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Hey Jude

Comments (39)

Just wondering if anybody went over the park to watch that well known blue Sir Paul last night. A lot has been written on various forums about GP not being the venue, but even I will admit that the old place is hardly the ideal venue for all the reasons pro-Kirkby posters keep saying.

Being anti-Kirkby, even I would be overjoyed if we are to move that I may be able to watch a Reformed Pink Floyd play at our new home. I then remembered back to the FAQ page on the OS when we were due to vote:

"8. Will the stadium be used for events other than football matches? Although its primary use will, of course, be first-team matches, there will be the capacity to stage major shows and concerts at the stadium." ? Good thinks me then I read:

"The stadium shall not be used for any events other than sporting events. No concerts or music events shall take place."

This was taken from the Meeting agenda of Knowsley?s Planning Committee for the Planning application to be held next Monday.

Do people think (especially the Yes voters)? That this is:

a) Only right, it?s a football stadium after all.

b) A crying shame as we will need all revenue streams available to give this any chance of working.

c) Yet more out-and-out lies from the club.

As we all know, people, St Jude is the patron saint of desperate cases and lost causes.
Tom Coleman, North Wales     Posted 02/06/2008 at 20:52:10

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Anthony Horabin
1   Posted 03/06/2008 at 07:53:17

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After being at the Foo Fighters concert at the City of Manchester Stadium last night, if we do get a new stadium it must include the use in the off season for concerts and other events. It must be used to its maximum to generate new revenue. As for your A, B or C we all have our own opinions.
Nick Entwistle
2   Posted 03/06/2008 at 08:05:45

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I watched the concert on TV, well the last 15 minutes. Ugh, couldn’t enjoy it, all those red scarfs etc. Just cool to see a dude of 65ish getting down with the kids!
Neil Quinn
3   Posted 03/06/2008 at 08:37:20

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Without concerts etc. It’s difficult to see where this extra £10m a year is coming from for Moyes. Can’t see a few exec boxes generating it somehow.
Jimmy Fearns
4   Posted 03/06/2008 at 08:36:57

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Or it could possibly be

d) the intention initially was to use the stadium for concerts etc. but in order to ensure the stadium gets built the plans had to be amended as with the reduced retail floor space the removal of a petrol station from the Tesco car park.

But then that wouldn?t give everyone an excuse to play ToffeeWeb?s favourite sport of ?bash the board?.


Bert Murray
5   Posted 03/06/2008 at 08:41:01

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As a ’Yes’ voter,I have to say that the whole concept is becomimg a dog’s breakfast.So many caveats have been placed on the plans that it’s hard to see the thing coming together.Non football events are vital if the magic £10M is ever to become reality and I know of no other major stadium wher these are forbidden.Never thought I’d say it but I am praying the plans get knocked back although i will have to live with my earlier folly of support
Tony Williams
6   Posted 03/06/2008 at 08:50:07

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Bert I am not trying to be confrontational, I know it can seem that way as there is no way of reading the inflection of my words.

Can you advise why you voted yes and what has changed so drastically to make you think it was such a bad thing that you are seemingly apologising for your vote?

I am just interested, not trying to cause a long argument about freedom of choice to change one’s mind and I am not asking for others to butt in, I am simply asking Bert one question.

Cheers
Graham Eaves
7   Posted 03/06/2008 at 10:18:46

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FYI Sir Paul is a RS fan.
I kinda know his daughter Stella and she has a border collie called Red for obvious reasons. Obviously I’ve raised the subject with her and she assures me that the whole family including her Da are firm RS
Gavin Ramejkis
8   Posted 03/06/2008 at 10:03:01

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Can Neil Pearse as one of the regular yes voters worth listening to, even if i dont always agree with him, say what effect this has financially running the new stadium with no other possible revenue streams from it? I hate told you so guys but the sums for Kirkby are falling further and further away from making this financially viable
Dawson Boyle
9   Posted 03/06/2008 at 10:29:25

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Bands are less likely to use the new ground because it’s not in the city.
World stadium tours don’t tend to focus on Paris, London and Kirkby!
Marc Williams
10   Posted 03/06/2008 at 10:37:08

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Hey Tom, you need to ask tougher questions mate as this is easier than a quiz on daytime TV.
It must be multiple choice though as the correct answers are : B & C
Any chance of a small prize ?
Tony Marks
11   Posted 03/06/2008 at 10:48:33

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Graham Eaves, you obviously missed the interview with Janice Long where Macca said and I quote..

" I support both teams really..................but when it comes to the crunch I am Everton"



Clear enough for me
Marc Williams
12   Posted 03/06/2008 at 10:44:15

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Shit, I’ve just relised as these are Kirkby related questions its probably fixed & the wrong answer will be the winning one.
Can I change my answer to : A
Methinks they’ll probably be tickets to a ’Blue Bill production’ west end show or maybe Tesco vouchers for thinking A is correct.
Karl Masters
13   Posted 03/06/2008 at 11:05:25

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Answer is somewhere between B & C.

I think that Wyness hoped it would be possible to stage non football events there, but as its turned out they won’t be allowed by the Council. He’d never admit it now, of course, but he misjudged how much opposition there would be locally and believed that the now glaringly obvious transport issues that are going to make Kirkby a nightmare location during big events were a figment of people’s imagination.

Badly advised by Davis, Gleeve & Steer ( or whoever they are ) and an error of judgement or knew all along this would be the case and chose not to reveal it as it would put the obvious question marks over why we’re even bothering ooing at this location? Whichever one it was, it’s not looking too clever now.

Hope it gets called in. Sad day for us all if it does though as it will prove what a waste of time, energy and resources it’s been while we could have looked for something better.
Simple Simon
14   Posted 03/06/2008 at 10:40:41

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Dawson: I can see it now, U2 playing Kirkby, with 60,000 people flocking to cosmopolitan Knowsley. The street cafes and bistros fill with individuals all intent on enjoying the delights of this thriving cultural hot-spot. The other stadium bands take note. Before long, REM, Pink Floyd, Bon Jovi follow suit. Lighter sales rocket on Merseyside. Kirkby becomes known as "Koolby".
Rupert Coghlan
15   Posted 03/06/2008 at 11:42:42

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Bands play where their manager tells them to play, Dawson, Simple Simon - Coldplay played the Reebok, Bon Jovi, GreenDay played the Milton Keynes Bowl - whatever that is - so there’s no reason why Kirkby can’t do gigs as well.

It’s just a matter of whether an entertainment based Chairman thinks it’s a good idea - which surely should be a no-brainer for a showman like Kenwright.
Even Wyness could surely see the sense. Maybe not...........
Rob Hollis
16   Posted 03/06/2008 at 11:41:45

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I was there on Sunday, Brilliant gig but depressing venue.

First time I have been in Anfield since watching a schoolboys match about 40 years ago when I was a kid. It was depressing because Anfield is a very nice stadium. It is not a massive and expensive stadium but it is reasonably modern with clear views all around as far as I could see.

Goodison really is something that should only appear in black and white photo?s by comparison. I don?t know if it will be Kirby or some other option but something needs to happen. Everton are on the edge of the top tier as a team but the facilities and views belong to another era.
Ed Fitzgerald
17   Posted 03/06/2008 at 12:11:46

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Rupert

Milton Keynes and Kirkby are worlds apart in terms of infrastructure and facilities! Maybe if Billy starts decamping some of his productions to the Kirkby Suite I will start to believe in this utopian vision of Knowsley as a centre of cultural excellence.

Eh why would a major band play in Kirkby when they could play at the Echo arena with all the attendant attractions and infrastrucutre in place? For those who doubt the ability of a City centre arena to absorb large numbers of people effectively, perhaps the 200,000 who are estimated to have visited Liverpool One on Friday answers the question.
Bert Murray
18   Posted 03/06/2008 at 12:43:51

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In answer to you, Tony, I think, like many others, that I bought into a load of bullshit from Kenwright and Wyness over the viability of this project and didn?t give the vote as much thought as I should have. I now see the reality was that they only enthused because it LOOKED like a freebie and perhaps that?s all they could afford!
Robbie Muldoon
19   Posted 03/06/2008 at 12:37:44

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If they planned to use the kirkby shite stad for concerts, LCC would certainly object out of rival competition for the echo arena.

This kirkby idea has got to falll through, please!
Gavin Ramejkis
20   Posted 03/06/2008 at 12:53:00

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Rupert have you not realised that KBC and the residents have objected to it being anything beyond a football venue due to the noise and traffic pollution, maybe 50k people could go to a concert there on bicycles? Seems like every day another flaw comes to light on the crime of the century
Rich Grayson
21   Posted 03/06/2008 at 13:00:55

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Graham, if McCartney was a red then why on the radio the other day did he say he was a blue? Wouldn't say that if it wasn't true would he?
David Hall
22   Posted 03/06/2008 at 13:20:29

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By sheer co-incidence, I sat next to Macca and his kids at the 1989 Cup Final. He told me he was an Evertonian but didn?t brag about it for fear of alienating too many of his followers! I spent most of the game telling him who was who and it was clear that, in truth, his knowledge of the game was somewhat sketchy!
Richard Harris
23   Posted 03/06/2008 at 13:19:30

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Perhaps Wyness should call the new stadium "the Field of Dreams". Bill, people will come, Bill. They’ll come to Kirkby for reasons that they can’t even fathom. They’ll turn up your driveway not knowing for sure why they’re doing it. They’ll arrive at your door as innocent as children, longing for the past. Of course, we won’t mind if you look around, you’ll say. It’s only £xx per person. They’ll pass over the money without even thinking about it: for it is money they have and peace they lack. And they’ll walk out to the stadium; sit in shirtsleeves on a perfect afternoon. They’ll find they have reserved seats somewhere along one of the touchlines, where they sat when they were children and cheered their heroes. And they’ll watch the game and it’ll be as if they dipped themselves in magic waters. The memories will be so thick they’ll have to brush them away from their faces. People will come Bill. The one constant through all the years, Bill, has been football. Britain has rolled by like an army of steamrollers. It has been erased like a blackboard, rebuilt and erased again. But football has marked the time. This field, this game: it’s a part of our past, Bill. It reminds of us of all that once was good and it could be again. Oh... people will come Bill. People will most definitely come.
James Marshall
24   Posted 03/06/2008 at 13:41:32

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Who gives a toss who Macca supports? I find him an embarrasment up there warbling away in his comfy trainers and M & S slacks - awful, just stoppit Macca please.

He could support al-qaeda for all I care.
Alan Codd
25   Posted 03/06/2008 at 14:28:46

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Well said james Marshall
I personally think Paul Mccartney is a greedy old fart.
When do you think this guy will decide he has enough money.
It embarresses me the way this city fawns over anything beatles.
Get a fucking grip at least Ringo Star was honest
So i couldnt give a shit if "macca" is a Man Utd fan or a Kopite,Ill bet he didnt hang around after his shite Gigg
Roy Coyne
26   Posted 03/06/2008 at 14:48:51

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I think most yes voters by now realise that they were taken in by the hype even if they wont admit it. Also I do not care who Paul or any of the Beatles support to be honest ? it's not as if any of them want to invest in the club.
Alan Codd
27   Posted 03/06/2008 at 14:57:01

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What pisses me off is the way some supporters refer to fellow EVERTONIANS as "yes voters" as though they are some sort of lepers.
At the end of the day every one has there own opinion and are free to act on that and shouldnt have some arsehole criticise them because of there opinion.
I spoke to a guy the other day who was slating supporters who voted yes and it turned out the prick hasnt had a season ticket for 8 years.
In my opinion what the fuck has it got to do with him!
Ed Fitzgerald
28   Posted 03/06/2008 at 15:27:46

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Alan

I can’t see how you can get upset by being called a yes voter if you voted yes?
I voted no so therefore people rightly call me a no voter.

Alan there are people on here who slate people who voted no who have not been the match for years, who live abroad and know little of the local context but they are entitled to their opinion.

Tony Williams
29   Posted 03/06/2008 at 15:42:49

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Alan calling anyone a Yes or No voter is not a derogatory term, it is the only way you can distinguish between Evertonians who voted a certain way on the Kirkby issue.

We are all Evertonians but we do have No voters and Yes voters.
Micky Norman
30   Posted 03/06/2008 at 19:06:50

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I’ve never seen Macca at a footy match so who cares who he supports? However, football grounds are about the worst venues possible for live music- especially when you’re sat in the same plastic seat for hours with your knees up around your chin and some tosser trying to sing along right behind you while the incontinent bugger three seats along gets up for a pee every ten minutes (the wife actually).Music in music venues. Football grounds are for football. I’d like to see it made into a criminal offence to mix the two. punishable by having to listen to your least favourite music in a cow shed.Stuff the money, you’d make more from a decent cup run.
Ron Leith
31   Posted 03/06/2008 at 19:39:35

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Anybody who likes music would go to a decent concert hall to hear some good acoustics. Football staia for concerts are generally total garbage. I have seen the Beautiful South at the Galpharm. I also saw Bruce Sprinsteen at Sheffield United and U2 at Leeds all total shite. Once a band gets to play at a football stadium you know the atmosphere will be none existent and the sound will be appaling. It is just a concert for the masses of morons who are prepared to be fleeced . People who go to such events are capitalist canon fodder for the Simon Cowells of this world. No I don?t want concerts at EFC.
Tony Anderson
32   Posted 03/06/2008 at 19:48:22

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I think we should move back to Anfield. If we don't stay at Goodison we should move back, we were born there, well near enough, just ask the red shite how much. At least we stay in the city. It fills me with dread thinking of Kirkby.
Tony Anderson
33   Posted 03/06/2008 at 20:02:34

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And we should somehow get the liverbird put on our shirts just to let people further afield know that we belong to Liverpool city and there is more than one team here. The first football medal was presented to Everton FC players and it had a liverbird on it, before LFC was even thought of, so let's have that back too.
Mick Gallagher
34   Posted 03/06/2008 at 20:34:16

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Aian, I haven?t had a season ticket since 85 and only miss games due to working offshore, home, away, Europe and further a field. So are you saying as a non-season ticket holder I shouldn?t have a say. Well tough shit mate because I will always voice my views about the ground move. If Yes voters don't like it ? tough! By the way, I've paid for my son?s season ticket for long enough.
Neil Pearse
35   Posted 03/06/2008 at 21:10:36

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Gavin, responding as a Yes voter since you asked me directly. Obviously it is not great news if we cannot get additional revenues from musical events. Simple as that really. Clearly it has to make the financials of Kirkby worse.

It’s unlikely however that it fundamentally changes the situation since such revenues would never have been the make or break factor in the whole thing, nor indeed a particularly large element.

However, what people sometimes seem to forget in all this discussion is - it’s all relative. It’s all a question of which option (stay at GP, go to Kirkby, go somewhere else) generates the most additional revenue overall. I am certainly tired of saying on here that there are no particularly great options that we have, given that we are not very rich. Nobody but an idiot thinks Kirkby is perfect. The question is whether it is better than other actually available options. Since the only other available option which we can afford is staying at GP, I would not change my Yes vote. The revenues are still likely to be substantially higher than GP, and borrowing probably no more than £50M for a brand new stadium is as close to a bargain as we are going to find in this world.

Remember also that any other new stadium (if we could afford a more expensive stadium than Kirkby - which we can’t) would be very likely to have the same kind of issues around planning restrictions etc. that Kirkby has. It goes with the territory of plonking a big new stadium down in a basically urban area. It’s all relative.

There is of course one actually feasible option which would be financially head and shoulders above all others. Sharing with the RS on Stanley Park. As others have pointed out, unfortunately neither side nor the city have the leadership to bring this about.
Colin Wordsworth
36   Posted 03/06/2008 at 22:47:12

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I think Neil calls this correct!

I think the fine print, old conversations, statements, telephone calls, e mails, letters, newspaper clippings etc have been dissected and read backwards to find any fault in the Kirkby application or the presentation of it.

I may be wrong (and it won’t be a first) but when did a major football ground in this country other than the reebok, man city and wembley and the rs only recently ever held concerts. It is a relatively rare thing in this country and could not be relied upon to provide a great income stream.

At the end of the day, if permission for the stadium is granted and it is built then an application can be made to vary the planning conditions and the conditions on the premises licence.
Pat Domingo
37   Posted 04/06/2008 at 00:18:38

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Jeez, the ’No surrender’ lot are really clutching at straws now. What will Toffeeweb actually exist for when the move goes through? (as they’ve been telling us it won’t for the past two years).
Can’t wait for the move. Even the ’No’ clique will be at Kirkby to hear Celine Dion warbling - after the planning laws are ’amended’ - it always happens for big firms with lawyers and lots of cash.
Ed Fitzgerald
38   Posted 04/06/2008 at 00:28:41

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Colin

Man U, Leeds, Coventry, Hull, Bristol City, Southampton, Derby, Hampden Park have all held concerts

Arsenal have a licence to hold 3 concerts a year too.
Gavin Ramejkis
39   Posted 05/06/2008 at 08:08:55

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Neil P thanks for answering, as I said will read your opinions even if I don’t agree as they don’t tend to be the "live with it" type response. We need to have certainties rather than maybes as far too much supposition has been involved in this whole debacle; maybe transport will be improved, maybe the tram will be built (a huge maybe which would take years after the stadium), maybe as Robbie hopes we can change the law and rules of use and have concerts, but maybe just doesn’t cut the mustard as you would be relying on maybes again and that’s simply not how to do business. The fiscal sense of sharing is obvious but highly unlikely to happen due mainly I feel to the RS not needing us or at least saying so despite the credit crunch. Not all projects will be perfect; currently working on one for the MoD worth more than £4bn and it’s far from perfect, but with all well run projects each option has been fully explored and the business case followed very stringently, I don’t think the Kirkby project has been run well at all with some massive mistakes that should have been dealt with. Project Jennifer is redeveloping the area the stadium is currently in, the city centre is being regenerated and I don’t think both have been investigated enough, Tesco are even building as part of Jennifer!

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