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Oh Dear, Liverpool Next

By Tony Marsh :  25/09/2008 :  Comments (94) :
Please tell me you can see it now. Please tell me you are on to Moyes and his crazy methods. It's getting beyond a joke now and all the backing Moyes gets from our fans makes me shake my head in disbelief. We are as bad now as we were in the Walter Smith era as far as the football goes. Steve Round as coach... WHO the Fuck is He? I mean what did Newcastle ever do this century or the last?

I for one don't really care about the Carling Cup or the Uefa Cup as they are both worthless and pointless to a club in our state but that's not the point. We are a shambles all over the park and we have been for years now. Sporadic decent displays and some 'get out of jail free' cards are what we rely on under Moyes and it's just not good enough.

I just don't see any progression as a football team with DM as manager. Ok, we have had an improved league position with DM in charge these past few seasons but let's be honest that's all we have had. Who is to say that this would not be the case with another manager in charge anyway?

It's heartbreaking and soul-destroying as an Evertonian to watch the way we play... and what makes it harder to bare is so many of you love it. David Moyes has gone stale at Everton and there is no escaping this fact. Moyes is all played out and has been sussed out as well.

When DM first arrived at the club, I thought, "Yes, a man with a bit of vision who will push us to greater things," but since then, year after year, it's been the same old shit. Peaks and Troughs, Boom and Bust, and the same old dreary Prehistoric tactics.

WHY can't you all see what so many of us have banged on about for years now?

I watched Swansea v Cardiff game on Tuesday night and Swansea were a joy to watch. On a different planet to us in footballing terms. Neat and quick passing to thier own players, swift breaks from midfield, one-twoes played to feet, all comfortable on the ball throughout the side, no hoofing balls down the channels, total proper football played in a fashion we can only dream of at Everton.

Swansea are a small time outfit in comparison to ourselves so why can they play proper footie and we can't? I mean, so many of you on here are quick to tell me that it takes tons of money to get players who can play football these days. Swansea have a mixture of homegrown players and loan players from abroad... a bit like ourselves in fact. So why can they do it and we can't?

The answer is simple: they have a manger in Martinez who knows how they game should be played and players who want to play this way. We don't have any of this. We have a 'go out and scrap for a result'-type manager with very little real football knowledge and players who are lost in it all. Just ask the strikers who we have turned into duds over the last few years...

For the first time in my life, I don't want to go the derby game on Saturday. I don't think I can take another mauling by the RS at this moment in time. There is a good chance I could get myself locked up if it goes the way I think it will but, like a fool, I will go for my annual dose of punishment. It's what we do best these days, though, isn't it?

Someone posted a comment on here yesterday stating David Moyes is the best manager we have ever had. Well if this is better than the Kendall or Joe Royle days then I am watching the wrong team. This is utter Garbagge and Moyes has nowhere left to take us. We have seen all he has to offer and it's not all it's cracked up to be.

I hope DM doesn't sign the contract that has been on the table for nearly a year now as I can't take much more of his Bullshit... I mean, how dare they call Davey Boy a ditherer over his contract! Of course you need a year to decide if you are staying or not. It's no different from when you want to sign a player, is it Dave?

Roll on Saturday then, lads, and let's put this horrible start to the season behind us with a win over the old enemy. I think it will be 3-0 for the Blues with a Yakubu hat-trick.... "TONY, WAKE UP ? your porridge is ready!"

Well, we can all dream can't we?

Reader Comments

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Paul Niklas
1   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:04:15

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Tony, you're in for a mauling I am afraid; however, I cannot really disagree with you.

I see all the problems we have in the body language of DM, I have even noticed Round being paraded more in front of the media which says a lot to me also.

It is very sad to see how someone with the promise DM has shown and what he has achieved relative to the previous 20 years is so down.

Let's hope he can raise himself and the team to give a performance we all expect, albeit I would happily lose it if I was assured we would get back to last years form for the next twenty games.
Ste Kenny
2   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:15:15

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Tony

I've stopped at the first part of your article. I'm going to read the rest in a minute but why in your opinion have we performed so much better under Moyes than Smith if we play the same football and the rest of the league has improved?
Neil Humphrey
3   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:19:04

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I never thought I would find myself agreeing with you Tony but I fear you may be right. We are a shambles at the moment. Moyes seems to have lost interest. However, I think we will pull it together on Saturday and beat the red shite. That will be enough to keep the eternal optimists dreaming that something good might come of this season. Jesus, I?m even starting to sound like Tony!
Anto Meehan
4   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:25:44

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Hmmmm, things are getting strange.... I?m beginning to come around to Tony's point of view. The football under Moyes has been shocking bar a few performances.

Looking at Arsenal the other night reminded why I fell in love with the game, not saying we have the players for that at the moment but come on, I?ve seen my Sunday league side put together more flowing moves!!

I think the clock has run out for Moyes...... question is, who could we get in?? The barcodes are so desperate they?re plumping for Venables FFS
Steve Beck
5   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:39:00

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Tony, I totally agree with you about wanting attractive football but who is available to achieve this or can Moyes change?
Christopher Mowll
6   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:45:26

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Tony, another rant after another poor performance. You really are predictable!

You have made some valid points regarding our brand of football though, and for that I agree with you. But like many of your articles you solely blame Moyes.

Statements like ?We have a ’go out and scrap for a result’-type manager with very little real football knowledge and players who are lost in it all.? completely cancel out any of the valid points your try to get across.

Don?t start making stuff up Tony. You may not be a Moyes? fan, but stop spouting drivel. No football knowledge? Whether you like his tactics or not, he has turned us from relegation fodder into a top 6 club, and on a shoestring budget in comparison to other clubs.

I am as deflated as the next blue this season as I expected so much more from us after the last few seasons. But that is just it isn?t it. I expected. We expected. We all want us to push on, play fantasy football, have our own Robhinio?s in a blue shirt, and challenge for the title.

But that isn?t going to happen any time soon is it? The question you need to ask yourself is ? is it all the managers? fault?

Mike Ashley says he wants to sell Newcastle and within 48 hrs he is courting Arabs, Nigerians and is all over Sky Sports News. Blue Bill says he wants to sell EFC at our EGM, it makes the back page of the Liverpool Echo, and then ???. nothing. Another BK sound bite.

Bill is not serious about selling the club. The Wyness saga stinks and hints of some sort of unrest behind the scenes. No one can talk about any theories as to why the pie man left, as Bully Keith will sue us all, and Davey is not signing his contract because he know what is going on.

We need investment. We have taken on the Sky 4 on our own terms, and have done a bloody good job. Now we need a little bit of help.

If Moyes goes this year, and the same infrastructure remains at the club regarding finances, would you still fancy Royle or Kendall to give it a go? My bet would be you would not get them anywhere near the place.

COYB
Robbie Skinley
7   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:31:38

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Did TM really bring up Swansea?! Does he believe these masters of beautiful football would do the business in the Premier League? Completely pointless comparison as far as I?m concerned.

As for Kendall and Royle, Moyes certainly can?t be classed as good as Kendall, but as TM complains about the style we play as much as anything, can?t really remember Total Football under Big Joe!

And as for ?I don?t see any progression as a football club other than improved league position?, that's barely worth responding to. Better team, no relegation scraps for last few years, still not great football but certainly better than in recent years, especially start of last season.

I?m as disappointed as anyone that we?ve won nothing under Moyes and he certainly has his faults, but with the state of the club when he joined and the resources compared to other clubs, don?t think he can be dismissed as easily as TM tries to. His dislike of Moyes seems to border on the completely irrational!

Despite the shitty start to the season and summer we?ve had, think people need to calm down and put things in some perspective.

COYB
Ian Tunny
8   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:46:05

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Tony, what league do Swansea play in? Where has this neat and tidy football got them? I can do a few keep ups and tricks with a ball and play neat tidy football at amatuer level, it doesn't mean I can do it in the Prem.
Mick Gallagher
9   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:52:14

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Well, these next 2 games could make or break what little confidence the players and manager have. Let's hope are defence learn to defend for 90 minutes because they owe us a good performance. I agree with you over Round because since he?s been here, we're defending worse then Newcastle. As for the Royle or Moyes debate, think back to the Anfield derby 2-1 with wingers and attacking players, Limpar and Kanchelskis taking the piss ? let's hope for the same on Saturday. UP THE FUCKING TOFFEES
Brian Waring
10   Posted 25/09/2008 at 18:54:16

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Tony, spot on as usual mate. Now wait for the usual suspects to berate you, even though, in front of their own eyes, what you are pointing out, has been going on for yonks, and up to now this season has been no different. They only want to remember the odd game here and there were we have actually played a bit of footy, but have memory loss, for the other 80% of the time. I actually think they slag you off, because deep down they know you are right, but don’t want to admit it. I’m just glad there are fans like me, you, Gavin, Jay and the other lads,who can see us for what we really are,a shambles. IMWT (in Marshy we trust )
Mike Price
11   Posted 25/09/2008 at 19:11:53

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I?ve been with you all along on this Tony. The true nightmare on Saturday will be if they announce that Moyes has signed a new contract... the thought of this overrated clown playing hoofball, using his dinasoar PE teacher tactics, wasting millions in the transfer market and picking up more than Wenger would be pure torture.

It's totally bizarre that so many Blues like him... he?s basically Gary Megson, a boring relic whos never won a thing and creates teams in his own image... dour, hardworking and boring. The sooner he goes the better.

Declan Brown
12   Posted 25/09/2008 at 19:22:40

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I quote you Tony -

"For the first time in my life, I don?t want to go the derby game on Saturday. I don?t think I can take another mauling by the RS at this moment in time. There is a good chance I could get myself locked up if it goes the way I think it will"

I feel the same way. Those words summed up for me exactly what is coming in this Derby and I don?t care what Doddy and his ?shiny happy people? crew think of that statement.

Right now I?m seriously dreading this Derby even though we?re at home. Seriously i?m shitting it, don?t want to watch it although of course I will be, praying like a priest on his death bed.

I like Moyes, I think he?s an honourable chap, too nice in the media sometimes for the raw deal we / he gets, the football we play can be so awful at times it makes me so angry, but deep down, i like the man, I want us to get it right under Moyes, but I have never felt any sort of hope going into a Derby with Moyes at the helm.

Say what you want about Kendall and Royle, but since Kendall left (and Joe Royle before him) we haven?t had a manager who seems to REALLY understand what the Derby means to the supporters, to have to listen to redshites after we surrender without a decent fight, no matter how bad you think Royle?s or Kendall?s (Mk2 and Mk3 period) teams were they went to spill their blood if they had to in a Derby match, if we lost you knew at least they gave the bastards a hard time in doing so.

Anyone remember the Dogs of War, in Royle?s first game in the Derby where McManaman was tackled and booted by Barry Horne and Joe Parkinson at the same time (that still sends a shiver up my spine when I see it) and in the following Derby?s anything that moved in a redshite shirt had blue shirts hounding it down into submission?

I hate seeing a Liverpool side bully us out of the game in a Derby, especially at Goodison. That was always one of our hallmarks, where we lacked ability we got double back in sheer guts, determination and heart, Royle and Kendall?s teams always had a bit of needle in them for the Derby, I always felt the players took pride in roughing up the redshite especially at Goodison.

This saturday lunchtime is going to be hard work for us supporters, real hard work, keep praying for miracles so we can have an easy week next week instead of listening to that shower of bastards from across the park.

Come on you Blues...
Simon Hopper
13   Posted 25/09/2008 at 19:48:28

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About a decade ago I had my worst night as a Blue:

We lost 4-1 at Coventry in the old version of the shitty cup. Remember when Shorty and co stayed on the pitch afterwards for a barney with Kendall?

What happened next? We beat the Shite 2-0 at the weekend.

It might happen again...

But I agree I’m worried.
Troy Bayliss
14   Posted 25/09/2008 at 19:51:15

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I have read alot of your articles, Tony, without ever posting, and I never thought I would agree with anything you said. And I don?t. What a load of negative bollocks.

Yes the summer has been a disater and I agree that the football of late has been rubbish, but when we were on good form last year playing some great pasing stuff what was DM?s roll in that? Bystander in a tracksuit?
Andy Crooks
15   Posted 25/09/2008 at 19:50:01

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Spot on, Tony. Our football is drab and DM?s tactics totally uninspiring. Our only genuinely skillful player appears unable to cross a ball our even take a corner. We don?t have a defender who seems remotely comfortable on the ball. We have just spent £15 million on a midfielder who?s most ardent supporter could not describe as being in anyway creative. There are still Evertonians who think we should be grateful for mid-table mediocrity and are happy that the man behind the current shambles is being offered the guts of £4 million a year. I have defended David Moyes any times but can do it no more.

I disagree with you Tony, about the Uefa and Carling Cups; I think any cup is important, especially when there is no chance of anything else, but with the rest I have to admit you?ve been right all along.

Troy Bayliss
16   Posted 25/09/2008 at 20:03:53

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Grateful for midtable mediocrity? Where did we finish last season? I don?t remember finishing mid-table.

And under previous managers we always used to sustained great form all through the year didn?t we? I used to love those battles right down to the wire..... to avoid relegation. Oh yes the glory years are all coming flooding back.
Robbie Muldoon
17   Posted 25/09/2008 at 19:45:24

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All this shit is because of the shower of shit that was our summer.

Moyes terrible tactics have often being overcome by a great team spirit and sense of direction coupled with fine individual performance from the likes of Cahill, Arteta, Pienaar and Yakubu.

The team spirit has bee derailed because we have let good British playes leave like Carsley and AJ and replaced them with foriegners who can?t speak English. Castillo and Fellaini should never be allowed to play together on the middle like they have been.

I can?t even be arsed going on. Fuck it brace myself for Saturday...
Paul Cooper
18   Posted 25/09/2008 at 19:52:56

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I don?t know why I even read the shite you write Tony. If you are sick of watching the blues and don?t want to watch the derby then fuck off and watch Swansea.

Moyes is trying to find a balance to the team after starting the season with no midfield. He?s brought in players who he needs to look at, look at their best position and give them time to settle. We have players coming back all the time and I think when Pienaar returns we will be a different team. We have had some pretty poor performances but if you look at the league table we are not that far off the 5/6 area we usually sit. I think Moyes has been a victim of his own success, as we?ve had a few good seasons he?s given us high expectations and reasons to hope whereas in the past we just tried to avoid being relagated.
Also don?t forget Villa and Man City went out last night to lower league sides. Moyes deserves time this season and then judge him.
William Firstbrook
19   Posted 25/09/2008 at 19:52:19

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I agree with most of your observations, Tony. While a Manager always has to shoulder some of the blame for a team’s poor performance, the main issue at present is that the lads are not performing. Not just one or two, but a vast number of them. On a small squad like this, that is a recipe for disaster and disappointment. Of course, the big question is why. I (and I imagine most on here) would dearly love to know the answer.

This team is at it’s best when the lads are playing for one another. You certainly saw that during stretches of last season. The harder one player worked, the rest felt compelled to follow. This year, the team is playing scared. Afraid to make a mistake and even worse, playing as it the player next to them will make a mistake. That mentality destroys a team pretty fast and is even more difficult to fix. While it’s possible Moyes may be directly or indirectly contributing to this problem, it’s my belief that the players need to account for themselves first and foremost. If they want to right this ship, they need to put in a full and honest 90 minute effort. The result may not be there right away, but it will lay the groundwork for them to re-establish the confidence which drove much of their success last season. I sincerely hope that this weekend proves to be a starting point in that regard.
Gavin Ramejkis
20   Posted 25/09/2008 at 20:12:37

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As Brian has said expect the usual suspects to retort with the usual but this rings so true on so many levels. Whether or not you are a fan of DM you have to try to look at the predictability of his dour football. The argument of DM’s past "success" of making Everton a top six side is history; football is constantly evolving and DM’s style and game play is failing abysmally. other manager’s are more than wise to our weaknesses and can drive right through them; just look at how many goals we have conceded already this season.

We should only judge any manager and players on the here and now and only their most recent form, at Everton this is damning in the extreme. DM has had years to evolve and develop game plans for different game scenarios, sadly he rarely has a plan b or substitutions which have either the time or ability to change a game.

To raise a response to who is available how about Slaven Bilic for a manager who has shown on a fairly big stage he can get his players passing and playing fluid attractive football.
Joe McMahon
21   Posted 25/09/2008 at 20:19:12

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Tony , I’m with you. For the first time in 3 years, I want Moyes to go. Our brand of football is embarrasing!
Richard Dodd
22   Posted 25/09/2008 at 20:28:04

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This post has no place on an Everton website. Tony hates everything about our club and rejoices when we lose.
We have an excellent chairman, a sound manager and an evolving team.
We will get at a point on Saturday to silence our biggest critic. Bet on it!
Gavin Ramejkis
23   Posted 25/09/2008 at 20:40:03

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Richard your excellent chairman is a documented lying bastard and your beloved manager is responsible for the team which this season has already shipped eleven league goals, two european goals and is out of one of the domestic cup competitions at the first hurdle, grow a spine and wake up.

Wouldn’t bet on anything you say either as I can always look at this summers mailbag archives for some of your "dead certs".

0 out of 10 - strike two
Ste Kenny
24   Posted 25/09/2008 at 20:41:31

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Richard

You're a bigger IDIOT than most people on here think you are if you think any of us feel like a point at home to that horrible pile of shit is a good result. Talk like that has no place on an Everton website.
Jan Borre Thomassen
25   Posted 25/09/2008 at 20:28:56

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I am a norwegian Evertonian, and have been member of the norwegian supporter club since end of the 80’s. I must say I’m very dissapointed about the football we play at this moment. The start of this season has been really bad, despite a couple of victories.
It seems like the players don’t believe in the way they play. Far too many long passes with no adress, too many errors in defence, no fast one-touch passes in midfield, and certainly no goalscoring ability in front... How will this end??

I (must) have faith in the lads saturday at this seasons BIGGEST game, but I’m worry about how we can loose the game against L’pool, not so much if we loose. A deserved loose is harder to face rather than a "lucky strike" from L’pool...Last season’s mersey-derby was poor, defeat at home is not good enough !!

Best wishes at saturday from Norway.

PS. My favorite player is Tim Cahill, he shows good attitude, he try as hard he can do in every game, has goal-scoring ability, good pace and not to forget,; he makes the other players better...
Dave Wilson
26   Posted 25/09/2008 at 20:29:26

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Is it my imagination or are them twats even more unbearable and gobby than usual this week.

This article is uncomfortably true. and a derby win can't alter that.

I know the memory plays tricks, but I can't remember ever wanting to win so badly.
Troy Bayliss
27   Posted 25/09/2008 at 21:04:30

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OK lets sack Moyes. And we will replace him with....?
Big Sam - he?s lorded for his fantastic passing football.
Or Curbishley. He?s proven.
Or Sven, he?s cheap. Oh yes sack Moyes and let the good times roll.

As some one rightly pointed out Tony isn?t even an Everton fan he just loves moaning.
Neil Scott
28   Posted 25/09/2008 at 20:41:13

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Tony, I agree in principle but not about Saturday.

The last time the crowd ?spoke? like they did last night after a game was the Spurs game at home two seasons ago.

Moyes heard that and reacted, big time, and somehow I think we?ll react again on Saturday... but most can now see that our good spell has long past and the spirit of our team has not been enhanced at all by a panic buy who only speaks Flemish.

And Dodd. If you enter a game of football with a team in the same division you aspire to WIN... which gives you THREE points, not one.

And Paul Cooper..."Moyes has been a victim of his own success"

Why? What?s he won?

Apart from £4 MILLION a year of course...
Tony Marsh
29   Posted 25/09/2008 at 21:17:16

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Yea you're right, Troy, I am no Evertonian ? I just do this a a wind up. What a tart you are. As far as I am concerned I have been there, done it, bought the T shirt and now I am sick to fucking death of it all.

Don't get me wrong, I would never speak this way in front of Kopites or any other fans for that matter and will always fight our corner but I won't go along with all this Moyes inspired bullshit just so I can say I am a true supporter. True supporters can't like what we are seeing at the moment can they?
Clyde McPhat
30   Posted 25/09/2008 at 21:21:38

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Someone a few posts ago brought up that Spurs match where the Boys were booed off, and Moyes admitted his mistakes. Why do we have to have history repeat itself. Team booed off, and the manager admits they were right to do it?

I have long been a Moyes supporter, but the start to the season should have been an unbeaten start. The Pompey result was shocking, and to lose twice to Blackburn in a month is disgusting. We cannot afford to give points away, and Moyes left everything to the last second.

To those who think our chairman doesn?t want to sell: NO ONE WANTS TO BUY US.
Troy Bayliss
31   Posted 25/09/2008 at 21:25:05

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Although I am Pro Moyes I do accept that we are not performing at the moment, and so yes I don?t like what I?m seeing. It is, frankly, shit.

But your posts are unrelentingly negative without provinding any alternatives. So what do we need to do? We can?t sign any new players. You say change manager - so who do we bring in?
Paul Gavin
32   Posted 25/09/2008 at 21:36:11

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Basically we are playin shite because there is instability at the club.

Moyes hasn't signed his contract - why is that - all we have been told is that there should be some news soon - if he isn't going to sign it then why doesn't he fuck off now - I think he wants to see what investment is coming in to the club before he commits.

The players are playing with no confidence and this stems from possibly the worst pre-season in our history.

If we concede first on Saturday then I can see us getting tonked, but even if we win it doesn't hide the fact that we are rudderless.

We have a chairman who won't sell and a manger who won't sign a contract and players who suddenly can't defend.

The buck stops with BK and DM.
Steve Edwards
33   Posted 25/09/2008 at 21:56:32

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Jan - I assume that your a red shite supporter taking the piss...
Andy Crooks
34   Posted 25/09/2008 at 22:01:42

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Troy, there are plenty of coaches other than big Sam and Curbishley. For £4 million a year we?d have plenty of options. Gavin mentioned Bilic and I?d go along with that or how about Maldini or how about anybody who?d bring some flair.
Christopher Mowll
35   Posted 25/09/2008 at 22:11:20

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Steve ? How on earth do you see Jan?s post as a piss take? Is no one outside of Liverpool allowed to support us? No wonder our brand name is fucked!

You have answered Troy?s question, but what about everyone else?s? Who do we bring in to lead our financially crippled club to the next level?

DM had all the riches of the Sky 4, would we even be asking this question?

it the manager, or the lack of financial support from sound bite Bill that is now the problem?

As far as I am concerned the manager has perfomed wonders. Am I happy with our style of football - of course not. Give DM £150 million to waste ala Rafael Beneathus, and then slag him off.
Dean Adams
36   Posted 25/09/2008 at 22:00:02

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I can?t help but remember hoping we would reach 40 points before the last 6 games as for as long as I can remember we tend to switch off. Our record at the death of the season has been shite for years. Let's get a grip. We are not a wealthy club and we cannot keep up with the big boys. We spend £20 mil, they spend £40 mil. They always move further ahead.

Blame Moyes. Easy option, but no answers. Fact is he has raised our expectations dramatically and is now paying the price as he was unable to bring in his first choices. He made it clear all summer but as usual very few bothered to listen.

Who is pushing us? Man City .... they lost to Brighton. Well Villa...... they lost to QPR. Portsmouth, oh yes they were battered by Chelsea.

Reality check. Moyes has managed us to our best run for 20 years. Is it enough? Of course not, but at least we have made progress. Is it natural to expect it all your own way? Only if you are so deluded that you can not see the wood for the trees. We have made progress, but sky 4 just up the anti, and we are stretched beyond our limit.

I hate to think those jammy gits across the park might beat us but really they just cheat anyway. Gerard dives, Carragher plays rugby with Lescott, no penalty. It wont change. We are not in their gang and they wont let us play with their ball. Just like those days in school. We are better than them and we will overcome, but maybe noy just yet.

David Moyes has been great for team morale but this dragging of the heals serves no positive for us Toffees.

Donald Galves
37   Posted 25/09/2008 at 22:26:27

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Dean,
A well reasoned and balanced post that doesn?t resort to histrionics and massive over reactions. I think you?ve strayed onto the wrong website chief.
Christopher Mowll
38   Posted 25/09/2008 at 22:45:52

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Donald Galves - now that?s made me laugh on this "lets bash Davey Moyes to bits post?. Nice one fella.

Dean - spot on mate - well said. If I wasn?t so pissed I would have loved to have put it so elequently myself.

Tony - I?m still waiting for a response from you. Who do we get to manage our club to the next level without all the millions to spend that the Sky 4 have?

What is your answer? As you hate Moyes so much you must have a plan B? Stop ducking the question man. If you want to post such negativity then let?s hear an alternative from you.
Nick Entwistle
39   Posted 25/09/2008 at 22:39:11

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What Dean said.
We’re chasing Ferraris and all we can afford is a Super Aguri.
Dave Jeanrenaud
40   Posted 25/09/2008 at 23:29:39

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Complete and utter tosh as usual Tony. I’m sure your musings were similarly prolific in the early weeks of last season when we took 13 points from our first 10 league games. You were then not heard from in months when Moyesy inspired the lads to our best spell of form in recent history.

I have total faith in Moyesy inspiring a similar run in the coming weeks and silencing you once more.
Ian Reddish
41   Posted 26/09/2008 at 00:10:52

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To be honest I agree with Tony and have done for a while, Everton under David Moyes have made strides, but we only play good football sporadically and as a season ticket holder who travels from Derbyshire for every game and most away games, I?m getting sick of watching hoofballs. Football isn?t a hard game, Blackburn passed the ball around beautifully Wednesday night and they had Stephen Warnock in midfield for god's sake! If Moyes does go at the end of the season or before, I won?t be upset to be honest.
Jason Lam
42   Posted 26/09/2008 at 02:52:18

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The point is we’ve become a (traditionally) Roma and Lazio club, where the whole season hinges on the 2 derbies. The prize is pride. For themselves and mostly for the fans. We’re not going to win any silverwave to be honest. It’s a sad fact but true.

If the lads in blue can’t motivate themselves in the most important game of the season we might as well give up as a football club. Fair enough we’re playing against 12 RS and we may likely lose the game. But if the players are not up for it then Moyes must go. I’ve seen managers sacked for less. This coming from a Moyes fan.
Sean Condon
43   Posted 26/09/2008 at 03:43:07

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I know that no one gives a fuck, but can I remind everyone that for nineteen games smack in the fucking middle of last season this man managed the best club in the league? Don?t believe me, do the math. Start with beating Derby away the week after Clattenburg.

That?s half a season in the biggest, bestest, roughest, toughest competition on this mortal coil. I know that it didn?t bring us any silver, but it was a substantial achievement nonetheless. And we won a game or two in the other, useless competitions as well.

We?re all fuckin pissed off. Get a collective grip and get behind your club.
COYB!

Steve Nikolovski
44   Posted 26/09/2008 at 05:58:30

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Even though I think Moyes is a sound manager, he turned a ok team when he took over and turned it into a good one. But I think that we need a great team and to do that you need a great coach, someone like a Guus Hiddink will do. Ask Tim Cahill !!!!!! If we are talking £3.5M per season for Moyes, we should be able to get Hiddink for £5M.
Derek Thomas
45   Posted 26/09/2008 at 05:55:12

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He’s right. I too am worried about The Derby. The only consolation is, with an IF and the obligatory BUT...If ever a game was made for a Moyes do or die performance AND we stay lucky all it will do is paper over the cracks.

And no, I don’t think Moyes will ever change, he is, as we all are, well just exactly what we are no more or less, people don’t change, they only become more so.
Adam Cunliffe
46   Posted 26/09/2008 at 07:44:18

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I?m inclined to agree with Tony?s article. We play shite football under Moyes and we can't even beat Hull after signing Fellaini who?s probably worth more than their whole team.

But, regarding the bit about Joe Royle, I know we won the FA Cup under him, but weren't we called the Dogs of War back then? I was only a baby with my Danka shirt on at the time but if we were called the Dogs of War I don't think our football was free flowing back then either.
Dave Lucan
47   Posted 26/09/2008 at 07:43:50

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Ok, we?ve played like shit, the ball never touches the floor, our defence seems happier to put in into our own net than keep it out, the crowd aren?t singing, the understanding between players has seemed to evaporated, we have no money, we don?t know where we?re going to be.......

This list goes on (as we all know). But we are not Manure, Chelski, RS or Arse fans, when has it been any different, oh ok 20 years ago is like fuckin yesterday now is it?

We?re 9th. We?re 3 points clear of Manure (tell me that doesn?t put a sly grin on your face) and at least there is potential in the team for better results.

For the record, I?m not exactly rubbing my hands with glee at the prospect of this weekend, but please, get behind your fucking team. I wish I could be there, but 7,000 miles away.
Rory Slingo
48   Posted 26/09/2008 at 07:36:14

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I?ve been on the fence about Moyes. I loved him at times and loathed him and his tactics at times. I?ll always be grateful and proud of the way he has stabilised our great club but I do find myself sharing Tony?s sentiment here. We?re an established mid-table side now that can?t progress any further without outside investment. So what?s the next step? Remain a mid-table side but improve on the field if not in the table?

I still don?t understand why some fans think we don?t have the players to play the beautiful game. Do they have blinkers on or selective memories? I?ve seen our boys do it on a few occasions over the last few seasons, string more than a few passes together and move it around the park. Well enough to make me sit up and think, "Oh my god, we?re actually playing with some style here!" and this goes back to when we still had McFadden and Beattie.

What makes it all the more frustrating is that it only lasts for a brief spell and the next game they go back to hoofball! It?s almost as if they go back in the dressing room and get the hairdryer from DM. Something like, "What the fuck was that shite, moving the ball around like that!? we only have 90 mins lads, we can?t waste time playing passes on the ground, hoof it up as far as you can and let AJ/Yak latch on to it FFS! One of ?em?s bound to get in, law of averages and all that!"

As an overseas blue, I can only ever watch matches on telly but I?m sure those few times where they?ve passed the ball like that, the lads had this look in their eyes, like they were doing something naughty whilst their parents weren?t looking. It?s obvious to me that the boys can and do want to play beautiful football, they?ve tried at times. So why can?t we do it on any sort of consistent basis? Surely the blame lies at the manager's feet on that?
Vinny Garstrokes
49   Posted 26/09/2008 at 08:29:29

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For those of us who think a great deal of DM, an announcement today or tomorrow morning that he has signed a new contract would be the perfect fillip going into the derby game. Even the shoddy Everton PR team would recognise that. DM is an honourable man but I am more worried about what he isn?t saying rather than what he is! Remember, my nan's, gran's boyfriend's sister's hairdresser told me 2 months ago that John Collins would be the manager before October is out!!!
Brad Wilkins
50   Posted 26/09/2008 at 06:58:42

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All you people asking who we should try to get if Moyes resigned, look no further than Luis van Gaal, excellent manager who has worked wonders with AZ on a very small budget. Get it sorted Bill.
David Nicholls
51   Posted 26/09/2008 at 08:01:33

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Ok Tony, I completely disagree with nearly everything you’ve written including this article but I respect your opinion because you’ve basically had the same viewpoint throughout the time I’ve known about Toffeeweb (About 3 yrs).

I do however think some posters on this site are a little fickle. The summer was if truth be told a bit of a disaster and we are blatantly struggling at the minute due to our new players not having time to bed in. But I think some of the negativity in the mailbag recently is way over the top.

I don’t want to seem like I’m burying my head in the sand but I’m actually quite relaxed about our ON FIELD situation. Although we are a little short on numbers we potentially have our best starting eleven since the eighties and I’m absolutely 100% convinced we can have a good season.

Keep the faith, we’ll come through this sticky patch and continue our undoubted progress under Moyes. Mark my words

COYB!!!
David Penrose
52   Posted 26/09/2008 at 08:46:58

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Must be strange because I also agree with a large part of Tony?s article. The football under Moyes is awful but to be fair to him he has bought/used good footballers. A midfield of Arteta, Pienaar, Osman should be able to play the ball to feet and the Yak and Saha are both decent on the ball. The problem for me is the defence's inability to bring the ball out and the fact that the midfielders do not show for it. Moyes is to blame for the lack of width/pace and as was mentioned he seems to have given up...
Arthur Jones
53   Posted 26/09/2008 at 08:18:18

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I recall an article Tony wrote last year were he actually praised Moyes, the team, and the football we were playing. The squad hasn?t changed that much, we?ve lost Carsley, Faddy and AJ and added Fellaini, Castillo and Saha. In the interim time though, we?ve had our fair share of injuries, and inexplicable loss of form of certain players ie Lescott and Howard.

I actually do understand sligtly where Tony Marsh is coming from, I was one of the thousands at Blackburn and I find it hard to remember a more inept performance... doom and gloom on the trip back home but I?ll still be there on Saturday, no more or less apprehensive than I normally am at a Derby!

I can?t blame David Moyes for our current form. It isn?t him who scored 3 totally avoidable own-goals this season, and despite Wednesday?s debacle, we are capable of scoring goals: The Yak and Tim C can score against the best.

You can?t compare Swansea trying to play pretty football, they wouldn?t last 5 minutes in the Premier League Derby played some nice football just before they came up ....... Whereas Stoke this season have already caused more problems to so called good teams, Villa and Liverpool, and their brand of the game is industrial to say the least. When we get a run of a couple of half decent results and the confidence returns we?ll be back to normal ......... Don?t Panic !!!

Rory Slingo
54   Posted 26/09/2008 at 09:03:51

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David Nicholls: "Although we are a little short on numbers we potentially have our best starting eleven since the eighties"

Hmm, you must be right. the difference is against Hull, the 80s team would?ve come back 2 goals and then gone on to destroy them 4-2. Careful in that sand now, tide?s coming in :p
Dave Lynch
55   Posted 26/09/2008 at 09:09:05

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Some accuse Tony of being negative? Fact! He is writing the truth. We are playing awfull football and have done for the majority of Moyes reign. Beside a few games where we started to actually pass the ball, we always revert to type. Long ball hoofs into corners or straight to the head of opposing centre half?s.
I have laid off Moyes for a long time, because I felt it futile to slag him off anymore. But when Doddy spouts his shite it really irks me big time. We will never, ever, ever............. Win anything with this man.
Chelsea in the CC semi did it for me. One glorious opportunity pissed away due to his negativity. You know the scenario. Don?t concede and you can?t be beaten, when we did concede, no plan B, and out we went like mice.

I, like the majority, fear the worst for Saturday. I predict a mullering, this is not negativity. It is based on current form and the garbage we are playing at the moment.

I know footys a funny old game, but we are not fun to watch. We are DIRE! Don?t expect it to change either.

James Brown
56   Posted 26/09/2008 at 09:30:47

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Tony Marsh on the wind up again. Bad start to the season? Yes. Get rid of Moyes? No. We would be playing championship football by now if we didn’t have Moyes. Did Smith ever get us in the top half of the table? Tell me things haven’t improved.
It’s obvious that TM is some sort of wind up merchant, I just feel sorry for those of you who are stupid/gullible enough to agree with him.
Jamie Evans
57   Posted 26/09/2008 at 09:48:48

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Although I am dreading the derby for obvious reasons ? our defence, Keane opening his account, our performances so far, Gerrard reffing the game etc ? I think the only thing us supporters should concentrate on is getting behind the team. Encouraging them throughout.... not the usual Goodison moans and groans at a mis-place pass or a broken-down move!

Let's cheer them on til the final whistle.... and if we do go 1 down let's have a big roar as we kick off..... this will help the team more than a quiet Goodison!

Let's raise the roof and cheer the boys on....

COYB
James Boden
58   Posted 26/09/2008 at 08:56:14

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Having read these comments, I have to agree with Tony and a small proportion. Football under Moyes is like watching paint dry, at times it really is pathetic. 6 years 0 trophies, 1 semi-final and even then we had a bye and got outplayed twice by chelsea. He?s extremely negative. Take Stoke the other week, he put out a team to match them, they are Stoke City for heavens sake.

And also I think some of our players are very poor to be fair. Neville is a pain in the backside, Howard has fallen right down the pan as has Lescott who Im tired of just for the fact he always has a cobb on. Also Osman is a fairy player only and I'm tired of hearing how great Arteta is. He's played over 20 games against top sides i.e. sky 4 and Fiorentina and I can recall him playing 3 good games maybe. In fact he?s been very poor for more than a year. He scores maybe 1 a season, delivery is atrocious, consistently hits the first man, that I'm sorry is not a good footballer.

And back to Moyes, I can't believe we ever finished 4th under him because, with the exception of the odd game, we've played some dire football in his time. The only time I can remember him showing ambition against a top 4 side was when we beat United in 2005 when Big Dunc scored, such a rariety under Moyes that we'd go for the win from the off. I don't care what any of you Moyes lovers say, he's tactically inept, we've got by in his time on grinding out a result.

I for one hope he walks out and Kenwright, who should go back to Blood Brothers where he belongs, joins him too. Bring in Billic, Hiddink or Guillit, all with more invention than Moyes. Do any of you honestly believe we have a hope in hell of getting anything from the derby? Keane and Gerrard are certainties to score and we will get hammered. We are in dire straights and will finish about 15th. I know most of you will go mad but come on, wake up, our football club has become a joke and that is something i am very sad to say.

Daniel McLoughlin
59   Posted 26/09/2008 at 10:26:25

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Look at West Brom, Tony Mowbray has them playing really good passing football but they are almost certainly going down. If we start trying to pass teams like Arsenal off the park we would get hammered, end of. We have our own style of play which isn?t pretty but it has been effective to a point. And the standard of football in the prem is a different world to Swansea vs Cardiff in the Championship ? even though we are shit, I think even we could look good against Cardiff. Talking shit again mate.
Ciarán McGlone
60   Posted 26/09/2008 at 10:30:23

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Why are people so offended by facts?

Why is it such a function of the human condition that we only see want to see?

Tony Marsh provides the facts - and gets roundly condemned for it...

What a bunch of aggravating shits the double bind optimism club are!
Roger Bear
61   Posted 26/09/2008 at 10:42:47

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If you want to appreciate good football skills on Saturday then get behind the 4 fat bastards who will be having a go at the "Kick for the Carribean|" challange at half time. No fitness levels to speak of, marginal understanding of football -- not dissimilar to what we all would have seen from the Blues during the first half.
Bill Goodall
62   Posted 26/09/2008 at 10:42:30

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I suppose eventually you had to be right Tony.
John Sully
63   Posted 26/09/2008 at 11:14:26

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2 posts in a week from Mr Marsh? things must be bad! I dont remember hearing much from you when we were doing well last season. Right or wrong its pathetic that fans like you will only make themselves heard when things aren?t going well. What do you do with yourself when we win!!? COYB
Declan Brown
64   Posted 26/09/2008 at 11:18:43

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Adam Cunliffe -

We were called the Dogs of War because we had a ?no nonsense, clear all danger first then re-organise? attitude in defence, a midfield that tackled anything and everything that moved, and a legendary focal point in Duncan Ferguson who terrorised defences when he actually played in his first seasons with us.

They played a bit too. Anyone remember Anders Limpar dancing through 4 Liverpool players before setting up Kanchelskis for his 2nd goal (and the winning goal) at the Kop end? Does anyone not remember Ian Rush crying on tv afterwards about Liverpool passing teams to death too much?

The problem with Joe Royle was that he was not given enough time to do what Moyes was given time to do, turn a team of battlers into a team in the mould of the School of Science, only for Peter Johnson to needlessly get rid of him.

I feel a lot happier if we had Joe Royle?s Dogs of War playing Liverpool tomorrow. The Redshite would have the bruises afterwards to show they were in a proper Derby match. Tomorrow?s game would be made for a Joe Royle team to get stuck into that lot across the park. Our boys under Moyes get bullied by them far too easily for my liking, that?s something I always thought Moyes would never ever stand for either.
Patty Beesley
65   Posted 26/09/2008 at 11:42:59

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Hate to burst your bubble Tony - yes Swansea were a joy to watch the other night against Cardiff but this is because Cardiff are their hated rivals [as with Liverpool and Everton] and they raised their game. If you look at their league record this season so far, it?s as good as Everton?s!! I should know I live up the road from there.
Stephen Stuart
66   Posted 26/09/2008 at 11:47:50

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@ Chris Leyland

You forgot to mention that we have the cleanest bathrooms in the premiership; that all the players clean their teeth regularly and Moyes has the record number of handshakes with opposition managers since the war!

AND HAVE WON ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!

Patty Beesley
67   Posted 26/09/2008 at 11:49:36

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Post removed for abusing the Conditions of Use
Simon Jones
68   Posted 26/09/2008 at 11:48:55

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A stuttering start to the season and we are all doom and gloom. Two wins, two losses and one draw. Ok so its not great but we’d finish the season on over 50 points at that rate. I can see why we are known as "Bitter Blues." Get real, every team has an indifferent start to a season now and again. Are they calling for Ferguson’s head on any Man U websites? I guess not, though I can’t bring myself to actually check it out!
Brian Richardson
69   Posted 26/09/2008 at 12:08:09

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"I just don’t see any progression as a football team with DM as manager. Ok, we have had an improved league position with DM in charge these past few seasons but let’s be honest that’s all we have had. Who is to say that this would not be the case with another manager in charge anyway?"

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

That’s priceless, Tony. Absolutely fucking priceless.
Paul Walsh
70   Posted 26/09/2008 at 11:52:12

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You know what? Some Evertonians of a certain age have never been able to adjust to the fact that we don?t enjoy the lofty status we had twenty years ago. Their whole view and perspective is jarred by memories of when we were kings, genuinely callenging for all the trophies. Every player that fills a position in the present side or recent teams suffers by comparison to one of the greats of yesteryear. They?ve never fully grasped the fact Everton have slipped away from the elite.

How do I know? Because I?ve been one of them and it caused me no end of pain and suffering (watching Blues slip and slide from the Harvey era right through to the end of the Smith one. Yes that includes Royle?s Dogs of War) until I learned to accept the way things really were. As a consequence I?m free of these expectations that continue to frustrate some of my fellow middle-aged Evertonians. I?d respectfully suggest Tony try to do the same.

Connor Rohrer
71   Posted 26/09/2008 at 12:39:49

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A losing mentality gets you nowhere though, we expect the worst and I do think that shows in the atmosphere at Goodison. If we believe we can win and create and positive atmosphere then I think we’ve got a chance.

If we expect to lose, create a negative atmosphere and get on the players backs it won’t help anyone. I just hope Goodison has one of it’s good days against Liverpool.

The players are having a tough time at the moment, booing and slagging them off will not help. Supporting them and getting behind them will give them alot better chance.
Dave Lynch
72   Posted 26/09/2008 at 12:35:40

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What is wrong with some of you people !
The reason some of us are not happy is because we are crap.
Plain and simple.
Nearly 7 years of none achievement, and don’t give me this highest position in the league mullarkey.
WE HAVE WON NOTHING, NADA, ZILCH.
The footy is woefull to watch, finishing the best of the rest is not achievement.
It is mediocraty.
Patty, stop telling people to go and support other teams you are out of order.
John Lloyd
73   Posted 26/09/2008 at 12:21:21

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First off, I dont like Tony Marsh. I think he?s a tool, I also dont subscribe to the theory that our football is shit to watch at present so sack the manager..... we?re not fucking geordies!!

But In the last few years when we have played poor football it has garnered us some success, more than in the 15 years that preceeded it anyway.

But I will say that DM along with his coaches & senior players needs to shake things up cos there is very few certainties in football but piss poor performances + bad results = trouble ahead, be that for the manager the club and usually the fans.

Need changes and need them for Saturday. I?m hoping that a fully commited Everton team take the 3 points of them bastards tomorrow & that kick starts our season & puts a bit of lost confidence in the likes of Howard, Lescott, Baines, Yobo & Felliani.

But then again aren't we all
Ciarán McGlone
74   Posted 26/09/2008 at 12:51:27

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Chris Leyland,

Your barrel scraping attempt to add a little gloss to the Moyes/Kenwright era is pathetic... Highest league position in 20 years?

....That was fourth mate, fourth!!!! Hardly something to crow about... and hardly made anymore fantastic by the fact that we were even worse for the previous years..

....and for your information, our record transfer fee is a matter of football player inflation.. and repetition of this is possibly one of the most contrived and utterly stupid validations of Kenwright's tenure.

Tony Marsh did indeed provide the facts ? you merely proved my point about people being double bound in their dismissal of the facts.

The facts are that Kenwright's tenure has been a farce... like our five-year-plan football!
Colin Potter
75   Posted 26/09/2008 at 12:54:31

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Chris Leyland,
It's not acase of getting rid of the manager after a few bad results. It's about getting rid after five seasons of dire crap hoofball! He should have the decency to walk away from Everton next week no matter what the results are on Saturday and Thursday.
Simon Jones
76   Posted 26/09/2008 at 14:02:40

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Yeah, I have heard that Venables is waiting on the Everton job, that’s why he turned down the barcodes job.

Be careful what you wish for...
Ciarán McGlone
77   Posted 26/09/2008 at 14:25:20

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I don?t recall anyone wishing for Venables!
Anthony O'Sullivan
78   Posted 26/09/2008 at 15:29:12

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If we win we won't hear from Tony for a while, if we lose, he will be on saying "I told you so."

But why does he have this fear of a team that drew 0-0 with Stoke and barely beat Crewe in the last 2 games???
EJ Ruane
79   Posted 26/09/2008 at 15:21:20

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Anyone starting a post with "I have heard..." needs to be handed over to an insane person, who is carrying a large blade, a bottle of lemon juice and a sack of salt.

HEARD BLEEDING WHERE ! ! ! ? ?
Michael Kenrick
80   Posted 26/09/2008 at 16:53:25

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The usual diametrically opposed viewpoints flushed out by Tony?s diatribes... but let?s tackle one thing: This "Supporters of the team" twaddle.

Correct me of I?m wrong but hasn?t the Goodison crowd in general prided itself over the years on being discerning when it comes to good football? And on not being reticent in expressing their displeasure when the standard of fayre on show drops below the level of ?barely acceptable??

Let?s have less of the moral judgements regarding what constitutes support and what doesn?t. There has to be some degree of freedom for us as individuals to support or critique the team/club as we see fit without this vile bile and bickering nonsense. So please let?s have no more of the pathetic jibes about supporting other teams or being compared with Newcastle.

We are Evertonians. This is an Everton website. Support, Criticsm, and everything in-between are welcome, so long as you acknowledge that the others posting are doing so from the same basis as yourself. If you can?t do that, then honestly, what is the point of discussing anything on here?

RESPECT!
Billy Coleman
81   Posted 26/09/2008 at 16:49:48

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Without Moyes we would have been relegated a long time ago........ we would have gone down just like City, but would we have got back? Don't forget were skint, until investment arrives, Davey will do the best he can....... COYB
Joeynkoo Ludden
82   Posted 26/09/2008 at 17:50:47

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Billy Coleman: if memory serves, Moyes only kept us up on goal difference in our worst league finish in over a century ? and if memory also serves, we had the same goal difference, only had scored more so stayed up.

Your opinion is another manager would have had us relegated ? I don't agree. Fact is, Moyes was but a knat's whisker away from doing it himself. Hardly cuts a special figure when you consider that.
Billy Coleman
83   Posted 26/09/2008 at 18:40:07

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We should have had Gary Megson!
Mike Evans
84   Posted 26/09/2008 at 19:08:53

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"Respect!" I totally endorse Mr Kenrick?s appeal as Editor of the site.
I might not agree with the views/opinions of Tony Marsh but his right to express them at all times must always be defended. However, my problem is this : I recently posted that a more moderate view (as opposed to perhaps Tony?s view or Richard Dodd?s view) should be allowed to exist within TW?s broad church. This was described by the Editor as "crowing about my De facto superiority". Someone who posted in my defence was described as "sensitive". I have decided it is better to mostly keep my head below the parapet. Recently, I have noticed that Tony has had TWO articles posted simultaneously. Broad church and respect anyone?
Paul Gavin
85   Posted 26/09/2008 at 19:16:22

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No-one seems to know why Moyes hasn't signed his contract and no-one is trying to find out why. It?s having a negative effect on the team. We need to know what the fuck is going on. The whole PR side is shit ? can someone fucking find out what's going on, because we need to know soon. I don't want it to turn out like Newcastle.
Paul Rimmer
86   Posted 26/09/2008 at 19:31:55

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Everton mix their play ? sometimes neat and tidy, sometimes a long ball. A lot of goals in the Prem are scored by a direct ball. It?d be great to see us play like the Arsenal youth side but I?m afraid that we won?t attract the calibre of their youth who they sign from all over the world (eg Ramsey). I don?t doubt that if we played like Arsenal, there?d be people on here spouting that we pass too much. Some people on here don?t seem to realise that 4th /5th/6th and a cup run is a real achievement considering how little we pay in transfers/wages compared to other teams. It?d be nice to get to a final and play attractive football and once this team gels and gets some confidence I believe we?ll see it this season. In Moyes I trust even if the worst happens and I?ll be backing the lads loud and proud in the Gwladys despite the doom mechants on here.
John Owens
87   Posted 26/09/2008 at 19:40:35

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Is is just me or does TM enjoy the poor performanes too much!! Even Man Utd have been poor this year in fact the only team who have looked anything like a decent side is Chelsea!! Our team needs time to settle down and find its best formation but more importantly we need the manager to either sign his contract or resign ? the situation is causing too much instability. Not seen the injury position but think the team should be. Howard, Neviile, Yobo, Jags, Lescott, Arteta, Osman, Saha, Fellaini, Cahill, Yakubu. Will be glad when Steve P is fit again!!
Nick Armitage
88   Posted 26/09/2008 at 21:53:36

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I’ve got a great idea that will surely have us playing dream football and bringing trophy after trophy back to a rebuilt Goodison.

Why don’t we just sign the best young players in the world and then adopt the tactics of Brazil in 1970? There you go, problem solved; it’s that simple isn’t it?
Michael Kenrick
89   Posted 26/09/2008 at 22:37:42

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Mike Evans, I said at the time, that was tongue-in-check mocking of your challenge ? as someone who claimed an aversion to absolute truths ? that you (and thousands like you) didn?t want to be mocked for "doing what we do best which is just getting on with supporting Everton."

I think what got to me was the irony of you posting from a position ? self-proclaimed as the "Silent Majority" ? to tell us in a thinly disguised way that somehow you were superior to those of us who wished to discuss all matters Evertonian.

It wasn?t really a serious point ? hence "Shame on you!".

You are of course free to post as much or as little as you like, as is Tony Marsh and anyone else who can accept our Conditions of Use. Everton are pretty dire at the minute and, as so many are lightening quick to point out, that?s when TM writes his stuff. So what if he doesn?t post when we are winning? God forbid that anyone ? especially Tony! ? was required to write in every week, rain or shine!

And it?s not a question of space being allocated, rather that it is "claimed" by those who submit articles of sufficient interest to merit publication.
Ian Starkey
90   Posted 27/09/2008 at 03:15:51

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People talk about facts, look in our Trophy Room, do you see any cups or runners up sheilds in the last 6 years? Football is all about results. Under Moyes we havent even come close, 4th in the Premier League (with a negative goal difference), whoopee do! we didnt even qualify for the champions League. Moyes has had his chance, and not done much with it. Now soft lad BK wants to give Moyes a mega contract for winning nothing. I am season ticket holder in the Park End, and under Moyes you your lucky to get 3 decent displays a season at Goodison where you walk away from the ground thinking "that was a good game of footy", I am fed up watchin aimless 50 yard balls pumped up field by Neville and Jags game in game out. Under Moyes we dont play good football. Time for a change! Yes Moyes did stop the Walter Smith rot and he has brought some good signings in, but we wont win anything with him or play a brand of football that has you on the edge of your seat. For me the ever decreasing lack of atmoshere at Goodison Park tells it own story.
Bob Turner
91   Posted 27/09/2008 at 10:56:11

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Joeynkoo, I think (?) the season you’re talking about is 2003/04 when we actually finished 6 points clear of the bottom 3, and were safe with 3 games to go.

Not quite the "kept us up on goal difference" claim you are making.

But, hey, don’t let the facts get in the way of a good story....
Joeynkoo Ludden
92   Posted 27/09/2008 at 11:14:01

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Bob - many apologies, my memory clearly doesn’t serve. I think I’ve mixed up 1998 with the 2004 finish and come up with a totally new season result for us.

That said, 2003/4 hardly endorses the manager. Of course 2004/5 does. I guess we wait to see if 2008/9 does also.

Apologies for erroneous posting above!
Vincent Siow
93   Posted 27/09/2008 at 14:50:44

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I?m using a bit of hindsight for this post as I?m writing this after watching the derby game end just ten minutes ago.

Tony, you?re spot on. Our football is really in shambles, so much so I wonder why Saha and Arteta are still playing for us where even supposedly smaller clubs like West Ham and Fulham are playing better, short, and the floor soccer than us. It?s heartbreaking to lose, and shocking to see our brand of soccer. We can?t pass the ball on the ground well, movement is poor, and all you do is hoofball. Liverpool showed us how to play with neat, short passing stuff. What do we do in training anyway?

So of you guys have been slagging off Tony Marsh, but as per the past few articles, I think he is making more and more sense. But I have to add more. Not just the football, but the club is in shambles. Look at our buys. Fellaini for £15mil? Someone is going to tell me give him time. But at that price tag, you don?t have time. Where are our signings to break into the Top 4 as promised?

If Moyes signs the big contract on the table, I?ll never forgive him if he complains about the lack of funds to buy players. After all, for a very mediocre manager, he surely doesn?t deserve as much as he is getting.
Terry Beeken
94   Posted 27/09/2008 at 17:10:20

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I too am writing this after the derby defeat and have never agreed with Tony Mash but he's RIGHT!!!!!!

It's always the same with Moyes, we send out a team to stop the top 4 playing and never to play to our strengths and have A FUCKING GO?

I am sick of the same shit every time we lose, negative tatics, if this had gone our way or if we would have had that decision, well we didn't and we are never good enough!!

It comes from the top, sign your contract or FUCK OFF! Everton have been around over one hundred years before Moyes and still will be after him.


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