I'd rather keep the rags

You will more than likely get torn to shreads for this peice, but I for one applaud you and agree with you 100%.

I agree with the crux of this but the fact it's not City we need to keep up with. It's the likes of Stoke, Sunderland, Villa or even Leicester FFS!!! They are in the Championship and just signed a centre-back for £5M! We can't even afford a loan!

Excellent post ? it's not being sentimental, it's being realistic and sums up what is great about EFC. I have been a blue for 44 years and seen many ups and downs and I will always feel a greater affinity to a Micky Lyons or Ossie than a Tevez. I don't lack ambition but I am realistic so I expect the most of what you have got and in the main DM and the boys have delivered enough to keep the faith.

Well said mate. Well fuckin' said. I could not agree more.

Fuck the glory-hunters!!

Agree 100% James great post lad.

I see what you are saying James, but doesn't it annoy you slightly when our best manager since Kendall in his prime is robbed of the opportunity to really give Everton FC and its fans what they all really crave because the chaps in charge don't really want to sell the club to a mega rich type like Man City to enable this ? granted they also don't want to do a Pompey, Leeds or Sheffield Wednesday and drown in debt ? but we can be better than having no transfer budget EVER...

Also, I don't think Moyes would sign trouble makers like Bellamy, Tevez, Adebayor who are complete mercenaries. He would sign hard working quality like Joao Mouthino, M'Bia, Manny Fernandes, The Sheffield Utd Kyle boys.. .all the players he did want but couldn't.

Well said, James, and the first 5 posters but please can we ban any mention, ever, of bloody Manny Fernandes! He had his moments and had his chance but his time is well and truly gone!

Brilliant stuff, James. You've summed up exactly how I feel. It's great to see such a positive piece on here.

This article sums up the plain and simple acceptance of mediocrity by some fans, fans standing and accepting the current malaise. It would be nice to have some direction and ambition for once. I don't think anyone would give two hoots about which players coming to Everton and being paid huge wages, getting called money grabbers and other names etc as long as they helped the team win a few trophies.

After all it is what you win that counts, doesn't really matter who helped win trophies. I don't see Paul Rideout's name being banded about everywhere so who cares if a money grabber helped win us a trophy?

I personally would like to see some vision as to where the club is going, do they not have a five-year plan? What's the point of just plodding along and having a chairman at the helm that just consistently comes out with lies after lies??

James,
You should be a motivational speaker. I remember going to the Fiorentina game and saying to my mate "I hope we don't score and start giving me hope, only to lose anyway."

We did score, we did lose but I have never enjoyed a game so much ? we were fantastic and there was a razor blade in it in the end.

You are also right about Hibbert, Osman, Arteta... throw in a few others from our squad as well. Our Manager does need a few quid to give him a chance though and there I think our Board does let the side down.

I just came in from playing footy, wore blue, lost to a team wearing red and had a stinker, feeling despondent I logged on to Toffeeweb and my life is fine again!

Thank you James Martin. A great piece.

COYB!

Just the sort of thinking that makes Tranmere the force they are.

Sorry fella, I like John Wayne films and believing good prevails over evil but, sentimental mush aside, the reason we are (were?) the club we are is due to success.

Make no mistake about it with Liverpool sharing the block, Manchester being equidistant for those on the East Lancs that sort of thinking just closes the door.

Do you think this model is sustainable?

If we, this generation, doesn't shape up there won't be another to follow ? they'll go elsewhere.

Self-indulgent.

Amen!

I think most Evertonians can at least relate to some of the things you have discussed James.

I agree 100% that part of the joy of following this club is that when we win something it won't be hollow. We are more than just a cheque book. We aren't a fan base full of glory hunters.

But at the same time I'm one of those fans feeling rather pissed off with the club at the moment. Because you don't have to something as shallow as Man City to be a club moving in the right direction.

I too don't really give a shit about the status of our players in the media, our sponsor etc. But what I do demand is that the club can at least punch at our wieght and not stagnate.

If the current management continues, you will be enjoying the rollercoaster ride in the Championship within the next decade.

Great read James,100% agree, good to have someone positive on here. Fuck the glory hunting money grabbers who would sell their mothers for the big salary and a few pieces of silver. We are Everton. COYB NSNO!

I'm not attempting to be negative and I agree with the concept and feeling of the main post.

But you don't have to be a fucking glory hunter just becuase you want your club to progress.

I don't need oil billions injected or the world best stadium but give me something... anything.

Put this lad in the dressing room before every game. Quality. I can't stand the way the game has gone but threads like this remind me how lucky I am to support this team. Everton, at present, do my fuckin head in, but I can't ever turn my back on them. The bastards!

James ? I really enjoyed reading that, genuinely.

Trevor Mackie's right though. Man Utd are to us what we are to Tranmere, who are to Southport what they are to Bootle.

Football is a food chain and we are gulping for air. We've experienced being at the top of that tree on many occasions but never thought ourselves glory hunters, just as the supporters of those clubs don't now. At the time I bet people shook their heads at our buying power, attendances, stadium etc. No different now.

The world has changed. Stay with it or stay in the past.

Interesting post James, but we need to get real here. People are going nuts over Man City and all their dough. Well, good luck to them; they've watched shite for years and have touched fortune. Everton were THE MERSEY MILLIONAIRES, and before that we were loaded too. In the past we would cherry pick the best, and they would crawl to Everton.

The Board, over a 30-year period, is who have let Everton down. The Board never really helped Kendall create his magnificent side, that was a mixture of youth with the addition of Gray and Reid. Those two fellas were finished when they arrived at Goodison, knees shot to pieces we were told... but they had the courage and commitment of lions. The Board did little to build that side.

We like to go on about our history, and we should ? we are the longest standing big club, we should never lose our big club mentality. We want the best and, although the team is not there yet, as a club we remain Number One. When I talk of the club, I am talking of course about us, the supporters. No one can touch us, and this is what makes us so special.

Being an Evertonian is about LOVE, in a nutshell that is what it is. It is why the Shite cannot understand us. We just fucking love Everton. Going to an away and being a part of such an incredible group of people who all share the same love is a wonderful connection. Evertonians' wit, style and class are what makes us peerless. Our day will come.

You can't just pick and choose your support, "I'll come back when the current Board's gone and we've got a new stadium and we've pumped £100 million into the team and we're winning things." Well, we don't want you back. The real Everton supporters don't have that choice. They'd watch Everton in the fourth division if they had to because it?s inherent within their nature.

That's exactly what I keep telling a mate that's an ex-Leeds supporter and current RS/ManU supporter. I'd rather support Everton in the Fourth Division than anyone else in the First and I applaud all those fans of teams in lower leagues that go to matches week-in, week-out. They are true supporters.

I agree with the sentiment of the article completely.

When I read James's post as I added the formatting and put it up on the site, I couldn't help wanting to distance myself from it.

I understand it completely... but to me it just stinks of self-righteous elitism, a last brave stand in the face of pernicious decline into mediocrity that the whole Richard Dodd "Seventh is Best" mindset represents.

To me, as an Evertonian, that is abhorrent. I feel it is my duty as an Evertonian to continue to aspire; to accept our current fate and seek to justify it in the ways James has, I find painfully embarrassing.

Matt Woods ? a fantastic piece of writing. We need to hear more from you.

James, I just cannot agree at all with you.

Last season I spent so many games downing pints till 2.55 then trailing to a game I did not want to go to, I spent so many games wanting to leave early because of the shit I was watching.

I spent endless hours trailing these sites for some jolly news only to be wound up about the state we are in and this is year in year out.

At these same times hardcore City fans, as good a supporter as me and you who have been through far worse, where enjoying their football club like a weird dream. Ask them would they rather be back to where they were, with the only shouts they had were just like ours about nostalgia, working class club etc and how some knobhead pop stars support them.

Football is also about enjoyment and I would like some once in a while.

James, I can't see how or why you include City as a club without heart or support... believe me, those supporters have been through some shite and as I know many of them I can only smile in admiration at their turn around. They HAVE supported their team in the lower leagues and they have stuck by the team big time.

City now have money and we all know they are going to spend it, and all I can say is fucking good luck to them. I'm sure we would be dancing down the Mersey if some rich Arab, Yank or whoever wanted to blow millions on players who Moyes thought could do the job.

The rest of your heart felt story is probably how 99 percent of us feel, however, when you have seen the cups paraded around Goodison and decent footy played on that same turf you tend too have a liking for it. Unfortunately some of the defensive shite that Moyes turfs up leaves you wondering what the fuck is going on ? I mean 4-4-1 against WBA, at Goodison Park with that overweight plank Anichebe up font. Yes, I can see why so many heads are dropping and why so many people are moaning.

You can't just pick and choose your support, "I'll come back when the current Board's gone and we've got a new stadium and we've pumped £100 million into the team and we're winning things." Well, we don't want you back. The real Everton supporters don't have that choice.

Well, guys, I am that fan. 39 years season ticket holder, sons all blues but this year I have not renewed (after a massive amount of soul searching) for one very simple reason ? the (lack of) direction of the club. I am still 100% blue, and a shareholder but am not prepared by financially supporting the club to give tacit acceptance of the current status quo. Simple as. My choice and nothing to do with any of you.

To suggest that I am not a real fan etc etc is not on. Think carefully before you write anything like that again.

I also want my son and all those other kids to see something like City have ? don't you think what joy that would bring to them?

I seriously worry about a decline in our fanbase if we carry on another decade like this, we have always had a good hardcore fanbase. Over the years that quip by Souness about everyone on the streets appeared to be blue may have been right; however, visit the schools or these charity outdoor events and you will see us outnumbered big time by the red wearing kids.

I agree with some things you say, but the City jibes are just sour grapes to me.

I assumed (and hoped) you were being sarcastic. Unfortunately I think I was mistaken. I appreciate the need to lighten the increasing dark mood of supporters, but I fear all you have done is send out a battle cry that mediocrity rules.

It doesn't by the way. Every Club's supporters crave success at every level and we are no different. Trying to mask this with an "I don't care and neither should you" slogan belittles us all.

I agree with you to a degree.

Yes I would support everton if they ever dropped into the nothingness of the lower leagues, but I wouldn't support a board who do nothing to try and avoid it.

Loyalty is one thing, apathy is another.

If we find ourselves wallowing around in League 1 in a few years time, could you honestly say our club was supported by a chairman and board who did the right thing? I don't think so.

I'm not looking for another Sheikh Mansour, or whatever his name is, to buy us out and pump a zillion dollars into the club. I just want someone with enough business sense to move the club forward (instead of backwards, like the current idiot).

If this were to happen, then maybe in some time we will find ourselves amongst the trophies again, and we can all clap and cheer because we did it through progressive building and advancement, and not by spending £50mil on a Torres, or a Tevez.

The way we are heading we won't even be able to keep players like Hibbo, or Ossie, or attract a Beckford from League 1.

Lol, do you really think that if Tony Hibbert was a Cafu-style right back and Man City offered him £200k a week that he wouldn't go? Course he would.

I complete get your point, supporting Everton is special, and I'm a very proud blue; however, it's not much to ask that we can compete with the likes of West Brom, Wolves etc in the transfer market ? that's the problem. We don't need billions, we just need a steady transfer budget every summer, which we don't have and never will have under Kenwright.

Post removed for defamation

I quite like the inverted snobbery of the pauper... it must appeal to my working class upbringing. The whole sentiment is well illustrated and strongly evocative but.. the anchor point inferring that those that yearn for a well run club are just glory hunters is probably less accurate than describing those that meekly accept the current status quo as blind sheep. Don't get me wrong I agree with much of this well written piece, but I'm probably more wary of the message of blind acceptance it sends. It is not glory hunting for fans to desire success....but it is a complete dereliction of duty for the club's heirarchy not to hunt glory with every last breath.... extracting the full potential out of every opportunity to move the club forward. They simply haven't! Everton have a strong following now because of our glorious history and the strength and vision of the founding fathers who built a truly great club that wouldn't accept mediocrity, but would always strive for excellence on and off the pitch..... let's not hope to consign Everton's glories to the history books just so that we can vainly declare that we are better fans. This would be purely sentimentalist and meaningless as the club needs real direction and success soon or that strong following will continue to diminish with our ever-aging fanbase.

Well said Mike Gwyer.

I was living a stones throw from Sincil Bank in Lincoln when City hit the old 3rd division. When City came to town I trotted along and there were hordes of City fans there to support their team.

I was saying to Our Kid the other week it's amazing what short memories football fans have - City were the perenial laughing stock of the flight they were in, routinely shat on year after year by their neighbours and patronised by everyone else. They get a few quid in the bank and all of a sudden they're the evil empire. Gary Cooks a complete cock to be fair but having worked behind the bar of a City pub for 4 years as a youth they're a proper football club with real fans.

It's easy to say we'd follow Everton all the way down the league if necessary but City have been there, done it and bought the t-shirt. We dont hold any kind of claim to being the best fans around - try telling that to Argyle fans travelling up to Carlisle to see their team get beat on a wet and windy Tuesday night. We're no better or worse than anybody else. Apart from the RS, admittedly.

"The world's largest chequebook and Mancini still only delivered them a Champions League spot and an FA Cup"

Exactly! This is what people don't realise. It doesn't take one £15m signing to 'push on' into the champions league spits. It takes about 6 or 7 £20m ones and then 4 or 5 £5 - 10m ones. Even then it will go down to the wire. The cost of winning is greater than the prize.

Brilliant read James . . . sums up my feelings exactly and I believe the majority of Blues supporters also. It's not being apathetic it's being realistic!

Doddy when you are a season ticket holder and you are wanting the season to be over in October, to me that is depressing and if you can say you walked to every home game last season all excited about what you where going to witness then you are a very strange man.

Ah... The acceptance of failure by the new breed of football fan. Second best is good enough (aka Doddy).

Seventh is failure and always will be. I remember a game back in the 80s, we where playing QPR or Sheff Wed I think? Anyway, the opposition scored within 5 mins of the kick-off and 3 lads in front of us went mental with delight, one turned to my mate and shook his fist at him.

My mate without flinching looked him in the eye and said, "That was the worst thing your lot could have done mate."

Everton then went on to pulverise them, it was the mindset of that great team and the supporters at the time. We had an air of arrogance and failure was not an option and was not acceptable.

Oh how things have changed.

So you're saying that we should just ignore the problems and bask in the warm glow of sentimentality and self-righteousness?

Wow ....cough,splutter, that's an interesting viewpoint.

Crazy thinking as this may be, but what about the view that if we LOVE the club so much we have a responsibility to not just stand idly by but to hold BK, DM et al to constant scrutiny of their stewardship?

Hang on, this is even crazier..... what about that we expected the board/manager + players to actually have the desire/ambition to WIN something?

Too radical?

Evertonians must be the best excuse makers in the world.

Whatever is shit about Everton, you'd guarantee to get fans making up excuses and making out that that shit thing is actually great, and worse still fans will buy it.

Keep telling yourself that.

The whole "I'd rather we won nothing than buy our way to a trophy" argument is fundamentally flawed.... because it's total bullshit.

It's like a cleaner telling someone he'd rather carry on scrubbing urinals for the rest of his life than win the eurolottery. It's just something the self-righteous simpleton spouts so his current shit encrusted situation doesn't seem so soul destroyingly depressing.

John Daley... I think that sums it up perfectly! That is the true "realist" stance.

We have stood by and watched for far too long.... the "real" world has passed our club by as the current owners have repeatedly demonstrated impotence and incompetence at every opportunity, with only David Moyes's efforts saving their embarrassment. Expecting miracles is simply not good enough, and couldn't be less in line with the traditions that made this club what it is/was.

The club's "real" long term future is perched on a knife's edge as we have ambled along aimlessly for far too long.

John Daley

Hear Hear.

That's exactly what this is - warm sentimentality playing to the unthinking audience.

Who would be surprised if answers to the multitude of questions surrounding Billy et al eventually uncovered vested interest and shady practice at the route of this everton demise.

Need answers.

Whilst Evertonians continue in this blinkered state the shit will go on, just read Dodd.

#37,

Your dichotomous thinking is more reflective of a simpleton than the main article, which is well written and a breath of fresh air on this site.

Is the guy really "self-righteous" to point out that is more satisfying to win as the underdog? Of course not, this is perfectly resaonable.

He doesn't even attest to support the board here, and yet so many of you accuse him of a lack of ambition.

Those of you throwing stones need to critique your own viewpoints. For instance, why is it that you totally reject any idea that is not bang in line with your simplistic and naive expectation that changing the board will solve all our ills?

#38, that's quite the braveheart speech there, but there's just one problem. There's no battlefield.

Anthony,
No-one mentioned battlefields, only you. Could it be you couldn't argue with the actual content?

Check ALL the EFC websites and even other local and national forums such as the Echo/talksport etc.... the apathetic Evertonian might be becoming a rare beast..... I wonder why?

Anthony, changing the board most certainly won't solve all our ills but it will be a start. Perhaps new ideas, some transparency, just something to inject new life and hope.

It is perfectly acceptable to keep supporting Everton, whilst not accepting the way that the club is run.

Despite the frustration and despite knowing better, I keep looking at various websites, several times each day, hoping for some good news. I even look at the BBC gossip column - just for a glimmer of hope - something that I used to refuse to do.

I will still support Everton, regardless of what lies ahead. Although at the moment it is hard to not be disillusioned, apathetic or just downright pissed off with all things Everton. Whatever happens, an opening day win against the Spuds will go a long way to making things better.....

#42 ? sanctimonious claptrap.

Remind us all where #37 mentions the board, may I suggest old man you critique that line?

0 out of 10, try again

This is more like it! We've not had a decent Toffeewebrawl for weeks!

Fight fight fight fight.....

James Martin,

I presume by the positive tone of your post that you had never been on TW before you submitted your post.

This is the website that had people slating Tim Cahill for kicking a ball straight into touch in the last few minutes of a match were we beat our greatest rivals 2-0 and Cahill had actually scored one of the goals and had a cracking all round game.

#46,

Good day to you Gavin.

Right on cue.

Regards post #38 not mentioning the board. Well, it did but then the editor removed a previous post and the post numbers altered.

Unimaginable hey? Well, perhaps for a an opinionated egotist.

Please, if you are so intelligent and in such an important job, which I have seen you previously brag about on this site, then enlighten me with your wisdom.



How is is exactly that my post (currently #42) is sanctimonious?

I strongly recommend you look that word up and then take a few breaths before responding.

Regards

Sorry, I know you like to use technicalities to try to win these debates:

I meant "how is it" of course.

Sorry, there was a duplicate that I deleted... but the numbered references still didn't make any sense. Please use name and number so I can correct them if needed.

Anthony you never did seem to clarify the point of the soap box or altar you choose to preach your verbose diarrhoea from, surprising that for a chap with so much time to eschew grammatical verbosity you think thats enough to claim a moral high ground.

Bang on cue you claim yet who are you little man to have any say whatsoever in what I do in terms of responding to such blatant arrogance thinking use of multiple syllable words places you above everyone else. Oddly, I can't find your name as a site editor or indeed anything beyond part time recent contributor to these pages.

I don't need to brag about my current or previous positions of employment but as you had previously taken some form of acute offence and idignation claiming I must be some peasant in your presence I rather did enjoy the retort.

Again, the last bastion of the idiot requesting I look up some words is a futile parry, an educated idiot Anthony is still an idiot, you still don't get any marks out of ten.

Right on cue, Gavin (#52).

We are forever Everton.

Chris @ 54

The point is are Everton forever?

I certainly wouldn't put money on it unless things change and that's what I find so irritating about this laissez-faire guff.

I agree with a lot of the sentiments of the article. There are still a lot of positives to accentuate about being an Evertonian, and the way that we go about things as fans and, even sometimes, as a club. That's not something you hear very often on this site.

I think the mistake you make is to see the alternative to our current situation as a Man City/Chelsea type situation. I absolutely don't want that. Given the choice between an Arab billionaire using us as his plaything, or stagnating and declining, then quite frankly I'd prefer to stagnate and decline. Better that than watch the club whore itself out for the cash.

But that's not the only alternative. I want to see an Everton just, well, run competently. To build on all that's good and special about us. There's commercial value in that. With leadership that would be prepared to act decisively and efficiently, we could grow like that. The model I would like to see us follow is someone like Arsenal, not someone like Man City. Arsenal are run as a great business. Not reliant on some individual for bags of cash, they also retain the aspects of their history and what makes them special.

Yes, it can still limit them somewhat. They can't throw ridiculous sums at mercenary players. They sometimes lose their better players for better offers. But they're competitive near the top of the league. They bring through young talent. They play the game the right way. They *know their history*. And, over a twenty or thirty year period they're going to be far better placed to maintain that strength than a club that's utterly reliant on the goodwill of a billionaire benefactor, and are prepared to throw away every part of their history and uniqueness in order to please than benefactor.

The original post is, sadly, the epitome of what's wrong.

Forget the appalling custodianship of Kenwright. We are, after all Evertonians. Let's get behind the team. And, fuck me, it's embarrassing to repeat it but.... "Basically, stop moaning because we're (relatively) in a bit of a dip".

That there are Evertonians lauding this article is beyond belief. I doubt Bill Kenwright has ever looked at this site but if he did, well, he'd be thinking, "fooled them again!"

I enjoyed the article.

I`d have James all day over the arl moaners who think they can blame all the clubs problems on this mysterious "new breed".

"It wouldnt have happened in our day" ... fuck me.

Dave, you're taking a contradictory view for the sake of an argument. I know that there is stuff in this article that you'd normally laugh at.

Nowhere in my post does it say I'm happy with the Board, the situation we're in, or that I wouldn't enjoy a new stadium or a few new signings. Of course I would. Every fan on this forum wants progression for Everton.

What's really self-righteous elitism is the group of fans on this forum who seem to think that anyone with a positive viewpoint on Everton is some sort of stupid sheep following Richard Dodd around because they don't know any better. That is elitism.

Who really are the stupid ones? Those who recognise that progress won't come quickly, may even have slight frustrations with certain aspects of the managerial/board leadership but in the main recognise that during a recession and in the current Premier League we are not the worst off? Or is it those who hold the belief that Kenwright is working 24/7 along with Elstone, oh and Ross as well (when he has the temerity to say anything, how stupid of him as Head of Communications) to deliberately destroy Everton from within. Good luck selling that theory to anyone outside of this site.

Don't give me all this 'new breed of Evertonian' crap. I grew up on a diet of relegation battles and awful players and an awful Board. Notice no one was moaning when we were signing up Yakubu and Fellaini after breaking our transfer record in three consecutive seasons.

Everyone slates Kenwright for Destination Kirkby even though hardly anyone on here wanted to move there anyway. Basically because we've taken a minor step backwards for one of the first times under Moyes, everyone has got impatient and redirected it all at the Board.

Anyhow when we turn over Spurs on the first day of the season, I'll be enjoying the game whilst you can all mull over your master plan to bring down Kenwright. A plan which largely consists only of writing KENWRIGHT OUT after every post or buying some stupid scarf with the RS bird on it.

Thank you Robin Cannon (#56) for probably the only decent balanced retort on this whole thread.

You're coming out with some very odd statements, James:

"Anyone with a positive viewpoint on Everton is some sort of stupid sheep..." ? It's not a positive viewpoint: it's a hugely negative one that wallows in mediocrity through a flawed process of self-justification.

"Everyone slates Kenwright for Destination Kirkby even though hardly anyone on here wanted to move there anyway." Err... Everyone slates Kenwright for Destination Kirkby BECAUSE hardly anyone on here wanted to move there anyway ? and because it was a pack of lies, an abysmal failure, and an astounding waste of precious club resources to get to that point.

Can you really not distinguish between people who are continually failing at their jobs, as distinct from them acting "to deliberately destroy Everton from within"??? ? What a laughable piece of pure invention.

Then you claim all this justified anger at the Board is "because we've taken a minor step backwards for one of the first times under Moyes" ? you really are completely off your rocker!!!

Finally: "I'll be enjoying the game whilst you can all mull over your master plan to bring down Kenwright." ? Why is it that you self-righteous ones seek to deny such basic pleasures to others? Heard of multitasking?? Taking a break from the campaign while the game is on???

I think you just sacrificed whatever limited credibility you may have had with that totally unbalanced retort.

James - I enjoyed reading your article yesterday during my lunch break at work. As an "exiled Evertonian" it did the heart good to read something positive rather then the doom mongering of many - who seem to want to use anything remotely negative to have a go at Kenwright or the board or both.

I am not pro Kenwright - I am pro Everton. That doesn't mean I agree with everything done or said by the management of Everton Football Club - either in the form of the Chairman, CEO, Board, Team Manager or any other representative of "Everton's management".

- We haven't bought anybody yet - a fact which has been used to have a go at various people but mainly Kenwright- so what. I think Sunderland have signed the most players - does it mean that they are going to win the League. Anyone going to put some money on it ?

A Blue Print for sucess : sign a midfielder who has a history of injury, sign a striker who has also been written off due to injury, sign a young midfield player from a 3rd tier club, sign a midfield player from your nearest rivals reserve team.

I am sure that you have all identified - Peter Reid, Andy Gray, Trevor Steven and Kevin Sheedy. They were transfers that hardly shook the world of football, that made the headlines on the back pages of the National papers. Or even stirred Evertonians.Yet all those players played a crucial role in Everton winning trophies in the 1980's.

Fast forward to 2011 - Evertonians no doubt are seriously underwhelmed by our transfer activity or lack of it. But what's to say that some of the less than big names that have arrived in the last couple of years could turn out to be successful Premier League players. Beckford !!!??? Well didn't he score around the same number of goals as Torres and cost about £50M less !!

One thing some Evertonians seem to be good at doing is slagging off players/management. How many on these pages have labelled Osman an average player or Beckford ? I wonder if they were celebrating Beckford's goal against Chelsea ? Probably and then no doubt in the same breath saying " well he had a bit of luck with a couple of deflections". If Beckford had scored 25 goals last season - I am sure there would have been people on TW saying " well we'll see how he does in that difficult second season"

So what if we don't buy anyone this season? So what if it?s only some unnamed lower league player? Get behind the boys and instead of preoccupying yourself night and day with the accounts of Kenwright?s theatre company, actually enjoy supporting Everton. Leave the transfer frustration and the constant wanting to be a Manchester Club to those lesser mortals across the park

Well said James.

Firstly the last sentence is a bit of a joke, a poke of fun with some slight overexagerration (obvious to the majority of people, a technique also commonly employed by all you 'positive' people including yourself, 'you're off your rocker', don't worry I'll take that as the joke I'm sure it was from our esteemed editor with a respect for everyone's viewpoints rather than just his own.)

The sheep point is just repetition from what's been said on this thread 'the unthinking audience'. It's not my point, actually I'm arguing against it in my comment.

There are people on this site who include Kenwright's cocking-up of DK in amongst their list of failures against him (along with the goalkeeping kit). That's true and that is all that point says.

I'm perfectly able to distinguish between people who have failed at their jobs and actively seeking to destroy Everton. Yet again my point is that other people on here can't, and surely you can't say that on this site the negative sentiment directed towards the board has never merged into the latter.

Anger towards the board is due to their perceived failings, yes, but it has only been accentuated and focused upon more than usual in recent times because of the team's bad run of form. This is again true.

Honestly, in what way are you encouraging people to continuously contribute to this site when you clearly have such little respect for a contributors opinion (no matter how crazy you think it is). If I wasn't off my rocker I'd have long gone.

James, I think you just exposed the total lack of objectivity and substance in your original (well. written and possibly well intentioned) article.

The only reason this club hasn't been relegated in recent yrs is Moyes. The only reason EFC has made any record signings is moyes (at the end of the day haven't all clubs made their record signings in recent yrs). Didn't even PJ manage it several times (without selling our best players too)? I remember when we could break everyones record and it wasn't that long ago in real terms. That prospect is completely unimagineable now. Facts are we can barely make ANY signings at all. now.

James, I think you just exposed the total lack of objectivity and substance in your original (well. written and possibly well intentioned) article.

The only reason this club hasn't been relegated in recent yrs is Moyes. The only reason EFC has made any record signings is moyes (at the end of the day haven't all clubs made their record signings in recent yrs). Didn't even PJ manage it several times (without selling our best players too)? I remember when we could break everyones record and it wasn't that long ago in real terms. That prospect is completely unimagineable now. Facts are we can barely make ANY signings at all. now.

Tom,

No PJ just sold our captain, best player and the fans hero without even telling the manager.

David,
Not denying that at all.... but even the oft-regarded tyrant could manage record signings, less debt and a trophy (remember them?) on his much shorter watch, and when he realised he could go no further, he sold up for less than the actual share-value to allow BK to take control (who incidentally was also on the board when DF was sold and did what?). Seems to me PJ was forgiven nothing for being a red, while BK is forgiven everything for being a blue (by an ever decreasing number). Don't get me wrong I'm no fan of his either.... but if PJ had been responsible for one tenth of BK's farces he would've been hung out to dry years ago..... I'm sorry, but even PJ's misdemeanors seem almost trivial compared to the littany of serial mishaps, and lies that have followed this fella to the point we are now at.

What was that banner at Anfield: "Mission Accomplished Agent Johnson"? Funny how short some people memories are; things like the farcical attempt to sign Nigel Martyn seems to have been forgotten. And of course PJ's treatment of Joe Royle and Howard Kendall.

And I don't think BK was on the board when we signed Rod Belfitt and Bernie Wright ? possibly the two worst strikers ever to play for Everton, certainly within living memory.

We have always had our ups and downs, our lean periods as well as our glory days. These things go in cycles for every club. Didn't Manchester United go 26 years without a title win? Isn't it 1981 since Aston Villa last won the title and 1957 since they last won the FA Cup and 1961 since Spurs were last Champions?

James,

I think the board are a joke. I think over the past few years Moyes has made some big errors and I believe sport is about winning.

I also believe that being an Evertonian is much bigger than all those things and for that reason alone your post has cheered me up and got me looking forward to the season for the first time since we last walked out of Goodison!

Each to thier own about how they support the club, for some going the match with their mates having a few pints and a singsong is enough.

The notion that these fans are the ones who are helping keep us down or are a barrier to winning in some way is absolute nonsense.

I bet you and your ilk put a fair few quid more in the coffers than some of the people denigrating your obvious love of being an Evertonian?

Lets hope that in typical Everton fashion we do the business when nobody is expecting it, it's the Everton Way!!

Michael,
My reference to PJ was regarding James' mention of record signings as somehow been a great achievement on the part of this board, when quite frankly it is not the board's doing at all. The whole list of real issues, mishaps and defficiencies has been laid out by Colin Fitz in his article.... none of these are addressed in James' article.... infact the point is, they are simply ignored for pure sentiment only. How long can we afford to ignore? Another 12yrs?

Michael,
I don't really care about Spurs or Villa. (Spurs a good cup record and that's it, and Villa won most of their championships in the 19th century) I could be wrong but isn't 24 seasons our longest sequence without being champions? Haven't Everton won something in all but two decades of their history (The fifties and the noughties)? Do we look like becoming champions anytime soon? I accept that we have no devine right to win, and that there have been lean spells aplenty before.... but the difference between now and then is that during most of these previous periods we at least had the potential to be contenders in terms of finance, stadium and fanbase. Nearly all other clubs' boards (including the ones you mentioned) have managed to address those off-field issues that could help preserve or even enhance their club's status..... While our lot have done nothing but continually fail. Even nearly sending us to an il-conceived out of town stadium that could've sunk us for good..... which incidentally generated easily the biggest mocking banners seen at Anfield regarding our club's state. "F*** off to Kirkby, the city's all ours" was a far more ominous mantra than the "agent Johnson" jibe.

Tom - to dismiss James' article as pure sentiment is rather patronising.

So what if we don't buy anyone this season? So what if it?s only some unnamed lower league player? Get behind the boys and instead of preoccupying yourself night and day with the accounts of Kenwright?s theatre company, actually enjoy supporting Everton. Leave the transfer frustration and the constant wanting to be a Manchester Club to those lesser mortals across the park.

That was his closing paragraph - hardly sentiment. My only criticism of his article is that he is too polite to some of the moaners. We are not even spending as much as Stoke, Sunderland etc etc they say - well I will just nip to the bookies during my lunch time and stick a tenner on those clubs to win a trophy next season. Sorry I wouldn't want to waste good money.

A couple of seasons ago - I heard some West Broms fans making fun of Goodison. A bit old fashioned - funny they weren't laughing at the end of that season when they were relegated!!

I see Aston Villa look like losing Downing - that will be Barry, Milner, Young and Downing leaving Villa over a couple of seasons. And Evertonians moan !!!!!

Tom - if you don't care about other clubs - then don't use other clubs to have a go at Everton as many others seem to like to do. " We aren't spending as much as Blackburn etc etc..........."

Michael,
The point is: I really do not need ANY kind of pep talk to support the club anymore than I always have, that is indeed paronising and quite frankly irrelevant in the extreme, especially when you consider the numerous outstanding issues affecting our whole future that have been outlined elsewhere, and have been building up for years. I do not need the rallying call because I will be taking up my place at GP and shouting myself hoarse, just as I have done for approx 40yrs, at least 35 of them as a season Tkt holder and nearly 20 as a shareholder. Nor do I think the fanbase in general needs the rallying call, as they have turned up continuously regardless...... they have always done their bit. The board however, have not!

You made a specific comparison to 2 clubs.... I think we should be bigger and better than them, that is why I'm not particularly interested in them. The point is however, even your choice of comparators are both better run clubs, both have bigger turnovers, and both have newer stadia and have consistently outspent us.... and there are several others too who have done similar or even more in all of these respects. Davie Moyes alone has managed to keep us amongst them ....

Michael. Belfit and Wright are not the worst strikers to play for Everton in living memory. There has been worse in very recent memory.

Andy - I would dispute that and indeed I would go as far as to say that Bernie Wright must be one of the worst players ever to play top flight football. Were you around in 1971-72 season? as one of my teachers at school said - your team scored a quarter of your goals for that season in one match!

Ask any Evertonian who remembers seasons 1971-72 and 1972-73 in particular. When you consider that we had been champions in 1969 -70 - it was quite a dramatic fall. I don't think any of the football we have played in the last couple of seasons was as bad as in those days. And if you are trying to have a go at Anichebe or any others in the current - which I suspect you are - then at least have the guts to mention the players by name.

Tom - I could have mentioned other clubs - such as Sunderland - who have I think have signed 10 players in this transfer window ( according to teletext) The reasons I referred to Villa & Spurs is that they have been mentioned by others as being comparable to us and we have been battling with them both for top 6 places. And as everyone seems to think it's the number of players you sign that counts I used Sunderland as an example to show that it ain't always so. They must have made more signings than any other club in the last couple of seasons - to just avoid relegation !

Tom - you may not need a pep talk - I just thought it was a nice change to have somebody put forward a positive article - instead of the same old same old - moaning.

Michael, the difference between now and say the early 70's, is that back then, we could outbid anyone on occasion......we could break the record on a Latchford or a Dobson, and they'd come running to us before Man U or Arsenal. Now we cannot even outbid the smallest clubs. You mention Sunderland, and they have regularly outspent us in recent yrs, whether it's been wasteful or not is not the point..... it's the fact that they can spend and we can't. They have built their stadium and they have done everything to push Sunderland as far as they can and we have chucked scraps at Moyes and hoped for the best. There have been times in recent years when we have been one or two players short of bridging that gap. There have also been times when we've gone into a new season knowing key players would be out injured..... yet we haven't been able to fill obvious gaps. This club is running on empty, and has been for far to long with no obvious plan to address these issues and move us forward properly.....

I'm all for positivity on a matchday, but the glaring defficiencies cannot be ignored forever.

"This club is running on empty".

Nail on the head Tom. I wonder what the Latin for "Running on Empty" is?

I've just banged it in an English to Latin translator and it's come up with

"Cursor et Inanis"

Maybe that could become our new motto.......?

Michael, I have had another look at my prized 1969 pennant. To think that Belfitt and Wright came shortly after is indeed awful. I apologize and agree with you. It wasn't always sunny then either.

Andy - back in 1972 I thought Bernie Wright looked more like a Rugby League player than a Footballer! And I still think that !! I think we beat Saints and Wigan for his signature !!

Where you at Goodison when he made his full debut/home debut v Man City? I think he smacked Mike Summerbee in the face and the Ref missed it !!!Towards the end of that season ( 1971-72) we made Captain Mainwaring's Home Guard look like a well oiled machine we were that bad. Thank goodness Howard Kendall was still around - one of the few highlights was his form. As for Bernie - well I think milk could turn faster than him!!!