Everton could move for Welbeck

No thanks.

Good athlete and OK running the channels/holding up ball for counter attacks but lacks guile when teammates are looking for a pass in to the box.

No thanks. Not good enough for them or us

Don't like him; never seems to have the composure in front of goal, or he tries to get too cute. How many breakaways did he get against Bayern Munich at OT? At least two and I remember the Pienaar-esque chip on one breakaway he blew. Plus, I want players who I can trust and if he's wanting out because of playing time, fine.

But, if he's leaving because Man U are struggling and he can't handle the negativity, then no thanks. We need players with strong personalities-guys who go into a slump and know they're going to fight their way out of it, or don't panic if the team loses form and press starts going against them. I never thought of Welbeck as having these traits.

Seems a little one dimensional to me for what he would probably cost, but that doesn't mean he couldn't be very effective if utilised in a very specific role.

Not wholely convinced he should be a priority target but would possibly work very well running off someone like Naismith, Osman or even a more mature and composed Ross Barkley.

Dude is amazing until he gets into the box.

True Peter Z. He's probably a good midfielder.

Always thought he was going to be a good prospect, but he's never gone past being a 'prospect'. He reminds me a bit of Anichebe, that he had a lot of potential, but it never materialised.

As we have noted many times. We no longer give permanent contracts to strangers. Even Messi would have to undergo the Martinez character assessment test. Our new boss will not risk dressing room or training ground upset. As an ex-professional player, he has probably seen the damage it can cause.

Welbeck seems nice enough though Harold ;)

Good link up player with plenty of energy but useless in front of goal.

A poor mans Sturridge.

Yes, but "seems" is not good enough for Martinez Peter. He knew all the Wigan lads and was well acquainted with McGeady thruogh our Irish boys and his own personal scouting. He now knows Lukaku, Deulofeu, Barry and Traore. The last named has been personally tutored on the history of Everton and the new football philosophy. Cleverley has already been assessed and the club will fill him in on Rodwell.

He has personally scouted certain players at Dundee United and Sunderland. Probably other places too. Our new boss is a young, intelligent, ambitious, gentleman who knows the exact shape of his missing jigsaw pieces and will not stop till the picture is complete.

If I could choose a reasonably priced player who would perform above his market value I would go for the 24yr old, 6'-1" Yannik Bolasie, the Palace rocket who ripped us apart and is nearing the end of his contract. Better than Mirallis, better than Delboy, this lad would be the answer to our prayers. OK, I know he loves London but Roberto would soon talk him round. What a gem. He murdered our whole defence on his own.

Harold, although Bolasie played well against us I watched the game with a palace fan who was most surprised. Apparently Bolasie usually has zero end product and is more of a poor mans Aaron Lennon. Not sure he's any better than Mirallas.

As for Welbeck, it depends on the price. People wrote off Sturridge when he moved to RS and look at him now. Welbeck has ability and could well prosper if made a regular starter which is something every footballer needs to give their best. I suspect Utd would want upwards of £12m for him and probably that's too much but I think he would do well at the likes of Newcastle/spurs/Southhampton. Now Hernandez...there's a player worth pushing out the boat for.

Wellbeck and Cleverley could be revelations under a manager who trusts them and instills confidence. The Manu player I would really like is Hernandez. He is the finished product.

I could almost write the same post on here as I did on the Cleverley thread, except I think Welbeck is a better player than Cleverley.

I think he's absolutely top class, and if given a run in a good side in his proper position would really show what he could do.

I don't know who blues expect us to sign, it seems anyone short of current Champions League Semi-Finalists are automatically written off. We have to do these kind of deals, we are limited in the type of player we can sign, and we have to sign unfulfilled potential and work with those players to release that potential. Cast-offs from richer clubs are an excellent way of doing this. We can't afford to buy 3 or 4 'sought after' players, this even includes some young players who are only potential at this stage.

These players have often been messed about, played in different positions, put in and out of the side, and importantly, not really coached as players because they are assumed to be good enough. Martinez could get hold of any one of about 20 players at Man United, Man City, Chelsea, Tottenham or Arsenal and make them a better player than they currently are now. The best thing about them is that having 'failed' to make it at their current club, they will genuinely have something to prove should they leave, and Everton, the club challenging the monopoly of the rich clubs, would be the perfect place to do it.

I mean, if Martinez can make a useful player out of Naismith, how much more could he do with someone as prodigiously talented as Danny Welbeck?

I do accept Harold's point about character. Each of these players would need to be judged in terms of whether they would be likely to respond in the 'something to prove' kind of way I've outlined or not.

Spot on Mike Allison. I’ve just read an article about how Roberto and, to a lesser degree, Rodgers have been far more effective with their squads than big spending teams like man city, Chelsea and man u.
With relatively small investment both merseyside teams have out performed their closest rivals in terms of results and performances.
I’d much prefer a close knit, talented squad over a bloated, mega rich, mega ego squad of individual mercenaries like the aforementioned teams. Both teams certainly have value for money over the big spenders IMO.

Not really a fan of Welbeck to be honest, nowhere near as good a player as Sturridge, and is definetly not the 18-20 goal a season striker we are searching for.

I tend to see where Mike Allison is going in his post but while I agree we won't be in the bidding for the same class of player that Liverpool or Man City this summer, I still think there are more accomplished strikers available than Welbeck.

You also have to take into account how much would he cost? He wouldn't come cheap being an International and at Manchester United.

Personally would rather we go after Bony who would be able to hold the ball up and give us a variety of options that Welbeck would not.

Harold, now do you know what extent Martinez has or hasn't scouted Wellbeck or anyone else?

I've spent the last 12 months telling my friends, even when they don't ask, just how shit I think Welbeck is.

If you put the EXACT same performances in a Fulham,West Ham or Hull shirt he would never be in the England SQUAD. Let alone the starting eleven.

It was just another example of ''oh, he plays for Man Utd, in that case he must be good enough for England''.

He played for the Champions last season. A team that dominated most of their matches. He was in the box for every set piece. Played as an attacking left midfielder. And he scored ONE goal ALL season.

Pathetic return.

If Martinez wants him as a striker then I will reserve judgement until Roberto has worked with him. If he wants Welbeck as a left midfielder then I think it is a shocking move.

I'd prefer McManaman. Even so, I would fancy Roberto to make a good player out of almost anyone at the moment.

Martinez just been asked "If you win your next next three games, will you qualify for the Champions League?"

"Yes."

Love the posso waves ( TM G.McKane) coming from this fella.

Colin, why not both? Roberto talks about the dynamics, Welbeck running from an attacking mid position laying it on a plate for Hernandez?

I think both would flourish under Martinez. Take Naismith as an example, we are now expecting things to happen when he plays, both would be reasonably priced too especially as their club wont be in Europe. Their values will probably fall now.

He could regain his confidence in the Capitol one and the FA cup...?

Lee, to put your stats (oh how I hate them) into some context, he scored one goal and had four assists in 1301 minutes in the PL last season. That's 14.45 games.
For some reason, but surely not to suit your argument, you didn't look at this year's figures which show that he has nine goals and two assists in 1289 minutes, which is 14.32 games. And this is for a mid-table side.
He's also only picked up six yellow cards and no red cards in his career so far so he seems like a nice chap.

Are Man United now Everton's feeder club?

I would take Welbeck if he was available on a free (out of contract) or in the £5m region. I wouldn't pay any more than that for him as I can't see him bagging us 20 a season. Hernandez certainly could and its about time he was first choice. £15m for him would be a good investment.

Other possibilities: Michy Batshuayi, Jelle Vossen, Lacina Traore, Romelu Lukaku, Alfreð Finnbogason, Wilfred Bony. We have to be careful though. I remember thinking Norwich had done well to get Ricky van Wolfswinkel who had a great scoring record in Holland and Portugal! With that in mind I would have to say Lukaku, Bony and Hernandez should be our main targets.

Iain, I don’t think we could afford them. And throw Cleverley in the mix I’m not sure getting so many ex-mancs would be healthy re: cliques in the dressing room.

Van Gaal will come in with a big broom and I can see at least 7-8 players leave OT e.g. Young, Nani, Rio, Evra, Vidic, Hernandez and even Rooney. VG won’t take any of, "the boss is here" bullshit.

Not good enough for me, if Lukaku doesnt sign then we need to be looking at a 20 goal a season replacement - Bony from Swansea would be my choice. Welbeck's scoring record is 37 goals in 171 games...hardly prolific is he?

He is a clown, but very fast and can turn a game, knows how to take his chances. I think with regular football, he would bag you between 15-20 goals a season.
Diving bastard all the same.
I could see spurs coming in for him.

Dizzie should stick to his music!! IMO hes too inconsistent to be a lead striker. Thinks hes a lot better than he actually is as well. Shows how bad Englands options up front are when he gets a game!
Got a feeling Lukaku will be going back to Chelsea so we need a strong, quick centre forward. Seems like Traore will be staying another season so maybe hes the man.
Martinez can concentrate on spending money where it matters, getting a creative midfielder (Silva, Cazorla type) that can unlock a defense with a killer pass.

IMWT COYB

I was one of those who Sam (#144) references - I thought it funny that Rodgers, having spunked £12m on Borini, and £15m on Allen, was panicking and blew another £15m on Sturridge.

Well, pretty much since he signed he's been a revelation, and maybe it's coming from a bit-part role at an established top 4 to a leading role at a top 4 chasing side (which is what they were at that time) was what was required.

So whilst I'm not convinced about Welbeck as a player, I would back RM's judgement over my own any day and if he gets him for a decent fee, then I'd love to see how it works out (and I'm sure it will). I still struggle to believe how half-a-season Jelavic one-touch-finish turned into full-season couldn't hit a cows arse with a banjo Jelavic. So I'll just sit back and leave it to the professionals!

I find it strange your all willing to put so much faith in Roberto Martinez’s judgement in the transfer market.

First off I have a fundermental problem with Martinez’s faith the loan-market. I personally hate the loan market and feel it should be stopped by the Premier League. It would stop the wealthy clubs stock piling players and it would also stop all this conflict-of-interest debate. Roberto however seems to love the loan system and it looks like he’s planning to make it a big part of Everton’s future.

Secondly in my opinion the jury is still out on most of the players Roberto has brought in this season.

Arounda Kone - Jury still out.
Antolin Alcaraz - Jury still out.
Joel Robles - Jury still out.
Aiden McGeady - Jury still out.
Jindrich Stanek - Jury still out.
Gerard Deulofeu - Jury still out. (Moments but not enough over a season)
Lacina Traore - Jury still out.
Romelu Lukaku - Jury still out. (Scored some goals but looks awful sometimes and I wouldn’t pay £20-30 million for him).

Out of the 10 incoming transfers Roberto has made this season only 2 (James McCarthy, Gareth Barry) have absolutely completely impressed me. But McCarthy cost £13 million and should be good and you could argue who didn’t know Barry was a good player??

I’m not hating on Martinez, he has done wonders this season and inspired a new confidence in Everton. He’s also gotten the very best out of players Moyes left him like Stones, Coleman, Naismith, Howard, Mirallas & Oviedo.

I would give Roberto Martinez top marks for managing the team, inspiring the players and most importantly getting results but so far I’ve not been overly impressed with his incoming transfers and would need to see players like Kone, Alcaraz, McGeady and Robbles really come good before I gave him my faith in his judgement.

Dick, I was just thinking that although regardless of price and prior knowledge, the signings of our two defensive midfielders were both shrewd pieces of business in my opinion.
He also payed approximately £ 6.5m for Mauro Boselli at Wigan so I think we should pause before kneeling down an fellating our current boss on this front.

I'm amazed that the jury is still out on Deulofeu and Lukaku. Deulofeu is young, and was never going to be a starter in every match...but he has been a consistent threat for us, and has undoubtedly contributed to our attacking game. Lukaku has a 1 in 2 goal scoring record for us... Except for Lukaku, when has a loan signing in recent history managed that? Bony, who many seem a fan of, has scored the same amount of Prem goals in more appearances, and he cost Swansea 12million. We are obviously better than Swansea..but haven't exactly provided Lukaku with consistent service, or tailored our game around him. I'd say that Martinez loan signings have been fantastically successful, and that his permanent signings, apart from McCarthy who has been brilliant, have not been.

I think Welbeck is a decent player. I think he would always score between the 10-15 mark in a Premier League season, and finish as a 1 in 3 man with good link up play. But I don't think he is better than that. I would love him as a second choice striker, but not as our best striker. Personally I think United's other misused striker, Hernandez, would be a far better option. I think he has the capacity to be a 15-20 goal a season player, is a natural goal-scorer, extremely quick and fantastic in the air. I also think that a young vibrant Everton would be as good a pick for him, as he would be for us. That said, I can see him getting a new lease of life at United, or getting a move to an Italian or Spanish Champions League side. Or the horrible Spurs.

No thanks, would much rather keep Rom and we also have Kone to come back.

He could join a long and distingushed list of Everton forwards who never score. That list stretches back to Lineker.

Also surprised by the criticism of Lukaku - sure his touch and passing can improve, but we are simply a better team when he plays and have a better win ratio to prove it. Plus he is only 20 years old.

Apart from the Yak for a period, he is the best forward we have had for a long time.

Colin Glassar @150

Colin, you say "With relatively small investment both Merseyside teams have out performed their closest rivals in terms of results and performances."
According to several websites I've been looking at Liverpool are the 3rd (4th on one website) highest spenders in the Premier League over the past decade. Everton are one of a couple of clubs with a negative net spend in more than one season. To suggest that Everton and Liverpool are in the same league when it comes to net spend is a bit silly.

Whatever you want to say about RM's transfer acquisitions, what I don't think you can criticize is his analysis of the requirements.

While Moyes was stubbornly holding on to guys who could do a job, Martinez came in and said this midfield isn't good enough and we need a couple of strikers - sold what he could and brought in quality. He had a lot of luck but you don't win the raffle if you don't buy a ticket.. etc etc

I would expect RM to make him into a fine player. Th kid has talent, is a great athlete, has pace and can finish - I don't think he was ever given enough of a run in the Utd team under SAF or Moyes.

You watch him blossom under Martinez if it ever happens.

Welbeck has played 6 games up front for United this season, and scored 6 goals...

Welbeck has played 6 games up front for United this season, and scored 6 goals...

Looking at Kone, age..... etc. I cant help but wonder if Matrinez caught him as the intention of a stop-gap for a transition period, while he "gets things together"
Because I think he has beaten his own expectations, and now must look to continue raising his game in search of "the next level"
I may be wrong, but whatever Kone May be, I feel he is not a "next level" striker for us.

I think I would be more impressed with Deulofeu and Lukaku if they were permanent signings.

If they were permanent signings it would be far more positive because I would feel that there was plenty of time for development and undoubtedly in two or three years both players will be exceptional.

But neither of them are permanent signings and can only be judged on the short time they have played for Everton.

Deulofeu has talent and will develop into a wonderful player but judged on this season, which will be his entire Everton career, you have to say he’s been inconsistant. At times sublime, at times frustrating. Sadly we won’t see the best of this player at Everton and he hasn’t played a big enough part for me to really say he’s been an exceptional signing. He’s been a useful signing without ever really being as important to the team as someone like Barry.

Lukaku has scored goals which I guess was his main objective but he’s also had games where he’s been awful. Far too many times he’s been absent from games or looked uninterested. He’s also got a terrible first touch for a striker which has been frustrating at times. I understand he’s only 20 and he’ll get better but he wont do that at Everton. I can only rate him for his short stay at this club.

13 Premiership goals is a decent return but its not exactly troubling Suarez (30), Sturridge (20), Toure (18), Aguero (16), Rodriguez (15) or Rooney (15).

I will say that if Lukaku was a permanent Everton player I would be very excited and rate him as a superb transfer but he’s not. He’s only here for a couple more games and I’m not sure I’d pay £20-30 million for him.

The big problem Roberto Martinez had when he walked in the Goodison door was find a striker who could get near the 20 goals a season mark.

Jelavic and Anichebe were never going to be up for the challenge and Roberto was spot on showing them the door.

Lukaku has done a job and nearly got to the prized 20 goal target but that’s been a short term solution.

The problem for Roberto is the same as it was a year ago. Find a striker that can get near 20 goals a season for Everton.

It’s the biggest problem this Everton team has and plugging the gap with loan players is not the answer. Roberto needs to address this problem over the summer and either spend big on a proven goalscorer or find a younger player who can be developed.

Lukaku could be developed into a 20 goal a season man but his price tag seems to be out of Everton’s reach.

BREAKING: Everton and Barcelona have agreed in principle for Gerard Deulofeu to continue on loan for another season.
Barcelona have also wavered Everton's loan fee as they are pleased with his progress on Merseyside.

Sam. Surprise reactiopn from the Palace fan. I'd watched Bolasie in a game the previous week and he was even better. His speed and crosses were phenomenal. So much s that when I saw Delboy was on the right wing, I knew Coleman was in for a hard time. As for Lennon. I wouldn't say no.

Shane. Correct. Most of his personal scouting will be done undercover. The less other people know the better.

Harold, did your previous post not suggest that you knew who he was scouting?

I don't understand all the negativity about Welbeck and Cleverley. Both young and with significant potential - Cleverley will be an excellent long-term replacement for Ossie and it'll be great to have an Englishman with flair leading the line again - we haven't had one since Johnson.

Overall, whatever any of you say or think, if Martinez sees an opportunity in either of these players, I trust him. Especially with Cleverley, who Martinez has worked with before and must have a few ideas about.

Personally, I would love to see both these players at L4 next season, and it would mean the striker predicament would be out of the way with money to spare, whereas buying Lukaku would probably consume most of our kitty.

But for now, let's focus on winning our final 3 games and wishing to whatever God or Gods might exist that Arsenal drop some points in their run-in.

COYB!

Welbeck is a better long term prospect than Lukaku. However I would question his attitude after recent antics. Plus him having to be asked to do more training by DM. On balance I don't want any more United players right now.

Martinez needs to look at swansea or saints players to fit into the system he plays. Although a god outside bet would be Snodgrass from Norwich. Could work well in a front 3.

Stones, Barkley, Cleverly, Welbeck. Could well be the back bone of a future England team

Wellbeck is a class player. Maybe not world class yet, but definitely has potential. How could we not want an England international with Champions League experience at the club. Same goes for Cleverley

It doesn't look like many people rate Welbeck. I think he could become a very good striker if he plays for a manager who gives him a good run of games and shows confidence in him.

I don't want Cleverly though. I think we have quite a few youngsters in the midfield position who could do a job as good as him and save us some money. Maybe the same could be said about our attackers but it seems more difficult to get game time if you are a striker coming through from the youth set up unless you have a ridiculous strike rate that's to hard to ignore.

I don't like Welbeck or Cleverly for that matter but as I am one of those who would back Santa Claus riding a Grand National winner if RM had coached him, then if Bobby says Welbeck is good enough for us, then I take it as read.

For what it is worth, if it isn't Rom next season, I can see Bony up front for us. Boy that guy doesn't need telling the goal sits in the middle between the corner flags.

Shane. Sorry if I left the wrong impression mate. You know as much as me. I just keep tabs on the whispers and places he visits more than once. His targets are all likely to perform better than their market value. That's it. No clever stuff.

His goal record is not good reading but I really like him. Every time I have watched him whether it be for England or Utd he impresses me with his speed, fitness, power and touch and if he could add a few more goals would be the complete striker that would not be within reach for our club so I say go get him.

Harold. I was totally kidding by the way. I have zero interest in us signing Danny Welbeck for all the same reasons everyone else doesn't want him. Great pace, touch, and engine, but zero finishing and decision making in the box. Lukaku, Bony, or Remy for me all day in that exact order.

I think Welbeck is a decent enough player, but being English and being from Man U means his price tag will be massively inflated. I would like to hope we have a creative enough scouting system under Martinez to find players of a good standard without having to sign players we have heard of who Sky sports tell us are fantastic when in reality they are just decent.

Ive been through every comment on this thread and by the end had to go back to remind myself that we are talking about a rumour that we may be interested in signing Welbeck. My opinion on Welbeck? I think in the hands of RM and with the confidence of a regular place he would be a cracking addition.

I could comment on all the other players that have been dragged into this thread but that just confuses the issue. If there are football fans out there who feel we would be a worse team with Welbeck in it, good luck to them. But Im sure we would be.

However, returning to planet Earth, how much would he cost? There's the rub.

Shane - Read my post again.

I said I would reserve judgement if he was played as a striker. Which is where he has played this season when he has got those goals.

According to Wiki, he made 40 appearances last season and scored twice. I thought it was once.

His return from left mid is astonishingly bad bearing in mind he played for the Champions. Pienaar gets a lot of criticism for a lack of end product so why the hell would we want somebody like Welbeck playing there when his return is even worse ?

I don't rate him. I do believe Roberto could improve most players though.

Great news about Deulofeu. Hope it's true.

I was hoping for a few changes but it's beginning to look as if most of the new faces will be those returning from injury. No complaints on that score but with Europe beckoning we'll need much more than the usual 3 or 4 first teamers on the bench.

Robbie Fowler on the radio, says he would probably take Welbeck to Rio. His England record is pretty good but it's time he stopped being a prospect. Cleverley he wouldn't touch with a bargepole. Doesn't know what he does. Can't tackle, can't pass, can't shoot.

There again. Fowler is not exactly Jose Mourinho. I certainly don't agree with his belief that Dalglish was better than Suarez.

Wellbeck? NO THANKYOU. The lad thinks he's a helluva lot better than he is. Scored the odd notable goal but so have

Gone right downhill since his "Blade" days....;-)

I.......so have I.

Hernandez said it before and will keep saying it, out of favour at utd but for me would love him in the current Everton team.

Hernandez is not strong enough. It would appear Roberto favours having someone powerful up front. Both to clear space for our wingers and to bang home crosses.

Where do people see enough of the players who are on the fringes at other clubs to form strong opinions on whether our club should sign them. I offer an opinion based on what I have seen for the players linked with us but always assume there are too many players I have never seen to be able to make recommendations on who we should be actively seeking to recruit.

I really don't get the relatively frequent shouts for Tom Ince since (as far as I can see) he hasn't really made any impression when given a chance in the Premier League. Isn't he on loan (but unused) at Crystal Palace at the moment?

Paul@699 Hernandez not strong enough? Same could be said about Messi, Owen, Fowler, Lineker and Rvp, but they found the net on a regular basis.

Hernandez runs his plums off and scores more often than missing the target, he scored vital goals for utd until ofm decided he didn't want to play two strikers.

Why clear space for our wingers, I must be watching a different Everton to you Paul, if you think our wingers tare arse down the wing then put in Hinchcliff type crosses then I'm clearly missing something, more often that not our wingers dribble in and try and go for goal themselves.

Take a good look at Naismiths goals, most have come from through balls and not many from leaping like a salmon to head home a big Duncan type header, Hernandez is a far better player than people give credit for and the setup we have he would be ideal in this current Everton team.

That's just my opinion Paul and why we have great discussions and debates on ToffeeWeb, each fan sees things differently.

Why the hell we would want a striker who has a good scoring record on the European stage is beyond me.