ToffeeWeb - Season 2007-08

The Mail Bag

Europe here we come... with a 4-5-1

So our European place is guaranteed now...and whilst it's still only the Intertoto that's a 100% certainty, the Uefa Cup place looks 90% sorted now... thanks to Boro and Wigan!

Whilst I did mention in a previous post that Wigan wouldn't be pushovers for Villa, I have to say I was expecting at best a draw rather than a Villa collapse at home, but at this stage of the season I'm more than happy to take the gift ? just proves that ALL managers and teams can have off days.

Ultimately, with just 1 point now needed from our last 2 games we surely have to feel like we've got a foot in the European door now and whilst I'd love to kick/bore their youngsters off the Emirates park in a hard-fought 0-0, I'd still be happy to need just 1 point from a Barcodes team with nothing to play for (especially if we had a few more fit players for the last one).

Personally I think I'd have happily settled for consolidating a Uefa Cup place with 6th, reaching a semi-final, having a decent Uefa Cup run and improving the squad with 2-3 class players at the start of the season, especially in light of our yo-yoing before.

The fact that we are almost certain to finish a deserved 5th, had a very good push at 4th 'til Fiorentina, and have improved on our points total, goal difference and goals scored (assuming we notch at least 1 in the next 2 games) surely has to count as genuine progress (especially considering the money poured into the likes of Villa, Spurs, Pompey and Man City).

Add in some genuine attempts to play good football and I think the term report has to be a solid B for Moyes and the boys... with a chance to make it a B+.
Chris James, London Posted 03/05/2008 at 16:20:32

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Jason Broome
1 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:03:08

Valencia... funny how I now love that name!

Jason Broome
2 Posted 03/05/2008 at 16:32:27

WIGAN!!!

Kind of funny how one word can raise so much emotion. At the start of the season the name of Valencia hurt like hell.... and now?

Dan Parker
3 Posted 03/05/2008 at 16:57:47

Thank heavens for Wigan!! Never thought I'd say that about the pie-eaters but 1 point and we're there!!

Colin Tunstall
4 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:08:53

I hope Moyesey packs our defence and midfield tomorrow. All the usual defenders plus Baines. Forget good football ? just cling to that point like it?s the last one we are ever going to get. After The Villa result we might even sneak one!

Michael Hunt
5 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:09:43

Old friends Benty and Zinedine put good shifts in as well. Good on them and Wigan. Strange to see Villa fans were leaving a good five mins before the end as well on their last home game. COYB!

John Blestone
6 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:13:48

How about this negative formation for Sunday?s game...for the one point:
5-2-3-1

Howard
Hibbert / Yobo / Jagielka / Lescott / Baines
Carsley / Neville
Osman / Fernandes / Pienaar
Yakubu

Albert Dock
7 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:14:22

Not worth opening a new thread for this but may I refer all doubters to today’s Times?

Daniel Finkelstein shows that, for the second time in three seasons, David Moyes is pound for pound the best manager in the Premiership.

This is arrived at by a comparison of points earned and total wage bill and transfer pay outs.

If anybody is smarter than me and can set up a hyperlink feel free. You will have to go to ’sport,’ ’football’ and then do a search for ’Finkelstein’.

Oh yeah, then tell me how to do it.

John Blestone
8 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:21:20

Oops... that's 12 players!!!

Dan Parker
9 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:21:09

How about 11-0-0 formation

Dan Adams
10 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:18:56

So John KB, you think we should play with 12 players tomorrow?

Martin Wareham
11 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:19:22

Actually our Intertoto place was already guaranteed even before today. That’s because Portsmouth hadn’t applied to participate in the Intertoto so even if they finished ahead of us we would still get the Intertoto spot.

So Villa’s defeat today doesn’t change our qualification for Intertoto. It just means we only need 1 point instead of 4 to be certain of the Uefa Cup place.

Dan Parker
12 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:27:36

For once in a life-time, the redshite may have actually done us a favour by unsettling Gareth Barry and Villa with transfer talk.

Barry Gooders
13 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:19:47

I thought Wigan would get something, they are that type of team and are in form and play good football under Bruce. Tomorrow, Moyes should play considering they?re playing younger ones:

Howard

Neville Yobo Lescott Baines

Rodwell Carsley
Fernandes Osman Pienaar

Yakubu
Bench: Wessels, Jagielka, Gosling, Anichebe, Johnson

MIchael Robinson
14 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:30:03

Now we have the 3pt cushion, why not actually go for it against a team with nothing to play for and improve our apalling record against the ?big4??

Mike Byrne
15 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:38:12

Arsenal - nothing to play for tomorrow?

Correct me if I am wrong but can?t they still finish second and therefore qualify automatically for the latter stages of the CL?

Improbable maybe but not impossible so expect a hard fight from them tomorrow!!!

Tony Horne
16 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:43:16

Albert, mate. Just copy & paste:-

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/fink_tank/

It just works.

Pity we can’t see the graph there though

Albert Dock
17 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:44:52

Yeah, but on the posh forums it comes up blue and you just click on it.

Then again I live in the posh part of Winslow and usually employ a little man to do all this sort of thing for me.

Keith Glazzard
18 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:35:46

I was driving home this afternoon as scores came over the radio and the news was as good as it could be. Boro did us a favour by taking Pompey out of the frame, and Wigan were always going to fight for everything. But, without seeing the game, I wonder how did Villa lose their last (important) home match tthis way? Dan suggests that Barry might have been unsettled - perhaps so.

I’d bet that we were their Fiorentina. They were on a roll, scoring freely, beating lower opposition. If they had swept us aside they would have won today (perhaps). But they didn’t, and although I think we should have beaten them, we were good enough to stop them. They followed up by losing at home to a relegation prospect.

A result at the Arse is possible tomorrow, and that will do. No Arteta, of course, and I do start to wonder if we will see him again.

Riquelme, anyone?

Michael Robinson
19 Posted 03/05/2008 at 17:50:21

Ok, so Arsenal do have something to play for but I would still expect to see Fabianski, Hoyte, Walcott etc.

Dan Parker
20 Posted 03/05/2008 at 18:00:07

My only problem is when they play their fringe players, we always seem to get spanked. Being so hard to get into the Arse side, they’re going to go all out. I’d rather get their normal 11!

Mac Holden
21 Posted 03/05/2008 at 18:01:04

Chelsea win tomorrow and that leaves Arsenal with nothing to play for!

Mike Byrne
22 Posted 03/05/2008 at 18:05:14

Mac - problem is that Chelsea aren’t actually playing until Monday so as it stands tomorrrow Arsenal, unless they have their crystal balls out, still have everything to play for!!!

Said it earlier it is not going to be an easy game - either way!!!

Michael Robinson
23 Posted 03/05/2008 at 18:05:05

Chelsea play on Monday unfortunately... so Arsenal still have something to play for unless they?ve already written off 2nd.

Peter Pickles
24 Posted 03/05/2008 at 18:21:53

Posh part of Winslow, Albert? Is that the Goodison Rd or the County Rd end?

Eddie O'Neill
25 Posted 03/05/2008 at 18:50:50

We just need the 1 point from our last 2 games.... and if we can?t do that then we don?t deserve European football. I mean we had many chances already to put this to bed, but messed up. We really are very lucky to have this last very good chance (with today's results going our way), so let?s just get on with it, and do it. If we don?t then there must be many???

Good luck.

Barry Blackmore
26 Posted 03/05/2008 at 19:58:35

Before you all kick back with a nice beverage and enjoy those silly Brummies cocking it up on MOTD, why not download the mp3 of a song called "Oh Valenica" by American indie rock band ?The Decemberists?

Quality tune and will bring a wry grin to all blues faces.

Matthew Salem
27 Posted 03/05/2008 at 20:07:34

I watched the Wigan match live and don?t think I?ve ever cheered as much for a team apart from ours. I would have given anything for a draw and then they go on to win. To all those of you still moaning and complaining about how shite we?ve been lately, just look at how shite Pompey and now even Villa were today. No team can play well all of the time as we did 'til February, as much as many unrealistically seem to expect. If we hold onto 5th based on Villa fucking up (or Wigan performing with great discipline), so be it. I am not ashamed of that. In fact, I will go to a Wigan blog now and post a thank you for beating Villa. COYB

Gerard Madden
28 Posted 03/05/2008 at 20:39:25

I feel a huuuuge hearty chortle coming on with the news that we?re in Europe next season and most likely by the ?5th place? route. I?m delighted. COYB!!!!!!!!!!!

Barry Foster
29 Posted 03/05/2008 at 21:51:36

Like this Albert?

Times Article - Moyes Best Pound for Pound

Dick Fearon
30 Posted 04/05/2008 at 01:08:20

Yesterday?s results make me even more anxious about 5th spot. As things stand we need only a draw from the Arsenal game. A perfect scenario for Moyes to abandon any ideas he may have had of giving it a damn good show. His innate defensive instincts will come into play and as with Fiorentina 1st leg the whole kit and caboodle could go arse up.

If that happens, things would be really desperate for our final game. On that day, all kick-offs are at the same time so we won?t know in advance what is required. Moyes would expect Villa to beat West Ham draw level with us on points yet with a better goal difference. We will be desperate for at least a draw against an invigorated Newcastle that is playing without pressure. That is the same kind of scenario we faced against Arsenal and probably with the same response from Moyes. A defenders instinct is ingrained in his nature, he can?t help it. Only when the chips are well and truly down is he able to cast off those defensive shackles that prevent him from being a truly great manager.

A piss weak midfield dos not help either. Despite my worrying, an old ingrained super otimistic Evertonian spirit lies just below the surface and ? though my brain says different ? my heart says we will hammer Le Arse.

Derek Thomas
31 Posted 04/05/2008 at 06:12:33

Strange to see an adopted convict / underarm bowler using ( even loosely ) the term brain, but if EFC go out with the phrase ’ Wigan’s already done the job for us ’ in the back of their minds whilst thinking about the up coming summer hols, then we could be on for another pasting ala 7-0.

Will it be another of Davy’s end of season whimper aka bottle the big game fiasco’s.?

Any way Dick, I hope your Cilla impersonation is up to the task and your heart is in the right place

mick wrende
32 Posted 04/05/2008 at 07:34:05

What a load of crap from settle for nothing Evertonians! Portsmouth and Cardiff going to Wembley, Rangers for heavens sake going to the UEFA cup final. Both these competitions were there for the taking but us Evertonians what do we get? Zilch. No glory days out. Nothing to give us a real buzz. Oh I forgot 5th place - brilliant - but on Moyes admission nowhere near the top 4. Great so next season we can cock the UEFA cup up again.

Albert Dock
33 Posted 04/05/2008 at 07:31:25

Following our exploits in Europe this season am I correct in thinking that we will be one of the top seeds in the EUFA Cup next year?

Or does the non qualification of England in 2008 have any bearing on the matter?

Please send hyperlinks to the posh part of Wilmslow, not Winslow. I was tired and emotional.

Alan Woodhead
34 Posted 04/05/2008 at 08:40:51

I can see us getting zilch from our last two games and Villa getting a win against West Ham.That could leave us both on same points and goal difference.Would it then be down to who had won most games?If so,eighth place is ours!

Albert Dock
35 Posted 04/05/2008 at 09:41:34

Just checked this out on the Premiership homepage. The determining factors are: points, goal average, goals scored.

Amazingly if all is still level then there is a play off. Which is irrelevant as we are miles behind Villa on goals scored thanks to their last couple of wins by huge margins. Lesson to be learned there methinks.

Tom Edwards
36 Posted 04/05/2008 at 09:59:40

Alan Woodhead above -- got to agree with you mate. I think 5th place is by no means a foregone conclusion at the moment (Sunday morning). We all know how Everton have a penchant for making it hard and Arsenal, even without Van Persie, will be no pushover. The Barcodes may not have anything to play for but they always seem to get one over on us and they have a certain M.Owen who regularly bulges the onion bag against us. Couple this with the absence of Cahill and Atreta, and the general drop in form since Fiorentina, and I will not rest easy until that last vital point is safely recorded on the table.

Lets hope the boys prove me wrong.

Zac Jeffries
37 Posted 04/05/2008 at 11:34:25

If Moyes can’t organise/motivate them enough to get one lousy point from these two matches,we don’t bloody well deserve to get into Europe!

Chris James
38 Posted 04/05/2008 at 09:32:46

Cheer up Mick, it may never happe -! go on lad, try a little smile it won’t crack your face I promise!
Of course the season hasn’t been perfect by any means.

Am I disappointed that we didn’t go to the UEFA final? Absolutely.
Was I cut up when we were edged out by Chelsea? Most definitely.
Did I fret when our poor run of form saw us slip out of the race for 4th? Too bloody right?

But the reason I am content is that for the first year I can remember we are feeling genuinely aggrieved that we’ve been pipped and know that with a little more luck, a tad more tactical nous or even a little more confidence we could have secured one, two or even all of those goals and no-one would be saying we didn’t deserve it (unlike our previous 4th place which we all have to accept was exceedingly lucky).
Did you really start the season feeling sure we’d be contesting fourth or looking the real deal in Europe Mick? No, the reason our ambitions have increased is that we have signficantly raised our game this year and with just 2 really good signings (a ball-playing midfielder who can tackle surely has to be the priority) we’ll be entering next season genuinely expecting that we can and will secure a top 4 finish AND seriously challenge on all cup fronts for silverware too. If next year brings no further progress than maybe I too will start to join the glass half empties, but right now I’m thinking of where we’ve been in the last 20 years, where we are now and where it looks like we’re going and to tell the truth I’m bloody excited. COYB!

Mike Coates
39 Posted 04/05/2008 at 12:54:59

I think progression is best..

6th... 5th... 4th next season :)

We still need to gain experience and build up for the top competition! Can?t jump in just right yet..

It would have been nice to get 4th, but perhaps its fateful we get there next season!

COYB!! And a repeat of Andy?s performance last season tonite!!!

Roy Huddlestone
40 Posted 04/05/2008 at 13:04:12

Arsenal have everything to play for today.

They can still overtake Chelsea, and hit second spot, which means automatic qualification to the group stage of the CL next year... If Arse dont end up 2nd, they play a home and an away leg like we do in the automatic Uefa Cup place.

INTERTOTO: WE HAVE TO PLAY AN EXTRA 4 GAMES ONTOP OF THE SEASON AND THE UEFA CUP. With such a threadbare squad, and the fact we need a boatload of quality players to get rid of the shit, I fear Intertoto will cripple us by Christmas. Look what happened to high flying Fulham all those years ago...they ended up 2/3 of the way down the league, and got kicked out of the Uefa Cup for all their extra hard work. Moral of the story... Intertoto Cup is for teams who have big squads and can cope with it.
Take Everton at 52 games, they wouldn't remotely have 6 more games in them, including Arsenal and the Barcodes and the 4 extra.