FAN ARTICLES
A Radical Solution
By Paul Niklas : 24/07/2008 : 
Comments (62) :
Now I know as I write this it will be met with derision and scorn, however, sometimes a totally different point of view or strategy is always deemed high risk, I would like to call it entrepreneurial.
Comments (62) : Bottom line we have no money, we are potentially moving to Kirkby (I am against that by the way) but even if we stay at Goodison the problem in my opinion financially is still the same if we have to fork out £78 million to develop it, purely because I don't believe an extra £10 million supposed revenue from Kirkby a season (based on £78 milion of new debt) scratches the surface.
So to my point, why not start again and take a high risk approach to future success.
I have calculated we could raise around £90 million from the players we have currently, I won't go into the individual valuations as someone will debate whether Piennar is worth 4 or 5 million. Sell the lot of them and concentrate on the kids, keeping the likes of Rodwell, Vaughan etc and take a chance that we might stay up.
If we go down then so be it, we end up with a stadium fully developed that we own, reduced debt and reduced costs as the bulk of the players' wages have gone. We would also have the parachute payment to support the re-build. Then with a sound financial base we start to build something that is sustainable and very investable.
I know its not an option for the majority nor is it ideal in any way some would say outrageous and even stupid, but it is the type of thinking any owner, managing director, venture capitalist of a small or large business would have to be considering in the real world.
I am a bit bored with the whole transfer saga at the moment and the same old arguments about DK so forgive me, I would like to hear sensible debate about why this would be stupid. Their are no gaurantees that we would get back into the Premier League but that's life I am afraid ? the same as it is at the moment for people buying petrol at the pump: they can't afford it so they look at alternatives.
Shoot!
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Are you mad?
You’re right, I think it is outrageous and even stupid.
Just for the loss of revenue alone with falling out of the Premier League, umbrella payment or not.
Just for the loss of revenue alone with falling out of the Premier League, umbrella payment or not.
Can I have some of what you are on please?
Tony, loss of revenue, so the wonderful supporters of Everton, who are fighting tooth and nail not to move to Kirkby would just walk away would they.
Fickle I would not have believed but so be it.
I am not suggesting its done but these things have to be considered in any business in the light of no alternatives.
Fickle I would not have believed but so be it.
I am not suggesting its done but these things have to be considered in any business in the light of no alternatives.
Paul, I?ll try and answer ?sensibly?. The scheme falls down at the outset when other clubs realise you are selling the first team. It would be a buyers market, prices forced down an the £90m figure you mentioned would be halved.
Then you have a very young - not to say tiny - squad, trying to avoid relegation and an alienated fan base disillusioned with a club that sells the best players. Any youngsters with an inkling of talent would want to go elsewhere as what incentive is there for them to stay at Everton? Team morale drops, fan interest (what?s left of it) evaporates and you have not enough money to build a stadium with not enough fans to fill it.
That?s just the start. Others will no doubt point out other flaws. It has some - sort of - logic but the reality of it would in no way match your ideal.
Then you have a very young - not to say tiny - squad, trying to avoid relegation and an alienated fan base disillusioned with a club that sells the best players. Any youngsters with an inkling of talent would want to go elsewhere as what incentive is there for them to stay at Everton? Team morale drops, fan interest (what?s left of it) evaporates and you have not enough money to build a stadium with not enough fans to fill it.
That?s just the start. Others will no doubt point out other flaws. It has some - sort of - logic but the reality of it would in no way match your ideal.
I blame the hot weather!
Sam, thank you ? someone with a bit of rational and sense.
Listen, I know all the pitfalls, but if things get worse then what will they do? No one will invest in this club ? that's pretty clear.
Listen, I know all the pitfalls, but if things get worse then what will they do? No one will invest in this club ? that's pretty clear.
Oh My Jesus Tap Dancing Christ Monkey Balls... away with you!
No money!?! We are far better off than we have ever been! £35 million in Sky money about to arrive! Profits from transfers... you have fallen for Wyness?s spin, you fool.
Bill Green, £35 million ok, at least £20 million of that on new players for this season, pay down some short term loans Yakubu for example not a lot left.
£78 million for new stadium in either location, more debt and still need to pay at least £20 million for players for next season.
No spin from any one here, just harsh reality, get in the real world or are you one of the Holy Trinity brigade who continue to live in the past?
£78 million for new stadium in either location, more debt and still need to pay at least £20 million for players for next season.
No spin from any one here, just harsh reality, get in the real world or are you one of the Holy Trinity brigade who continue to live in the past?
What in the name of all that is Holy are you talking about Paul?
Loss of revenue, ie no more millions from Sky. The sponsor deal amounts will decrease (if that’s possible), Setanta money non-existant, as I don’t think they do the Fizzy Drink Leagues.
Some fans will be put off by the Premier League season tickets costs when playing the likes of Darlington, so yes there will deffinitely be leakage.
Loss of revenue, ie no more millions from Sky. The sponsor deal amounts will decrease (if that’s possible), Setanta money non-existant, as I don’t think they do the Fizzy Drink Leagues.
Some fans will be put off by the Premier League season tickets costs when playing the likes of Darlington, so yes there will deffinitely be leakage.
My main point of this post is to highlight the emotion attached to most people on this site.
I am fully aware of the issues around my suggestion; however, what alternative has any one else got apart from what the club are trying to achieve?
Or will everything be alright when Abramovich No 2 comes along and puts Hans Christian Anderson in charge to make up nice stories for you all, that make you feel good.
Alternatives please????
I am fully aware of the issues around my suggestion; however, what alternative has any one else got apart from what the club are trying to achieve?
Or will everything be alright when Abramovich No 2 comes along and puts Hans Christian Anderson in charge to make up nice stories for you all, that make you feel good.
Alternatives please????
Paul
The obvious way to raise cash is to issue more shares at, say, £1000 each. The Board won’t do this as the individuals holding the existing shares will have their investment diluted (I presume)
I also presume the the ordinary non-Board member shareholders didn’t buy their share(s) to make money...they are Blues
So we as individuals are left with the option of giving the club the money free and gratis. Could we get 45000 worldwide to donate $2000 or 90000 at £1000?
That’s the 90 million pound question
The obvious way to raise cash is to issue more shares at, say, £1000 each. The Board won’t do this as the individuals holding the existing shares will have their investment diluted (I presume)
I also presume the the ordinary non-Board member shareholders didn’t buy their share(s) to make money...they are Blues
So we as individuals are left with the option of giving the club the money free and gratis. Could we get 45000 worldwide to donate $2000 or 90000 at £1000?
That’s the 90 million pound question
I wondered where you’d been since ’Just Good Friends’. Contrary to popular opinion, EFC is not a second-rate sit com.......or is it?
Paul... as you said: "a radical" solution.
If it could be done without getting relegated it?s as good an idea as any other. I don?t agree with you but I accept it?s an idea one could put on the list of things to consider so to speak.
However, and this is my point, if we don?t have enough players NOW and we sell £90m?s worth of players....who the hell would be left?
Your idea would actually work for somebody like Chelsea... they could probably see £100m+ worth of players and still have a cracking team...... if we did it, we?d not only not have a team, we?d have no marketing staff, no directors, no financial people, no office people, no customer service people..............hang on.....it?s a brilliant idea Paul! Let?s do it!!!
Seriously though....... it would never work.
If it could be done without getting relegated it?s as good an idea as any other. I don?t agree with you but I accept it?s an idea one could put on the list of things to consider so to speak.
However, and this is my point, if we don?t have enough players NOW and we sell £90m?s worth of players....who the hell would be left?
Your idea would actually work for somebody like Chelsea... they could probably see £100m+ worth of players and still have a cracking team...... if we did it, we?d not only not have a team, we?d have no marketing staff, no directors, no financial people, no office people, no customer service people..............hang on.....it?s a brilliant idea Paul! Let?s do it!!!
Seriously though....... it would never work.
JUST SAY NO !
NO!
In the desperate words of Mr Partridge...’monkey tennis’
Genius Paul, why not use the grounds staff as players and do away with the whole squad. BK could manage via cell phone and save even more on managerial money. In four years time when playing on Sunday mornings we could heve the players ride share to avoid the bus fare allowance that we would otherwise pay. Get the mums to make pack lunches and dads could line the fields. Keep the brilliant options coming. I’m sure Wyness will be contacting you about a front office job as soon as your electric shock therapy treatments are concluded.
On the 12th of August EFC will be taken over by a German car firm who apparently will bring in new money for transfers and will begin operation Goodison Relocation.
You heard it here first folks.
You heard it here first folks.
Mr Source - great completely ridiculous rumour - it's what summer is all about. I can imagimne the BMW Boardroom meeting now ? "We are in the middle of a credit crisis so what we really need to do now is to buy a football club which is losing money hand over fist - all in favour raise your hand." ? priceless!!!
Paul,
I believe I understand your logic but it is flawed.
Everton FC is a TOP FLIGHT football club, indeed, more so than any other in English football history. The Premier League is like a pyramid, it is a long way to the top but that is where to be.
The finances are all important and it is through success on the pitch that our revenue will increase.
Success will be most likely by keeping and building on our existing squad.
Can you imagine the media led feeding frenzy that would follow your possible course of action? I
n the real world the vultures would tear the flesh off the carcus before you could say, "Nil Satis Nisi Optimum".
I believe I understand your logic but it is flawed.
Everton FC is a TOP FLIGHT football club, indeed, more so than any other in English football history. The Premier League is like a pyramid, it is a long way to the top but that is where to be.
The finances are all important and it is through success on the pitch that our revenue will increase.
Success will be most likely by keeping and building on our existing squad.
Can you imagine the media led feeding frenzy that would follow your possible course of action? I
n the real world the vultures would tear the flesh off the carcus before you could say, "Nil Satis Nisi Optimum".
Its all a bit Vorsprung durch technik to me.
Hey Paul ... I?ve got a better idea ... lets borrow £90 million .. ok well perhaps £78 million ... pretend to need it for a stadium .. invest in the hottest young footballing talent to supplement our squad and watch EFC break the big 4 monotony - sorry monopoly ... Win the Champions League and recoup all the money in the space of three years ...make massive profit after the next two.. thus funding the purchase of a bigger, better and more ?central? stadium than was intended in the first place ... become a G14 club on the proceeds of our 90k gate every fortnight.. install Joe Parkinson as head of FIFA and pursue our ideal of complete world domination. In a football sense of course .... I think this fits better with NSNO than your idea perhaps :-)
Think he’s been on the sauce !
Jackanory! Jackanory!!
You are certifiable. Your next, immediate, action should be to section yourself.
If my comment sounds like a joke, please, trust me IT ISN’T - You need serious help now.
If my comment sounds like a joke, please, trust me IT ISN’T - You need serious help now.
Sell the yak for 10m, stick it all on the 50/1 longshot ’Runs Backwards’ in the 2.30 at Kempton... buy back the yak for 20m... do the stadium thing... buy a white cat.. cradle it one handed while smoking large cigars... develop an evil laugh... then plot to take over the world.... or if we’re being totally crazy - move to Kirkby...
This is exactly what I used to do 10 years ago when I got bored winning all the prizes in CM 97/98.
Somehow I assume it doesn’t work that well in real life...
Somehow I assume it doesn’t work that well in real life...
Paul, I?ve no objection to radical ideas or lateral thinking but this one really is a non-starter. The way the Premier League is constructed now we would drop like a stone, our season ticket income would be wiped out which is currently repaying our long-term loans, the Championship is a notoriously difficult league to be promoted from ? ask Leeds, Forest, Coventry, Palace, Southampton, Watford, Wolves... And I really can?t see the point in trying to get to the top of the ladder from starting at the base when you?re already 4/5 of the way from the top anyway!
Bless. I just love care in the community.
Super smashing greaaaatttt! Finally, the solution we’ve all been waiting for!
Why was this utter rubbish even published
I think everyone needs to settle down a bit on this one. My take on Paul’s suggestion is that he trying to encourage us to think outside the square on ways to move our currently stagnating Club forward as the current ways are clearly not working (as evidenced by the split between EFC fans, the lack of new faces and the endless debates about lack of investment coming into the Club).
Paul, I admire your gumption for posting this suggestion, even though I don’t necessarily agree with it. But what does amaze me is the immature reaction of many to your suggestion - and not one of those damning you (generally with a mouthful of vitriol) has responded to your challenge to offer a viable option! Even more alarmingly, many have based their "partial options" for raising funds in supporters putting their hands in their pockets yet again (not a bad idea if it leads to changes at the top of the EFC organisation) but then assumes that the current "leadership" of the Club will use it purposively on players and/or infrastructure.
Once again, this clearly has not happened, especially since the arrival of KW as evidenced by the "missing" millions from the sale of McFadden and the misleading statements over our financial burdens and other infrastructural requirements in relation to Kirkby, the (in my opinion fraudulent) Fortress Funds affair, etc, etc.,
So, rather than tearing Paul to shreds on this one, let’s try and focus on the bigger game which is the survival and continued improvement of our beloved EFC and try to come up with realistic options to achieve this.
Paul, I admire your gumption for posting this suggestion, even though I don’t necessarily agree with it. But what does amaze me is the immature reaction of many to your suggestion - and not one of those damning you (generally with a mouthful of vitriol) has responded to your challenge to offer a viable option! Even more alarmingly, many have based their "partial options" for raising funds in supporters putting their hands in their pockets yet again (not a bad idea if it leads to changes at the top of the EFC organisation) but then assumes that the current "leadership" of the Club will use it purposively on players and/or infrastructure.
Once again, this clearly has not happened, especially since the arrival of KW as evidenced by the "missing" millions from the sale of McFadden and the misleading statements over our financial burdens and other infrastructural requirements in relation to Kirkby, the (in my opinion fraudulent) Fortress Funds affair, etc, etc.,
So, rather than tearing Paul to shreds on this one, let’s try and focus on the bigger game which is the survival and continued improvement of our beloved EFC and try to come up with realistic options to achieve this.
I think Matt’s idear is more feasable !
The German car firm...is it Audi? Or "Ow Do" as they say in Yorkshire?
Thanks Laurie,
By no means would I want us ever to go down the route I suggest, however in business terms all things have to be considered in the absence of cash.
It is distressing to wake up every morning wondering if a business is going to survive especially with the added pressure of irational football supporters which we all are to a degree.
I merely offer a thought process that I would expect a good chariman/ CEO to consider if the problem of cash was only going to get worse.
Yes you look at all other alternatives as well as thats your job to do, a cold hard look at things now and again can focus the mind on more positive actions.
I hope and I believe to be honest that we will be fine and good times lay ahead but not without some pain first.
Thanks again Laurie.
By no means would I want us ever to go down the route I suggest, however in business terms all things have to be considered in the absence of cash.
It is distressing to wake up every morning wondering if a business is going to survive especially with the added pressure of irational football supporters which we all are to a degree.
I merely offer a thought process that I would expect a good chariman/ CEO to consider if the problem of cash was only going to get worse.
Yes you look at all other alternatives as well as thats your job to do, a cold hard look at things now and again can focus the mind on more positive actions.
I hope and I believe to be honest that we will be fine and good times lay ahead but not without some pain first.
Thanks again Laurie.
Won’t work. Neville has just signed a 4 yr contract. It’s like a new signing. Here it now, over the summer we have signed neville and moyes on long term deals which were our goals before close season.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! NEVILLE HAS JUST SIGNED A NEW 4 YEAR CONTRACT EVEN THO HE’S RUBBISH AND HE’S 31! What the hell is Moyes doin???
I think we just need to calm down a bit. Absolutely mental to suggest we sell all our players. If we were to go down we would never come back up.
Paul, nothing but admiration for someone who has the balls to post something like this, but come on you can’t possibly believe what your saying. Sell the full 1st team and the queue round GP would stretch for miles with people returning season tickets, therefore we lose even more money. Any how have a nice time at the home.
Im enraged all i can say in the words of mr T
SHUT UP FOOOOOOL
SHUT UP FOOOOOOL
OK Paul, enough?s enough. selling the whole team sounds crazy on its own but don?t expect us to believe Phil Neville's signed a 4-year contract, now your just getting bloody ridiculous. How did you get that on the official site?
Dear Mr Kenwright/Wyness
Please, please, please can you do something positive with our football club, so that we can have something nice to debate on Toffeeweb. We are all so bored of scouring the internet for something positive that we are creating ridculous posts.
PS. Neville on a new 4 year deal is not quite what I had in mind!
Please, please, please can you do something positive with our football club, so that we can have something nice to debate on Toffeeweb. We are all so bored of scouring the internet for something positive that we are creating ridculous posts.
PS. Neville on a new 4 year deal is not quite what I had in mind!
’I would like to hear sensible debate about why this would be stupid. Their are no gaurantees that we would get back into the Premier League but that’s life I am afraid’
It was at that point that I pissed myself laughing at this joker.
It was at that point that I pissed myself laughing at this joker.
Congratulations on the most ridicuous comments I have ever heard.
So we would rather be relegated with a group of kids, and not move to Kirkby, but as you say "Thats Life", no it isnt!, That's insanity. It's not even an option. Why the hell are people considering jeapordising the team on the pitch for the stadium?? If we move to Kirkby we have 100% ownership, a team in the Premier League, and hopefully still a decent side on the pitch.
I support Everton the team, that's the most important thing, remember this: your Premier League position affects how much money you get, playing in the Championship = fuck all money and a stadium we won't be able to fill.
Come on guys and girls, is this the kind of fans we have at the club now? I'm still yet to hear a single viable option other than Kirkby. I love Goodison, but realise the future of the club is more important than anything else, some people are willing to chuck ot all away. Crazy Talk.
But thanks though Paul, you did make me laugh very loud.
So we would rather be relegated with a group of kids, and not move to Kirkby, but as you say "Thats Life", no it isnt!, That's insanity. It's not even an option. Why the hell are people considering jeapordising the team on the pitch for the stadium?? If we move to Kirkby we have 100% ownership, a team in the Premier League, and hopefully still a decent side on the pitch.
I support Everton the team, that's the most important thing, remember this: your Premier League position affects how much money you get, playing in the Championship = fuck all money and a stadium we won't be able to fill.
Come on guys and girls, is this the kind of fans we have at the club now? I'm still yet to hear a single viable option other than Kirkby. I love Goodison, but realise the future of the club is more important than anything else, some people are willing to chuck ot all away. Crazy Talk.
But thanks though Paul, you did make me laugh very loud.
Paul, can I ask what planet you are orbiting at the moment?
I have to say it's a better idea than moving to Kirkby.
Tom Campbell.
I have never read of anything so insane.
Moving to Kirkby indeed!
I have never read of anything so insane.
Moving to Kirkby indeed!
Build a Hotel on the Park End with a nice little iconic tower & call it "The Park End Hotel". One side Hotel & Everton Shop, one side view of pitch for us proles & the prawn sandwich brigade. Sell corporate boxes, recoup costs albeit slowly. Knock down Bullens Rd, rebuild, knock down Gladys Street, rebuild being careful to incorporate St Lukes, knock down & rebuild Main Stand. Time to complete 5 years, result - nirvana. That’s my business plan once I’ve bought Bill out......then the alarm clock went off & I woke up.
This is the best laugh about Everton I have had in ages. If entertaining us was your intention then well done!
As for "I merely offer a thought process that I would expect a good chariman/ CEO to consider if the problem of cash was only going to get worse" Get real! This is something an Everton Chairman/CEO might consider but even they are not that inept. If we sold the entire first team squad we wouldn’t really have a viable option.
Plus you forget that our current debts ARE securred against Premier League Money and future Season Ticket sales.
Barry Kermode, your idea is an updated version of Tom Hughes plans and is actually financially viable.
If we are to borrow money it should be to build a new Park end stand a la Tom Hughes. The enlarged stand would then allow us to slowly rebuild the ground, stand by stand. It would also mean we could have all the new technology encorporated over time and we would actually have Stadium not a big bowl!
Even Man United did it slowly!
As for "I merely offer a thought process that I would expect a good chariman/ CEO to consider if the problem of cash was only going to get worse" Get real! This is something an Everton Chairman/CEO might consider but even they are not that inept. If we sold the entire first team squad we wouldn’t really have a viable option.
Plus you forget that our current debts ARE securred against Premier League Money and future Season Ticket sales.
Barry Kermode, your idea is an updated version of Tom Hughes plans and is actually financially viable.
If we are to borrow money it should be to build a new Park end stand a la Tom Hughes. The enlarged stand would then allow us to slowly rebuild the ground, stand by stand. It would also mean we could have all the new technology encorporated over time and we would actually have Stadium not a big bowl!
Even Man United did it slowly!
Paul, I’m sorry mate but this has to be the funniest post I have ever read on this site. With actual tears in my eyes I cannot stop laughing.
Our best youngsters couldn’t even beat Cambridge. Can you see the grin on Gerrards face when he scores the 9th goal at Kirkby... before half time!
Not to mention Hull City collecting our Sky money.
Lee Smith summed it up in the first response. After that everything else is superfluous.
Our best youngsters couldn’t even beat Cambridge. Can you see the grin on Gerrards face when he scores the 9th goal at Kirkby... before half time!
Not to mention Hull City collecting our Sky money.
Lee Smith summed it up in the first response. After that everything else is superfluous.
Clearly on drugs!!
Hardly an original idea.
I believe it is commonly called The Leeds Model. Run out of cash, flog your first team, rely on kids to keep you up and finish up with Ken Bates as your Chaiman and Dennis Wise in-charge playing 2 divisions below where you started.
No thanks.
In terms of thinking outside the box....how about getting one of the largest and most successful business in the UK to build us a new stadium as part of a major regeneration project, somwhere fairly close to our roots, but perhaps more conveniently located for travel?
Ideally we would get them to pay for virtually all of it minimising our overlal exposure and risk.
Sounds crazy. Actually it sounds insane, it is so far out of the box.
I am not necessarily pro-Kirkby, but in terms of out of the box and a radical plan.......err I believe that it ticks all of the.....err boxes.
I believe it is commonly called The Leeds Model. Run out of cash, flog your first team, rely on kids to keep you up and finish up with Ken Bates as your Chaiman and Dennis Wise in-charge playing 2 divisions below where you started.
No thanks.
In terms of thinking outside the box....how about getting one of the largest and most successful business in the UK to build us a new stadium as part of a major regeneration project, somwhere fairly close to our roots, but perhaps more conveniently located for travel?
Ideally we would get them to pay for virtually all of it minimising our overlal exposure and risk.
Sounds crazy. Actually it sounds insane, it is so far out of the box.
I am not necessarily pro-Kirkby, but in terms of out of the box and a radical plan.......err I believe that it ticks all of the.....err boxes.
How to kill a club in a few easy steps!
New stadiums are wonderful ... especially at the expense of quality players - just ask Southampton and Leicester fans!
Lolly!
New stadiums are wonderful ... especially at the expense of quality players - just ask Southampton and Leicester fans!
Lolly!
Lets sell all our best players and get relegated to push the club forward.
I?m sure this one?s a bit tongue in cheek. I just hope BK doesn?t see this otherwise big Keith will be out of work.
Your?e obvoiusly not the only advocate of stripping all our assets.
I?m sure this one?s a bit tongue in cheek. I just hope BK doesn?t see this otherwise big Keith will be out of work.
Your?e obvoiusly not the only advocate of stripping all our assets.
It really saddens me what is happening at OUR club. I am in my late 50s and EFC has brought me some boss memories. And some I?ve felt like topping meself. But nothing hurts more seeing and hearing Blue bloods, young and old, torn apart by the mechanisms of the club?s heirarchy. Greed has taken its cancer to Goodison. Can it be cured? I fucking hope so.
A more obvious solution would be that Kenwright and Wyness fuck off and someone with some money takes over the club. This way we keep the squad we have and build on it by buying even better players, Goodison is redeveloped and we go on to be crowned English and European champions!
Was having a bad day so I thought i’d read this again... cheers mate!
I?m sorry if I sound a little naive, but can someone explain exactly what Mr. Wyness does at EFC? I am genuinely perplexed as to his contribution. What does he do on a daily basis to earn such a big salary?
A few youngsters and a few cheap older heads could keep you up. Maybe. Once!
But it would take three years to build a new ground. Could we survive in the Championship for that long?
To be honest - it’s not a bad plan for a team who was hovering around 14th in the Prem every season... but giving up the chance of top six finish each year is a big gamble.
ps. Replace Wyness with Carol Vorderman!
But it would take three years to build a new ground. Could we survive in the Championship for that long?
To be honest - it’s not a bad plan for a team who was hovering around 14th in the Prem every season... but giving up the chance of top six finish each year is a big gamble.
ps. Replace Wyness with Carol Vorderman!
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1 Posted 24/07/2008 at 14:29:55
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