The Mail Bag
History?
Comments (37)
I am on a day off and have lots of time to ponder, albeit this has bothered me for some time.
I would like to ask True Evertonians what their thoughts would be on the subject of stopping the singing of "If You Know your History"
We know our history; nobody else cares and to be honest it does not really matter any more.
Football only started in this country in 1992 and thats a fact ( Sky).
Example: Ronaldo best free kick ever, like fuck it is.
How about Sheeds doing it once then showing everyone how to do it again straight after (Wonderful)
Anyway, back to my point, it's a crap song any way and means nothing any more. Some lyricist out there, give us something else that represents all that we are.
A club that will always be a big club no matter how much money is pumped into the game and a club that will consistently move with the times, we always have and are doing so again.
We can't live or think of the past any more ? it's the future and in my opinion a bright one.
Paul Niklas, Posted 04/02/2008 at 15:52:52
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Richard Grisdale
1 Posted 05/02/2008 at 02:20:41
1 Posted 05/02/2008 at 02:20:41
And Paul, the lyrics are spot on...every word....
Joe Aylward
2 Posted 05/02/2008 at 02:09:14
2 Posted 05/02/2008 at 02:09:14
I actually think Paul and Lyndon are both wrong.
Paul, our history matters and will contiue to matter to all supporters of this club. What we have unlike the corporate message espoused by the so-called big four is a story and a tradition, which is to be shared and embraced by all blues from generation to generation. The more cynical could say its all we have but I for one will always embrace it and pass it down to my kids, even though I live 12000 miles from my home town.
Lyndon, I always thought that this song (First heard by me not at Goodison but from the rather sectarian terraces of Celtic Park) gives a negative connotation, in the sense that two lines in our version refer to the RS.
I dont want to refer or even think about the RS in what has become our signature song!
I want us to not only know our history but not feel insecure of our place in history - those lines to me are negative, myopic and smack of paranoia. We can do better than than this song.
Could be a good thread this!
Joe Aylward, Adelaide South Australia
Paul, our history matters and will contiue to matter to all supporters of this club. What we have unlike the corporate message espoused by the so-called big four is a story and a tradition, which is to be shared and embraced by all blues from generation to generation. The more cynical could say its all we have but I for one will always embrace it and pass it down to my kids, even though I live 12000 miles from my home town.
Lyndon, I always thought that this song (First heard by me not at Goodison but from the rather sectarian terraces of Celtic Park) gives a negative connotation, in the sense that two lines in our version refer to the RS.
I dont want to refer or even think about the RS in what has become our signature song!
I want us to not only know our history but not feel insecure of our place in history - those lines to me are negative, myopic and smack of paranoia. We can do better than than this song.
Could be a good thread this!
Joe Aylward, Adelaide South Australia
sean condon
3 Posted 05/02/2008 at 02:49:41
3 Posted 05/02/2008 at 02:49:41
Frankly, I have been a tad afraid of expressing any negative views regarding ’If You Know..." for fear of some of you lunatics hunting me down.
I like the lyrics. I like the insertion of the RS reference, even if it does speak of the general paranoia and insecurity so many of us seem to be afflicted with regarding the Pinkies.
What I don’t like is how fucking bad that ’whoa, whoa, whoa’ part sounds on tv. Like excruciatingly bad 80’s pop hair metal. A minor quibble.
Tell ya what, though. NOTHING ever sounds better than Z-Cars.
We are going to fucking destroy Reading.
I like the lyrics. I like the insertion of the RS reference, even if it does speak of the general paranoia and insecurity so many of us seem to be afflicted with regarding the Pinkies.
What I don’t like is how fucking bad that ’whoa, whoa, whoa’ part sounds on tv. Like excruciatingly bad 80’s pop hair metal. A minor quibble.
Tell ya what, though. NOTHING ever sounds better than Z-Cars.
We are going to fucking destroy Reading.
Paul Niklas
4 Posted 05/02/2008 at 02:47:24
4 Posted 05/02/2008 at 02:47:24
Lyndon, I do celebrate it and cherish it but nobody really outside of our selves will ever do so.
Are we really any more unique than other clubs, i feel we are, especially every time I enter Goodison.
I think sometimes you can get a bit hung up about the past When deciding on the future, the ground move is an example. Albeit I am against it, for reasons of geography not history.
we should also embrace the future one that I feel is rosier now than its been for 20 years.
its like cherishing your own family and its traditions, something you do naturally, the reality is though no one outside your family cares.
I suppose having the same feeling about your football club is unique... or is it.
Stil hate the song.
Are we really any more unique than other clubs, i feel we are, especially every time I enter Goodison.
I think sometimes you can get a bit hung up about the past When deciding on the future, the ground move is an example. Albeit I am against it, for reasons of geography not history.
we should also embrace the future one that I feel is rosier now than its been for 20 years.
its like cherishing your own family and its traditions, something you do naturally, the reality is though no one outside your family cares.
I suppose having the same feeling about your football club is unique... or is it.
Stil hate the song.
Paul Gladwell
5 Posted 05/02/2008 at 07:58:31
5 Posted 05/02/2008 at 07:58:31
Not a lover of the song plus it is a Celtic song and we have only being singing it for five minutes.
I loved the new history dvd but one fault was the constant use of this song far more than that of Z Cars.
I consider " On the banks" to be our song although the words will not fit soon.
I loved the new history dvd but one fault was the constant use of this song far more than that of Z Cars.
I consider " On the banks" to be our song although the words will not fit soon.
Jip Foster
6 Posted 05/02/2008 at 08:29:17
6 Posted 05/02/2008 at 08:29:17
I loved singing it at the 2nd leg of the Carling Semi - the way everybody shouted ’if you know your history...’ part directly at the glory hunting Chelski fans. It kinda shows we are proper fans, in it for the love of our club, and that over time we are the best team.
Paul Niklas
7 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:02:44
7 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:02:44
Jip, its great singing songs at any time and in particular your right the sentiment works against Chelsea.
But reality is we are not the best team over time, we are up there but not the best.
I also agree we are proper fans particularly away from home , they amaze me at times with how many travel.
But reality is we are not the best team over time, we are up there but not the best.
I also agree we are proper fans particularly away from home , they amaze me at times with how many travel.
patty beesley
8 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:04:29
8 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:04:29
Sorry but I am very fond of singing "If you know your history" especially the "we don’t care what the RS say " in the kitchen at work when I am having to make coffee for those Liverpool supporters upstairs!!!
Ed Fitzgerald
9 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:00:44
9 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:00:44
I dont like the song, and its not ours anyway. Its quite a recent edition to the rather limited Everton song book. The defining sounds of Everton are Z-Cars and on the banks of the Royal Blue Mersey. Perhaps luvvie duvvie Kenwright can get a songwriter to pen a rousing ditty about the streets of Westvale and Tescos finest range to inspire us in our new home.
Peter Laing
10 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:28:23
10 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:28:23
What a ridiculous suggestion, to my knowledge as a 30 something Evertonian this song has become synonomous with the Club and been around from my recollection since at least the mid 80’s. It may be a Celtic song but as with every Club these anthems are picked up along the way and sometimes adapted by other supporters. Follow,follow,follow isnt exactly our song either, however it makes me sick to here the shower across the park trying to hijack it. As long as we are winning we will keep singing, after all it is a grand old team to support. COYB FTRS
Ed Fitzgerald
11 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:38:41
11 Posted 05/02/2008 at 09:38:41
In my experience as a 45 year old and a season ticket holder for 35 of those years, I never heard it home, away or abroad throughout the 80’s. The follow, follow chant is shite too and thats not ours either. If more people fucking cared about our history we would not be going to Kirkby would we!
Paul Niklas
12 Posted 05/02/2008 at 11:29:52
12 Posted 05/02/2008 at 11:29:52
Eddie, I am going to respond to you in a way I would respond to my 14 year old.
Firstly, none of your business.
Secondly and more importantly, what type of supporter are you, commenting on your rivals site or even entering it for that matter.
Whats wrong is it difficult to get a meaningful debate in Norwegian.
We know are history and we know yours, leave it at that.
We are not interested in you or your comments.
Go away and play with your new franchise to which the future will be all important to you, as their wont be one.
Firstly, none of your business.
Secondly and more importantly, what type of supporter are you, commenting on your rivals site or even entering it for that matter.
Whats wrong is it difficult to get a meaningful debate in Norwegian.
We know are history and we know yours, leave it at that.
We are not interested in you or your comments.
Go away and play with your new franchise to which the future will be all important to you, as their wont be one.
jayharris
13 Posted 05/02/2008 at 11:57:03
13 Posted 05/02/2008 at 11:57:03
I really liked "we shall not be moved".It was our theme song for the 80’s and is so easy for everybody to join in.I do beleive it was also an EFC original.
Ronnie Mukherjee
14 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:26:50
14 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:26:50
Eddie,
You really need to get a girlfriend, or at least some friends.
Ronnie Mukherjee
You really need to get a girlfriend, or at least some friends.
Ronnie Mukherjee
patty blue
15 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:40:02
15 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:40:02
And another thing....if it wasn’t for us blues your lot wouldn’t be playing at Anfield. As for your own history .. when are you replacing "You’ll never walk alone" gates with a MacDonald’s sign? Instead of singing a song from an American musical [ Carousel] which you share with Celtic, perhaps you might start singing "There could be trouble ahead!!"
Steve A
16 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:34:22
16 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:34:22
Jay - We shall not be moved was a New Seekers song from the 1960s. We definately sang it at the 1968 cup final and may have sung it at the 1966 final as well.
The song that we used to play at the end of a the game prior to Grand Old Team was Forever Everton.
Z Cars just the best though. If I ever feel down I ring the box office because I know I will be on hold for ages and they will play me the first few bars of Z Cars.
Love Grand Old Team, especially when we win - best I can remember was after the 3-0 win over the RS last season.
The song that we used to play at the end of a the game prior to Grand Old Team was Forever Everton.
Z Cars just the best though. If I ever feel down I ring the box office because I know I will be on hold for ages and they will play me the first few bars of Z Cars.
Love Grand Old Team, especially when we win - best I can remember was after the 3-0 win over the RS last season.
Michael Brien
17 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:13:13
17 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:13:13
Eddie - your limited vocabulary as well as your limited knowledge of the history of this great game speaks volumes for the quality of supporters that they get these days at Anfield.
As an Evertonian since the age of 7 ( in 1964) I have gone through some bad times also some glorious times .Your maths is not so good either - by my reckoning 1970 was 38 years ago and we were Champions that year.
One of my proudest moments as an Evertonian, was in August 1974 - for the opening day of the 1974-75 season.The Blues where at home to Derby County whilst Liverpool were away at Luton Town. The recently retired Liverpool manager - Bill Shankly was at Goodison that day.When he took his seat in the Goodison Road Stand before the kick off, the whole of Goodison applauded him. I don’t think you would get such sporting behaviour today. By the way Eddie, Bill Shankly was Liverpool Manager from December 1959 until July 1974.As you are so ignorant I doubt whether you know your own club’s history!!
I am not surprised that Liverpool fans don’t like discussing history, well let’s face it you seem to all go quiet at any mention of the 1985 European Cup Final don’t you - I wonder why that is?
As for songs well I remember as a kid "We shall Not Be Moved" by the Seekers being played before some games at Goodison- mainly from 1966 - 1969 when we had some very good years in the F.A. Cup.
Personally speaking I think it is vital that supporters not just of Everton , but of all clubs have a sense of the history of their club. I remember my late father telling me stories about Dixie Dean, when I was about 8. I didn’t realise at first - but as my Dad went to his first game in 1949- he had never actually seen the great man in person.
I was too young to see Dave Hickson play and his great exploits during the 1953 F.A. Cup run- but I have read about them,seen the film and indeed heard the stories by word of mouth and they are part of my heritage as an Evertonian. We should be proud of our history and sing our songs to reflect it.Let’s be proud of our history but not bound by it.The current squad are capable of making the next few seasons proud chapters in our history.
As an Evertonian since the age of 7 ( in 1964) I have gone through some bad times also some glorious times .Your maths is not so good either - by my reckoning 1970 was 38 years ago and we were Champions that year.
One of my proudest moments as an Evertonian, was in August 1974 - for the opening day of the 1974-75 season.The Blues where at home to Derby County whilst Liverpool were away at Luton Town. The recently retired Liverpool manager - Bill Shankly was at Goodison that day.When he took his seat in the Goodison Road Stand before the kick off, the whole of Goodison applauded him. I don’t think you would get such sporting behaviour today. By the way Eddie, Bill Shankly was Liverpool Manager from December 1959 until July 1974.As you are so ignorant I doubt whether you know your own club’s history!!
I am not surprised that Liverpool fans don’t like discussing history, well let’s face it you seem to all go quiet at any mention of the 1985 European Cup Final don’t you - I wonder why that is?
As for songs well I remember as a kid "We shall Not Be Moved" by the Seekers being played before some games at Goodison- mainly from 1966 - 1969 when we had some very good years in the F.A. Cup.
Personally speaking I think it is vital that supporters not just of Everton , but of all clubs have a sense of the history of their club. I remember my late father telling me stories about Dixie Dean, when I was about 8. I didn’t realise at first - but as my Dad went to his first game in 1949- he had never actually seen the great man in person.
I was too young to see Dave Hickson play and his great exploits during the 1953 F.A. Cup run- but I have read about them,seen the film and indeed heard the stories by word of mouth and they are part of my heritage as an Evertonian. We should be proud of our history and sing our songs to reflect it.Let’s be proud of our history but not bound by it.The current squad are capable of making the next few seasons proud chapters in our history.
Liam Reilly
18 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:56:58
18 Posted 05/02/2008 at 12:56:58
Well said Michael. Additionally, Shankly also said that in his later years he was more fondly received at Goodison than he was an Anfield.
Just goes to show you what kind of supporters they really are.
Just goes to show you what kind of supporters they really are.
jayharris
19 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:04:26
19 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:04:26
Steve A,thanks for reminding me.Those great times will come again.
Neil Styles
20 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:17:05
20 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:17:05
Paul I can see where youre coming from, I dont necessarily agree we need a new song but on that subject every time I hear the Lou Reed song ’Perfect Day’ I always think of our boys. To me, that song more accurately illustrates my feelings for EFC than Grand Ol’ Team. Besides, Spurs, Hibs and Celtic all sing GOT so maybe a new song with a more emotional air isnt such a bad idea.
Steve A
21 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:11:11
21 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:11:11
Michael - Thanks for reminding me about Shankly. I was at that game as well with my dad and my grandad (who did actually see Dixie play).
I had a season ticket in the Paddock but my dad and grandad had season tickets in the main stand. My Dad said Shankly looked like Norman Wisdom in his cap and too small jacket and I believe he wore a red and white scarf under the jacket. I was also told that he shed a tear at the reception he received from Goodison that day.
Would Catterick have received the same respect over the way?
I think not!
I had a season ticket in the Paddock but my dad and grandad had season tickets in the main stand. My Dad said Shankly looked like Norman Wisdom in his cap and too small jacket and I believe he wore a red and white scarf under the jacket. I was also told that he shed a tear at the reception he received from Goodison that day.
Would Catterick have received the same respect over the way?
I think not!
Tony Waverleas
22 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:06:03
22 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:06:03
Oh Edward, Edward.
Shouldn’t you be busying yourself translating YNWA into Arabic or parading round the streets in your robes holding up portraits of El Badly Bearded One or perhaps pledging your allegiance to the stars and stripes? So many choices, Edward so many, many choices. And yet you feel your time’s best spent on here making an utter plum of yourself.
Do go away, child.
Shouldn’t you be busying yourself translating YNWA into Arabic or parading round the streets in your robes holding up portraits of El Badly Bearded One or perhaps pledging your allegiance to the stars and stripes? So many choices, Edward so many, many choices. And yet you feel your time’s best spent on here making an utter plum of yourself.
Do go away, child.
Craig Walker
23 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:36:22
23 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:36:22
Can someone tell me when we first started playing ’If you know your history’? It sounds like a really old song but I only remember it since the Walter Smith era. I don’t remember hearing it when my dad used to take me as a kid. Any info would be appreciated.
Jimmy Royston
24 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:30:04
24 Posted 05/02/2008 at 13:30:04
Hi Micheal.. Good post.I started a couple of years before your dad (1947) so I do remember the realy good times and I actually met Bill (Dixie) Dean indeed spent ashort holiday with him and his daughter Barbara with some old B/W photos to prove it. The best way to treat ignorant Kopites is just Ignore them. Keep singing "History2 " ! well I like it and Billy Maher needs the royaltys from any record sales.... Z cars has to be No1 but we also used Singing the Blues amongst others for quite a while. The suggestion to get Blue Bill write or rewrite something thats rousing, comfortable & easy to sing loudly is not such a bad idea.. One to make our own. Any sensible suggestions....
Michael Brien
25 Posted 05/02/2008 at 14:43:08
25 Posted 05/02/2008 at 14:43:08
Why not revive "We shall not be moved" - I fancy a nice run in the U.E.F.A Cup - If we won it and then in the near future won the Champions League - we would have a complete set of European trophies !!! I am proud of Everton’s history but I think this side is capable of writing the opening pages in an exciting chapter of Everton History.
Trevor Thompson
26 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:01:16
26 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:01:16
I like the song and see no problem with it. Paul, you say it means nothing any more; nor does the song ’we’re by far the greatest team the world as ever seen!’ Which every bloody club in the UK sing. Does that mean that every club in the UK are the greatest team in the world? No, but it means something to the supporters. Who cares what other fans think. It means something to us so sing it loud and sing it proud
Ed Fitzgerald
27 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:04:05
27 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:04:05
Jimmy
I was being ironic with the song idea, but perhaps there is someone out there who could pen us a song as cheesey as it sounds. Perhaps that lazy get Lee Mavers from the LAs can be bothered to write something for us he is meant to be a Blue. After all the dirge the Kopites sing had its origins from from the Musical Carousel !
I was being ironic with the song idea, but perhaps there is someone out there who could pen us a song as cheesey as it sounds. Perhaps that lazy get Lee Mavers from the LAs can be bothered to write something for us he is meant to be a Blue. After all the dirge the Kopites sing had its origins from from the Musical Carousel !
Paul Niklas
28 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:12:35
28 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:12:35
Trevor, now you have come to mention it.
I agree thats a crap song as well.
Lets get rid of every song any other club might sing and be unique on that front.
Banks of the Royal blue mersey is the one and only at the moment.
Z cars is Everton through and through.
I will sing anything loud and proud and I do, but lets have something different.
I agree thats a crap song as well.
Lets get rid of every song any other club might sing and be unique on that front.
Banks of the Royal blue mersey is the one and only at the moment.
Z cars is Everton through and through.
I will sing anything loud and proud and I do, but lets have something different.
Jimmy Royston
29 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:15:07
29 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:15:07
Hi Ed ..Thanks for the polite reply..Did realize it was tounge in cheek especially the the Westvale/tower hill? bit.. But the basic idea of something we can realy give the Biffta’s to is pretty good. I aint got much time left to watch now ( getting a bit wobbly) but I do think this side is showing some promise lets try to make it memorable for the kid’s to come.... Hope so pretty dam’n quick..
Ed Fitzgerald
30 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:54:28
30 Posted 05/02/2008 at 15:54:28
Jimmy
You never know with some of the people who post on here!! You are quite right to point out that the promise this side is showing. Something unique would be really good.
You never know with some of the people who post on here!! You are quite right to point out that the promise this side is showing. Something unique would be really good.
Lyndon Lloyd
Editorial Team
31 Posted 05/02/2008 at 05:18:00
Editorial Team
31 Posted 05/02/2008 at 05:18:00
Paul: "I do celebrate it and cherish it but nobody really outside of our selves will ever do so."
But we don’t sing it for anybody else but ourselves and who cares what it sounds like on TV? I mean, how utterly shite does "One Man Goes to Mow..." sounds anywhere let alone TV?
We sing it for ourselves. It’s a nod to our history and traditions — which guide our aspirations for the future — has a good jibe at the RS along the way, and there’s nothing like being in a crowd of Blues singing that song in full voice.
Come up with new classics by all means, but it doesn’t mean we should drop our signature chant, surely?
Richard Harris
32 Posted 05/02/2008 at 16:22:11
32 Posted 05/02/2008 at 16:22:11
Steve A wrote "We shall not be moved was a New Seekers song from the 1960s. We definately sang it at the 1968 cup final and may have sung it at the 1966 final as well" .
We shall not be moved goes further back into American Labor Union history and was sung on picket lines as far back as I can recall. The original version was I shall not be moved until the 1930s when it was changed from a gospel song to a protest song.
We shall not be moved goes further back into American Labor Union history and was sung on picket lines as far back as I can recall. The original version was I shall not be moved until the 1930s when it was changed from a gospel song to a protest song.
Peter Laing
33 Posted 05/02/2008 at 17:01:28
33 Posted 05/02/2008 at 17:01:28
If ye know your history then you should know that ’grand old team’ became an Everton anthem during the mid 80’s, I fondly recall reciting the verse standing on the old Gladwys Street end as a kid during the Kendal mark 1 era. The song has become a classic, just because Watford also run out to Z cars shall we drop that as well in the interests of being kitsch ?
Michael Brien
34 Posted 05/02/2008 at 17:23:22
34 Posted 05/02/2008 at 17:23:22
Richard - "We Shall Not Be Moved" - was a hit for The Seekers in the 1960’s and NOT the New Seekers. Judith Durham was one of my first favourite female singers - and she is nicer looking than those girls in the New Seekers!!!
Michael Brien
35 Posted 05/02/2008 at 17:38:48
35 Posted 05/02/2008 at 17:38:48
Apologies for the 1960’s nostalgia trip and aplogies if anyone has mentioned this previously - does anyone recall a chant from the late 1960’s based on the Manfred Mann hit single "The Mighty Quinn" ?
The chanting went " Come on without,Come On within......You’ll not see nothing like the mighty EV - ER - TON.
On the subject of Z Cars - if we ever stopped playing that I am sure there would be protests from Evertonians of all ages !!
The chanting went " Come on without,Come On within......You’ll not see nothing like the mighty EV - ER - TON.
On the subject of Z Cars - if we ever stopped playing that I am sure there would be protests from Evertonians of all ages !!
Paul Niklas
36 Posted 05/02/2008 at 17:43:22
36 Posted 05/02/2008 at 17:43:22
Lyndon, I do agree with the sentiment and you should always acknowledge the past.
However when do you stop, when does it become a bit embarrassing to us.
We have been great, but not for 20 years.
all I ask is that we look forward also and come up with something different, or stick to Z cars and Banks of the Mersey which would put the hairs up on the neck of any supporter.
Actually "If you know your history" does not do that.
Why, because its not really our song
Been a good debate though.
By the way we dont need a song or anything else for that matter aimed at the RS they are making a good go of screwing them selves.
Great job you guys with this site, albeit the miisus is not happy, talk to this site more than her now.
However when do you stop, when does it become a bit embarrassing to us.
We have been great, but not for 20 years.
all I ask is that we look forward also and come up with something different, or stick to Z cars and Banks of the Mersey which would put the hairs up on the neck of any supporter.
Actually "If you know your history" does not do that.
Why, because its not really our song
Been a good debate though.
By the way we dont need a song or anything else for that matter aimed at the RS they are making a good go of screwing them selves.
Great job you guys with this site, albeit the miisus is not happy, talk to this site more than her now.
Paul Niklas
37 Posted 05/02/2008 at 18:13:23
37 Posted 05/02/2008 at 18:13:23
Back again Lyndon.
Interesting your point about sky and falling into their hands.
Would not want to do that.
However they re wrote history for everyone else except Utd and Liverpool
As much as it was a terrible thing to happen,they have not shut up about Munich 1958 this week.
When it suits ey
Interesting your point about sky and falling into their hands.
Would not want to do that.
However they re wrote history for everyone else except Utd and Liverpool
As much as it was a terrible thing to happen,they have not shut up about Munich 1958 this week.
When it suits ey
© ToffeeWeb
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By taking this defeatist attitude, you play right into the hands of Sky's re-writing of history but you can't erase 104 years just because the meejah and the money men want to sell you an alternate reality.
Our history is unique. Embrace it. Cherish it. Celebrate it.