Season 2011-12 Fan Articles
Healthy Competition for Places
By Sam Hoare :: 07/02/2012
48 Comments (»Last)
For the first time this season, with some new players coming in and some others returning from injury, I am beginning to feel like there is a healthy look to the squad with some good competition for most starting berths.Goalkeeper
This is one of two positions that is uncontested. Howard ? despite Saturday's blunder ? is the clear frontrunner with Mucha and Hahnemann only back-ups.
Left-Back
The other uncontested spot with Leighton Baines the clear choice. Garbutt and Bidwell may challenge in seasons to come but not yet. Neville or Distin can fill in if needed.
Centre-Back
Good depth here with Heitinga really coming into himself recently; Distin arguably our best defender over the last 2 years; Jags an assured international; and Duffy showing much promise and maturity in his short run.
Right-Back
Probably room for improvement but Hibbert and Neville both have plenty of experience and nous between them. Hibbert has been the better bet this season so far.
Left-Midfield
Pienaar might never have left, so assured was his second debut, and with Drenthe and Gueye in reserve, we have some decent options. McFadden must wonder why he is here...
Centre-Midfield
Gibson has been solid if not spectacular while Fellaini has returned to his dominant best recently. Rodwell was beginning to deliver on his potential before injury while the calls for Barkley to be included continue. Osman and Pienaar are also options. Hopefully not too much more of Neville and Heitinga here please.
Right-Midfield
Donovan will no doubt continue whilst here, after which the position will be contested presumably by Drenthe and Coleman with Osman and Anichebe having also played there in the past.
Attacking Midfielder
Cahill is currently in possession of this spot but Osman will soon return. It could also be a position for the likes of Barkley or Drenthe... or Moyes could surprise us all by playing two out-and-out strikers instead. Baxter also thrived in this role on loan at Tranmere.
Striker
The emergence of Straqualarsi as a hard-working hold-up man seems like a genuine possibility while Jelavic comes with the promise of goals. Anichebe is now our top scorer despite minimal game time and a similar claim could be made of Vellios. I'd also be interested to see more of McAleny.
All-in-all, my team in general (post Donovan) would be:
Howard
Hibbert Heitinga DIstin Baines
Drenthe Rodwell Fellaini Pienaar
Osman
Jelavic
Jagielka, Barkley, Stracqualursi, Cahill and Coleman all have good claims and no doubt will play their parts but i feel the team above is solid at the back whilst possessing a combative hard-working core with enough flair and creativity to make things happen.
In particular, I feel that playing Osman in the hole with Pienaar and Drenthe buzzing around him will create the chances for Jelavic to hopefully put away.
Either way, I feel quite happy with the makeup of our squad, even if four of our current senior roster are here only on loan, and hopeful that we might still finish the year looking up rather than down.
Reader Comments (48)
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Tommy Coleman
2 Posted 07/02/2012 at 17:04:43
2 Posted 07/02/2012 at 17:04:43
Why are we struggling to play at our potential then ?
Must be the manager ?
Must be the manager ?
Peter Laing
3 Posted 07/02/2012 at 17:03:44
3 Posted 07/02/2012 at 17:03:44
Good analysis Sam, I would love to see Fellaini given the Defensive / Midfield role with Rodwell and Barkley operating in front of him with Pienaar on the left and Coleman / Drenthe on the right. If the new man Jelly can hit the ground running and find his shooting boots with a fairly stable defence and experienced options coming from the bench / providing cover we have the making of a decent side. The only problem appears to be the continuing issue of injuries which seems to perenially trouble Everton and disrupts the fluidity of team development and progress.
Arthur Westhead
4 Posted 07/02/2012 at 17:20:46
4 Posted 07/02/2012 at 17:20:46
Sam, I agree with most of your comment, but if we play that eleven:
Surely the two shortest full backs in premier league.
The two shortest wide players in premier league.
The shortest 'striker' (Ossie) in premier league.
Defending corners and freekicks would worry me.
I wouldn't change it much but Rodwell in ahead of Gibson? Not for me. He has not made a good partnership with Fellaini. It's no coincidence that Felli has played his best in last three games since Gibson has been alongside him. I would like to see Rodwell in a more forward position in place of Ossie. And that helps a bit defensively as well.
Surely the two shortest full backs in premier league.
The two shortest wide players in premier league.
The shortest 'striker' (Ossie) in premier league.
Defending corners and freekicks would worry me.
I wouldn't change it much but Rodwell in ahead of Gibson? Not for me. He has not made a good partnership with Fellaini. It's no coincidence that Felli has played his best in last three games since Gibson has been alongside him. I would like to see Rodwell in a more forward position in place of Ossie. And that helps a bit defensively as well.
Phil Walling
5 Posted 07/02/2012 at 18:23:47
5 Posted 07/02/2012 at 18:23:47
With that squad,how can we possibly not get into Europe?
Oh,I just remembered! You HAVE to average more than a goal a game!
Oh,I just remembered! You HAVE to average more than a goal a game!
Wayne Smyth
6 Posted 07/02/2012 at 18:48:18
6 Posted 07/02/2012 at 18:48:18
Even as it stands I'd find room for Drenthe as the attacking midfielder, with no defensive duties. He has a combination of pace and creativity that our side usually lacks.
That way Royston can get on with what he is good at which is attacking, counter attacking and not worry about the stuff he is crap at, like defending and marking. (Isn't this what a highly paid manager is meant to figure out??)
If we didn't play with just 1 up front, I think Jelavic + anichebe/straq/vellios would be a decent pairing. They're not world-beaters, but should still be capable of keeping a back 4 occupied and scoring goals.
Anyway, I agree with Tommy and Phil, with the players at his disposal Moyes should be aiming a bit higher than draws at the bottom team in the league.
Longer term, most of those players who are making a difference are loans and I doubt Drenthe will stay given that he's been sidelined so often. Next season is going to be key and I hope that Moyes continues the work done with Saha and Bily and shows the door to Neville and perhaps even Cahill and tries to build for the future.
That way Royston can get on with what he is good at which is attacking, counter attacking and not worry about the stuff he is crap at, like defending and marking. (Isn't this what a highly paid manager is meant to figure out??)
If we didn't play with just 1 up front, I think Jelavic + anichebe/straq/vellios would be a decent pairing. They're not world-beaters, but should still be capable of keeping a back 4 occupied and scoring goals.
Anyway, I agree with Tommy and Phil, with the players at his disposal Moyes should be aiming a bit higher than draws at the bottom team in the league.
Longer term, most of those players who are making a difference are loans and I doubt Drenthe will stay given that he's been sidelined so often. Next season is going to be key and I hope that Moyes continues the work done with Saha and Bily and shows the door to Neville and perhaps even Cahill and tries to build for the future.
Michael Winstanley
7 Posted 07/02/2012 at 18:55:56
7 Posted 07/02/2012 at 18:55:56
Not just Jimmy Mac who wonders why he's here...
I'd like to see Moyes start to develop the team for next season. Coleman at right back for starters, he has to learn if he's going to play there, I'd rather he learnt the tail end of this season than the start of next.
The midfield is a problem for me, Fellaini and one other but who? Rodwell/Gibson/Osman, none of whom cry quality.
Wingers, Drenthe/Gueye/Pienaar
Forwards, Jelavic & Barkley
The real issue for me is if we have to sell in the summer, who goes?
Neville, Cahill are past their best and need to move on. Potentially the high earners, however Fellaini tops that tree and would be madness to sell him. Many on here don't appear to see his qualities but if we lost Fellaini we'd be right in it.
I think Jelavic will a great signing (blind optimism) who I think would benefit from a player with the ability to pick a pass (more optimism) Barkley or Osman being the most obvious choices.
Whilst I agree with you Sam, quite a bit of my optimism was drained after our lacklustre performance at Wigan.
I'd like to see Moyes start to develop the team for next season. Coleman at right back for starters, he has to learn if he's going to play there, I'd rather he learnt the tail end of this season than the start of next.
The midfield is a problem for me, Fellaini and one other but who? Rodwell/Gibson/Osman, none of whom cry quality.
Wingers, Drenthe/Gueye/Pienaar
Forwards, Jelavic & Barkley
The real issue for me is if we have to sell in the summer, who goes?
Neville, Cahill are past their best and need to move on. Potentially the high earners, however Fellaini tops that tree and would be madness to sell him. Many on here don't appear to see his qualities but if we lost Fellaini we'd be right in it.
I think Jelavic will a great signing (blind optimism) who I think would benefit from a player with the ability to pick a pass (more optimism) Barkley or Osman being the most obvious choices.
Whilst I agree with you Sam, quite a bit of my optimism was drained after our lacklustre performance at Wigan.
Jimmy Sørheim
8 Posted 07/02/2012 at 18:59:58
8 Posted 07/02/2012 at 18:59:58
Problem is Moyes will not stick with the same first eleven game after game, and that disturbs the flow, we have seen it 2 or 3 times already this season.
Coming off a good win Moyes fucks it up by mixing it up again.
The one common thing about teams that get on a winning run is that they stay with the same first eleven, Harry Redknapp found his, why the hell can`t Moyes?
Coming off a good win Moyes fucks it up by mixing it up again.
The one common thing about teams that get on a winning run is that they stay with the same first eleven, Harry Redknapp found his, why the hell can`t Moyes?
Tommy Coleman
9 Posted 07/02/2012 at 19:16:14
9 Posted 07/02/2012 at 19:16:14
I'm with you Wayne regarding Drenthe, give him a freerole and let be between attack/mid. I thought he was great against City and put in a good shift but then got dropped and as a final kick in the nuts Neville was put on instead of him vs Wigan. There is no way he will stay at Everton, he's just not a Moyes type player.
In fact Martin Tyler summed it up perfectly in the City game, after Drenthe closed down Richards, Tyler said " Jelavic has just seen what you need to do in a David Moyes' side, work, work and work again !"
He was being complementory but I just cringed.
The modern day reputation of Everton.
In fact Martin Tyler summed it up perfectly in the City game, after Drenthe closed down Richards, Tyler said " Jelavic has just seen what you need to do in a David Moyes' side, work, work and work again !"
He was being complementory but I just cringed.
The modern day reputation of Everton.
Anthony Jones
10 Posted 07/02/2012 at 19:40:01
10 Posted 07/02/2012 at 19:40:01
This article implies that we have hope now that Moyes has options.
Moyes is consistently a shit-house manager who won't take risks and who will no doubt favour ageing and ineffective favourites (e.g. Captain Twatter) unless they speak out against him (e.g. Saha).
Stop tormenting yourself and accept that Moyes will never trust players with flair.
I can't wait to see the back of the control freak.
Moyes is consistently a shit-house manager who won't take risks and who will no doubt favour ageing and ineffective favourites (e.g. Captain Twatter) unless they speak out against him (e.g. Saha).
Stop tormenting yourself and accept that Moyes will never trust players with flair.
I can't wait to see the back of the control freak.
James Stewart
11 Posted 07/02/2012 at 19:48:37
11 Posted 07/02/2012 at 19:48:37
A very kind review of our squad there sam!
Gk.
Average with inconsistent Howard unthreatened by the poor Mucha and never gonna play hannamann.
Rb. Crap with Hibbert the best of a very sorry bunch. Neville is barely worth mentioning as he is one of our poorest ever players let alone captains.
Cb. Our strongest area which is no surprise considering our zealously cautious leader.
LB. Quality Baines with no backup what so ever.
Mid. A mess as Moyes doesn't play people in their natural positions. Take out Donovan and Drenthe as they won't be here next year and what are you left with?
Str. Again poor unless Jelavic turns out to be a world beater. Strac is very useful but will he be here next year?
Overall we are still one of the smallest squad's with ageing players like Cahill & Distin who will need replacing. If you take away our loan stars it all starts to unravel very fast.
Gk.
Average with inconsistent Howard unthreatened by the poor Mucha and never gonna play hannamann.
Rb. Crap with Hibbert the best of a very sorry bunch. Neville is barely worth mentioning as he is one of our poorest ever players let alone captains.
Cb. Our strongest area which is no surprise considering our zealously cautious leader.
LB. Quality Baines with no backup what so ever.
Mid. A mess as Moyes doesn't play people in their natural positions. Take out Donovan and Drenthe as they won't be here next year and what are you left with?
Str. Again poor unless Jelavic turns out to be a world beater. Strac is very useful but will he be here next year?
Overall we are still one of the smallest squad's with ageing players like Cahill & Distin who will need replacing. If you take away our loan stars it all starts to unravel very fast.
Ian Kearney
12 Posted 07/02/2012 at 19:58:05
12 Posted 07/02/2012 at 19:58:05
I'd agree that having competition for places is healthy, but only if its a fair competition, when the manager so obviously has favourites and sticks with them regardless of form, and other sometimes more talented players dont get the same level of faith, then its not so healthy.
Michael Winstanley
13 Posted 07/02/2012 at 21:52:14
13 Posted 07/02/2012 at 21:52:14
i think Drenthe will stay. Other Premier League teams will wait to see just how good he is before taking a punt. He'll stay and learn how to play in the Premiership.
I can see your point James. Without Fellaini we'd be lost in midfield.
I can see your point James. Without Fellaini we'd be lost in midfield.
Sam Hoare
14 Posted 07/02/2012 at 22:30:29
14 Posted 07/02/2012 at 22:30:29
Love how this article is meant to be an appraisal (admittedly slightly optimistic one) of our squad but instantly becomes a reason to have a pop at Moyes!!
James Stewart, just picking you out of many but one things that often annoys me is this claim that Moyes always plays people out of positions. I'm not saying that he doesn't make selection mistakes but nearly all top managers have played players in a variety of positions. Ferguson played Neville in CM, Hiddink played Billy at left back Wenger at the moment has been playing Coqcuelin at left back. Sometimes through choice sometimes through necessity.
Also Anthony Jones: 'Moyes will never trust players with flair'. Such overblown generalisations force me to play the part of the apologist. Moyes bought in and played consistently the likes of Gravesen, Pienaar, Fernandes and Arteta. All players with flair. Crucially they were all players that could work hard as well as that is what he requires. Understandably so in my opinion.
James Stewart, just picking you out of many but one things that often annoys me is this claim that Moyes always plays people out of positions. I'm not saying that he doesn't make selection mistakes but nearly all top managers have played players in a variety of positions. Ferguson played Neville in CM, Hiddink played Billy at left back Wenger at the moment has been playing Coqcuelin at left back. Sometimes through choice sometimes through necessity.
Also Anthony Jones: 'Moyes will never trust players with flair'. Such overblown generalisations force me to play the part of the apologist. Moyes bought in and played consistently the likes of Gravesen, Pienaar, Fernandes and Arteta. All players with flair. Crucially they were all players that could work hard as well as that is what he requires. Understandably so in my opinion.
Ciarán McGlone
15 Posted 07/02/2012 at 22:51:32
15 Posted 07/02/2012 at 22:51:32
Ah, the old 'whataboutery' defence Sam.
We've recently had Mr Wilson extolling the virtues of playing Neville in midfield, because some other geezer made the same mistake previously.
So It's defensible because someone else made the same mistake.
Cringeworthy twisting of logic and piousness.
We've recently had Mr Wilson extolling the virtues of playing Neville in midfield, because some other geezer made the same mistake previously.
So It's defensible because someone else made the same mistake.
Cringeworthy twisting of logic and piousness.
Anthony Jones
16 Posted 07/02/2012 at 23:03:32
16 Posted 07/02/2012 at 23:03:32
Sam,
Whilst I accept it is supposition on my part to state that Moyes does not trust flair players, equally you are making the assumption that playing flair players means that the manager genuinely trusts them.
My reasoning is subtle but valid: Arteta strongly suggested to the press that Wenger gives much less instruction to his players than Moyes. Fernandes did possess some flair but was still a holding centre mid, and Gravesen was as much a bustler as a flair player.
Granted Pienaar has flair but he doesn't show it in terms of goals or assists. Perhaps it is because Moyes has our players shitting themselves in case they lose possession of the ball (see his touch-line antics)?
The defense of Moyes as a man-manager and tactician is becoming ludicrous. You know as well as I that he alienates players that don't express his rigid ideology, and that he has a propensity to load his team with defenders (see your article above). His many strengths are becoming overshadowed by his increasingly long list of weaknesses.
I agree with your appraisal for the most part, and applaud your optimism, but I still want Gollum out. Sorry for dragging down the tone.
Whilst I accept it is supposition on my part to state that Moyes does not trust flair players, equally you are making the assumption that playing flair players means that the manager genuinely trusts them.
My reasoning is subtle but valid: Arteta strongly suggested to the press that Wenger gives much less instruction to his players than Moyes. Fernandes did possess some flair but was still a holding centre mid, and Gravesen was as much a bustler as a flair player.
Granted Pienaar has flair but he doesn't show it in terms of goals or assists. Perhaps it is because Moyes has our players shitting themselves in case they lose possession of the ball (see his touch-line antics)?
The defense of Moyes as a man-manager and tactician is becoming ludicrous. You know as well as I that he alienates players that don't express his rigid ideology, and that he has a propensity to load his team with defenders (see your article above). His many strengths are becoming overshadowed by his increasingly long list of weaknesses.
I agree with your appraisal for the most part, and applaud your optimism, but I still want Gollum out. Sorry for dragging down the tone.
James Stewart
17 Posted 07/02/2012 at 23:38:32
17 Posted 07/02/2012 at 23:38:32
Have to agree with Anthony. Moyes cannot be described as a tactician really has there is only one tactic he cares about and that is try and keep it tight. Regardless of who we are playing.
I take your point Sam sometimes top managers do play players our of their natural positions but not every week! The Neville/cahill sub at the weekend was the final straw for me. Stank of cowardice. Why move our best midfielder up front when you have 2 forwards chomping at the bit to bring on a right back to play in midfield. I challenge even the Moyesites to explain that one? And don't give me any rubbish about fellaini being a striker!
I take your point Sam sometimes top managers do play players our of their natural positions but not every week! The Neville/cahill sub at the weekend was the final straw for me. Stank of cowardice. Why move our best midfielder up front when you have 2 forwards chomping at the bit to bring on a right back to play in midfield. I challenge even the Moyesites to explain that one? And don't give me any rubbish about fellaini being a striker!
Peter Barry
18 Posted 08/02/2012 at 03:22:06
18 Posted 08/02/2012 at 03:22:06
James that is absolutely true about the Moyesophiles they constantly try and gloss over the tactical ineptness and lack of motivational ability of their beloved leader.
Anto Byrne
19 Posted 08/02/2012 at 07:34:34
19 Posted 08/02/2012 at 07:34:34
We still have to replace Arteta in that central midfield role and Osman, Drenthe, Coalman, Cahill, Faddy or Pienaar don't have that artisan element in their game. We miss the Best Little Spaniard and he rates up their with the best of them.
I would love a Martin Dobson in our current midfield with Peter Reid type (Barkley perhaps) and a winger in the mould of Dave Thomas although, if Baines could get down the byline on occasion and put a few pinpoint crosses on the head of the Stracq or Big Vic, that would work.
We are pretty workmanlike and Moyes don't like superstars so until we change managers with a more adventurous tactically astute one then expect the same old dire dross to be served up, week-in, week-out.
I would love a Martin Dobson in our current midfield with Peter Reid type (Barkley perhaps) and a winger in the mould of Dave Thomas although, if Baines could get down the byline on occasion and put a few pinpoint crosses on the head of the Stracq or Big Vic, that would work.
We are pretty workmanlike and Moyes don't like superstars so until we change managers with a more adventurous tactically astute one then expect the same old dire dross to be served up, week-in, week-out.
Derek Thomas
20 Posted 08/02/2012 at 09:04:24
20 Posted 08/02/2012 at 09:04:24
4 or 5 yrs ago I said that Moyeses ( and BK's) pluses got us where we are; and their minuses stop us going any further...STILL TRUE
Sam Hoare
21 Posted 08/02/2012 at 09:27:02
21 Posted 08/02/2012 at 09:27:02
Anthony and James
I agree with alot of what you say. For me its not a case of tactical ineptness as much as it is tactical inflexibility.
Moyes' philosophy has always been to be hard to beat and organised defensively and its fair to say that any player posessing flair has to fit in to that side of the game too. But i'm not sure thats the same as saying that he hates flair....more that he loves organisation. These are the tactics that have mostly dragged us up the league for the last 10 years. Though whether they still have their merit now is clearly a question for much debate. I do think that when times are tough (such as these) Moyes always manages to scrape points here and there. I'm not dead against a change though. Derek Thomas may well have summed it up right.
I agree with alot of what you say. For me its not a case of tactical ineptness as much as it is tactical inflexibility.
Moyes' philosophy has always been to be hard to beat and organised defensively and its fair to say that any player posessing flair has to fit in to that side of the game too. But i'm not sure thats the same as saying that he hates flair....more that he loves organisation. These are the tactics that have mostly dragged us up the league for the last 10 years. Though whether they still have their merit now is clearly a question for much debate. I do think that when times are tough (such as these) Moyes always manages to scrape points here and there. I'm not dead against a change though. Derek Thomas may well have summed it up right.
Sam Hoare
22 Posted 08/02/2012 at 09:35:28
22 Posted 08/02/2012 at 09:35:28
Ciaran, you are of course assuming its a mistake in every case.
Cringeworthy and habitual self righteousness.
Cringeworthy and habitual self righteousness.
Roman Sidey
23 Posted 08/02/2012 at 09:41:32
23 Posted 08/02/2012 at 09:41:32
Sam, I like the look of your favoured 11 to an extent. I just don't think that Osman would be a good option there for long. He typically has a few good games in a short run against lesser opposition, and is pushing 31.
Have to agree with Anthony re: Fellaini and Gibson. No secret what I thought of Fellaini until the last few games. I thought he was a waste of space and hoped we'd sell him, but since Gibson came in, for some reason Fellaini has stepped up and is one of our most important players at the moment - along with Heitinga.
Have to agree with Anthony re: Fellaini and Gibson. No secret what I thought of Fellaini until the last few games. I thought he was a waste of space and hoped we'd sell him, but since Gibson came in, for some reason Fellaini has stepped up and is one of our most important players at the moment - along with Heitinga.
Ciarán McGlone
24 Posted 08/02/2012 at 13:58:00
24 Posted 08/02/2012 at 13:58:00
I assumed nothing Sam.
Self-righteousness? Certainly.
Self-righteousness? Certainly.
Nick Entwistle
25 Posted 08/02/2012 at 14:15:20
25 Posted 08/02/2012 at 14:15:20
Sam's line up...
Rodwell and Fallaini don't work well together, never have, never will. Two very talented footballers, but so are Lampard and Gerrard who also can't play together.
Fallaini is key for me, and Gibson lets him play. Gibson may have to be a water carrier allowing Fallaini to run the show, but so what.
Maybe even Gibson would allow Rodwell to play to his strengths but you just can't play Rod and Fella in the same team. It has NEVER worked and is one reason for our turgid displays this season.
Rodwell and Fallaini don't work well together, never have, never will. Two very talented footballers, but so are Lampard and Gerrard who also can't play together.
Fallaini is key for me, and Gibson lets him play. Gibson may have to be a water carrier allowing Fallaini to run the show, but so what.
Maybe even Gibson would allow Rodwell to play to his strengths but you just can't play Rod and Fella in the same team. It has NEVER worked and is one reason for our turgid displays this season.
Dave Wilson
26 Posted 08/02/2012 at 14:35:19
26 Posted 08/02/2012 at 14:35:19
Ciaran
"We`ve had Mr Wilson extolling the virtues of Neville in midfield" . . lol
I`d love to see that post.
Perhaps the people who have been slaughtering me everywhere i`ve been these past couple of days, for going over the top in my condemnation of Phil Neville being selected ANYWHERE, would accept it in my defence.
Nice to know you`ve lost none of that ability to read one thing and think you`ve read something else
"We`ve had Mr Wilson extolling the virtues of Neville in midfield" . . lol
I`d love to see that post.
Perhaps the people who have been slaughtering me everywhere i`ve been these past couple of days, for going over the top in my condemnation of Phil Neville being selected ANYWHERE, would accept it in my defence.
Nice to know you`ve lost none of that ability to read one thing and think you`ve read something else
Ciarán McGlone
28 Posted 08/02/2012 at 15:43:03
28 Posted 08/02/2012 at 15:43:03
That's not quite the whole story Dave, is it?
On one thread you criticise Neville getting a game... and even go on a rant about Mancs.
While on another, you are offerred the argument that Moyes is an idiot for playing Neville in midfield... and what do you do? Do you agree wholeheadtedly, consolidating your position on the other thread? Do you not respond and avoid a conflict with you pious ideas about Moyes?
NO, you tacitly defend the decision by stating that other managers have played him there.
You played a blinder, Dave.
On one thread you criticise Neville getting a game... and even go on a rant about Mancs.
While on another, you are offerred the argument that Moyes is an idiot for playing Neville in midfield... and what do you do? Do you agree wholeheadtedly, consolidating your position on the other thread? Do you not respond and avoid a conflict with you pious ideas about Moyes?
NO, you tacitly defend the decision by stating that other managers have played him there.
You played a blinder, Dave.
Alex Kociuba
29 Posted 08/02/2012 at 15:48:27
29 Posted 08/02/2012 at 15:48:27
I think the first two words of the original post sums it up in its own right "Healthy Competition".
Players playing well get a game, those on the bench fight for a place. Players getting a game regardless of form is unhealthy.
Players playing well get a game, those on the bench fight for a place. Players getting a game regardless of form is unhealthy.
Keith Glazzard
30 Posted 08/02/2012 at 16:30:34
30 Posted 08/02/2012 at 16:30:34
With everyone fit and available, the run-down of the squad in Sam's post is surprisingly good considering not many of them cost £35m. Moyes has - without being infallible of course - served us well in this respect for 10 years. But familiar questions about team selection and tactics seemed to come to a head in the last two games.
City - a triumph : Wigan - shite.
Drenthe - a "flair player" as they say.
Started against City, who have conceded only 19 goals. A good call which paid off with the break-out for the goal as well as him defending adequately.
Dropped for Wigan, who have let in 47 - hardly the best defence in the world. Baffling. And to add insult, Neville for Cahill..... its all been said. No wonder frustration bubbles up into anger.
With a full squad and a good few games to go Moyes has chance to get it right., but will he?
City - a triumph : Wigan - shite.
Drenthe - a "flair player" as they say.
Started against City, who have conceded only 19 goals. A good call which paid off with the break-out for the goal as well as him defending adequately.
Dropped for Wigan, who have let in 47 - hardly the best defence in the world. Baffling. And to add insult, Neville for Cahill..... its all been said. No wonder frustration bubbles up into anger.
With a full squad and a good few games to go Moyes has chance to get it right., but will he?
Steve Sweeney
31 Posted 08/02/2012 at 17:55:03
31 Posted 08/02/2012 at 17:55:03
This is when the Dark Side of Moyes comes to the fore. He just does not know or cannot make his mind up as to what is the best team.the team that gelsc,players that compliment each other.it is always the same when we have a fully fit squad or more than 14 fit players.
The display and set up for the Wigan game is an example. God help us when the mighty Blackpool come to town ,he will be dithering all week on should he or shouldn't he play 6 defenders,
Oh for a bit of let's just go for it.
PS I Wish he would send Round packing
The display and set up for the Wigan game is an example. God help us when the mighty Blackpool come to town ,he will be dithering all week on should he or shouldn't he play 6 defenders,
Oh for a bit of let's just go for it.
PS I Wish he would send Round packing
Keith Glazzard
32 Posted 08/02/2012 at 18:28:54
32 Posted 08/02/2012 at 18:28:54
Steve - what do we know about Round? Has anything good happened since he's been here? He was referred to as 'short Round' recently and others have pointed out that Moyes has surrounded himself with nobody who is likely to inject an idea about attack, creativity or even pace into the discussion. No defenders on the bench because they're already on the field.
And ten years in charge means that the only challenge to his outlook can come from above - Bill? - or from below. Us, the crowd.
Which is happening, and I don't mean 'Bill Out' protests. When we pass sideways and back from well in their half for Howard to boot upfield, our Paddock half of the park shout and boo loudly. If they can't hear that in the directors' box, and wonder about season ticket sales, there will never be anything else we can do. Handcuffing ouselves to the goalposts perhaps? After you Claude, but you never know.
And ten years in charge means that the only challenge to his outlook can come from above - Bill? - or from below. Us, the crowd.
Which is happening, and I don't mean 'Bill Out' protests. When we pass sideways and back from well in their half for Howard to boot upfield, our Paddock half of the park shout and boo loudly. If they can't hear that in the directors' box, and wonder about season ticket sales, there will never be anything else we can do. Handcuffing ouselves to the goalposts perhaps? After you Claude, but you never know.
Dave Wilson
33 Posted 09/02/2012 at 10:14:48
33 Posted 09/02/2012 at 10:14:48
Ciaran
The debate was about whether Neville should be described as a midfileder or a defender or indeed a utility player.
The one thing we did agree on was that he is poor in either posisiton.
Try to digest what you read before diving in, You may be pleasantly surprised.
It will greatly reduce the probability of your posts being batted clean out of the park for a start
"Extolling the Virtues of playing Neville" . .fuck me
The debate was about whether Neville should be described as a midfileder or a defender or indeed a utility player.
The one thing we did agree on was that he is poor in either posisiton.
Try to digest what you read before diving in, You may be pleasantly surprised.
It will greatly reduce the probability of your posts being batted clean out of the park for a start
"Extolling the Virtues of playing Neville" . .fuck me
Ciarán McGlone
34 Posted 09/02/2012 at 13:32:29
34 Posted 09/02/2012 at 13:32:29
Dave,
The argument was about 'playing him in midfield'.
Batter away.
The argument was about 'playing him in midfield'.
Batter away.
Anthony Jones
35 Posted 09/02/2012 at 15:24:41
35 Posted 09/02/2012 at 15:24:41
Continung the optimistic theme, how about:
Howard, Coleman, Heitinga, Distin, Baines
Drenthe Fellaini Gibson Gueye
Pienaar
Straqualursi?
Howard, Coleman, Heitinga, Distin, Baines
Drenthe Fellaini Gibson Gueye
Pienaar
Straqualursi?
Stephen Kenny
36 Posted 09/02/2012 at 16:00:30
36 Posted 09/02/2012 at 16:00:30
I'm not saying Duffy is a better player than Distin on an individual basis but as a whole our defence looked a lot calmer with Heitinga/Duffy in the middle of it.
No doubt that Distin's been our best player on many occassions over the peast couple of years but I don't think theres been a time when the chemistry has ever been really right at the back since Lescott left.
I personally put that down to Distin and Jagielka not regaining his absolute best form. The calmness and communication Heitinga brings is a valuable thing in football and if this doesn't rub of on Distin after a few games together we need to think about looking for a different combination.
Nice to have good players to come in though.
No doubt that Distin's been our best player on many occassions over the peast couple of years but I don't think theres been a time when the chemistry has ever been really right at the back since Lescott left.
I personally put that down to Distin and Jagielka not regaining his absolute best form. The calmness and communication Heitinga brings is a valuable thing in football and if this doesn't rub of on Distin after a few games together we need to think about looking for a different combination.
Nice to have good players to come in though.
Steve Edwards
37 Posted 09/02/2012 at 20:20:27
37 Posted 09/02/2012 at 20:20:27
Never been completely happy with Howard and I'm not just saying this because of his latest howler. I just think at best he's very ordinary. I wonder what Moyes thinks now about letting Ruddy go to Norwich. From what I've seen of Ruddy lately he looks a much better keeper than Howard or anyobody else at the club.
Howard just dosn't command the box for me and lacks presence. I do think we could do better. He's probably only there because other parts of the team are of a bigger priority when it comes to improving and having money spent on it and Howard is, well, O.K.
Howard just dosn't command the box for me and lacks presence. I do think we could do better. He's probably only there because other parts of the team are of a bigger priority when it comes to improving and having money spent on it and Howard is, well, O.K.
Peter Barry
39 Posted 10/02/2012 at 03:18:51
39 Posted 10/02/2012 at 03:18:51
"Swansea City manager Brendan Rodgers signs a new three-and-a-half-year contract."
Another missed opportunity. I am sure he wold have snatched our hand off for a £67,000 a week contract.
Another missed opportunity. I am sure he wold have snatched our hand off for a £67,000 a week contract.
Leung Chi Ho
40 Posted 10/02/2012 at 09:12:51
40 Posted 10/02/2012 at 09:12:51
Stephen (578), is it the reason for Heitinga/Duffy look more solid than Distin/Jagielka:
Heitinga/Duffy - Heitinga is the leader and Duffy would listen and learn from him.
Distin/Jagielka - two experience defender have their own throught.
Heitinga/Duffy - Heitinga is the leader and Duffy would listen and learn from him.
Distin/Jagielka - two experience defender have their own throught.
Stephen Kenny
41 Posted 10/02/2012 at 11:32:34
41 Posted 10/02/2012 at 11:32:34
Leung, I would say so.
Neither Distin or Jagielka strike me as good communicators either. Vital at the centre of defence.
Neither Distin or Jagielka strike me as good communicators either. Vital at the centre of defence.
Nate Allen
42 Posted 10/02/2012 at 16:37:04
42 Posted 10/02/2012 at 16:37:04
Michael 169, Osman doesn't cry quality to you? Not even over Gibson and Rodwell? This is a judgement error on your part. Before Ossie was injured he was the most creative midfielder we had (Including Drenthe!) and I think even with our new signings he would contend for that spot. Good with both feet, smart passing and a knack for scoring goals. For me, Ossie cries quality.
Howard Don
43 Posted 10/02/2012 at 20:12:25
43 Posted 10/02/2012 at 20:12:25
Peter 273 - Moyesophiles?? just so I'm clear is this the new derogatory term for those of us who think Moyes is doing an excellent job? I take it acolyte and apologist are now old hat?
Agree with Sam 244 amazing how the knockers will reduce any post to a reason to knock their whipping boy/scapegoat for our potless situation.
Agree with Sam 244 amazing how the knockers will reduce any post to a reason to knock their whipping boy/scapegoat for our potless situation.
Derek Thomas
44 Posted 10/02/2012 at 23:11:29
44 Posted 10/02/2012 at 23:11:29
Competition for places means nothing if Moyes picks all the usual suspects again and again.
Alan Feehely
45 Posted 10/02/2012 at 23:16:41
45 Posted 10/02/2012 at 23:16:41
At center-half, I would like to try out a Jags-Heitinga partnership.
Distin is without doubt an outstanding defender, but his contract is up at the end of the season, and at 34 how likely is it he will get a new deal?
Heitinga meanwhile has probably been our best player of 2012, really proving that center-half and not central midfielder his his best position.
With rumors of Spartak Moscow interested in Heitinga, we should give him a starting place in the starting XI for the rest of the season, and leave Sylvain ride off into the sunset, replacing him with another young defender.
Distin is without doubt an outstanding defender, but his contract is up at the end of the season, and at 34 how likely is it he will get a new deal?
Heitinga meanwhile has probably been our best player of 2012, really proving that center-half and not central midfielder his his best position.
With rumors of Spartak Moscow interested in Heitinga, we should give him a starting place in the starting XI for the rest of the season, and leave Sylvain ride off into the sunset, replacing him with another young defender.
Ian Smitham
46 Posted 10/02/2012 at 23:23:48
46 Posted 10/02/2012 at 23:23:48
I wrote on here a few days ago that I would make JH Captain. watched him coaching Duffy through a game, Pip is an organiser and a talker on the pitch, but simply not good enough as a player. JH, as others have said, has been our best player this season, has world Cup experience and is a whole lot better player than the "red card" waiting to happen player of two years ago.
I would play him and Duffy as Duffy seems to be up to it, tall, strong, and talks. The latter being a missing feature of many of the squad
I have said it before, nothing against Jags, but sell NOW before he is too old, cash in on a top last ditch defender. Get the money and save the wages and secure Duffy.
Cheers
I would play him and Duffy as Duffy seems to be up to it, tall, strong, and talks. The latter being a missing feature of many of the squad
I have said it before, nothing against Jags, but sell NOW before he is too old, cash in on a top last ditch defender. Get the money and save the wages and secure Duffy.
Cheers
Peter Barry
47 Posted 11/02/2012 at 02:31:10
47 Posted 11/02/2012 at 02:31:10
Howard Don ? Definition of a Moyesophile:
"One that still believes Dour Davey is doing a good job with an almost religious fervor despite all the evidence to the contrary."
We are, as you say, 'potless' despite having the third longest serving and third best paid manager in the Premier League. So, unless you are one of those who think that just getting in to the top half of the Premier League and avoiding relegation is success, good luck.
But to the rest of us, tactically inept Dire Dour Davey is a colossal failure putting out unmotivated teams every week to play tactically defense dictated DROSS.
"One that still believes Dour Davey is doing a good job with an almost religious fervor despite all the evidence to the contrary."
We are, as you say, 'potless' despite having the third longest serving and third best paid manager in the Premier League. So, unless you are one of those who think that just getting in to the top half of the Premier League and avoiding relegation is success, good luck.
But to the rest of us, tactically inept Dire Dour Davey is a colossal failure putting out unmotivated teams every week to play tactically defense dictated DROSS.
Peter Barry
48 Posted 11/02/2012 at 02:39:45
48 Posted 11/02/2012 at 02:39:45
Oh and to all those Moyesophiles who make the excuses that Dour Dire Davey has not had any money to spend. Please reconcile that fact with the clubs who have spent even less than we have who are above us and whose managers earn a fraction of the obscene £67,000 a WEEK that non performing Davey does.
James Flynn
49 Posted 03/03/2012 at 06:23:15
49 Posted 03/03/2012 at 06:23:15
Peter (890) - Why waste the many Ds in your last sentence. That's 3 more of them to add to "dire, dour" etc.
Martin Mason
50 Posted 03/03/2012 at 08:14:22
50 Posted 03/03/2012 at 08:14:22
If I could offer some criticism of DM it is reall around Johnny Heitinga. J8MM that has really been lying around wasted since he was bought. All it needed was a decent run in his best position and both he and the team have benefited. With Duffy around now we have one too many central defenders and we could sell one whther its Jags or Johnny. When you see our problem debt of say J40MM 20% could have been solved by better handling of Heitingas talents? I believe that his instinct on buys is second to none and his management of the buys when he has them is questionable. I'd expect to see Jelavic on the bench for a few months
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1 Posted 07/02/2012 at 16:52:28
I agree with almost all that. Only thing I'd change is being a bit more adventureous at home.