ToffeeWeb - Season 2007-08

The Mail Bag

And If Ya Know Yer History....

Please help me. I have read many, sorry, every article on here regarding the ground move debate. I picked up on one point in particular... the one about Everton moving out of the city once before when we left Anfield. Well in the pub after the game on Saturday, I repeated this 'fact' only to be called the biggest prick in the world.

So my question is can the people stating said fact back this up with any evidence and if so where can I find it? This is nothing to do with the stadium debate ? I just need to prove I'm not repeating complete bollocks.

It may also help you prove to the peole on here who might have also thought you were talking bollocks...
Andy Baker, Liverpool Posted 13/08/2007 at 14:17:34

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Dave Roberts
1 Posted 13/08/2007 at 15:53:11

The current site of Goodison Park was not in the city of Liverpool when Everton moved there from Anfield. I was always under the impression that neither was Anfield in the city of Liverpool at that time but Lyndon thinks differently, he may be right. Everton as a village was not in Liverpool at the time Everton Football Club were founded.

Phil Bellis
2 Posted 13/08/2007 at 15:53:43

Hi Andy
a timeline of sorts...
1699 Liverpool becomes an independent parish (previously part of Walton)
1895 City Boundary extended to include the rest of West Derby, Wavertree, Toxteth and Walton, trebling the size of the city....
so it appears in 1892 Walton wasn’t within the City boundary (don’t know whether or not Anfield was).

I recall a book ’Football on Merseyside’ by Percy M Young gives great detail on the early years. (I think Michael will be able to tell you more about this book, if you’re interested )

Andy Baker
3 Posted 13/08/2007 at 16:23:47

Cheers lads...thread over.

thanks

btw Dave doing my own research i stumbled across information that stated that Stanley park was NOT inside liverpool BUT was owned by LCC.

SO. Does that mean that we were never actually inside Liverpool, moved to Walton which at the time was also outside liverpool and only came within the city boundary in 1895 when Walton became Liverpool???

jesus ive got a headache!

Greg Murphy
4 Posted 13/08/2007 at 16:34:27

Andy, if you go to Google Earth you’ll find a handy marker called "Liverpool 1868 overlay". Download it and you’ll see the boundary of Liverpool and Walton on the Hill. Neither Anfield nor Mere Green / Goodison were in Liverpool City in 1892. They were both about 50 yards outside it. The point that many make about Everton not being in the "city" of Liverpool when we were founded is true; because we wouldn’t have been, would we - for the city was only founded in 1880. We’re two years older than it. Both the Anfield site and Mere Green came under Walton-on-the-Hill and in fact Anfield actually stands atop the very "hill" in question (you’ll find real life boundary markers for WOH at Croppers Roundabout and in front of the pub opposite Georgeson’s Garage on the corner of Priory Road; you’ll also find a Borough of Liverpool marker right outside the Abbey pub at Goodison). That’s essentially why it never occurred to Everton to call itself "Liverpool" in the first place. By the time the Houlding spat came about (and it was W.E. Barclay’s idea to adopt the name of the city) they knew it was a matter of time (months as it turned out) before they could legitimately claim the title "Liverpool". It was an act of one-upmanship that characterised the whole bitter row at the time. As it transpired, Goodison and Anfield both came under the city boundary at the same time. So when people say Everton moved out of the city to go to Goodison, it ain’t true...because we weren’t even in it at Anfield.

Chris Jones (Wakefield)
5 Posted 13/08/2007 at 17:10:42

I seem to recall reading somewhere that the Red Shi*e originally wanted to call themselves Everton Athletic Football Club (or something like) but the Football League wouldn’t let them. That’s when they opted for Liverpool. This then apparently upset a Liverpool rugby club (and possibly South Liverpool FC as well) but the FL let this stand.

Greg Murphy
6 Posted 13/08/2007 at 17:16:50

Chris, that’s right. Houlding wanted to call them an "Everton" of sorts to claim the existing fan-base. Barclay was convinced that "Liverpool" was a stronger name to go with. When Houlding’s "Everton MK II" bid was thrown out he agreed to Barclay’s plan...which seemed flawed to begin with as we got 10,000 for our first game and they got less than 100. Sigh.

colin
7 Posted 14/08/2007 at 15:06:32

Thank you Greg Murphy for the information about anfield and Goodison.Maybe now these people will shut up about Everton moving out of the city once before!!