Hear Hear Tom well said!

To answer your questions Tom:

1) Why is there a high possibility it will seriously erode our fan base, either in the short term or the long term? In spite of 20 years of mediocrity against the regular successes of the ’bours, our support has held up remarkably well. Our match day support is not drawn exclusively from postcode L4. We are relocating four miles - not to sheep farm in Cumbria. You must believe our fan base is very fickle if you think it is going to collapse overnight, or even in the long term. I have greater faith in them than that. I also believe that we should not simply be looking to retain our existing fan base, but extending it - in this media savvy era - beyond the city boundaries.

2) What is the point of your statement? Are you implying that both BK and KW are only doing this to turn a profit and line their pockets? Even if that is true and they make a killing, then surely that will mean their strategy was correct, that Everton attracts big money investors and the club benefits. As for what are we sacrificing, much has recently been made of Joe Beardsley’s club’s account article. We are not sacrificing a great deal, but we stand to gain a helluva lot.

3) Again, just what do you mean by this vague question? And does it not contradict your second question? BK and KW are beaten up for not attracting corporate investors, yet people seemingly completely overlook that to put the Kirkby deal together they have done just that, at very low cost to the club, with UK’s biggest retailer. Make your mind up, Tom... do you want to attract investment or not? Do you want BK and KW at the helm or not? Your questions 2 and 3 seem to tread on each others toes. You also seem willing to surrender and submit to the ’bours. Do we passively accept the benefits they might gain from their American investors, or do we get into the ring with them and compete? I know what I prefer.

4) Where to start in answering this one? Improved attendances, more corporate boxes, better catering and match day facilities, improved day-to-day income streams outside the match day experience currently not available at GP...how’s that for starters? And even if it is "just" £10 million extra a season available for transfers, that is £10 million more than we’ve had to spend this summer.

5) Invert your question. Will the likes of Cahill, Yobo, etc hang about if we simply stagnate and do nothing, which appears to be your alternative? To use your own phrase, I dont think so.

And finally, this: "we should be looking at finding an investor to build a stadium and invest in our club". We have - Knowsley Council and Tesco. It’s a helluva of a deal... not quite in the city which really seems to be your only major sticking point, but "part of a major development shops appartments" that you desire.

That is the responsibility of Bill as you say. He has found it in Kirkby with Tesco.

Now... why can’t contributors who are anti-Kirkby acknowledge this...?

Great response Art,im a pro-kirkby and believe in everything you have just said! The anti-kirkby lot just want us to look at it from there point of view but are to blind and sentimental to see it from ours!

Hear Hear Art well said!

Ive heard this a few times from the anti-kirkby followers, are they speaking for themselves? I for one will be sad if we move to Kirkby, Goodison has a lot of memories for us all but Kirkby will have its own memories one day too, I for one would travel to that sheep farm in cumbria if thats what it took to see my beloved blues - unlike some of the anti-kirkby followers I see on here

What part of that £10m will be ringfenced to service the Kirkby build debt? The figures provided by the club so far don’t add up. Add to this 1000 car parking spaces and just where will people park? I heard there will be park and ride from Aintree, well from where I travel Upholland that would mean driving past the ground to come back to it on public transport then wait to get back to my car and return on public transport again and didn’t Ikea get knockback from that area because of potential traffic congestion problems?

Art will Cahill and the likes stick around if they also fail to take the bullshit they are served up by the management is perhaps a more pertinent question, a strengthened squad?

Nobody with SERIOUS financial interests and motives is going to invest in a club with a long term debt of say 30 million when he, she or they would have to spend another 100 million building a stadium that has the turnover to make their money back. Think about it, they would have to stump up say 50 million to buy the club, 30 million to clear the debt and then another 100 million to build the new stadium!! It doesn’t make good business sense really. I’m confident that once we DO move then you may see a lot of interest from investors. I don’t think Tesco are looking to screw us over, at the end of the day any shop on the new site is gonna have takings of 1 million a week while if the old Goodison site does become a Tesco then thats another million quid a week business for them. I would like to see a bit more detail from the club on the move just to make sure but it does seem a prima facie good deal. However, if the KEIOC guys can come up with some detailed plans of how we could move forward at Goodison or the Loop site then I would be very interested to see them provided it doesn’t involve getting a 100 million quid loan to build it because that would cripple us even more surely?

It was also published a significant time ago that the securitised debt if I remember correctly with Bear Stearns could only be paid off early with substantial penalties so the overall debt of the club is a little hard to calculate in terms of early clearance for a new owner where some could be cleared quickly and others couldn’t without prohibitive penalties.

It doesnt really matter what we vote anyway because at the end of the day Kenwright or Wyness are going to rig it so that they get what they want!

Dont think Everton can rig it Shaun as they have got the electoral commision in to deal with it to put anti-kirkbys minds at rest!

A ?yes? vote only means that negotiations can proceed further and not that it becomes a done deal! A ?yes? vote would just mean that LCC would have a move on if they want to supply an alternative whereas a ?no? vote means they can take there time and if it goes tits up then oh well!!

Gavin, Tom’s original comment and your (challenge...?) to me on what the players may or may not do in any given scenario is highly specaulative bullshit, dressed up as fact or inevitable consequence of an invented or imagined situation.

As such, it lends absolutely nothing to the ongoing debate.

So what you’re actually saying, Ken, is that if you want to vote to stay in Liverpool, you should vote ’yes’ to Kirkby.

God, I bet Bill loves you.

Gavin you can get a train from Upholland to Kirkby and then walk to the proposed new ground in less than 5 minutes. Train from Upholland to Kirkby takes 14 minutes, so you can leave home and be in the ground or pubs in Kirkby Town Centre in 20 minutes. Do some research instead of being negative all the time.

Bob have you ever been to Upholland station? Tie that to the fact I drive two disabled family members to every home game and you begin to get the bigger picture. I haven’t taken a train from Upholland since I was very young and last time I looked there is a bare concrete platform with no shelter and god knows how often the trains run. So Bob hows about that for research without even fucking looking.

Oh and Bob, if you want to be a club lackie that’s your choice, mine is saying it how I see it, not negative it’s called my point of view