Be that as it may, the sudden swing round in the economy may just be about to work in our club`s favour. Already we hear that Roman Abromovitch has ordered a major cut-back of staff at Stamford Bridge with over thirty scouts and background staff unlikely to enjoy their Christmas.
`Over the road`, joint owner George Gillett is looking to find loans of £50M in order to hang on to his stake whilst even `sensible` Arsenal have had to succumb to the overtures of their despised American shareholder and `welcome` him onto their Board. At Old Trafford, the demise of sponsor AIG has sent their income projections into free-fall whilst Iceland`s bankruptcy may well see the end of West Ham as Premier League players.
In comparison with these clubs, Everton`s indebtedness is trivial and, whilst Blue Bill may well have reached his credit limit, the relatively sensible way his lieutenants have controlled the club`s finances may just see us emerge as `big winners` come the inevitable meltdown.
A big factor in this will be the delay and inevitable abandonment of the Kirkby project. Already, we know that the club have no way of funding their contribution to this white elephant and, as gates retract to the 30,000 level, a phased and modest up-dating of Goodison will be seen as the only way forward.
Regardless of the Man City phenomenon, the days of £100k-a-week players are doomed and even lavishly rewarded managers may be in for a pay-cut! Let`s face it, only the ability to borrow huge sums have set the big four apart from the mere mortals who make up the Prem and whilst they may still be clinging to their delusions of grandeur their end is in sight. When they implode ? as they surely will ? the Evertons of the league will be far better placed to ride out the storm.
Theatre people have long told me that BK is a `lucky promoter` ? just how lucky we are about to find out!!!
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1 Posted 16/12/2008 at 14:37:22
But yes, Everton do not have the credit line (is that the term?) these teams are allowed with their banks due to being ’small’, so that too is in their favour in these times... and if it really was an issue for the time being, would they really have put £15m on Big Bird?
2 Posted 16/12/2008 at 14:42:36
Economics is not your strong point is it.
The sky four have larger income and revenue streams than ourselves, they may make cutbacks to cope with recession, but they will do just fine. It is the clubs with lower levels of income, relative to debt levels that will struggle.
Neither is recent history, one of your strong points Throughout most of the summer the club had no money for transfers, until they got another loan to add to the dozen that they already have.
I have no wish to be harsh on you, but let's be realistic: in a recession its the weak who go the wall not the strong.
3 Posted 16/12/2008 at 14:48:52
As such, if one or more of the "big 4" implode then it can only be for the good of the game in this country. As it stands at present, the EPL is turning into a game of monopoly for the uber rich with Man City the latest after Chelsea and QPR to be dubbed the richest in the world.
Sky TV, unregulated foreign investment along with the scandalous cartel that is the "Champion's" League, are ruining the game over here and more and more people are getting pissed off with the whole thing. I had a conversation with a good friend of mine the other day who has been a season ticket holder at Anfield for over 20 years. He said that he was considering not renewing his ticket next year (this despite his team being top of the league and in the next round of the CL). His reason: stupid ticket prices & stupid kick-off times.
I am also considering not having a season ticket for the first time since I was 14. My reasons are on the same lines as his but you can also add to them the following:
(a) Moving EFC to an average stadium out of the city purely to chase foreigh investment;
(B) Not a hope in hell of winning anything without the above or a dramatic redistribution of money within the game.
The above comment may come accross as a bit glory-hunterish; however, when you consider I have had a season ticket since Colin Harvey?s first season, that doesn?t fit. Things need to change because ? despite what Sky may have you believe ? things aren?t all rosy in their garden.
4 Posted 16/12/2008 at 15:16:34
If any of the banks demanded their share of our reported £90 mill debt back, we?d be donald ducked instantly... Could you say that about the big four? Not likely.
Misguided article. We are probably in one of the most precarious positions of any club in the league.
5 Posted 16/12/2008 at 15:36:58
6 Posted 16/12/2008 at 16:39:04
7 Posted 16/12/2008 at 16:49:07
8 Posted 16/12/2008 at 16:54:07
9 Posted 16/12/2008 at 17:05:05
10 Posted 16/12/2008 at 17:04:21
I think you?re right with regard to an impending financial football crisis. I do feel, however, that you are wildly optimistic in believing that we are in any position to ride out the storm.
A re-negotiated Sky deal will hurt us as much as anyone. There are more signs of our attendances falling than any of the big four. We face a second half of the season with nothing to play for. We don?t have any waiting list for tickets to fall back on. Also, are the sensible lieutenants you refer to those who have made us one of the worst marketed clubs around?
Ok, were Abramovich to go, Chelsea would likely implode. With regard to everyone else, I think clubs will be hit in relation to their current situation. If Everton, Man U and Stoke all cut their wage bills by 30% nothing will change in the order of things.
In addition, we are in (and I hate to say this) a worn out stadium. Is now really the time to divide the fan base with Kirkby?
Football is facing a crisis and we are no less vulnerable than many others.
11 Posted 16/12/2008 at 18:05:47
David O’Keefe - toatally agree with your point about debt as a percentage of turnover, not sure how we compare on that front. We have a much smaller debt than some of the bigger clubs, but we also have a smaller amount of revenue coming in.
However, "in a recession its the weak who go the wall not the strong.", not so sure about how you are defining "weak" here. As Gerry said, take a look at the news and tell me that all of the companies/banks going under are "weak". Would you have defined these huge organisations weak before the crisis hit? I doubt it.
Economics is not my strong point either, let’s face it the economy is an incredibly complex thing as I have discovered trying to get my head around how this all happened. I would not be so bold as to sit here smugly waiting for the Big 4 to go out of business while we apparently prosper. Everyone will struggle in this climate and would be wise to tighten the belt.
One thing’s for sure, I agree with Andy Crooks, love it or hate it (Kirkby) now is not the time to be building stadium.
12 Posted 16/12/2008 at 18:45:31
Does that make it good for us the present time? Obviously not. We can?t compete with the so-called Sky 4 on the pitch, and 5th place is never the ultimate goal to aspire to. I am as frustrated as the next blue; however, if I don?t hold on to the hope that in the foreseeable future things will even themselves out and we can once again compete at the very top level, then I may as well jack it all in now!
I?m just hoping Abramovich fancies buying Honda?s F1 team. That would at least be one club to the wall!
13 Posted 16/12/2008 at 19:35:49
However, I agree that the global meltdown has pissed on the fireworks of many "giants". Chelsea are technically insolvent, making a loss every year and holding debts of almost £800m.
I expect there to be a shake up, but we lag so far behind in our revenue that I worry about us more than others. Football has lived beyond its means for far too long. Instead of vilifying him, fans should applaud the efforts of Michel Platini to regulate the game in favour of fans & competition. When all?s said & done, it?s what the game is all about.
14 Posted 16/12/2008 at 21:40:47
Size isn?t everything. The weak are those businesses that are badly managed, inefficent and poorly led. GM may be a big busineess, but it has been mismanaged for many years.
15 Posted 16/12/2008 at 22:17:50
1. That the Govt is eager to stimulate the economy and a £400m project that is ready to go would fit into that category.
2. The price of fuel, steel and raw materials has dropped substantially in recent times.
3. Tesco is cash cow and that sector of the market (groceries) etc, stands up pretty well in a recession.
The major con, of course, would be our ability to raise £78m in the current climate. My gut feeling is that there is no way we can raise that money unless Tesco loans it to us at a mate's rate OR a sugar daddy comes in if the project gets approved.
16 Posted 16/12/2008 at 23:13:25
17 Posted 17/12/2008 at 00:59:02
18 Posted 17/12/2008 at 10:34:20
19 Posted 17/12/2008 at 11:01:12
The club files public accounts, in case you didn?t know, and there have been plenty of statements or indications given by Bill Kenwright, and indeed others, on the subject. Many TW contributors have also taken the time to investigate our position on all fronts.
Whichever side of the fence you are on, there is no deep mystery about Everton?s finances. Just because you haven?t bothered to look at the info doesn?t mean nobody has.
The fact that you seem oblivious to this is, to borrow your adjective, amazing.
20 Posted 17/12/2008 at 11:45:52
I know for a fact if I continually fucked up in my job year after year, lied to customers, and showed a complete lack of competence in everything important I tried to do, I would've been fired a long time ago.
8 years of BK?s reign and what do we have? Still no significant player investment since Agent Johnson was removed, despite our strongest squad performances for 20 years. Plenty of bullshit about fake transfers and bogus investment companies. Oh and Destination Oblivion...
21 Posted 17/12/2008 at 11:12:56
Should the rumours of Abramovich’s disappearing wealth be anywhere near the truth, Chelsea could well get into serious trouble. Also the Icelandic chairman of West Ham (forget his name) could well be in deep trouble......
Should the economic crisis deepen and some of these rich chairmen go to the wall, we could well see another couple of Leeds’ happen.
We should be relatively safe compared to these clubs, as it is extremely unlikely that the banks which hold our loans will call them in or go tits up. There may be a collective tightening of belts at GP as well as other Premiership clubs, but even a hike in our interest rates would probably, at worst, result in a few of our on-field assets being cashed in.... as long as it’s only a few, despite the squad size, we should get by.
22 Posted 17/12/2008 at 12:54:58
My point is that you insinuated that the Big 4 were strong by saying that they wouldn’t suffer because the "weak" are the ones who go to the wall in these times. You insinuate that EFC are the "weak" and that the Big 4 are strong. I don’t think that you can simplify it like that. The mismanagement that you speak of in most cases was not deemed to be mismanagement at the time. These companies have over extended and when the proverbial has hit the fan they have been left in the shit.
As said in my previous post, economics is complicated so why do many on hear try to make it sound so straight forward. It is foolish for anyone to assume that they are safe in the current climate, but as long as the club remains responsible with its spending, then we should ride it out.
23 Posted 17/12/2008 at 15:33:59
> David O?Keefe; "Size isn?t everything."? Ask your missus...
24 Posted 17/12/2008 at 16:29:47
Could this mean there will be a bit of money to spend in the January sales?
25 Posted 17/12/2008 at 17:43:53
26 Posted 17/12/2008 at 22:09:19
27 Posted 18/12/2008 at 10:15:18
This is nothing but another cynical piece of marketing from the club to cover the cracks of Bill & Co to provide any investment whatsoever.
28 Posted 18/12/2008 at 17:39:46
29 Posted 19/12/2008 at 09:49:11
30 Posted 19/12/2008 at 09:55:30
31 Posted 19/12/2008 at 10:50:55
No drivel Richard. But the board can’t take the praise and not the brickbats over the illusion of choice that is Kirkby.
As Kipling said.. Treat both success and failure the same..both are imposters
Of course that could have been Mr Kipling.. makes exceedingly good cakes...
32 Posted 20/12/2008 at 09:41:44
33 Posted 20/12/2008 at 15:33:50
34 Posted 21/12/2008 at 11:13:19
35 Posted 21/12/2008 at 13:27:05
The point that I am making is it's what the club don?t say and don?t disclose that really matters. There?s a lot that goes on within the club that we don?t get to know about and that's when the guessing starts because things don?t quite make sense... the summer transfer window being a prime example. Few of us would have expected that, except maybe your enlightened self.
36 Posted 21/12/2008 at 14:17:10
37 Posted 21/12/2008 at 18:20:47
But there again maybe myself ? along with a host of other Premier League clubs that managed to generate a decent transfer kitty ? have no idea of football economics.
38 Posted 21/12/2008 at 20:01:12
39 Posted 22/12/2008 at 09:38:19
40 Posted 22/12/2008 at 16:09:59
I used to live in Southend and half the town supports West Ham instead of the local team. Many people moved from East London to Southend after the war and there is a very large and loyal fan base across the whole area.
41 Posted 24/12/2008 at 11:15:52
While I agree West Ham's following runs right through Dagenham to Southend, you also need to remember there are a lot of Arsenal and Spurs fans too and to a lesser extent Chelsea and Fulham.
Everton?s fanbase runs right through the Wirral, North Wales and Ireland. Recent attendances show West Ham hovering around 32,000 with a capacity of 35,000 at the Boleyn ground whereas Everton?s average attendance this season, although down on last year, is close to 35,000 with a 40,000 capacity.