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Just a thought

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I know of a stadium that houses around 50,000 supporters, will become available over the next few years, is located well within the city of Liverpool, a stadium which the mighty Blues were once along time ago kicked out of.

Surely it is our right to reclaim it as OUR own. If it seems a little difficult to stomach ? and frankly I'm shocking myself writing this ? but we must explore all the possibilites that may stop us from leaving the city of Liverpool. Anyway just think of how those red noses will feel when their beloved Anfield is painted blue, serves over-priced, warm Chang beer and reverberates to the sound of Z cars and 50,000 + mad Evertonians. Has anyone got Bill Kenwrights phone number?
Mike  McCarthy, Liverpool     Posted 07/11/2007 at 20:22:35

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Lyndon
Sorry, Mike. Anfield's footprint is earmarked for recreational park land, a tree-lined pedestrian boulevard or something if I recall correctly. They're effectively trading it for the area on which they're building the giant, chrome sandwich toaster as part of the deal. They would never have got permission to build on Stanley Park otherwise.

If we didn't need the proceeds from Goodison ? or have to rely on Tesco as well ? we might have been able to do the same.

Danny Mullally
1   Posted 07/11/2007 at 22:38:36

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Firstly fuck Anfield for a game of darts, I dont want a kopite cast off for our new ground, although I do want us to stay in the city.Before this kicks off the "debate" again, I don’t know about anyone else, but after reading the recent echo articles regarding our ground move and hearing rumours from certain well placed people, it is becoming increasingly likely that this ground move to Kirkby is far from done and dusted. We have a large divide in the fanbase, there is apparantly a large divide in the Kirkby residents appproval, there are now two MP’s opponents united in opposing the move. We are yet to have an update on the proposals for staying in Liverpool but we know that there are two sites suitable if investors / finance can be found.
Wit the Premier league attracting more foreign investment than any other league in the world, couple this witha good run in the domestic and Uefa cup fronts we are looking more of an attactive proposition every day.

It will be an interesting 2008....
Paul Ramsey
2   Posted 07/11/2007 at 23:14:17

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As lyndon and danny have highlighted Anfield is not a serious option but a subject of discussion for the absent minded and pissed, or both, group, small in number, of evertonia! But danny eludes to some more serious ground issues to which i would like to agree and add my penny worth.

Firstly, Everton must remain in the city. You may add that what is the city but a boundary? and you would have a point. so we must more clearly define where we consider it acceptable for everton to relocate to? i would suggest that everton not relocate outside 3 distinct areas. The first being the walton area...the second being the everton area...and the third being within very close proximty of the city centre itself(the docks for instance, example kings dock). Why? Walton has essentially been our home now for the better part of 115 years. Everton is our heritage. both of these are very important...the city centre is the only non-hertiage option to my mind because its the city centre. feasability? we can argue feasability all day, but nothing should be impossible, if we desire to achieve something so much it can be done!

That small debate out the way, i consider the design of the stadium to be all important. A stadium, a home for out beloved club, is more than simple that, a stadium or a home? its a piece of art, heritage, a statement of intent and greatness, a symbol of everything that everton is! do not let the board sell us the idea of a rectangle stadium instead of an oval as a revolution in thought on stadium design and a continuation of evertons heritage. I hate to say it, but the shite have got there stadium design right, because its got ambition without limit and perspective of what a home and piece of art should be. A new stadium for everton football club should incorporate icons of this great club, the tower of our crest, the wreaths, statues of out greats, not a poster that says peoples club on it??? its should be ambitious, beatiful, make u shiver everytime you enter, make you weap with joy at first glimpse, make that walk the ground every week a walk of anticipation. Why not build a stadium of such stature but in the mould of goodison? for me, the iconic look of goosion is created by the main stands imposition over the rest of the ground, the first 3 teared stand, goodision was for years the cutting edge, a new goodision could be again? a new three teared stand, with a two sides encoporating the two teared gladdy an bullens road end look, and a single teared park end type stand would maintain our unique stadium anew. that is everton, that is goodision, not a heartless rectangle, which no doubt kirkby has been presented as...we may as well have an oval shape.

Think i have said enough...i want evertonians to think about this, we seem to eager and easy to settle for a new stadium, regardless of location no matter of its design?? our children, childrens children will have to sit in this ground...lets aim to make it as iconic as the sydny opera house, not as dull as the JJB?
Lee Heath
3   Posted 07/11/2007 at 23:47:26

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Totally agree with ramsey there. Dont like the stadium plans, take a look at Pompys new plans, they are spectacular, ive always had an image of a new Everton stadium as being a spectacular new and original work of art. Somthing to rival the new Bayern Munich stadium or the Reebok for gods sake, that still looks impressive. Or even if we wanted to keep a rectangle shaped stadium, look at the Dortmund stadium. Tight, compact, futuristic and huge. Seeing the plans for the new stadium design did not inspire me at all and I think that it still belongs in the last century
Paul Donaldson
4   Posted 08/11/2007 at 00:53:18

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Mike, I am living in Australia these days, but that has not stopped my fanaticism. I have had the same thought as you, (probably because I am not a local anymore), so am not there to gauge the reaction.
However, I think it would be a great idea to reclaim what was once ours, run amok there for 2 years only, whilst we REBUILD GOODISON on its current site.
I am anticipating an explosive response to this suggestion. Thank Christ I am in Aus.
Paul
Dave
5   Posted 08/11/2007 at 06:29:53

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For the record

We did not get kicked out of Anfield, we walked out
Ray Roche
6   Posted 08/11/2007 at 08:11:48

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Paul,that comment of yours contains one of the best ideas to come out of this "ground move" debate. Build the new stadium as a modern copy of Goodison Park, but with modern building techniques,with a building in the corner where the church now stands,incorporating Prince Ruperts Tower. We could also replicate Archibald Leitch?s familiar latticework struts on the front of the stands,not in a structural way, but merely as a reminder of where we?re from. It would be miles better than the usual characterless Reebok clones.
Allan Hobbs
7   Posted 08/11/2007 at 09:47:45

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All the stadium plans are artists impressions though, they don’t actually show you what the grounds will look like. Pompey’s is going to hold less than Goodison by the way Lee so thats a no goer.

Our proposed ground is taken from one of the German grounds I think isn’t it? Can anyone remember which one? I remember quite liking their ground; it looked like an old style ground (which I think most Evertonians want) so it might end up being pretty good. Goodison is old, its fucked and falling apart, much as I love it, it is on its last legs to be fair. We need to move, fact.
Andy Ellams
8   Posted 08/11/2007 at 10:07:46

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Anfield doesn’t hold 50,000 supporters or even 50,000 west country glory hunters
Allan Hobbs
9   Posted 08/11/2007 at 10:18:34

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anfield

45,362
Iain Sweeney
10   Posted 08/11/2007 at 10:57:44

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Pele, Eusebio & Beckenbauer.
Legends that graced Goodison during the 1966 World Cup. England are set to bid for the 2018 WC. Now imagine England get it.
Paul said
"A stadium, a home for ourbeloved club, is more than simply that, a stadium or a home? its a piece of art, heritage, a statement of intent and greatness, a symbol of everything that everton is!"

We need a stadium that can compete to host games in the World Cup (whenever it may be). Current plans, ideas, venues etc, fall very short of that......
Richard Flaherty
11   Posted 08/11/2007 at 11:01:46

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Are you mad?

Anfield painted blue? Z-Cars on the tannoys?

First off i believe the pinkies spiritual home is to be torn down for redevelopment when they vacate and move to their new premises.

Even if it was still a viable option, i would not exactly be mad about the idea of moving across Stanley and playing home games at a hated rivals old stomping ground.

Could you possibly envisage the red shite doing the same and moving into Goodison if the roles were reversed? Didn’t think so.

Dont get me wrong, i’m all for staying within the city boundaries but this option while locationally ideal is a no brainer.

Its just as well that this soft idea will never see the light of day.
Chris Foster
12   Posted 08/11/2007 at 10:58:16

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I have to agree with Paul Ramsey. Personally I cannot live with the thought of a poor mans off the shelf stadium set in poor mans land of Kirkby. However that aside, and god it galls me to place it aside because of the dreadful choice that the yes vote made, we do need another Stadia. Where and what should bethe focus. It is more than a place to play a game of football, Goodison Park means more to Evertonians than that. Its like your family home. Its about heritage and bringing Nothing But the Best to mean the home of our club, not just the team. Ok I hear you, we can;t afford it.. I say we can;t afford NOT to do it. Its like downsizing the family home from a family mansion to a council hosue in Kirkby. The quality IS important. The heritage IS important. I for one never shop in Tesco, I could never call it home.
Yes I am whinging, yes I won't let it go.. why? because its bloody important!
Gerard Madden
13   Posted 08/11/2007 at 11:33:35

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Danny Mullally - I see no evidence of a ’large divide in the fanbase’ except on small message boards. I see 35,000 plodding in and out of GP each week seemingly ’content’ with matters on and off the pitch - oops!

On to the main point - I’ve a feeling some on here have absolutely zero idea how close their new stadium will be to their old site - It’s new Anny Road ’Kop’ will literally be yards and I mean yards from their old Anny Road ’away’ end. No way on gods earth will the council allow EFC/LFC to be THAT close together. In any case they’ve got other plans for their old site.
Michael Newton
14   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:06:53

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Kirkby is no richer or no poorer than most districts in Liverpool or Knowsley, so its not fair to describe the town as poor mans land.
The fact that it is outside of the city boundaries is what people are annoyed with.
Harry Charles
15   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:01:43

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We did not get [kicked out of are old ground] we left of are own accord ,and the Evertonians that remained called themselves liverpool, the is a survey just come on the Everton website to do with staying at Goodison ,the is one Question asking what you would like pre match at goodison ,i have answered that bill Kenwright comes onto the pitch, and says sorry i diddnt now what i was doing saying leave GOODISON PARK ,AND SAYS WERE STAYING, LETS ALL FILL IT IN LIKE THAT ,AND GET THE REAL VOTE
Miohael Newton
16   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:14:54

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I would like the bloody tannoy to be turned down a few decibels and get an announcer who knows something about football. Trying to have a prematch chat is very difficult when you have him blasting down your eardrums.
Allan Hobbs
17   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:18:30

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Iain Sweeney - the proposed Kirkby stadium is one earmarked for the World Cup - it WILL BE big enough and WILL BE part of the FA proposal to FIFA.

Why are we still debating this anyway? We need to move, Goodison has had its day - move on people, history is......history, leave it behind. The futures bright, it just aint at Goodison.
James Elworthy
18   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:17:01

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Scantily clad cheerleaders would be nice. Leather padding on the seats, people who serve you beer at your seat. Parking lot next door to the ground, picnic hamper full of drinks and sandwiches under my seat.
My god I think I am at the Dolphin Stadium Miami
Allan Hobbs
19   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:35:36

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I went to see the Chicago Bulls play a couple of years ago, now that really was a great stadium - they even had a bloke dressed as a monkey (or bear?) leaping around, playing basketball, sitting on peoples laps and giving away presents - it was all very entertaining. No leather padding on the seats though, not like The Emirates stadium which is bloody lovely. I remember the Gooners being well pissed off about leaving the library but now they love their new ground. Shame it takes 2 hours to leave but thats a minor detail.
Anto Doran
20   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:34:59

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not ever had the pleasure to see Everton live at Goodison and the following can be corrected but isnt Anfield pretty close to Goodison? If so, is there not the possibility that we can add onto Goodison from parts of Anfield? Daft idea yeah??
Chris Briddon
21   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:34:33

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For those concerned about having a stadium that is suitable to host world cup matches.

Well FIFA rules say only 1 city can have 2 or more stadiums so if were were still in our current location, we would have no chance against the 60,000 capacity airport terminal across the park.

However, a move to Kirkby is not in Liverpool and therefore a 50,000 capactiy stadium there would be elligible to host games as well.
Lee Spargo
22   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:39:43

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I think Mike was pissed.
Allan Hobbs
23   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:41:50

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Chris - according to all the reports I’ve read, they’re saying that they’d use both ours and Liverpools - neither of which has been built obviously. They want to spread the tournament across the country, and currently the only stadiums in the north big enough are Old Trafford, The Stadium of Light and St James Park - add to that, the RS new one and ours, plus the renovated Villa Park, Wembley, Spurs new ground and The Emirates, maybe the Millenium Stadium too and thats it. Where have you got this rule about 1 stadium per city??

Michael Newton
24   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:46:22

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Allan in the USA sports games are a family day out.
I went to an Atlanta Braves baseball game, BBQ in the carpark, loads of beer, all kids got a bat when they went in as was bat day. Imagine kids here what they would do with one of them.
Yes the guy came round to your seat serving beer, hot dogs, popcorn you name it, He shouted what he had in poetry.
It was fun and I was so pissed glad I wasnt driving.
As for the game it was shite boring and too long, but with all the entertainment and ale it was a fun day.
I am thinking of taking up test match cricket where you can have 5 days and nights on the ale and fall asleep during the game and not miss anything.
Steve Williams
25   Posted 08/11/2007 at 12:48:58

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I wondered how long it would be before Gerard Madden chipped in. However, dear boy, you have really outdone yourself this time. Whilst I have a lot of time for sensible ’YES’ voters, you take the biscuit:-

"I see no evidence of a ?large divide in the fanbase? except on small message boards"

Where the hell have you been this last year?? This has been the single, most argument-provoking topic to hit EFC since Alan Ball was sold! And you haven’t noticed it!

Well, well, well - that’s a clear enough message for us all to completely disregard your drivel in future.
Paul Duberry
26   Posted 08/11/2007 at 13:12:03

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I have heard from Liverpool Parks & Gardens that Anfield is being turned into an allotment.
Initial soil surveys have confirmed that due to amount of manure that has been on the field for many many years it is good fertile land for the growth of cabbages and spuds.
I for one have put my mother in law down for a patch, as the more time she spends growing sprouts the less time she will come round to my house.
Dave wilson
27   Posted 08/11/2007 at 13:19:17

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Gerrard Madden

Still havent chagrd the record I see
Happy with events on and of the pitch ? your delusional mate. The fanbase is split like never before and only a marked improvement on the pitch is masking the fucking shambles off it
SMELL THE COFFEE
Erin Kane
28   Posted 08/11/2007 at 13:35:31

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picnic hampers at goodison.

Is peter johnson on his way back?

Sandwiches and changs close at hand would be lovely . And dont forget the vegetables.

But enough about the players.

I am kind of looking forward to the kirkby move, I was not happy about it by any means, but the future and well being of the club is of paramount importance although i can fully understand some peoples sentiments about wanting to remain with the old lady.

Unfortunately its a part of life that things change and sometimes you have to move on for the better. I wonder at the stadium if z-cars will be played there too. As the show itself was centered on the kirkby area itself, its truly fitting.
Chris Briddon
29   Posted 08/11/2007 at 14:03:31

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Allan - Apparently FIFA suggest 1 stadium per city but will allow 1 city to have more.
They also suggest stadia of 40000 capacity & above. I?m not sure where it came from but it has been mentioned in a few articles regarding world cup bids.

Hence at present you couldn?t use COM & Old Trafford or Anfield & Goodison, as the likely city with 2 stadia would be London with Wembley & The Emirates.

When Evertons ground has been suggested, it has been the new stadium in Kirkby.
Michael Newton
30   Posted 08/11/2007 at 13:58:08

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As there is no other posting to put this I see the Nuremberg coach Hans Meyer is a bit of a character:
I have pasted some of his comments.
’He’s been learning German now for 2 years and all he can say is Guten Tag’ (A comment about Ghanian Lawrence Aidoo who he coached at Moechengladbach)

They are quick to build a monument to you in football if your succesful but even quicker to piss on it if your not.

Well he certainly looks more interesting now.(after one of his players received a broken nose)

On why he didnt sign Daniel Felghauer, ’He came into the dressing room and asked to swap jerseys, I said why as you will have plenty next season when you play for us, he stared at me like I had two heads, he failed my humour test so I didnt sign him’

On German reunification when he coached East German minnows Jena.
Now that the Berlin wall has come down I expect a phone call any minute from Bayern Munich to offer me a job.


I wonder if Herr Mayer will have any witticisms tonight after he gets thrashed.
Any scouser witticims anyone for him to come up with.
Mark Pendleton
31   Posted 08/11/2007 at 14:00:23

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I believe our new design was based on the Cologne stadium. I for one can’t understand anyone citing the Reebok as a design cue for how it should look, that’s dull and also small. I’m not a fan of the "bowl" design. I believe the proposed design, with four quite imposing towers is a good design and with it’s steeply raked sides would be much more like the type of stadium in which to recreate some of the nights we’ve all enjoyed at Goodison. Alot of the others look a bit gimmicky and won’t stand the test of time.

Oh, and as for move into An(al)field. You must be joking.
Phil Jones
32   Posted 08/11/2007 at 13:55:14

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Alan Hobbs, I believe the stadium is modelled after the Koln stadium, if I’m not mistaken. Also, your comment on leaving history in the past is preposterous. All I ever read on this board is about the past, the glory days, the history and tradition of this club. You can’t argue for the one and not the other. I live in the U.S., and have been following the stadium debate for over a year now. I live in Philadelphia, maybe some of you will remember Stallone comparing Liverpool (in particular, Everton) to Philly, being a toguh, blue-collar town and all. I have that picture of him hauling the Everton scarf over his head on my desktop. As much as an outsider can, I have watched in agony as the "vote" sealed Goodison’s fate, and approved for a move to Kirkby. It’s true, in real terms Kirkby isn’t that far, geographically (I’ve gone to the point of going to Google maps, and measuring distance, average time on the motorway, etc.), but it appears to be light-years away from the heart of Evertonians. I also found it odd how only a select group of season-ticket owners were given the option to vote. Now follow me here: Everton are not the "glamour boys" of Liverpool; I think those queens wear red. Moyes claims we are the "peoples club." Perhaps it’s silly to assume that the masses, then, can afford expensive season tickets. It may be correct (or not) to assume that those with enough money to buy season tickets may not represent the burning heart of the people - those who queue up every week to buy their tickets before the match, who save all week long at shitty jobs to support the club they love on a Saturday or a Sunday. It seems to me that vote, as it were, is not representative of those people.

My one hope is to come out the Goodison and watch a game before the Old Lady comes down. I’ve read a few people suggest a short-term move to Anfield while Goodison is redeveloped. I think a ground redevelopment without ever leaving Goodison is possible (KEIOC has some plans on their site), and levels would never dip below 30,000, I think it is. I may not know much, but this seems to be the best option in the end. Tottenham are unwuilling to leave their ground, and are planning a redevelopment at White Heart Lane. I think more than an architectural staement needs to be made in a stadium for a club like Everton. This club seems to have a deeper connection to its current home, with the soil, and ought not abandon it under any circumstances. I’ve heard a lot of talk about how we need to grow to compete in the future, and while I agree to some extenet, there’s something to be said about the soul of this club. It’s just different, and it’s why I pull for Everton when everyone else over here has never heard of them.
Allan Hobbs
33   Posted 08/11/2007 at 15:02:35

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Phil - I think you misunderstand me; what I mean is that its time to move on - Goodison has been a great stadium and somewhere that we all know & love but my point is that history isn’t going to move us foward in the modern game.

We have to look to the future, invest in it and leave the past in the past - not forget, but let it go, and leaving Goodison is part of that. We need to move to keep apace with our competitors - all those clubs that have had to move, have moved or are about to move so why should we be any different? Staying put would be shooting ourselves in the foot because we can’t afford to stay there if we want to compete with the top teams. Its very simple, this is no time for being all blurry eyed about the past.
Phil Jones
34   Posted 08/11/2007 at 15:14:37

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Allan, thanks for reply. Certainly, I think I misread your post. True enough, we need to move forward. Interesting what a perspective does - in the Hebrew mind, one progresses into the future backwards, always with the past within sight. Maybe this isn’t an appropriate analogy, but I feel that Everton is different from all the other clubs. And not to flog a dead horse, but Spurs are trying to not move from White Heart Lane. I think they are still the club we have most in common with, in terms of money and position (in recent season) in the league. This year is a little different for them, but that is my take on it. Also, aren’t the Reds building their new stadium right next to Anfield? I suppose my question is what kind of psychological and spiritual price are we willing to pay to add some more seats to a stadium? Goodison is out of date, but is it hopelessly so? And if it is, and we must move, isn’t Kirkby a dagger in the heart of the Everton soul? It certainly seems like ti from this side of the pond...
Allan Hobbs
35   Posted 08/11/2007 at 15:20:22

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Many would agree with you there Phil but there issues to be taken into account.

We dont have much money so our hands are tied in some respects with our options regarding a move - Goodison cannot be redeveloped in a timely or costly manner due to our partners in the ground move needing space for their own ventures - therefore staying put isn’t really an option for us. We need to ’keep up with the Joneses’ so moving has to happen soon; the flood of money into the game is continuing to grow and we must be a part of that otherwise we’ll become smaller & smaller, rather than bigger.

Liverpool are indeed moving very close to Anfield, just across the way in Stanley Park in fact, but theres no room for 2 there and theres no point debating the point as its a done deal with the council (whether we like it or not)

I believe that we dont have much choice in this due to the financial aspect; people on here hate me for it but I’m a firm believer that change is a good thing, and positive forward thinking is what gets us where we want to be in life - looking back never made a buck, nor did it make a success out of anyone.
Phil Jones
36   Posted 08/11/2007 at 17:20:11

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Well Allan, while I can’t say I agree with you 100%, I appreciate the clear-headed answer. I still think that progress can be made without causing this much division. It does seem to be a massive disagreement in the camp, doesn’t it? Is it worth moving to Kirkby when so many of the fan base are so clearly against it? I’m all for progress, but not at the expense of the fans. I know the team likes the idea, but they will eventually retire, and then the club is saddled with a stadium they don’t like in a part of town they don’t wantto be in. If there’s to be a move, it ought to stay in the city. But I see your point, and maybe I will come to where you are after move, if it goes through. Either way, I am dying to come to Liverpool, and catch a game at Goodison. My wife and I are planning a trip!
Kevin Mitchell
37   Posted 08/11/2007 at 22:13:38

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Firstly I don?t give a shit who?s grounds are earmarked for any future world cup.
What I do care about is keeping everton in the city. To all you people out there who "reluctantly" voted to move to a tin shack in Kirkby to enable the club to move forward, what makes you think that fifty thousand supporters are going to turn up every week, were going to sell another 5,000 hot dinners and warm changs which should by bully boy?s reconning take us up another level and into the champions league.
Most evertonians I know (who are mostly season ticket holders) say they will not renew their tickets in Kirkby. Some say they will only pick their games. In a nut shell Liverpool are getting a city centre penthouse whilst were getting a council flat in Kirkby. Now that may be allright for you but it?s not for me and thousands others who see this as reinventing another football club outside Liverpool.
Bill Kenwright has got a serious problem.

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