ToffeeWeb - Season 2007-08

The Mail Bag

Objective analysis

One of the two national TV channels over here started showing a Premier League highlights package on a Saturday evening about eight seasons ago. For a while, soon after the show had started, ratings were touch and go and there was a debate as to whether or not the show would be axed. The Evening Herald ran an article about the show and it's merits at the time. It raised two very interesting points.

The first was that Eamonn Dunphy and John Giles, the show's two main pundits, were that long gone from the game in England that they no longer had any ties to people employed as players, managers, coaches or directors. They simply didn't mix in the boardroom, in a corporate box, or on a golf course with any of the above.

As a result they could be as honest and as forthright as the liked with their analysis. Alan Hansen, Gary Lineker, Andy Gray and whoever else were pundits at the time in England, on the other hand, were still mixing with then current players, managers etc. The obvious inference was of course that you were going to get the bland neutral analysis you were getting at the time. They were hardly going to criticise their friends, were they?

The second interesting point the article made was that a lot of football jouralists in England would request a tape of the the show be sent across on Monday. The reason being of course the honesty involved with the analysis.

The show was kept on, and last season was interesting by way of one of it's pundits. Graeme Souness, without a club, got work doing punditry with the show. Articles citing interviews with him towards the end of the season highlighted how much his eyes had been opened. In fairness to the guy, he was actually a fairly good pundit, and once he got into the swing of it, was honest and objective. Alan Shearer, on the other hand, was a guest on a radio talkshow over here during last season and got savaged while trying to defend MOTD.

In an age when Sky and it's patronising approach dominates the sport, the show this side of the water really is a breath of fresh air.
Kieran Fitzgerald, Dublin Posted 16/08/2007 at 22:25:11

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Comments

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Nick Entwistle
1 Posted 17/08/2007 at 00:35:55

Good points there Kieran.

BBC I beleive just toe the line to promote the Premiership brand. When they’re so desperate in keeping their few remaining sports on the channel why would they rock the boat with the FA and lose out to ITV again?
Where as Hansen is a good pundit (just), Dixon, Shearer, Peacock, Lawrencen, Bright et al frustrate me with meaningless drivel to fill air space.
Gabriel Marcotti (sp?) who I believe has just moved from TalkSport to 5Live suffers from no such problem. He’ll happily dismiss a players ability and future career if he doesn’t rate them, and will tell you why he thinks so. He’s insightful and knows more than the old boys network above despite I believe never being a player.
Maybe he’s one to go well with Aidrian Chiles on MOTD2 who tries to be objective, but when you have Lee Dixon along side, it’s a lost cause.

If a player dives, why can’t a comentator say so, instead of saying ’there seemed very little contact there’, or just siding with the decision? Why treat us as idiots?

Andrew Humphrey
2 Posted 17/08/2007 at 02:04:32

Thanks for that Kieran, its good to know punditry is alive and well somewhere! I can understand commentators trying to appear neutral and simply report the facts, i.e. little contact, rather and guessing what the dirty little divers intentions are. But pundits are employed solely to give their opinions! I know its early in the season, but watching MOTD on the first weekend - Shearer really is ridiculous. Asked about all the relegation fodder for each team he thought ’they’ll be okay’. Well who does he think will go down? Someone’s got to. Football coverage in England has been all the poorer since Rodney Marsh made that albeit misjudged, but really quite well formed pun about the toon army.

Robin Byrne
3 Posted 17/08/2007 at 07:13:55

Great point Kieran, "The Premiership" is must see TV over here alright, plus its on around 7/8pm so its the first to show highlights of the games. Good analysis, even when Ray Houghton is on! A plus that you neglected to mention though is that Trevor Steven is a regular pundit.

philip mcavoy
4 Posted 17/08/2007 at 08:44:12

Eamonn Dunphy is the worst pundit ever. John Barnes has better analytical talents than him.
He can say what he likes because he’s like a madman ranting in the street.

Eugene McLoughlin
5 Posted 17/08/2007 at 09:22:15

I agree with you on some points Kieran, however they are Man Utd biased a lot of the time and also I find Giles to be quite patronising sometimes. Dunphy needs to be taken with a pinch of salt - he is sensationalist, good for controversy. Here’s to them showing more of Everton...

Seamus Murphy
6 Posted 17/08/2007 at 09:45:33

Apart from Dunphy drooling all over everything Roy Keane says or does i agree with you Kieran!!

ryan crest
7 Posted 17/08/2007 at 09:48:17

Interesting to get a different perspective.

Many viewers, however, find acerbic and antagonistic punditry distasteful, which may be one of the reasons Sky and the BBC opt for bland and inoffensive characters to present their shows.

Juan Roman
8 Posted 17/08/2007 at 10:00:28

RTE is much superior to MOTD & whatever absolute garbage that ITV churn out. The problem is that the pundits know very little outside the top four sides. The main highlights ALWAYS come from these elite clubs with only the goals shown from the other games. Where Dunphy & Liam Brady really excel is the midweek Champions League games because they’re able to compare United, Chelsea etc to the cream of Europe. Giles on the other hand knows his own personal principles on the game & the top 4 sides but very little else. Additionally he’s afraid of Dunphy after a falling out the had over the Keano Saipan affair. But it’s great entertainment to hear Dunphy slating twinkle toe Ronaldo, if nothing else.

ronan mcg
9 Posted 17/08/2007 at 10:19:25

it’s interesting to watch the rte analysis -v- bbc analysis of the same game, particularly on "the shite" and gerrard, when they play rubbish rte will say so but somehow bbc see a completely different game and rant and rave about how brilliant gerrard is! Also I will give anyone ?100 if they can find a clip of Jamie Rednapp criticising somebody.
btw houghton was very complimentary of everton last season so more of that! could do with a bit less of dunphie’s sensationalism (spot on eugene) and his sycophantic complimenting of giles/brady when they are sitting right beside him.

Gavin Ramejkis
10 Posted 17/08/2007 at 11:18:48

Got to agree that with a cornered market the MOTD commentary is pap, I often watch the Championship on ITV and it’s much better even if it is lower leagues stuff, most teams get a decent look in too. Trouble with MOTD is though who would you have to replace the likes of Shearer and Dixon?

Andy
11 Posted 17/08/2007 at 11:34:41

I would like to see more journalists involved such as Marcotti & Winter as they are articulate, concise and informed. They are also less biased than an ex-pros. Jimmy Hill’s Sunday Supplement is always a good watch because the guests actually have debates and have to justify & support their argumnents.
The Ex-Pro clubs are fucking useless - I can handle Hansen & Lawrenson but Dixon, Wright & Schmeical are atrocious.
By far the worst though is Shearer - how he ever got the job I have no idea - he is the most cliched uninsightful dulll tosser going. I can only think he is Hansen & Lineker’s golf partner or something. The only requiremnt to get on BBC is to have won the title or played for England.
However they are trumped by the appalling Sky pundits where you have the lobotomized housewives favourite Jamie Redknapp whose only real criteria is that some women used to fancy him. He makes Shearer look controversial he’s so bland.

Brian Reidy
12 Posted 17/08/2007 at 12:11:12

i would agree that the premiership is better than motd in terms of being critical

however sometimes the review of footage and highlighting bad/good play isint as good as motd

also the editing can be pure tripe at times - litterally showing the first 10mins of the game to show a chance on 9 mins and the rest of the game condensed into the 10mins of footage

also aston villa could draw 0-0 with liverpool in a dour affair - and this match will be covered for 20 mins

and then the 4-3 extravaganza of fulham and west ham for instance will show the 7 goals in a minute

Seamus Murphy
13 Posted 17/08/2007 at 12:15:11

Ronan mcg - spot on about Jamie Redknapp. Mr bloody nice guy. Go on Jamie, just once tell us what you really think!!
If they dive, say they dived - if they fucked up, say they fucked up!!

Shaka
14 Posted 17/08/2007 at 12:28:06

Sorry lads. Changing the subject here. Breaking news on Sky Yakubu has been left out of the Boro squad. His move to Everton has got a step closer. A figure of 11mill has been agreed. Yak is expected to sign by the end of the week. Manny is doing the 2nd part of his medical and is expected to sign in the next few hours. Moyes was asked about where the money is coming from. He basically said he told the board he they need to provide him with the tools to do his job. Getting excited now.

Mark Creevy
15 Posted 17/08/2007 at 12:28:46

They should get Big Nev on as a pundit. There’s a bloke who isn’t afraid to say what he thinks, has a brain, and probably wouldn’t be too bothered about missing out on the odd golfing invitation. Imagine the toes that he’d tread on in that Lineker/Hansen/Lawrenson love-in.

Then again, that’s exactly why the BBC would never look at him.

Ben Brown
16 Posted 17/08/2007 at 12:48:02

That’s the kind of thread highjack I don’t mind Shaka! Come on boys!

I really disagree with the comments about Jamie Redknapp. For me he’s the one sky pundit that isn’t afraid to disagree with Richard Keys. Whenever there’s a penalty he says exactly what he thinks regardless of any niceties. He’s quite often argumentative just for the sake of it and is usually right! He’s always going, "Is it though Richard?" or "Well, I’m not so sure, if you look at this". Anyway, I think he’s good.

Tell you who else is good; Guillaume Balague. That guy knows everything about football.

cathal donnellan
17 Posted 17/08/2007 at 13:34:24

this is dunphy at his most hilarious.
well worth a look.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Prep4trYNj4

Derek Thomas
18 Posted 18/08/2007 at 07:35:14

Roddy Doyle in his novel ’The Van’ which had as a part sub plot the Irish teams 1990 World Cup Games,Has the hero (Jimmy Rabbite?)running a snack business from an old ice cream van, hence the title, and a hot dog or sausage, was, because of Dunphy’s utter shite comments called a Dunphy aka turd. I take it he has improved thern or the MOTD pundits are so bad as to now make him look good...any thoughts Keiron??