The Mail Bag
Three Years- Top of the Pile ?
Comments (28)
It's my hope that we as a club are moving forward, and within the next three years Everton will be challenging the big four... make that three! ... for the Premier League and other major honors. I know the last five years have been a somewhat slow and sometimes painful experience for most of us Blues, but I feel we have improved nearly everything about the club under Moyes in the past 5 years or so.
We have great a manager (but not faultless), a mostly young side and I can see we have a lot of quality coming through the ranks, not to mention the new training facilities which can only attract better quality youngsters to join the club. The future's bright, it might not be this season (hope it is) but I feel all of us Evertonians will be celebrating some silverware in the next two/three seasons, and I'm talking about the big stuff.
Great to be a Blue at the moment. Chelsea, you will be the first one of the so-called big gun's to be hit with Everton's new resolve and resurgence. Chelsea you have be warned, or is that Vaughan-ed!
David Lawless, Posted 14/01/2008 at 21:59:38
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Jimmy Crack
2 Posted 15/01/2008 at 02:40:41
2 Posted 15/01/2008 at 02:40:41
I’m too young to have ever seen a Blue lifting a trophy (’95 FA Cup aside), and I really do think that we’re on the right path under Moyes and (dare I say) Kenwright.
That being said, it’s arguably much easier to turn a relegation team into a mid-table team than a mid-table team into a league-topping team, especially without some investment into the squad.
I’d say it’ll be at least four or five years (assuming Moyes is still here) until we can seriously challenge for top spot
That being said, it’s arguably much easier to turn a relegation team into a mid-table team than a mid-table team into a league-topping team, especially without some investment into the squad.
I’d say it’ll be at least four or five years (assuming Moyes is still here) until we can seriously challenge for top spot
Peter Pridgeon
3 Posted 15/01/2008 at 06:34:33
3 Posted 15/01/2008 at 06:34:33
I would think you are being a little over optimistic David. We are going to have a hell of a job overturning Man United, Arsenal and Chelsea not to mention the resurgent clubs like Man City and Aston Villa. If as has been reported recently that the RS are going to change hands and be bought by the Arabs, this will create even more of a difficulty when its all settled down.
There is a common link with all these clubs and that is simply foreign money, without it you can kiss the champions league goodbye.
The RS have seen their chances slipping (but by no means over) because Gillette and Hicks are refusing to spend their own money.
We simply cannot compete with the money clubs
Moyes may strike it lucky once every season with a find like Cahill, Arteta and above all Lescott but this will not give you a squad like Man United, Chelsea or Arsenal.
We live in hope
There is a common link with all these clubs and that is simply foreign money, without it you can kiss the champions league goodbye.
The RS have seen their chances slipping (but by no means over) because Gillette and Hicks are refusing to spend their own money.
We simply cannot compete with the money clubs
Moyes may strike it lucky once every season with a find like Cahill, Arteta and above all Lescott but this will not give you a squad like Man United, Chelsea or Arsenal.
We live in hope
Jason Broome
4 Posted 15/01/2008 at 06:43:39
4 Posted 15/01/2008 at 06:43:39
I think our next three signings are going to be crucial to our future.
We have the holy trinity again of Arteta, Cahill & Fernandes so now it is up to DM to be patient and wise in who he chooses to buy & sell.
I like the fact that he is investing in the youth team, as well as the first, however nothing but world-class quality is good enough for us now.
League challengers... with caution & patience, 2 years!
We have the holy trinity again of Arteta, Cahill & Fernandes so now it is up to DM to be patient and wise in who he chooses to buy & sell.
I like the fact that he is investing in the youth team, as well as the first, however nothing but world-class quality is good enough for us now.
League challengers... with caution & patience, 2 years!
Shaun Brennan
5 Posted 15/01/2008 at 10:23:34
5 Posted 15/01/2008 at 10:23:34
For Crying out loud. It?s not that easy and we won?t be challenging for the league in two or three years.
Listen to yourself. Its just not that easy! Football Manager alert again!
Listen to yourself. Its just not that easy! Football Manager alert again!
Eddie Millington
6 Posted 15/01/2008 at 10:54:31
6 Posted 15/01/2008 at 10:54:31
Yeah I reckon it?s a bit ambitious saying 2/3 years. Who knows with the slow growth over the years (which I love to see, slowly improving a bit every season without blowing huge wads of cash on gambles) we may get there. You look at Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal though and you have to agree they are still quite a way ahead of us. A cup is by no means out of our grasp though.
Ed Casey
7 Posted 15/01/2008 at 10:46:50
7 Posted 15/01/2008 at 10:46:50
I think its really over optimistic to think we can win the league within a few years. We are flying at the moment and long may it continue but until we get a mega-investor (in the Abramovich mold) I think the best we can hope for is consistent Euro qualification via UEFA or by nicking fourth place through gutsy hardwork (one of our consistent traits).
I just pray that the turmoil the redshite are going through at the moment will put them back years in the way the Souness reign did. The last time they won the league is only two years less than the last time we won it. Loved the comment by Wenger recently that Goodison is a more intimidating place to come these days than Anfield.
I just pray that the turmoil the redshite are going through at the moment will put them back years in the way the Souness reign did. The last time they won the league is only two years less than the last time we won it. Loved the comment by Wenger recently that Goodison is a more intimidating place to come these days than Anfield.
Anyway, like I said I dream of the demise of our ?illustrious? neighbours but even with the wheels falling off their present campaign, behind the scenes they have a DIC waiting in the wings to take over. Thats right, Liverpool this time next season will be DICs - rich DICs but DICs nonetheless. Would love to see them running out with DIC on their shirts. And there is nothing childish about that!
David Whitwell
8 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:01:18
8 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:01:18
Peter Pridgeon makes the assessment that the common link between the top clubs is foreign money, whilst I agree Arsenal have spent less than us and are challenging for the title.
I think sometimes we get to carried away that the very best players always go to the top clubs, probably Ronaldo aside are the rest of them individually much better than some of our players?
The most important thing for us is that we have players who want to play for our club, our supporters and our manager. I believe that is an edge more important than money, just look at whats happening to the RS.
P.S if you take a league table from when we lost to L’Pool we sit in 3rd, only 3 points behind Chelsea, 2 behind Man Utd & ahead of Arsenal on GD with a game in hand, Man city would be 9 pts behind us & L’Pool 6 points behind.
Lets keep it going & break the mould!
I think sometimes we get to carried away that the very best players always go to the top clubs, probably Ronaldo aside are the rest of them individually much better than some of our players?
The most important thing for us is that we have players who want to play for our club, our supporters and our manager. I believe that is an edge more important than money, just look at whats happening to the RS.
P.S if you take a league table from when we lost to L’Pool we sit in 3rd, only 3 points behind Chelsea, 2 behind Man Utd & ahead of Arsenal on GD with a game in hand, Man city would be 9 pts behind us & L’Pool 6 points behind.
Lets keep it going & break the mould!
Geoff Whitlow
9 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:15:28
9 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:15:28
No chance sadly. With Everton still facing a massive bill to resolve the stadium issue one way or another and money more important than ever in English football it will be a great achievement to stay challenging in the top half
Nick Broadhurst
10 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:31:54
10 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:31:54
^ lol. I know David’s original post was perhaps a wee bit ambitious, but I think yours is about as pessimistic as it gets Geoff!
Baby steps I say. Champions League football should be our main goal for the next few years... then, who knows?
Baby steps I say. Champions League football should be our main goal for the next few years... then, who knows?
Dave Lynch
11 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:28:33
11 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:28:33
Is it no wonder Kopites come on here taking the piss with posts like that.
Start bragging when we have actually won something, or are competing at the top level.
As for your assertion about the Chelsea game ?
You are giving them bullets to fire back, so keep it real. Chelsea hold the upper hand and are a very very good side.
A lot better than us dare I say, but stranger things have happened in football.
Start bragging when we have actually won something, or are competing at the top level.
As for your assertion about the Chelsea game ?
You are giving them bullets to fire back, so keep it real. Chelsea hold the upper hand and are a very very good side.
A lot better than us dare I say, but stranger things have happened in football.
Mark Griffiths
12 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:37:49
12 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:37:49
It is may be a little premature to start talking about winning league i feel.
I think our next target in the coming 2/3 seasons is to try and break that top 4 and go feurther in cup competitions, CC FA and UEFA and who knows the CL will be the next goal.
I think our next target in the coming 2/3 seasons is to try and break that top 4 and go feurther in cup competitions, CC FA and UEFA and who knows the CL will be the next goal.
Mike Oates
13 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:43:59
13 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:43:59
This must be my 3rd or 4th attempt to try and get some reality into the lastest mails.
While we are undoubtedly improving year by year under Moyes I still feel that we are some way still seriously behind Man U , Arsenal and Chelsea.
(i) In order to be a club challenging for the top spot you need first and foremeost a cast iron defence . You need to be absolutely sure that when you’re having an off-day up front you aint going to lose the game. Look at defensive records of the current Top 4 , goals aginst 11,17,16,14 - ours 22 , good but still not good enough . We are prone to monthly lack of concentration as its called whereas the top teams probably limit their faults to only 1 or 2 times a season.
(ii) you need a guarranteed supply of creativity and goals, allowing for injuries and suspensions and bloody ANC .
Utd - Ronaldo,Rooney,Scholes,Tevez,Nani,Saha - goals scored 44
Arsenal - Adebayor,Eduardo,Fabregas,Van Persie,Rosicky - goals scored 43
Chelsea - Drogba,Anelka,Lampard,Shevchenko,Cole,Wright Phillips,Ballack - goals scored 35
Everton - Yakubu,Johnson,Cahill, Arteta,Osman - goals scored 38 , getting better !
If you’ve noticed I’ve left Liverpool out of item (ii) as they totaly rely on Torres and Gerrard - their true weakness this season.
I think the reality is we need to get the 4th spot and steadily grow from there. At the moment besides Liverpool I think Aston Villa are the real threats (40 goals - with some good young players).
While we are undoubtedly improving year by year under Moyes I still feel that we are some way still seriously behind Man U , Arsenal and Chelsea.
(i) In order to be a club challenging for the top spot you need first and foremeost a cast iron defence . You need to be absolutely sure that when you’re having an off-day up front you aint going to lose the game. Look at defensive records of the current Top 4 , goals aginst 11,17,16,14 - ours 22 , good but still not good enough . We are prone to monthly lack of concentration as its called whereas the top teams probably limit their faults to only 1 or 2 times a season.
(ii) you need a guarranteed supply of creativity and goals, allowing for injuries and suspensions and bloody ANC .
Utd - Ronaldo,Rooney,Scholes,Tevez,Nani,Saha - goals scored 44
Arsenal - Adebayor,Eduardo,Fabregas,Van Persie,Rosicky - goals scored 43
Chelsea - Drogba,Anelka,Lampard,Shevchenko,Cole,Wright Phillips,Ballack - goals scored 35
Everton - Yakubu,Johnson,Cahill, Arteta,Osman - goals scored 38 , getting better !
If you’ve noticed I’ve left Liverpool out of item (ii) as they totaly rely on Torres and Gerrard - their true weakness this season.
I think the reality is we need to get the 4th spot and steadily grow from there. At the moment besides Liverpool I think Aston Villa are the real threats (40 goals - with some good young players).
Paul Lenehan
14 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:20:34
14 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:20:34
I think its a little early to be talking of winning the league. I think the only way we will get Everton to where we all want them to be is to achieve Champions League football on a regular basis. Easier said than done I know, but consistantly finishing fourth and increasing our budget through CL TV money has to be our aim. If we achieve that over the next 3-4years who knows where we can go. But as has been said many times on this site babysteps are the order of the day.
Ange Matool
15 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:57:31
15 Posted 15/01/2008 at 11:57:31
Most comments here indicate that we?re far away from challenging for the title. The fact is people, we were very close & unlucky on both occasions to lose to Man Utd, ripped off against the RS, played well at home against Arsenal (who played hoofball that day) before our defense capitulated, and got a point at Chelsea. Not bad for a team with limited funds. Moyes just has to strengthen our back line, especially right back & defensive midfielder, then who knows what could happen a year or two ......COYB
Karl Masters
16 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:21:06
16 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:21:06
Whilst it will be difficult to get to that level again, who knows?
You would have said in December 1983 that Everton had no chance of winning anything, especially the League, but less than 18 months later we were chasing a treble and achieved a double. Things can change very quickly when the time comes.
Anyway, haven?t any of you been paying attention? I?ve said it before, and I?ll say it again:
Everton win the League every 24 years:
1891 1915 1939 1963 1987 .... 2011 ?
That?s in 3 year?s time.....here?s hoping and get your bets on now!
You would have said in December 1983 that Everton had no chance of winning anything, especially the League, but less than 18 months later we were chasing a treble and achieved a double. Things can change very quickly when the time comes.
Anyway, haven?t any of you been paying attention? I?ve said it before, and I?ll say it again:
Everton win the League every 24 years:
1891 1915 1939 1963 1987 .... 2011 ?
That?s in 3 year?s time.....here?s hoping and get your bets on now!
Jay Campbell
17 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:46:55
17 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:46:55
Just 3 more years is that all??
With that board we haven’t got a prayer within 3 decades. FFS wake up.
With that board we haven’t got a prayer within 3 decades. FFS wake up.
Simon Watts
18 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:04:17
18 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:04:17
If you take a league table from when we lost to Liverpool we sit in 3rd, only 3 points behind Chelsea, 2 behind Man Utd & ahead of Arsenal on GD with a game in hand, Man city would be 9 pts behind us & L?Pool 6 points behind.
Bearing in mind we was robbed in the Liverpool game. We would be top and 9 points in front of them.
Bearing in mind we was robbed in the Liverpool game. We would be top and 9 points in front of them.
David Lawless
19 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:42:21
19 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:42:21
I may have been a bit ambitous with my post, re-hopfully challenging the big boys in the next few years. I also acknowlege some of the replies, we do need massive long term investment in the club, but we are Everton not some of the sides mentioned on the replies. We should believe and aim for better and bigger things, we can challenge them. Liverpool or the big three have NO devine right to all the trophies and C/L places. I know we have still got a long way to go, but please don’t tell me we can’t even have a go at being ambitious. Things can change very quickly in the world of football, so why can’t we moved forward and really push them hard and give them somthing to think about. If we dont believe we can topple them, what hope for all the other sides. As for me bragging before we have achieved anything, re Chelsea game next week, maybe we should follow the Chelsea’s web-sites advice, Everton should not bother turning up.
As for my reply to the R/S fan having they being saying the same thing for past 18 seasons, ’’We have got a great chance of winning the Premiership this year’’.
As for my reply to the R/S fan having they being saying the same thing for past 18 seasons, ’’We have got a great chance of winning the Premiership this year’’.
Tony Williams
20 Posted 15/01/2008 at 13:28:09
20 Posted 15/01/2008 at 13:28:09
That’s what I like to see, a bit of optimism. It doesn’t matter how deluded it is, it is always nice to see.
We are miles away from the "Sky 4" in terms of money and squad, we simply cannot compete with their transfer dealings.
I agree we played well against them this season and were unlucky to lose them all but we then look at the Reading, Newcastlw and Villa games and then realise until we can consistently beat these teams when we have off days, we are not going to challenge for the title.
It is a long way off, but hopefully it is coming
We are miles away from the "Sky 4" in terms of money and squad, we simply cannot compete with their transfer dealings.
I agree we played well against them this season and were unlucky to lose them all but we then look at the Reading, Newcastlw and Villa games and then realise until we can consistently beat these teams when we have off days, we are not going to challenge for the title.
It is a long way off, but hopefully it is coming
Charlie Percival
21 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:09:05
21 Posted 15/01/2008 at 12:09:05
Whats priority this season, 4th spot in prem or winning carling cup?
I would have to say 4th in league due to the fact we will get more money from league position, champ league (if qualify), it willl attract better players and also will help shape our future for the next 5-10 years. CC win would be a trophy in the cabinet, but it wouldnt have the same affect I dont think as coming 4th. But thats just my view
Chris Masey
22 Posted 15/01/2008 at 14:00:25
22 Posted 15/01/2008 at 14:00:25
If you read Tony Marsh’s column, and then this, you would think they were talking about different clubs.
Not sure I agree with this optimisim though. Moyes is doing a great job with limited resources, but to say we can challenge for the league in 3 years is crazy.
One step at a time. Lets try and win a trophy of any sort first.
Not sure I agree with this optimisim though. Moyes is doing a great job with limited resources, but to say we can challenge for the league in 3 years is crazy.
One step at a time. Lets try and win a trophy of any sort first.
Jason Broome
23 Posted 15/01/2008 at 13:47:24
23 Posted 15/01/2008 at 13:47:24
FACT: If the Premiership did not contain the top two we would be realistic title challengers... today!
The glass doesn’t always have to be half empty. Chelsea & R/S have sold the family silver and they still can’t shake us off.
For years we lacked consistency and this season has proven that we need fear noone. With the right class of signings, luck, and solid determination EFC can and will continue to defy logic!
The glass doesn’t always have to be half empty. Chelsea & R/S have sold the family silver and they still can’t shake us off.
For years we lacked consistency and this season has proven that we need fear noone. With the right class of signings, luck, and solid determination EFC can and will continue to defy logic!
Robin Massart
24 Posted 15/01/2008 at 14:07:21
24 Posted 15/01/2008 at 14:07:21
I’m a lifelong Everton fan, but until we have £30+m to spend every season challenging for the title is a dream. I am sure we can get some silverware with a bit of fortune and even enter the champions league every now and then. But the title? We have to hope I suppose...
One key thing is whether Moyes knows how to build a team of superstars. He’s shown he can pick and mix lesser players and turn them into a formidable team. But the next few seasons will show us if he can build a successful team of internationals. A team where the bench is filled by international players who would be in most teams starting line ups. That’s the difference between Everton and the top 3.
One key thing is whether Moyes knows how to build a team of superstars. He’s shown he can pick and mix lesser players and turn them into a formidable team. But the next few seasons will show us if he can build a successful team of internationals. A team where the bench is filled by international players who would be in most teams starting line ups. That’s the difference between Everton and the top 3.
Paul Lenehan
25 Posted 15/01/2008 at 15:11:25
25 Posted 15/01/2008 at 15:11:25
Fair point Robin. We are certainly moving in the right direction which will give us very different challenges to what we have been used to in the recent past.
Art Greeth
26 Posted 15/01/2008 at 16:51:27
26 Posted 15/01/2008 at 16:51:27
Interesting thread this one... people are regularly berated on here for not living up to the NSNO mantra for believing a top six place is ’acceptable’, yet when someone (as Dave has done here...) speaks optimistically of winning the league in 2-3 years he is (mildly) rebuked and told to ’get real’.
The Arse and Manure have consistently contested the league for a decade now . Chelski is only a recent phenomenon because of Abramovich’s dosh. The ’poo has not been genuine title contenders for almost as long as ourselves.
We are currently equal on points with the ’poo and eight points adrift of Chelsea. Whilst I accept the top two are way out in front, both the ’poo and Chelsea are within our sights.
Everybody knows the spending power of those four clubs. Everybody is aware how much more careful we have to be with our monies. Yet, as this season shows, we are on an equal par with two of the four. Contesting a cup semi with Chelsea, still in Europe and bunching up with them and the ’poo in the league.
With the patience of the board to retain the manager and the sound direction of the team under Moyes, the quantity and quality of the squad has improved year on year. With continued incremental improvement, why is it so ridiculous that in 2-3 years time we cannot sustain a genuine title challenge?
Robin Massart asks an interesting question about Moyes’ ability to build a team of ’superstars’... Well, maybe that is just what he is doing with the current set of players with his very disciplined transfer policy. He only signs players he believes can improve the squad. Moves them on if they don’t. Brings in players that fit into the tight team spirit and work ethic that defines DM’s Everton.
Others have alluded to the parallels the current squad has with the all-conquering team of HK1 in the 80s. As evidenced by us being completely overlooked by the media, is that not yet another parallel with that great side? Largely unsung, largely ignored, but suddenly, they swept all before them with majestic football.
Everton Football Club - Premier League Champions 2010-11. Dare to dream. Why not...?
The Arse and Manure have consistently contested the league for a decade now . Chelski is only a recent phenomenon because of Abramovich’s dosh. The ’poo has not been genuine title contenders for almost as long as ourselves.
We are currently equal on points with the ’poo and eight points adrift of Chelsea. Whilst I accept the top two are way out in front, both the ’poo and Chelsea are within our sights.
Everybody knows the spending power of those four clubs. Everybody is aware how much more careful we have to be with our monies. Yet, as this season shows, we are on an equal par with two of the four. Contesting a cup semi with Chelsea, still in Europe and bunching up with them and the ’poo in the league.
With the patience of the board to retain the manager and the sound direction of the team under Moyes, the quantity and quality of the squad has improved year on year. With continued incremental improvement, why is it so ridiculous that in 2-3 years time we cannot sustain a genuine title challenge?
Robin Massart asks an interesting question about Moyes’ ability to build a team of ’superstars’... Well, maybe that is just what he is doing with the current set of players with his very disciplined transfer policy. He only signs players he believes can improve the squad. Moves them on if they don’t. Brings in players that fit into the tight team spirit and work ethic that defines DM’s Everton.
Others have alluded to the parallels the current squad has with the all-conquering team of HK1 in the 80s. As evidenced by us being completely overlooked by the media, is that not yet another parallel with that great side? Largely unsung, largely ignored, but suddenly, they swept all before them with majestic football.
Everton Football Club - Premier League Champions 2010-11. Dare to dream. Why not...?
Simon Watts
27 Posted 15/01/2008 at 19:19:05
27 Posted 15/01/2008 at 19:19:05
Well said Art. I dont want no new chairman like the red shite have. The money is all borrowed anyway. I think we have a genuine chance. I think many of our players are good enough. Bring it on. We just need to replace the Hibberts etc and we nearly there.
Kev Prytherch
28 Posted 17/01/2008 at 01:53:28
28 Posted 17/01/2008 at 01:53:28
Just looking at our fixture list and I can't see any reason why we can't go through the next 9 premiership games unbeaten. Granted away to Blackburn and City will both be difficult but the wheels seem to have come off a bit for these teams since the start of the season.
The next game I can honestly say I'm expecting to lose (and it's got more to do with recent refereeing appointments than anything else) is March 29th. Even that's not a certainty. Kind of puts you in an optimistic mood!!
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1 Posted 15/01/2008 at 02:22:00