The Mail Bag
Moyes states squad is big enough?
Comments (30)
Whilst I see where Moyes is coming from, I feel more depth still in the squad is needed. I understand Moyes is right in saying that replacing the deadwood will help massively though. In particular, how much better off would we be if we had functioning quality players in place of perennially unavailable Andy van der Meyde and Tommy Gravesen? Also a replacement for McFadden would be pretty handy just now!
Still, if we are serious about progressing in both domestic cups plus Europe (in addition to the 38 league games) then further reinforcements rather than just replacements are needed likely a necessity if we are to compete with the top 3.
Come on BK, back Moyes big time this summer. It is all very well saying we've broken the transfer record in successive summers but that is to be expected given the explosion in TV revenue.
Michael Hunt, Posted 04/04/2008 at 17:41:19
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Dave Reiner
2 Posted 04/04/2008 at 20:26:33
2 Posted 04/04/2008 at 20:26:33
That comment was a bit of a head-scratcher for me as well. It seems obvious that Moyes likes to find an 11 that functions well, let them find their ’groove’, & keep putting them out there game after game. Basically this is the anithesis of the Fat Spanish Waiter who prefers to endlessly rotate his players game-to-game. It would appear that Moyes’ stance allows the squad to gel, which leads to consistency when the 1st squad is fit (start/middle of the season, usually) but leads to problems when injuries/suspensions/int’l fixtures mount. Aston Villa, with their even smaller squad, is suffering worse than we are right now. Beneathus’ rotation policy, on the other hand, leads to early problems largely stemming from miscommunication but in the end leads to a much larger group of pickable players who can be mixed & matched to trump the opposition’s strengths & weaknesses while keeping players rested & therefore a better finishing kick, especially in cups where matchups become more highlighted. I’m a supporter of Moyes but would like to see him adapt a more flexible approach to squad selection (in midfield, particularly), without reverting to the extremes of the fat man across the park (not that we could afford such a luxury). If we are to mount successful campaigns on multiple fronts in future seasons, we will have to be able to withstand the attrition that comes with such ambition.
Peter Bourke
3 Posted 04/04/2008 at 21:48:57
3 Posted 04/04/2008 at 21:48:57
I can see his point and i think he?s right.
If you took out the 3 or 4 deadwood so to speak and had 3 or 4 quality players to fill in we would at the moment still have a big enough squad. With the progression of the younge guys like Rodwell etc, he may only have to find 2 or 3 able replacements.
If you took out the 3 or 4 deadwood so to speak and had 3 or 4 quality players to fill in we would at the moment still have a big enough squad. With the progression of the younge guys like Rodwell etc, he may only have to find 2 or 3 able replacements.
Mark Pendleton
4 Posted 04/04/2008 at 22:18:44
4 Posted 04/04/2008 at 22:18:44
I’m with Peter on this one.
Derek Thomas
5 Posted 04/04/2008 at 23:11:42
5 Posted 04/04/2008 at 23:11:42
If Moyes is going to go minimalist and the cash situation would make this more likely than not. Then the very least he can do is biff out AVdM and Gravesen.and bring four in.
But I have a feeling that 2 of the 4 will be Peanuts and Manny...It’s like signing two new players! we’ve heard that before.
The game is won and lost in the midfield. 12-15mill should get you a Yakubu class midfielder. That and a couple more try before you buy loaners is a minimum.
OR IS THE MONEY ALL TIED UP IN THE KIRKBYDOME BILL ???
But I have a feeling that 2 of the 4 will be Peanuts and Manny...It’s like signing two new players! we’ve heard that before.
The game is won and lost in the midfield. 12-15mill should get you a Yakubu class midfielder. That and a couple more try before you buy loaners is a minimum.
OR IS THE MONEY ALL TIED UP IN THE KIRKBYDOME BILL ???
John Blestone
6 Posted 04/04/2008 at 23:31:12
6 Posted 04/04/2008 at 23:31:12
We have a small Squad? Not really.
Let's stop sulking and whining about the squad size. Im with Moyes, we need one or two more quality players, not more players. (We got kicked out of cups regardless of how many fit blues we have anyway). I wish for a match winner in some seasons to come. (Example of match winner, someone who can win the game whereby 10 others are shit. Ronaldo-ManU, Drogba-Chelsea, Gerard-Liverpool, Messi-Barca, etc,etc)
Aston Villa 21
Birmingham 24
Boro 25
Derby 26
Newcastle 26
Man City 26
Everton 27
Reading 27
Wigan 28
Portsmouth 28
Liverpool 31
Blackburn 31
Chelsea 31
Man U 31
Spurs 32
West Ham 32
Sunderland 33
Arsenal 33
Fulham 34
Bolton 35
Let's stop sulking and whining about the squad size. Im with Moyes, we need one or two more quality players, not more players. (We got kicked out of cups regardless of how many fit blues we have anyway). I wish for a match winner in some seasons to come. (Example of match winner, someone who can win the game whereby 10 others are shit. Ronaldo-ManU, Drogba-Chelsea, Gerard-Liverpool, Messi-Barca, etc,etc)
Aston Villa 21
Birmingham 24
Boro 25
Derby 26
Newcastle 26
Man City 26
Everton 27
Reading 27
Wigan 28
Portsmouth 28
Liverpool 31
Blackburn 31
Chelsea 31
Man U 31
Spurs 32
West Ham 32
Sunderland 33
Arsenal 33
Fulham 34
Bolton 35
Murray Jones
7 Posted 04/04/2008 at 23:50:59
7 Posted 04/04/2008 at 23:50:59
@ John Blestone
Um, all the sides who are competing in Europe in your list (United, Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs) have 31+ players. We only have 27?
That would suggest we need a squad of 31+
First and foremost, though, we obviously need to replace the dead wood with quality.
Um, all the sides who are competing in Europe in your list (United, Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs) have 31+ players. We only have 27?
That would suggest we need a squad of 31+
First and foremost, though, we obviously need to replace the dead wood with quality.
Ciaran Duff
8 Posted 05/04/2008 at 00:31:08
8 Posted 05/04/2008 at 00:31:08
A couple more quality players to replace Shandy and Mad Dog would satisfy me. Thats assuming that we keep Peanuts and Manny (or a Manny replacement).
Apart from trying to keep a consistent team, building better morale, as well as limited funds, I’ve always wondered whether Moyes uses the small squad as a way of attracting players (ie they have a much better chance of getting a game with us than sitting on the bench for one of the Sky4)? Of course, there is a down side when a few key people are injured but really with our budget its a no brainer - small with quality beats large with average players any day.
Apart from trying to keep a consistent team, building better morale, as well as limited funds, I’ve always wondered whether Moyes uses the small squad as a way of attracting players (ie they have a much better chance of getting a game with us than sitting on the bench for one of the Sky4)? Of course, there is a down side when a few key people are injured but really with our budget its a no brainer - small with quality beats large with average players any day.
Kieran Kinsella
9 Posted 05/04/2008 at 00:42:27
9 Posted 05/04/2008 at 00:42:27
The squad isn?t that big though if you discount AVDM (as Moyes has for 2 years and counting) and players out on loan. The real sqaud is the one he actually uses which is
Howard, Wessels, Turner
Neville, Hibbert, Jags, Lescott, Yobo, Baines, Valente, Rodwell
Fernandes, Gravesen, Pienaar, Arteta, Carsley, Osman, Cahill,
Johnson, Yakubu, Anichebe, Vaughan
Which amounts to 22. 3 of them are keepers and 3 are only on loan to us.
That doesn?t leave us with much.
Howard, Wessels, Turner
Neville, Hibbert, Jags, Lescott, Yobo, Baines, Valente, Rodwell
Fernandes, Gravesen, Pienaar, Arteta, Carsley, Osman, Cahill,
Johnson, Yakubu, Anichebe, Vaughan
Which amounts to 22. 3 of them are keepers and 3 are only on loan to us.
That doesn?t leave us with much.
Mark Pendleton
10 Posted 05/04/2008 at 01:08:50
10 Posted 05/04/2008 at 01:08:50
Well, in terms of outfield players we have 2 left backs (Nuno & Baines), 2 right backs (Pip & Hibbo), 3 central defenders (Yobo, Jagz & Joleon). We have one holding midfielder (Cars), one attacking midfielder (Cahill), 4 regular midfielders (Ossie, Mikel, Pienaar & Manny) and 4 strikers (Yak, AJ, Vaughan & Vic). I am of course ignoring the likes of Mad Dog and AvdM and fringe/young players and assuming Pienaar and Manny to stay. I think in addition to this we need a quality right back (of the Hutton bracket), another central defender as cover (not sure Gardner will stay but i think we need a really promising youngster), a quality midfielder (big, strong and mobile) and perhaps another wide midfielder.
Mark Pendleton
11 Posted 05/04/2008 at 01:17:44
11 Posted 05/04/2008 at 01:17:44
Forgot, i also think we need a long terms replacement for Cars. That’s at least 2 big money signings (8-12m) and a couple of medium cash siginings (4-6m). 30m should do it.
Mark Cassin
12 Posted 05/04/2008 at 07:14:24
12 Posted 05/04/2008 at 07:14:24
@mark penddleton we have Rodwell as 4th choice centre back.
Basically the only 2 areas where we dont have cover are in Carsley and Cahills positions.
Going along these lines you’d expect;
1-Right back--Baines type.
2-Defensive midfielder--Cana/Felliani
3-Support forward-Arshavin?
Those 3 with Fernandes and Pienaar would be fine for me as long as they were all top drawer.
Basically the only 2 areas where we dont have cover are in Carsley and Cahills positions.
Going along these lines you’d expect;
1-Right back--Baines type.
2-Defensive midfielder--Cana/Felliani
3-Support forward-Arshavin?
Those 3 with Fernandes and Pienaar would be fine for me as long as they were all top drawer.
Ajay Gopal
13 Posted 05/04/2008 at 07:06:23
13 Posted 05/04/2008 at 07:06:23
Mark, that?s about right. 3 mid-fielders not counting Pienaar and Fernandes. Any 3 of the names that we have been linked with recently would be fine : Kallstrom, Arshavin, Bradley, Howard, Sidwell, Bullard, etc.
I think Moyes will also go for a replacement for Wessels if there is a proven goalkeeper available at the right price. I believe we need a reliable and proven backup to Howard. Maybe he will sniff around one of the relegated teams.
I think Moyes will also go for a replacement for Wessels if there is a proven goalkeeper available at the right price. I believe we need a reliable and proven backup to Howard. Maybe he will sniff around one of the relegated teams.
Mark Cassin
14 Posted 05/04/2008 at 10:59:28
14 Posted 05/04/2008 at 10:59:28
@Ajay, I’m thinking 2 midfieders plus a right back like Baines who can attack.
Of the names listed and we have heard about I’d say Arshavin on your list is the only one i’d go for. The guy looks quality. All the others listed are quite slow players especially Kallstrom who i think is well overrated.
Love to see Moyes go for Cana from Marseilles as he looks like a Roy Keane on Youtube which is backed up by my french friends telling me that he is an extremely hard tackler and their captain.
The 20 year old from Standard leige looks like a big chap too and for 10mil you would expect him to be good!
So, Arshavin Cana and Felliani would be interesting for me.
Of the names listed and we have heard about I’d say Arshavin on your list is the only one i’d go for. The guy looks quality. All the others listed are quite slow players especially Kallstrom who i think is well overrated.
Love to see Moyes go for Cana from Marseilles as he looks like a Roy Keane on Youtube which is backed up by my french friends telling me that he is an extremely hard tackler and their captain.
The 20 year old from Standard leige looks like a big chap too and for 10mil you would expect him to be good!
So, Arshavin Cana and Felliani would be interesting for me.
Mark Pendleton
15 Posted 05/04/2008 at 11:34:45
15 Posted 05/04/2008 at 11:34:45
Mark Cassin, I?ve not really seen enough of Rodwell. It?s obvious they rate him highly, but we?ve seen plenty of that kind that have then left. Hopefully he is the player we need and it?s one less we need to bring in.
As for midfielders I?ve not seen enough of Arshavin and I?d probably be keener on him signing on loan to see if he can cut it in the Premier League. Problem is though I can?t see him being available on loan and we?d need to get a deal pre-arranged as per Pienaar. Hardly seen anything of Kallstrom so can?t comment but am sure Moyes know?s what he?s doing.
As for midfielders I?ve not seen enough of Arshavin and I?d probably be keener on him signing on loan to see if he can cut it in the Premier League. Problem is though I can?t see him being available on loan and we?d need to get a deal pre-arranged as per Pienaar. Hardly seen anything of Kallstrom so can?t comment but am sure Moyes know?s what he?s doing.
Mike Allison
16 Posted 05/04/2008 at 11:46:38
16 Posted 05/04/2008 at 11:46:38
Sniffing around the relegated teams might be a good tactic this year. Giles Barnes at Derby remains a big talent though we haven’t seen much of him this year, and I think Bullard would be an excellent signing for us. My mate met him for a drink once and said he was an absolute top bloke as well which would mean him fitting in perfectly.
Manny is the long term replacement for Carsley by the way. Whenever he plays he takes over that role and Carsley ends up looking like a spare part. I think Carsley lack of pace and agility make him a problem at the moment, he doesn’t pick up enough of the loose balls, or present enough of a barrier to the opposition. I’d drop him now and play Manny instead, if I had enough players to fill the rest of the team.
Manny is the long term replacement for Carsley by the way. Whenever he plays he takes over that role and Carsley ends up looking like a spare part. I think Carsley lack of pace and agility make him a problem at the moment, he doesn’t pick up enough of the loose balls, or present enough of a barrier to the opposition. I’d drop him now and play Manny instead, if I had enough players to fill the rest of the team.
Mark Cassin
17 Posted 05/04/2008 at 12:41:34
17 Posted 05/04/2008 at 12:41:34
@Mark Pendleton -- For me, Rodwell would be 4th choice centre back. Not much to lose having him at that and it seems as he?s favoured more highly than our pointless loan of Gardner!!!
@Mike Allison -- I like Barnes and he looks like a great prospect although sometimes these relegated teams make good players look great...
As for Fernandes, I agree that when Carsley looks alongside him on the pitch it?s like seeing a new and improved version although he doesn't seem the type to consistently put in nasty tackles as Cana would and as Carsley does.
@Mike Allison -- I like Barnes and he looks like a great prospect although sometimes these relegated teams make good players look great...
As for Fernandes, I agree that when Carsley looks alongside him on the pitch it?s like seeing a new and improved version although he doesn't seem the type to consistently put in nasty tackles as Cana would and as Carsley does.
Helen Pull
18 Posted 05/04/2008 at 14:55:34
18 Posted 05/04/2008 at 14:55:34
Can?t anyone see that this is Moyes letting the fans know there will be few/no new signngs through the summer. Someone has to pay for the new stadium. At the moment no one could say the squad is big or good enough - heard it here first!
Danny Roberts
19 Posted 05/04/2008 at 14:59:53
19 Posted 05/04/2008 at 14:59:53
We need a good right back who gets up an down, 2 tall powerful centre midfielders and Arshavin on the wing with bit of pace. Get rid of Gravesen and Fernandes
Mike Allison
20 Posted 05/04/2008 at 15:51:58
20 Posted 05/04/2008 at 15:51:58
I just can’t understand the ’get rid of Fernandes’ shout. I know a lot of people have been disappointed but if you look he’s hardly been played. He is a defensive midfielder and Moyes has frustratingly played safe by sticking to Carsley all the time. Manny is a class above most of our other players and several above Carsley, he just needs to be used in the right way (ie. not as an attacking option as a substitute). He should start, and be told we expect him to dominate the midfield. Responsibility brings out the best in people where 20 minute cameos don’t.
Mark Cassin
21 Posted 05/04/2008 at 16:37:28
21 Posted 05/04/2008 at 16:37:28
@Mike Allison -- I'd say personally he would be a great buy for £10mil or less.
@Danny Roberts -- Agree 1000%about the 2centre midfielders. BUT surely you mean VDM and not Fernandes who is our most skillful midfielder when fit. Also Arshavin is not a winger...he plays the same role as Cahill.
@Helen Pull -- why is it that every message you write is the most negative thing I've heard over the whole day (in my life not onlyon this website!). Jose Mourinho won the league not too long ago with the same size squad as ours. Don't you think that replacing VDM and Gravesen with 2 players of top quality would have seen us in 4th or even 3rd this year?
@Danny Roberts -- Agree 1000%about the 2centre midfielders. BUT surely you mean VDM and not Fernandes who is our most skillful midfielder when fit. Also Arshavin is not a winger...he plays the same role as Cahill.
@Helen Pull -- why is it that every message you write is the most negative thing I've heard over the whole day (in my life not onlyon this website!). Jose Mourinho won the league not too long ago with the same size squad as ours. Don't you think that replacing VDM and Gravesen with 2 players of top quality would have seen us in 4th or even 3rd this year?
Jimmy Mac
22 Posted 05/04/2008 at 18:31:05
22 Posted 05/04/2008 at 18:31:05
If you look at goalkeepers the guy @Fiorentina looks good think its Faye. The word is that one midfielder is the already lined up: Davies from Portsmoth ? not my choice but remember Moyes tried to get him before. We really do need a class midfield man with some size & beef. Plus a strong character as captain to boss on the pitch...
Alan Clarke
23 Posted 05/04/2008 at 19:02:46
23 Posted 05/04/2008 at 19:02:46
Moyes is still operating on a miserly budget and that is why he won’t want to spend big on a defensive midfielder so I wouldn’t be suprised to see him sign Davies. Moyes needs to spend the majority of his budget on a winger in my opinion. Having seen what Young has done for Villa this season, a pacey attacking winger would give us so many attacking options.
Gavin Ramejkis
24 Posted 05/04/2008 at 19:55:55
24 Posted 05/04/2008 at 19:55:55
Rumours are than Ramos is going to have a clear out at Spurs, if he does then a move for Lennon wouldn?t go a miss for a winger with pace who can also find the box, pity we didn?t get him from Leeds when he was only £1.5M. Central mid I?d prefer a hard man type who can dominate and pass but they are non-existent in Britain so would need to be sourced overseas where midfielders thrive anyway.
Richard Murray
25 Posted 06/04/2008 at 04:23:15
25 Posted 06/04/2008 at 04:23:15
Mark Cassin is hitting the nail, firmly, on the head.
Mark Cassin
26 Posted 06/04/2008 at 09:11:44
26 Posted 06/04/2008 at 09:11:44
@Richard--Cheers.
Lennon -- Why are there rumours that Ramos wants to offload Lennon? The reason is that Spurs fans have the opinion that he has no end product and is a bit McFaddenesque! Saying that though I?ve slways thought he looked good on the tv!
Moyes has moved for Essien/Parker/Sissoko for £6million plus each time. Now I can't see him going in for Davis after the medical said his knee was weak last time. Personally I think that is where he will spend most of his money!
1st on Fernandes then he will move on Lucho again with an improved bid on last summers £12M. He?s 28 though so could be Fellaini or Cana for under £10M as confirmed by Standard and Marseilles last few weeks.
In the Express online Moyes said he had his targets set up and was waiting for budget confirmation from bill.
Last summer Baines/Jags/Yak plus bids of £012 each for Manny and Lucho would have put our spending at £45M. I believe we will have over £35M this summer hence Moyes?s posturing.
Lennon -- Why are there rumours that Ramos wants to offload Lennon? The reason is that Spurs fans have the opinion that he has no end product and is a bit McFaddenesque! Saying that though I?ve slways thought he looked good on the tv!
Moyes has moved for Essien/Parker/Sissoko for £6million plus each time. Now I can't see him going in for Davis after the medical said his knee was weak last time. Personally I think that is where he will spend most of his money!
1st on Fernandes then he will move on Lucho again with an improved bid on last summers £12M. He?s 28 though so could be Fellaini or Cana for under £10M as confirmed by Standard and Marseilles last few weeks.
In the Express online Moyes said he had his targets set up and was waiting for budget confirmation from bill.
Last summer Baines/Jags/Yak plus bids of £012 each for Manny and Lucho would have put our spending at £45M. I believe we will have over £35M this summer hence Moyes?s posturing.
Nick McCay
27 Posted 05/04/2008 at 23:17:32
27 Posted 05/04/2008 at 23:17:32
Just been thinking about next season and with players we are gonna bring in. We seem to be a club who likes to pick players off the lower clubs and bring them to the next level which is something I don't mind. Although I do feel we should purchase big players in the summer, I'd say Davey Boy will have a look at the players coming through from the Championship or players down near the bottom. Looking at the bottom 4, I feel Davey may try and get a few on the cheap to cover some of our departures like Shandy Andy, Mad Dog, and Wessels. I also would be the first to say that Ossie will go this summer....
So who do we bring in which will be effective? who wont cost too much? looking at the relegation fodder, there maybe 1 or 2 worth having a look at.
1. Bullard. Could be a good midfielder to replace ossie, he would also give the team another free kicker and someone who works hard.
2. Danny Murphy - ok providing we get him free he could be a decent stop gap player, he wouldnt be the 1st to have played for both, but i feel the offer would be too good for him and i wreckon at timesl ike now he would be a better asset than Mad Dog
3. Kenny Miller - We need a 5th striker and he does work hard. Had a poor season but he had has no service all season
4. David Healy- We have been linked with him before and i do believe with a decent service he can find the net. You dont be top Euro Championship striker to crap overnight
5. Kevin Nolan - I wreckon he could be a comander for the next time nev drops the armband in a huff.
Now ok, these players won't win us titles but im thinking about a few players who we could get in cheap to replace the lower end players and bolster the squad. I do think we should spend approx £20 million on top line players aswell. 3 new players at the top end I would go for Barry at Villa, Lennon at Spurs, Ashton at the Hammers... Those 8 in for approx £30 mil... along with out players at the moment... Liverpool will be crapping themselves.
Helen Pull
28 Posted 06/04/2008 at 19:07:03
28 Posted 06/04/2008 at 19:07:03
All this talk of cheap new players proves my point - maybe Moyes should go to Sommerfield where they have a 2 for the price of 1 offer at the moment :)
Amar Tamang
29 Posted 07/04/2008 at 01:20:01
29 Posted 07/04/2008 at 01:20:01
Lets get Andre Arshavin from Zenit St Petersburg. I think he will be our great buy of the season, what a player he is, he gives absoulately everything to our team, creativity, attacking option everything. I know his price tag is about £8million but still I believe he is a bargain, what an impact he has made in Uefa Cup against Fiorentina, he should be our player for next season.
Ian Tunny
30 Posted 07/04/2008 at 15:58:28
30 Posted 07/04/2008 at 15:58:28
@ Nick. DANNY MURPHY!!!
Have you seen him play??? He is dreadful and I would rather play Mad Dog. Have you no ambition? This is a player who goes from lower club to lower club every season as he is so bad. I like a couple of the players you have mentioned such as Bullard and Nolan but I think we will be out-bidded as usual by the likes of Sunderland and Portsmouth. The other two I think are just the like McFadden ? good for their countries but not for their clubs. I think Moyes will go after the players he has tracked in the past such as Gonzales and Bradley.
Have you seen him play??? He is dreadful and I would rather play Mad Dog. Have you no ambition? This is a player who goes from lower club to lower club every season as he is so bad. I like a couple of the players you have mentioned such as Bullard and Nolan but I think we will be out-bidded as usual by the likes of Sunderland and Portsmouth. The other two I think are just the like McFadden ? good for their countries but not for their clubs. I think Moyes will go after the players he has tracked in the past such as Gonzales and Bradley.
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1 Posted 04/04/2008 at 20:26:33