The Mail Bag
Striker Clear-out time?
Comments (26)
Whilst it is delightful to see young strikers joining our club, I am a little perplexed. According to my reckoning, we now have six out and out strikers at the club, plus another 2 on loan. The young under-21 french striker Gueye joined today to add to Silva, Beckford, Yak, Saha and Anichebe. Plus Lucas and James on loan.This is surely an embarrassment of riches.
Even Man Utd et al haven't got this many. Do you think Moysey knows something we don't with regard to players leaving? For what it's worth, we also seem to have about 8 top quality midfield players with Jack, Timmy, Bily, Peanuts, Mikel, Felli, Ossie and Gosling (when fit).
I'm not complaining you understand, but just puzzled. This must be the first year in recent memory when it's been like this.
Tony McDonald, Posted 01/07/2010 at 15:22:23
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Mike Allison
2 Posted 01/07/2010 at 20:25:30
2 Posted 01/07/2010 at 20:25:30
Not to start a silly numbers game argument, but is the 4-5-1 going to become more of a 4-3-3, with strikers basically fulfilling the wide midfield roles instead of the likes of Pienaar, Bily and Osman? It could be that Big Vic's appearances there were the early signs if this evolution.
This is basically what Inter Milan did, with Eto'o playing down the right. Moyes actually played that way at Preston if memory serves me correctly. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
This is basically what Inter Milan did, with Eto'o playing down the right. Moyes actually played that way at Preston if memory serves me correctly. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
Andy Morden
3 Posted 01/07/2010 at 20:34:49
3 Posted 01/07/2010 at 20:34:49
Some of these lads are for the future, to be developed and nurtured. Moyes is doing the Wenger approach and I am really pleased. We all know top class striking talent costs a fortune, if he can develop some of these lads in the next 4 years then we'll have saved a fortune. If some come through now and prove to be stars all the better. Remember, Yak and Saha started off in (comparitvley) low key teams / leagues and ended up over here. No saying they will become top players, but if they do, well, hats off!
Tom Rowe
4 Posted 01/07/2010 at 21:02:33
4 Posted 01/07/2010 at 21:02:33
Im a bit more pessimistic. There's no way back for the Yak. You can't even order the new shirt with his name on. Beckford is his replacement and the rest are for the future. I think with regards to Vaughany and Jukebox, their loan situation will depend on pre-season performance and attitude. They can stay and fight for their place or be sold.
Andy Mack
5 Posted 01/07/2010 at 21:07:04
5 Posted 01/07/2010 at 21:07:04
All good to me, wish we had several youngsters pushing hard for every position in the team... might force our seniors to buck up their ideas regarding form - Certainly beats perma-injured Shandy Andy as backup.
Maybe Moyes is repairing the dismantling of the reserves over the past few years?
Maybe Moyes is repairing the dismantling of the reserves over the past few years?
Michael Kenrick
6 Posted 01/07/2010 at 21:17:53
6 Posted 01/07/2010 at 21:17:53
Interesting that the OS lists just TWO strikers in the Everton Academy squad: Conor McAleny and Lewis Codling. Four more familiar names in the Reserves (Jutkiewicz, Arnoux, Agard and Baxter), none of whom are setting the world alight.
I wonder how much this influx of young striking talent is meant to compensate for a real dearth of strikers coming through the ranks? ANd doesn't getting them in young put us in a good position to claim sooner than later they are "homegrown"... if//when those rules come in to play???
I wonder how much this influx of young striking talent is meant to compensate for a real dearth of strikers coming through the ranks? ANd doesn't getting them in young put us in a good position to claim sooner than later they are "homegrown"... if//when those rules come in to play???
Ian Bennett
7 Posted 01/07/2010 at 21:27:27
7 Posted 01/07/2010 at 21:27:27
I think Jukebox will be gone if a decent enough bid comes, and probably Vaughan so that will take the numbers down.
The stiffs look short on talent so it's not surprising Moyes is shopping for some gems.
I guess Yak will be around next season given the risk of losing Arteta and Pienaar as I don't think we can risk losing too many senior players. Might be wrong....
The stiffs look short on talent so it's not surprising Moyes is shopping for some gems.
I guess Yak will be around next season given the risk of losing Arteta and Pienaar as I don't think we can risk losing too many senior players. Might be wrong....
James Stewart
8 Posted 01/07/2010 at 22:09:04
8 Posted 01/07/2010 at 22:09:04
It certainly is interesting. I can't see Lucas, JV, or Yak being with us next season at the moment. Yakubu's poor showing at the WC could see Moyes cashing in and I can't say I would blame him. Yakubu seems to think he is a left winger these days and the rare moments he did get in the middle it all seemed to go horribly wrong.
Graham Holliday
9 Posted 01/07/2010 at 22:55:17
9 Posted 01/07/2010 at 22:55:17
I imagine Joao Silva and Gueye are signings of the Jutkiewicz/Scott Spencer (remember him?!) ilk...
Sub £1million for a striker is v inexpensive.
These guys will not be on big wages compared to proven strikers, and if they fail to make the grade at Everton then they can be released/sold on without great loss, and maybe for a profit.
If, however, one makes the grade - then we've got a striker for far less than the tens and tens of millions you'd have to pay these days.
A sound policy for a club without a pot to piss in I guess! Let's just hope that one of them make it.
Sub £1million for a striker is v inexpensive.
These guys will not be on big wages compared to proven strikers, and if they fail to make the grade at Everton then they can be released/sold on without great loss, and maybe for a profit.
If, however, one makes the grade - then we've got a striker for far less than the tens and tens of millions you'd have to pay these days.
A sound policy for a club without a pot to piss in I guess! Let's just hope that one of them make it.
Andy Hegan
10 Posted 01/07/2010 at 23:28:25
10 Posted 01/07/2010 at 23:28:25
Why perplexed? How many of them will be considered ready for the team? Just enjoy the fact that we are building for the future. If you think we can suddenly replace Yak and Saha, (we wish), then you must know something about our finances you're not telling.
Eric Myles
11 Posted 02/07/2010 at 01:54:09
11 Posted 02/07/2010 at 01:54:09
Maybe the traditional English 2-3-5 of the School of Science days is about to make a comeback?
David Hallwood
12 Posted 02/07/2010 at 01:57:43
12 Posted 02/07/2010 at 01:57:43
Nah Eric we would need wingers
Michael Brien
13 Posted 02/07/2010 at 07:27:54
13 Posted 02/07/2010 at 07:27:54
I think it is following a similar path to Arsenal - sigining young players with potential. I doubt whether these signings will have made many major headlines in the sports pages. However, when Arsenal signed Viera and Fabregas I don't recall there being a lot of news about either of those signings.
In recent years I think that the lack of games for the Reserves has not helped matters. I think that they only play 18 games in their league, which is clearly not enough. I think it would be far better if the Reserves were able to play in a league system which had say 30 or 34 games. The reorganisation of the league system for Reserve teams has in my opinion been very poor. These days teams will have to loan out their best up and coming players in order to gain them "game time" as the Americans would say.
I know that it can be argued being out on loan at a League1 or 2 club is gaining better experience than at Reserve level. However, there are many fine players who came through the Reserves who didn't go out on loan. e.g. Joe Royle, Jimmy Husband. We have seen a "dumbing down" of the Reserve League, to the extent that sending players out on loan is virtually a necessity.
In recent years I think that the lack of games for the Reserves has not helped matters. I think that they only play 18 games in their league, which is clearly not enough. I think it would be far better if the Reserves were able to play in a league system which had say 30 or 34 games. The reorganisation of the league system for Reserve teams has in my opinion been very poor. These days teams will have to loan out their best up and coming players in order to gain them "game time" as the Americans would say.
I know that it can be argued being out on loan at a League1 or 2 club is gaining better experience than at Reserve level. However, there are many fine players who came through the Reserves who didn't go out on loan. e.g. Joe Royle, Jimmy Husband. We have seen a "dumbing down" of the Reserve League, to the extent that sending players out on loan is virtually a necessity.
Matthew Lovekin
14 Posted 02/07/2010 at 08:17:17
14 Posted 02/07/2010 at 08:17:17
It's all about quality and not quantity. Therefore:
Yakubu: will never be back to his best, before his injury nightmare.
Saha: getting old and injury prone. Anything we get out of him is a bonus.
Vaughan: injury prone. Anything we get out of him is a bonus! Probably will be sold this summer.
Vic: not enough quality. Another year or two before ending up at someone like Hull or West Brom.
Beckford: Wildcard. Remains to be seen if good enough or not.
Lukas: not good enough, will end up in Scottish league.
Silva & Gueye: youngsters for the future. Will stay in the reserves this season.
Unfortunately, this leaves not one striker good enough for a team looking to break into the top 4. We can't afford to spend £20m on 1 striker that is good enough, therefore end up paying £1m each for youngsters that hopefully will turn into that world class striker. If we have to buy just less than 20 of these young strikers to get 1 that makes it, then it will have been worth it.
Yakubu: will never be back to his best, before his injury nightmare.
Saha: getting old and injury prone. Anything we get out of him is a bonus.
Vaughan: injury prone. Anything we get out of him is a bonus! Probably will be sold this summer.
Vic: not enough quality. Another year or two before ending up at someone like Hull or West Brom.
Beckford: Wildcard. Remains to be seen if good enough or not.
Lukas: not good enough, will end up in Scottish league.
Silva & Gueye: youngsters for the future. Will stay in the reserves this season.
Unfortunately, this leaves not one striker good enough for a team looking to break into the top 4. We can't afford to spend £20m on 1 striker that is good enough, therefore end up paying £1m each for youngsters that hopefully will turn into that world class striker. If we have to buy just less than 20 of these young strikers to get 1 that makes it, then it will have been worth it.
Alan Rooney
15 Posted 02/07/2010 at 09:11:47
15 Posted 02/07/2010 at 09:11:47
What if getting in all this young talent early is a way of weakening the bargaining position of the likes of Saha and Pienaar? Having alternatives already in place allows the club the luxury of being to be able to call their bluff.
Dick Fearon
16 Posted 02/07/2010 at 09:37:18
16 Posted 02/07/2010 at 09:37:18
Regarding the Yak some people have short memories. He was off the boil long before his injury.
On this very forum it was regularly suggested that he was looking for another big transfer pay out.
On this very forum it was regularly suggested that he was looking for another big transfer pay out.
Ben Howard
17 Posted 02/07/2010 at 10:23:03
17 Posted 02/07/2010 at 10:23:03
Tom Rowe (4), I just looked on the OS and you're right, you can't buy a shirt with Yak's name on the back. This has to be the biggest indication that he's off, non?
Tony McNulty
18 Posted 02/07/2010 at 11:08:49
18 Posted 02/07/2010 at 11:08:49
Tom and Ben (4 & 17)
Conspiracy or cock-up? If we were to have a Toffeeweb poll, I wonder if the votes would be equally split (a bit like on Yakubu himself.)
Conspiracy or cock-up? If we were to have a Toffeeweb poll, I wonder if the votes would be equally split (a bit like on Yakubu himself.)
Norman Merrill
19 Posted 02/07/2010 at 12:33:41
19 Posted 02/07/2010 at 12:33:41
I do not know anymore than the rest of us, but I have a feeling Beckford will feature strongly pre-season.
Moyes has been watching him for some time, and I think he may be in line for a place, in the starting eleven,
come August.
providing his fitness levels are ok.
Moyes has been watching him for some time, and I think he may be in line for a place, in the starting eleven,
come August.
providing his fitness levels are ok.
Richard Porter
20 Posted 02/07/2010 at 12:40:19
20 Posted 02/07/2010 at 12:40:19
You can buy a Yakubu shirt from the official website- a long sleeved shirt, women's shirt, child's shirt or long-sleeved child's shirt, and all away shirts. which rather suggests that his name being unavailable on JUST the adult men's short-sleeved home shirt is an omission rather than a conspiracy
Tony McNulty
21 Posted 02/07/2010 at 12:58:56
21 Posted 02/07/2010 at 12:58:56
Maybe there are no outsizes available on the adult mens' shirts
Tom Astley
22 Posted 02/07/2010 at 13:06:22
22 Posted 02/07/2010 at 13:06:22
You would have thought they would have changed this error by now though. Surely people have made the OS aware
Mike Allison
23 Posted 02/07/2010 at 18:02:40
23 Posted 02/07/2010 at 18:02:40
Gueye says he's not an out and out striker, although he can play there. He describes himself as a 'support striker', and refers to himself as pacy (as well as left footed). It adds to my suspicions that Moyes may be planning to use strikers like Gueye, Anichebe and Beckford as the wide men in the 4-3-3/4-5-1.
Steve Jones
24 Posted 02/07/2010 at 18:14:33
24 Posted 02/07/2010 at 18:14:33
Re the Yak, it's a cock up on the site not having it on the drop down list. With a bit of digging you can buy the latest shirt with his name on for all kits;
http://evertondirect.evertonfc.com/stores/everton/products/product_browse.aspx?category|category_root|10055=football+kits&attribute_value_string|Everton+Heroes=yakubu+22&portal=DPJKIDRH
http://evertondirect.evertonfc.com/stores/everton/products/product_browse.aspx?category|category_root|10055=football+kits&attribute_value_string|Everton+Heroes=yakubu+22&portal=DPJKIDRH
Conor Waters
25 Posted 02/07/2010 at 19:01:38
25 Posted 02/07/2010 at 19:01:38
It's not surprising that the ToffeeWeb poll on the Yak was about 65-35 in favour of him staying ? then he had that absolute sitter vs Korea (not to mention his fluffed one on one vs Greece). Since then the vote is swinging the other way!
Anyone can see the positives or negatives in the strikers we have right now. Proven track record v injury-prone for the elder statesmen. Pace/Potential v Inexperience for the younger incoming players. It seems to be a case of safety in numbers.
Don't we always whine and moan when we are ravaged by injuries depleting our squad? Well hopefully now we'll have plenty of cover for such situations, not to mention when strikers hit a rough patch.
Anyone can see the positives or negatives in the strikers we have right now. Proven track record v injury-prone for the elder statesmen. Pace/Potential v Inexperience for the younger incoming players. It seems to be a case of safety in numbers.
Don't we always whine and moan when we are ravaged by injuries depleting our squad? Well hopefully now we'll have plenty of cover for such situations, not to mention when strikers hit a rough patch.
Karl Masters
26 Posted 03/07/2010 at 00:45:50
26 Posted 03/07/2010 at 00:45:50
If you look at our squad you see quality everywhere, especially in midfield.
We are now adding a bit of quantity to avoid games like West Brom in Aug 2008 when two 16-year-olds had to start as we were so short of players.
Next season is going to be very interesting if we can keep hold of all these players....
We are now adding a bit of quantity to avoid games like West Brom in Aug 2008 when two 16-year-olds had to start as we were so short of players.
Next season is going to be very interesting if we can keep hold of all these players....
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1 Posted 01/07/2010 at 19:55:36