The Mail Bag
Hypocrisy or common sense
Comments (23)
Now I have a big question for both sides of the Stadium debate. ToffeeWeb are asking if the development of Goodison turned out to be same as moving to Kirkby, What would you choose? I know my answer, it would be to remain at Goodison.
The question from a cost perspective is how much revenue would we lose whilst the stadium is not at full capacity during the rebuild. Sure, this has been costed in by KEIOC. To the question then: Would Everton supporters welcome (during the redevelopment using) Anfield as our stadium for what really would be two seasons?
I think this would be the best solution as doing the development piecemeal is time consuming and I suggest also costlier. The die-hards would have a problem, I don-t think the new franchise owners of the RS would have a problem as they would earn from it.
The question really is would you support that type of move, which in my opinion is worth considering.
Paul Niklas, Posted 22/04/2008 at 17:12:17
Comments
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Matt Kay
2 Posted 23/04/2008 at 07:02:49
2 Posted 23/04/2008 at 07:02:49
I for one would never ever watch my blues in Anfield.
Enough said.
Enough said.
Chris Dottie
3 Posted 23/04/2008 at 08:29:24
3 Posted 23/04/2008 at 08:29:24
I think it’s a great idea Paul. The whole Kirby move is for practical reasons, if we have to be practical and play our home games at Anfield for a season so that our home can stay for the next century where it has been for the last century, that’s surely a small price to pay. If it’s full of us, it’s ours. It was our home first and we watch our blues there once a season. Have a word with Bill, Paul.
Sean Allinson
4 Posted 23/04/2008 at 08:40:21
4 Posted 23/04/2008 at 08:40:21
I have always thought this to be the obvious answer. It was originally our ground anyway, so where?s the problem? The fact that some fly-by-nights have squatted the place for a while shouldn?t put us off. It?s in need of a good clean and I, for one, would offer my services with a brush to repaint the place a proper colour.
Tony Williams
5 Posted 23/04/2008 at 09:00:07
5 Posted 23/04/2008 at 09:00:07
Interesting idea, my one question would be how much would the Shite charge us to do that?
You get nothing for free in this life and no doubt we would have to pay rent or something along the same vein, which in turn lowers our monet intake again.
You get nothing for free in this life and no doubt we would have to pay rent or something along the same vein, which in turn lowers our monet intake again.
David Thompson
6 Posted 23/04/2008 at 09:28:54
6 Posted 23/04/2008 at 09:28:54
You may be interested to know that very recently, I had a conversation with a Director of LFC who actually suggested that!
Paul Niklas
7 Posted 23/04/2008 at 09:35:24
7 Posted 23/04/2008 at 09:35:24
I don't know really what the charge would be, Tony, if it was me and this would test our ability in filling a larger stadium.
They average about 44,000, let them have all the proceeds above our average of 37,000 for the period we are there. That would probably rake them in about £200k a game and about £5 million a season. Not bad for doing nothing. Two seasons £10 million, a free player.
Everton would take the benefit of increased hospitality money and catering.
They average about 44,000, let them have all the proceeds above our average of 37,000 for the period we are there. That would probably rake them in about £200k a game and about £5 million a season. Not bad for doing nothing. Two seasons £10 million, a free player.
Everton would take the benefit of increased hospitality money and catering.
Tony Waring
8 Posted 23/04/2008 at 09:48:37
8 Posted 23/04/2008 at 09:48:37
Yes. It belonged to us originally anyway - always assuming of course that the other lot can aford to build a new ground on green space!
Steve Lyth
9 Posted 23/04/2008 at 10:30:23
9 Posted 23/04/2008 at 10:30:23
Do you know if Bill and Fatty actually had the fans interests at heart with regard to the clubs future revenue stream, thats exactly what they should do Paul,
Gordon Blair
10 Posted 23/04/2008 at 10:34:37
10 Posted 23/04/2008 at 10:34:37
Thing is, the small dips in revenue for the first 10 home games of the season to allow for completion of the Park End would be far less than the cost of hiring our old place for a couple of years.
The idea of a staged or peicemeal renovation of GP is that it can be largely self funding (it may take 10-15 years, but we’ve been chimping on about moving for that amount of time already).
Double up the Park End, moving it back towards the park at the same time. All of a sudden, you’ve got a 46k capacity, better corporate facilities and an enabling development on the corner (say, the 1878 Hotel and Conference Centre, overlooking the birthplace of football in the City - with room on the ground floor for a football museum and the France Collection)
The above could be done in close season and only impact a few home games in the next season. It would cost far less than Kirkby, be far less contentious, and would pay for itself relatively quickly.
The idea of a staged or peicemeal renovation of GP is that it can be largely self funding (it may take 10-15 years, but we’ve been chimping on about moving for that amount of time already).
Double up the Park End, moving it back towards the park at the same time. All of a sudden, you’ve got a 46k capacity, better corporate facilities and an enabling development on the corner (say, the 1878 Hotel and Conference Centre, overlooking the birthplace of football in the City - with room on the ground floor for a football museum and the France Collection)
The above could be done in close season and only impact a few home games in the next season. It would cost far less than Kirkby, be far less contentious, and would pay for itself relatively quickly.
Derek Turnbull
11 Posted 23/04/2008 at 11:05:25
11 Posted 23/04/2008 at 11:05:25
The thing that’s always forgotten about the costings are that if Goodison was redevelped piecemeal when it was first suggested 10 years ago (?) then it would have been completed by now. We would therefore have had say 6 years of revenue in the new stadium.
It seems strange that fans may so no to playing at Anfield again, yet I’ve heard more people support a groundshare? Very odd.
It seems strange that fans may so no to playing at Anfield again, yet I’ve heard more people support a groundshare? Very odd.
Alan Rodgers
12 Posted 23/04/2008 at 11:28:48
12 Posted 23/04/2008 at 11:28:48
There will be any number of twists in the ground move saga before anything happens for EITHER club. I wouldn’t rule out the ground share coming back into view and let’s face it ANYTHING is better than Kirkby.
Mark Stone
13 Posted 23/04/2008 at 11:55:57
13 Posted 23/04/2008 at 11:55:57
I?d happily move Anfield and play there for seasons to come. Out with the red in the blue. Nil Satis Nisi Optimum above the Anfield road gates. We played their first after all!
Sean McNally
14 Posted 23/04/2008 at 12:26:19
14 Posted 23/04/2008 at 12:26:19
I'd rather move to Southport's ground than play at the redshite.... simple as.
Trevor Skempton
15 Posted 23/04/2008 at 13:16:02
15 Posted 23/04/2008 at 13:16:02
This is a red herring.
There is no practical reason why an incremental phased redevelopment of Goodison to seat 60,000 would require capacity to ever drop below 40,000 [and 48,000 in the later stages], starting with construction works BEHIND the existing Park End and Bullens Road stands.
All it needs is a commitment from the club to work in partnership with the City Council and the local community.
There is no practical reason why an incremental phased redevelopment of Goodison to seat 60,000 would require capacity to ever drop below 40,000 [and 48,000 in the later stages], starting with construction works BEHIND the existing Park End and Bullens Road stands.
All it needs is a commitment from the club to work in partnership with the City Council and the local community.
Steve Carter
16 Posted 23/04/2008 at 13:25:18
16 Posted 23/04/2008 at 13:25:18
And, er, the dosh to do it, Trevor.
Steve Lyth
17 Posted 23/04/2008 at 13:35:48
17 Posted 23/04/2008 at 13:35:48
Steve, we need money whatever way you look at it, I go along with Trevors view that redevelopment is the cheaper option.
Paul Niklas
18 Posted 23/04/2008 at 14:40:15
18 Posted 23/04/2008 at 14:40:15
Their is no way Everton could maintain 40,000 during redevelopment, not without building a ground around the existing structure, which requires compulsory purchase of at least everything on Bullens road for a start.
Health and safety alone would not allow 40,000 onto a building site for a start.
The redevelopment / rebuild can be done far easier without all that and with the constraints of the existing land we currently occupy.
Health and safety alone would not allow 40,000 onto a building site for a start.
The redevelopment / rebuild can be done far easier without all that and with the constraints of the existing land we currently occupy.
Steve Lyth
19 Posted 23/04/2008 at 18:44:39
19 Posted 23/04/2008 at 18:44:39
Paul you have obviously not come across Trevor Skempton before, he has submitted documented evidence that such a feat can indeed be achieved.
Given his credentials, you would do well to read previous stuff he has posted on this site before reaching that decision.
Given his credentials, you would do well to read previous stuff he has posted on this site before reaching that decision.
Steven William
20 Posted 23/04/2008 at 19:20:20
20 Posted 23/04/2008 at 19:20:20
We were the first team to win a trophy at Anfield not the shite, but us. I would move there for a year or so while Goodison is re-developed ? providing the colour of the seats were changed, of course.
Paul Niklas
21 Posted 23/04/2008 at 19:30:57
21 Posted 23/04/2008 at 19:30:57
Steve, not disputing his credentials what so ever and Trevor its not a red herring.
From a football perspective also it would be beneficial to keep the atmosphere which you would lose in a stadium under construction.
I would still debate it would be difficult to achieve a piecemeal approach to the development due to my previous points.
The argument is not whether we can achieve it really, my point was Anfield is another option and an equally sensible one in my opinion.
We all want Goodison re developed if we can afford it, I would rather move to Anfield than stay during the work.
From a football perspective also it would be beneficial to keep the atmosphere which you would lose in a stadium under construction.
I would still debate it would be difficult to achieve a piecemeal approach to the development due to my previous points.
The argument is not whether we can achieve it really, my point was Anfield is another option and an equally sensible one in my opinion.
We all want Goodison re developed if we can afford it, I would rather move to Anfield than stay during the work.
robert carney
22 Posted 23/04/2008 at 22:58:05
22 Posted 23/04/2008 at 22:58:05
The most interesting devolopment regarding this debate is the public declaration this week from the Honorable Member who represents Knowsley. He tells us that he will make up his mind in the coming weeks whether or not to support, or give his backing to the public to oppose or call it in for an enquiry. This is total nonsense. To beleive he has not given early endorsement to this devolopopment is total shit. He may be wavering now(he is a politician) but even the member for Walton congratulated Knowsley for foresight. Read what you want into this but I an more than cynical. No corporation can get so far down the track with out consultation. Tesco have also bought out any commercial opposition this week. They have the most effective lobbying group and have never lost an objection to their proposals.
They have also made a public declaration that any attempt to block will be fruitless.
Farewell my Blues.
They have also made a public declaration that any attempt to block will be fruitless.
Farewell my Blues.
robert carney
23 Posted 23/04/2008 at 23:12:07
23 Posted 23/04/2008 at 23:12:07
Paul Niklas, when we played Wimbldon, was not the Parkend demolished? Now I have been in Goodison for many a year and the atmosphere that day (either way) will not be forgotten.
Please, instead of apologising for the in-eptitude of our board for not reading the wealth coming into the game or more frightening keeeping hold of the club for personal glorification mist your eyes.
There is more than no plan B or C on offer. We tied ourselves up to the most proffessional retal outlfit in the history of Britain blindly. Let us reap the rewards of gobshtres and brought(even bought) in CEO for the ruination of a once great club.
Please, instead of apologising for the in-eptitude of our board for not reading the wealth coming into the game or more frightening keeeping hold of the club for personal glorification mist your eyes.
There is more than no plan B or C on offer. We tied ourselves up to the most proffessional retal outlfit in the history of Britain blindly. Let us reap the rewards of gobshtres and brought(even bought) in CEO for the ruination of a once great club.
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1 Posted 23/04/2008 at 06:42:16