number of points in the PL we?ve ever had and stop looking for something to panic or moan about.
15 Posted 10/04/2008 at 19:13:27
Althougth Moyes knows where he wants Everton to go, he may realise this summer that its not going to happen soon. Everton are in a bunch of 6-8 teams outside the ’top 4’ vying for the 5th placed ’Championship’, but unlike most of the other teams, we are currently at maximum potential. A 5th placed finish, good run in Europe and one of the cups is about as good as it gets for Everton at the moment. We are not going to break into the top 4 for the foreseeable future so the only way is down after Man City, Newcastle, Villa, West Ham, Portsmouth and Tottenham have 50m EACH to spend in the summer.
However, Moyes may realise that he has no better options this summer, therefore to sit tight at the club until something better comes along, meaning Man Utd. Moyes has taken Everton as far as he can. Nothing to do with Moyes, but the potential, or lack of, of Everton.
16 Posted 10/04/2008 at 19:56:48
I think it would take a great deal to wrestle him away from Everton where he has built a potentially sound squad and is loved by the fans.
I also think he is playing a few mind games not only with BK but also with his main adversary Fat "I pull the pursestrings"Keith and the only way I can see him going is if he feels he is wasting his time putting plans together when "Other" people are not on the same page.
Rabbits and hats + smoke and mirrors ring any bells
17 Posted 10/04/2008 at 21:08:06
Hope he doesn?t come on here because if he does he?ll be off next week.
According to other threads, he is the manager of a club, that is on the verge of bankruptcy, where the Chairman and CEO are invetarate liars, the proposed new stadium is going to be a pile of breeze blocks in a town where no one wants us oh and the rest of the board are just plain incompetent.
I really can see why he would want to stay.
18 Posted 10/04/2008 at 21:10:00
And as for the smoke/mirrors etc over money for transfers... what part of "we?ve broken our transfer record for the past 2 seasons" don?t you understand? We have moved the team on, we are better this term than last, Moyes has stated his position like he has done every season, I remember dumb n dumber going on about Spurs/Villa Newcastle/Portsmouth spending loads more dosh than us..a nd they?re all still behind us in the league!!! Best you lot stay in a council area within Merseyside which doesn't want you with AFC Everton/KEIOC backed by Sons of Shankly, coz you don?t hell as like support your club!!
Ha haaaa... got me tin hat on just in case!!
19 Posted 10/04/2008 at 21:26:31
Why don’t we move to Anfield when the RS relocate.It must be the luckiest ground in the world,
And its about time we had some luck!!
20 Posted 10/04/2008 at 22:37:42
21 Posted 11/04/2008 at 00:16:49
Totally agree with you on Arshavin and Fernandes but Bullard's too old and Damien Duff doesn't seem to be the same player since he?s been out injured for so long.
22 Posted 11/04/2008 at 02:25:33
Well, you can see where I’m going with this, for every Evertonian there’s thousands of RS worldwide...
23 Posted 11/04/2008 at 05:10:20
..Chang deal seems extremely cheap for the 5th placed team in the Prem: £2M a year over 3 yrs....
The actual deal is £8M for 3 years and most of the money is paid up front which is in our favour. I had a look around for comparative figures which were hard to find. A lot of clubs don’t publish the figures. I did find one for Man City who are comparable to us who have a 2 year deal of £3M with Thomas Cook. It does expire soon but still our deal looks fairly good in comparison.
24 Posted 11/04/2008 at 07:11:59
The RS sing "We?re all off to Moscow you?s are off to Tesco" How does that sit in your stomach?s??? and FFS please spare me the "We don?t care what the RS say" shout ? it?s pathetic!!
No chance are they gettin my money for that season ticket next season because the way the club is run is an absolute disgrace.
25 Posted 11/04/2008 at 07:36:02
So it?s either Everton or Celtic for Davey Boy! My money is on him staying although whether that?s the right decision for him only time will tell!
26 Posted 11/04/2008 at 08:56:35
27 Posted 11/04/2008 at 09:34:29
The amount of mistakes he makes in terms of tactics, formations, transfers and player choice is still quite obvious.
Now, before those without the ability to criticise start... I admit that he?s the best manager we have and he?s learning... but to be honest he learns pretty slow and at this rate he may be ready for a top four team in 10 years...
So, I?d suggest that he doesn't have a great deal of options in terms of other teams that would be more attractive than us..
It?s time for a bit of financial backing from those who matter...because to be honest, I?d rather he learnt his trade here and took us back where we belong while doing it!
28 Posted 11/04/2008 at 09:56:33
29 Posted 11/04/2008 at 10:28:13
I don’t mean the usual negative posts from the usual suspects. I’m picking it up from normally more positive contributors, the crowd at recent games, and I have to say it’s starting to get to me as well, despite knowing that we shouldn’t be in the doldrums.
I don’t think it’s completely down to our poor form of late, or the run of luck that the RS have benefitted from over the same period of time - although I don’t think it helps. The damping down of our 4th place expectations and the disappointment of going out of the UEFA cup prematurely and seeing the likes of Zenit and Fiorentina still there, doesn’t help either, but again it’s not the reason for the grey skies at present.
I think its the current uncertainty that hangs over much of the club at present and the relative news vacuum coming from the club’’s hierarchy on a number of issues.
The first one concerns Davey Moyes. I know the contract delay is probably nothing to worry about, but it’s still a concern. Despite his faults, I think he’s doing a great job and it’ll do us no good at all if he leaves us.
The second is our financial situation. Despite my gut feeling that Blue Bill has been a positive influence on us in the last few years as Chairman, the lack of success in getting more investment into the club is beginning to get to me. Surely we should be generating more interest than we are. I don’t mean the Spurs or Man City approach, but surely a summer transfer kitty of £20M-£30M should be an automatic for our club, and I fear it might not be (and this is what Davey is realising with his subtle media soundbites of late?)
Thirdly, it’s my concern that our current squad might actually be at the start of a bit of a break-up. I know not to believe everything in the tabloids, but are we going to see some surprise departures this summer, more so than the quality additions we hope for? Why the delay over Peanuts? What’s the vibe about Arteta?Fernandes? Is AJ going to be here next season? Having lived through many unexpected squad break-ups as a blue in previous decades - the Alan Ball shock, the loss of Gray and then Lineker and the subsequent erosion of that wonderful mid-80s team of ours (our best ever!) - I normally expect the worse.
Finally, its Kirkby, which I’m increasingly getting very concerned about. I might not have believed all the club PR, but I genuinely thought it seemed to represent a cost-effective way to progress the club. But over the last few months it is clear that both our finances, and those concerning the move are much less rosy than was implied. I’m not particularly impressed by the claims of the KEIOC, but the clubs recent attempts to gag them, and the constraints which the exclusivity agreement imposed, seem very wrong. After the experiences of this season, I’m listening more to my heart and I know it’s very irrational - but I really, really don’t want us to leave Goodison, and I now want to get better answers over why it can’t be gradually redeveloped.
Of course, it’s very probable that Davey signs up for another 5 years, we keep our current squad and get a realistic and decent transfer kitty to perk up our midfield etc. this summer - ready for another go at the Sky 4 and the UEFA cup etc. next season......
....it’s just that I have a niggling concern that season 2007-08 might turn out to be high point of this decade and that the summer will be one of those watershed moments in the club’s history - although that’s probably what you get when you get raised expectations, mixed in with that in-built supporter pessimism, a lack of reliable club news of late, and a board who’s ambition for the club might not match those of the fans, and reading too many Toffeeweb threads over the last few weeks...hmm, I’m beginning to sound like Tony Marsh...I think I’ll go lie down in a corner with a couple of valiums...
30 Posted 11/04/2008 at 12:34:05
DM said months ago that there wouldn?t be any contract talks until the season was over because he didn?t want to worry about anything other than the team's performance. Therefore if contract talks had started he would be admitting that our season had ended, as it is he is still pushing for fourth whilst consolidating fifth.
As for the transfer market, if the club can afford to pay Peanut's wages he will be signed, most probably on April 29/30 when we have exhausted any chance of saving money. If you think that's a bad way of doing things, go learn how to run a business.
Moysey knows who he wants as first team players (his A list) and squad players (his B list). He will most probably surprise us with who is on each list, there will be at least one or two that nobody else would consider, like Peanut and Jags, that turn out to be marvellous. There will also be a couple of loan signings, so that when next summer comes round and he signs them permanently some of you can complain that he isn?t really strengthening the squad.
31 Posted 11/04/2008 at 13:54:57
Don’t they guys.
32 Posted 11/04/2008 at 14:54:08
I do not subscribe to him being the greatest or being that popular but who could we get better if he goes? The buzz is Celtic have been sniffing (and Moyes still spends lots of time back home in Glasgow) and for sure David Jones still comes home to Mum, who lives in "his house" in Runcorn... He also still loves Everton... Food for thought?????
33 Posted 11/04/2008 at 16:23:18
A quick snapshot of the future for EFC: I was at a training session for 6/7yr olds yesterday and out of 15 or so kids only one had an Everton kit on.
Success on the pitch is vital now, whoever is in charge. I don't think Moyes is going anywhere especially Scotland. For what it's worth, Id go for Slaven Bilic if DM gets pissed off with having no backing for transfers.
34 Posted 11/04/2008 at 17:18:51
Wouldn?t mind seeing FA Cup hero Joe Ledley in the Royal Blue next season
35 Posted 11/04/2008 at 17:34:20
...but for you to criticise our progression under Moyes is idiocy at its finest. As the Walter Smith days were drawing to a close, where did you expect us to be in 5 or 6 years time from then?
You criticise Moyes in the transfer market, but he?s taking us from a relegation team in waiting to a team that is now a nailed-on top 6 team every season. Only Arsene Wenger has done any better with the recources that he has, but with respect, Wenger inherited a far more capable squad than Moyes did. Spurs, Man City, Newcastle, Aston Villa, West Ham all spent more than everton over the last 2 years...and look where they are.
As for Moyes not being able to handle star players - i?d class Yakubu there and wouldn?t judge him over a petulant 18 yr old Wayne Rooney. I believe that if we give Moyes the big money, he will deliver.
36 Posted 11/04/2008 at 17:47:38
Do you think moyes would see it as a challenge with 1 decent opposition club in the SPL and another 1 major club in the CL?
I don’t think he’s done anything to put himself in the frame for a Man utd job yet, but i’d be more worried about Newcastle or West Ham flashing the cash at him.
No manager with any ambition would manage an Old Firm club.
37 Posted 11/04/2008 at 18:05:50
38 Posted 11/04/2008 at 18:16:38
39 Posted 11/04/2008 at 20:06:30
Did you just miss it or DID RANGERS NOT QUALIFY FOR A EUROPEAN SEMI YESTERDAY ?
Check the papers ............. Rangers beat Sporting 2-0 to qualify without their star defender David Weir.
I love our team to bits but the last few years have been as gloomy as any Blue could ever want.
If I ever want to make comparisons I will look across the park at a side which has been mediocre for years but has still picked up enough trophies to keep their moronic (can?t call them ?the other m word fans? fans....can I ? Heysel never happened did it ?.......figment ?) followers happy.
Neither of us had ever had a sniff of winning the Premier League and today we both look as far away from that as either of us ever have.
Should we really be throwing a word like mediocre at other teams and places when surely our first concern should be that we are surrounded by it in a city that was once a real football powerhouse.
This is the most expensive and by far the highest paid team we have ever had. Where are they going ?
Ah well there?s always next season or the next again or................hmmm !!!
40 Posted 11/04/2008 at 21:32:54
41 Posted 11/04/2008 at 09:53:07
I love Mikel Arteta more than anyone in this world (even more than his lovely girlfriend), but if he is getting his head turned by some fuckwit agent than he can go and pack his ?maleta?, because no-one is bigger than our club!!
As far as Peanuts goes, if he really said all that shite well he can fuck off back to Germany and be a bit part player! He is a great player and I would love nothing more than to sign him up full time, but if you are fortunate enough to have pulled on that blue shirt, you should never have to doubt your commitment!!! COYB
42 Posted 12/04/2008 at 10:10:13
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