Rodwell back in the frame

I would live to to see JR back but I wonder will the UEFA fine & squad restrictions on Man City affect their transfer dealings? In particular I am puzzled by what this means :-
"...21-man European squad, cut from the usual 25, of which eight must qualify as "homegrown".
What does "homegrown" mean? Are they more likely to hold onto English players for UCL squad?

I’d take Jack back as I feel he still has great potential. I’m not one of these EFC fans who blames Moyes for everything but I do feel he turned Jack Rodwell into a crab. When fit, he’s a good box-to-box midfielder who’s handy with his head off crosses and also decent with both feet. (Remember his 2 goals, one with either foot, vs Sigma!!)

One big thing that would need to be checked would be his hamstring as it’s that which has kept him out for almost 2 years.

The more I think about it the more I think that it's a nap that City will put in a bid for Ross - although the word was they would do all their dealing before the world cup kicks off - as they will be desperate for top-drawer English players next season if as it seems likely Milner jumps ship.

That said, Birkdale Jack will surely be part of the offer - putting City in another knot as they will need to get another native in to meet rules and requirements.

Not saying for one second that Ross would go but I can see this scenario happening. If it does, it will be a real test of where we are right now as I would rather we kept hold of Ross than scoop what anywhere between 25-50 million, but much more likely to be closer to 25.

Unfortunately, I think injury has curtailed his career before it ever really got going but, for arguments sake:

If you could magically guarantee he'd stay fit for a full season and the price was right then I'd take him back...but only if the end goal was for him to feature as a central defender.

I always felt our former cadre of coaching geniuses never really had a fucking clue what they wanted to do with the lad. One minute he was a young centre half filling in in midfield, the next we were told he was defo a defensive midfielder who maybe, might, one day, cut it as a centre half later in his career. After a couple of goals he was suddenly seen as an attacking option, shoved up behind the forward and being talked up by Moyes as the next Tim Cahill, then he was given the regulation 'just whack him out on the right wing' role, before suddenly metamorphosing into a man marking/holding midfield 'specialist'.

He was a talented centre half at youth level and that is the position he should have been left to concentrate on, rather than lazily being converted into a rank average midfielder to make up the numbers.

I saw an interview recently with an ex Everton coach (Tosh Farrell), the focus of which was Ross Barkley but it also included a damning indictment of the way in which Rodwell was ultimately mismanaged:

"There are times, with the likes of Jack Rodwell and Ross, that you wouldn’t know if they were right- or left-footed. There wasn’t too much between them. Jack was like a Rolls-Royce. At under-14 Jack was probably the most coveted player in the country. Everyone was after him for big money and he would have justified it, no doubt.

If someone had got hold of him and taught him how to head properly he would have been the best centre-back that we’ve ever produced. He was fantastic. He had the lot."

I hope not, very average player who is too injury prone, I would rather give the next generation of youth a chance like Lundstam and Ledson or put Baines in the midfield.

Plus he had me cringing the way he was celebrating winning the league when he has done bugger all.

John #869, Martinez doesn't seem to worry about a player being injured when he signs, look at Alcaraz, Kone and Traore.

I would like to know the ins and outs of his injuries before deciding if this is a yes, no or maybe.

However, at times he did look like a class player and if that ability can still be brought to the fore then I wouldn't write him off yet. A lot may depend on whether he still has a real desire to prove himself.

He may not have figured a great deal but he still qualified for a Champions medal so I don't think he can be criticized for celebrating fully with his team-mates.

Kone was hardly injury prone and neither is Traore. Look at Gibson he is about as injury prone as you can get, Martinez didn't sign him.

Eric, very disingenuous post that, Alcaraz and Kone were not injured when they signed, Traore was carrying a hammy but did his OTHER hamstring in during the warm up at Chelsea, don't make things up mate, is Roberto supposed to 'know' when injuries are going to happen in the future?

Rodwell is a strange one. I think there is a decent player lurking somewhere in him but he does seem to be destined to have a career as a sick note. I think there are better options out there.

John Daley 869- absolutley spot on. Bring him back as central defender. But not as a midfielder. He looked skillful as a centre back, but totally unimaginative in midfield. Surely heading is not too difficult a skill to learn!! But only if his injuries are clear (which almost certainly they are not)
Kevin - 877 - well said. I can't stand the criticism that occurs using the retrospectoscope that all ToffeeWebbers have. None of Alcaraz, Kone or Traore were injury prone players when we bought them (and we didn't even buy Traore).

I am getting a bit sick of all these transferred players being linked with moves back to Everton. It never works just look at Pienaar who has been a big disappointment since costing us millions and returning from Spurs. Lets have a bit of imagination and move forwards not backwards.

Pete Barry - 888 - strikes the right note. Bobby is all about the future and that doesn't necessarily exclude former players in his new systems.... but (1) Jack is not that player and (2) injuries.

Pienaar was not the millions that Pete spells out but Rodwell is not the answer or I suspect has even featured in Bobby plans –even though Jack comes from the Man Utd heartland in Birkdale!

Why does anybody care about newspaper lies? We comment on these ridiculous stories as though they are undisputed fact. Let's face it, we all know that the media has a very specific agenda, which is to preserve and promote the status quo. Now that we present a serious threat to that situation the liars are moving in to overdrive.

Stones to Chelsea, Barkley to whoever, no evidence presented whatsoever. We could very easily start our own website and invent our own stories - how about "Me-la secret Chelsea fan?" The evidence is much better than any of the stories that are printed about our Club.

Freddie Starr ate my hamster.

No thank you! We have enough in the treatment room!

It's the Daily Mail for god sake. It about as reliable as women's weekly

Can't understand this "would love Rodwell back" attitude.

He never pulled up any tree's when he was here and he is forever injured, when we already have Gibson with those injury records we don't need another.

There must be better options that Rodwell out there.

For me it would just be like going back to the David Moyes days of mediocrity.

Nah, not for me. He hasn't developed in my eyes and he can't head the ball. Certainly not getting carried away with excitement anyway.

If Rodwell is the answer, what was the question?

No . Will never fulfill early promise. Almost certainly better players out there to invest in.

Danny,

The question was....

Name the young midfield player who strolled through games with the look of a potentially top class midfielder. Only to have his confidence sapped by a manager who played him wide right and wide left.

When he didn't do it in those positions, the manager dropped him, thus reducing his confidence even further. And turning him into a player scared to express himself.

Danny @ 909 the question is: Can you name an English midfielder with dodgy hamstrings who shows glimpses of potential and can be really frustrating to watch?

There may be other questions that would fit the bill...

Jim Benings, don't lumberjacks pull up trees, not footballers?

If Jack was available free then I'd be pretty keen to take a punt on him. FFS the kid is still only 23 !

I do agree with John Daley's preference for Jack as a CH, which was his natural position, until he was converted into a "Versatile Utility" player by Gordon Lee....erm dave Moyes.

The points made in most previous comments is about better options and moving ahead, and that I can not fault.

Given the injuries presently being carried by Kone, Alcaraz & Gibson, I would not foresee Roberto taking any gamble at all for next seasons increased demands, infact, quite the opposite.

Roberto is a strikingly intelligent man, so I expect him to continue to do intelligent things..........most will work pretty much as anticipated, some (due to unpredictable factors) will work differently......better, worse & weird.

"Dear Mr Shoggleshaft, thank you for your design for a well that provides water to remote villages. We particularly like the traditional rope and bucket being replaced by something more streamlined and your suggestion of a permanent hollow iron rod that can draw water to the top, using water pressure is very clever. By the way, do you have a name for your device?"

For Danny Broderick (909)

In was actually Rodwell's performance in a holding midfield role man-marking David Silva in a match at the Etihad in September 2011 (they lost two-nil) that prompted the then Man City manager Mancini to buy him the following summer.

Yes, I do agree that he should've been a centre half long term but obviously the injuries have ruined him. Interesting in the pre-season of 2012 that Rodwell was handed the number 8 squad shirt by Moyes (a number traditionally associated with a midfielder with attacking credentials).

In my opinion, the Rodwell ship has sailed!

Good one Eugene!

I don't believe that Robbie would bother signing a player if he was a) average at best, as some have posted, or b) Carrying a major injury.

We've seen what Tosh Farrel has said and City paid loads for him. Robbie will not waste funds on a crock and the lad has undoubted talent. If it comes off we could have (If Stonesy doesn't get grabbed by one of the rich clubs) a pairing of young classy centre halves for the next decade.

I can see legs in this and no pun intended

Martinez wants defenders to be able to pick the ball up in defence and bring it forward, and be able to pass to a player to a blue shirt. That's the reason he brought in Alcaraz, unfortunately with him having a snotty nose all the time this hasn't worked. But this has brought on Stones.

Rodwell was classed a the best youth "centre back" in many years, it was only Moist who changed him to a average midfield player.

I can see him and Stones in a three centre back defence, or player in a back four, think of what that could offer our side.

Or would you like to return to......Hoof........Hoof......Hoof...from defence, sorry Jags!

Bobby Martin has got everything under control, I have faith and I am positive we are all going to be pleased with what he does in this window, don't forget it hasn't even started yet.

Also that's the reason we are worried about the wrong player leaving, Jags is a fantastic defender, but his distribution is well....shyte, does he fit with the new style we play?

Is it a club policy to sign players with dodgy hamstrings or are the treatment rooms at Finch Farm a centre of exellence for the treatment of hamstrings? Barring a goalkeeper, Everton could turn a hamstrung team out every week!

"The kid is only 23"??

Yes and how many matches has he managed since making his professional debut back December 2007?

Much like James Vaughan and going back a bit further, Tony Grant.

He may be young but there is a major problem with the amount of time he had spent missing with what seems like the same kind of injury.

The question that needs asking is 'why have his injuries never cleared up?

What convinces people that signing Rodwell on loan would be any different to Franny Jeffers 'second homecoming' for a loan deal in 2003??

That was hardly deemed as a successful venture...and why?.because just like when he was here in his first spell, it was dogged by injuries.

I really love watching Rodwell when fit! Him, Stones, Coleman etc would provide us with a young defence that could progress for years!!

Unfortunately these type of moves very rarely work. He has been in the professional ranks now for nearly 6 years and has yet to complete any kind of run in any side!

I suppose you have to trust Roberto and his man-management and hope that, once he starts proclaiming Rodwell as an "amazing and phenomenal " talent, he will climb out of that cotton wool box and give it a real go!

I'm sure that Martinez can get that misfiring Rolls Royce back in tune. The School of Science is now open for business and only the best will do.

A potential CB pairing of Rodwell and Stones could be amazing. Two English, ball playing, technically gifted central defenders is the stuff of wet dreams in my opinion.

Rodwell was never a bad player. There's some serious revisionism going on here. He's a talented lad who's been unlucky with injuries and ruined by Moyes. I think under Martinez he'd really flourish and I'd be delighted to have him back. Especially on the cheap!

Rodwell has not played CB since he was about 16 and has certainly never played there in the Premiership. I always thought that positioning and anticipation were two of his weakest attributes so I don't know where all this belief that he would make a great CB come from.

Perhaps he could be converted back successfully but I would see him more as cover or companion for McCarthy and like the Irishman his energy, composure and athleticism are his gifts. Hopefully Martinez could give him more confidence to bring it and play it forward then Moyes did.

Getting Rodwell back would be a total no-brainer. The lad is an Evertonian and when he has been fit has been a class act. He needs the right physical management as did Giggs and Michael Owen with their hamstrings in their early careers but he would be a brilliant addition to our squad.

People have short memories on here and that ridiculous unforgiving culture about former players and managers is so lacking in class. Moyes ruined him, rubbish!!! Man City paid £15m pounds for him. I saw him in a League Cup match last year and he was the best player on the pitch. The lad owes Everton Football Club nothing. Can't see it happening mind under FFP.

Sam,

Could it not be that the reason Rodwell always seemed slightly unsure of himself and lacked anticipation was due to the fact that he was having to perform in a role that did not come natural to him? I think I'm right in saying that the first time he ever played in midfield was when he was thrown in there for his Premiership debut.

He played centre half at all youth levels. That's the position he knew and possessed all the natural attributes for.

Obviously it would be unrealistic to expect him to seamlessly slot back in there straight away but that's why I said hopefully that would be the end, rather than immediate, goal.

Even if Jack has now become steadfastly accustomed to simply plodding side to side in the middle of the pitch, like a table footballer minus the pole through his midriff, it doesn't mean he won't take to being moved back where he began.

Over the years there have been a number of more 'natural' midfielders, lacking Rodwells apprenticeship in the position, who have made the switch to centre half and looked comfortable.

Javi Martinez blossomed there. Mascherano/ Tuco from 'The Good, The Bad and the Ugly' has done it at Barcelona and made it look easy. Kolo Toure was a midfield figure of mirth until settling down as central defender with only part time clown tendencies. Michael Carrick has even managed it on occasion.

Further back, there was Paul Lake, in whose situation Howard Kendall sees parallels with Jack Rodwell:

"[Rodwell] has not been helped by untimely injuries, and the lack of a defined role..... is he a centre back, right, left, or central midfielder?

In a way Jack reminds me of a young player I coached at Manchester City, Paul Lake. Sadly Paul's career finished early due to injury but he was a very talented lad who sometimes suffered for his own ability to play in a few roles.

In the end I moved him to centre back and he was outstanding. Pace, power and a lovely pass.

Like Paul, Jack needs to be given a definitive role"

You may be right John, although I'm pretty sure he played centre mid for a while in the reserves before breaking into the first team.

I'm just not convinced he would necessarily make the transition successfully. Pure speculation of course but I see his skillset better suited to the McCarthy role.

If he comes it will be interesting to see where Martinez plays him but my money is on midfield.

If he can stay fit, he could be absolutely class under Martinez

The £18 million was the figure mentioned in the media and I was absolutely gutted. I hope to God it is not true! To fulfil the manager and fans aspirations we have to use all the money saved over the last two transfer windows plus a large portion of the extra revenue we made due to the increase of Sky money if we are to be genuine challengers for the title or at least a top four place.

I am sick of the likes of Spurs being touted as a bigger club than us when our trophy cabinet exceeds theirs and our history is far better. I see all the other top contenders bidding more for single players than we appear to have for our entire budget. Surely under this manager's progressive outlook we can expect this board to seriously invest if they share his optimism.

Our kids are beginning to look the part and we do not need the likes of Rodwell to clutter the bench. Garbutt and possibly a couple more are a better bet for the future along with some astute, exciting signings.

Ranieri has left Monaco, could mean we don't get Traore back? Definitely need two strikers if that is the case.

Rodwell my arse.

Please no! We must be able to do better, we need a "dogs of war" type in midfield, a fighter, a winner, a leader, none of these describes Rodwell!

Could we not go for Toure? Surely the Toffees could come up with a lovely cake and hug every May.

Rodwell : ?
As Cloughie once said about Trevor Brooking.
" Floats like a butterfly, stings like a butterfly"
sorry guys not one for me.

Rodwell?

As Cloughie once said about Trevor Brooking: "Floats like a butterfly, stings like a butterfly."

Sorry, guys... not one for me.

I am torn as to what I want regarding Rodwell so I will put my trust in the gaffer. He seems to do okay.

ps: I hope Bobby is putting strikers to the top of the priority list.

Dan

We'd need two strikers even if Traore stays.

Ant Dwyer #859 I DO blame OFM. He played Jack all over the show. He played him when he was obviously injured. He even played him on the wing when it was obvious he was struggling (I can't remember he game but he went off injured).

The lad is a natural CB, defensive MF at a stretch. He doesn't have what it takes to be a box-to-box MF player. If we can get him for free then I'd take him but only after a rigorous physical and a watertight contract in case he continues to break down.

We can do much much better than Rodwell.

We should be looking at players like Redmond from Norwich. Not likely Rodwell will be fit very much.

It was great to get £15 million for a player who was always injured. It paid for Mirallas. If we don't manage to sign Barry, we would be left with two similar players: Gibson & Rodwell, for the same position, who will probably miss most of the season. So no thanks.

Karl, there are rumours that we are going for Stephen Defour (Porto) and two Real Sociedad players (Martinez and Grossman?). These sound more like Roberto type players tbh. Tom Ince is also being mentioned strongly although I would prefer Redmond.

I correct myself, it's Griezmann. Both 23 years old and very exciting by all accounts.

Colin, there are two Martinez's (how do you spell the plural of Martinez) at Sociedad, both defenders and I think one is in the provisional Spanish squad. One of them was tipped to go to Barcelona.

Griezmann is in the French squad. You may remember he scored an absolute cracker against Lyon in the CL preliminary round. Check it on youtube just to get yourself excited.

Shane, I think it is Martinezesses (the plural of Martinez) I think it's Inigo Martinez who's a striker or attacking MF player.

Sign him.

Oozes class and talent and only needs the right coaching.

Will become a quality midfielder with no real weaknesses if he can learn from Martinez, McCarthy and Barry.

Colin I think you will find Inigo Martinez is a centre half and there are a few teams looking at him.

I'd take him at the right price. He went from exciting prospect to a take no risks crab. That was coaching.

I've said earlier this year that if he'd stayed he would have suited Bobby's setup and probably would have had a big role.

Cheap Barry replacement?

It seems that Yaya Toure is angling for a move. Although money is not important to him, he needs to play for a club where he receives more respect.

I think Roberto should call him and offer him a place in a Europa League team plus about ¼ of what he is getting now and say he will get all the respect in the world from our club and Blues fans around the world – provided he stops behaving like a complete twat.

"...he needs to play for a club where he receives more respect."

Quite right too. The way he's been treated is outrageous.

Quote from Toure's agent:

"He got a cake but when it was Roberto Carlos's birthday, the president of Anzhi (Makhachkala) gave him a Bugatti"

Fuck me. I'd love to see his reaction if he was at Everton with Bill making a massive gesture of getting him two free tickets for the Chuckle Brothers comeback.

Love the Toure comments. Great player, but dear me...

On Rodwell, there is a pervasive 'only needs the right coaching' view. I am sceptical of this. Leaving aside how he was coached at Everton, what about City? Okay he's had injuries, but he basically failed to make an impact and looked like he did with us - a bit of a crab. Was the coaching rubbish at City too? It's possible that there is a much better player inside the crab, but I think there are better options.

Kenwright and Elstone see Yaya Toure isn't happy at City and swiftly move in with an offer.

http://hencam.com/static/uploads/2013/09/DSCN3861.jpg

Hate this going back for former players, especially one with a injury record like Rodwell's. I hope this isn't true. Oh and, er, belated Happy Birthday, Yaya, lad. Just, er, sign on the dotted line please there, mate. Cheers!!

Jim @ 993

"If Jack was available free,then I'd be pretty keen to take a punt on him. FFS,the kid is still only 23!" — THAT is my statement, OK!

NOT

"FFS the kid is still only 23!" — Shifting the goalposts a shade TOO far there.

And yes, Jack Rodwell IS 23.

Eugene (109) – that is a rather sorry looking pie. I heard what they actually need is a 'beau gateau'.

I'll get my coat....

Will this be after the summer operation to take the splinters out of his arse. Rodwell should only be taken back on a pay-as-you pay basis. If this is the best the club can do, we should resign ourselves to sitting at the feet of the top clubs and accepting any scraps they might throw our way.

I hope Martinez likes shopping at Aldi, Lidl and charity shops, if he doesn't he'd better get used to it.... Rodwell, give my bloody head peace!

Rodwell is a good move. I reckon Martinez sees him as a ball-playing centre-half. Rodwell and Stones....

We don't think so! That is my toffee mates and me. For all the negative reasons listed above. Midfield we are taken care of or will be when the AGEING (he is) Barry is replaced. No-one is irreplaceable. Now, as for strikers, we want two ASAP.

No no no way too injury prone. Snap Steve sidwell up for free ffs

Too injury prone and not aggressive enough for me. Will trust Roberto's judgment though.