The Mail Bag
Johann Vogel ? Coup of the summer!
Comments (59)
OK in my last post I was quite negative so I?m being more upbeat now and with good cause. Bully has pulled one right out of the hat! We might be signing someone!
Although we have NOT yet signed him, Keith Wyness has announced that we are in talks to bring in a new player on on a free transfer. He is 30 year old Johann Vogel a good player, a little dour and one definitely in the Moyes mold (not always a bad thing) in that he is versatile. He can play at right-back, centre-back and in his prefered role of a holding midfielder. He is Phil Jagielka but a good few years older!
It IS good news that we are looking to add to our threadbare squad we will be playing a lot of football next year (with a bit of luck). I just wonder has Bully not learnt from the mistakes of a couple of seasons ago when we were announcing who we were talking to before they were signed and them they went to Newcastle or Liverpool. Now I doubt that this will happen with a 30-year-old squad player but...
Oh yeah, I?m being more upbeat. This guy, if we do tie him up, IS a worthwhile addition to the squad (especially as he is in our price range: £0.00). COYB
Mike Newhouse, Posted 17/07/2007 at 14:27:58
Comments
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Jon Berry
2 Posted 17/07/2007 at 14:59:19
2 Posted 17/07/2007 at 14:59:19
A new signing, woo hoo!!!!! Johann Vogel - At last a new signing. Don't know if he'll cut it but his cv's pretty good.
Shaun Yomoto
3 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:16:25
3 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:16:25
If we get him its a positive but I am satisfied with that. I wanted Fernandes a player to push us to the next level with talent but we end up with an old timer who is defence minded even though he has a good cv. COME ON EVERTON SUPRISE ME PLEASE !
Shaka Islam
4 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:24:46
4 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:24:46
Everyone seems to be linked. If Everton where to make a team of all the linked players. they?d probably be the best team in the world but Carlsberg don?t do football teams. He sounds like another jagielka. probably can play in goals as well.
Ger Johnson
5 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:37:58
5 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:37:58
Happy Days is what I say. I know we’ve been ’linked’ with loads of other players and all but one have fallen through, but this has hit the web like a tidal wave and that’s usually indicative that its all but wrapped up.
Plus its par for the course that the ones we hear almost nothing about bear fruit in the end, whereas many of the sagas like Nugent/Koumas/Richardson etc fall through.
Vogel would be a clever and valuable addition and I was thinking only the other day why hadn’t Moyes brought in more free transfer people (Distin, anyone?) seeing as he mite be tight for dosh??
Mr Vogel would be gr8 for the UEFA Cup campaign, and Jagielka could learn a lot from him in a season (along with whatever advice he get from Carsley in his swan song season).
Perhaps, as pointed out, not the ’next level’ in quality that we have in 3 or 4 players already but he’s definitely a solid addition to the squad - hope I’m not jinxing it now!!
Plus its par for the course that the ones we hear almost nothing about bear fruit in the end, whereas many of the sagas like Nugent/Koumas/Richardson etc fall through.
Vogel would be a clever and valuable addition and I was thinking only the other day why hadn’t Moyes brought in more free transfer people (Distin, anyone?) seeing as he mite be tight for dosh??
Mr Vogel would be gr8 for the UEFA Cup campaign, and Jagielka could learn a lot from him in a season (along with whatever advice he get from Carsley in his swan song season).
Perhaps, as pointed out, not the ’next level’ in quality that we have in 3 or 4 players already but he’s definitely a solid addition to the squad - hope I’m not jinxing it now!!
Nick Entwistle
6 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:51:07
6 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:51:07
I’m not getting this... some one has added a line to a wikkipeedeeahhh entry and now we’re buying him?
Do we need him? We’ve got Cars, Nev, Jags, Da Silva, Yobo who can all just about hold the middle... I agree with the post above saying Fernandes is what we should look for as the next level of talent.
Do we need him? We’ve got Cars, Nev, Jags, Da Silva, Yobo who can all just about hold the middle... I agree with the post above saying Fernandes is what we should look for as the next level of talent.
Seamus Murphy
7 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:51:17
7 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:51:17
Yeah good to see the squad being added to and seemingly a versatile player which is always good when you have a squad the size of ours. Still need that big signing for Midfield though!! COBB
Ian Burton
8 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:54:58
8 Posted 17/07/2007 at 15:54:58
Clever buy as in europe Moyes will almost certainly play 4-5-1 with 2 defensive midfeilders, him, neville and carsely bring a wealth of experience and quality.
After all of the worrying as long as we sign a wide player with more quality than Osman to complete the midfield of cahill arteta carsley, neville or Vogel or Jags then we have the basis of a strong if not small squad.
Moyes has already impleid he has the funds for one player so hopefully that will be him.
After all of the worrying as long as we sign a wide player with more quality than Osman to complete the midfield of cahill arteta carsley, neville or Vogel or Jags then we have the basis of a strong if not small squad.
Moyes has already impleid he has the funds for one player so hopefully that will be him.
Andy Tomczak
9 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:09:53
9 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:09:53
I think Vogel would be a great signing - i think we need a holding midfielder to take over from Cars. Surely this is what we mean when we say boosting our squad - a quality international on a free.
I really hope we can seal the deal, then bring on Manny on a loan, replace Beattie with Alan Smith and we?ve got a wicked squad
I really hope we can seal the deal, then bring on Manny on a loan, replace Beattie with Alan Smith and we?ve got a wicked squad
David Barks
10 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:11:38
10 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:11:38
Along with Vogel, it appears that we are strongly linked with Brazilian defender Edu Dracena of Fenerbahce. If we do land these two players, we would have two experienced quality players who have played many games in European competition, providing cover in defense and midfield. This would appear to mean that Moyes is quite happy to use Arteta, Osman, VDM, Mcfadden on the wings, interchangeably ofcourse. We may not think that these are the best wingers, with the exception of Arteta, but Moyes seems quite content with them. I have to say that if we get these two players coupled with the earlier signings of Jagielka, Lucas, and the contract extensions of Cahill, Arteta, Vaughan, and Anichebe, this would in the end have to be considered a descent transfer season after all. We’ll just have to see what happens, it’s still only rumours ofcourse.
Connor Rohrer
11 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:25:22
11 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:25:22
Sounds like he has a good pedigree. International, captain, AC Milan, Real Betis, PSV. Yes he is 30 but for a free it would be a bargain. Hopefully we can get 2 or 3 years out of him. Someone told me he is like a more elegant version of Carsley.
Adam Carey
12 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:34:53
12 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:34:53
Nick, I looked him up on Wikipedia earlier this afternoon and the Everton move wasn’t there so this isn’t a case of internet rumours.
Its come from the official site.
Quite a lot is being made about his ability to hold up the ball. Much as I love the Cars, his crab-like passing has always let down is good tackling.
Also, at 30 Moyes won’t be able to drill the short passing out of him!
Its come from the official site.
Quite a lot is being made about his ability to hold up the ball. Much as I love the Cars, his crab-like passing has always let down is good tackling.
Also, at 30 Moyes won’t be able to drill the short passing out of him!
David Barks
13 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:35:02
13 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:35:02
Yeah Connor, 2 or 3 years out of a seasoned international who is a free transfer would be very good. I think we will see him in the starting line up for the Uefa Cup games before we see him starting in the Premiership, as it might take him a bit more time to adapt to the English style, but he has much experience in European games. I’m happy with this one, I really am, and I’m glad to see it on the "official" site as it shows we finally have a potential signing to discuss that isn’t complete rumor.
Jay Wilson
14 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:37:02
14 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:37:02
This sounds like the right way to go, picking up someone on a free to do a good job and add experience to the squad. Hopefully leaving what little cash we have to spend on the flair we need on the wings.
Shaka Islam
15 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:57:30
15 Posted 17/07/2007 at 16:57:30
Great another defender being linked. Now it?s a Brazilian. Here?s the formation for next season. 8-1-1. Someone should tell Moyes we need another attacking player.
Nick Harris
16 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:05:34
16 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:05:34
yes hes a good player , yes its a good transfer (for free), but why the hell do we need another defencive midfeilder ?
carsley jags neville da silva and even yobo can fill that place !
even a blind rs knows we need a playmaking midfeilder and/or a decent winger ! the 2 players we dont/didnt need are a defender and a defensive midfeilder !
sorry but i think moyes is actually laughable this summer.its starting to look like he hasnt got a clue.
carsley jags neville da silva and even yobo can fill that place !
even a blind rs knows we need a playmaking midfeilder and/or a decent winger ! the 2 players we dont/didnt need are a defender and a defensive midfeilder !
sorry but i think moyes is actually laughable this summer.its starting to look like he hasnt got a clue.
David Barks
17 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:10:33
17 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:10:33
Shaka, Yobo is going to be gone for about 2 months for the African Nations Cup, leaving Lescott and Stubbs, so we need another defender. It’s called having cover. Having the ability to partner Lescott with a Brazilian international instead of having to depend on an old Stubbs doesn’t sound bad to me. We currently have AJ, Vaughan, Victor, Beattie, Mcfadden, Lucas, as strikers, but that doesn’t mean we will be playing them all at the same time. Come on, people have been crying for more players to cover the demands of this coming season in Europe, and now you’re complaining about it.
David Barks
18 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:14:38
18 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:14:38
Nick, the most important thing is having a strong defense, and that includes good holding midfielders. Scoring a bunch of goals is great, but if you don’t have a good defense you will never get the opportunity to attack as you will always be pulling the ball out of your own net. There is nothing wrong with having options, but Yobo has already proved to not be up to the task as a holding midfielder. That said, I think we just need to come to grips with the fact that Moyes sees his wingers as Arteta, Osman, Van Der Meyde, and Mcfadden.
Shaka Islam
19 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:20:31
19 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:20:31
David Barks. Yobo will be away on African nation but we have jag who can play in defense. he has pace and good technique. That was his best position for Sheff utd last season. I watched him a few times last season and thought he was a decent player. He also scores the odd goal from long distance. We also have Neville who can play there. If we sign Vogel that?s another player who can play in that position. I just think the little money we have will be better spent on our midfield. We need a left winger to give the midfield a good balance.
David Barks
20 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:29:40
20 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:29:40
I agree with you Shaka that we have a good amount of players who can play there and that it would be good to get a winger. But we are getting Vogel, a midfielder, on a free transfer. If we were spending 3 Million on the move then I would have a problem with it, but it’s on a free and he will provide experience and quality.
Shaka Islam
21 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:44:47
21 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:44:47
Spurs and Man City are being linked with Bulgerian left winger Petrov. May be Everton should take a look at him.
David Barks
22 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:52:05
22 Posted 17/07/2007 at 17:52:05
Where does Petrov play currently? I wonder how much he would cost if Spurs are linked with him and now that City’s corrupt Thai politician owner is willing to spend all this corrupt money. But if he is good maybe we should take a look at him.
Shaka Islam
23 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:15:39
23 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:15:39
David Martin Petrov plays for Athletico Madrid. He is being linked with a 8mill move to Spurs. That?s us out of the picture.
David Barks
24 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:21:51
24 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:21:51
Well it looks like it is only City that are currently in talks with him for 6.5 Million. He’s a 27 year old who missed almost all of last season with a knee ligament injury. I don’t think the price would be too high, but I don’t think Moyes would want to have the possibility of signing another Van Der Meyde. In either case, it looks like City are going to get him.
Sean La Douche
25 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:21:54
25 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:21:54
any1 slagging off the signing of Vogel are a bit unfair.
he is not another carsley or jagielka. neither of them has the european experience of vogel, or international (in terms of playin in world cups etc.)
in a few yrs we cud see jags in defensive mid role (probs right bak this yr) an vogel be replacment centre half like stubbs may be this yr.
i think, esspecially for a free, he may be a very gud signing and we shud wait until the season starts to critisise him or the manager.
he is not another carsley or jagielka. neither of them has the european experience of vogel, or international (in terms of playin in world cups etc.)
in a few yrs we cud see jags in defensive mid role (probs right bak this yr) an vogel be replacment centre half like stubbs may be this yr.
i think, esspecially for a free, he may be a very gud signing and we shud wait until the season starts to critisise him or the manager.
Jay Wilson
26 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:29:46
26 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:29:46
I can?t believe us as a fanbase. We are crying out for numbers, we get and established international on a free and we are up in arms. Yes we need players in other postions but this is a FREE TRANSFER to bolster the squad, see it for what it is and be happy for 5 minutes.
David Barks
27 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:37:27
27 Posted 17/07/2007 at 18:37:27
Jay, I don’t think many people are up in arms. A few people we will never make happy, no matter what we do. If we signed Ronaldinho I could see someone saying "yeah but his tricks won’t work in the premiership". I’m happy, you’re happy, most are happy, so lets not let others get us down. That said, I can understand some concerns over wanting a different "type" of player, but Vogul will be a solid addition to our side for Europe and the league.
Jeremy Sweetnam
28 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:03:29
28 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:03:29
Just a point, but I dont think "coup of the summer" can apply to someone that NO toffeeweb poster has ever heard of. He may be an "international" and the best captain in switzerland, but lets not forget that as england fans we expect to drub them 5-0. Real Betis is hardly La Liga challengers either.
In all honesty, I read this report with dismay. It truly shows how little money we have available for transfers. Even Sunderland have spent £16 million so far this closed season... and they?re a Championship club.
Mid-table mediocrity beckons I?m afraid Gents. And I will dance naked around Goodison Park (or whatever it is to be named...) if we finish in a European spot this coming season. Thats a promise.
In all honesty, I read this report with dismay. It truly shows how little money we have available for transfers. Even Sunderland have spent £16 million so far this closed season... and they?re a Championship club.
Mid-table mediocrity beckons I?m afraid Gents. And I will dance naked around Goodison Park (or whatever it is to be named...) if we finish in a European spot this coming season. Thats a promise.
Randy Collie
29 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:15:35
29 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:15:35
Jeremy - you read the report with dismay?
We?re close to signing a player, who well now well known, appears to have a bit of a pedigree and will surely be a great addition to our squad, on a free transfer. But you would rather us spend £16m on the calibre of players that Sunderland have bought this summer?
This country.
We?re close to signing a player, who well now well known, appears to have a bit of a pedigree and will surely be a great addition to our squad, on a free transfer. But you would rather us spend £16m on the calibre of players that Sunderland have bought this summer?
This country.
Jeremy Sweetnam
30 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:18:20
30 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:18:20
Randy, I havent stopped laughing! Well known? Come on...
You are right though... "appears to have a pedigree". Dont they all, eh?
These people...
You are right though... "appears to have a pedigree". Dont they all, eh?
These people...
Jeremy Sweetnam
31 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:23:56
31 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:23:56
ps: Pedigree players rarely get ditched by Milan clubs (VDM springs to mind...), and I think you?ll find that players allowed to leave on a free and not courted by the major players are usually not wanted by their clubs... but I?ll leave you to "go figure!"
David Barks
32 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:26:51
32 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:26:51
The guy has been capped nearly 100 times Jeremy. He has played for PSV and AC Milan before Real Betis. He is proven.
Tony Ainscough
33 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:38:35
33 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:38:35
How many fucking holding midfielders do we want?
Steve Williams
34 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:18:50
34 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:18:50
I’m sorry Jeremy. That is some of the worst ’shite’ I have ever read on TW. Its worse than any postive spin ’Doddy’ could write.
I know the point you are trying to make but just to rephrase your wording a little’ Sunderland a team with championship pedigree have spent 16million on shite to add to the several million pounds worth of carp they already had in their squad. If they are lucky enough to be a top flight team in 2008/2009 some of their quality signings will still seek pastures new again either by choice or force. Clubs with no real chance of success in this division are gambling on a 10th place or better finish. Those that fail will be selling like its the latest fashion next summer as they need to trim their wage bills and set more realistic targets. 50 million the golden egg which is the Tv money sounds like a lot of money this year but 50 grand and above wage packets soon add up ie 2.25million per player a year on top of final or second instalments for players at the end of the year. 50 million soon goes and many clubs will use a large part for ongoing costs as well. Let the other teams spending spend their money and let us concentrate on our real rivals, ie spurs and above who we would do well to stick close to next season or indeed overtake as a completely optimistic viewpoint. Europe or not next year, we still won’t be selling to the extremes some will. Whatever the arguments about the lack of investment we will move forwards slowly, not much you can do if you don’t like it that way but continue to express your opinions and view points.
Two words ’KIERON RICHARDSON- and the scenario Sunderland have especially a bad season this year-one guarantee is he would definately not be purchased by any team inside the top 10 if they were relegated. Sunderland have bought a player there who is not interested in the team but he’ll be more than happy with his wage packet, after all who else placed a bid or more acurately who did Sunderland outbid? 2nd rate teams there will always be and there’ll be more than half a dozen in this league every season.
I know the point you are trying to make but just to rephrase your wording a little’ Sunderland a team with championship pedigree have spent 16million on shite to add to the several million pounds worth of carp they already had in their squad. If they are lucky enough to be a top flight team in 2008/2009 some of their quality signings will still seek pastures new again either by choice or force. Clubs with no real chance of success in this division are gambling on a 10th place or better finish. Those that fail will be selling like its the latest fashion next summer as they need to trim their wage bills and set more realistic targets. 50 million the golden egg which is the Tv money sounds like a lot of money this year but 50 grand and above wage packets soon add up ie 2.25million per player a year on top of final or second instalments for players at the end of the year. 50 million soon goes and many clubs will use a large part for ongoing costs as well. Let the other teams spending spend their money and let us concentrate on our real rivals, ie spurs and above who we would do well to stick close to next season or indeed overtake as a completely optimistic viewpoint. Europe or not next year, we still won’t be selling to the extremes some will. Whatever the arguments about the lack of investment we will move forwards slowly, not much you can do if you don’t like it that way but continue to express your opinions and view points.
Two words ’KIERON RICHARDSON- and the scenario Sunderland have especially a bad season this year-one guarantee is he would definately not be purchased by any team inside the top 10 if they were relegated. Sunderland have bought a player there who is not interested in the team but he’ll be more than happy with his wage packet, after all who else placed a bid or more acurately who did Sunderland outbid? 2nd rate teams there will always be and there’ll be more than half a dozen in this league every season.
Neil Patten
35 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:54:02
35 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:54:02
He will probably fail his medical... that?s what they normally do. Isn?t it?
Chris James
36 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:49:17
36 Posted 17/07/2007 at 19:49:17
Looks like a great signing to me (assuming he does sign), offering further strength in depth in midfield, challenge for places and some much needed European experience.
We do clearly need to add to our midfield creativity though, preferably on the wing (with Cahill and/or Arteta in the centre we only have Osman - skillful but lightweight, Shandy - injured/drunk and Faddy - who rankly prefers to play up front).
Maybe Beefy’s got Riquelme lined up next?
We do clearly need to add to our midfield creativity though, preferably on the wing (with Cahill and/or Arteta in the centre we only have Osman - skillful but lightweight, Shandy - injured/drunk and Faddy - who rankly prefers to play up front).
Maybe Beefy’s got Riquelme lined up next?
David Barks
37 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:13:31
37 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:13:31
Arteta is a winger now, that is where he played most of last season. Arteta and Osman did well there last year, despite everyone slamming Osman it was his hard work holding of Davids that set up AJ’s goal against Spurs at White Hart Lane this past year. And the guy is still young, who’s to say he won’t be better this next year, just as he was better this past year than he was the year before that. Riquelme aint coming though, sorry.
Dutch Schaffaer
38 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:13:39
38 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:13:39
You know I agree with everyone who says we need more attacking players but that doesn’t mean we should pass on Johann Vogel.
Johann Vogel is a very experienced player who is available on a free. He’s a player who has performed at the top level and has a Euro experience our young squad will benefit from.
Yes we do need some flair players but Johann Vogel on a free is too good a deal to pass on, especially when you consider that most importantly it adds another face to our small squad.
Johann Vogel is a very experienced player who is available on a free. He’s a player who has performed at the top level and has a Euro experience our young squad will benefit from.
Yes we do need some flair players but Johann Vogel on a free is too good a deal to pass on, especially when you consider that most importantly it adds another face to our small squad.
Seb St Clare
39 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:16:44
39 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:16:44
What a great week it?s suddenly become! A bright new ground in prospect and a top International signing in the offing. So much for all those doom and gloom merchants at the weekend! Everton are indeed on the up and up!
Randy Collie
40 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:42:25
40 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:42:25
That was a typo Jeremy - it should have said "not well known", not "now well known". I thought it was quite obvious what I meant as what I actually typed didn?t make sense, but when someone like you wants to clutch any old straw I guess you?ll grasp it any way.
Brian Waring
41 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:40:57
41 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:40:57
Wow Seb, you're easily pleased mate. "A top international signing in the offing"... Did you know it was Switzerland he played for? Also, Does anybody know what his injury history is like? It?s just when I looked him up on the internet, I noticed he only played 14 games for Betis last year and half were as a sub. And in his stint with Milan before Betis he played exactly the same number of games for them: 14. It just doesn?t seem like a lot of games he has played in the last couple of years. Let's hope he is not another Shandy Andy...
Jeremy Sweetnam
42 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:47:13
42 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:47:13
No Randy, I just read what you wrote.
Which was "well known".
Actually, I mistyped all my response. I meant to say "every" toffeeweb user has read about him and "he?s fantastic".
Oh and steve - give me a break. Its shit because I date to challenge the signing of an also-ran? Tell you what mate - why dont you be brave enough to put your money where your mouth is? I?ll bet you £100 that by the end of the season, an independent TW poll shows that he was not a first choice midfielder over the course of a season. Take the bet - or dont criticise.
Which was "well known".
Actually, I mistyped all my response. I meant to say "every" toffeeweb user has read about him and "he?s fantastic".
Oh and steve - give me a break. Its shit because I date to challenge the signing of an also-ran? Tell you what mate - why dont you be brave enough to put your money where your mouth is? I?ll bet you £100 that by the end of the season, an independent TW poll shows that he was not a first choice midfielder over the course of a season. Take the bet - or dont criticise.
Jeremy Sweetnam
43 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:52:13
43 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:52:13
Oh Brian, dont upset them with pragmatic reasoning and proper research. Let them wear their rose-tinted specs and pretend he is a quality international signing...
Some of their from-the-hip responses have been the worst rubbish I?ve ever read on any forum on the internet...
Some of their from-the-hip responses have been the worst rubbish I?ve ever read on any forum on the internet...
Steve McBride
44 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:46:57
44 Posted 17/07/2007 at 20:46:57
And they say sarcasm doesn?t come across very well in the posts - nice one Seb
Brian Waring
45 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:00:17
45 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:00:17
Steve Mc,its got that way now with the posts mate,that you can’t tell if someone is being sarcastic or being totally genuine.Apologies Seb if you were being sarcastic.You will probalby reply now and say you were genuine.
David Barks
46 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:07:09
46 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:07:09
Here is a link you can go to and see what he played and against who.
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/players/gamelog?id=11064&cc=5739
It looks like he played all of September and October, missed November, then played throughout Dec. and January, played part of Feb., then missed March and April, came back and played the end of april and May to finish the season. If you go to the squad and see how much each player played, it appears that there was a lot of rotation among midfielders. So there is your research done. But you’ll always find ways to bitch and moan won’t you.
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/players/gamelog?id=11064&cc=5739
It looks like he played all of September and October, missed November, then played throughout Dec. and January, played part of Feb., then missed March and April, came back and played the end of april and May to finish the season. If you go to the squad and see how much each player played, it appears that there was a lot of rotation among midfielders. So there is your research done. But you’ll always find ways to bitch and moan won’t you.
David Barks
47 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:13:52
47 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:13:52
By the way Brian, maybe you should do your math again,
"It?s just when I looked him up on the internet, I noticed he only played 14 games for Betis last year and half were as a sub."
I count 3 games that he came on as a sub, and I also count him playing 17 games in the Spanish league and starting 14 of them last season, so lets see 3 goes into 17.....
"It?s just when I looked him up on the internet, I noticed he only played 14 games for Betis last year and half were as a sub."
I count 3 games that he came on as a sub, and I also count him playing 17 games in the Spanish league and starting 14 of them last season, so lets see 3 goes into 17.....
Brian Waring
48 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:31:19
48 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:31:19
David,I stand corrected.I checked wikipedia and your right it does say he played 17 games for Betis last season.But,it is still worrying,that he has only played 31 games in total in 2 years for his clubs.I just wanted to know if anybody knew what his injury record was like.
Dutch Schaffaer
49 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:24:21
49 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:24:21
How about we agree to give the lad a chance? You don’t get to Captain your country at a World Cup and play for PSV Eindhoven/AC Milan unless you have something about you.
Players like Carsley and Jagielka can learn from his Euro experience and nobody can be upset at seeing another option in the small squad.
At the end of the day he may turn out to be very useful or he may be past his best and not good enough for the quality squad we now have.
But he’s a free transfer so how can we lose? Stop moaning, lets at least see him kick a ball before writing him off.
Players like Carsley and Jagielka can learn from his Euro experience and nobody can be upset at seeing another option in the small squad.
At the end of the day he may turn out to be very useful or he may be past his best and not good enough for the quality squad we now have.
But he’s a free transfer so how can we lose? Stop moaning, lets at least see him kick a ball before writing him off.
David Barks
50 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:40:08
50 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:40:08
Brian, thanks for admitting your mistake, much appreciated and something that most don’t do. But if you look at that link, he also played in a lot of games for Switzerland over qualifying for and in the World Cup, and a game in the Copa Del Ray, bringing the total that he played in all competitions last year to 34, so that’s not all that bad.
Brian Waring
51 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:44:51
51 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:44:51
Not a bad return for last season as you say David.Also,I suppose if you play for someone like Milan,unless your one of the superstars,you first team opportunities are going to be limited.Fingers crossed he does the bizz for us.But,at the end of the day there’s not much of a gamble taken, if you are getting something for free.( I know you still have to pay wages).
David Barks
52 Posted 17/07/2007 at 22:03:17
52 Posted 17/07/2007 at 22:03:17
Exactly my thoughts Brian. If we were paying 3 million or something to buy him, then I would be pissed, but a guy with his experience in Europe on a free, that’s good business in my opinion.
Daz Roberts
53 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:55:54
53 Posted 17/07/2007 at 21:55:54
Just gutted we couldn't come up with a deal for Fernandes that lads goin places and leaving us behind. why take him on loan in the first place we knew the tag on his head he couldnt have done much more in 6 months, lack of ambition Everton shame on you!
Eugene Beh
54 Posted 18/07/2007 at 03:32:17
54 Posted 18/07/2007 at 03:32:17
Lets not get into any arguement on Vogel. He is ’FREE’ and he is a useful cover for our team (period). Lets see how he performs during pre-season matches and the first 5 opening matches, then we can make judgement on him later. For now, lets welcome him! =)
Dutch Schaffaer
55 Posted 18/07/2007 at 08:11:44
55 Posted 18/07/2007 at 08:11:44
Daz Roberts, the idea of taking Fernandes on loan was because Everton needed an extra push in their quest to qualify for Europe.
Fernandes was drafted in to do a job, help get Everton into Europe. Something he did very well.
Moyes plan was to bring in a good player on loan to cement the Euro position. An ambitious plan which worked perfectly.
How can bringing in a good player to qualify for Europe show lack of ambition?
Fernandes was drafted in to do a job, help get Everton into Europe. Something he did very well.
Moyes plan was to bring in a good player on loan to cement the Euro position. An ambitious plan which worked perfectly.
How can bringing in a good player to qualify for Europe show lack of ambition?
Brian Waring
56 Posted 18/07/2007 at 09:37:19
56 Posted 18/07/2007 at 09:37:19
Dutch,you say "how can bringing in a good player to qualify for europe show a lack of ambition"I agree, it doesn’t show a lack of ambition.But,do you know what?Then getting rid of that quality player who helped us qualify for europe,does show a lack of ambition.
Dutch Schaffaer
57 Posted 18/07/2007 at 11:08:44
57 Posted 18/07/2007 at 11:08:44
Brian, Moyes isn’t getting rid of Fernandes, he simply doesn’t have the funds to keep him.
Its not lack of ambition, its lack of money. If Moyes had a £50 million war chest then I’m sure Fernandes, Koumas & Nugent would all be signed but thats not the case.
It would be crazy for Moyes to spend what little money he does have on a Fernandes who still has alot to prove.
Moyes has a decision to make spend all his money on a talented-yet-unproven youngster or use that money to bring in 4 or 5 solid players that will undoubtedly do a job.
Remember Harry Redknapp, famed for signing everyone at any price, also decided against spending big on Fernandes so there has to be some doubts about him.
Its not lack of ambition, its lack of money. If Moyes had a £50 million war chest then I’m sure Fernandes, Koumas & Nugent would all be signed but thats not the case.
It would be crazy for Moyes to spend what little money he does have on a Fernandes who still has alot to prove.
Moyes has a decision to make spend all his money on a talented-yet-unproven youngster or use that money to bring in 4 or 5 solid players that will undoubtedly do a job.
Remember Harry Redknapp, famed for signing everyone at any price, also decided against spending big on Fernandes so there has to be some doubts about him.
Nick Xenos
58 Posted 18/07/2007 at 12:29:28
58 Posted 18/07/2007 at 12:29:28
Vogel has apparently agreed terms to a 3-year deal and will have his medical today, according to TribalFootball
Ron Ronsson
59 Posted 18/07/2007 at 17:39:04
59 Posted 18/07/2007 at 17:39:04
i think vogel will pass medical and join us ,just probably be another andy van der meyde cmon moyes no more deffensive players
.....i heard we are in talks with pienaar from dortmund i hear he plays midfeild dont know were though???
.....i heard we are in talks with pienaar from dortmund i hear he plays midfeild dont know were though???
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1 Posted 17/07/2007 at 14:28:50
Some may raise an eyebrow at his age (30) but Everton's small squad will probably see a number of youngsters playing a part next season so a more experienced player is very welcome. Plus he's a free-transfer, at the very least he adds a number to our small squad without taking away from whatever transfer funds Moyes may have.