United plan second bid for Fellaini

If he's goin then get it done ASAP so bobby can get in couple quality midfielders, knowing kenwright will be hour to go on deadline day felli will go n well get sissoko on loan..

This has to be Bollocks. This is a 25 year old established international with 3 years left on his contract who cost £15m when he was basically an unknown 20 year old? If the market values Willian at £30m then Fellaini has to be at least that.

It should be £25 million plus a player. Not just a squad player. Maybe Kagawa or Hernandez. Ideally, someone as good as Fellaini but minus the attitude. I understand Rooney is looking to leave Man Ure.

I reckon they'll bid around 22m. Not sure if it will be accepted or even if I want it to or not.

I've always thought he was a fantastic player and we would undoubtedly miss his physical presence even though he doesn't always move the ball all around quickly or accurately enough to suit Martinez' system. We also probably lose 10 goals a season if he goes which I can't see McCarthy replacing though obviously he's a different type of player.

I do think its important that Martinez puts his own stamp on the team as the 11 in the first 2 games were very much Moyes' boys and so to that extent maybe Fella's leaving would facilitate RM bringing in some fresh blood to mould this new team he is building.

Seriously Matt. I'm still having trouble understanding the panic about him leaving. In order for the move to happen, a big bid over 30 million has to come in. We hold all the power because the release clause is gone, Fellaini's got 3 years left, and we have no reason to sell this late in the window. To add to your point about Willian, Lamela is valued the same and he's much more unproven. At least Willian killed Chelsea in the CL with Shaktar. For some reason the valuation of Everton players becomes discounted in the media. I don't get it. We finished 6th in the best league in the world, beating the last two champions in the process. If our top performers were shit, we wouldn't be where we are now. The papers would have you believe we're gonna sell Fellaini and buy McCarthy for the same price! It's preposterous.

I agree with Chris Stubbs, £25m plus one of their players like Hernandez. Anything less and we'd lose out after paying off agents, former clubs etc...

Peter Jones,
"For some reason the valuation of Everton players becomes discounted in the media. "
It's because all the world and his wife, dog and cat know that with Kenwright in charge we haven't got the proverbial pot to piss in and will sell in order to appease the banks.

How to deal with a transfer approach in less than 60 second.

Martinez office.

Phone: "Bring-briiiing....bring-briiiing" (er..it's an old 1970s phone).

Roberto: "YELLLOH"

Moyes: "25 mill for Fellaini?"

Roberto: "No way Joe!"

Moyes: "Well..erm...whit DAE yez want?"

Roberto: "£30m"

Moyes: "Away tae fuck!!"

Roberto: "Suit yourself, it's that or nada, if you change your mind get back to me, if not, have a good season" - click -

Ok, maybe that's oversimplification, but it makes MUCH more sense to me than weeks and weeks (and fucking weeks!) of fart-arsing about, whispering campaigns, press speculation and secret squirrels.

Yes we know (as it's us and we need money) ALL our players are for sale but they must surely all have a price too.

So why not just say what the price is and if you're not prepared to pay, do one.

It would remove all that "If they offer that" or "if we accept this" or "I think he's worth that" nonsense.

For me, the sensible option would be to appoint Neville Southall as chief negotiator ....

Meanwhile Kenwright gets on the blower to Wigan.

"Dave, it's BK, we want to talk about McCarthy - do you accept to reverse the charges?"

If anyone thinks we are going to get anything near £25m plus Hernandez they are in wonderland. I would say that £25m cash is the absolute tops we will get and I would be astonished if BK did not sell for anything that was over the expired release clause of £23.5m.

His value and ability has been talked down all summer.

He's a match winner, box to box midfielder (of which there are few), international in a fantastic team. Pretty much un-markable at times, scores goals, makes tackles, holds up the ball, defends corners, can act as a target man...

Anything less than £25m in todays market and we've been done.

£30m and I don't think we could complain too much.

And don't pay £15m for McCarthy, that's ludicrous.

One report is saying that Man Ure are having a punt at Mesut Ozil, as he has spat his dummy out, presumably over the impending arrival of Bale. Now, if this is true, surely Moyes would not pursue Fellaini as well.
Arsenal, on the other hand, who still, have not signed anyone of note, could still put in a late bid for him.
We seem to be linked with all sorts now, and there are reports that Newcastle are favourites to sign James McCarthy, as Roberto has denied that we have even bid for him.
I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm getting pretty fed up now with speculation after speculation, red herrings, blue kippers, I hope this transfer window business in future, is shut before the season kicks off.

We won't get what we deserve for him because we are Everton and we have absolutely no business acumen whatsoever.

If he does go for £25m that says that Gareth Bale is 4 times the player he is, Suarez is worth at least £15m more & a load of unproven PL players signed this season are worth more than him

When Moyes was told Mourinho had said the player had to come out and tell him whether he wanted the move or not, Moyes said "Well that would be illegal wouldn't it"

This is after talking about our players openly, and no doubt making contact with the players himself.

He is without doubt a liar, and his double standards are laughable. The man is clearly out of his depth.

I loathed Whelan's continuous spouting in the press during the summer over Martinez etc but how I would like just ONE positive spout from BK right now on this transfer business.

He is the custodial chairman of our club and he has a new manager to back - for goodness sake BK, come out and back your manager and tell him he doesn't have to sell unless it is for 35m and the deal is done within 48 hours (a la Mourinho re Rooney) so he can buy a replacement before the blinking window shuts.

Or am I just looking for rainbows on a sunny day?

If Man Utd were unwilling to meet the £23m clause there is no way they will pay more now, unless all their other targets fall through and they are desperate. I don't think we can afford to sell for less than £25m considering the investment we have put into Fellaini in transfer fees, add ons, wages, development and also considering his sell on clause with Liege. To me this all points to him staying, unless he throws a massive wobbly and refuses to play. I'm not 100% convinced on his temperament, but I can't see him doing this, especially not in a world cup year.

Considering that his potential replacement, McCarthy, would be coming from the Championship and would cost something in the £15m region I think anything less than £25m would be terrible business for us. If he goes we should look at replacing him with a first team midfielder and another striker. However, finding a striker that would be better than Jevavic and Kone on our budget and who would be willing to join us is no mean feat. I wouldn't want us to waste the money on someone of comparable talent to the ones we already have as we will then just have more strikers sitting on the bench. What realistic strikers are there out there?

I remember we were being linked with Negredo a way back, but I now see that was never a realistic option. We were only offering half of what he went for, and he was obviously looking for CL football. What we need is a Benteke / Michu type signing, but where might we find such a bargain striker?

Drew - Looks like Demba Ba will be surplus to requirements at Chelsea, did they pay IRO £8m for him?

He would do nicely.

Drew 331

I agree and it's not just about looking for someone with an eye for goal, we need someone who knows where to be to score goals (a la Jelavic when he first came).

Having said that, we create virtually nothing for him throughout a game and moan when misses a scrap of a chance. Better supply is just as important in my opinion.

When we took Fellaini he cost us with add - ons 16 - 17 mil. and I suppose you all remember he was not the player he is today. In my eyes for 1,5 year he was a flop. He developed, he bacame the player he is and anything less than 30 mil would be laughable. Not because 20 mil or 25 mil are little money but because I am sick Everton to be the only team with undervalued players. I hear silly money in the market for average or upcoming players like mc carthy (15 mil!!! - no way!!!) and then I hear 20 mil for Fellaini and I feel sorry for us...I wish we had the balls and unfortunately I have to admit I also wish we had the money to tell anyone who don't respect us to f..k off. Money of course don't grow balls, either you have them or you don't and the reason I feel sorry for us is because I don't trust our board has a pair...

Lakovos (#339)
You are right about the board not having a pair of balls...................... but they have tits!

We have striker already signed, Kone, he will do the job for us.
In the West Brom game he only came on late, but every time he touched the ball he made a telling pass or looked a danger to their defence, he'll do for me.

As for Fellaini, its a waste of time keeping a player who wants to be elsewhere.
Moyes will look silly if he paid over £23m for him now, but it could happen if he's desperate enough very late on in the window!
I would like him to stay, if he still wants to, but on the other hand Roberto desperately need some cash.

Comparing the price for Willian is a little misleading as players who go to City and Chelsea will have their price upped due to those surplus cash mountains these clubs have.

Everton though, more than any team in the Prem would have hit the jackpot with the new Sky money and feel they have no reason to sell unless the Afro starts grumbling away.

Fellaini is more important than Baines. You can't get a ready made player like that to come to Everton who will give the solidity and presence lacking in the team.

Keep both and carry on... Maybe that should be on a tea towel.

Martinez has denied a bid - he says no selling either. "We are very, very strong financially" quoted on SKY.

Roberto if we really are financially strong why are stumbling on with Osman in midfield? Why have we not moved for anyone in that crucial area? I hope I do not feel confident about it.

What we paid for him is irrelevant..

Anything around 20 million and we will take it. I'll not lose any sleep over him going. In fact, I think if we add someone decent in midfield we'll be a better unit..

More bullshit drom the Spanish maestro. He's bought into Project Kenwright with a vengeance but will pay the price if it all gets passed down the pan.

Fellaini will go for anything over £20 M.'The lad had his heart set on it,you know,and it would cruel to hold him back.' -Around noon on 2nd Sep !

"Everton though, more than any team in the Prem would have hit the jackpot with the new Sky money"
---------------

Have I missed something?

20 mil ?

No need for Utd to negotiate, let the Everton fans do it for them !

Nick

Have to disagree for me Fellaini is nowhere near in the same league as Baines either in talent or importance to Everton. Baines in my opinion is the best left back in the Prem, I don't think Fellaini would be in anybodys top 10 of midfield players.

I have no qualms about him going as long as we look at better options than McCarthy, and I would not give Whelan another chance to conduct our business via SSN. Knowing Whelan he will want as much of the Fellaini money that he can get, and for a very average midfield player.

Moyes is under even more pressure now to bring players after the Chelsea game therefore Fellaini can only be allowed to go for 25 million, we are under no pressure......make JUDAS pay 1.

Phil Walling

Any chance of you taking a day off from this little vendetta you're pursuing?

Brian, well, best he may be. But you don't win games due to your left back. The system he was working in with Pienaar is brilliant, (though there was lots of ex-pro pundits at the weekend saying Martinez no longer deploys this on either flank) and Oviedo would be able to keep closer to the standard of Baines compared to the hole in midfield that would happen if say McCarthy came in for Big Bird. All my amateur opinion of course...

Ciarán, we've been hamstrung by the banks for seasons. Zero transfer kitty five out of seven windows, zero net only in the other two... not counting this summer of course.

The extra money this season allows more freedom... comparatively... for Everton than any other club. Again, just my amateur opinion...

Garry, 357 - it is just a question of how much Fellaini goes for (important as that is), it is a question of WHEN he goes!

If he goes late on the 2nd September, the money appears to be less important because we will have run out of time to replace him.

For me, the sensible option would be to appoint Neville Southall as chief negotiator ....

Eugene, I'd prefer if Martinez shouted down the phone that surreal chant you made up. What was it? A cloud! A cloud! A egg!

Dave Richman, I fully agree with your suggestion.

Why this has not been implemented is beyond me

Nick you may not win games directly with your left back but compare his goal assists to the rest of the team and Fellaini and you can't ignore his importance to the team

Grab the bull by the horns - phone em up and say - "it's £30m cash up front and you've got till the weekend. If it happens after Saturday it's £35m. If this call goes public it's £35m. If it happens on transfer deadline day it's £40m. If you don't like it fuck off!"

Yup, that would do for me Alisdair. With a very accentuated "FUCK OFF"

Straight swap - Fellaini for Rooney. Then we can sell big Vic and Jela and maybe afford McCarthy into the bargain.

The extra money this season allows more freedom... comparatively... for Everton than any other club. Again, just my amateur opinion...

-------------------

If that's indeed the case then why have we spent sod all (by my reckoning we've probably spent about 2-3 mill)?

My guess is that the new money was well and truly spent on servicing the debt some time ago..

Exactly, Ciarán. No need to sell Fellaini. The banks are placated. For now.

The banks may be placated...is our midfield requirements placated?

I suppose it depends on whether you think Fellaini can pull his weight..

Then that's up to Martinez to consider the sell to buy option. They're now no longer the sell to... do absolutely nothing club. Such as when Arteta, Vaughan and others left for £17m in one year and not a penny was reinvested.

All options open.

I think Fellaini will go for around £25m. However £7m of that will be add ons. That way Moyes can say he only paid £18m, Bill can say it was a '£10m deal of a lifetime profit' and Martinez can say he is happy now he has managed to bring in Barry and Heskey on loan with the money he has been given.

Ciaran the German at it again

"...whether you think Fellaini can pull his weight"

He was our top scorer last season and is our most sought after player. The belguim team is built around him. What more evidence do you need?

And your moaning about how much we've spent when the window hasn't even shut yet. There's bound to be a player coming in on TDD wether Fellaini leaves or not. If Chelsea do more business Ba or Moses could become available or RM may get that winger from Valencia.

We have 4 CM Fellaini, Osman, Gibson and Barkley and Heightinga can play there. All internationals except Barkley who will be. Why the panic?

Is it because you play champo and these average players Norwich, Swansea and Southampton have bought are good on it?

If Dave's suggestion of Neville Southall isn't available, then I'd like to nominate Alisdair at #377 for our negotiator!

Nick has a point - we had an operating loss of around £10m a year before this "windfall". We've reduced our wage bill with the change of manager, and we're able to spend around £7m in transfer fees this season. I'm guessing they might be using some of the rest of it to pay down some debt, which begs the question why was the Vibrac loan renewed?

Of course, other clubs are laughing all the way to the bank too. The RS, with both games so far, plus their next, on live, are already nearly £3m extra to the good. Keep that going and they'll wipe out the losses on Downing and Carroll in another 12 years.

Alan,

Firstly, i'm not German...

Secondly, Our 'most sought after player' - is a rather meaningless phrase and is also incorrect as there's been two bids for Baines and only one for Fellaini...

Thirdly, the Belgium team is NOT built around him in any shape or form.. In fact, he's probably the worst starting midfielder they have! (and he's only recently been getting a starting spot)

Frankly you live in cloud cuckoo land..you've spent the last month bleating on about the 'new TV money'...and despite our financial model and position being explained to you several times..the penny still hasn't dropped!

We are severely short in centre midfield- that fact isn't changed because you think Osman's an international!

Nick Entwistle

"But you don't win games due to your left back."

He created the most chances in top-flight European football last season, but don't let that cloud your judgement. Yeah fucking useless left backs, never win you anything. I reckon we should just do way with them altogether. Just bang another striker up there and hope for the best.

Alan Smith

I love how you've thrown in that Belgium have built their team around Fellaini. It's as though you think you can just slip it in there and nobody will even question it. Sadly, it has not gone too well for you though as everybody knows that Fellaini is quite often not even in their first eleven.

A good player, but maybe reign in those 'facts' that you dream up to support your argument.

Supporters are talking about buying varios players coming in if we sell Faliani.

The majority of supporters however realise that with the finacial structure within Everton you will have to hire sherlock holmes to find out were the transfer fee goes.

The major problem that I can see is trying to sign players of the calibre we need is the outlandish wages they demand.

A perfect example of this is G Barry who ia available on loan but we cant afford his wages.

Phil... yeah right, I've been thinking he's Tony Hibbert all along.

I did qualify what I said afterwards, but hey...

But yes, a Belgian I know, with similar hair says Fellaini is a bench warmer.

Based on the inflated prices going round this Summer, Fellaini really should be a £30m fee.

What I can't understand though is why we would pay anything like £15m for McCarthy. Half that at most I'd say. Playing for some Scottish minnows and a relegated Wigan team is hardly a CV to drool over is it? And before anybody mentions playing for Ireland, Kevin Kilbane won over 100 caps for them, and that's when they were half decent, so that doesn't make a lot of difference does it, even if Zinedane is a really nice fella.

He starts most of the games for belguim. No way is he their worst mid(hes better than dememble who is also class) and there have been two bids for him...arsenal and utd. He has 47 caps. He has 7 goals, more than any current Belgian midfielder.

And who are you to explain our financial position to me? Do you work for Everton and have access to the accounts? I only suggested that we could increase our wage bill slightly by £3.5m, which given the increase in TV revenue and the information given at the EGM is viable.

You on the other hand talk about "placating the banks" when we owe the money to VIBRAC. I an no financial expert, but if we are servicing the debt at a cost of £4m a year, then I don’t think it’s time to start panicking yet. Every club has debt and £4m a year out of an £83m(soon to be £100m plus) turn over isn’t the verge of bankruptcy you constantly peddle

You are a German! You talk about banks, Evertons accounts, players youve never watched more than once or twice or never, like medal, bony, lovren and Fer.

Do you play Champo? is that we’re you do your scouting?

1) I am happy with our team and the 4 players we’ve brought in, inc. Fellaini and think this squad can finish top 6, top 7 easy.

2) I think we will finish above Swansea, west brom, and Southampton.

3) I think our wage bill will increase by £3.5m this season and we won’t go into receivership.

You have consistently argued against these 3points and you don’t rate Fellaini. IMHO I think your a German who spends 5 hrs a day on Champo.

Osmans our 4th best CM and is good player who gives his all for Everton. The teams you gone about would love Osman in their squad. Swansea your favourite team play Nathan Dyer regularly.

Whether you'd be happy or not to see Fellaini and/or Baines go, or whatever you think a fair price, if either of them or both were to leave now, it would mean a lot of what was tried pre-season would have been a complete waste of time.

I mean we're not talking about two fringe players, we're talking about (when fit) two definites who have a lot of say in how we attack and defend.

If they go now, the next 6 games or so are basically another pre-season, learning how things work with their replacements (assuming - which we can't - there'll be any).

It would make loads more sense (for everyone!) if the transfer window opened a day after the season ended and closed on the last day of June.

The whole thing is a fucking joke and a huge distraction.

The managers imo should say to Sky (who appear to love it) "If you don't get together with the PL etc and move the thing forward, we will make a deal amongst ourselves to stop doing business two weeks early.

That'd put the block on "Only 42 days 7 hours and 23 minutes until the window slams shut" etc bollocks waffle blah.

The last post 414 was for the attention of Ciaren 402

Barkley in England squad

I don't understand how anyone can think that we will not miss Fellaini. Top scorer last year, can play in front of defence, centre mid, or upfront, (crucial flexibility in a small squad), and the only one with some height and bite in a mid-field of midgets. And he is one of Belgiums key players now, (if that is viewed as being important). The other point is the risk. Bring someone new in and that player may be better, or may well turn out worse, (more likely IMO).

Phil 403.

Downing created the most chances in the prem the season before last. No one is saying Baines is not a fantastic LB. but some people believe that Fellaini is just as good a CM and therefore can be more influential in terms of dictating the play and dominating midfield.

On Fellaini I did not dream up those facts. He has started 5 of 7 qualifiers, has 47 caps, 7 goals and started the last game against France. Judging by the only full Belguim game I watched versus England, he was clearly their main man. How many belguim games have you watched? And who is their main midfielder IYHO?

Alan, increasing the wage bill may not be as simple as it sounds in the season that the Financial Fair Play rules are introduced. The club is already running at an annual loss so to increase the amount of the wage bill against turnover is asking for trouble

Firstly, Arsenal never bid for him..

Secondly....You stated Belgium built there team around him..that's nonsense...Witsel, Defour, Hazard are far more competent and consistent midfielders..

Thirdly, I don't need to work for Everton to see the accounts.

Fourthly, Our debt is not costing us 4million a year...We are making a loss or 4 million a year. Quite stunning difference.

Fifthly, I've never talked about Lovren or Fer on this site once...stop making shit up.

Sixthly, How do you know what players I've seen?

Seventhly (probably sic), We owe to a lot more people than Vibrac..

Eightly, I never have, and never will play championship manager (I do like a bit of God of War though!)

Ninthly, I don't think ive ever mentioned Swansea - again stop making shit up!

I haven't seen to much of Belgium but they have such a fantastic selection of midfielders I would guess they all take their turn on the bench from time to time. Miralles is by no means a regular starter though

Alan

How many Belgium games have I seen? A damn sight more than you by the sounds of it! One bloody game you've seen and yet you confidently assert that Belgium are building a team around Fellaini.

As for your stats - well Leon Osman plays nearly every game for us...are we building a team around him?

I don't even disagree with your point that Fellaini is a top player...but why throw in these ridiculous lies that everyone knows to be bollocks.

No Ciaren

The money we pay to investors/banks we borrow the money off is around £4m a year. Or that's what was said at the EGM.

Defour and hazard(winger) have been on the bench for certain games. And Witsel has also played wide and sometimes RWB. Why aren't Man U signing defour?

"Thirdly I don't need to work for Everton to see the accounts" explain them in detail then. All I know is we make a small loss or break even every year. Even though we have a small squad we have the seventh biggest wage bill. We finished sixth and have signed four good players.

Haha god of war...quality!

How many times have you watched belguim then? Your always listing players from other shit sides likes Swansea, Southampton etc complaining they've bought and we have only spent £6m or whatever. Get a grip mate.

Barkleys in the England squad now. I player I said two months was good enough to start the season for us but got shot down on here.

I give up.

If we put a clause in Fellis contract pf £23.5m thrn that surely is what we valued him at. Moyes will know this so why would he bid more than our valuation?

Fuck off Kenwright.

Sorry, keyboard Tourettes

Because he didn't want to buy him when the clause was set,now he has missed out on ALL his other targets the sky is the limit price wise 😃
Apparently

Stu Smith (442) - "If we put a clause in Fellis contract pf £23.5m thrn that surely is what we valued him at. Moyes will know this so why would he bid more than our valuation?"

Here is why.

It is a matter of record that Moyes wanted the 'valuation' (re the get-out clause) to be £30m, THAT is the figure HE put to Fellaini.

Fellaini and/or his advisors/agent refused.

£23.5m was NOT a valuation, it was simply where both sides 'met in the middle' - a figure both sides (eventually) agreed on so Fellaini would sign his contact.

But the important thing to remember is MOYES wanted it to be £30m and that is why Everton FC should have the plums to say..

"The valuation of Marouane Fellaini is £30m. That valuation was arrived at by David Moyes when he was the manager of Everton FC. The fact that David Moyes is now the manager of another team, does not in our opinion affect that valuation by one penny, unless it's a higher figure and ESPECIALLY if it is David Moyes that wants to buy the player"

Phil Sammon and Ciaren

thats right one belguim game ive watched against England. Ive watched a lot of their players in the the prem and Witsel who is probably their best player in europe a few times(plays wide right for zenit, did in portugul and for Liege). I remember defour from his stanard liege days was not as good as Fellaini, 4 full games I watched, 2 v RS,2v us. Basically when those players faced English sides.

Why the fuck would I be watching all of Belguims games?

In the game and highlights I've watched Belguim, Fellaini was at the centre of everything. We will see what impact he has at the World Cup.

So now your watching every Belguim and Everton game and so is Ciaren. Not mention all the prem league matches you watch, along with every second of Germany's games, and you still find time to comment on here. FFS ciaren still finds time to play God of War....well done, ill concede to your greater knowledge.

What does concern me though is your reluctance to answer direct questions and just give up.
So we will have to see who is right next summer. I predict;

Our wage bill will have gone up at the next AGM and so to will our turn over.

Fellaini will be Belguims main CM at the World Cup.

We will finish top 7

We wont go Bankrupt if we add to the Squad.

The German has argued against all of this and now Champ Manager Phil wants to have a go. Put your computer games away, put Evertons accounts down and go and give your Boyfriend some attention. We will see who is right soon enough.

The Sky Sports bit titled "Everton Don't Need to Sell" is under their "Championship" heading not Premiership! Premature (or written by Phil W.? sorry, Phil, I don't dislike your posts).

Did the article mention the words "tippy tappy" or "Wigan" Brent? If it did, it was definitely written by Mr Walling.

Blimey, Alan,

You sound like Doddy from 2005-12

I appreciate you like having a go and think yer right but fuck off with your "German" comments.

it simply is not clever or funny and adds little to the points you're trying to make.

Eugene

You try telling that to Paul Andrews.

Alan

Why would you be watching Belgium games?

Well you're the one who stated that they built a team around Fellaini. I didn't think someone would put forward such a notion without having a fair knowledge of the Belgian side.

Yes, believe it or not I've probably seen a handful of Belgium's games over the last two or three years. Where do I find the time?!

Phillipa,

He would be better telling that to Mr Chairman.
Not a fucking chance Blue Bill will make that statement

Get Southall in to negotiate transfers for players leaving... Stick Moyes in a room with him and lock the door!!

Is there actually any truth in Standard Liege getting part of Fellaini's sell on Fee? Iv'e heard 2 contrasting stories. If its true, its an absolute joke! What the fuck was we playing at?! To pay £15 million for a young prospect playing in poor league was bizzare in the first place... but then to offer them part of a sell on fee is absolutely ludicrous. I despair!

No to McCarthy. He is not an adequate replacement and is worth 5 mil tops.

At the end of every season Fergie used to ask his squad which player caused you the most problems. Then he'd buy that player. Something similar is going on here plus DM is probably shitting himself that MF will have another great game against them when we stuff them at OT. Imagine how embarrassed he'd be!

Also, it's quite possibly Utd's biggest transitional season since Busby and with Spurs, chelsea, man city splashing the cash and an improving RS, missing out on CL could cost them £20-60m.

So...
£30m for Moyes' own valuation.
£20-60m for increase in potential revenue.
£5m for us to keep quiet about the tapping up.
£5m for being late in the window.
£3m because we know they have money.
£10m Judas tax.

Then we can say 'ok dickheads, let's meet in the middle. We can't say fairer than that'.

I cannot understand the fascination with James McCarthy. Yes, he has potential but far from being a top class midfielder. I have been very disappointed with his performances with Ireland and imo anything over £7 million for him would be a huge gamble — And that's coming from an Irishman.

Just been reading this:
Manchester United are believed to have had a £20m bid for Marouane Fellaini accepted by Everton, according to reports.

The deal is currently unconfirmed by either club, but is thought to be worth an initial fee of £20m, which will rise to £24m.

MORE: Wayne Rooney won’t ask Manchester United for Chelsea move

Former Everton boss David Moyes has been keen on both Fellaini and left-back Leighton Baines following him to Manchester United from Goodison Park all summer, but infuriated bosses at his old club with a joint bid of £35m last week.

Doubting that source Mark. The bid was more like £28M wasn't it?

Just seen that in the Metro

Well it's just been on Sky News £23M would be the figure Man Utd are thinking towards. I would say £28M. If they what him, or should I say Moyes wants him, well pay up. If sold I, think he'll go for the clause amount of £23M. Although that's not in play now.

It's obvious Moyes waited until July was out of the way, thinking he could get him for a knock down price. With McCarthy in RMs sight and the window coming to an end, well he probably thought RM would snap his Hand off with shit and insulting bid he made.

That was good to hear, that Moyes first home match was the first 0-0 since 2009. Well let's hope it continues in that vein and the Man Utd fans turn on him. I was in a cab the other night and the driver was Man Utd supporter. He said the Man Utd fans expect to win the Premier League again... and, if they don't, Moyes will get an almighty backlash.

Phil Sammon. Yes your right, 28 million. Not 35 million.

If all this is true thenn did people really expect him to go for more than his release clause? I know the market's inflated a bit but he is just not worth more than about 20 million. The reality is that we grossly overpaid for him in the first place due to panic buying. We should bite their hands off. If Moyes doesn't buy him no one else will be stupid ennough to pay that price.

James Martin - "the reality is we grossly overpaid for him"

Complete bollocks imo.

You say the market's Inflated?

Well inflated or not, it is what it is and in THIS market, Fellaini is EASILY worth £30m.

Forget for a moment he plays for us - now imagine he plays for Chelsea and Real Madrid want him - still £20m?

Plus the ONLY feller who wants to buy him has already valued him at £30m - still think £20m?

And strikers Carroll £35m and Torres £50m (in this inflated market) were both outscored by Fellaini in the PL last season - still £20?

Someone posted yesterday that they felt Fellaini had been constantly undersold/underpriced by the media and some Evertonians (and obviously NOW Moyes) and I couldn't agree more.

Here's what I think 'the reality' is - the constant chipping away at our status since the start of the PL, means some Evertonians are prepared to say 'yeah take what you want and just give us what you like'.

I don't think he's a genius player but I really hope we keep him for one reason.

If he goes to Utd, Everton simply appear (once again!) to be a piss-weak club who say about our players "He's not going anywhere!!!"...before selling.

Again, death by a thousand cuts.

Tell Moyes, 20 million is OK...... PLUS Kagawa ! Ha ! Buy McCarthy for 10 million, Moses for 6 million and 4 million to the banks. 3 players for 1 (of course, wages would increase, but only marginally I would imagine).

How's this for Everton's team in the future?

Howard
Coleman, Stones, Jagielka, Baines
Kagawa, McCarthy, Barkley
Mirallas, Kone, Moses

Bench: Robles, Distin, Heitinga, Alcaraz, Hibbert, Oviedo, Pienaar, Osman, Gibson, Deulofeu, Anichebe, Jelavic.

Good to dream, isn't it?

Tell Moyes, 20 million is OK...... PLUS Kagawa ! Ha ! Buy McCarthy for 10 million, Moses for 6 million and 4 million to the banks. 3 players for 1 (of course, wages would increase, but only marginally I would imagine).

How's this for Everton's team in the future?

Howard
Coleman, Stones, Jagielka, Baines
Kagawa, McCarthy, Barkley
Mirallas, Kone, Moses

Bench: Robles, Distin, Heitinga, Alcaraz, Hibbert, Oviedo, Pienaar, Osman, Gibson, Deulofeu, Anichebe, Jelavic.

Good to dream, isn't it?

I fully agree with you Eugene (742). Given the currently stupid prices being quoted for players, and the possible arrival of the first €100m player value - Fellaini is worth substantially more than 20million. A midfielder who routinely knocks in 10 goals a season...

The supply and demand would also suggest that to Everton, a club who doesn't have a 10 goal a year player other than Fellaini, his value is more than that.

I would question any board who would sanction the sale of Fellaini for less that the release clause price. To me it suggest that there is an underlying motive that EFC want shot of him - be this for money reasons or whatever. Either way, I find it laughable that the team at Spurs can negotiate extortionate values for their players, and we have trouble giving away our most valuable assets.

It really sticks in my craw when you hear the stupid remarks from across the park that Suarez is a 60million pound player - someone at Everton should be on the BBC saying that Fellaini is a 40million pound player - we should be playing him up, raising the price and not permitting the media to downplay the value of the players in this club.

To be honest - i'm not convinced Moyes actually wants him..

All this and the BBC Gossip column has Joey Barton in as Fellaini's replacement!!!

The flaw in the arguement about Fellani's market value is that he had a release clause upto a couple of weeks ago valuing him at £23m yet not one club sought to trigger that clause. Why? Because clearly felt that he wasn't worth it. Alternatively, someone with insider knowledge of the club's finances (say a former manager) could have thought that there was no point in bidding whilst that clause existed as they know hat they can get him for less once it expires?

Chris - (772) - "The flaw in the arguement about Fellani's market value is that he had a release clause upto a couple of weeks ago valuing him at £23m yet not one club sought to trigger that clause. Why? Because clearly felt that he wasn't worth it".

It WASN'T a valuation.

One more time - It is a matter of record that Moyes wanted the 'valuation' (re the get-out clause) to be £30m - THAT is the figure HE put to Fellaini.

Fellaini and/or his advisors/agent refused.

£23.5m was NOT a valuation, it was simply where both sides 'met in the middle' - a figure both sides (eventually) agreed on so Fellaini would sign his contact.

You could still say "Ah yes but so what, nobody even wants him for 23.5"

True (so far) but here's the rub.

Nobody wants him for 23.5 (roll on the drums) FROM US!

Everton aside - clubs aren't stupid and when other clubs come for Everton players, they are no doubt thinking (AS MOYES IS!) "They don't have a pot to piss in, all their assets are on the pitch, they'll huff and puff but they've got bills to pay and we'll get our man for a price that suits us".

We are NOT Spurs, we are run by a clown who, in these situations, has left us like a mouse confronted by a hawk.

The question is not 'What is the player's value?', it is (obviously!) 'What will Everton accept?' - two VERY different things.

I really hope we keep him, but my guess is we'll lose him, not get anywhere near £30m and be left with no time to replace him.

That would certainly be the Everton way

Chris #772 - they could've got him for less when the clause was in place, had we been happy to accept whatever the offer was.

The only thing expiry of the clause does is remove the player the choice to walk out of his contract should the clause be met.

There is no valuation by Everton as they have said they do not want to sell and haven't as of yet put a price on the player.

Moyes has offered £16m but its fair to say he values the player higher than this due to the valuation he put on him at Everton.

Until Everton put a value on him, and a club are willing to meet it, the only value Fellaini has is what he can offer us on the pitch.

From the minute Martinez sat down at his first press conference, teary bollocks actually put Fellaini up for sale then. (That's if he wasn't already hawking him round)

Why mention buy-out clauses of individual players at the new manager's unveiling FFS?

Our teary friend knew we only had a minimal budget to offer the new manager, and was even quoted as saying "Roberto can have 100% of funds raised from players leaving." What a guy - we are so lucky not to have some Johnny Foreigner here. A true fan in charge.

It's all being played out right in front of us, deals and fees arranged behind closed doors weeks or months ago.

The original offer made was only to make tiny tears look like we squeezed every last penny out of the Fellaini deal.

Kenwright will never, ever come out and say anything derogatory about Moyes, he knows Moyes is only one book deal away from blowing the lid off his tinpot empire.

If we knew the truth about the lies, cover up's and mis-information we have been fed, I think a lot of people would have to leave these shores.

Then again....he's one of us.

A couple of points:-

Eugene, whether Moyes valued Fellani at £50m, £30m or whatever didn't matter because, whilst there was the £23.5m clause in place (for whatever reason it ended up in his contract) that was his effective maximum market value regardless as no one would have paid more than that whilst it existed.

This brings me on to Mike (809) - I agree that he could have been sold for less than this clause whilst the clause existed but he wasn't. Everton do have a valuation of him and Martinez effectively said as much last week when admitting that every "player has a price". I'm pretty much sure that Everton's price for Fellani is far nearer the previous release clause price than the figure many fans would want to achieve for him. I'm also pretty sure that our former manager is well aware of this and he probably discussed it with Kenwright as to what offers would be acceptable for each player whilst he was still our manager. indeed in wouldn't surprise me if he still doing so during his regular chats he says him and Bill still have.

As such, I agree wth Eugene's statement that 'I really hope we keep him, but my guess is we'll lose him, not get anywhere near £30m and be left with no time to replace him.That would certainly be the Everton way.'

Kenwright will never, ever come out and say anything derogatory about Moyes, he knows Moyes is only one book deal away from blowing the lid off his tinpot empire.

---------------

Whenever Moyes came out with his 'I know how things work at Everton' statement - I read this as a threat to Kenwright...since then we've heard sod all..

We've went from the lofty position of 'Derisory and insulting' to tone deaf ...

With problem we're dealing with here is that United have never paid big money for players..they expect favours, and normally get them - they are not a Real Madrid or a Liverpool..

Chris #814 – I agree with much of what you say, and it just goes to show what a prick Moyes is for his opening bid of £16m + £12m for the pair – doesn’t it?

Ciarán (817) - You might have a (very good) point.

Chris (814) "Everton do have a valuation of him and Martinez effectively said as much last week when admitting that every "player has a price". I'm pretty much sure that Everton's price for Fellani is far nearer the previous release clause price than the figure many fans would want to achieve for him"

I'm sure you're right but..I'd love to know what is it.

This secret squirrels/Cairo market aspect of football drives me nuts and takes up so much bleeding time.

I mean how mad would it be to go into a shop, look at a wrist-watch, ask "How much is that one?" only to get the response "You tell me!"

And when you play along and say "Er..ok, 300 nicker" the feller responds "FUCK OFFFFF!! You're JOKING aren't you!?"

(nb: and the normal response to this would be "Well just tell me the fucking price nob-head!!")

So much of what goes on, in and around football and how so many people behave, reminds me of the carry-on you get from narky, pinched-faced, whispering teenage girls.

If people started acting like men instead, they might find they could say things like..

"EVERY player has a price. This particular player won't be sold for a carrot under £30m, if you're not prepared to pay it - DON'T call us" - Everton FC.

(love someone to tell me why exactly this would be so difficult)

Because we are skint?

Sam Wallace (the Independents lead football writer) on Twitter......Baines has asked Everton to agree a deal with Man United!!! Gutted If true.

BBC radio merseyside understand the same. Can't say I am surprised but gutting news.

Ciaran, very good point.

Well it has just said on BBC Radio Merseyside that Fellaini has gone for £20 mill and Baines has asked to sort a deal out. Kenwright, you are one back-stabbing shithouse, you are a disgrace to call yourself an Evertonian. Your aim is to get us relegated this year to get your greedy grubby hands on the £57 mill for getting relegated.

You and your ginger haired shithouse have dragged my beloved club to the gutter. You have got your ideal man in Martinez as he is a yes-man. After 50 years, I will not give you and your greedy buddy's another penny of my money, and I will not put another foot in Goodison Park till you have gone.

There is a saying: what goes around comes around; I cannot wait for the day you get yours.

I really do feel like asking for a refund for my season ticket. Until that twat Kenwright goes we'll be a second rate club.

They should tell them to put in a written request. It's like telling your boss you want to leave for a rival firm, but expect a redundancy pay-off beforehand.

Cunts. The lot of 'em.