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There's Nobody Better

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Now, I'm not trying to be deliberately controversial here, although some people may see it that way.

I've been reading all the debate about Tim Cahill's best position and form etc and I've decided to get something off my chest.

Now I'm not being a doom monger, but does anyone else think Mikel Arteta is over rated? At least by us lot, the fans.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a massive fan of Mikel (and of Cahill) but I honestly think he's over rated. When hes on top of his game, playing against the likes of Wigan at home I agree he can be unplayable, but lets be honest, he's not that consistent is he? As for his corners...

As has been mentioned before, he does not do it against sterner opposition, why is this?

As I said before, I'm not one of those fans who sees fault in everything, and Im made up with the way the season has gone, I just wonder if Im alone in thinking this. Probably.

Right, my shields up. I await your responses...
Franny Porter, Somwhere in the Middle East!     Posted 06/02/2008 at 11:19:41

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Tim Lowe
1   Posted 06/02/2008 at 16:30:04

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You’re a brave man Franny

Admittedly dont think he’s been as consistent this season but the guy is class on his day.

You wait until he has a blinder in the derby and scores the winner from 25 yards. You wont be saying he’s overrated then
Dan Mckie
2   Posted 06/02/2008 at 16:34:38

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Quit yo jibber jabber FOOL!
Per Stumo
3   Posted 06/02/2008 at 16:35:19

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Brave indeed :-)

I wouldn’t say he’s overrated though, but he does seem to be in a bit of a slump these days. A bit tired maybe? Hard to say, but he’s still a clear cut first choice in midfield in my book...
Dan Walker
4   Posted 06/02/2008 at 16:32:01

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As the manager of any team, you’d be looking to nullify the opposition’s main threats. For the top teams, with their greater tactical nous and higher calibre of players it will be easier for them to concentrate on our main players like Arteta and mark them out of the game.

But when we play the some of the lesser teams, they see more of our players as a threat, so they would be foolish to just concentrate on Arteta. Hence, Mikky gets more time on the ball to weave his magic.
Alan Clarke
5   Posted 06/02/2008 at 18:15:11

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Living in Manchester, I hear a lot of Man U fans saying the same about Ronaldo - that he doesn’t perform in the big games.

I still think the burden is too great on Arteta when Pienaar isn’t playing.
Mick Dempsey
6   Posted 06/02/2008 at 18:33:22

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Spot on Dan, for me Arteta is the most exciting player we have had for years, Rooney was a one off, but Arteta is class and with more players of his quality in the team, he will get better. If I was a manager playing Everton I would tell my players to get very tight on him and with the top sides they have top players to this job and thats why we need more quality. On his day Arteta is a joy to watch, the tricks, passes and ability to beat a man with sheer skill, show me another player in the premiere league who can produce this week in and week out besides Ronaldo.
Mick Dempsey
7   Posted 06/02/2008 at 18:33:22

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Spot on Dan, for me Arteta is the most exciting player we have had for years, Rooney was a one off, but Arteta is class and with more players of his quality in the team, he will get better. If I was a manager playing Everton I would tell my players to get very tight on him and with the top sides they have top players to this job and thats why we need more quality. On his day Arteta is a joy to watch, the tricks, passes and ability to beat a man with sheer skill, show me another player in the premiere league who can produce this week in and week out besides Ronaldo.
Sean Loftus
8   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:07:53

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What are you on about Franny!

Mikel is far better than anybody we have going forward, and we rely on him far too heavily. I think to say is he over rated is ludacrus as he has by far the best player i have seen at EFC (i am 16 years old).

Yes perhaps he has not been the same this season as he was last, but he is still the only player who can change a game in an instance. He ha been out player of the year both of the two full seasons hes played for us. I am very dissapointed that people would even question the ability of him!
AndyMacFarlane
9   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:00:08

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As an admitted "Owl Arse" I just think back to when the ’66 team was being reconstructed under Harry Catterick. We looked at Colin Harvey - fantastic prospect, but what is his best position? Alan Ball - great energy- World Cup Winner - but is he a striker or a midfield player? Howard Kendall - in his first few games he was crap. Possibly NONE of them would have reached the magical heights had we had them alone in our team. But....individually they were brilliant "on their day" and when they settled into the team together,they were unstoppable, even if one of them dipped below form for a few games. Now, I’m not yet comparing Arteta with any of the Holy Trinity, (no way!) but he has the potential to contribute to be a part of a team that is even greater than the sum of its parts. Piennar / Fernandes / Arteta / Cahill, anyone?
Mick Mc
10   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:24:15

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andy so your a Owl Sheff Wed or an old arse
AndyMacFarlane
11   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:26:23

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Old Arse - born 1950!
jason cooke
12   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:27:50

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Fran. Let me hear what you say about Arteta when he is injured like before and we struggle. He is magic so do the people of liverpool city say or he would not have picked up that award the other day.......
Micky Norman
13   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:27:33

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Mikky is the best blue since Alan Ball. That’s why he get’s the sh.. kicked out of him most weeks. The most fouled player in the PL. Involved in nearly every Everton goal, even with crap corners- how many goals has Lescott scored from these crap corners? And even Bally didn’t take too many dead balls on. If he left tomorrow it would take 20 million to replace him.
Micky Norman
14   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:36:03

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Oh yes, and he’s human like the rest of us.
Steve A
15   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:28:53

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Bit like the kings new clothes this isn’t it and Franny bless him is the kid who shouts ’the king is in the altogether’.

I agree definately not a patch on last season and I also agree that his ability to beat the first man from the corner flag is not up to standard.

BUT we don’t make enough of the space he creates because he is so heavily marked. Really looking forward to having Peanut back because in him I think we may have seen the ideal foil for the best little Spaniard.
Keith Glazzard
16   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:06:29

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It’s not a bad idea to be made to think again about things you believe - and I believe that Arteta is a great. Even Ball, Kendall and Harvey didn’t individually have an outstanding game every game. How could they? And Mikel can’t either. But the future must be to have other players in the team who are as good as him - better, even. That would be real progress.
Mike Allison
17   Posted 06/02/2008 at 19:45:19

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Well no-one can do it all game, every game on his own. I think some people have come to expect too much from Arteta, and this is compounded by him being targeted by the opposition as our only/main threat. The reason we’ve done so well this season is that Pienaar has provided an alternative. With Fernandes here and Osman showing form then it will no longer be a case of stop Arteta, stop Everton, which is the way a lot of teams have been looking at it this season. This is especially true of the ’top’ teams, whose defenders are actually good enough to stop him at times.
Stephen Davies
18   Posted 06/02/2008 at 20:27:04

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Everton play there corners to the near post. The look for a flick from there because they hav a few instictive scorers in the box. Weve seen Lescott, Cahill and the Yak prodding chances i the 6 yardbox. If Moyes tell Mikel to aim near post obviously he will the first man more often than if he was hitting it deep.
paul whitehouse
19   Posted 06/02/2008 at 20:29:55

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and about time for this debate...

No goals, lackluster and rarely beats the first man with
corners or free kicks. I know its the unthinkable but i still believe we should sell him if we get 15 mill- ish.

We can make excuses that he’s heavily marked but for me he reminds me of a inferior ronaldo but without the goals, pace and delivery!

i dont know Echo award or fooball player of the year award.. what should an everton star player be winning?
cliff zampost
20   Posted 06/02/2008 at 21:14:45

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It must be - pick on everton players this week - starting with cahill and now arteta. who’s next?
Lewis abbott
21   Posted 06/02/2008 at 21:08:24

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I think you have a point when you say that he hasent been consitent this season and his corners have been poor although jolean still seems to make a good effort of them.

As for playing the big teams he does seem to go missing, and i do agree that the big temas do try to mark him out the game and it mostly works.

I however see that arteta’s problem is that he has not been clinical enough for us recently. He had a lot of the ball against chalsea in the home leg(although it was always going to be a massive game to win) but i didnt really see him make one clear cut chance and simply ran into corners or passed which is unusual for him. To me he has been very frustrating recently.

But i do think now that we have another quality dead ball specialist in manny fernandes, (and dare i say carsley seems to want to take alot) and a good left footer in baines(who i think should definetly take the corners from the respective side and try some free kicks) and we also have pienarr who seems is going to be another skillful winger, that maybe the pressure can be realeased a bit on arteta and he should be free’d of some of his jobs that he takes for granted. He should take them when he has a good feeling about, not because he is the only one that can.

He is still a great everton player though, fact.
Joe McParland
22   Posted 06/02/2008 at 21:12:13

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The best little Spaniard we know has one fault.
He doesn’t shoot enough.
paul whitehouse
23   Posted 06/02/2008 at 21:41:30

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or score, create or dominate against a big team, apart from that he?s world class!
Harj
24   Posted 06/02/2008 at 22:02:30

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Arteta is pure class....you have to remember many teams put 2 men on him and its difficult to perform every game...but he always gives 100%

Best Spaniard on Merseyside.....yes better then Alonso and at the moment better then Torres....although Torres is good.
Steve Ryan
25   Posted 06/02/2008 at 22:19:50

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GREAT players perform to a very high standard, consistently, home and AWAY against the lesser and TOP clubs. Ball, Harvey, Kendall, Reid, Bracewell , Sheedy and Steven were great midfield players. Arteta, in my humble opinion, is not a great player as he is inconsistent, especially away from home and rarely performs against the top clubs. Furthermore, his final delivery often doesn’t match his build up play. He has marvellous skill and technique but will never be a great player which is why he was released from his previous clubs quite cheaply and is not a Spanish International.
In order to win trophies, our players need to perform to a consistently high level against all opposition. People criticise Cahill’s technique but you can guarantee that he wont be anonymous during the forthcoming Anfield derby.
Kieran Kinsella
26   Posted 06/02/2008 at 23:14:17

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I have seen Mascherano play a few times this season including against Waterlooville and I have to say that Arteta is better than him and he is costing the RS $17million.
I think Arteta suffers with Pienaar being out because as our one creative player he is an obvious target for man markers. I do think it was ridiculous when some papers suggested he was "better than Ronaldo" earlier this year but I think he and Pienaar are better than say Mark Ward and Peter Beagrie who were part of our side in the late 80’s before we turned crap.

Arteta works harder than Limpar and isn’t a one trick pony like Kanchelskis so consequently is likely to last longer than either of them at the top level. I do think his performances haven’t been that great of late but how often down the years has Giggs had dips in form only to bounce back ? The more good players we have the easier it is for them all to prosper and I think Mikel, Manny and Tim will be all the better for having Yak and Pienaar back from the ANC as there is safety in numbers when it comes to man marking.
Tony Williams
27   Posted 06/02/2008 at 23:16:53

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I see the comedian Paul Whitehouse is still as funny as ever.

Back to the initial post though, I think Franny realitically knows that he is being a bit over critical or else he would not have added the comment about needing a shield.
Michael Tracey
28   Posted 06/02/2008 at 23:16:05

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I was wondering when this was going to get mentioned! Over the last few days there has been endless crap about Cahill and how he is suddenly the new Tony Hibbert of the team. Arteta I feel in my very humble opinion has been very ordinary thi s season and apart from this post no one has even questioned his game. Cahill has not scored in a couple and then people start bagging the piss out of him. Cahill is the new scapegoat and one reason is because he choses to play for his National Team and that has ruffled some feathers. Players invariably go through bad patches sometimes and because Cahill is so prolific for a midfielder when he goes a couple without scoring he all of the sudden wshed up or not comitted to the team like he should be.
John Mickelson
29   Posted 06/02/2008 at 23:41:00

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Michael Tracey, well said, by far the most sensible and rational post on this ridiculous thread. It is literally unbeleivable - I am convinced some of these threads are started by reds.
Guy Wilkinson
30   Posted 07/02/2008 at 00:18:02

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Arteta is good, but not a great player. He needs to work on his pace and as has been mentioned - dead ball delivery which is woeful.
Without pienaar it is easy for oppo to nullify him by double marking.

Having said that i am totally pissed off by the crap spouted recently about him and cahill. even good players have poor spells, and sometimes the only way to traverse a dip in form is to start games. We would miss either of these players big style - my concern is that cahill is a natural replacement for scholes @MU.


We have a thin squad - AFCON has proven this. The loss of any of our better players would cripple us.
Franny Porter
31   Posted 07/02/2008 at 05:38:26

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Hmmm,

A few very angry repsonses their, if you read the original post, you will see I am a fan of Mikky, however, I merely think we rate him too highly, Im not suggesting hes shit or that we should sell him.

John Mickleson, get a grip.

Tune in next week for my newest thread - "Dixie Dean - not a team player - dicuss"

Thankyou, Im hear all week,,,,
John Lloyd
32   Posted 07/02/2008 at 10:47:50

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ha ha, like that dixie column!! ha ha

Just in response, I disagree about Mikel. In my opinion he’s the most talented player we’ve had a Goodison in twenty years. I do think he’s suffering from the attention he’s getting now but the arrival of Manny, along with the return of Pienaar will help with that I think.

How about next column - Unsworth - overweight or tight shorts....you decide!!
Dave Lawley
33   Posted 07/02/2008 at 11:52:22

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On his day he is as good as they come, the end of last season he was playing super football, I think because manny was in the team and up to speed, there is no one else he can work with like that other than maybe peinaar but he is on the other wing so they don’t link up very much. I hate to say it if he had better players around him he would be alot more consistent, the man marking is a very valid point too. I think he is superb if we can add better players around him for the better teams to worry about we will see him excel still further, and the signs are (with manny) this will happen.

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