The Mail Bag
Vs Man Utd
Comments (25)
No Arteta today!!
Bit worried by the line up, gone to 4-4-2 with Hibbert at RB and Neville moving to centre mid with Carsley, Cahill and Pienaar wide.
Comments
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Lee Heath
2 Posted 23/12/2007 at 13:53:45
2 Posted 23/12/2007 at 13:53:45
Not happy. Dodgey last minute pen fucks up our unbeaten record!!!!!
David Barks
3 Posted 23/12/2007 at 13:56:14
3 Posted 23/12/2007 at 13:56:14
The penalty wasn’t a dodgy one, it was a stupid inexcusably lazy challenge by Pienaar. All that hard work down the drain.
John Andrews
4 Posted 23/12/2007 at 13:55:47
4 Posted 23/12/2007 at 13:55:47
I was going to post earlier and ask what time the Man U penalty would be. And sure enough it happens !
Cheating bastards !!
Cheating bastards !!
joe mcparland
5 Posted 23/12/2007 at 13:58:57
5 Posted 23/12/2007 at 13:58:57
Soft penalty, but a penalty none the less. It was about the only way they were going to score. The boys played great and hopefully we can pick it back up on boxing day. COYB
Paul Coleman
6 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:00:49
6 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:00:49
We can’t handle pressure.
We respect the top four too much.
Until this changes we will always be the best of the rest.
We respect the top four too much.
Until this changes we will always be the best of the rest.
David Barks
7 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:01:19
7 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:01:19
Obviously you didn’t watch the bloody game John, it was a stone wall penalty, no cheating involved. Pienaar stuck his leg out behind him in a blind attempt at the ball and only got Giggs’ legs. There was no doubt about it, a stupid stupid challenge by Pienaar.
Simon Gemine
8 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:02:01
8 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:02:01
Absolutely gutted. Silly challenge by Peanuts. Still, no disgrace to only just lose to Man U. But I dont understand the team selection or formation. Why slip back into a 442 when 451 has worked so well?
Mark Griffiths
9 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:07:02
9 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:07:02
It was a penalty, no question, but every fucking time we play these bastards they do this, i suppose part of me thinks that is why they are champions but another part of me thinks the jammy bastards!!! we playeed very well and give a stupid goal away and a draw was a very fair result given the effotd we put in and considering we hd no arteta and the money spent on both squads is vast, unlucky lads!!
But Johnson looked knackered, why did he not come off??? And Where the fuck is Vaughan???
And what the fuck is up with Arteta now??
But Johnson looked knackered, why did he not come off??? And Where the fuck is Vaughan???
And what the fuck is up with Arteta now??
Jalil Noor
10 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:02:44
10 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:02:44
Schoolboy error from pienaar. No Arteta meant it was going to be a disciplined, hard work performance from the lads and it was that until Pienaar made that stupid challenge. Yak was off form and was not playing the holding ball role well although he was pissed when he got subbed.
A couple of times we were pretty lucky to get away with silly mistakes like passing the ball back to their players instead of ours. This just shows we rely too much on Arteta for creativity and we need another creative midfielder, and for once the ref were pretty fair to both sides.
For one thing Moyes going to be pretty furious with Pienaar when he sees the replay of that challenge. Sucks to be Pienaar now. Hopefully the lads can bounce back on boxing day
A couple of times we were pretty lucky to get away with silly mistakes like passing the ball back to their players instead of ours. This just shows we rely too much on Arteta for creativity and we need another creative midfielder, and for once the ref were pretty fair to both sides.
For one thing Moyes going to be pretty furious with Pienaar when he sees the replay of that challenge. Sucks to be Pienaar now. Hopefully the lads can bounce back on boxing day
Steve Jones
11 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:11:25
11 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:11:25
Absolutely gutted - father Christmas certainly has come early for Ronaldo.
Hope Cahill is goung to be fit for the next few games.
Pienaar has been brilliant for us, so lets stick together after this and start a new unbeaten run - this will test the team spirit and hopefully make us stringer to push on again with some big games coming up.
Hope Cahill is goung to be fit for the next few games.
Pienaar has been brilliant for us, so lets stick together after this and start a new unbeaten run - this will test the team spirit and hopefully make us stringer to push on again with some big games coming up.
Darren Reeves
12 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:16:58
12 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:16:58
Have to say Pienaar has been fantastic of late and it was a great cross for our goal. Particularly in finding that bit of space to make it. But....yeah schoolboy mistake.
Let?s kick on from this.....
COYB?s
Let?s kick on from this.....
COYB?s
Stan Sheppard
13 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:19:52
13 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:19:52
Poor tackle and a definite penalty.
Gutted!!!!!!
Thought we were good today and probably deserved a point. Neville?s distribution was poor in midfield and we lacked a bit of quality going forward.
Having said that we did quite well and were far from outplayed or over awed. Next up a must win home to Bolton.
Gutted!!!!!!
Thought we were good today and probably deserved a point. Neville?s distribution was poor in midfield and we lacked a bit of quality going forward.
Having said that we did quite well and were far from outplayed or over awed. Next up a must win home to Bolton.
Tony Williams
14 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:33:56
14 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:33:56
I was always going to be tough with Neville back in midfield soing his Unsworth impression with floated, useless passes and when is he going to learn that his long throws are fooking useless.
We played well and were unlucky that a midfielder had to track Giggs and throw ouut a tired leg which gifted the game to them.
Feel as depressed as I did walking out of Goodison, as they didn’t deserve to get the points in that game either.
I just hope Cahill is fine and Arteta only has a touch of cold and will be able to play on Boxing Day
We played well and were unlucky that a midfielder had to track Giggs and throw ouut a tired leg which gifted the game to them.
Feel as depressed as I did walking out of Goodison, as they didn’t deserve to get the points in that game either.
I just hope Cahill is fine and Arteta only has a touch of cold and will be able to play on Boxing Day
James Byrne
15 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:36:57
15 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:36:57
Really surprised by the team and playing an unusual 442, especially away from home! I suppose the missing Arteta would of influenced DM’s team selection.
As an overall assessment of the game we played really well at the back, Jags & Yobo done very well and United looked like they would of been content with the draw until Pienaars moment of madness. Hibbert didn’t do too bad but for me his place is well and truly on the bench with Neville right back.
Great goal by Cahill and some massive positives to take away from the game.
However, I thought the ref gave us fuck all all through the game; he gave United everything.
As an overall assessment of the game we played really well at the back, Jags & Yobo done very well and United looked like they would of been content with the draw until Pienaars moment of madness. Hibbert didn’t do too bad but for me his place is well and truly on the bench with Neville right back.
Great goal by Cahill and some massive positives to take away from the game.
However, I thought the ref gave us fuck all all through the game; he gave United everything.
Steve Wolfe
16 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:40:26
16 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:40:26
Gutted like everyone else but Utd deserved to win it, we basically sat back from the 30 min onwards and you reap what you sow. I really thought Utd were there for the taking today if we went at them. Hopefully we can resume the 4-5-1 on Wednesday, players permitting of course.
Art Greeth
17 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:40:11
17 Posted 23/12/2007 at 14:40:11
Nonsense, Paul Coleman.
1) We can’t handle pressure?? We were under immense pressure for long spells, yet Utd actually had little or nothing in the way of clear opportunites. The fact that they only won with a penalty two minutes from time totally refutes your claim.
2) We respect the top four too much?? Look at how Moyes sent out his team without the likes of Arteta and Ossie. Two up front with Cahill in support - at OT, against the champions who have won their last eight home games. I didn’t see any of our players been over respectful or awed by the reputations and names of a very good Utd side.
3) Until this changes we will always be the best of the rest?? Disagree with your first two premises, so this simply doesn’t apply. It is difficult to crack the top four. We have done so before and I believe we will do it again - possibly even this season. And I further believe that Moyes thinks on similar lines to mine rather than such defeatist attitudes as you offer.
1) We can’t handle pressure?? We were under immense pressure for long spells, yet Utd actually had little or nothing in the way of clear opportunites. The fact that they only won with a penalty two minutes from time totally refutes your claim.
2) We respect the top four too much?? Look at how Moyes sent out his team without the likes of Arteta and Ossie. Two up front with Cahill in support - at OT, against the champions who have won their last eight home games. I didn’t see any of our players been over respectful or awed by the reputations and names of a very good Utd side.
3) Until this changes we will always be the best of the rest?? Disagree with your first two premises, so this simply doesn’t apply. It is difficult to crack the top four. We have done so before and I believe we will do it again - possibly even this season. And I further believe that Moyes thinks on similar lines to mine rather than such defeatist attitudes as you offer.
Kevin Molloy
18 Posted 23/12/2007 at 15:02:00
18 Posted 23/12/2007 at 15:02:00
God, if they end up champions, then what about us? I think we?ll do fourth this year. Great great performance, only undone by a moment of complete madness.
Johnson is seriously getting me down though. He should have been full of beans today, and there was vitually nothing. I read an article yesterday saying he?s "happy to stay at Everton". Gee, that?s big of you, Andy, how many stoires is that linking him with a move away?
Watching the replays when we got deep and wide, his movement in the box was a fucking disgrace, if a bid comes in in Jan I say get rid. I?m tired of wondering what?s making him so gloomy.
Johnson is seriously getting me down though. He should have been full of beans today, and there was vitually nothing. I read an article yesterday saying he?s "happy to stay at Everton". Gee, that?s big of you, Andy, how many stoires is that linking him with a move away?
Watching the replays when we got deep and wide, his movement in the box was a fucking disgrace, if a bid comes in in Jan I say get rid. I?m tired of wondering what?s making him so gloomy.
Brian Waring
19 Posted 23/12/2007 at 15:03:09
19 Posted 23/12/2007 at 15:03:09
Why is it that when we are beaten, we always feel we were hard done by?It was a stone-wall penalty.James the ref never gave every decision utd’s way.I thought the back for were excellent today (including Hibbert!),and we were beaten after a rush of blood to the head by Pienaar.I agree with Steve Wolfe,after a good first half,we came out in the 2nd half and started playing too deep.utd at the end of the day,probalby deserved the win.A big plus point for me is that they never over-ran us,and for most of the game we looked comfortable.
Paul Coleman
20 Posted 23/12/2007 at 19:28:10
20 Posted 23/12/2007 at 19:28:10
Nonsense Art?????
1 - Yeah we held on till the 88th minute but there are 90 minutes in a match plus stoppage time just like we found out against Liverpool. So errr yeah cant handle pressure.
2 - Im not talking about the formation, Im talking about the players respect the top four too much. The Everton team shit their pants when they have to play any top four team. It doesnt help having players like Arteta licking Ronaldos arse before the game and then handing in his sick note on the day.
3 - I think our team is as good as any top four team although we are weak in a couple of positions. Once we crack the mentality, we will crack the top four and thats the only difference.
1 - Yeah we held on till the 88th minute but there are 90 minutes in a match plus stoppage time just like we found out against Liverpool. So errr yeah cant handle pressure.
2 - Im not talking about the formation, Im talking about the players respect the top four too much. The Everton team shit their pants when they have to play any top four team. It doesnt help having players like Arteta licking Ronaldos arse before the game and then handing in his sick note on the day.
3 - I think our team is as good as any top four team although we are weak in a couple of positions. Once we crack the mentality, we will crack the top four and thats the only difference.
Jay Campbell
21 Posted 23/12/2007 at 20:14:55
21 Posted 23/12/2007 at 20:14:55
Brian Waring, Hibbert was awful again. He back’s off way to much and allows good players to much time on the ball. The amount of crosses that Rooney got into the box in the 2nd half was scandalous. No wonder Rooney went out to his side of the back four coz he tears the hoop out of him every time he plays against him. End of the day Moyes well and truly fucked up his team selection today. I thought the penny had dropped with him to Keep Neville at right back and never pick Hibbert again. Poor poor decision!!! Against Utd you need your best Footballers on the park, Moyes left better players on the bench today end ov story. Been impressed with Moyes lately but today he got it all wrong.
Tony Williams
22 Posted 23/12/2007 at 20:40:44
22 Posted 23/12/2007 at 20:40:44
Here we go again, it was Moyes’s fault, his team selection was the problem etc etc.
It didn’t take the Moyes hater long did it.
Ok then Jay, who else should we have put in midfield now that Ossie was injured, Arteta ill and Graveson not being able to complete a full game?
I am with you about Neville, he should never be played in midfield but the team selection was done out of necessity, nothing more and we wanted to have a go at them, unfortunately once you have Cars and Pip in midfield you are effectively playing a 6-2-2.
Saying that there was no-one else to play, Fadds was truely awful on Thursday and Vidarsson looks too green and would have been over awed in this game.
Who else, pray tell?
We were a few minutes away from a semi-comfortble point (ManUre huffed and puffed buut did not look like scoring) when a moment of madness killed us off.
It didn’t take the Moyes hater long did it.
Ok then Jay, who else should we have put in midfield now that Ossie was injured, Arteta ill and Graveson not being able to complete a full game?
I am with you about Neville, he should never be played in midfield but the team selection was done out of necessity, nothing more and we wanted to have a go at them, unfortunately once you have Cars and Pip in midfield you are effectively playing a 6-2-2.
Saying that there was no-one else to play, Fadds was truely awful on Thursday and Vidarsson looks too green and would have been over awed in this game.
Who else, pray tell?
We were a few minutes away from a semi-comfortble point (ManUre huffed and puffed buut did not look like scoring) when a moment of madness killed us off.
terry hayes
23 Posted 24/12/2007 at 12:57:22
23 Posted 24/12/2007 at 12:57:22
totally agree with kevin molloy, johnson is a waste of space and contributes nothing[get rid] also not only do i believe that phil neville should not play in midfield ever again, he should not play against man utd as he is a fucking liability.
Jay Campbell
24 Posted 24/12/2007 at 13:42:53
24 Posted 24/12/2007 at 13:42:53
Tony Williams why didn’t he pick young Vaughan or Victor and play 3 up front?? UTD’s defence were there for the taking yesterday coz Wes Brown is a fucking galute and Vidjic is no great shakes either. Sorry Mate but Moyes got it wrong yesterday and every time he picks Hibbert we are handicapping ourselves.
He is totally out of his depth in this league and should never play again. Your right McFadden didn’t play well on Thursday but Hibbert’s that shite i’d have stuck him on left with Pienaar moving in the middle. Every other option should be considered first b4 he even considers playing Ann Robinson at Right back. He made the wrong choice Tony and by the way I don’t hate Moyes he’s really impressed this season. Still can’t believe though he thinks Hibbert can play at this level coz anybody can see he can’t.
He is totally out of his depth in this league and should never play again. Your right McFadden didn’t play well on Thursday but Hibbert’s that shite i’d have stuck him on left with Pienaar moving in the middle. Every other option should be considered first b4 he even considers playing Ann Robinson at Right back. He made the wrong choice Tony and by the way I don’t hate Moyes he’s really impressed this season. Still can’t believe though he thinks Hibbert can play at this level coz anybody can see he can’t.
Art Greeth
25 Posted 24/12/2007 at 17:44:58
25 Posted 24/12/2007 at 17:44:58
Yep Paul - Nonsense.
1 - Indeed there are 90 minutes plus stoppage time in every match... and in scoring late goals we are, literally, the best!!! You cannot seem to admit that ManU and the ’poo (your example) are two very good teamsl. In your example of the Derby game you totally overlook the fact that we played virtually all the second half with ten men - and still went for it and gave the ’poo a game - and the small matter of ClattenBERK’s quirky performance and denial of a stonewall penalty AFTER the ’poo went 2-1 up late in the game. So -errr - yeah. To that I can add that even though we were trailing at Chelsea and getting something of a football lesson, the team stood strong and carved out an equaliser for a great away point. So - yeah - your claim is bollox.
2 - "The Everton team shit their pants when they have to play any top four team". Your opinion, founded on what exactly? I saw no one bottling it or being over respectful of reputations in ANY of EFC’s games this season. Just because YOU think otherwise doesn’t make it true.
"... doesnt help having players like Arteta licking Ronaldos arse before the game and then handing in his sick note on the day." So you think Arteta is a wimpish bottler do you...? Hands up anyone else who agrees with this infantile, derogatory comment about our Tater...? Hmmm... just you at the back there, Paul. Again, just because you think that doesn’t make it true. More bollox from you.
3 - A bit more positive thinking from you, albeit a contradictory one: "I think our team is as good as any top four team although we are weak in a couple of positions". Ehmm... how can we be as good as ANY of the top four AND be weak in a couple of positions...? A non-sequiter for me, Paul me lad...
I genuinely believe we have the potential to crack the top four, but as yesterday showed, a couple of injuries and our resources are still stretched, particularly in midfield.
And as for you closing comment: "Once we crack the mentality, we will crack the top four and thats the only difference." The 13 game unbeaten run, across three competitions, playing back-to-back games for the past three months is evidence aplenty to me that there IS that mental toughness developing.
And I will add that even with that great run, I still believe there is plenty more to come from these players and this team. They have NOT been playing above themselves, or necessarily peaking... and that really excites me.
1 - Indeed there are 90 minutes plus stoppage time in every match... and in scoring late goals we are, literally, the best!!! You cannot seem to admit that ManU and the ’poo (your example) are two very good teamsl. In your example of the Derby game you totally overlook the fact that we played virtually all the second half with ten men - and still went for it and gave the ’poo a game - and the small matter of ClattenBERK’s quirky performance and denial of a stonewall penalty AFTER the ’poo went 2-1 up late in the game. So -errr - yeah. To that I can add that even though we were trailing at Chelsea and getting something of a football lesson, the team stood strong and carved out an equaliser for a great away point. So - yeah - your claim is bollox.
2 - "The Everton team shit their pants when they have to play any top four team". Your opinion, founded on what exactly? I saw no one bottling it or being over respectful of reputations in ANY of EFC’s games this season. Just because YOU think otherwise doesn’t make it true.
"... doesnt help having players like Arteta licking Ronaldos arse before the game and then handing in his sick note on the day." So you think Arteta is a wimpish bottler do you...? Hands up anyone else who agrees with this infantile, derogatory comment about our Tater...? Hmmm... just you at the back there, Paul. Again, just because you think that doesn’t make it true. More bollox from you.
3 - A bit more positive thinking from you, albeit a contradictory one: "I think our team is as good as any top four team although we are weak in a couple of positions". Ehmm... how can we be as good as ANY of the top four AND be weak in a couple of positions...? A non-sequiter for me, Paul me lad...
I genuinely believe we have the potential to crack the top four, but as yesterday showed, a couple of injuries and our resources are still stretched, particularly in midfield.
And as for you closing comment: "Once we crack the mentality, we will crack the top four and thats the only difference." The 13 game unbeaten run, across three competitions, playing back-to-back games for the past three months is evidence aplenty to me that there IS that mental toughness developing.
And I will add that even with that great run, I still believe there is plenty more to come from these players and this team. They have NOT been playing above themselves, or necessarily peaking... and that really excites me.
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1 Posted 23/12/2007 at 11:51:09