ToffeeWeb - Season 2007-08

The Mail Bag

Tactics gone pear-shaped

First of all, why is Leighton Baines getting dropped to the bench to accomidate a centre half being put in his position? Bemused... too right: if Moyes belives in winning matches, he should've started the game with his strongest line-up available eg. Howard Neville, Yobo, Lescott, Baines, Fernandes, Jagielka, Carsley, Pienaar, Yakubu, Johnson.

Moyes seems blind to the fact that Carsley and Neville play terribly together in the center of the park. Also why when we concede a goal we sit back and defend instead of going for a goal? It needs sorting fast or Everton are going to leave the fans with no belief and no desire to support the team they love.
Paul Lynch, Liverpool Posted 18/04/2008 at 19:51:59

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Mark Pendleton
1 Posted 19/04/2008 at 07:09:38

Lescott is superb at left back and Jagz and Yobo have been excellent in the centre. Against big physical sides Moyes has preferred to employ Lescott at left back to Baines to provide the extra height and physical presence for attacking or defending set pieces.

As for Neville and Carsley in midfield that was enforced as the formation pretty much picked itself due to player availability (and don’t mention Gravesen as he’s not capable of much more than a cameo appearance). Moyes has admitted that he sees Neville as a right back, where i think he fares pretty well, not quite as good as Hibbo in the tackle but offers more going forward.

I’m sorry Paul, but they are the facts and i really don’t expect many, if anyone, to agree with your post.

Ste Kenny
2 Posted 19/04/2008 at 08:03:36

I don't think there was much room for manouvre team where selection is concerne. but to be honest the sub?s we made were awful. We finished the game with 3 centre midfielders and a right back in our midfield

Alan Foster
3 Posted 19/04/2008 at 08:46:52

Can?t understand the fans? obsession with Baines. He?s far too small and fragile and I think Moyes has regretted his signing almost from the off. I think he?ll seek to move him on ?ere long as Lescott becomes a fixture at left-back.

Mark Pendleton
4 Posted 19/04/2008 at 09:03:50

I disagree Alan, Baines will be a good signing for us and i think Moyes rates him, however the success of Lescott at left back and Jagz form has given him the option to change things to suit times where the extra height and presence i mention in my above post will come in useful. Kicking sand in the face of those who suggest tactical naievity in my view. It’s called good use of resources.

Robbie Muldoon
5 Posted 19/04/2008 at 10:21:43

Alan Foster, I do not know if Moyes has regretted signing Baines or not... if he has he would be a bigger fool than I think. I don’t know how anybody could prefer to see a big 6ft centre back playing out of position at left back when Baines who is the best left back this club has had for many many years is fully fit and chomping at the bit. Its more Moys dithereing/ shithousery in my eyes.

Luke Dunn
6 Posted 19/04/2008 at 11:16:12

Paul makes a valid point; it is time to make Neville a permanent right back, he cannot play in midfield. There is no creativity with Neville and Carlsey together. A similar issue occured a few seasons ago when Weir was constantly picked despite being well past it ( when we lost 7/8 games at the start of the 2004-05 season). We stopped leaking goals once he was dropped.

I think it has to be Carsley / Manny / or sign a decent playmaker / Arteta.

Mark Cassin
7 Posted 19/04/2008 at 11:24:49

Neville to me is not a decent player...he is certainly not a centre back and doesnt look too clever at right back either.

However similarly to cahill, he does seem to boost the results of the team when he plays. I think the same could be said of baines who is absolutely top notch.

Evra/Clicy/Cole are all dwarves like baines so i dont know why he doesnt play every game other than to accomodate jags/yobo/lescott in defence.

Hopefully we will see some good summer signings to allow our defenders some midfield assistance to allow them to pass to feet!

Neil Pearse
8 Posted 19/04/2008 at 11:51:57

On the Baines issue, what puzzles me is more that Moyes doesn’t play him left mid in our time of crisis, with Neville or Hibbert at RB (pluses and many minuses with each), and Pienaar, Carsley and Fernandes across the middle.

Given also that Carsley is on his last legs (which means he has legs, unlike Gravesen), it really is a mystery that a young, fit and energetic Baines is spending his time on the bench. Especially when he plays the Yak and AJ upfront, who desperately need the service of someone who can actually get wide and cross the ball - like, er, Leighton Baines.

Jay Harris
9 Posted 19/04/2008 at 12:24:07

Neil
you took the words out of my mouth.

I am sure many Evertonians are bewildered that Baines who has come in fresh and looking good in recent games would not have been a better option in MF(instead of Neville) especially in a must win game against a very nervous Chelsea.

Having said that I was also amazed that he preferred to bring Grav on instead of Baines.

Now if Baines was having injury concerns why was he on the bench in the first place.

James Smith
10 Posted 19/04/2008 at 12:34:43

Baines is carrying an injury, he requires an industrial amount of injections before each game.

Simar Singh
11 Posted 19/04/2008 at 13:17:08

The Baines situation baffles me. If Moyes thought he was too small or not strong enough then why did he pay £6 million for him?!
I thought Baines was an excellent footballer at Wigan and was thought highly enough of to be made club captain. He is also highly rated by Stuart Pearce, a man who I would suggest knows a thing or too about the full back position.
If you look back to the start of the season he was dropped for the ?big? games ie the Derby and Kharkiv away. We already have cover in them postions ie Neville and Valente. My point being, why did Moyes spend all that money on him and couldnt it of been better used on a midfielder?!!!

Alan Wilks
12 Posted 19/04/2008 at 14:15:18

James Smith,

Baines is not injured, and doesn't have "industrial" injections before every game ? what a load of shite. Why pay £6 million for him if hes not strong enough?

Joanne Tooher
13 Posted 19/04/2008 at 15:42:24

5-3-2. Simple.

Howard

Baines
Lescott
Jagielka
Yobo
Neville

Fernandes
Carsley
Arteta

Yakubu
Johnson

Darren Gough
14 Posted 19/04/2008 at 16:31:11

Joanne Tooher, I'm sorry but 5-3-2? Our midfield is bypassed easily enough as it is so how on earth do you expect a 3-man midfield to function, let alone get the ball and supply our strikers????? Women eh??..........just kidding, but disagree with you on that one mate...

Michael Crawley
15 Posted 19/04/2008 at 12:21:58

For me Neville and Carsley can't be in the starting lineup next season. Carsley's had his day and now he simply can't start, yes he does break up the play BUT we need someone who breaks it up and then does more. Neville simply can't be captain, his ability is lacking now, yes he was a one time united and england player but now he's living on his previous reputation, the chip ball he does every game simply does my head in.

Furthermore people who call for Hibbert heads, don't realise how good of a defender he is, he is a good squad player and someone who can do a job, but top teams have fullbacks who can cross. Fernandes and Pienaar must BOTH be signed, not silly money for Fernandes, but his energetic performance shows you how good he can be when he's fully fit. We really need 5 players in the summeron top of Pienaar and Fernandes, some may say thats extreme but we need a right back, defensive midfielder, left winger, another top striker, then a world class attacking midfielder.

Brian Waring
16 Posted 19/04/2008 at 10:35:45

I'm not Hibbert's biggest fan, but some of the stick the lad get's is unbelievable. His distribution is poor, I know that. But I thought his job was to defend, which he actually does quite well. He alway's give's 100%, never shirk's a tackle, and you never see him whinging, he just get's on with it.

It seem's funny to me that the people who slate him are the same people who defend AJ. A player who cost £8.5M to score goals, but just runs round like a headless chicken, and has one of the worst first touches in the Premier League. Also, I thought Hibbert had a decent game the other night, but he is still picked out for criticism.

As I said, I'm not one of his biggest fan's, but I think the lad deserves to be cut a bit of slack now and again.

Neil Scott
17 Posted 19/04/2008 at 22:29:44

Personally lads I think the whole Neville/Cars midfield debate is getting very tired. We know it doesn't work. They lose posession too easily and we lose games when they are paired. The stats dont lie.

In which case, the main question now is: What is going to be done?

Scenario one - both are replaced this summer. This would be ideal but if it happens it ain't gonna be an Arshavin guys. At best it will be a Kallstrom plus maybe a Ledley or a Bradley.

Scenario two - both stay this summer. This is far more likely, especially as both have DM backing and have the versatility and work rate that he champions. And if they stay, they play. Simple as that.

Until there is a significant change in the finances (and therefore the ownership) at EFC, then DM will continue to value his changing room ?motivators? no matter how badly they perform once they get on the pitch.

And why? Because he?s no bloody choice.