Uefa and Fifa rules banning breakaway league unlawful, says court

I am sure the European clubs that wanted to set up this league will be very keen to reconstitute the possibility of a new ESL. I wouldn't be surprised if the Saudi league agree to foot the bill as long as two of their sides are allowed to compete.

Everton should threaten to leave the Premier League and join the Super League as a demonstration regarding our unfair treatment, by points deduction. The Premier League would be happy to shove us in administration and have shown no empathy towards our plight. They have just sought to make an example of us.

Full of marketing bullshit and keeps stating it's for the fans... yeah right.

Matches are going to be midweek, so...they state will be compatible with all European league structures, there will be a promotion and relegation structure and reading between the lines will herald the end of Fifa and Uefa competitions.
They are also stating all matches will be free to watch.

I reckon the FA will be shitting bricks as it won't matter who wins the league as the top clubs are already in the Super League.

With there being only one true religion left in this world, it all makes perfect sense, expressed in €URO'S, DOLLAR'$, POUND'$ & P£NC£

The 'merit' of this competition is that it will increase revenues via commercial sponsorship for the super-rich, and make it even harder for clubs such as Everton to compete in its domestic league.

Any proposed Super League, regardless of its format, will have the same outcome. I'd be happier if the 'elite' clubs did go away and form their own European Super League and leave the English League system, but like as has already been mentioned, that won't happen, it'll be yet another cash-cow for the super rich clubs to milk, whilst Everton et al, try to operate within an ever decreasing market place, when it comes to commercial sponsorship.

They serve only themselves and each other, financially I'm sure and through nullifying competition and grass roots excitement.

And should this actually happen - please, God, yes - and the grass proves less green on the other side than they thought, and they want to crawl back, then they must start at the very bottom of the pyramid. No ifs, no lawyers, nothing.

Bring it on!

PS I'm very interested to see the PL's and Masters' reaction. And Everton, please, stay quiet this time. Let them go. We have enough of our own challenges to negotiate...

Be interesting to see if any of the Sly 6 rekindle their discussions, and following that, whether the Premier League will then hit them with a points deduction as per the revised rules!

The original attempt was ill thought out and to rushed, this time it's well thought out and promises riches.

The clubs involved will eventually go for it simply because the global market is greater and history, tradition and local identity can get fucked.

All matches will be played at the home ground of the “bigger” team to maximise revenues, matches between “big” teams will be decided by the Sun Supercomputer (based on factors such as merch sales, TV revenues, bribes to league officials).

Personally I would give away a ticket to any Champions League match and can't remember ever watching one. I really don't care whatsoever about some French team kicking lumps off a Croatian team in some meaningless match designed to maximise revenues and nothing else.

At least during the season they were guaranteed so many flights from Norway. This new league, games played at home etc could seriously dent profits.

It's not a 12-team exclusive anymore. As Dave @17 says, they've put a bit more thought into it that may make it attractive to teams well beyond the Scab 6. And they are only playing 14 games a season before the small playoff stage (Top 4).

But get this: it's to replace the Champions League and the Europa League and the Conference League — all of Uefa's shite competitions.

That means nobody would be leaving the Premier League. The ESL is meant to coexist with the domestic leagues, not threaten them. Let that sink in.

German clubs have already refused as they have fan representation on their boards, so it is effectively dead.

And as I pointed out, will make winning the title pointless as there is no reward.

It will be impossible to anyway when the big money is handed out to participants of the SL. Let's see how FFP pans out then.

So opening the way for a full breakaway, the FA will then shit their pants and agree to it.

The FA are a governing body, albeit a corrupt one, they do not own the clubs or players.

LIV Golf have done it, after the PGA threatened to sanction players, they can still play in the majors.

The huge TV revenues switch from the Premier League to the European Super League and so inevitably do the best players. In a couple of seasons, the Premier League will be as relevant as the Championship is now.

Does anyone really imagine that replacing fixtures v the Sky Six – as much as we detest them – with Leicester, Ipswich, Leeds, Southampton, West Brom and Hull will fill the new stadium every fortnight?

It will probably then be broken down into European and other continental groups like the World Cup. More qualifying teams from European or contential type competitions joining in the future.

The finishing of the European Super League was due to a threat of bans by Fifa and Uafa from their competitions, which has now been deemed unlawful. So Fifa has now an alternative in place.

It is interesting that the Premier League has recently put in an objection to the extension of the World Club Cup championship. The Current competition fixtures are in Saudi Arabia, no less.

Yes, the equivalent of a European Super League is now on the horizon. The Premier League won't be dishing out any Everton-type sanctions and the likes of Man City won't tolerate them anyway.

We have seen the Golf world turn upside down and the big fights go to the Gulf; Football is no different.

Interesting times.

It's all about the money, as Tony said abov£.

Without competition, sport is dead; our domestic and European leagues do need to change to level the playing field as more or less the same teams win each domestic league year on year. We have more or less become the Scottish Premiership.

This Super League will feed the same teams until they burst.

The big boys will have squads of 50 with endless money to buy from smaller feeder teams. Man Utd will play Real Madrid 6 times a year.

Italian football imploded when every game was televised and fans stopped going. This will be similar. I could imagine teams giving tickets away to get some sort of atmosphere going.

The Premier League will rightly be worried that their piece of the pie will become smaller. The rest of us are already making up the numbers. It will be interesting where Newcastle fit into this.

Good job the Premier League never issues points deductions for the 6 clubs involved originally; otherwise, there would be lawsuits flying everywhere.

No matter what the organisation is called, Premier League, FA, Fifa, Uefa, ESL, power breeds corruption so the only thing that will change are those who skim the dosh.

The ESL may well start off in conjunction with already established tournaments but, in my opinion, in time it will replace them with its own and cream off the big earners from the rest.

How Spurs get called a big club or Newcastle escapes me – they've won what recently? 🤷💙

Your Septic Six won't be going anywhere anytime soon.

In the modern game, it's about turnover, nothing more, nothing less.

That type of archaic thinking is what held us back for years under the teary one.

But it threatens national football leagues as it would be unacceptable to have fixtures arranged to suit other midweek commitments, weakened teams, the probable cancellation of Cup competitions and I suppose any idea of a winter break. Or does it mean a year-long season with barely a break between seasons?

I don't think it has been thought out properly this time either or we are yet to hear the whole truth but it does seem to be run for the money and not for the show.

Did you see the presentation of it? If not, watch it.

It's structured (or so they say) to give football back to the people, the spin and bullshit was oozing out of it...

It will appeal greatly to the "new" football fan, you know the ones, they are usually in Anfield filming the game without an ounce of passion on their iPhone.

There is a new order in world sport... brace yourself.

“… every game was televised and fans stopped going”

Yes mate, Klipperty has already come out imploring the RS tourists to try and create an atmosphere against Arsenal at the weekend because the fans may be stale after ‘too much football'. Last night was apparently like a morgue.

This proposed league looks very complicated and, if Klipperty thinks they're playing too much football now, God knows what will happen with the extra games that will be played under that setup.

In the blink of an eye, football will be controlled by the Saudi regime and with their unlimited money; all the already-rich clubs will be their puppets with money spilling out of every orifice. We are seeing the gradual demise of football as we know it, and it will increase in pace until football as we know it has ceased to be.

They're more sinister than the Spiderman villains.

I'm no conspiracy theorist... God forbid, but I am beginning to think there is some kind of ulterior motive to all this.

The Champions League group stage was as boring as I can recall. Very few matches in the 6th round made any difference to qualification for the knockout stages. Just fuck off already.

The Premier League is a competition in name only, there needs to be changes to make it more so.

As it is now, if a team other than the perennial Top 6 clubs do well, they just go and buy their star players – and that puts an end to any chance of that team's success.

They have too much advantage in many other ways to call it competitive; how long is Branthwaite going to be our player, for instance?

I suppose in the end it will depend what the TV companies want because that is where most of the money is coming from, they hold the strongest hand.

I was quite vocal on the initial proposal.

What I'm reading today is a breakaway from the Champion's League and possible collapse of that competition. But not a break away from national leagues.

The only odd thing is that giants like Bayern and Dortmund didn't want to play last time out. And there is still the closed shop element of if with certain clubs being guaranteed access regardless, which makes me uncomfortable, even though there will be scope for others to qualify.

Then again, the Champions League was built on the concept of allowing those bigger clubs who didn't actually win their league to participate – unlike its predecessor, the European Cup, a true champions competition.

Let us see how this plays out.

If clubs decide to join any breakaway league not sanctioned by Fifa, then their players would be banned from international competitions such as the World Cup and be unable to play for their respective countries. So their players may not wish to be banned and demand moves to clubs still under Fifa rules.

Then there is the whole concept which now appears to be far removed from the original vision of a few big rich clubs playing in a single league with no relegation. Now they are talking about 64 clubs in divisions with promotion and relegation.

The big clubs didn't sign up for that at all and may not be interested in it since it just looks like another midweek league on top of their domestic league.

So more injuries and bigger squads leading to bigger salary bills and higher transfer fees. Not to mention trying to prioritise which league to go for. Although I would presume it would be the one that pays the most in prize money.

Finally there is the cost to the fans. Just how much money do they think we have? Following a rich club in one nation is already expensive. So where do they propose we get the money to pay for two games a week? Especially if one of them is in another country.

They are saying it would be free on TV but how long would that "promise" last when there is PPV money to rake in?

Football is not golf. Golfers are individuals who can do whatever they like. But football clubs are a part of the community they started in and cannot just be moved around like some American franchise.

Just like the last time, I have no doubt the fans around Europe will not take kindly to greedy moneymen trying to take away their clubs just to line their own pockets.

The qualifying rules for the 2025 World Club Cup are vague at the moment. Man City qualify, but Man Utd does not, but they will find a way of changing that.

It will mean that the Septic Six will have even more money than now. They won't be turning their backs on their increasing Premier League monopoly and the income that generates. Even with the European Super League they were never going to do that.

It will be the select big-name teams and the money will be held within their ranks. Bigger squads, more subs, and benches packed with megabuck signings, with global media deals.

The breakaway clubs did not envisage leaving the domestic league, it was only because the various bodies made threats to them, that they backed down. I agree that the new proposals are far different to the original Super League plan, but the elite clubs still want and need to participate in the English Premier League.

Will the 12 clubs leave their domestic leagues?

At the moment they are hoping to remain playing in those competitions but the leagues have all issued strong-worded statements condemning the clubs and the new breakaway league.

LinkExplainer: how will the new European Super League work? Original article published in April 2021

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/apr/19/explainer-how-will-the-new-european-super-league-work

H v Luton
A v WHU
A v Arsenal
H v Palace
A v Villa
H v Spurs

At the same time, they would play in the ESL Star League as they are calling it:

1st 6 fixtures

A v AC Milan
H v Porto
A v Barca
H v RS
A v Bayern
H v Athletico Madrid

And so it would continue for the rest of the season.

In which matches would they play their best XI, given the rewards for winning the ESL would be so much more as will the revenue for televised games. The ESL would not stand to see sub par teams put out. So the Premier League becomes the new League Cup. Squad teams playing, whilst the best players are rested for the ESL games.

Eventually the need for the Premier League would die off for the Sly 6 and anybody else who joins them, ie, Newcastle, as the League Cup / FA Cup are doing.

It becomes the be-all and end-all for the super rich clubs, as they will have no choice but to carry on, as their revenues would be built around the ESL games / sponsorship / prize money etc.

The end in so many ways.

Particularly the latter with their flagship competition potentially under threat if this goes ahead.

Whilst condemning the Premier League, the new format will weaken their power and influence on teams, something that's needed.

But is this latest version of the European Super League actually Super? Or is it a European league set out to eventually replace a domestic league?

The Premier League clubs would still be in breach of the league's rules and it would weaken the totalitarian power base but eventually it would come down to money and survival for most clubs, including ours.

One thing is clear though, the FFP rules would go out of the window, as competing in different leagues would render the control of finances by the Premier League, with no control over costs or income incurred in a European league, making any sanction impossible. Could it actually mean the end of the Premier League?

The "Super League" as originally proposed is dead. It died almost immediately after it was announced.

If there is another attempt, it will be interesting to see what it will look like. Outside the clubs that initially agreed to it, that first run at it was screamed down by everyone else.

I would be very concerned if I was the Premier League or Uefa right now.

Bayern already announced they will not participate in the ESL. I doubt any German teams will.

I anticipate a halfway house with the number of Premier League teams reduced and a so-called European Super League replacing the Champions League and Europa League. We may even see Rangers and Celtic apply to become part of the Premier League.

At the end of the day, unfortunately, money talks and we all know how greedy most owners are.

It's like F1 has just become a borefest with more knobs than personalities. The equipment is mind boggling but the sport is almost absent.

Clubs will find it impossible to participate in both with full commitment to both, cost and management, never mind the size of squads or impact on players... something would have to give.

Being in a cup knockout competition is totally different from that of a league.

The Premier League has released a statement condemning the proposals but it drips with hypocrisy, especially its comments relating to its commitment to fans...

I doubt the two leagues could co-exist for long, the torpedo would hole the good ship Premier League beneath the waterline.

All that happens is that the favoured few become more sustainable under existing rules.

Speaking in a news conference, Ceferin said "Football is not for sale".

It's not reported if he managed to keep a straight face when saying this.

How could you hold one team to account on a set of rules whilst allowing another team in the same league a free pass because they could argue their cost base is fundamentally different? Which league has precedent? It can't work.

The more fixtures played and the more accessible they make football, the less exciting it becomes.

All we can do is sit and watch the money men squeeze every last drop from the once beautiful game.

With 64 clubs, that's most of the Premier League teams competing in it; otherwise, we will end up with meaningless Real Madrid v Laughing Boys of Genk non-matches. The one thing they will have to do is not make it a closed shop, still allow a means to entry at the bottom tier.

Do Uefa deserve this? Answers on a postcard…

One of Man City's many sins is failure to release satisfactory proof of income, which they have refused to do as City are part of the City Group and their holding company is registered in Abu Dhabi.

Ceferin makes Blatter look like an angel.

The present mob at Uefa and Fifa have learned from the Blatter years and taken it to a new level.

So, the question is: all of you who are above me on this thread, rubbing hands, denigrating the morality of this new proposal and its sole origins in Mammon, and rubbing hands with glee because the super six will be off (on that, see Mr Kenrick's timely reminders), would you want us to join this league if we got that invitation to the big table?

How many of us might change how we feel about this if we were one of the charmed 64?

But if you are playing half your games in a European league, a domestic league cannot have a say over how and where you make a profit or loss from.

I concede under the current single league scenario, the domestic league is essentially the governing body when it comes to FFP or PSR, but it's a different ball game (literally) when a club has two masters / two governing bodies (when both would be under threat as well).

If so, do the income & expenditure streams related to the breakaway league get included in the same way? I'm not sure why they wouldn't be.

The competition angle was strange from the European Court as though they now resented that the leagues and competitions are run by monopolies. The governance of member clubs requires a monopoly body doesn’t it?

It’s been a while since I’ve looked at Anti-Trust issues but I thought leagues were understood to be quasi-monopoles. Then the authorities largely focused on ticket prices and development issues. This seems to be an unusual stance to make way for clubs since fans have access to all the matches they want presently.

I can’t imagine the European Court outmaneuvering the PL and local government on what is obviously an English, ahem, product.

I think you're bang on the money: Everton being among the Top 20 clubs in world soccer (per Deloitte), we would surely be a slam-dunk (to indulge in your basketball vernacular) for an invite.

But seems it's too soon for such sensible dialogue; the mob are still rending spleens over the Scabby 6 and seem determined not to contemplate what this might possibly mean for us going forward.

The sooner we realise that the better.

Personally I am not interested in a European Super League and would prefer Everton getting involved in a revised Football League where money is not everything and corruption not so prominent.

"Man Utd, Man City, Chelsea and Spurs have said they won't be joining. So have the German teams."

I think I'd be a bit more wary of them. Chelsea, for example, have said “We firmly believe that, by working with the Premier League, FA, other European clubs through our strong relationship with the ECA, UEFA, FIFA, we can together continue to develop the European game for the benefit of everyone”. That's not exactly a "no"?

Similarly Man Utd: "Our position has not changed. We remain fully committed to participation in UEFA competitions, and to positive cooperation with UEFA, the Premier League, and fellow clubs through the ECA on the continued development of the European game."

Maybe they will just slither off and join Al Shittihad, PSG and Real.

For once, it should be abundantly clear to you that you are talking absolute garbage with this 'two leagues, two masters, can't work' strawman.

Premier League clubs currently (and I would suggest will only ever) compile one set of audited financial accounts showing all ins and outs, irrespective of the source. This is exactly what happens now, despite some getting income from the Champions League, some from the Europa League.

Yes, that latter group have to satisfy Uefa FFP rules, as well as Premier League P&S Rules. It would work exactly the same with the European Super League there instead. Why wouldn't it?

Sadly, you have really let your imagination run wild with this one. Get a grip, woman!

Plain old greed will call the shots...it always does, especially in sport!

No way. This would eventually lead to contracts with clubs requiring several seasons and then those contracts will be deemed anti-comptetive by the European Court whose memebets haven't been paid off by the previous arrangement.

So with this in mind, then how does this stand with owners restricted in buying players and not being able to make a loss of £105 over 3 years, is that not restricting rich owners from spending their money on purchased goods.

You would not get this in any other Buisness, Aldi told they can only spend so much, while Tesco’s and the likes can spend much more, surely it has to be a breach of freedom in providing services.

As for the Premier League, they are quite powerless, in that it was more a backlash resistance, until Figs and Uefa threatened a ban. It could now progress, working with Fifa and Uefa without the Premier League.

As did Bayern, Inter, PSG and Atletico Madrid. Napoli apparently welcomed it, as did Juve, Milan, Real and Barce. Roma also against it.

So basically Stevie Gs Saudi team with 600 fans, Liverpool, Arsenal, Real, Barce, Napoli and Juve joining along with I guess 58 teams from Belarus, Norway etc? Sounds super!

But the gap between the elite and also rans will get wider, but doesn't that mean the Sly 6 were right to try and any sanction would have been unlawful?

Must rush have a cupboard full of straw men for Michael...

Everton don't even rank among the UEFA coefficient of 400 clubs now because we haven't been in Europe for so long. But if we go Sky style biggest 64 clubs in Europe (history/stadium size etc) this would be my list in no particular order:

Benfica, Porto, Sporting, Real, Barce, Athletico, Sevilla, Valencia, PSG, Lyon, Marseille, Monaco, PSV, Ajax, Feyernoord, Inter, AC, Juve, Napoli, Roma, Lazio, RB Salzburg, FC Copenhagen, Club Bruges, Galatassary, Fernerbache, Besiktas, Olympiakos, Panathainalos, AEK Athens, Celtic, Rangers, Dynamo Kiev, Shaktor Donetsk, Slavia Prague, Legia Warsaw, Red Star Belgrade, Steau Bucharest, AIK Stockholm, FC Zurich, Bayern, Dortmund, RB Leipzig, Frankfurt, Schalke. Stuttgart, Zagreb, Hadjuk Split, RS, Arsenal, Man U, Man C, Chelsea, Spurs, Newcastle, Villa, WHU, Brondby, Udinese, Zaragoza, Bilbao, Lille, Lens, EVERTON

Athletico Madrid even rejected the Super League proprosal yesterday, which I guess leaves Real Madrid, Barcelona, Juve and the minor leagues to make up the 64 teams.

There are plenty of posts talking about inequality across Europe and the huge spending of English clubs.

I think it would be too much for me, not that we will have any say in these top flight games for quite awhile!

Rubbish, just wait till they find out how much money they will make. You won't see them for dust.

I doubt anyone believes a Super League proposal will drive fair and open competition across the professional game.

Plainly a new league will have no regard to paying spectators. It will be made for TV audiences and driven by TV broadcasters.

Year by year, the professional game is devaluing its own currency with too many competitions, larger tournaments and too many games.

I was thinking similarly. For example Ajax v Feyenoord is always a massive game due to the local rivalry. Man Utd v Man City is a massive game for the same reason. But would millions of neutrals right now tune in to watch a league game of Ajax v Man Utd?

No, because neither are very good and there is no established long-term rivalry there to generate interest. And yet both Ajax and Man Utd based on history would likely be in the proposed Super league.

Everyone wants to watch their own club but many will also watch the best clubs whoever they may be and that changes over time. People watched the European Cup Final last season – not because it was Man City v Inter instead of Marseille v Red Star Belgrade – but because those were two top teams right now, just as the latter were 30 years ago.

Any Super League will have half a dozen really good teams at any one time; no-one cares to watch meaningless games between the rest.

Just a pity these commentators and managers can't pass those sentiments on to the Premier League. Obviously when it comes to us, Master's and the Premier League don't give a shit about us.

Mind you, let's see what these clubs do when the wedge of cash is dangled in front of them. The golf world seems to have changed their minds and I have no doubt footy will do the same.

That 6's puny fine compared to the mountain we have been given to climb... bet they're sick at the minute!