My two older brothers were already crazy Evertonians who were 17 yrs and 19 years old, Before my mam died, every Saturday I would say "Where are Robert and John going, mam?" My mam would say to me, "They're going to watch Everton, lad." I would say, "Mam, why can't I go and watch Everton with them?" She would say, "You're too little, lad; there's too many people there ? 60,000 people ? you might get lost."
So one week in 1966, after pestering them for weeks to take me with them, they took me to see Everton V Sunderland... 64,000-odd people there. I was sitting on my brother's shoulders in Bullens Road... I had never been so happy in all my little life! The summer of 1966 was and will always be the worst time of my life because my mam died. But what my two brothers done by taking me to watch Everton before my mam died gave me something to turn to for comfort.
From that day day when my mam died, most people would say i lost the plot because i would not listen to my two brothers, I ran away from home and any kind of authority. Where did i run to? I found a mate whose mum had also died that same year, and who was also introduced to Everton at the same time as me. Dave Coey was his name. We decided the best way to cope with what we were going through was to follow Everton ? no matter where we played.
We hitch-hiked all over the country at a time when they hadn't built most of the motorway network. We were running across farmers' fields in Hampshire coming back from Southampton because we were shit-scared. So that's my passion for Everton FC. I have read most of the posts on ToffeeWeb concerning the vote (I would have voted No if they would have sent it to me).
My title is Why?...
- Why don't the club want to talk to anyone (they might have a better deal even than Tesco). Surely as business people you keep your options open?
- Why have the club allowed this divide to happen?
- Why are the people who own and run the club deaf to everyone who is just asking them to talk to anyone who has a suggestion? I don't think they realise the mistake they are making... or they don't care.
We will be totally screwed playing Marine and so on. Since this exclusivity crap was started the club made a statement, "We cannot talk to anyone because of the said exclusivity deal." Two weeks later, Evertonians are told "Vote for Kirkby or we're Doomed!" Then they tell us they are sending 36,000 ballot papers out; considering we only have 22,000 season ticket holders, a couple of hundred shareholders, and a couple of thousand Evertonia members... Where did the other 9,000 ballot papers go?
Everything has been done so underhandedly, there has been no clarity on anything ? just how good it will be because we are getting it for next to nothing. Let me tell you, if you're getting something for nothing ? it's worth nothing! If you're getting something for next to nothing, it's worth virtually fuck all.
By the way, I do wish the people who keep describing themselves as the Winning Yes voters would enter into proper dialogue instead of just dismissing anything anyone says that they don't agree with. There are a few yes voters who are excellant debaters but most just keep repeating the same rubbish. This is too big to "just get over it".
The point is 60,000 every week in Goodison Park... there's more of us in this city so lets stay and fight for whats ours; build a new stadium in the city and we have the people to fill it. More people are in work in the city, the city is booming, we will fill 60,000 in our city! All we need is the commitment of the owners.
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1 Posted 12/09/2007 at 05:52:47
2 Posted 12/09/2007 at 06:50:46
3 Posted 12/09/2007 at 08:16:06
4 Posted 12/09/2007 at 08:46:32
5 Posted 12/09/2007 at 08:41:42
6 Posted 12/09/2007 at 08:57:59
7 Posted 12/09/2007 at 09:01:01
8 Posted 12/09/2007 at 09:01:23
9 Posted 12/09/2007 at 09:00:18
10 Posted 12/09/2007 at 09:23:16
11 Posted 12/09/2007 at 09:07:18
First of all, I do not follow at all the ’get over it / move on now’ line with those who voted NO. Obviously this is something that is incredibly important, and is still hurting, and it is not going to magically go away. Anyway, it is not for me to tell anyone else what they should or should not be feeling.
All I ask from the NO voters is that, likewise, they accept that YES voters are intelligent people who feel passionately about this subject too, and have acted in the best interests of the club they love as they see it. All the accusations about who are the ’true Evertonians’ (from both sides) sound like children in a playground, it’s embarrassing, and prevents any meaningful discussion or progress. If we weren’t true Evertonians we wouldn’t spend our time on this (excellent) site. End of.
Secondly, on Keith and Bill and the ’Everton management’. I think they deserve huge credit for giving the fans a vote on the move (no other major club has ever done so), but, boy, have they cocked-up the communications around all this big time! Personally, I don’t know why they weren’t much more straightforward about stating the case for Kirkby (only Terry Leahy did so), because I think in the circumstances it is a very good case.
However, I am much more of a believer in the cock-up than the conspiracy theory of history. They are very far from perfect, but I think the view that Keith and Bill are somehow evil geniuses only in this for their own financial gain is self-evidently ridiculous, and is completely ruining any possibility of a sensible debate. Again, we could well do with the end of the ’evil Bill’ line of argument - it takes us nowhere.
Finally, I wanted to endorse Neil Millichip’s excellent post above as the shortest and best statement of the YES case I have seen. (And this is not just because us Neils need to stick together!)
In essence, those of who voted YES did so because we do not want our club to be left behind and become non-competitive in a decaying Goodison. And, given that the club have been looking for years for other alternatives and have not found any, we are reluctantly but wholly convinced that there aren’t any which can now be reliably delivered in the timeframe required. We have no faith in the last minute options trumped up by LCC, essentially to save their own political faces. I support Everton management at this stage in not getting sidetracked into discussions with people who obviously cannot deliver. We believe that Bill and Keith would ’keep Everton in our city’ if they could (why on earth wouldn’t they?), but that this has not proven possible. And we also believe that Kirkby is scouse and is Liverpool, and we are therefore not abandoning our historic roots in going there.
Hopefully, Dave, this is what you see as ’entering into proper debate’ (it is certainly what I intended). Of course, I do not expect NO voters to agree with what I have just said, but I do ask that they respect that this is a view which has been thought about long and hard, and is held passionately by someone who is genuinely concerned for the future of our club if we do not move from Goodison in the near future.
12 Posted 12/09/2007 at 10:02:06
13 Posted 12/09/2007 at 10:23:21
Yes that would be very philanthropic and humanist of the RS to let that happen so their competition (us) builds up their finances.
Would be exactly in character with them, don’t you think?
Or do they not get a say in the matter?
14 Posted 12/09/2007 at 10:21:58
15 Posted 12/09/2007 at 10:22:42
I would have loved to stay at GP or to have moved to Kings Dock. I live in Kirkby and really don’t want us to move here, however I have more faith in what comes out of the Everton boardroom than what comes out of the LCC, so I voted yes. That was my vote and no-one elses.
Tom - Will putting a new stand at the park end get rid of the obstructed views? Will it give better facilities to supporters everywhere in the ground?
16 Posted 12/09/2007 at 10:48:45
If anyone is brainless its you lad.Most NO voters will see this thing through to the end irrespective of your take on the matter and in the end we will do what we want.Why dont you go and support the RS you have got the gob for the job.
17 Posted 12/09/2007 at 10:28:22
The FACT is we DO need to have a serious plan for the future development of Everon FC including ground location and development. Its should form PART of the strategy and not become the only part of it.
We could argue that Goodison is the right or wrong location, we could argue that the present capacity could keep us afloat for the next 3 years, we could argue about Kings Dock, Stanley Park, Scotland Road or even how the heck we are supposed to make it all work.
The only FACT is we haven’t got a Strategic PLan and we haven;t been given any options. How can we evaluate any management decision when we don;t know where they are going. All we are left with is emotion. Our passion. Our gut feeling. By voting Yes we may have done our club a huge disservice, one that we may forever have to live with. But the choice, the vote, was flawed because there was no alternative solutions offered, no plan for the future, nothing to base a reasoned decision on.
Coming from Liverpool myself, born and breed in blue, I went to my first match where Albert Dunlop saved a penalty with his legs, I think it was against West Ham or Burnley, around 62 63 saeson..
I love Goodison Park with all its bad spots and lack of corporate hospitality. Its called CHARACTER and SOUL. But business rules the heart. But GOOD Business must justify decisions and explore all options. BAD business just goes for the "too good to be true" deals. Its not the best deal we have been offered, its the best deal thats been sold to us.
The only deal the board wanted.
Just because they have a YES vote does NOT mean the deal is a good one. They are making the cardinal sin of all business, ignoring common sense.
Why? Keep asking...
18 Posted 12/09/2007 at 11:01:29
We had a vote on the subject of the move. The majority voted YES and the continuation of the NO campaign is cynical and disingenuous. If the vote had been NO, would it be fair for the club to turn around and say - oh it doesn’t matter what the majorty want - we’re pressing ahead with the move nonetheless? There’d be uproar.
19 Posted 12/09/2007 at 11:01:42
I just hope I am not sat next to anyone like the yes men up this list!
20 Posted 12/09/2007 at 11:01:26
21 Posted 12/09/2007 at 11:03:38
22 Posted 12/09/2007 at 11:35:45
’PUTTING LIPPY ON A BULLDOG’
Must be the greatest statement of all time, I am gonna use that one Ryan, with your permission of course.
23 Posted 12/09/2007 at 11:29:15
24 Posted 12/09/2007 at 11:46:24
don’t you think we deserve a better stadium than whats on offer because in my eyes the kirkby stadium is a million miles from what we deserve.
25 Posted 12/09/2007 at 11:57:52
I think it’s always important to remind people that it was the fans in a democratic ballot that was looked after by the highly reputable ERS who are taking us to Kirkby - no one else, no one was forced to vote ’yes’. The result was that 60% of us want this move to Kirkby, only 40% don’t want to move (for a plethora of reasons) and there were 11,000 voters who don’t care where the club play - those are the factoids of the situation no matter how difficult they are to take in for some.
26 Posted 12/09/2007 at 11:59:13
27 Posted 12/09/2007 at 12:09:29
as i understand it you are a yes voter, im not gonna have a pop at any person who voted yes because you voted for what you believed to be the right decision, but are you completely satisfied with the quality of the stadium? seriously it looks cheap as any stadium i’ve ever seen, don’t you think that we deserve better?
28 Posted 12/09/2007 at 12:09:41
29 Posted 12/09/2007 at 12:08:15
Do you want a move to a new stadium in Kirby or not? Or not What?? Stay at Goodison, pursue other options??
The question was asked under a poor premise. But thats where we are, we didn;t have a choice of options or questions to vote on.
All I am saying is don;t delude yourselves into thinking we had options. Kirby was chosen in the absense of another choice. (No Plan B)
Oh Yee of little brain.... Mr Wyness...
We may end up in Kirby, but the board owe it to the past and future generations of supporters who have made this club what it is, to consider all options. CONSIDER other proposals with an open mind. EMPLOY an independent party to assess best options and recommendations. Cut out the emotion and do it properly adn make the call armed with all the facts.
30 Posted 12/09/2007 at 12:21:07
31 Posted 12/09/2007 at 12:21:54
could they have looked into more options, and could they have added more questions on the voting form? possibly. but seeing as the MAJORITY of fans are happy with this stadium option, then their decision has been vindicated.
Well done BK and KW - you?ve delivered a stadium the fans want
32 Posted 12/09/2007 at 12:45:09
i?ll watch us in kirkby if thats were we end up but theres no denying that the stadium looks bog standard.
33 Posted 12/09/2007 at 13:10:22
If it does turn out to be pap, then I’ll be happy to revise my post above. UP TO THIS POINT however (i.e. prior to final design and build) I think all has gone well.
34 Posted 12/09/2007 at 13:06:57
35 Posted 12/09/2007 at 13:18:14
there on the nsno website, there a slight improvement on the night vision shots but it looks really cheap.
36 Posted 12/09/2007 at 13:44:44
37 Posted 12/09/2007 at 14:02:39
38 Posted 12/09/2007 at 12:23:21
No offence David, but you have done nothing but repeat questions that were raised and debated months ago.
And so follow all the usual people, saying all the same things, yada yada yada, blah blah blah. You will not find the answers on here, believe me I’ve been looking for some time.
I did think that the continued debate was a good thing and (obviously from this post) I am always looking out for the stadium articles, but this article, along with many of the recent ones, have put me off as there is no progress being made at all. You will not change each others minds with these arguments.
There are even identicle posts under different names?!
I will say two things about the way I feel though...
Groundshare - NO F***ING WAY!
GP - Love the idea, but we need to do more than increase the capacity and put new roofs on. Come on, we need better facilities and something that will generate revenue. People keep going on about how we are not going to fill Kirkby, so how is expanding GP to 50,000 and putting new roofs on it, going to solve our problems? All for the same cost as the supposed contribution to Kirkby? Well maybe I’m nuts, but despite my reservations about Kirkby, I would rather contribute £30m to a new stadium than on patching up GP. If it’s not going to be a proper redevelopment then I don’t see it benefiting the club in anyway. Pouring money into a hole.
No offence to anyone who still feels strongley about this issue, but it feels like we are chasing our tail at the moment.
39 Posted 12/09/2007 at 14:21:53
Selling Goodison Park and the naming rights would help fund the £50m.
40 Posted 12/09/2007 at 14:39:37
41 Posted 12/09/2007 at 14:38:11
In any other kind ov business these balloons would have been lashed years ago!! But certain Everton fans seem to be content with having a story telling chairman(we’ll be here till Christmas writing down the whoppers he’s come out with over the years) who, hasn’t got a carrot to his name and is the man who is saying to every Everton fan, f*ck your 130 years of tradition and the club’s home this is my way and we’re doing it my way like or lump it!!
Don’t even insult my intelligence by saying "we all had a vote on it" and "it’s a democracy"
42 Posted 12/09/2007 at 15:43:05
No I won’t insult your intelligence mate, i’ll say some soothing words that you will no doubt approve of - 60% of fans voted NO to Kirkby, only 40% of fans voted YES and those 11,000 who didn’t care enough to vote? They would have ALL voted NO - That’s it the end of Kirkby.
43 Posted 12/09/2007 at 16:03:58
Can anyone tell me if Terry Leahy has ever considered a Tesco buy out of Everton? We might not want to be known as the Tesco Team but does it make more financial sense to Tesco (and probably Everton) in the long run?
You see, there we go again with those never before asked or answered questions, that little bit of clarity of purpose that seems completely lacking from our current leaders.
44 Posted 12/09/2007 at 16:01:51
45 Posted 12/09/2007 at 16:39:56
46 Posted 12/09/2007 at 16:43:27
Tell me if any of the following is wrong. He gave us a vote. He didn’t have to, and no other club has done likewise over their ground moves. There was a very real vote - if the vote had been a majority of voters voting NO, then all negotiations regarding Kirkby would have stopped.
Actually, for all the cries of "propaganda", in my opinion Everton management put together a piss poor job of communicating around Kirkby, with the only well-stated case coming from Terry Leahy.
Guys, I can understand you not wanting to go to Kirkby, and I can understand you being unhappy that the vote went against what you wanted. But unhappy that there was a vote?
47 Posted 12/09/2007 at 16:38:18
The conduct out of Wyness(done a boss job of the mighty Aberdeen’s finances) was nothing short of disgraceful and Kenwright nowadays hardly put’s his fat head in front of the camera’s coz you know, and he know’s he’s bound to come out with another stormer to add to the list.
Kenwright has got one man to thank that he’s still in a job at Goodison and that’s Moyes.
48 Posted 12/09/2007 at 17:01:34
49 Posted 12/09/2007 at 17:06:56
This is the same, Everton have done business like 8 yr old children, no plan B, constant changing of figures (all projected anyway) and writing off any other proposal without proper & thorough investigation!!
The LCC have been even worse, dragging thier heels over offering land, that lying twat Bradley in the papers every two minutes waving his season card about. (I’d knock fuck outta him if I saw him at match).
All I want is facts not opinion, facts that can be backed up.
a) Who is paying what for Kirkby project?
b) Explore ALL other possible site & give reasons why, if found to be not feasible.
c) List all voters of vote and results because if earlier post is true & we have only 22,000 season ticket holders, 2/3 thousand Evertonia members & a couple of hundred shareholders then WHO THE FUCK ELSE GOT THEM???????
My head is battered with this, I voted no, because although the ’FACT’ remains that we do need to leave Goodison (kills me writing that) I dont believe that Kirkby is best option, never mind only option. There is something not right with Wyness whoring the project, if it was the deal of the century you wouldnt need to sell it as much as he has!!
1-0 saturday, Yak 1st goal at goodison.
50 Posted 12/09/2007 at 17:31:49
But but but the club have given public explanations why GP and the loop are unsuitable, they’ve used their own experts but some of the ’no’ voters don’t want to believe them. I don’t see what more our club can do to that minority of the minority who continue to support such small sites and don’t believe a word our club says.
51 Posted 12/09/2007 at 17:33:32
52 Posted 12/09/2007 at 17:26:48
The conspiracy theories are rife on this site at the moment.
I find it hard to believe that the board would be capable of such manipulation of the vote (especially as we are persistently told that they are all morons). Anyway, all they had to do was not give a vote if they were so desperate to get the move. I don’t buy the crap about them relinquishing responsibility to the fans by giving them a vote as it is clear to see by the posts on this sight it has not succeeded in lifting responsibility/blame from them at all.
53 Posted 12/09/2007 at 17:45:38
54 Posted 12/09/2007 at 17:50:49
55 Posted 12/09/2007 at 17:46:00
And the NO camp need to seperate reason from emotion, otherwise they?re just gonna go round in circles. I mean ?saying BK is an idiot and got us into this mess? only works if you think we are in a mess.
You may not want to move from GP, you may not want to move from the city, but that is personal opinion not a sign that the club is in a mess. On the contrary, we have a new stadium on the way paid for by outside investment, and the best squad for years. BK has done well in my book.
1-0 sat too. aj to slot it home
56 Posted 12/09/2007 at 17:23:09
57 Posted 12/09/2007 at 18:13:32
58 Posted 12/09/2007 at 18:08:39
But as I’ve posted previously, what about the corporate stuff and the facilities etc. Can we improve them? Can we tap into some other revenue streams once we’ve made these modifications? The costs you mention don’t seem to be negligible, so if we are to invest that money in GP, will we be able to recoup it? We would have no partner or investor in the GP renovation.
Of course I don’t expect you to just pull these answers out of the air mate, but I am always ready to hear the GP alternative.
Are people still working on this option (obviously the club aren’t)?
59 Posted 12/09/2007 at 19:27:02
Now 9/10’s of the articles are about Kirby and feelings. I don’t want to spend time reading about peoples childhoods, I want answers, options or at the very least, somekind of hint at when Kirby gets the green light. I appreciate the gravity of the issue... but surely now, it has been done to death. (A slow and very painful death at that).
Why spend our time arguing over Bestway, KEIOC, LCC, "The management". If you have no input into the relocation of Everton FC, keep quiet on the matter.
The only FACTS at present are: 10% of matchday Evertonians (which is Statistically viable) voted, with the majority voting YES. Other than this... there are no other options as of yet. Maybe in months, years, decades there will be other options... but can we rely on maybes?
60 Posted 12/09/2007 at 19:02:33
They miss the point completly.We did vote with our hearts but only because our heads told us to.
Personally.my heart sinks when i think of Kirkby and our shed at thebottom of the garden.And it sinks even more when i think of me next door neighbours .
My heart also sinks when i think of the propaganda used by our custodians running my club,and how we are so skint we have to bend over backwards to tescos for a sub.
But it sinks even more when i think me neighbour is loaded and can buy what he wants in a park that used to belong to us.
In general my heart sinks for the future of my football club in ten years time and that is why my head says no to any proposalls this club give us right now.
When this club gives us something along the lines of say Kings dock we wont need any debate the head and heart will be as one.
Unfortunately the club dont care what we want but they will give us what the think we need.And they used the woolyback out of towners to get it for them.
If you dont believe me check with the electoral reform society where the voting papers are at and youl get your answer.Its free for the public if you ask.
Thank god the teams on the up,but in a way its diverted attention away from the biggest issue this clubs faced in a hundred years ,and we let an out of work couldnt act anyway phoney to do it for us and a tight jock sidekick looking for a brucie bonus.
They may get what they want but they?l never rest in peace i can promise you that.
EVERTONIANS TILL WE DIE,GOD BLESS
61 Posted 12/09/2007 at 23:08:04
62 Posted 12/09/2007 at 23:06:25
63 Posted 12/09/2007 at 23:25:17
64 Posted 13/09/2007 at 00:04:49
65 Posted 13/09/2007 at 00:34:29
66 Posted 13/09/2007 at 06:06:05
67 Posted 13/09/2007 at 07:32:32
i was born and brought up in wavertree and now live in speke and voted yes, am i a woolyback out of towner?
so if the design for the new stadium was the kings dock one but still in kirkby you would have been ok with that?
The current design is adaptable and can be expanded on, it will not be the finished stadium, but will be
1) better in terms of facilites(than what we have now)
2)serve as a foundation for a better stadium in the future
Evertonians till we die (upon the proviso that your opinion of what an Evertonian is, is in agreement with Colin Riley)br />
68 Posted 13/09/2007 at 09:44:32
69 Posted 13/09/2007 at 10:08:39
By your logic, there are more season ticket holders and Evertonia members (the people who had the vote) from "out of town" than there are from "in the town".
What a load of balls. By all means argue against Kirkby, but flogging this woolyback, out of town crap is insulting to all Evertonians, wooly or otherwise.
As Brian said before FO!
70 Posted 13/09/2007 at 10:31:22
Now without sounding condescending i would say that the majority of that 36000 can afford a seaon ticket every season for the last 3 years. I do believe these supporters are not in the same bracket as the thousands of match day going fans who by my guess are ordinary working class people who can’t offord but would love a season ticket.
As we have one of the highest percentage of fans that come from the city that the club was founded from(I think Blackburn in the top flight are the only club that has a higher percentage) this would have been a matter that our board would have been fully aware of and that’s why they never gave these fans a vote in my opinion coz they would have told them to shove Kirkby up there you know what.
It really is a shame that a lot of these fans whose families laid the foundations of this club never had an opportunity to have a say in it’s future people who have hitchhiked on motorways on a cold midweek night to go to place’s like Swindon and Bristol City in the league cup all for the love of the blue’s. It’s these people who i fear will be lost for good our club’s backbone!!
71 Posted 13/09/2007 at 14:19:57
1 week ticket priority period to ensure you are first in line to purchase home Premiership tickets.
Free entry to Everton Reserves and Ladies home fixtures.
Free membership to our Away Travel Club (worth £5).
and would have given them a vote all for the princly sum of 20 quid.
If you can afford a ticket for the game on a regular basis then you can afford for a membership. There had to be some criteria set for those eligable to vote or would you rather we were an autonomous collective?
72 Posted 13/09/2007 at 14:37:57
The Board did not need to give us a vote. No other club ever has. 36,000 people got a vote. These were season ticket holders and Evertonia members for the last three years - a perfectly sensible way of giving the vast majority of our core support the vote (without also including people who rarely attend). If over 50% had voted against Kirkby, we would not be going (i.e. the fans had a very realistic opportunity of over-ruling the recommendation of the Board). The vote was conducted by the highly reputable ERS, and was in no way rigged.
What on earth is your problem?
73 Posted 13/09/2007 at 14:58:41
But what the f*ck we’ll just sacrifice all of that for the b*llocks that you have quoted above because we all have a crystal ball don’t we and we all new 3 years ago that our chairman and his cronies were gonna have the kek’s right off us with this vote.
Tony Marsh came out with a quote the other day that a lot of Evertonians have become tit’s nowaday’s and i’m starting to think he’s right.
As for your sarcastic comment of nearly being in tears, you’ll know all about that when your sitting in a half empty stadium in Kirkby and you’ll have them 15000+(Massive percentage of Everton’s support) to thank for that.
My guess is they are mostly woolybacks like you with a fair wedge in their pocket everyweek.
74 Posted 13/09/2007 at 15:31:16
But what exactly are you asking for? That the vote should have been open to anyone who wanted to vote? That ballot papers should have been handed to anyone who attended a game at the ground? That the vote should have been given to everyone except those who can afford a season ticket? That the vote should have only gone to those living in Liverpool? That there shouldn’t have been a vote at all?
75 Posted 13/09/2007 at 15:37:47
76 Posted 13/09/2007 at 15:48:13
This situation has arisen because of a incompetant Chairman end of story. He’s been on the board during Everton’s most trajic comedies and this stadium b*llock’s just about cap’s it off for me. It’s still not as good as his shout to James Beattie when he signed saying "You could be the next Dixie Dean"!! Just think you halfwits are trusting that clown.
77 Posted 13/09/2007 at 16:11:31
78 Posted 13/09/2007 at 16:42:46
79 Posted 13/09/2007 at 16:40:28
80 Posted 13/09/2007 at 16:51:31
81 Posted 13/09/2007 at 17:41:04
I’d say a weaker character would have walked years ago having Kenwright as your Chairman coz Moyes had no support for years and still i think he doesn’t get enough now. My anger is not vented at YES voter’s it’s vented at him and them oaf’s he has with him on the board for putting our club in this situation.
If the move goes ahead i’ll be devestated.
82 Posted 13/09/2007 at 18:19:27
Not that we don’t understand the problems in the past - King’s Dock, NTL, Fortress Fund etc. - but they don’t seem to justify the extreme level of hatred. And most of these things are now pretty far in the past, so maybe Bill is learning. And Bill also has a lot on the ’plus’ side of the ledger - replacing Chairman Johnson, bringing in Moyes, finding money for Johnson, Yakubu and the rest, and giving the fans a vote on the move.
And when you compare him with the scum at some other clubs (I think we all know which clubs and Chairmen we are thinking of), it really does seem hard to hate Bill THAT much. But - obviously not.
I don’t think many YES voters think Kenwright (or Wyness for that matter) are in any way perfect. I certainly don’t. But one of the big divides in the fan base seems to be grounded in the extreme antipathy to Bill felt by a section of the NO vote.
83 Posted 14/09/2007 at 00:10:44
84 Posted 14/09/2007 at 08:55:02
Kenwright’s team is third in the Premiership - but he is hopeless. The Wyness big bonus claim has no basis whatsoever. This just makes you look deranged.
85 Posted 14/09/2007 at 09:09:21
86 Posted 14/09/2007 at 09:28:10
However, yes, I do think that Kenwright, in particular, has done a decent job of getting Everton where we are today. He may not pick the team, but he provides the environment in which it all happens. So he should get some of the credit. Look at Tottenham and Newcastle (and of course Leeds) if you want to see clubs where real incompetence and worse in the Boardroom has hit the team on the pitch.
And there is no evidence that Kenwright is in this for purely selfish financial motives. None whatsoever, and much evidence that he is not (he’s put his own money into the club after all). If he and Wyness were really desperate to get the Kirkby deal for their own interests, why on earth did they hold a vote? Just tell me that.
Bill is not God and he is not the Devil. That’s actually all I am saying Michael. I still don’t know why you hate him with such a passion.
87 Posted 14/09/2007 at 09:44:04
Maybe I have been a bit over the top about it but its only that because I love Everton (as you quite clearly do)and it has been such an important part of my life. We are special and I just don’t think that what is happening is right. People that follow Everton are all real supports. Because I mean really if it was just about success and all then everyone would follow the Red Shite, Manure and now the new flavour of the month Chelsea. I currently live in Laos and its funny to see all these people wearing kits from the above mentioned. They might have many people from around the world who do the same thing but went it comes down to it, We are Everton and you will only see an Everton shirt on an Everton fan.
Heres to a new future for our Great Club. One name, one City, Liverpool. How about just One Name Everton.
88 Posted 14/09/2007 at 10:30:22
My dad, another big Evertonian, always maintained that supporting Everton makes us all a bit deranged. Think he’s probably right!
I have nephews now in Devon and in New York - they all support Chelsea, Manure, or the RS, and have all the shirts - what the fuck?
Good luck in Laos!
89 Posted 16/09/2007 at 13:17:04
well they fucked up there, apparently those nasty schemers sent ballots out to 11,000 yes voters as well...your so right Neil , they cant get nothing right..Bring back Johnson..and we can ask that nice mike walker to be manager..we always passed it on the floor when he was boss..and the end of season was so exciting..will we stay up..will we go down.oohh and none of this having to fork out for trips abroad....I right with you Neil..
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