The Mail Bag
The ref is a tosser but...
Comments (68)
Although today the ref was absolutely off his head, I thought our second half was absolutely awful. Three of the four goals we conceded were late Christmas presents for the Arse and we had no attacking impetus at all.
We may blame the ref for the second goal and a whole lot of other dodgy decisions but our defence was asleep.
Yobo had his worst game in a long time and Jags wasn't at his best either. I actually thought Hibbert covered his man well and played decently. Lescott as always was rampaging but didn't have the class to make the most of his opportunites. Cars was quiet and overall i thought we were lucky to score.
Now onto the ref, is he Crappenburg's brother or father? He had a shocker. Only one yellow in the first half when I counted 4 neccessary (2 to us for diving) and then handing them out like confetti in the second. Mikel was silly and if I look at it again i will think it was a red but at the moment I don't think it was. Their red should have been a straight red not a second yellow.
Their second goal was a clear handball! I saw it on tv and if I did how come the ref missed it? It just looks to me as the big four being helped along once again. The commentator even said that when he said "once again the big four get the Irish luck"
Over and out!
David Moore, Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:10:51
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Dominic Fitzpatrick
2 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:37:28
2 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:37:28
I disagree completely; I think if it wasn’t for a complete and utter defensive capitulation we would have won this game, and won it convincingly at that.
Some of the football was excellent; tremendous ball retention and passing which made Arsenal look extremely ordinary.
However goals change games, and Arsenal took every single one of theirs with relish. (not surprising considering all but one were given on a plate)
I think the comment that we were awful is a tad harsh.
Some of the football was excellent; tremendous ball retention and passing which made Arsenal look extremely ordinary.
However goals change games, and Arsenal took every single one of theirs with relish. (not surprising considering all but one were given on a plate)
I think the comment that we were awful is a tad harsh.
Ian Dagnall
3 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:33:34
3 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:33:34
It’s one game. We always get at least one 4-1 defeat a season, so hopefully it’s out the way (usually seems to be this time of year), and at least it wasn’t against the likes of Blackburn or West Brom.
As you say, the defending was awful today, but I don’t imagine it’ll happen again for a while. Perhaps the players were starting to believe their own hype a bit and needed bringing down a bit.
It’s disappointing but hopefully everyone will pick themselves up for the game against Boro, and with any luck we’ll have a couple of new faces to add to the midfield.
As you say, the defending was awful today, but I don’t imagine it’ll happen again for a while. Perhaps the players were starting to believe their own hype a bit and needed bringing down a bit.
It’s disappointing but hopefully everyone will pick themselves up for the game against Boro, and with any luck we’ll have a couple of new faces to add to the midfield.
Martin Cutler
4 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:38:07
4 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:38:07
Yes the ref was crap but it was a horrible performance from us (in the second half) ....almost embarrassing to watch our defensive players today and we were next to useless in terms of threatening their goal.
As to Arsenal....they didn’t play well enough to deserve a 4-1 win but, hey, they’re top four so what do you expect.
Fabregas should get a straight red just for being a Frenchmen.....volatile little twat that he is.
As to Arteta .... if he gets the 3-game ban he’ll miss the 1st leg against Chelsea, oh dear.
As to Arsenal....they didn’t play well enough to deserve a 4-1 win but, hey, they’re top four so what do you expect.
Fabregas should get a straight red just for being a Frenchmen.....volatile little twat that he is.
As to Arteta .... if he gets the 3-game ban he’ll miss the 1st leg against Chelsea, oh dear.
George McClelland
5 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:54:21
5 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:54:21
Oh yeah! Fabregas is French...that’s why he plays for the Spanish national side...spent his childhood playing for Barcelona...presumably holds a Spanish passport...and deserves to get sent off by default of being French.
I am not French but when petulant, moronic nothingness (because thats what it is...hot air) besmirches this website...oh, oh it makes me blood boil it does!....arsehole.
I am not French but when petulant, moronic nothingness (because thats what it is...hot air) besmirches this website...oh, oh it makes me blood boil it does!....arsehole.
Nick Toye
6 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:57:39
6 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:57:39
@Martin Cutler - Fabregas is Spanish, so perhaps you should think of facts before you go diving in with Racial comments.
Ok, knee jerk reactions are likely to occur. However, the fact remains we fucked up in defence, Arsenal never stepped it up, we just switched off.
But the Top 4 mentality is winding me up, because I don’t think they necessarily have better players, spend more money. Pound for pound we have made as good signings as Chelsea, Liverpool and Man U. Its the media hype and in particular Sky. They can’t wait to chime in with top 4 bollocks. They don’t seem to notice things like Andy Johnson not being Lee Carsley.
Sky reported that Bender fouled Carlsey and got sent off. Now this could be an honest mistake. Personally I think its a Carsley, Johnson whatever type of attitude to players who operate outside of the top 4.
Ok, knee jerk reactions are likely to occur. However, the fact remains we fucked up in defence, Arsenal never stepped it up, we just switched off.
But the Top 4 mentality is winding me up, because I don’t think they necessarily have better players, spend more money. Pound for pound we have made as good signings as Chelsea, Liverpool and Man U. Its the media hype and in particular Sky. They can’t wait to chime in with top 4 bollocks. They don’t seem to notice things like Andy Johnson not being Lee Carsley.
Sky reported that Bender fouled Carlsey and got sent off. Now this could be an honest mistake. Personally I think its a Carsley, Johnson whatever type of attitude to players who operate outside of the top 4.
Robert Poots
7 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:58:57
7 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:58:57
Martin, Fabregas is Spanish! And surely the red card would apply to league games?
Awful defensive display in the second half by us. Piss Poor infact. Hopefully Arteta’s absence will make Moyey buy quickly on Jan 1st.
Awful defensive display in the second half by us. Piss Poor infact. Hopefully Arteta’s absence will make Moyey buy quickly on Jan 1st.
John Andrews
8 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:59:15
8 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:59:15
I thought that Jagielka had an absolute nightmare today. It may be time for Lescott to play centre back again and bring back Nuno ?
As much as Jagielka had Anelka in his pocket last match he had no answers today.
As much as Jagielka had Anelka in his pocket last match he had no answers today.
Martin Cutler
9 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:02:11
9 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:02:11
French or Spanish (okay, I was wrong...calm down) he’s still volatile and he’s always stirring it up, making things appear worse than they are (like today), running straight to the ref etc.......he does it and you know it.
Thanks for calling me an arsehole George.....or would that be a similar case of besmirching this site or at least a fellow blue........if you don’t agree with me just fucking say so.
Thanks for calling me an arsehole George.....or would that be a similar case of besmirching this site or at least a fellow blue........if you don’t agree with me just fucking say so.
Phil Bellis
10 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:04:50
10 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:04:50
Everton Team Statistics Arsenal 1 Goals 4
3 Shots on Target 4
God, I hate football at times; spanked at home by a lomg-ball team
3 Shots on Target 4
God, I hate football at times; spanked at home by a lomg-ball team
Nick Toye
11 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:07:40
11 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:07:40
@John Andrews, right on cue with the knee jerk reactions. What about Yobo? Howard? they were equally poor, should we ship them out? Jags has been quality in recent games, one mistake and all of a sudden he’s out. Get a grip will you.
First half he was excellent and kept Arsenal at bay.
First half he was excellent and kept Arsenal at bay.
Simon Birdsey
12 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:54:39
12 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:54:39
Today’s game was a depressing spectacle for many reasons, most notably the poor passing. As much as I like Jagielka, every time the ball comes to him he boots or heads it away even when under no pressure rather than trapping it and playing a simple pass. Carsley’s problem is that he can’t get the ball out of his feet quick enough. You just don’t have time in a congested midfield to control the ball and then think what to do with it. As a side we need to move the ball much more quickly to take advantage of any space on the pitch. Instead we tend to bypass the midfield with long, straight balls.
With two holding midfielders, we should be encouraging the fullbacks to bomb forward on the overlap much more often and to get dangerous balls into the box from the byeline.
There was an opportunity today for Moyes to make a really bold move and have a go at Arsenal, rather than playing with a cagey 5 man midfield. He could have played with Yakubu up top with Vaughan and Anichebe dovetailing off him to occupy and harrie the inexperienced fullbacks. They could drop in to perform a 5 man midfield if required, with a tight unit of Carsley and Neville either side of Arteta, who could float and pull the strings. That would also have given us the opportunity to rest Cahill and Pienaar.
I know that we’ve got some big games over the festive period, but I really do think that Moyes needs to think about using his squad more. Using the same system and same personnel more often than not makes for tired players and a predictable style of play. Maybe tiredness is a factor with some of the diabolical goals we’ve conceded recently?
As for Arteta’s sending off, it was a straight arm rather than an elbow. I’m sure that they’ll appeal against it. What did disappoint me though was blantant diving from Yakubu and Neville of all people!
With two holding midfielders, we should be encouraging the fullbacks to bomb forward on the overlap much more often and to get dangerous balls into the box from the byeline.
There was an opportunity today for Moyes to make a really bold move and have a go at Arsenal, rather than playing with a cagey 5 man midfield. He could have played with Yakubu up top with Vaughan and Anichebe dovetailing off him to occupy and harrie the inexperienced fullbacks. They could drop in to perform a 5 man midfield if required, with a tight unit of Carsley and Neville either side of Arteta, who could float and pull the strings. That would also have given us the opportunity to rest Cahill and Pienaar.
I know that we’ve got some big games over the festive period, but I really do think that Moyes needs to think about using his squad more. Using the same system and same personnel more often than not makes for tired players and a predictable style of play. Maybe tiredness is a factor with some of the diabolical goals we’ve conceded recently?
As for Arteta’s sending off, it was a straight arm rather than an elbow. I’m sure that they’ll appeal against it. What did disappoint me though was blantant diving from Yakubu and Neville of all people!
George McClelland
13 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:08:33
13 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:08:33
Ok, Martin, I apologise for calling you an "Arsehole", there was nothing meant in it. I had made my point and there was no need to add insult. I know you’re upset by the result as much as every other Evertonian is but there was just no need for the Fabregas/French comment.
Nick Toye
14 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:15:54
14 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:15:54
Getting a little sick of this "We lost, so therefore we were shit and Moyes was wrong" attitude.
We outplayed Arsenal completely in the first half, dominated the game. Out passed them, and we still carried that onto the second half. A mistake by the defenders for the first goal, a handball for the second goal, Yobo and Howard mistake for the third goal, and the 4th was irrelevant.
Arteta was very unlucky to be red carded.
I just felt we were unfortunate, on the back of a couple of mistakes, we were punished and therefore started chasing the game.
Lescott and Hibbert were getting forward more often than Arsenal’s full backs.
Really, we need to watch the game and take stock of what really happened, instead of talking crap.
Cue the Moyes out comments.
We outplayed Arsenal completely in the first half, dominated the game. Out passed them, and we still carried that onto the second half. A mistake by the defenders for the first goal, a handball for the second goal, Yobo and Howard mistake for the third goal, and the 4th was irrelevant.
Arteta was very unlucky to be red carded.
I just felt we were unfortunate, on the back of a couple of mistakes, we were punished and therefore started chasing the game.
Lescott and Hibbert were getting forward more often than Arsenal’s full backs.
Really, we need to watch the game and take stock of what really happened, instead of talking crap.
Cue the Moyes out comments.
James Newcombe
15 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:14:57
15 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:14:57
We’re just not ready to beat the big boys yet. We have a strong team when they’re all available, but we don’t have enough quality/depth in midfield at this time. As against Utd, we built up some nice moves and then it came to Neville (who was actually alright tonight) to finish, and they’re only going to end up in the crowd!
With regards to Fabregas, i’m really starting to dislike football for this kind of crap, making the most of challenges, diving, playacting... All teams do it though, even us! Bring back the 70’s style game I say, at least it was a man’s sport then!
With regards to Fabregas, i’m really starting to dislike football for this kind of crap, making the most of challenges, diving, playacting... All teams do it though, even us! Bring back the 70’s style game I say, at least it was a man’s sport then!
Martin Cutler
16 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:18:08
16 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:18:08
Apology accepted, thank you.
And, yes, I’m upset........there were moments of brilliance from Everton today but overall, especially in defense, we were awful......although I will say had we not conceded the 2nd when we did it could have been very different (Arteta conceding the free-kick that led to that didn’t help either).
As to Fabregas, I shouldn’t have made the comment based on his nationality (especially when I got it wrong, lol) but he is a trouble-maker in my opinion and he could be from Afghanistan for all I care, I don’t like him!
And, yes, I’m upset........there were moments of brilliance from Everton today but overall, especially in defense, we were awful......although I will say had we not conceded the 2nd when we did it could have been very different (Arteta conceding the free-kick that led to that didn’t help either).
As to Fabregas, I shouldn’t have made the comment based on his nationality (especially when I got it wrong, lol) but he is a trouble-maker in my opinion and he could be from Afghanistan for all I care, I don’t like him!
Dick Fearon
17 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:47:53
17 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:47:53
No excuses just a few puzzles. Why swap Neville for Hibbert who was having a great game at right back? Two of Arsenals goals were created in the zone that Hibbert previously had dominated.
After bringing on AJ why continue flinging high balls at every opportunity into the box?
As masters of the hopeful long punt how come we were undone by exactly that kind of ball. Lets hope our frailty in that area has gone unnoticed by other teams.
After bringing on AJ why continue flinging high balls at every opportunity into the box?
As masters of the hopeful long punt how come we were undone by exactly that kind of ball. Lets hope our frailty in that area has gone unnoticed by other teams.
Steve Jones
18 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:24:26
18 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:24:26
Just one of those games second half today - Imagine us being undone by the long ball game , by Arsenal !
First half was exellent , but we really missed an attacking central midfielder - although Neville did very well. If you recall last year, Fernandes ran the midfield and with Osman and Gravesen injured, its a gap we need to fill very quickly.
Lets not get carried away , against most teams in the prem we would have gone on to win comfortably, but you have to admit Arsenal had some quality players to bring on and made their own luck.
First half was exellent , but we really missed an attacking central midfielder - although Neville did very well. If you recall last year, Fernandes ran the midfield and with Osman and Gravesen injured, its a gap we need to fill very quickly.
Lets not get carried away , against most teams in the prem we would have gone on to win comfortably, but you have to admit Arsenal had some quality players to bring on and made their own luck.
Martin Cutler
19 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:35:24
19 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:35:24
Oops! Jeez....I must be so upset I’ve made another booboo..........I meant Arsenal’s first goal, not the second one.
Sorry!
Sorry!
Simon Birdsey
20 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:27:14
20 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:27:14
Nick, I am pro-Moyes. I’ll take 6th under him rather than a perennial relegation fight anytime, but it must be the games that I miss in which our football is Arsenal-esque! Yes, we dominated them territorially, but we never looked like hurting them.
I appreciate that the conditions weren’t ideal for free-flowing football, but I want to see one-twos, through balls, switches of play, first time passes and players beating their man rather than long punts upfield and playing the percentages.
We are battlers- that’s what we do best- but I would like to see a bit more thought and enterprise go into our play sometimes.
I appreciate that the conditions weren’t ideal for free-flowing football, but I want to see one-twos, through balls, switches of play, first time passes and players beating their man rather than long punts upfield and playing the percentages.
We are battlers- that’s what we do best- but I would like to see a bit more thought and enterprise go into our play sometimes.
Nick Toye
21 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:40:27
21 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:40:27
@Simon,
What a load of toss. We played some nice one touch football in the first half. I’ve seen triangles, one-twos, little flicks. Did you not see Neville just firing over from a move that involved one touch football?
Arsenal today were playing the long ball more than we were.
Its this Dogs of War shite that just means we may as well be fighting relegation.
We are good enough to break the top 4, we are very close to doing that.
Have a little more ambition!
What a load of toss. We played some nice one touch football in the first half. I’ve seen triangles, one-twos, little flicks. Did you not see Neville just firing over from a move that involved one touch football?
Arsenal today were playing the long ball more than we were.
Its this Dogs of War shite that just means we may as well be fighting relegation.
We are good enough to break the top 4, we are very close to doing that.
Have a little more ambition!
Hugo Kondratiuk
22 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:13:43
22 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:13:43
Not the Christmas present we were looking for. Just heard Wenger on the radio, reading from the script they put into his hand when he ventures north of Watford Gap. About how you have to battle against physical teams like ours (Wigan, Bolton, Blackburn, eh bien! Which one of them is it today?).
As far as I’m concerned we played all the football in the first half, and were than undone by our inability to deal with route 1 football (plus the usual connivance by the ref) in the second. Ironic or what?
The big-boot West Ham goal in the Carling Cup, which at the time seemed a one-off, now looks like it was a wake up call we didn’t heed.
Christmas, full house, lots of people watching in the pubs. We could have done ourselves a lot of good today. Somewhere out there there are a few little boys who were developing a bit of an affection for the Blues, but have now decided that all their mates who’ve plumped for the Top 4 were right after all.
Three points against Boro is our only answer. Although of course no-one will be watching except us.
As far as I’m concerned we played all the football in the first half, and were than undone by our inability to deal with route 1 football (plus the usual connivance by the ref) in the second. Ironic or what?
The big-boot West Ham goal in the Carling Cup, which at the time seemed a one-off, now looks like it was a wake up call we didn’t heed.
Christmas, full house, lots of people watching in the pubs. We could have done ourselves a lot of good today. Somewhere out there there are a few little boys who were developing a bit of an affection for the Blues, but have now decided that all their mates who’ve plumped for the Top 4 were right after all.
Three points against Boro is our only answer. Although of course no-one will be watching except us.
Simon Birdsey
23 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:46:37
23 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:46:37
@Nick,
What a load of toss! Moyes has done a good job of getting us consistent and we’ve beaten three of the four big sides during his reign- having a good go at Chelsea too. He’s brought in some excellent players. There are plenty of positives with DM.
However, we’re generally a scrappy team who bundle a great number of goals over the line from inside the 6 yard box. Nothing wrong with that, but we’re not exactly a joy to watch. We don’t have players of the stature of Torres, Gerrard, Lampard, Drogba, Adebayor, Fabregas, Rooney or Ronaldo who can win a game out of absolutely nothing. Hard work and organisation can get you so far, but it takes sheer class to get you to the top of the tree and we don’t quite have that at the moment.
I doubt that you can name more than a couple of occasions where we strung a few passes together today and looked like opening Arsenal up. Being comfortable on the ball is something that we need to drill into Everton players right the way through the club, the same as they do at the big four. A perfect example...you know that if the ball unexpectedly fell to Hibbert inside the opposition penalty area that it would end up in the crowd, whereas Sagna or Clichy would be much more composed.
What a load of toss! Moyes has done a good job of getting us consistent and we’ve beaten three of the four big sides during his reign- having a good go at Chelsea too. He’s brought in some excellent players. There are plenty of positives with DM.
However, we’re generally a scrappy team who bundle a great number of goals over the line from inside the 6 yard box. Nothing wrong with that, but we’re not exactly a joy to watch. We don’t have players of the stature of Torres, Gerrard, Lampard, Drogba, Adebayor, Fabregas, Rooney or Ronaldo who can win a game out of absolutely nothing. Hard work and organisation can get you so far, but it takes sheer class to get you to the top of the tree and we don’t quite have that at the moment.
I doubt that you can name more than a couple of occasions where we strung a few passes together today and looked like opening Arsenal up. Being comfortable on the ball is something that we need to drill into Everton players right the way through the club, the same as they do at the big four. A perfect example...you know that if the ball unexpectedly fell to Hibbert inside the opposition penalty area that it would end up in the crowd, whereas Sagna or Clichy would be much more composed.
Ian Tunny
24 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:55:38
24 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:55:38
I can't believe what i have just watched, we out play Arsenal at their own game in the 1st half and then are beaten by our own game in the second half.
If I wasnt so pissed off it would be funny!
Should we play to our strength and get back to hoofball?!
Hoofball 3-2 Football
and our goal although was as a result of football was from a corner.
If I wasnt so pissed off it would be funny!
Should we play to our strength and get back to hoofball?!
Hoofball 3-2 Football
and our goal although was as a result of football was from a corner.
Pete Cummings
25 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:43:35
25 Posted 29/12/2007 at 20:43:35
A few weeks ago I commented on the EFC forum in the Echo about the tendency of certain defenders to panic under pressure and that, in my opinion, Howard was far from the ideal Everton keeper,sadly today proved me right, after Arsenal equalised I knew the writing was on the wall but never expected total collapse,Jagielka,as against United,handed them the points on a plate,followed by the Fred Karno antics of Yobo and Howard with the support of yet another comedian in the shape of the ref,all in all a very sad end to a very good year.
Nick Toye
26 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:06:32
26 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:06:32
@Simon, your comments are typical of this miserable site.
We haven’t got ourselves into the position we are in by scrapping, we have that, but we have ball players. Osman, Arteta, Pienaar, Cahill, Lescott, Gravesen, Yakubu.
I think I know who you are, RS!
We haven’t got ourselves into the position we are in by scrapping, we have that, but we have ball players. Osman, Arteta, Pienaar, Cahill, Lescott, Gravesen, Yakubu.
I think I know who you are, RS!
Nick Toye
27 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:06:32
27 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:06:32
@Simon, your comments are typical of this miserable site.
We haven?t got ourselves into the position we are in by scrapping, we have that, but we have ball players. Osman, Arteta, Pienaar, Cahill, Lescott, Gravesen, Yakubu.
We haven?t got ourselves into the position we are in by scrapping, we have that, but we have ball players. Osman, Arteta, Pienaar, Cahill, Lescott, Gravesen, Yakubu.
Simon Birdsey
28 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:09:02
28 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:09:02
@Nick,
You seem to only be hearing the negative in what I’m saying. Yes, we do have some very good players but, for whatever reason, they generally prefer punting the ball forward rather than using it intelligently. That is a generalism- i do appreciate that we can be creative at times- but our play is mostly hopeful rather than calculated.
When Arteta’s on his game he can be mesmeric, but not since Fernandes have we had another ballplayer to ally him with.
You seem to only be hearing the negative in what I’m saying. Yes, we do have some very good players but, for whatever reason, they generally prefer punting the ball forward rather than using it intelligently. That is a generalism- i do appreciate that we can be creative at times- but our play is mostly hopeful rather than calculated.
When Arteta’s on his game he can be mesmeric, but not since Fernandes have we had another ballplayer to ally him with.
Nick Toye
29 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:21:39
29 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:21:39
@Simon,
Well I don’t see just the long ball. I see the passages of play when we pass it through midfield. You seem to think that we hoof it at every attempt.
Not since Fernandes? Err Pienaar anyone? Who as it happens has been better than Arteta this season.
Well I don’t see just the long ball. I see the passages of play when we pass it through midfield. You seem to think that we hoof it at every attempt.
Not since Fernandes? Err Pienaar anyone? Who as it happens has been better than Arteta this season.
Simon Birdsey
30 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:23:41
30 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:23:41
Fernandes has a swagger, Arteta has a swagger...I wouldn’t say the same of Pienaar. I think we do need that something different, but I don’t think that Pienaar is necessarily capable of producing the unexpected.
Nick Toye
31 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:31:06
31 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:31:06
Well I disagree with you. I see him on the wing going pas t players, tackling back, being tenacious. Nipping in here and there, swapping wings with Arteta.
Some may say that Fernandes did fuck all apart from dance around Fabregas for 10 seconds and score a good goal against Man U.
Some say that Fernandes goes missing for plenty of the game.
Pienaar doesn’t, but then I suppose you are one of those who thinks we should sack Pienaar off for the foul he committed against Giggs.
Some may say that Fernandes did fuck all apart from dance around Fabregas for 10 seconds and score a good goal against Man U.
Some say that Fernandes goes missing for plenty of the game.
Pienaar doesn’t, but then I suppose you are one of those who thinks we should sack Pienaar off for the foul he committed against Giggs.
Mick Simo
32 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:31:23
32 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:31:23
I cant be arsed reading the posts fucking gutted with a second hallf display of amature sunday league defending that is the bottom line, inept defending school boy errors and I didint believe in father christmas until today, gifted a shite arse team 4 goals on a big silver plate, not being a cynic but you would think our defenders had took a bung at half time thats how bad they was.
Nick Toye
33 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:40:23
33 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:40:23
Sweeping statements as usual.
First goal was a missed header by Jags.
2nd goal was handball initially, and then Jags slipped over which was crucial on a wet pitch.
3rd goal was a cock up by Yobo and Howard.
4th goal was just a good finish.
So by my reckoning that’s two mistakes not 4.
First goal was a missed header by Jags.
2nd goal was handball initially, and then Jags slipped over which was crucial on a wet pitch.
3rd goal was a cock up by Yobo and Howard.
4th goal was just a good finish.
So by my reckoning that’s two mistakes not 4.
Arthur Jones
34 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:23:11
34 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:23:11
That was a freak result ina game we should have won, we outplayed Arsenal in the first half so they resorted to underhand tactics which went unpunished by an incompetant referee and linesmen, the handball by eduardo for their 2nd goal was a bad refereeing decision by a ref in awe of being in charge of a game he was incapable of taking control, Clichy was guilty of fouling Arteta all game but was never punished once, Fabregas is a dirty little snidey nark who again got away with murder. Our defensive errors were unforgivable but out of character and happily, i thought Tony Hibbert had his best game for a long time, ..I?m not too concerned about this particular defeat , as I?ve said, a freak result, I?m more concerned about missing Arteta for 3 games.
Nick Toye
35 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:44:26
35 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:44:26
@Arthur,
At last you have give me hope that there are some intelligent Evertonians out there.
At last you have give me hope that there are some intelligent Evertonians out there.
Simon Birdsey
36 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:34:56
36 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:34:56
Pienaar does fit Moyes team ethic and he works hard to protect his fullback. I’ve got nothing against him especially, but I haven’t seen evidence from him so far that he could pick the ball up on the counter attack and look like going all the way.
It’s not Pienaar especially. Arteta aside, we just don’t look confident on the ball, that we could go passed our man at will or have the balls to try the ’Hollywood ball’. Whilst Fernandes might have made Yakubu look industrious, his trickery put a smile on the face of every Evertonian and will live longer in the memory than a million hard-fought 1-0 victories.
My original point was that we’re not playing the sort of football that puts a stupide grin on your face. We’re outbattling teams.
It’s not Pienaar especially. Arteta aside, we just don’t look confident on the ball, that we could go passed our man at will or have the balls to try the ’Hollywood ball’. Whilst Fernandes might have made Yakubu look industrious, his trickery put a smile on the face of every Evertonian and will live longer in the memory than a million hard-fought 1-0 victories.
My original point was that we’re not playing the sort of football that puts a stupide grin on your face. We’re outbattling teams.
Tony Edwards
37 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:46:53
37 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:46:53
On another day them goals would not have happend, they got the luck with bad defending, thats' why they are top of the league. They were shite first half, and without that first goal, and lets be honest came from a hoof ball and a mistake in defense, we would have cruised it. That's football, its how we bounce back is the making of a decent team. Look on the bright side lads...
Nick Toye
38 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:52:45
38 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:52:45
Funny, I thought Fernandes put a scowl on the face of every Evertonian, not many of us True Blues like being shafted.
Again, I disagree with you completely.
Again, I disagree with you completely.
Tony Edwards
39 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:53:14
39 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:53:14
What pisses people off is two fotted tackles, diving or fucking rolling around like you have been shot in the head. The likes of Wenger and the other prick across the park thinks two footed tackles well they would, see this going down like a bag of shite pisses me off more than any tackle, now dont call me racist but these foreign managers never utter one complaint about diving and play acting ? WHY?
Simon Birdsey
40 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:54:31
40 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:54:31
Fernandes had no say in where he went, he was sold and told where to go. Funny how often the rumours of him coming back keep cropping up though and how interested people are to see that he’s not in the plans of the Valencia manager.
I’d rather than we’re a hardworking team in the mould of Blackburn or Leeds of old and up near the top of the league than a team that tries to play entertaining football and comes unstuck (any team managed by Keegan or Ardiles), but even more preferably I’d like to see us marry the two, which I think that Moyes is trying to do.
The frustrating thing is that, with the personnel that we have, the simple things should be instinctive. We should be able to trap the ball and find a team mate in space with much more ease than we currently do.
I’d rather than we’re a hardworking team in the mould of Blackburn or Leeds of old and up near the top of the league than a team that tries to play entertaining football and comes unstuck (any team managed by Keegan or Ardiles), but even more preferably I’d like to see us marry the two, which I think that Moyes is trying to do.
The frustrating thing is that, with the personnel that we have, the simple things should be instinctive. We should be able to trap the ball and find a team mate in space with much more ease than we currently do.
Derek Thomas
41 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:42:08
41 Posted 29/12/2007 at 21:42:08
Dick Fearon and others: I noticed the frailty Vs the long ball in the West ham game(s).
No doubt there will be the all the usual post Christmas hangover type headlines, elements of believing our own publicity, along with both sides of the IMWT or taken us as far as he can debate.
I think that, while being nowhere near the ’can do no wrong Moysiah’ That he is progressing at a slow but steady pace in more or less the right direction and is learning as he goes. There may even be vague hints of turning into the Scottish Wenger.
But today ’ The REAL slim shady’ DID stand up.
More Nouse and the overall slightly higher class players both on and off the field to back it up.
Strange reffs notwithstanding.
The top 4 bollocks about being lucky, better teams make poorer teams make mistakes, end of.
And this season at least, the top 4 is shaping up into 2 lots of higher two’s. Do the pretenders have the wherewithall to get to 3rd ?? 2 weeks ago I was in the yes camp, but now, who knows.
No doubt there will be the all the usual post Christmas hangover type headlines, elements of believing our own publicity, along with both sides of the IMWT or taken us as far as he can debate.
I think that, while being nowhere near the ’can do no wrong Moysiah’ That he is progressing at a slow but steady pace in more or less the right direction and is learning as he goes. There may even be vague hints of turning into the Scottish Wenger.
But today ’ The REAL slim shady’ DID stand up.
More Nouse and the overall slightly higher class players both on and off the field to back it up.
Strange reffs notwithstanding.
The top 4 bollocks about being lucky, better teams make poorer teams make mistakes, end of.
And this season at least, the top 4 is shaping up into 2 lots of higher two’s. Do the pretenders have the wherewithall to get to 3rd ?? 2 weeks ago I was in the yes camp, but now, who knows.
Brian Waring
42 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:05:35
42 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:05:35
Tommy, I?m not being funny mate, but the 2 worst dives in the game were fom Arteta and Neville, and the yak went down rather easily when he was running through with Toure. I?m not having a dig, I know we are are all disappointed with the result, but I think tonight we just need to look a little closer to home when it comes down to pointing the finger for diving. If it had been 2 of the Arsenal players diving like Arteta and Neville, we would have been calling them cheating bastards now.
Nick Toye
43 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:23:31
43 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:23:31
@Simon,
So Fernandes had no say in the matter? Why do you say that? At the end of the day he had a choice between Everton and Valencia. He told the club he was signing for us, and if you check the Everton news archives they said as far as they were concerned the deal was on and people were up all night trying to seal it.
Yet he decided to fuck us off and go to Valencia. Seriously are you sure your not a red because you seem to know fuck all about Everton!
So Fernandes had no say in the matter? Why do you say that? At the end of the day he had a choice between Everton and Valencia. He told the club he was signing for us, and if you check the Everton news archives they said as far as they were concerned the deal was on and people were up all night trying to seal it.
Yet he decided to fuck us off and go to Valencia. Seriously are you sure your not a red because you seem to know fuck all about Everton!
Tony Edwards
44 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:21:25
44 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:21:25
Brian, fair comment, but come on I am not talking about going down, I am taliking about going down and rolling around like our Henry has just caught you flush on the jaw, I cant remember many players in a blue Jersey doing this if they did they need a dig from big frank bruno. You never hear Wenger moaning about divers and hollywood best man dead actors do you fuck
Simon Birdsey
45 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:29:20
45 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:29:20
Fernandes was owned by a third party who sold him to the highest bidder. The decision wasn’t down to him.
Losing on the football argument, so you thought you’d get personal, eh?
So far I’ve argued that Everton are hardly playing ’dream team’ football, but that they’re organised, hard to break down and capable of nicking goals (punt that the keeper misses, playing on when the opposition stop, nipping in between defender and goalkeeper, scrambling the ball in from a corner), whereas you think the exact opposite.
You’re right, we really are the greatest team the world has ever seen!
Losing on the football argument, so you thought you’d get personal, eh?
So far I’ve argued that Everton are hardly playing ’dream team’ football, but that they’re organised, hard to break down and capable of nicking goals (punt that the keeper misses, playing on when the opposition stop, nipping in between defender and goalkeeper, scrambling the ball in from a corner), whereas you think the exact opposite.
You’re right, we really are the greatest team the world has ever seen!
John Simpson
46 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:33:28
46 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:33:28
It’s impossible for passionate fans to watch everton games without a personal bias so I always check the SkySports stats when the game is over. For the record, the arse had 4 shots on target and (obviously!) scored all four. They had 2 shots off target. By contrast, Everton had three shots on target and 8 off target. We also had (marginally) greater possession and territorial advantage.
The stats tell us we lost to clinical finishing. I reckon that without that killer third goal we would have gone on to get at least a point. So... 3 points out of 9 over Christmas, but we’ve probably played the two best premiership teams in that period. I’m disappointed, but if I were to have predicted our points tally from these games I doubt it’d have been much different. Dunno whether I’m pessimistic or realistic. Hope our heads stay up tho; we played some good stuff again today. COYB
The stats tell us we lost to clinical finishing. I reckon that without that killer third goal we would have gone on to get at least a point. So... 3 points out of 9 over Christmas, but we’ve probably played the two best premiership teams in that period. I’m disappointed, but if I were to have predicted our points tally from these games I doubt it’d have been much different. Dunno whether I’m pessimistic or realistic. Hope our heads stay up tho; we played some good stuff again today. COYB
Brian Waring
47 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:52:39
47 Posted 29/12/2007 at 22:52:39
Tommy,I can see where your coming from. Even though there can be no complaints about Arteta?s red card, Fabregas went down as if he had just been hit by Mike Tyson. Also, I would never encourage violence in footy, but I wish someone would haved lamped Flamini tonight. Who the fuck did he think he was?!!
Nick Toye
48 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:05:54
48 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:05:54
@Simon,
How have I got personal? By saying you seem to know sweet FA?
I just don’t agree that we are a kick and run team. I’m sure I read some stats that shows we are up there with Arsenal for pass completion.
Today we passed our way around Arsenal, whereas they were resorting to hoofs.
I don’t think I am losing any football argument. Certainly not from you, who can’t see quality in our play, seriously why do you bother supporting the side if all you can see is shite?
How have I got personal? By saying you seem to know sweet FA?
I just don’t agree that we are a kick and run team. I’m sure I read some stats that shows we are up there with Arsenal for pass completion.
Today we passed our way around Arsenal, whereas they were resorting to hoofs.
I don’t think I am losing any football argument. Certainly not from you, who can’t see quality in our play, seriously why do you bother supporting the side if all you can see is shite?
Gavin Ramejkis
49 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:06:57
49 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:06:57
Surprise fucking surprise, two things missing from MOTD, the first and important was that slimy bastard Edwanko getting booked when the blind bastard in the black finally spotted him using his hand and the second which was Fabregas coming onto the pitch goading the fans slapping his untouched face - cheating bastards but what do you expect against the G14? Can anyone tell me the last time Everton got a decision against one of them and in a goal scoring position? Any statto out there tell me how many times we have had a player sent off against a G14 side when they have? Fucking stinks - challenge for the top four but you have to score a shitload for it to count.
Brian Waring
50 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:09:29
50 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:09:29
Simon, I think Nick is right on the football point. I have always been one of Moyes?s biggest critics, and some of the football we played was dire to say the least. But lately some of the football we have been playing has been excellent, and we have cut out the hoofing it up game. Even tonight, some of the passing and movement was great to watch. At the end of the day, it was just piss poor defending that lost us the game.
Simon Birdsey
51 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:17:55
51 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:17:55
@Nick,
The difference between us and Arsenal is that they hit long passes that actually find someone (watch Arsenal’s goals today and someone was on the end of everyone of those long balls to bring it down) whereas we kick it into the final third and run after it.
Yeah, we are capable of being creative, but all too often Neville will launch a straight ball down the pitch that will drift into touch, Carsley will get caught with a poor touch or Jagielka will play head tennis when he has all the time in the world to bring the ball down and pass it to a colleague.
If anyone has shit-tainted spectacles on mate it’s you, because I’ve given plenty of positives about the virtue of our play under Moyes, which you systematically choose to ignore. There is always room for improvement though.
The difference between us and Arsenal is that they hit long passes that actually find someone (watch Arsenal’s goals today and someone was on the end of everyone of those long balls to bring it down) whereas we kick it into the final third and run after it.
Yeah, we are capable of being creative, but all too often Neville will launch a straight ball down the pitch that will drift into touch, Carsley will get caught with a poor touch or Jagielka will play head tennis when he has all the time in the world to bring the ball down and pass it to a colleague.
If anyone has shit-tainted spectacles on mate it’s you, because I’ve given plenty of positives about the virtue of our play under Moyes, which you systematically choose to ignore. There is always room for improvement though.
Nick Toye
52 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:32:23
52 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:32:23
@Brian,
Glad you agree, I think we have become a footballing side but with a tenacious streak. I think the first half today was as good as we could have expected against Arsenal. Against lesser teams we would have been 2 or 3 up.
Worth pointing out though that only 2 goals were defensive errors, and I have to say quite a large slice of luck chucked in too.
More gutted than disheartened because like Moyes I thought we were the better side and deserved more than what we got.
Glad you agree, I think we have become a footballing side but with a tenacious streak. I think the first half today was as good as we could have expected against Arsenal. Against lesser teams we would have been 2 or 3 up.
Worth pointing out though that only 2 goals were defensive errors, and I have to say quite a large slice of luck chucked in too.
More gutted than disheartened because like Moyes I thought we were the better side and deserved more than what we got.
Nick Toye
53 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:34:57
53 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:34:57
@Simon,
All you have done is say that we don’t play football, we are kick and rush, and frankly mate thats bollocks.
Perhaps you should read some stats before you start slagging the team off. We don’t need people like you.
We have had some great results in the past few months, into a Semi final of a major tournament and last 32 of the Uefa Cup.
Can you please list the positives that I have seemingly ignored please?
All you have done is say that we don’t play football, we are kick and rush, and frankly mate thats bollocks.
Perhaps you should read some stats before you start slagging the team off. We don’t need people like you.
We have had some great results in the past few months, into a Semi final of a major tournament and last 32 of the Uefa Cup.
Can you please list the positives that I have seemingly ignored please?
Simon Birdsey
54 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:40:12
54 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:40:12
Bollocks eh? You want stats? Have a look at the following table:
Arsenal 6942
Man Utd 6877
Chelsea 6818
Man City 5439
Spurs 5416
Liverpool 5415
Blackburn 4815
Newcastle 4367
Middlesboro 4358
Sunderland 4351
West Ham 4207
Derby 4194
Portsmouth 4008
Bolton 3851
Wigan 3826
A Villa 3752
EVERTON 3676
That’s the total number of completed passes by each team this season acording to Opta. Considering we’ve got about half as many as the top teams, that would indicate that we’re either a direct team or incapable of stringing more than two passes together.
Why don’t you give me some stats before you start talking out of your arse?!
Here’s the link for your information:
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11096_2705370,00.html
Arsenal 6942
Man Utd 6877
Chelsea 6818
Man City 5439
Spurs 5416
Liverpool 5415
Blackburn 4815
Newcastle 4367
Middlesboro 4358
Sunderland 4351
West Ham 4207
Derby 4194
Portsmouth 4008
Bolton 3851
Wigan 3826
A Villa 3752
EVERTON 3676
That’s the total number of completed passes by each team this season acording to Opta. Considering we’ve got about half as many as the top teams, that would indicate that we’re either a direct team or incapable of stringing more than two passes together.
Why don’t you give me some stats before you start talking out of your arse?!
Here’s the link for your information:
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11096_2705370,00.html
Nick Toye
55 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:55:21
55 Posted 29/12/2007 at 23:55:21
I’m talking about what I see on the pitch, compared to what I saw last year.
But those completed passes don’t show the amount of passes. But I was told by a reliable source on the forum here at TW, that we are up there with Arsenal on pass completion percentages, not necessarily the amount of passes.
If that’s true and your stats don’t really prove otherwise, then surely thats a good thing having a high percentage of pass completions.
But listen pal, and listen good. I was banned from the forum because I was fed up of negative shite that comes out of this site, I’m also fed up of arguing the toss with people like you.
All that matters to me, is that I see an Everton team that is performing, scoring goals (the same as Man U as it happens) has gone on an incredible league/cup run. And our last three defeats in what 15 games have been at the hands of the Top 4.
We are in the last 32 of the Uefa Cup after beating everybody in what was deemed a tough group.
We are in the last 4 of the Carling Cup.
We have drawn away at Chelsea, only just lost to Man U in the last 2 mins. Were robbed by Liverpool and were the better team today against Arsenal.
I don’t give a shite if you want to think that the Blues are a negative, kick and run, long ball side, with no creativity. Your opinion in my life, the players lives, David Moyes life and the chairman’s life, means fuck all. Because we all know that this side is the best side to come out of Everton since the 85-87 team.
Did you see the goal that Osman scored in the Uefa Cup. One touch football, little flicks and a Roberto Carlos-esque finish. Was that just a fluke was it, or can this team play?
But those completed passes don’t show the amount of passes. But I was told by a reliable source on the forum here at TW, that we are up there with Arsenal on pass completion percentages, not necessarily the amount of passes.
If that’s true and your stats don’t really prove otherwise, then surely thats a good thing having a high percentage of pass completions.
But listen pal, and listen good. I was banned from the forum because I was fed up of negative shite that comes out of this site, I’m also fed up of arguing the toss with people like you.
All that matters to me, is that I see an Everton team that is performing, scoring goals (the same as Man U as it happens) has gone on an incredible league/cup run. And our last three defeats in what 15 games have been at the hands of the Top 4.
We are in the last 32 of the Uefa Cup after beating everybody in what was deemed a tough group.
We are in the last 4 of the Carling Cup.
We have drawn away at Chelsea, only just lost to Man U in the last 2 mins. Were robbed by Liverpool and were the better team today against Arsenal.
I don’t give a shite if you want to think that the Blues are a negative, kick and run, long ball side, with no creativity. Your opinion in my life, the players lives, David Moyes life and the chairman’s life, means fuck all. Because we all know that this side is the best side to come out of Everton since the 85-87 team.
Did you see the goal that Osman scored in the Uefa Cup. One touch football, little flicks and a Roberto Carlos-esque finish. Was that just a fluke was it, or can this team play?
Anthony Newell
56 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:11:56
56 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:11:56
Nick, it’s a shame Osman (or anyone else for that matter) didn’t take the shot that Neville wastefully ballooned over the bar like he did against Man U!
Nick Toye
57 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:23:38
57 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:23:38
@Anthony,
It is a shame, but the approach play needs some recognition I feel. It is certainly a step in the right direction, and I am going to recognise it.
It is a shame, but the approach play needs some recognition I feel. It is certainly a step in the right direction, and I am going to recognise it.
Simon Birdsey
58 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:04:41
58 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:04:41
@Nick,
I think you over-reacted to my initial post, which is why I’ve taken a defensive stance. The bottom line is that we both think that Everton are heading in the right direction.
Any side, whether it’s Arsenal, United, Chelsea or Liverpool has to start with a solid defensive base and then to add creativity as they develop.
Moyes has generally made us much more watertight, although maybe we’ve sacrificed a little of that this season to be more adventurous....close to the top of the goalscoring charts, but far fewer clean sheets.
It’s all about balance at the end of the day (just ask Rafa!). We are heading in the right direction, as evidenced by our progress to date in all competitions. My concern though is that we’ll have our hopes raised only to falter because of Moyes’s over-reliance on a small group of players (who will inevitably tire as the games come thick and fast later in the season) and because we can be a bit predictable in our tactics and general play.
I’m not saying that we’re a route one team, but all too often we see the ball lofted towards the opposition back four from the full back position (and easily headed away) rather than being worked across the pitch searching for an opening.
I am happy with our achievements to date and I think that there is plenty of potential with the players that we have. I do know that we’re capable of attractive football and we’ve shown that from time to time.
I would like to see the simple things becoming more instictive though, such as a simple short pass rather than people kicking the ball away hurriedly when under no pressure at all, which was my complaint this evening.
I think you over-reacted to my initial post, which is why I’ve taken a defensive stance. The bottom line is that we both think that Everton are heading in the right direction.
Any side, whether it’s Arsenal, United, Chelsea or Liverpool has to start with a solid defensive base and then to add creativity as they develop.
Moyes has generally made us much more watertight, although maybe we’ve sacrificed a little of that this season to be more adventurous....close to the top of the goalscoring charts, but far fewer clean sheets.
It’s all about balance at the end of the day (just ask Rafa!). We are heading in the right direction, as evidenced by our progress to date in all competitions. My concern though is that we’ll have our hopes raised only to falter because of Moyes’s over-reliance on a small group of players (who will inevitably tire as the games come thick and fast later in the season) and because we can be a bit predictable in our tactics and general play.
I’m not saying that we’re a route one team, but all too often we see the ball lofted towards the opposition back four from the full back position (and easily headed away) rather than being worked across the pitch searching for an opening.
I am happy with our achievements to date and I think that there is plenty of potential with the players that we have. I do know that we’re capable of attractive football and we’ve shown that from time to time.
I would like to see the simple things becoming more instictive though, such as a simple short pass rather than people kicking the ball away hurriedly when under no pressure at all, which was my complaint this evening.
Nick Toye
59 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:26:14
59 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:26:14
@Simon,
Fair enough,
I will concede that when we chase games we do tend to drop back and hoof. Whereas in the first half we outplayed them in every department.
I’m sure Moyes will say the same.
Fair enough,
I will concede that when we chase games we do tend to drop back and hoof. Whereas in the first half we outplayed them in every department.
I’m sure Moyes will say the same.
Simon Birdsey
60 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:35:49
60 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:35:49
Yeah, we did dominate them territorially, but we didn’t create too many chances with which to test Almunia. We’re not really the sort of side to hit too many 30 yard piledrivers into the top corner..unfortunately.
We’ve been on a fantastic run recently and it’s great to see us beat teams who we would traditionally expect to beat. Because of our resources, if we have to play deep to do that then so be it.
I would love to see us to develop into a more expansive, fluid side though and...I’m sure Moyes would say the same to that too! ;-)
We’ve been on a fantastic run recently and it’s great to see us beat teams who we would traditionally expect to beat. Because of our resources, if we have to play deep to do that then so be it.
I would love to see us to develop into a more expansive, fluid side though and...I’m sure Moyes would say the same to that too! ;-)
Nick Toye
61 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:56:17
61 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:56:17
Funny though, I didn’t really notice Arsenal create that many chances apart from the goals they scored. One of the goals was not a chance they created, the other was a handball, one was a mistake by Jags (from a hopeful punt) and the other was a token goal at the end of the game.
I really think they were lucky today, they didn’t deserve that and neither did we.
Of course we all want fluid football, but this is the closest we have come to that, (this season I mean).
I’m sure Moyes will be thinking of that when he dips into the Transfer Market.
I really think they were lucky today, they didn’t deserve that and neither did we.
Of course we all want fluid football, but this is the closest we have come to that, (this season I mean).
I’m sure Moyes will be thinking of that when he dips into the Transfer Market.
Nick Xenos
62 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:33:55
62 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:33:55
If there ever was a time when the score didn’t reflect the true story of a game, then this was it. I think that the quality of our attacking football today was brilliant, so much so that Arsene resorted to route one football to get at our backline. Fortunately for him, moments of madness and a bit of luck gifted his team 3 goals. Ok, Jag and Yobo made huge gafs but I think Howard should also be held accountable as well. There seems to be some indecision/lack of communication on Howard’s part when the ball is on the edge of the 18-yard box and our defenders are facing their own goal. He sometimes tends to stay on his goal-line too much when he should be coming out to the edge of the area to snuff out the danger. Looks like Wenger spotted this and surely, other managers would have taken note after this game. Bring on Boro!
John Andrews
63 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:48:48
63 Posted 30/12/2007 at 00:48:48
To the all seeing, all knowing Nick Toye.
The first goal emanated from a missed header by Jagielka as you correctly quoted.
The second goal came when Jagielka fell over and Eduardo didn’t. In my book that is two mistakes made by Jagielka.
It may be possible that the timing of these two mistakes was fairly crucial as they both happened just after half time and put Everton on the back foot.
I don’t regard my comments as knee jerk reactions as Lescott is a centre back and as such, in my opinion, should be playing there.
As far as Yobo and Howard are concerned it would be foolish to even suggest that they are "Shipped out".
After a fantastic first half the team just seemed to fall apart and especially the defence. The third goal was just sheer folly leaving only the fourth as a reasonable strike.
Of the 61 posts on here you have posted 18 of them which may suggest, to me at least, that not everybody agrees with you.
The first goal emanated from a missed header by Jagielka as you correctly quoted.
The second goal came when Jagielka fell over and Eduardo didn’t. In my book that is two mistakes made by Jagielka.
It may be possible that the timing of these two mistakes was fairly crucial as they both happened just after half time and put Everton on the back foot.
I don’t regard my comments as knee jerk reactions as Lescott is a centre back and as such, in my opinion, should be playing there.
As far as Yobo and Howard are concerned it would be foolish to even suggest that they are "Shipped out".
After a fantastic first half the team just seemed to fall apart and especially the defence. The third goal was just sheer folly leaving only the fourth as a reasonable strike.
Of the 61 posts on here you have posted 18 of them which may suggest, to me at least, that not everybody agrees with you.
stu jonno
64 Posted 30/12/2007 at 01:35:09
64 Posted 30/12/2007 at 01:35:09
stop bickering ladies !!!!!
we’re doing very well arent we.
we’re doing very well arent we.
Nick Toye
65 Posted 30/12/2007 at 01:54:33
65 Posted 30/12/2007 at 01:54:33
@John Andrews,
Don’t give a toss if nobody agrees with me. :)
Don’t give a toss if nobody agrees with me. :)
Simon Birdsey
66 Posted 30/12/2007 at 01:54:55
66 Posted 30/12/2007 at 01:54:55
Watch the Arsenal goals again. Clichy didn’t launch the ball aimlessy upfield to clear danger, it was a deliberate long pass to Edouardo. The ’hoof’ upfield for their third goal had Adebayor underneath it.
Contrast that with your typical Hibbert/Neville ball from the right back position aimed at a flat back four, where the presumed aim is that our lone striker will outjump four defenders and knock it into the net.
True, Arsenal didn’t create much either, but they didn’t really turn up today. On the other hand they were clinical with the four chances that they did have.
I do like Jagielka, but he evidently still needs to settle in. His distribution is woeful and he has been (partly) culpable for a number of goals recently. It might have made more sense at 2-1 down to switch Lescott and Jagielka, as I feel that Jags was getting badly exposed.
I’m not saying that Arsenal were brilliant and we were poor. It was more of a smash and grab raid on their part. They defended stoutly (anyone remember our strikers’ contribution in the second half?), found their strikers with accurate long passes and finished unerringly. A lesson indeed.
Contrast that with your typical Hibbert/Neville ball from the right back position aimed at a flat back four, where the presumed aim is that our lone striker will outjump four defenders and knock it into the net.
True, Arsenal didn’t create much either, but they didn’t really turn up today. On the other hand they were clinical with the four chances that they did have.
I do like Jagielka, but he evidently still needs to settle in. His distribution is woeful and he has been (partly) culpable for a number of goals recently. It might have made more sense at 2-1 down to switch Lescott and Jagielka, as I feel that Jags was getting badly exposed.
I’m not saying that Arsenal were brilliant and we were poor. It was more of a smash and grab raid on their part. They defended stoutly (anyone remember our strikers’ contribution in the second half?), found their strikers with accurate long passes and finished unerringly. A lesson indeed.
Chris Smith, Liverpool
67 Posted 30/12/2007 at 10:36:06
67 Posted 30/12/2007 at 10:36:06
To P. Whitty. the reason why the ’big four’ are called the ’big four’ is because believe it or not, they are the best four sides in the league and by far the biggest four in the league. In my opinion everyside needs investment and with investment comes status. you cannot complain that liverpool and man utd have the history to be considered a big four side, while chelsea and arsenal are well on their way to creating history warranting a place in the big four. history doesnt lie, those four sides have dominated everything in this country for the past 20 years. everton do have a lot of potential, but need investment. with investment brings other avenues to push smaller teams up there with the big four. look at city for the evidence. please correct me if i am wrong.
Dan Wragg
68 Posted 30/12/2007 at 12:05:43
68 Posted 30/12/2007 at 12:05:43
I know it was an elbow, but could Everton appeal the red card given to Mikel Arteta against Arsenal?
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1 Posted 29/12/2007 at 19:20:12