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Explain this one...

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'We had some discussions two months ago but there has been nothing since. I haven't actually been offered a new contract and nothing has been mentioned about holding more talks.' David Moyes, Daily Mail 9 May 2008

`Bill and David have been deep in discussions for some months,? Wyness said. ?Those talks are going fine, there is absolutely no problem there at all.' Keith Wyness, Times 8 May 2008.

You couldn't make it up! Who's telling porkies?
Phil Bellis, L8     Posted 10/05/2008 at 00:17:34

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Jay Harris
1   Posted 10/05/2008 at 04:17:37

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I admit to being prone to conspiracy theories but it does seem our form has hit rock bottom at the same time as there?s no news on Moyes new contract and according to him today he is still to present his wish list.
Now if he hasnt put a wish list together yet despite "talking" for several months perhaps theplayers know something we dont.
The one thing about EFC is you never know what the truth is or whats going on.

The "Rabbit out of the hat man" has been seriously significantly silent for the last few months too despite our fight for 5th and the proposed Tescodome.
Jay Harris
2   Posted 10/05/2008 at 04:31:39

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Just came across this quote from Moyes.

Now this is getting serious:

The Everton manager said: ?My job is here and I am under contract for another year. I will be here next season unless I am told differently but beyond that I don?t know.

?It may seem strange to be preparing for another season with just one year on your contract but maybe that is a question for the chairman.

?We had some discussions two months ago but there has been nothing since. I haven?t actually been offered a new contract and nothing has been mentioned about holding more talks.?

Moyes has drawn up a list of transfer targets, headed by Heerenveen?s United States midfielder Michael Bradley, but he is in the dark about his budget.

?I told the club three months ago what I was looking for but I don?t know when I?ll get an answer,? he said. ?I don?t know whether I?ll be shopping at Harrods or the bargain basement.?

The uncertainty extends to Moyes? appointing a successor to Alan Irvine as assistant manager. ?I can?t really bring someone in until my own situation is sorted out,? he said
Michael Hunt
3   Posted 10/05/2008 at 04:33:35

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Moyes said very in yesterday’s press conference he has given his list of trandfer targets to the board but has not been told yet how much is available and who they will be able to land.
Hopefully it is a smokescreen to keep our massive transfer kitty secret so we can sign up the best players in the world (flaming nora, this ale is strong!)
Michael Hunt
4   Posted 10/05/2008 at 05:25:52

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(and here’s hoping Lescott’s knee proceedure is routine!)
Gavin Ramejkis
5   Posted 10/05/2008 at 07:43:46

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If I ever shook hands with Fat Boy I’d count my fingers afterwards, have you heard anything out of his mouth that’s honest?
Davey Militwitch
6   Posted 10/05/2008 at 07:50:23

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I am a Moyes fan, we would not be where we are without his leadeship. There appears to be some stalling from Kenwright obviously, I just wonder whether it has anything to do with the current spate of high profile managers currently / due to be out of work.

Sam Alllardyce,
Jose Mourinho
Frank Rijkaard
Ronald Koeman
Martin Jol
Sven Goran Eriksson

Wouldn?t it be Everton all over to fuck him off while we are on the cusp of having something like success? If we lose Moyes I will go fucking crazy.
Derek Thomas
7   Posted 10/05/2008 at 07:52:31

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If the board told me it was Wednesday I would check to see if it was Tuesday or Thursday.

If Moyes ’ knows ’ that all the spare cash is going to the Kirkby/Tesco dome then he might well be off.
Gary Tudor
8   Posted 10/05/2008 at 08:32:23

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I usually dont get involved in board bashing but this scenario is just plain stupid.
We have one of the most talented British Mangers in Moyes, who has built a side on showstring that some other managers could not acheive with a £100 million.

Moyes would be the best signing of the summer, if we do not tie him down to at least 4 years it will be a travesty!
We would also lose some of our top players, Jol and Allardyce are hardly top managers!!! Give him the £25-30 million he needs to take us to the next level.
Taxi for Kenwright and Wyness!!!

Rich Jones
9   Posted 10/05/2008 at 09:21:24

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And people come on here and try to convince us to trust Kenwright and his sidekick. I wonder what we would all think of Billy had Moyes not worked his miracles in terms of results? Wyness has said talks are going well while Moyes says none have taken place in two months. The website today says Moyes is still to provide his transfer targets for the summer yet Moyes says he gave his targets in and has had no feedback. I know who I believe.
Alan Clarke
10   Posted 10/05/2008 at 09:40:33

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Fingers crossed that Moyes is off! We won’t have to watch his boring negative defensive tactics anymore.

Hopefully Kenwright and his fat mate will leave too after this whole Kirkby fuck up then we’ll have a clean slate to start from and actually start playing some decent football again.
John Barry
11   Posted 10/05/2008 at 09:49:34

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If we lose Moyes we may as well get used to fighting alongside the mighty Middlesbrough and Bolton. Moyes has single-handedly transformed this football club from the shambolic Walter Smith era (Steve Watson as a lone striker anyone?) into a side that his battling for top four. We are not one of the rich clubs anymore and we have no divine right to be near the top. Moyes has earned that. Lose Moyes we?re fucked,
Don Talbot
12   Posted 10/05/2008 at 10:26:49

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What a load of suckers you all are! Moyes is just playing Kenwright for extra dough. He knows he?s got the fans right up his arse in spite of his considerable limitations. It?s a pound to a pinch of brown stuff that the contract?s signed within days!
Simple Simon
13   Posted 10/05/2008 at 10:48:44

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My guess is that Moyes is seeking a more lucrative contract than is currently being offered. I’m sure he’ll get something close to his desired amount sometime soon.
Simple Simon
14   Posted 10/05/2008 at 10:51:33

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Alan Clarke: What the fuck is your problem? Granted Moyes isn’t perfect, sometimes makes poor decisions, and has the tendency to talk shite on occasions. But the negatives have been shown to be far outweighed by the positives. I’ve also been anti-Moyes in the past but have been proved wrong. Maybe next season he’ll fuck up, and we can all call for his head. But at the moment he’s doing incredibly well and deserves more respect than you currently give.
Nelly Blythe
15   Posted 10/05/2008 at 10:27:44

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At times on this site I have been very critical of some of Moyes?s negatives tactics especially against the Sky 4 but I find it absoulutely astounding that as we speak he has no idea what his transfer budget will be for next season. How the fuck can he be expected to plan for the future or approach prospective targets if he doesn't know if he?ll be able to afford them?

I think the time has truely come for Kenwright and his sidekick to fuck off as quickly as possible. It is blatently obvious by their actions and admissions from the Tesco people that Kenwright has no intention of selling any of his shareholding and the only investmnent he has brought into the club (i.e Robert Earl) was done in order to strengthen his own position. Under his stewardship we have had many a debacle (King?s Dock and the sale of the only ?world class? player we?ll see in our lifetime are but two).

He and Wyness are also responsible for selling out to JJB... what a fucking joke they are !!... EFC?s main merchandising partner who never stock any EFC merchandise in any of their shops...need I say more!!! I understand he is an Evertonian through and through but so am I and these two are once again making us a laughing stock.

As much as I?ve criticised Moyes I don't think there is any one out there who could do a better job than he?s done....(certainly not Sam fucking Allardyce!!). This season I truely believed we were on the verge of good things (despite our obvious failings) and things could be better next season with the right planning and transfer captures... so why the fuck are these two clowns stalling with Moyes and jepardising the future of the club?

If this was in Spain and/or Italy the fans would be up in arms and demanding the resignation of these two idiots but we just accept it. Now whilst I?m not suggessting we go rioting in the streets I think that some sort of major protest should be undertaken to show our displeasure at these two idiots... I'm sure SKY would give it lengthy air time considering how they obviously feel about Everton.

When he took over, above all Kenwright promised the supporters TRANSPARENCY... something which has never happened so I say to these two either LEAD US FORWRD or FUCK OFF NOW!!!

Mark Pendleton
16   Posted 10/05/2008 at 11:04:31

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Moyes has handed his wish list to BK. There is no way BK will not offer Moyes a new deal. DM is not screwing the club for more money (remember a few years back when we staved off relegation and BK offered Moyes a better deal and he wasn’t interested at the time by saying how it’s not about the cash).
Nick Broadhurst
17   Posted 10/05/2008 at 11:15:05

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This is precisely why you shouldn’t believe everything you read in the papers.

Both quotes (the Moyes one in particular) sound like they’ve been hashed-up by a journo with a chip on his shoulder if you ask me...
Barry Cass
18   Posted 10/05/2008 at 11:12:15

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I know who I believe and he isn?t a fat waste of space who hasn?t got a clue!!

The whole board is a disgrace! One lie after another and people still defend them. Unbelievable.

However, in his defence, Bill has probably been quiet as he?s knackered from searching for new investement 24/7 !!!!!!

Tony Williams
19   Posted 10/05/2008 at 11:41:53

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I never trust papers, when you wipe your arse with them they put on more shite that they take off
Rich Jones
20   Posted 10/05/2008 at 12:03:04

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Lovely Tony !!! thanks for that.
Colin Jones
21   Posted 10/05/2008 at 12:01:04

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Some of you are right in saying that things in newspapers aren?t always true or can be misleading; however, in this instance we are looking at two direct quotations that are strongly contradictory. It?s not appropriate either to believe everything or nothing in newspapers, you have to judge each case individually
Jeff Leahey
22   Posted 10/05/2008 at 12:27:15

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I don?t think Kenwright can afford Moyes anymore, it's not his wages but the man's ambition he can?t match. We have been told that Moyes wants £20 million to kick on with , £20 million to the man in the street is a massive amount of money, but in the EPL terms its a minimal amount to add to what you have and improve apon.

OK, some of the football has been shite at times but the league position doesn?t lie. To offer him less is an insult to Moyes and the hoards of us who support and spend our money on this club. It would not surprise me if he pisses off and ends up at Celtic or maybe as assistant to Alex Ferguson and to eventually take over.

Andrew Flanagan
23   Posted 10/05/2008 at 13:12:34

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I wouldn?t read too much into the comments made by Moyes for a number of reasons. Firstly, he is a cagey guy who likes to downplay things. We hear these things all the time, ?Liverpool should finish 4th?, ?Top ten would be success for us?. This is who David Moyes is.

Secondly, Bill Kenwright loves Moyesey and I?m sure he would leave his wife for him given half a chance. I guarentee a couple of weeks after the season, it will be all smiles and a brand new 4-year deal. This is simply the Everton way.

Paul Rotheram
24   Posted 10/05/2008 at 13:23:53

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As a fully paid up member of the Moyes fan club, it is ironic that he seems to be talking about "strange" situations regarding a new contract. One of the main reasons Everton have done so well in recent seasons is the players have been kept on there toes, especially regarding loan players whom want a contract and are not offered one until the very last minute. It seems to me Moyes is been played at his own game and you reallly should not throw stones if you live in a glass house. One more matter I have and I encourage more Evertonians to stop buying the Daily Mirror ? it is 100% a red newspaper (comic).
Ste Kenny
25   Posted 10/05/2008 at 13:43:29

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I keep hearing about Moyes?s so-called limitations. IMO these limitations are more to do with a poor squad he has painstakingly had to build over a long period of time. More often than not, all he has to change the game are a big lump who falls over his own feet and a glorified cross-country runner who has the most unbelievable knack of always finding the corner flag with every run he makes.

Although to be fair he has made the odd poor sub. Like every other manager in the world.
Rob Newland
26   Posted 10/05/2008 at 14:44:16

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Alan Clarke: [[ Hopefully Kenwright and his fat mate will leave too after this whole Kirkby fuck up then we?ll have a clean slate to start from and actually start playing some decent football again. ]]

LOL ... "again" ... like we did twenty years ago before the game was fundamentally changed by a hnuge influx of money leaving us far behind? Is that the "again" you speak of?
Alex May
27   Posted 10/05/2008 at 15:35:15

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There have been a number of times when I have questioned David Moyes. I do not regret some of it as it came during the season when we slumped to 11th place.

Our performances in the biggest matches this season, suggest that further improvements are unlikely. However, I feel that Moyes has often been the glue to hold this club together.

If Moyes decides to walk away from this club through the actions and lack of ambition of our chirman and CEO, will everybody finally see Kenwright for the charlatan that he is? He´s taken the piss for years and been very lucky that the team has out-performed the investment it has received.
Peter Pickles
28   Posted 10/05/2008 at 16:04:17

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The Daily Mail!!!

That beacon of truth and honesty...!

Give it a rest
Phil Bellis
29   Posted 10/05/2008 at 17:34:43

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Peter, you mean the Daily Mail made it up?
Thank Christ!
For a minute there, I thought our CEO might be lying.
Paul Coleman
30   Posted 10/05/2008 at 18:52:28

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The first signs of a crack in the relationship between Bill and David. There is no smoke without fire.
Either Bill is going for Jose Mouhrinio, in thinking that David has taken us as far as he can (A load of bollocks IMO) or Bill can?t meet Davids transfer demands. I thank David for calling Bills bluff to expose him as the pennyless chairman that he is. I've been saying for ages THIS CLUB NEEDS INVESTMENT!!!
Chris Briddon
31   Posted 10/05/2008 at 19:14:35

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I am impressed that you all have so mcuh faith in the football club that you believe what?s printed in the Daily Mail instead!

In the Independent interview Moyes did that was out only a day or 2 ago, he indicated he was quite happy and had given his wish list of players.

Even the Mail quotes mention that Moyes and Bill talk all the time ? just not about his contract; both have said on numerous occasions that they were waiting to get the football season out of the way until they sort it out.

As far as the comments from KW go, Bill and DM talk all the time, both are happy with the current situation ? what?s the problem!
Pat Alsopp
32   Posted 10/05/2008 at 19:18:59

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So Kenwright is the barrier preventing the world?s richest oliogaths (or whatever monied fools are called these days) from pouring billions into Everton FC! What strange deluded fools are so many of my fellow Evertonians. Don?t they realise that if BB took their perverted advice and ?did one? tomorrow, the club would go into meltdown.

Just look at what happens whenever an owner says he?s had enough of the name-calling and rancid abuse dished out by fans. Think of Leeds, Leicester, Southampton, Wolves, Sheffield Wed et al ?all who have graced the top flight in none too distant times ? and reflect: Where are they now? Deep in the shit is the answer... and all because their loyal and well-meaning owners were hounded out of office and eventually left them to stew.

Be assured, there is no queue of rich men just waiting to take over the debts, build us a new ground, double Davey?s salary and buy him a new team. We?ve been here before and ended up with Chairman Johnson ? what a saviour he turned out to be!
Just hold your water, wait to see how it all works out. Bill and Davey will sort it out without our help so stop worrying and concentrate on tomorrow?s game!

Jay Harris
33   Posted 10/05/2008 at 21:10:23

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Where do you get the idea that EFC would go into meltdown if BK sold up?

He has asset-stripped the club since the day he took over and the operational management is a shambles. As for marketing and PR... don't even go there.

The only difficulty with EFC has always been the way the shareholding is structured and with BK holding 66% through a private holding discourages anyone from making a bid.

EFC is valued at £100 million not bad for Bill who only put up £1 million eh? And why do we need the world?s richest "Oliogaths"? ? there are plenty of rich successful businessmen about ? just ask QPR. Unlike years ago there is plenty of money in football now so return on investment is much easier to justify.

BK needs to be a willing seller then watch the amount of interest.

Henry Lennon
34   Posted 10/05/2008 at 21:49:29

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I live in Birmimgham and witnessed at first-hand how long it took Doug Ellis ? a willing seller ? to find somebody WHO ACTUALLY HAD THE MONEY to take Villa off his hands. From memory he was reported to have made at least five deals which collapsed when the dough was due. It also happened to Birmingham City last year. With Everton?s debts, I don?t think a queue will be forming at Bill?s door!
Michael Kenrick
35   Posted 10/05/2008 at 21:34:55

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Firstly, for the record, as of May 07, Bill Kenwright held 8,754 shares in EFC Co Ltd. ? 25% ... not 66%.

66% is the approximate joint sharholding of the Everton Board of Directors: Kenwright, Woods and Earl. You could argue that, since the board is united behind Bill, his ownership is effectivey 66%, which enables him to weild power... but in reality this is done through the united Board.

You may be right in effect that, for anyone to gain control of EFC, they would need to buyout the full 66% held by the Board. However, if it was an amicable sale, I see no structural reason why Bill could not sell his 25% stake, and the buyer gain control, with the goodwill of the remaining Board members.

The reason this does not happen is liklely two-fold: they don’t want to sell... and thus there are no real prospective buyers. It takes two to tango.

I can’t really blame them for not wanting to sell; I think, if Kirkby goes through, they are effectively sitting on a goldmine. How big a goldmine probably depends on the size of the debt at the time but a nominal club value of £100M would net Bill over £2,000 per share over what he paid for them (BTW, I think he put up around £7½M, not £1M; we haven’t found anyone on here to coroborate your claim that he leveraged the £7½M through teh club’s books). I’m guessing that number would be pro-rated down by the magnitude of the outstanding debt at the time, but he stands to make a tidy sum when (not if) he decides it’s time to move on.

But why would he do so now? If the Tescodome is a real prospect, he has every reason not to sell.

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