ToffeeWeb - Season 2007-08

The Mail Bag

Shambles

I visited St Georges Hall today with a fairly open mind and came away unimpressed with what KEIOC had to offer.

If 'presentation' is everything it was a shambles. The first three posters decrying the move were littered with poor grammer [Irony alert! — Ed] and spelling mistakes.

"Annfield" and "Warren Bradly" two such examples. But to cap it all, no-one was present from the Bestway Group, except a young girl who was 'PR' and quickly deferred any questions asked of her to a member of KEIOC standing close by.

But to cap it all, absolutely no-one bothered to attend from LCC, despite it being on their doorstep.

The content was questionable to say the least, there seemed to be several pictures of the same stadium from different angles (with no roof apparently) with plenty of accompanying text exclaiming how it was possible for Everton to build a new ground on the site of Goodison Park, whilst demolishing the old one bit by bit, but wait for it, with no loss of revenue!! Remarkable.

They really did themselves no favours. Everyone was asked on exit to declare their intentions by marking on a slip of paper which had the question '' Do you want to move out of Liverpool''

Speaking to a number of people there, most had already decided before entering the venue which option to choose so the question was pointless.

I feel that KEIOC presented the illusion to anybody who attended that a viable alternative was 'done and dusted' and investors already lined up.

In reality no such parties exist and the only credible plan in place whether people like it or not is the Kirkby option.

If fans decide not to move to Kirkby it should be on the basis that they consider Kirkby unsuitable, not the alternative offered by KEIOC which quite frankly was a joke.

The club have quite rightly been accused of propaganda tactics of late with prepared 'statements' from players supporting the move who probably won't be around in 2010, if that's the case KEIOC should be a little more transparent as to who the 'mystery' investors are who are prepared to fund the 'loop' alternative.

In essence, the KEIOC proposal had no real substance and will only serve to muddy the waters for many people who will come away from the venue convinced that a real alternative is in place.
Steve Hogan, Chester Posted 03/08/2007 at 22:12:00

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Lyndon

Steve, criticising the professionalism of KEIOC's presentation is missing the point entirely. They were working with next to no budget, particularly compared with the resources at Everton FC's disposal and had to pull a lot of the material together quickly as a collaborative effort by FANS.

Furthermore, the meat of the Bestway proposal (and you must have missed their more senior representative who spoke at length with several fans about the key issues) and the investment details for the "Loop" site will not be revealed in detail until next week.

Rather than criticise KEIOC, perhaps we should congratulate them for packing St Georges Hall for the day and bringing some alternatives to the fans' consciousness.

colin malone
1 Posted 03/08/2007 at 23:09:17

Well said Lyndon. These people[KEIOC]were giving their own time up, for their aims. Not to line their own pockets.

Brian Waring
2 Posted 03/08/2007 at 23:08:09

Steve, these lads at KEIOC are just like us,Evertonians,who are concerned about what is happening to the club.Un-like Wyness they won’t be paid mega bucks for their time.And for some fans to criticise them is bang out of order.If your willing to be lead on a leash to Kirkby by BK and KW,that’s up to you,but,some of us are not willing to do that until every avenue has been explored.And,I for one thank the lads from KEIOC,for their time and hard work to show the club there is other options.

Peter Jones
3 Posted 03/08/2007 at 23:20:17

Dear Lyndon,

I read the contributions to this site many times a day. This is the most infomative information base I have found. I often find the editorial staffs opininions polarised,frequentley diametrically opposed to my own. I am now sat here spannered but please, regardless of my opinion, please keep the forum open for all blues.

COYB and vote no!!!!!

chris taggart
4 Posted 04/08/2007 at 00:05:06

I to went to the third floor jury room of st Georges hall and whilst it was full, the suggestion or impression that st Georges hall was packed full of evertonians is wide of the mark. In fact their was some sort of music festival/rally to save the Mathew street festival, in the main hall, so there was no chance of any LCC members being anywhere near that part of town today

I make no secret that I think the way KEIOC have conducted themselves has been infantile in parts misguided in others and downright disgraceful at times I do applaud the effort taken by ordinary evertonians

However i have to agree with Steve Hogan in that if you are a no voter you must vote no only if you feel the Kirkby option is unsuitable.
I felt the KIEOC representatives were very anti BK and KW today to the point of fanaticism at one point decrying the fact that if we move to Kirkby BK will trouser 20,000,000 and KW will receive a cut and they will both bugger off, failing to see that that scenario would mean some mystery benefactor would have to (heavily) invest in the club for this to happen (is this not a win win?)

I think Keioc would have been better to source the sugar daddy first then with the possibility of funding in place the possibility of redevelopment/other sites could have been a more concrete option to explore

Also why is no one questioning why bestway are suddenly bending over backwards to get rid of the loop? What?s in it for them? Is the land viable at all? If so why has it not been developed sooner? i saw a best way card by the ballot box but no rep from bestway although i am not doubting they were there at some point

I will leave you with this gem from the consultation if we want maddonna to hold a concert at any new stadium she needs 12 months notice, but lets face it she aint coming to the loop either given we?ve got the nice shiny new kings doc arena

James Mackenzie
5 Posted 04/08/2007 at 00:46:17

Reading the detail behind Tom Hughes/KEIOC’s plan for the redevelopment of Goodison was much more inspiring for me than the way the club have tried to sell the move to Kirkby.
As ever the problem is how the project could be funded but it has certainly made me even more likely - or certain - to cast a No vote.
I’m looking forward to seeing the "Loop" plans next week (or whenever they surface.) Even as someone living, and born, outside of liverpool I can understand the importance of remaining close to our roots and the centre of the city.
I’d just like to say well done to everyone involved in putting forward this alternative and trying to move the debate on from the current hobson’s choice.

Steve Rout
6 Posted 04/08/2007 at 08:30:01

So Lyndon, let me get this straight:

1) We shouldn’t criticise KEIOC for any lack of professionalism but at the same time we should debate their proposals at the same level as those produced by the club we love and which is recommended by board, manager and players. This on a decision that is one of the most important that our club has faced. And that even after they have dragged the name of our club, our board and our fans through the mud for their own purposes.
2) EFC are accused of stage-managing press releases and even transfer activity to manage a yes vote. Yet when the Loop proposals are delayed until just before the vote, obviating any kind of rational discussion on them, this is not deemed worthy of any such comment. (That and the belief that realistic "plans" can be cobbled together in two weeks by people that have had the last five years to discuss them and have done precisely nothing in that time.)

Neil
7 Posted 04/08/2007 at 09:02:36

I don’t believe the move to Kirkby has any hidden agenda. Financially it has to be the best option available to Everton at the moment. Yes we are seeing a few hastily arranged alternatives but they seem to little to late and lacking in any real substance regarding funding etc. Why has Warren Braddley waited until now to find alternatives? I’m not saying that one of the alternatives won’t work. But we can’t afford to wait to much longer. This summers transfer nightmare shows we are skint and need to find more revenue from somewhere. In an ideal scenario Everton could delay the vote just so they can look at the alternatives to see how funding etc would be achieved. But to delay the restructuring of Everton FC indefinitely would be suicidal.

Carlos Roberts
8 Posted 04/08/2007 at 11:57:42

I also attended the KEIOC event yesterday to get some information on the alternatives being put forward to the ?Kirkby Option?.
It?s important to know my ?starting point? on the potential ground move.

I do not believe that staying at a revamped Goodison is the right option for the club as we would always be in the shadow of LFC (both literally and metaphorically).

I am prepared (probably) to vote ?YES? to the Kirby site but am desperately searching for a reason to vote ?NO? if a financially viable option is available nearer our ?spiritual home?. I believe many Evertonians are in the same boat as me.

The event was very much focussed on the redevelopment of Goodison with lots of guys putting over their differing points of view in a small, hot, noisy room.
I was lucky as I got there fairly early and managed to talk to the Bestway guy (there was nobody from Liverpool City Council at the event!!!!).
He said that Bestway had approached LCC with a view to giving up the ?Loop Site? with Bestway/LCC forming a ’partnership’ in the redevelopment of the surrounding area. The Stadium build was the catalyst for this redevelopment, which could not take place without it. The income from this redevelopment would part-fund the building of the Stadium. He talked at length on the issues surrounding the ?Loop site?, but also said that LCC needed to ?pull their finger out?.

My overall impression from the meeting was:
· KEIOC?s overriding main concern is to keep Everton at Goodison.
· Bestway appear to have the enthusiasm to put forward an alternative to Kirkby (they freely admitted that they were still working on the ?figures? to produce a viable plan that could work for EFC).
· The ?Loop? location near to the City Centre would appear to have many attributes acceptable to Evertonians (as per Lyndon Lloyd?s article).
· The ?Loop? site is far from ideal and there are many questions about how suitable it is (I look forward to the Bestway/LCC proposal).
· LCC need to PROVE they are a worthy business partner to EFC (I don?t know how they do this, but soundbites from Warren Bradley will not be enough).
· I can understand EFC?s frustration with LCC.
In summary, I have not change my initial views but I look forward with anticipation to the ?Loop Plan?.

Paul Burns
9 Posted 04/08/2007 at 13:59:09

As if Kenwright has been transparent!!!!!

The pictures for the Kirkby shed are right off a computer game, the capacity and cost change by the day.
Its amateur and the KEIOC effort was brilliant when taken pound-for-pound.