ToffeeWeb - Season 2007-08

Andy Callaghan
1 Posted 10/01/2008 at 03:01:01

Silly question. Both duh.

Wayne Smyth
2 Posted 10/01/2008 at 03:26:49

Given that we should still have £10M or £11M from the Lucho Gonzalez failed bid last summer, then I would imagine that Moyes will have enough money this summer to sign both.

We have first dibs on Pienaar at the end of the season for an agreed price(£2-2.5M?) and given that he seems as happy as a dog with two dicks at the moment, I can?t see him going elsewhere.

With Fernandes in the centre of the park I think we will be a different side. Along with Pienaar and Arteta it really is a midfield which oozes creativity and class. I really can?t wait!

John Charles
3 Posted 10/01/2008 at 03:58:25

Pienaar option at £2.5M. Would be crazzzzzzy not to take that up. I think its a dead certainy he will. Only reason he hasnt said it publically is he wants to keep PIenaar hungry to earn his deal.

Nail on.

Tony Cornmell
4 Posted 10/01/2008 at 06:29:52

I think Peanuts and Fernandes should both be signed but why do people keep writing off Carsley one of our most consistent performers who does not look like he?s over the hill and can play on for years .

Eric Myles
5 Posted 10/01/2008 at 06:46:55

I agree both would be ideal but didn’t know Pienaar was only valued at 2.5 million quid!! A bargain and I hope we get both.

Tony, I’m not knocking Carsley but we need an understudy for when he’s injured or suspended and we need to start thinking about it now, before the only option we are left with IS Neville.

Tony Part
6 Posted 10/01/2008 at 07:59:45

Nobody s writing off Carsley..I love the guy..He has been one of our most consistent players for the last three years and is a genuine good guy off the field,but I think this is his last season under contract isnt it?. Unless he gets one more year which perhaps is likely..I think people are just looking at the future and sadly Cars is not 27 or 28 so wont be around for much more.

Gaz Davies
7 Posted 10/01/2008 at 08:32:01

Again, both would be ideal but it will come down to the money and what areas Moyes decides to prioritise in the summer.
Finding a natural successor to Carsley is a must, as I don’t think we have a current squad member who comes close.

Regarding the £11m from the failed Lucho bid - didn’t we spend that on Yakubu?

Mark Ashton
8 Posted 10/01/2008 at 08:50:39

Three midfielders and a right back we need!

Allan Hobbs
9 Posted 10/01/2008 at 08:57:51

The Pienaar thing is a stick-on, but it hasn’t been said because the deal is a season long loan with the option to buy at THE END of the season. If it doesnt happen I’ll eat my hat. As for Manny, we should defo sign him at the end if we can; the kids class and with a midfield of Arteta, Pienaar, Fernandes & Carsley, with Cahill playing in the hole behind the Yak, we should have a cracking lineup when the ACN is over. As long as we can get a decent centre half and another full back our squads going to look alot better.

The only issue really is cover for Carsley, who as you rightly say, wont go on forever - in fact I’d say he’s on the (everso slight) slide as we speak. I love him as much as the next man but he’s what, 34 now? Players for that midfield role are few & far between so thats one hell of a job finding a replacement.

Great news on Manny, I really hope he signs, even if only on loan.

Danny Mullally
10 Posted 10/01/2008 at 09:00:09

It HAS to be both if Fernandes PROVES he’s worth a contract. Carsley is playing the best football of his career in my opinion but we know he wont carry on forever. We do need cover for Carsley, especially as he does his role so well and it is vital that we do not upset the balance of the side with all the flair players we could potentially have. We DO need a midfield destroyer-whether Moyes is sorting Fernandes then going after Vogel is unclear but we do deffo need someone to cover Carsley.

Right back I am happy with if Neville fills in.

Allan Hobbs
11 Posted 10/01/2008 at 09:04:03

Just found these, looks like its a goer - the press association & Reuters are never wrong. : )))

http://ukpress.google.com/article/ALeqM5jz8RXkfIRWyo5Uj4-rWBEG_ijMTQ

http://uk.reuters.com/article/footballNews/idUKL0944259220080109

Nick Coyne
12 Posted 10/01/2008 at 09:02:00

Just a couple of things to clarify:

- to Gaz, I believe the additional £11-12m being talked about was the money originally put aside for the failed Fernandes bid. We bagged Yakubu quite rightly for the £11m that you talk about, but we were also told that there was another £12m to box Manuel off first time around and to satisfy the 3rd party.

- I was lucky enough to bump into Kenwright before Christmas and obviously set about interrogating him about existing players and posible targets. Regarding Pienaar, he said that the decision to sign him would ultimately come down to Moyes, but that a figure of £3m had already been agreed with Dortmund.

Get that boy signed because he’s a dazzler!!

Ian Short
13 Posted 10/01/2008 at 09:07:12

I hope that we get both if Fernandes lives up to expectation - Piennar and Fernandes play in slightly different positions and Fernandes sees himself eventually as a holding midfielder (though he would have to defend a little better if he wants this position). Just a note about little Ossie - he was playing superbly before his injury linking the team together in his favoured central role and working his socks off - yet he always gets overlooked when another midfielder is linked. The signing of these two guys would certainly add to the competition and allow Moysey to play those that are in-form (which could still include Ossie).

Wayne Smyth
14 Posted 10/01/2008 at 09:13:23

Gaz, I think the money for the gonzalez transfer was in addition to the money paid for the yak.

If the stories of a £20M kitty underwritten by Robert Earl are to be believed then only half of that is now gone.

What Moyes will have in addition to that in the summer is anyones guess, but I would be surprised if he took Fernandes back for 6 months without having the ability to buy him at the end.

Louis Huglin
15 Posted 10/01/2008 at 09:37:32

Three midfielders and a right back we need

I agree with that assessment - and Pienaar, Fernandes and possibly Gosling mean that the only hole urgently in need of filling this summer is a Carsley replacement. I know he is still class this season but it would be idiocy not to look for his replacement now - a solid defensive minded midfielder to break up opposition play, and with the presence of mind to play someone in once he has the ball. Lets see how it all happens - I for one have pretty good faith in Moyes’s transfer dealings - he’s had far more success’s than cock ups.

Ben Jones
16 Posted 10/01/2008 at 09:54:01

I’m not sure about buying a right back, because Phil Neville is good enough for us there, at least for another season. However, Pienaar, Fernandes and a holding midfielder to replace Carsley in two seasons time (Lassana Diarra?) would do us just nicely when next season comes. Maybe a centre half as well, depending what Stubbs does, I can actually see him getting a coaching role with us next season, so a centre half as well is a must I reckon.

Peter Pickles
17 Posted 10/01/2008 at 09:57:19

Nobody is fit to replace Carsley until they prove themselves at being "unsung".

Paul Lenehan
18 Posted 10/01/2008 at 09:49:07

Excellant signing and our midfield will be much the better for it. As this season has already proven everyone iin the squad gets a chnace and if you play well Moyes normal rewards you. So I don’t think Ossie has anything to fear. There will be no automatic starters and if Ossie does the stuff he has every chance of playing. But with injuries and suspensions there is no doubt we are short in quality so this marks a good bit of business by Moyes.

Mark Pendleton
19 Posted 10/01/2008 at 10:15:51

We are talking about next summer’s transfer kitty here by the way and although we’re not the richest club in the world we do have a transfer pot each summer of sorts. Pienaar is almost a certainty to be signed, although quite rightly when we’ve an agree option to buy for a fixed price it’s stupid to exercise it now when we can have that cash sat in our own account (overdraft!) for 6 months. Also, heaven forbid he were to get a serious injury between now and the end of the season etc.

As for Manny, excactly what we needed and still need. Hopefully he’ll sign on loan, pick up where he left off and we’ll sign him as having Manny, Pienaar, Arteta, Cahill and Ossie to pick from to fill 3 or 4 midfield positions depending on formation is great. Then we just need back-up / long term replacement for Cars holding role.

Allan Hobbs
20 Posted 10/01/2008 at 10:18:15

Its not so much about people ’getting a chance’ its more about having strength in depth. Look at the top 3 (I dont include the RS), they all have players that can come in because they play so many games - thats where we should be, and are aiming. Man Utd for example, have players like Owen Hargreaves, Wayne Rooney, Ronaldo etc on the bench every week; not because they aren’t good enough, but because Ferguson has the ability to rotate when he needs to. Thats what Moyes is trying to achieve at Everton and all power to him for it. Its not just a case of ’replacing’ players, its more about having 2 players for every position that are as good as those that they play instead of. As a club our mentality is changing, as players the same is happening, the fans need to follow suit - this is one of the reasons we lose to the so called big 4; mentality.

Chelsea’s fans on Tuesday night when they were down to 10 men, were all shouting ’attack attack’ which sounds stupid to me but it shows their mentaility is such that like their team, they refuse to think of anything other than winning. Thats what we should aspire to (though please dont aspire to be like Chelsea fans!)

Paul OHanlon
21 Posted 10/01/2008 at 10:21:53

The fact that Moyes has just signed a promising right back and the current right back is a Moyes favourite and current club captain, suggests he won’t be looking at this area again in the summer.

I’d like to see him bring in a winger in this window. As shown in the past few weeks we have no adequate cover for Arteta or Pienaar (AJ and Fads just don’t cut it in midfield) and with the latter now being away for at least a month we have a problem.

Lee Smith
22 Posted 10/01/2008 at 10:50:06

Talking of Diarra, yesterday on SSN it was announced that Newcastle and "another un-named" Premiership club" had approached Arsenal with a view to sign him. What are the odds that that other club is Everton I wonder, specially as we all know how much Davie likes to keep his tranfers dealings underwraps as much as possible? If it is us, with Newcastle now being managerless at the moment, maybe we would be in the driving seat to sign him?

Stuart Mitchell
23 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:03:04

Just a quick mention for Leon Osman, Everyone is discussing how our midfield is going to look, and not one person has even mentioned him.

He has been a vital player in the way the 5 man midfield has played this year, there are even talks of him making the England squad.

It is going to be good when we have all our midfielders fit and available though!

Ric Wallace
24 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:11:20

I still believe what we really need this summer (After signing Piennar and Fernandes) is a centre back to replace Stubbs.

Its best getting him in this summer as you know for definite next summer we will need one when Yobo will be off again for ACN! Might as well get a youngster who can only improve.

Chris Winslet
25 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:12:47

It started as a joke; but after the performances of the last couple of years I believe to be a cast iron fact - Real Madrid really did think they were signing Lee Carsley!

Jack Johnson
26 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:09:42

Having Manny in the middle with Pienaar and Arteta around him would also bring the best out of Cahill as he won’t be expected to be so creative - something he’s actually not very good at - and will be able to concentrate more on what he does best - getting into the box and twatting the ball home.

Stuart Mitchell - you make a good point about Osman, I love the guy but does anyone else think that as this team gets stronger his position in the middle of the park would seem to be the most obvious that would be sacrificed?
Ossie’s such a classy little gem, and he plays the Everton way - on the deck. But for some reason I just never see him as the long term answer to success, whereas I do with the likes of Cahill, Arteta, Pienaar and even manny (IF HE SIGNS!)
It probably has something to do with his size, which sadly is the complete opposite of intimidating. I still love the lad though so don’t kill me!

Matt Kassell
27 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:19:44

Try saying Mark Ashton’s comment in a Yoda voice.

Stuart Mitchell
28 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:32:02

I agree JJ that Leon is far from intimidating with reference to his size, but Pienaar, Arteta and Cahill are hardly man mountains.

He may not be in the first team every week, with the midfield we are buidling, but can anyone tell me they do not want him in the squad!

Arteta, Cahill, Fernandes, Osman, Pienaar.

That would be an amazing attacking midfield 5! Althougth Carsley has been amazing for us and I would only use that midfield above against teams we expect to roll over.

It does look amazing though!

Ed Fitzgerald
29 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:27:20

Manny is a defensive midfielder, he just has more in his locker than Carsley or Neville has. Carsley has done a excellent job for us but I would not go as far as eulogising him as some of the posts do here. Yes he is 100% every game but when he has to do more than destroy he is woefully out of his depth. His distribution is mediocre. Before the posts start with the abuse I am not barracking the guy, just making an honest assessment of his whole time at Everton. For those of us who have watched week in, week out we know the crowd have not always been appreciative of Lee, have we? Pienaar should be signed as he provides width, guile and work rate. Fernandes may be a sneaky sly bastard (summer fiasco) but he is an excellent footballer who will improve the side.

Neil Pearse
30 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:34:59

Speaking up with some others for Leon: only when he has been absent has it been clear how important he has been in linking up play and driving us forward creatively. We need 6 good midfield players at least, and Leon is one of them.

I also agree that if we only sign one more player this window I would love it to be a Carsley replacement. Diarra would do just fine. Vogel could be a stopgap until the summer.

In terms of funding all this, it’s reported today that Birmingham have upped their offer for McFadden to £4M. If this is anywhere where near true we should bite their hands off. I also think Neville is dispensable in the summer, when we should make Lescott captain.

Stuart Mitchell
31 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:45:41

Good call on Lescott for future captain!

The next Kevin Ratcliffe!

Neil Pearse
32 Posted 10/01/2008 at 11:51:57

Making Joleon captain may also help keep him at the club. I think he is a huge player for our future, and he must now be being coveted by so-called ’bigger’ clubs. Also he really is the driving force behind so much of what we do, and leads by totally committed example. Give him a big new contract and make him captain.

Ste Bold
33 Posted 10/01/2008 at 13:01:43

How about Vogel to fill in for Cars when he’s injured or needs a break? I think Vogel’s 30 or 31 at the moment so we could probably get 3 years out of him. Holding midfileders seem to peak last well into their early thirties, look at Makelele, or indeed Carsley himself. Vogel’s a good player and he’s free - there’s little risk.

Tom Carter
34 Posted 10/01/2008 at 13:57:47

Wayne you are forgetting we paid £10M for Baines and Jags.

Eddie Harrison
35 Posted 10/01/2008 at 13:45:13

I really think Diarra would be a wrong move, he’s undoubtedly quality but he’s leaving a succesful (or soon to be) Arsenal team in order to get first team football. And right now I wouldnt pick him over Carsley, and where else would he fit in amongst a potential Arteta, Cahill, Fernandes, Pienaar combo.

Plus he strikes me as a bit of a whinge bag, if he isn’t happy on Arsenals bench he isn’t going to be any happier on ours, and if he does do exceptionally well I can well imagine him throwing a mini ’le sulk’ after a move. Unless of course we were succesful enough to keep the whingebag.

Having said that he put in a couple of cracking performances at right back for Chelsea.

Ajay Gopal
36 Posted 10/01/2008 at 14:01:28

I think one of the positions that DM will very carefully look into during the summer is the goal-keeper. Wessels has hardly filled anybody with confidence after his display in the FA Cup. And, Howard (brilliant though he has been), has started to look vulnerable to a few mistakes. A good back-up keeper would be essential.

Assuming that DM will tie-up Fernandes and Peinaar on long term deals in the summer, DM may look at a strong centre-back and a quality goal-keeper in the summer.

Micky Norman
37 Posted 10/01/2008 at 13:56:35

If we sign Manny it could actually prolong Lee Carsley’s career at Everton. Playing like he does, full blooded, tackling like a shark and in my opinion- our best player in many games this year he needs a rest now and again to recover from knocks. More so as a player ages. We shouldn’t always need to play 5 in midfield and Fernandes could comfortably do the more defensive role of a centre midfield pair with either Ossie or Tiny Tim. The competition from Peinaar has also brought the best from Ossie which is what he needed.Looking at the rich clubs, its the strength in depth which makes the difference for them and we look to be getting there, if only slowly. Hopefully we’ll be in cups/ Europe again next year as well and with two games a week we’ll need a strong squad. I’m sure Moyes knows this is a priority and it looks like he is going towards the Mourinho plan with two quality players in every position but with the money tight it’s taking time (and we’re not there yet are we?). I don’t think that every new signing is likely to be a nailed on first team regular now - however good they are and that’s got to be a good thing.

Mikey Cummins
38 Posted 10/01/2008 at 13:02:28

This Won't take long, if all goes well with Manny, think of our possible midfield 4.

Arteta (RM) Fernandes (CM) Cahill (CM) Stevie P (LM)

That my fellow bluenoses is PURE CLASS. See you at Wembley!!!

Dan Parker
39 Posted 10/01/2008 at 14:35:05

I'm not best pleased at the moment as the wheels have started to fall off but the prospect of a midfield of Arteta, Pienaar, Fernandes and Cahill is an exciting one.

Ste Riley
40 Posted 10/01/2008 at 16:07:12

Well i’m proper made up Manny’s come home i would still like to see Vogel @ Goodison ffs he’s a free agent! just a thought maybe Manny and his naughty behaviour was done on purpose so he could get fucked off from a place that he didn’t want to be at and his beloved blues would come and save him from his nightmare!

Ste Riley
41 Posted 10/01/2008 at 16:07:12

Well i’m proper made up Manny’s come home i would still like to see Vogel @ Goodison ffs he’s a free agent! just a thought maybe Manny and his naughty behaviour was done on purpose so he could get fucked off from a place that he didn’t want to be at and his beloved blues would come and save him from his nightmare!

Kieran Kinsella
42 Posted 10/01/2008 at 23:10:27

Any news on how the medical went and if we are actually sure he is joining this time? With regard to Moyes recent denial of the deal I was thinking that it is possible that Valencia initiated it given their desire to be rid of him and so perhaps Moyes wasn't lying but just hadn't been offered him yet.