The Mail Bag
Moyes has got to go
Comments (77)
There's been a load of posts with regards how bad the team are playing and why they are playing so bad: Howard is off-form and Arteta is having a stinker; Neville is to old and slow; Osman is not a Premier League player; this player is crap, and that player is crap, bla bla bla.
We all have opinions on who is the best players and in some players we can see no wrong no matter what they do. Nine months ago, all these players where playing together as a team and played very well. What has happened since then? ? It's not three years ago... it's only nine months ago.
These players that where playing their socks off the second half of last season haven't all grown old in 9 months or are recovering from horrendous injuries; it?s basically the same squad with a couple of new faces. Our Manager picks the team week-in and week-out, we look at his team selection each week and some supporters will think it?s a great selection against the opposition but others will think it?s a crap selection.
The point I am trying to make here is the fact that Mr Moyes picks the squad each week and he has run out of ideas; he simply doesn't know what to do with the guys he has available. He constantly plays his players out of their natural playing positions and thinks out of desperation it will work out ok. It's not working and it's his fault and nobody else's. The blame lies firmly on his doorstep and I think the whole team have lost confidence in him and that?s why we are seeing poor form week in week out.
They must be able to see the same as we can see and can do nothing at all about it. They will see what we are seeing week-in and week-out. It's not the squad that are at fault, it's not the players off-form, it is not the lack of funds... it's Moyes: he is not managing the team correctly and he is to blame for our bad form at the moment, nobody else.
He has to go and before I get slagged off for asking him to go, I don?t know who can replace him.
Mark Burns, Posted 24/01/2011 at 10:10:41
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Kenwright out.
Its Kenwright who has to go!
We could replace Moyes with Mourinho and it wouldnt make a blind bit of difference.
Yes, a change of manager mite be a quick fix to a few wins but what happens in the summer when this new manager ask's for some money to spend and our chairman tell's him to go and work a miracle like our current manager does time and time again!
We could replace Moyes with Mourinho and it wouldnt make a blind bit of difference.
Yes, a change of manager mite be a quick fix to a few wins but what happens in the summer when this new manager ask's for some money to spend and our chairman tell's him to go and work a miracle like our current manager does time and time again!
To be honest what has changed is the way teams line up against each other. Everyone is drawing week in week out because one team or the other sets out just to stifle the opposition. West Ham did this to good effect on Saturday and their goals both came during Evertons best periods. It is no coinidence that team who have come to Goodison and attacked have been beaten (Liverpool and Tottenham) even though they are much more talented than some who have come here and gone away with a point.
How will a change of manager mean we can afford to buy a top class forward rather than play a league 1 striker, a half fit one who in some glimpes looks world class and others like a pub player and Victor?
You'd still have the same problems. A better manager than Moyes wont come to Goodison.
Not when he has 5 theatre tickets to trade as his transfer kitty.
You'd still have the same problems. A better manager than Moyes wont come to Goodison.
Not when he has 5 theatre tickets to trade as his transfer kitty.
Can anyone name a better manager than Moyes that would take the job?
No?
No?
Have to disagree with you Mark.
Although the team have been playing poorly of late and certain key players have been a shadow of themselves, the blame should not be laid squarely on the shoulders of Mr Moyes.
The man has done a remarkable job with the resources available to him over the past few seasons and inevitably he, along with the players have found it tough going this season.
I felt the optimism at the start of the season "strongest squad ever etc..' was gilding the lily somewhat. Perhaps with an exciting new striker, a 'marquee' signing if you will, the whole club would have been lifted then maybe some momentum would have begun. The fans genuinely feeling we had the firepower to push for honours.
However, with so many players returning from the world cup with hangovers and seeing no new faces to speak of at the training ground then I believed it was inevitable that we would struggle to maintain the high standards of recent seasons.
The football has improved to a certain extent and Seamus Coleman has been a revelation in his more attacking role but the chronic lack of investment seems to have cast its shadow over the entire club from fans to players and manager.
Moyes wants to spend money but is hamstrung by finances. He simply cannot buy the players he want, to fill the positions that need to be filled.
Until new money, new investment and new ideas arrive from the top down then the club will never go forward.
Pienaar say the writing on the wall and thank God we made a few million out of him before he was allowed to leave on a free. but the Gosling farce and now the Vaughan loan debacle as well as the Kings Dock and Kirby fiascos go to show how badly run, mismanaged and shoddy the boardroom is.
If Mr Kenwright truly loves this club which I believe he does, he must find an investor or investors who will allow this great club to continue progressing.
Without money, without investment, how can any club succeed?
Although the team have been playing poorly of late and certain key players have been a shadow of themselves, the blame should not be laid squarely on the shoulders of Mr Moyes.
The man has done a remarkable job with the resources available to him over the past few seasons and inevitably he, along with the players have found it tough going this season.
I felt the optimism at the start of the season "strongest squad ever etc..' was gilding the lily somewhat. Perhaps with an exciting new striker, a 'marquee' signing if you will, the whole club would have been lifted then maybe some momentum would have begun. The fans genuinely feeling we had the firepower to push for honours.
However, with so many players returning from the world cup with hangovers and seeing no new faces to speak of at the training ground then I believed it was inevitable that we would struggle to maintain the high standards of recent seasons.
The football has improved to a certain extent and Seamus Coleman has been a revelation in his more attacking role but the chronic lack of investment seems to have cast its shadow over the entire club from fans to players and manager.
Moyes wants to spend money but is hamstrung by finances. He simply cannot buy the players he want, to fill the positions that need to be filled.
Until new money, new investment and new ideas arrive from the top down then the club will never go forward.
Pienaar say the writing on the wall and thank God we made a few million out of him before he was allowed to leave on a free. but the Gosling farce and now the Vaughan loan debacle as well as the Kings Dock and Kirby fiascos go to show how badly run, mismanaged and shoddy the boardroom is.
If Mr Kenwright truly loves this club which I believe he does, he must find an investor or investors who will allow this great club to continue progressing.
Without money, without investment, how can any club succeed?
On that point, the only way of breaking these teams down is by introducing a player who can score a blinder from 30 yards out of nothing, or by putting a big man up front and punting it in the hope that he will nod it down. This probably explains Moyes' decisions to bring Bily on, and to push Fellaini up top - both of which worked to good effect.
I agree, and have done for a while, that David Moyes has to stay. It's the fat clown at the top that has to go. It's not his lack of foresight or leadership that really grates me, it's his constant lies. I won't name them as we all know what they are by now. I would have more respect if he came out and says "we are skint, I am doing what I can but I am not what Everton need right now. I love the club but it will not move forward until somebody better prepared in the business world and a little more wealthy comes in. Goodbye, it's been fun but to love you is to leave you." Those last few lines are available to Bill if he wants to copy and paste them sometime in the near future.
MOYES IN
KENWRIGHT OUT
MOYES IN
KENWRIGHT OUT
Mark, your probalby wasting your breath mate. When things are going well, Moyes is hailed as a messiah because he does it without money (Apparently ) when things are shite, its everyone else's fault, but his.
My god... look at all the apologists.
The man is fucking inept, what possible part of that can you not understand?
Steve Pugh ? he is ambitious? What a load of bollocks mate. He is a dour, negative twat, lacks tactical intellgence... who thinks that drawing at Anfield is miraculous.
You say sometimes more isn't enough regarding his wages? The fucker is being paid more than most of our players are! He is one of the higher paid managers in the Premier League, for fuck's sakes. At the end of the day the buck stops right at his door.
Pienaar ? he knew he was not going to sign a new contract; he should have been sold in the summer before the World Cup... no excuses, no bullshit.
Yakubu ? should have been sold to West Ham when they initially offered £6 million for him. Then, like a twat, he then tries to get more, and West Ham then continuously lowered the bid until it was £2 million.
Anichebe ? should have been sold, every little helps in getting replacements.
Now if he hadn't have been up his own arse about Pienaar (how he will force him to play the season, even tho he knows he wouldn't sign a new contract) smacks of stupidity beyond belief.
Instead of having around £10/11 million to spend on players last summer, we suddenly had nothing because he didn't want to do business with anyone.
Brian Keating ? who can do a better job? Since thats the lamest ever question to pose, perhaps try asking the board, since it's them that selects managers and not us.
I'd take Di Matteo, Holloway, even go with Owen Coyle. All would do a better job than the negative, dour twat we have now ? added to the fact we have better players than all the teams they currently manage.
The man is fucking inept, what possible part of that can you not understand?
Steve Pugh ? he is ambitious? What a load of bollocks mate. He is a dour, negative twat, lacks tactical intellgence... who thinks that drawing at Anfield is miraculous.
You say sometimes more isn't enough regarding his wages? The fucker is being paid more than most of our players are! He is one of the higher paid managers in the Premier League, for fuck's sakes. At the end of the day the buck stops right at his door.
Pienaar ? he knew he was not going to sign a new contract; he should have been sold in the summer before the World Cup... no excuses, no bullshit.
Yakubu ? should have been sold to West Ham when they initially offered £6 million for him. Then, like a twat, he then tries to get more, and West Ham then continuously lowered the bid until it was £2 million.
Anichebe ? should have been sold, every little helps in getting replacements.
Now if he hadn't have been up his own arse about Pienaar (how he will force him to play the season, even tho he knows he wouldn't sign a new contract) smacks of stupidity beyond belief.
Instead of having around £10/11 million to spend on players last summer, we suddenly had nothing because he didn't want to do business with anyone.
Brian Keating ? who can do a better job? Since thats the lamest ever question to pose, perhaps try asking the board, since it's them that selects managers and not us.
I'd take Di Matteo, Holloway, even go with Owen Coyle. All would do a better job than the negative, dour twat we have now ? added to the fact we have better players than all the teams they currently manage.
Would that be a generalisation, Brian?
Out of interest, do you not think that Blue Bill would now sell the club at any given opportunity? Any buyer would do!
Anyone who was at GP on Saturday would have seen & heard the general hostility towards BK. However, the bad news for us is that BK is now stuck with what he has created, it obviously seemed a good idea to him to look for investment deals rather than buyers. He would remain king of the castle and someone else would have to pay. Sounds great, but fortune or a good old recession soon put paid to that.
It would seem dark days are ahead, with many rumours now floating about that we are seriously fucked financially. For me, though, Moyes must be thinking what amount of dog shit did he step in, because what seemed to be a promising season is now quite laughable.
Anyone who was at GP on Saturday would have seen & heard the general hostility towards BK. However, the bad news for us is that BK is now stuck with what he has created, it obviously seemed a good idea to him to look for investment deals rather than buyers. He would remain king of the castle and someone else would have to pay. Sounds great, but fortune or a good old recession soon put paid to that.
It would seem dark days are ahead, with many rumours now floating about that we are seriously fucked financially. For me, though, Moyes must be thinking what amount of dog shit did he step in, because what seemed to be a promising season is now quite laughable.
Al Reddish,
Kenwright has actually said as much recently! Can't remember when but he has said those things.
I'm not justyifying anything in terms of Blue Bill's methods, but he has admitted he is skint which means Everton are skint, which means we need investors; which means he's looking 24/7... which means he's not dedicating any time into his other businesses ? which means he's lying (or which he could mean metaphorically).
Kenwright has actually said as much recently! Can't remember when but he has said those things.
I'm not justyifying anything in terms of Blue Bill's methods, but he has admitted he is skint which means Everton are skint, which means we need investors; which means he's looking 24/7... which means he's not dedicating any time into his other businesses ? which means he's lying (or which he could mean metaphorically).
Are we really in that much trouble that Administration is just around the corner, Mike?
Sorry about that awful English, I just have lost all enthusiasm I ever had for football. The game is ruined and it's corrupt.
Football isn't the game I used to love anymore.
Football isn't the game I used to love anymore.
http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpool-news/regional-news/2010/11/16/everton-fc-granted-planning-permission-to-build-9m-retail-and-administration-development-at-goodison-park-100252-27665035/2/
Maybe that £9 million should have been spent on players we desperately need instead of some pretty little building assets.
Thanks, Elstone.
Maybe that £9 million should have been spent on players we desperately need instead of some pretty little building assets.
Thanks, Elstone.
James Hollister here here!
James #11, How can you blame Moyes for the mess we are in but choose to say nothing about the clowns who run our club?
It is these clowns that have got us into this mess with their complete lack of ambition for our club and support for the manager.
Having to sell one of your best players to raise money for a fucken loan signing is a great way to keep team spirit alive and fill the players with confidence isnt it? But that is exactly what Moyes had to do because our board are a fucking joke.
It is these clowns that have got us into this mess with their complete lack of ambition for our club and support for the manager.
Having to sell one of your best players to raise money for a fucken loan signing is a great way to keep team spirit alive and fill the players with confidence isnt it? But that is exactly what Moyes had to do because our board are a fucking joke.
Sorry, I just cant beleive what some people say on here. Lose David Moyes and we would go down very quickly indeed. Yes we are having a poor season and yes Moyes has made some mistakes, (although I dont think you can blame him for the 8 extra points that Tim Howard has cost us alone and by the way would have seen us on 35 points and in 7th right )
now. And despite having a poor season we have only lost 6 games all season. Arsenal have only lost one less than us) we have not been beaten in 17 games !! under Kendal (2nd/3rd reign), Smith etc we would have been beaten alot more regularly. Moyes has been a remarkably consistent manager for us and I hope he stays a lot longer. Although I think we are actually on a 12 month count down. Alex ferguson will take the Kopites record of titles and Moyes will spend a year under his tutorledge before taking the Manc reigns.
As much as I like Kenwright he has to hand over to someone more able to take us forward. Just worry that we will fall into the wrong hands as the shite have. Just that we wouldnt recover from it like they have. Which is exactly what BK is worried about too.
Think about it boys without Moyes and Kenwright what would we have. A Curbishly and a Takshin Sinawatra - No thanks !!
now. And despite having a poor season we have only lost 6 games all season. Arsenal have only lost one less than us) we have not been beaten in 17 games !! under Kendal (2nd/3rd reign), Smith etc we would have been beaten alot more regularly. Moyes has been a remarkably consistent manager for us and I hope he stays a lot longer. Although I think we are actually on a 12 month count down. Alex ferguson will take the Kopites record of titles and Moyes will spend a year under his tutorledge before taking the Manc reigns.
As much as I like Kenwright he has to hand over to someone more able to take us forward. Just worry that we will fall into the wrong hands as the shite have. Just that we wouldnt recover from it like they have. Which is exactly what BK is worried about too.
Think about it boys without Moyes and Kenwright what would we have. A Curbishly and a Takshin Sinawatra - No thanks !!
Ask yourself the question if Moyes did go - who the hell would want to come in and try to fill his boots?
This season has so far shown us to be nothing more than a medium club with great history along with SOME good players. But moving forward - not even a pot to piss in.
This season has so far shown us to be nothing more than a medium club with great history along with SOME good players. But moving forward - not even a pot to piss in.
I agree that Moyes is increasingly looking like a spent force. His ability to fight back seems to have deserted him and he's sounding more and more despondent.
However, the club's biggest problem is not its manager, but its chairman. To focus on the former will only serve to alleviate pressure on the latter.
Furthermore, I don't think BK will ever sack DM, because he would know that it would look like he was trying to find a scapegoat for his blundering chairmanship and that he'd be the next in line.
Possibly there would be some short-term improvement in footballing terms if Moyes did go, but after a while it would all wear off as the deep forces bringing down the club would reassert themselves.
However, the club's biggest problem is not its manager, but its chairman. To focus on the former will only serve to alleviate pressure on the latter.
Furthermore, I don't think BK will ever sack DM, because he would know that it would look like he was trying to find a scapegoat for his blundering chairmanship and that he'd be the next in line.
Possibly there would be some short-term improvement in footballing terms if Moyes did go, but after a while it would all wear off as the deep forces bringing down the club would reassert themselves.
We need a board with money or at least some money to buy a squad of players who'll give competion to the players who are already in the starting line up!!
We don't need a new manager thats for sure.
We don't need a new manager thats for sure.
I think we probably are pretty close to administration and the firesale that has happened this month is proof.
However there is a positive in this. If people are made aware of the plight of the club then offers to buy the club at a discountede rate with the new owners agreeing reduced repayments to settle the debts. Creditors would accept 30p in the pound if they now the club is going into administration and may only get 15 or 20p in the pound so it makes it an attractive proposition at a cheap purchase price.
Surely if it gets to this stage Kenwright would surely have to sell before the the adminitrators come in.
See Milan Mandaric at Sheffield Wednesday. A perfect case in point.
However there is a positive in this. If people are made aware of the plight of the club then offers to buy the club at a discountede rate with the new owners agreeing reduced repayments to settle the debts. Creditors would accept 30p in the pound if they now the club is going into administration and may only get 15 or 20p in the pound so it makes it an attractive proposition at a cheap purchase price.
Surely if it gets to this stage Kenwright would surely have to sell before the the adminitrators come in.
See Milan Mandaric at Sheffield Wednesday. A perfect case in point.
Matt Brown - You are correct, and another way you could look at it is this: If Moyes does go, who would come in for him. I reckon most of the Premier League chairmen would love to have him at their club. (And I did say most before I get told the top 5 wouldn't touch him etc.!)
James # 24, you may be right about the danger of administration, and it would most likely mean relegation, with the attendant 9-point deduction.
Good point about Mandaric and Sheff. Wed.
Good point about Mandaric and Sheff. Wed.
Not sure whether this site should be renamed Deja Vu.....
Why are the players getting away scott free? It's the fault of the players, the manager AND the chairman. Not just one entity.
Tony,
the spirit has been sucked out of the players and the manager by the lying Charlatan upstairs.
A blind man can see that.
It all smacks of desparation now.
the spirit has been sucked out of the players and the manager by the lying Charlatan upstairs.
A blind man can see that.
It all smacks of desparation now.
I feel we are feeling the effects of the failure to get the Kirkby site. Easy to say but with a new ground the investors would have followed as we'd have been seen as a progressive club to any budding "merchant of venice".
As for Moyes, he looked gob smacked on the touchline trailing one nil and it took a brilliant strike from Bily to set up rescue act part 1.
Moyes will do what he's best at, re-assess his options and generate a competitive side for next season.
With expectations lowered he'll then shock us all and so the Everton cycle continues.
If Moyes went it's a relegation fight for a few years ahead i feel.
As for Moyes, he looked gob smacked on the touchline trailing one nil and it took a brilliant strike from Bily to set up rescue act part 1.
Moyes will do what he's best at, re-assess his options and generate a competitive side for next season.
With expectations lowered he'll then shock us all and so the Everton cycle continues.
If Moyes went it's a relegation fight for a few years ahead i feel.
"Lose David Moyes and we would go down very quickly indeed."
What conclusive evidence is there to back up such an assertion? How do you know that a new manager with fresh ideas and no preconceived favourites would not have an immediate, uplifting effect and force our underachieving players to go out there and actually prove they deserve a part in his future plans? Gullible media hounds used to say the same thing about bloody Walter Smith when he was here. How he was doing such a great job under difficult circumstances and how no other manager could possibly do any better whilst working under the same constraints. It was bollocks then and it's still bollocks when the same line is trotted out about Moyes now.
"although I dont think you can blame him for the 8 extra points that Tim Howard has cost us alone and by the way would have seen us on 35 points and in 7th"
David Moyes bought Tim Howard. David Moyes selects Tim Howard to start every week. David Moyes never criticises Tim Howard for costly errors. David Moyes has never brought in a half decent back up keeper to put any realistic pressure on Tim Howard (Not that I've got a problem with Tim Howard. He's kept us in a number of games this season despite the odd cock up).
"we have not been beaten in 17 games !! "
What?
"However, the club's biggest problem is not its manager, but its chairman"
Undoubtedly. The problem is that they are a double act and you won't get rid of one without the other. On the one hand Moyes bemoans a lack of finances but then in the next breath proceeds to lavish praise on Kenwright, stating that he wouldn't swap him for any other Chairman.
What conclusive evidence is there to back up such an assertion? How do you know that a new manager with fresh ideas and no preconceived favourites would not have an immediate, uplifting effect and force our underachieving players to go out there and actually prove they deserve a part in his future plans? Gullible media hounds used to say the same thing about bloody Walter Smith when he was here. How he was doing such a great job under difficult circumstances and how no other manager could possibly do any better whilst working under the same constraints. It was bollocks then and it's still bollocks when the same line is trotted out about Moyes now.
"although I dont think you can blame him for the 8 extra points that Tim Howard has cost us alone and by the way would have seen us on 35 points and in 7th"
David Moyes bought Tim Howard. David Moyes selects Tim Howard to start every week. David Moyes never criticises Tim Howard for costly errors. David Moyes has never brought in a half decent back up keeper to put any realistic pressure on Tim Howard (Not that I've got a problem with Tim Howard. He's kept us in a number of games this season despite the odd cock up).
"we have not been beaten in 17 games !! "
What?
"However, the club's biggest problem is not its manager, but its chairman"
Undoubtedly. The problem is that they are a double act and you won't get rid of one without the other. On the one hand Moyes bemoans a lack of finances but then in the next breath proceeds to lavish praise on Kenwright, stating that he wouldn't swap him for any other Chairman.
David please dont let this be the start of another Kirkby debate.
DK was never on from the start and would not have been to the benefit of EFC in any way shape or form.
Even if it was viable where do you think the 100 million to build it would have come from,the back of Bill's sofa?
DK was never on from the start and would not have been to the benefit of EFC in any way shape or form.
Even if it was viable where do you think the 100 million to build it would have come from,the back of Bill's sofa?
'Why are the players getting away scott free? It's the fault of the players, the manager AND the chairman. Not just one entity. '
About the most sensible thing i've read on this thread.
Everyone has their part to play in this disapointing season.
To lay all the blame at Moyes feet is both unfair and unhelpful. We all have theories about what he could do differently. Turns out that 442 wasn;t the obvious answer that everyone claimed it was...so we attack him for something else.
He's far from perfect but he's not exactly getting a lot of help from his players or his chairman is he?
About the most sensible thing i've read on this thread.
Everyone has their part to play in this disapointing season.
To lay all the blame at Moyes feet is both unfair and unhelpful. We all have theories about what he could do differently. Turns out that 442 wasn;t the obvious answer that everyone claimed it was...so we attack him for something else.
He's far from perfect but he's not exactly getting a lot of help from his players or his chairman is he?
If Moyes and Kenwright refuse to go, can they least agree to bring back the cushions ?
Sam, he built the squad, he coaches the squad and is supposed to motivate the squad. Still, I have some sympathy with your point ,he has been badly let down .
People defending Moyes after the evidence of this season no nothing about football, absolute timewasters.
Keep your SKY subscriptions up otherwise you'll have no opinion at all, unbelievable garbage.
Keep your SKY subscriptions up otherwise you'll have no opinion at all, unbelievable garbage.
ahem, no = know
From time to time managers need new players to revitalise things. How many of us could predict Artetas apparent demise or Yaks/Saha's lousy form coming onto this season leaving us with an untried Beckford? These are the reasons we havnt excelled. Piennar going has further reduced our attacking capacity. Moyes has made mistakes (not selling yak, and keeping Anichebe for anything other than drying the dishes are two) but he has proven he can make us competitive on a thin budget. He has earned the right to be able to spend in order to make us competitive again. Everyone else does it so why not us.
Leon, the evidence of this season:
- That if you don't spend any money in the summer, you struggle, not even standing still but go backwards as Stoke and Sunderland overtake us?
Is that the evidence you're talking about?
Yours,
Sky Sports Subscriber & Everton season ticket holder for the last 24 years.
- That if you don't spend any money in the summer, you struggle, not even standing still but go backwards as Stoke and Sunderland overtake us?
Is that the evidence you're talking about?
Yours,
Sky Sports Subscriber & Everton season ticket holder for the last 24 years.
james 24 # could be nearer the mark than anyone on here realises, dont forget the shite were 15 minutes away from an administration order so its not so ridiculous.
if this is the case then the club has been run disgracefully for years, plenty of revenue has come in from various sources including sky, place finishings, recent cup run, europe and obviously player sales.. however our net spend on transfers is practically negligible.
we pay roughly 60% on wages compared to the RS but we dont have a world wide support base/merchandising expertise/pact with the devil so we need to be very careful how we tread.
here is a suggestion
1. Dave Moyse reduces his weekly wage to £ 45k which I am sure is more than enough, All the other top earners (over 35k a week) take a 7.5% cut in wages forthwith or we agree to sell them at the earliest opportunity.
2. we all sign a fucking big petition demanding that Kenwright speaks to us telling us how bad a position we are in, why the accounts are late, how much is he trying to sell the club for... be proactive, the shite wouldnt stand for this I tell thee...
if this is the case then the club has been run disgracefully for years, plenty of revenue has come in from various sources including sky, place finishings, recent cup run, europe and obviously player sales.. however our net spend on transfers is practically negligible.
we pay roughly 60% on wages compared to the RS but we dont have a world wide support base/merchandising expertise/pact with the devil so we need to be very careful how we tread.
here is a suggestion
1. Dave Moyse reduces his weekly wage to £ 45k which I am sure is more than enough, All the other top earners (over 35k a week) take a 7.5% cut in wages forthwith or we agree to sell them at the earliest opportunity.
2. we all sign a fucking big petition demanding that Kenwright speaks to us telling us how bad a position we are in, why the accounts are late, how much is he trying to sell the club for... be proactive, the shite wouldnt stand for this I tell thee...
There was a piece in the papers today about Blackburn and their new manager. Now I didnt see their game yesterday but apparently they're a completely different side to what they were under Alardyce.
Kean hasn't spent any money, he's just got the same bunch of players to start playing the ball on the deck and believe in themselves. A bit like Hollaway and Di Matteo. You dont need money to play some decent stuff. Any half decent coach could get us playing decent stuff. Moyes is just too negative and dour to try, or too stubborn to change his ways.
Kean hasn't spent any money, he's just got the same bunch of players to start playing the ball on the deck and believe in themselves. A bit like Hollaway and Di Matteo. You dont need money to play some decent stuff. Any half decent coach could get us playing decent stuff. Moyes is just too negative and dour to try, or too stubborn to change his ways.
Steve, if "King Kenny" was their chairman the shite would stand for much worse than we've been standing, believe you me!;-)
Ste - we are capable of playing the ball on the deck and playing good stuff under Moyes, as shown by wins over Liverpool, Spurs and Man City this season. He's played 2 up front for the last 4 games and we've scored 11 goals. We badly need a striker. We have no money. This isn't Moyes fault. A new manager would not change that. A new manager isn't going to turn Beckford into a Premiership striker any quicker than Moyes, nor will a new manager improves Saha's ability to stay fit longer than a month at a time. David Moyes is exactly the sort of manager we could only dream of, if we got rid of him. We already have the best manager for us at this time. I wish people would recognise the one major, massive problem at Everton Football Club - because it certainly isn't Moyes.
John # 31, if we can't get rid of one without the other, which I tend to agree with, then what's the point of wanting Moyes to go? It's the man at the top who has to go first.
Thin line between sucess and failure.
6 more goals turning six of those draws ( Wolves, Wigan, West Ham twice, Blackpool and Fulham ? ) into wins and we would have another 12 points and be fourth.
You'd all be cheering then.
6 more goals turning six of those draws ( Wolves, Wigan, West Ham twice, Blackpool and Fulham ? ) into wins and we would have another 12 points and be fourth.
You'd all be cheering then.
Yes, Karl, but on the other hand, if instead of drawing those games we had lost them, we would have six points less and where would we be?;-)
And it's not like we played the opposition off the park in most of those games.
And it's not like we played the opposition off the park in most of those games.
As you say everyone has an opinion and mine is that your talking utter bollocks. Moyes is only to blame for not kicking up enough dust about the cash he gets because he doesn't want to rock the boat. He's on a huge contract and working for a boss who must be blowing him off. And Kenright's happy to have a manager who doesn't create a fuss and keeps us from relegation(for now). I'd love to see Kenright piss-off then see how Moyes does with some cash. Do you honestly believe he would be giving the like of Anichibe and Osman the time of day if he had Money. He Knows a good player when he see's one but he can only window shop. If Kenright goes and we get cash it will be better than Moyes going because we'd end up away to Scunthorp.
I'm sorry boys but I do think that the club is in some serious financial trouble - administration I feel is a certainty - hope not but that what it smells of, next in news Everton players have not been paid watch this space!
James #17, you really should have read that article, Billy Bullshitter doesn't have five bob never mind £9m, the development is being funded completely by third party suppliers as quoted by Keane look-a-like Elstone "Mr Elstone added: "This new scheme is totally self-funded by partners so there is no net cost to the Club. In fact, it is cash-positive from the start.?
In 1999 Johnson was hounded out of the club for far less than the current Chairman has done, where have our spines gone that we suddenly accept the whole shameful mess he has brought this club to?
In 1999 Johnson was hounded out of the club for far less than the current Chairman has done, where have our spines gone that we suddenly accept the whole shameful mess he has brought this club to?
All these jokers with the "without Moyes we will go down" and "who else can we get in?"
Are you guys for real?
We have a squad with some quality players that have proven every now and again that they can play. Noone else but Moyes can keep this squad up? REALLY? The players we have now compare with the likes of Blackpool and Wigan?
Who else? Well, there is plenty to choose from. Managers are a dime a dozen and there are quite a few a would believe are able to bring in some fresh ideas. I don´t feel the need to name names, but i honestly there can be found 10, maybe 20 names across great britain and the rest of the world that could do good things with this team. 10-20? Oh well, maybe even more.
Are you guys for real?
We have a squad with some quality players that have proven every now and again that they can play. Noone else but Moyes can keep this squad up? REALLY? The players we have now compare with the likes of Blackpool and Wigan?
Who else? Well, there is plenty to choose from. Managers are a dime a dozen and there are quite a few a would believe are able to bring in some fresh ideas. I don´t feel the need to name names, but i honestly there can be found 10, maybe 20 names across great britain and the rest of the world that could do good things with this team. 10-20? Oh well, maybe even more.
Gavin, apparently people need some evidence that BK is a boyhood redshiter before they start screaming for his ouster, as was the case with the Agent. Nothing less, it seems, will do the trick.
Come on, anyone who once saw him standing in the Kop on MOTD please come forward!
Come on, anyone who once saw him standing in the Kop on MOTD please come forward!
If it wasn't for the 1985-1990 ban from European competition, would our club be in this shitty predicament now?
Steve # 40.
Wheres that pettition?
Heres my name for it.
Wheres that pettition?
Heres my name for it.
Simon 39
Blackpool.
Get a grip and use your eyes.
Blackpool.
Get a grip and use your eyes.
David, will this do?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzRpkL8X2UQ
acting my arse, he's always been a redshite, he's just taken longer to accomplish his mission of destroying the club
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzRpkL8X2UQ
acting my arse, he's always been a redshite, he's just taken longer to accomplish his mission of destroying the club
Moyes is on about 60 grand a week -- we paid £10 million for a Russian who never plays -- do the maths, we could have bought a decent striker for the money and kept Pienaar (one of our better players) -- instead we keep Osman, Vaughan, Anichebe -- all squad players on decent money. Moyes is to blame and then Kenwright for finding £10 million for a player we did not need. MOYES OUT!
We can all agree Kenwright is the bigger evil here and I think we should all turn our attentions to him and getting rid of him.
We won't go into administration because we've still some expensive assets we can sell but we'll have no squad left.
We won't go into administration because we've still some expensive assets we can sell but we'll have no squad left.
Moyes has loads of failings, biggest one being he's negative. However, I don't want him to go, biggest problem is the board. My dad told me EFC are 60m in debt. If that is true, it is ridiculous and the incompetence of our board is our biggest problem
Just a couple of points:-
The accounts are NOT late, the company has 9 months from the financial year end (31st May) to file them, that gives them until 28th Feb to file them, as they did last year.
The issue isn't just about Black Bill, it's also his cronies, Earl and The Shadow (aka P Green), in my honest opinion.
The accounts are NOT late, the company has 9 months from the financial year end (31st May) to file them, that gives them until 28th Feb to file them, as they did last year.
The issue isn't just about Black Bill, it's also his cronies, Earl and The Shadow (aka P Green), in my honest opinion.
Thanks, Gavin, I knew that one. But I was asking for evidence of him in the Kop!;-)
John, it's thanks to Billy Bullshitter that Green has a say in what's going on; why did Green agree with the sale of Rooney? Who is the "silent man" that KMBC refuse to name they were in consultancy with as part of DK despite a freedom of information act request? Billy Bullshitter brought him to our door so he has to fuck off and take him with him.
Everton's Companies House entry
Status: Active
Date of Incorporation: 14/06/1892
Country of Origin: United Kingdom
Company Type: Private Limited Company
Nature of Business (SIC(03)):
9261 - Operate sports arenas & stadiums
Accounting Reference Date: 31/05
Last Accounts Made Up To: 31/05/2009 (GROUP)
Next Accounts Due: 28/02/2011
Last Return Made Up To: 17/08/2010
Next Return Due: 14/09/2011
Everton's Companies House entry
Status: Active
Date of Incorporation: 14/06/1892
Country of Origin: United Kingdom
Company Type: Private Limited Company
Nature of Business (SIC(03)):
9261 - Operate sports arenas & stadiums
Accounting Reference Date: 31/05
Last Accounts Made Up To: 31/05/2009 (GROUP)
Next Accounts Due: 28/02/2011
Last Return Made Up To: 17/08/2010
Next Return Due: 14/09/2011
In the absence of the 2010 accounts, lets take the 2009 accounts for reference, if I've read them right the following is true:-
Assets
Intangible Assets 39.378 mill
Tangible Assets 9.183 mill
Debtors 11.779 mill
Investmenst 2.767 mill
Liabilities
Creditors amounts we owe within ONE year -51.979 mill
Creditors (amounts we owe after one year -37.335 mill
Provison for liabilities -0.474 mill
Net Liabilities -26.681 mill
The upshot of this is that the group was worth -£26,681,000 as at 31st May 2009, yes, ALL our assets (not including home grown players) were worth some £26.681 million LESS than our liabilities, frightening indeed!!
Assets
Intangible Assets 39.378 mill
Tangible Assets 9.183 mill
Debtors 11.779 mill
Investmenst 2.767 mill
Liabilities
Creditors amounts we owe within ONE year -51.979 mill
Creditors (amounts we owe after one year -37.335 mill
Provison for liabilities -0.474 mill
Net Liabilities -26.681 mill
The upshot of this is that the group was worth -£26,681,000 as at 31st May 2009, yes, ALL our assets (not including home grown players) were worth some £26.681 million LESS than our liabilities, frightening indeed!!
David, a picture of him in the Boy's Pen is about as likely mate or one of him waltzing around London with Elvis.
Gavin (60) - I couldn't agree more, the point I was making in my post at 58 was that they all need clearing out, not just Black Bill.
There are two returns required by Companies House.
The first is the Annual Return which comprises details of Directors and any changes in address etc.
The second is the filing of Statutory Accounts, this is the one which we are all awaiting and the company has 9 months, from financial year end, to file.
There are two returns required by Companies House.
The first is the Annual Return which comprises details of Directors and any changes in address etc.
The second is the filing of Statutory Accounts, this is the one which we are all awaiting and the company has 9 months, from financial year end, to file.
We lived the Dream ? Bill Kenwright's story
Date: 29/01/2011
Time: 15:00
Venue: Goodison Park press room.
Press: What's happened, Bill?
Blue Bill: We lived the dream!
Press: What dream was that Bill?
Bill: We have been in the top 8 fo the last 5 yrs We made the Champions Leauge. We were in Europe! We were in the FA Cup Final. It all costs money, class like Beckford does not come cheap!
Press: What did you win?
BB; Well... we never actually won anything ? but we nearly did!
Press: Are you going to quit?
BB: Never, I love this club, David and I will never leave this club, its a marriage made in Heaven. Ok, we don't have as much money, ambition or style as some of the other big clubs like Wet Brom and Stoke, but we still complete with them.
Press: What's next, Bill?
BB: Watch this space... I mean Wow!!! ? David's a magician.
Press: David, what are your thoughts?
Moyes: Well you need luck in this game, we came out of our half at least twice in the first 80 minutes, then we ran out of steam. Did you see that person throw the bottle. i mean football is insignificant when something happens like that!
Press: That person was your keeper throwing down his water bottle!!
Moyes: Oh, erm... Bill? Where are you? I need you to help explain this... Bill, Bill!
BB from the distance: Yes, lovvie, you can be the next Dorothy!
You're right, Gavin. I was only making the point that some people will only rebel with hard evidence that he is a red.
Cheerio.
Cheerio.
Leon 54
Blackpool - what? Are having a good first half to the season? A team we drew with at their place, and actually should have beaten but for Saha and Beckford's inability to put away chances?
If you think they're playing good football, you're right. They have nothing to lose. Everything thought they'd be relegated by now. As opposed to everyone thinking they'd be in the top 6 and challenging the top 4. Different expectation levels. They have a 2nd half of the season to come, and appear to be about to lose their captain and best player. Let's see where they finish in May. I'll be very disappointed if we finish below them (and yes, I guess that is a sign of how bad a season we are having - underpinned by chronic non-investment in the team by Kenwright.
I go home and away and my eyes have been wide open, I can assure you.
Blackpool - what? Are having a good first half to the season? A team we drew with at their place, and actually should have beaten but for Saha and Beckford's inability to put away chances?
If you think they're playing good football, you're right. They have nothing to lose. Everything thought they'd be relegated by now. As opposed to everyone thinking they'd be in the top 6 and challenging the top 4. Different expectation levels. They have a 2nd half of the season to come, and appear to be about to lose their captain and best player. Let's see where they finish in May. I'll be very disappointed if we finish below them (and yes, I guess that is a sign of how bad a season we are having - underpinned by chronic non-investment in the team by Kenwright.
I go home and away and my eyes have been wide open, I can assure you.
Kenwright is like a fecking squatter now. It's a joke how we all put up with it, and I've been as bad as anyone. It's time for action so is there anyone out there who's familiar with stirring the shit and organising marches, making banners and composing songs. ps: please no kopites.
Abuse Kenwright if you must but you cannot ignore the fact that big share of the blame lies with Moyes.
He recruited or developed every player on the books, he picks the team and dictates its tactics. Against the Hammers it was not BK who played Osman ahead of Bily, it was not BK who subbed Beckford rather than Anichebe, It was not BK who had Rodwell warming the bench when Arteta was miles off the pace and clearly struggling.
In his post game comments Moyes slammed his strikers for lacking imagination. This coming from a man that neither himself nor any of his ex defenders on the coaching panel would have any idea of what makes a striker tick.
His juvenile excuses cannot hide the fact that for all its shortcomings the team against West Ham was the end result of his nine years of his management.
To go through a few more of my gripes, it does not instill confidence when subbing a midfielder for another midfielder it requires does it really need a full five minutes of written list of instructions before an incoming substitute enters the field?
Does it register with Moyes that Arteta?s corners rarely beat the first defender. As Mikel will continue with his futile kicks why dosen't Moyes instruct at least one player to position himself in that near post zone.
Do all our throw ins have to take ages to complete therebye negating any inherent advantage.
Those are simple faults that any half decent manager would have easily corrected long ago. Such minor things occur many times in every game and each time they act like a pressure release valve for opponents.
Look out for them occuring again and again against Chelsea.
I believe that this is something that the fans need to be united on more than anything.
Moyes is not the immediate problem, whether I am right and he has just lost interest or others are right and he is just inept, and the luckiest manager ever to get all those good finishes with no ability. It doesn't matter, a new board will find him out.
Getting rid of Moyes now might give the team a short term boost, but improvements in results under a new manager rarely last unless the new manager is able to bring in his own personnel. Which we all know will not happen. Then what? Replace that manger when his results fall off?
It is my opinion that we need to get rid of the board before we do anything else. That will, hopefully bring some money into the club for players. Once the new board is in place we can then judge DM. He might return to being the great motivator he was when we finished 4th, in which case we can move forward. Or he might prove to be inept, in which case get rid and bring in a new manager who will have the funding to build on the players that we have.
So there you have it. Board out now, then see about Moyes.
Moyes is not the immediate problem, whether I am right and he has just lost interest or others are right and he is just inept, and the luckiest manager ever to get all those good finishes with no ability. It doesn't matter, a new board will find him out.
Getting rid of Moyes now might give the team a short term boost, but improvements in results under a new manager rarely last unless the new manager is able to bring in his own personnel. Which we all know will not happen. Then what? Replace that manger when his results fall off?
It is my opinion that we need to get rid of the board before we do anything else. That will, hopefully bring some money into the club for players. Once the new board is in place we can then judge DM. He might return to being the great motivator he was when we finished 4th, in which case we can move forward. Or he might prove to be inept, in which case get rid and bring in a new manager who will have the funding to build on the players that we have.
So there you have it. Board out now, then see about Moyes.
I pity an incoming manager having to cope with Moyes dross.
Take away Cahill, Baines and Fellani and there's not much left.
Take away Cahill, Baines and Fellani and there's not much left.
James Hollister
The three managers you mention would all be adequate replacements but do you honestly think they'd leave their clubs to pick up a poison chalice at skint Everton ? No way.
Is Moyes in charge of all the transfers in/out? Didn't Mark Hughes say that City would talk with the people "who do the deals"?
The three managers you mention would all be adequate replacements but do you honestly think they'd leave their clubs to pick up a poison chalice at skint Everton ? No way.
Is Moyes in charge of all the transfers in/out? Didn't Mark Hughes say that City would talk with the people "who do the deals"?
I'm afraid that going to Goodison lately is becoming a bit of negative experience.
When I go, I'm expecting the worst.
We are unable to score, with little or no chance of getting a striker capable of doing the buisness. This is further soured by the comments by our manager we can only get a "loan in", however, I do remember him also saying we can't even afford a "loan ins" wages....this totally depresses me & makes me wonder why we are in buisness.
Our manager has had 9 years to develope our side into cup winners, indeed, we should certainly now be at stage 2 of his so called improvement plan.
Our manager is now quite clearly unable to motivate his players to have a "get at them" mentality, however, they do appear to motivate themselves when playing upper 6 teams.
I'm totally bored with hearing the same old crap of no money, however, other teams seem to be able to raise the finance when buying players.
I am now seriously considering not renewing next seasons season ticket.
EFC are ripping my world apart.
When I go, I'm expecting the worst.
We are unable to score, with little or no chance of getting a striker capable of doing the buisness. This is further soured by the comments by our manager we can only get a "loan in", however, I do remember him also saying we can't even afford a "loan ins" wages....this totally depresses me & makes me wonder why we are in buisness.
Our manager has had 9 years to develope our side into cup winners, indeed, we should certainly now be at stage 2 of his so called improvement plan.
Our manager is now quite clearly unable to motivate his players to have a "get at them" mentality, however, they do appear to motivate themselves when playing upper 6 teams.
I'm totally bored with hearing the same old crap of no money, however, other teams seem to be able to raise the finance when buying players.
I am now seriously considering not renewing next seasons season ticket.
EFC are ripping my world apart.
I'm sorry but that is complete and utter BS. Moyes has run out of ideas?? The players have been shite, it's very simple. If Moyes has run out of ideas it's because he doesn't recognise any of the players who've pulled on the blue shirt this season bar a few
#66
Sure the investment in Everton have been poor.
But
We have a squad worth heaps more than Blackpool, even our young players earn more than Blackpool's top earner. All these players bought by David Moyes with money he has been given.
What Blackpool have done is very, very good no matter if they go on a slump in the latter part of the season. Maybe we can manage to squeeze past them, but in reality we should already be 10-15 points ahead of them.
We are not and when a business fails to do what is expected of them it is only fair the the ones in charge take most of the responsibility.
Sure the investment in Everton have been poor.
But
We have a squad worth heaps more than Blackpool, even our young players earn more than Blackpool's top earner. All these players bought by David Moyes with money he has been given.
What Blackpool have done is very, very good no matter if they go on a slump in the latter part of the season. Maybe we can manage to squeeze past them, but in reality we should already be 10-15 points ahead of them.
We are not and when a business fails to do what is expected of them it is only fair the the ones in charge take most of the responsibility.
It would be absolute madness to even contemplate replacing Moyes at this stage of the season.
Moving on to the end of the season I think unless there is a guarantee of investment,Moyes will walk....if he does not he will taking a huge gamble.
Moving on to the end of the season I think unless there is a guarantee of investment,Moyes will walk....if he does not he will taking a huge gamble.
Ironically if Moyes did go, especially of his own volition, I believe that the focus the club would come under would see the end of the Kenwright era.
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1 Posted 24/01/2011 at 14:31:07
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Before anyone goes on about his wages, sometimes being paid a lot isn't enough.
Don't get rid of Moyes just yet. Get rid of the board and then see what happens